National Registry

[Guest guest]

Are you asking for a petition to the State of Texas to move from the NR to a

" state based test " ?

While I doubt they'd entertain the thought given the cost of doing a " state

testing system " (yes, I know you had one in place once but that was then this

is now) and their current lack of manpower and funds to do what they are

currently mandated to do already hence you'd be adding another layer with no

likely source of income (the fees would barely cover the administration of a

test

let alone the development and maintenance of such a testing system in my

opinion.

Is that what you're looking to do?

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino@...

(Cell Phone)

(Home Phone)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless

I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for

its

stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the

original author.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/7/2006 8:55:47 P.M. Central Standard Time,

paramedicop@... writes:

The concept is called " economy of scale. " Essentially, once they've put out

the costs to get started in any one state, the cost of rolling the testing

process out to other states is incrementally lower and thusly produces a

greater return on investment.

There's no good ROI for the state to re-create a testing system...

Mike

Mike beat me to the punch on this answer. The bottom line is that Texas,

even with the large number of certifications that we do in a given years could

simply not afford to develop valid tests at all of the levels that we'd need.

Historically speaking a government entity can't operate like a business and

that too has a place in this discussion.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino@...

(Cell Phone)

(Home Phone)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless

I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for

its

stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the

original author.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/7/2006 9:05:59 P.M. Central Standard Time,

ewalker@... writes:

Several states utilize

on line testing for EMS candidates for their states by contracting with

companies that supply professional examinations such as EMS, nursing, PA,

medical assistants, as well as other professions. IF

For certification? Who? What vendors?

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino@...

(Cell Phone)

(Home Phone)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless

I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for

its

stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the

original author.

[Guest guest]

I hear and understand everyone's concerns with the National Registry. One

of my students called and talked to someone at National Registry and just

made a general comment about not caring for the National Registry and she

was told by the person at National Registry that if you do not like the

National Registry why don't you get a petition started and get signatures

and send it to the state. Do not remember the number of signatures

required, but as many people that are having problems with the concept of

National Registry why not get a petition are what would it take to get one

started or is this a null and void idea?

DSF

[Guest guest]

Yes. If there is not enough funding in this project why is the National

Registry Company doing it?

DSF

Re: National Registry

Are you asking for a petition to the State of Texas to move from the NR to

a

" state based test " ?

While I doubt they'd entertain the thought given the cost of doing a " state

testing system " (yes, I know you had one in place once but that was then

this

is now) and their current lack of manpower and funds to do what they are

currently mandated to do already hence you'd be adding another layer with

no

likely source of income (the fees would barely cover the administration of

a test

let alone the development and maintenance of such a testing system in my

opinion.

Is that what you're looking to do?

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino@...

(Cell Phone)

(Home Phone)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and

the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with

unless I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only

for its

stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by

the

original author.

[Guest guest]

There ARE testing services available other than NREMT. Some other states

have dumped NREMT and are moving toward alternatives. My organization uses

another test developer to develop exams for our programs, and we have found

them to be reliable.

Not saying that we should dump NREMT. I liked it the way it was before

NREMT, but that was in the days when TDH had enough funding to run the exam

program. That won't happen again anytime soon. So going back to state

developed

and monitored testing is not an option, at least now.

I'm waiting quietly to see what happens when NREMT goes computer based after

the 1st of the year.

I think it's going to be a disaster because Pearson VUE doesn't have a

fershlugginger clue what they're doing and they cannot handle the volume of

testing

that they have taken on now. Example: They now do the Excelsior Nursing

exams, as well as a gazillion other exams, and people tell me it's almost

impossible to get an appointment to test. Contrast how many people are taking

nursing exams with the numbers of medic students that Texas produces, and you'll

get a glimpse of the possible future. I do not believe that Pearson VUE has

fully appreciated the task it has assumed, nor do I believe that it has taken

reasonable and prudent steps to prepare for NREMT testing.

Perhaps I am being overly pessimistic. My friends at NREMT tell me " Don't

Worry, Be Happy. " So that's what I'm doing until we see what happens, but,

cynic that I am, I foresee a debacle ahead.

I really hope that I am wrong. I really hope that all is smooth as a baby's

butt, and that things will be efficient and wonderful.

This will be a serious test for NREMT and for Pearson Vue. If this does not

succeed, then I think GETAC and DSHS will be warranted in examining other

alternatives.

One issue that I see is that Pearson Vue has an inadequate network of test

sites, and is simply not prepared to provide the testing that will be required.

Pearson Vue got this contract with a low bid. And you all know what

happens sometimes with low bidders.

NREMT cannot, because of contractual agreements, authorize free-standing test

sites within 50 miles of an existing Pearson Vue site, or so I have been

told. This is hearsay and I do not vouch for the accuracy of that statement.

It may or may not be true. If it is true, then NREMT must hold Pearson VUE's

feet to the fire and make them provide adequate opportunities to test.

NREMT is an ant and Pearson Vue is an elephant. Pearson Publications is the

world's biggest publisher of EMS texts, I believe. So it's not clear just

how much pressure NREMT can put on Pearson VUE. Of course, I haven't seen the

contract, and that would tell us a lot. But we won't see that.

Computer testing is the way to go. NREMT is right about that. Whether or

not they chose the right company to do the testing will soon be known.

Time will tell. Things will either go well or badly. We'll see what

happens.

If things go badly, then we must ask the hard questions of DSHS and NREMT.

I hope that doesn't happen.

Gene G.

>

> Yes. If there is not enough funding in this project why is the National

> Registry Company doing it?

>

> DSF

>

> Re: National Registry

>

> Are you asking for a petition to the State of Texas to move from the NR to

> a

> " state based test " ?

>

> While I doubt they'd entertain the thought given the cost of doing a " state

>

> testing system " (yes, I know you had one in place once but that was then

> this

> is now) and their current lack of manpower and funds to do what they are

> currently mandated to do already hence you'd be adding another layer with

> no

> likely source of income (the fees would barely cover the administration of

> a test

> let alone the development and maintenance of such a testing system in my

> opinion.

>

> Is that what you're looking to do?

>

> Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

> FF/NREMT-B/FSI/ FF/

> Freelance Consultant/Trainer/ Freelance Cons Freelance Consultant/Traine

>

> LNMolino@...

>

> (Cell Phone)

> (Home Phone)

> (IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

> (IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

>

> " A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

>

> " Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

> discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

>

> The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and

> the

> author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

> organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with

> unless I

> specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only

> for its

> stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

> retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by

> the

> original author.

>

>

[Guest guest]

The universities have absolutely no interest in EMS programs for the most

part. The community colleges have that franchise, but they are only interested

in the cashflow from the programs. They are not going to get involved in EMS

testing unless you can show them a huge payoff. That's all they understand.

All the crap you read about colleges and universities being better at

teaching EMS is just that: CRAP. The program directors answer to deans and

vice

presidents who have not the faintest clue about EMS and couldn't care less

about it. It's all about the bottom line.

You see, education is a BUSINESS. Yes, a BUSINESS. Whether or not it's

done by colleges, universities, or private academies, it's a business, just like

Uncle Joe's Spiffy Used Cars is a business.

And college administrators are not much different from Uncle Joe. Except

that Uncle Joe is likely to be more honest than your average college

administrator.

So unless you can show them how they can make a ton of money by developing

and administering EMS exams, it ain't gonna happen. Couple that with the fact

that college and university administrators are conservative to the extreme,

scared spitless of taking a chance on anything, and unwilling to buy into

anything that's not a slam dunk.

And yes, I am prejudiced. I spent 14 years at a community college, fighting

the bureaucracy all the time, and I finally lost, so yes, I have sour grapes.

That's why I now work for a private academy where I can do the things that

I know are right for education without having to deal with dumbass Deans.

If we want an alternative to NREMT, we should look to the private testing

services. There are many and they are quite good at what they do. NREMT

wants

us to believe that it's the ONLY testing organization that can do EMS testing

competently. Don't believe it. There are plenty of others.

Gene G.

[Guest guest]

The concept is called " economy of scale. " Essentially, once they've put out

the costs to get started in any one state, the cost of rolling the testing

process out to other states is incrementally lower and thusly produces a

greater return on investment.

There's no good ROI for the state to re-create a testing system...

Mike

>

> Yes. If there is not enough funding in this project why is the National

> Registry Company doing it?

>

> DSF

>

>

> Re: National Registry

>

> Are you asking for a petition to the State of Texas to move from the NR to

> a

> " state based test " ?

>

> While I doubt they'd entertain the thought given the cost of doing a

> " state

>

> testing system " (yes, I know you had one in place once but that was then

> this

> is now) and their current lack of manpower and funds to do what they are

> currently mandated to do already hence you'd be adding another layer with

> no

> likely source of income (the fees would barely cover the administration of

> a test

> let alone the development and maintenance of such a testing system in my

> opinion.

>

> Is that what you're looking to do?

>

> Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

> FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

> Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

>

> LNMolino@... <LNMolino%40aol.com>

>

> (Cell Phone)

> (Home Phone)

> (IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

> (IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

>

> " A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

>

> " Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

> discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

>

> The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and

> the

> author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

> organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with

> unless I

> specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended

> only

> for its

> stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

> retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain

> by

> the

> original author.

>

>

[Guest guest]

But Mike, there really isn't a need to recreate it. Several states utilize

on line testing for EMS candidates for their states by contracting with

companies that supply professional examinations such as EMS, nursing, PA,

medical assistants, as well as other professions. IF the NR is such a

problem and IF there are viable alternatives out there, shouldn't they be

explored? Question is: who will do the exploring? If EMS educators are not

satisfied with the current process, they should then " lead the charge " .

Eddie , EMT-P

Director of Clinical Services

4100 Ed Bluestein Blvd., Suite 100

Austin, TX 78721

ext. 110

_____

From: texasems-l [mailto:texasems-l ] On

Behalf Of Mike

Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2006 8:26 PM

To: texasems-l

Subject: Re: National Registry

The concept is called " economy of scale. " Essentially, once they've put out

the costs to get started in any one state, the cost of rolling the testing

process out to other states is incrementally lower and thusly produces a

greater return on investment.

There's no good ROI for the state to re-create a testing system...

Mike

On 12/7/06, Debbie Fishbeck <lcambulance@ <mailto:lcambulance%40techisp.com>

techisp.com> wrote:

>

> Yes. If there is not enough funding in this project why is the National

> Registry Company doing it?

>

> DSF

>

>

> Re: National Registry

>

> Are you asking for a petition to the State of Texas to move from the NR to

> a

> " state based test " ?

>

> While I doubt they'd entertain the thought given the cost of doing a

> " state

>

> testing system " (yes, I know you had one in place once but that was then

> this

> is now) and their current lack of manpower and funds to do what they are

> currently mandated to do already hence you'd be adding another layer with

> no

> likely source of income (the fees would barely cover the administration of

> a test

> let alone the development and maintenance of such a testing system in my

> opinion.

>

> Is that what you're looking to do?

>

> Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

> FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

> Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

>

> LNMolino (AT) aol (DOT) <mailto:LNMolino%40aol.com> com <LNMolino%40aol.com>

>

> (Cell Phone)

> (Home Phone)

> (IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

> (IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

>

> " A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

>

> " Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

> discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

>

> The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and

> the

> author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

> organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with

> unless I

> specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended

> only

> for its

> stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

> retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain

> by

> the

> original author.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Florida was using a company called SMT, they did a short stint with National

Registry and were unhappy.

I haven't kept up with it lately, but they were in the process of developing

their own exam again last I heard.

Hatfield FF/EMT-P

www.canyonlakefire-ems.org <http://www.canyonlakefire-ems.org/>

" Ubi concordia, ibi victoria "

Re: National Registry

In a message dated 12/7/2006 9:05:59 P.M. Central Standard Time,

ewalker@metrocareem <mailto:ewalker%40metrocareems.com> s.com writes:

Several states utilize

on line testing for EMS candidates for their states by contracting with

companies that supply professional examinations such as EMS, nursing, PA,

medical assistants, as well as other professions. IF

For certification? Who? What vendors?

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino (AT) aol (DOT) <mailto:LNMolino%40aol.com> com

(Cell Phone)

(Home Phone)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with

unless I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only

for its

stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by

the

original author.

[Guest guest]

>

> But Mike, there really isn't a need to recreate it. Several states utilize

> on line testing for EMS candidates for their states by contracting with

> companies that supply professional examinations such as EMS, nursing, PA,

> medical assistants, as well as other professions.

But someone has to /make/ the tests. The computer delivery is a

rather easy process - and even that's being done by contractors, not

by NR themselves. More below...

> IF the NR is such a

> problem and IF there are viable alternatives out there, shouldn't they be

> explored? Question is: who will do the exploring? If EMS educators are not

> satisfied with the current process, they should then " lead the charge " .

I honestly don't know what, if any, alternatives to the NR exam still

exist. I thought that was the original question - Texas used to have

a state exam... and that exam was de facto competition against the NR

exam while it existed. What, if any, options for tests other than NR

that Texas would possibly accept is a question I don't know the answer

to, and I'm not sure which GETAC committee that would ultimately rest

with but Education seems like a reasonable starting point.

Mike

[Guest guest]

>

> Mike beat me to the punch on this answer. The bottom line is that Texas,

> even with the large number of certifications that we do in a given years

could

> simply not afford to develop valid tests at all of the levels that we'd

need.

I don't know that I agree with that statement. I don't know because I

don't know what it USED to cost, what it costs NOW (does the state pay

NR for administering the tests, or does NR pay the state for all the

student referrals for our students that take the NR test?), and I have

no basis to figure what it would cost to do it AGAIN in the FUTURE.

I think that needs to be studied, though, if NR is still being

recalcitrant with regards to customer service.

> Historically speaking a government entity can't operate like a business and

> that too has a place in this discussion.

Carole Keeton Rylander Strayhorn Padraig Herrington

had a theory that government shouldn't do anything it could find a

provider for in the phone book.

Consolidation seems to be key right now, though, and you'd have to

think that the state universities could/should have a stake in

developing and validating exams for all sorts of state licensures...

it would be a great way to use interns seeking management, education

and statistical/math degrees (for a start).

Mike

[Guest guest]

DSHS has been wanting out of the testing biz for a very long time.

Remember when your local TDHHS Consultant would come out and do skills

and written tests, and grade everything right there?

Whenever DSHS put out the RFP and no bids came back except for an

alternative from the NR, no further attempt was made to look for

anything else. The NR bid was excepted, most likely before the NR sent

their bid back to Austin. At the GETAC meeting where it was announced,

Bill Brown from the NR sat there grinning like a Cheshire cat that ate

the canary, despite an angry crowd. He had fulfilled the lifelong dream

of getting Texas. DSHS was out of the testing biz. Everybody was happy

- right?

Going to a computer generated test is nothing new. In 1993, a plan was

developed by a TDH-EMS regional staff to contract with Sylvin Learning

Centers. The plan never went anywhere.

Going through Columbus, Ohio to get something done in let's say -

Catus, Texas - is always going to create problems. Fingers fly in 100

different directions when there is a problem. Confusion reigns.

Precious time is lost in waiting for results. Remember when your

regional TDH office graded the exams and got you back results within 72

hours?

I was an NREMT-P from 1984-2000. In that time I voluntarily re-took

the exam 3 times to keep up with it. I thought the NR was a superior

exam to the TDH exam until about the early 90's where the TDH exam

paralleled the NR.

The NR, in my opinion, has an invalid exam because of the use of

subscales. No testing and measure professional I have talked to has any

idea why the NR can get by with using subscales for failure with so

little sample size and overriding overall score. The NR provides no

research into their theory, other than saying - " We've never been sued

and we spend a lot of money on this exam " .

Our previous skills verification was superior to the NR. Remember the

8 hour examiner course? Any random dude can examine NR skills. We

hire our own examiners for the NR skills tests(who we train how to do

skills exams), and have to pay someone to come out sort the NR skills

sheets. We did that for free before the NR.

Does DSHS pay the NR for any services? Don't know... Could DSHS have

re-tooled the RFP and kept the state tests? Don't know.....

Would DSHS consider for one minute getting back into the testing biz?

Most likely not.... Would DSHS pay attention to any petition signed by

20,000 EMS certificants? Most likely not.....

The only possible way out of the NR is through an EMS Commission, which

has it's down side.... that's a whole thing to itself.

-MH

>>> " Eddie " 12/7/2006 8:59 pm >>>

But Mike, there really isn't a need to recreate it. Several states

utilize

on line testing for EMS candidates for their states by contracting

with

companies that supply professional examinations such as EMS, nursing,

PA,

medical assistants, as well as other professions. IF the NR is such a

problem and IF there are viable alternatives out there, shouldn't they

be

explored? Question is: who will do the exploring? If EMS educators are

not

satisfied with the current process, they should then " lead the

charge " .

Eddie , EMT-P

Director of Clinical Services

4100 Ed Bluestein Blvd., Suite 100

Austin, TX 78721

ext. 110

_____

From: texasems-l [mailto:texasems-l ]

On

Behalf Of Mike

Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2006 8:26 PM

To: texasems-l

Subject: Re: National Registry

The concept is called " economy of scale. " Essentially, once they've put

out

the costs to get started in any one state, the cost of rolling the

testing

process out to other states is incrementally lower and thusly produces

a

greater return on investment.

There's no good ROI for the state to re-create a testing system...

Mike

On 12/7/06, Debbie Fishbeck <lcambulance@

<mailto:lcambulance%40techisp.com>

techisp.com> wrote:

>

> Yes. If there is not enough funding in this project why is the

National

> Registry Company doing it?

>

> DSF

>

>

> Re: National Registry

>

> Are you asking for a petition to the State of Texas to move from the

NR to

> a

> " state based test " ?

>

> While I doubt they'd entertain the thought given the cost of doing a

> " state

>

> testing system " (yes, I know you had one in place once but that was

then

> this

> is now) and their current lack of manpower and funds to do what they

are

> currently mandated to do already hence you'd be adding another layer

with

> no

> likely source of income (the fees would barely cover the

administration of

> a test

> let alone the development and maintenance of such a testing system in

my

> opinion.

>

> Is that what you're looking to do?

>

> Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

> FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

> Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection

Consultant

>

> LNMolino (AT) aol (DOT) <mailto:LNMolino%40aol.com> com <LNMolino%40aol.com>

>

> (Cell Phone)

> (Home Phone)

> (IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

> (IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

>

> " A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

>

> " Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small

minds

> discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 -

1962)

>

> The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author

and

> the

> author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

> organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated

with

> unless I

> specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is

intended

> only

> for its

> stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential

materials

> retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public

domain

> by

> the

> original author.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Reply in the body of the text.

Eddie , EMT-P

Director of Clinical Services

4100 Ed Bluestein Blvd., Suite 100

Austin, TX 78721

ext. 110

_____

From: texasems-l [mailto:texasems-l ] On

Behalf Of Mike

Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2006 10:11 PM

To: texasems-l

Subject: Re: National Registry

On 12/7/06, lnmolino (AT) aol (DOT) <mailto:lnmolino%40aol.com> com <lnmolino (AT) aol (DOT)

<mailto:lnmolino%40aol.com> com> wrote:

>

> Mike beat me to the punch on this answer. The bottom line is that Texas,

> even with the large number of certifications that we do in a given years

could

> simply not afford to develop valid tests at all of the levels that we'd

need.

I don't know that I agree with that statement. I don't know because I

don't know what it USED to cost, what it costs NOW (does the state pay

NR for administering the tests, or does NR pay the state for all the

student referrals for our students that take the NR test?), and I have

no basis to figure what it would cost to do it AGAIN in the FUTURE.

EW: The contract was, I think, a little over $200K for exam development

before the exam problem we experienced in 2001. NR does not pay the state to

administer the First Responder or EMT exams. The state does it to maintain

control over who can take the exam, nor does NR pay the state any money. The

cost is borne by the students taking the exams.

I think that needs to be studied, though, if NR is still being

recalcitrant with regards to customer service.

> Historically speaking a government entity can't operate like a business

and

> that too has a place in this discussion.

Carole Keeton Rylander Strayhorn Padraig Herrington

had a theory that government shouldn't do anything it could find a

provider for in the phone book.

Consolidation seems to be key right now, though, and you'd have to

think that the state universities could/should have a stake in

developing and validating exams for all sorts of state licensures...

it would be a great way to use interns seeking management, education

and statistical/math degrees (for a start).

EW: Mike, that's how we got into this to start with. Come by the office

sometime, but me a Pepsi and I'll tell ya the story.

Eddie

[Guest guest]

Gene, I couldn't agree with you more. When I was at Brazosport College, I

was teaching five classes. I went to the Dean to ask for help and his reply

was, " You will have to have at least 44 students for 3 consecutive semesters

before we will hire anyone " . I realized then it was a business and the

bottom line was the almighty buck.

Eddie , EMT-P

Director of Clinical Services

4100 Ed Bluestein Blvd., Suite 100

Austin, TX 78721

ext. 110

_____

From: texasems-l [mailto:texasems-l ] On

Behalf Of wegandy1938@...

Sent: Friday, December 08, 2006 1:22 AM

To: paramedicop@...; texasems-l

Subject: Re: National Registry

The universities have absolutely no interest in EMS programs for the most

part. The community colleges have that franchise, but they are only

interested

in the cashflow from the programs. They are not going to get involved in EMS

testing unless you can show them a huge payoff. That's all they understand.

All the crap you read about colleges and universities being better at

teaching EMS is just that: CRAP. The program directors answer to deans and

vice

presidents who have not the faintest clue about EMS and couldn't care less

about it. It's all about the bottom line.

You see, education is a BUSINESS. Yes, a BUSINESS. Whether or not it's

done by colleges, universities, or private academies, it's a business, just

like

Uncle Joe's Spiffy Used Cars is a business.

And college administrators are not much different from Uncle Joe. Except

that Uncle Joe is likely to be more honest than your average college

administrator.

So unless you can show them how they can make a ton of money by developing

and administering EMS exams, it ain't gonna happen. Couple that with the

fact

that college and university administrators are conservative to the extreme,

scared spitless of taking a chance on anything, and unwilling to buy into

anything that's not a slam dunk.

And yes, I am prejudiced. I spent 14 years at a community college, fighting

the bureaucracy all the time, and I finally lost, so yes, I have sour

grapes.

That's why I now work for a private academy where I can do the things that

I know are right for education without having to deal with dumbass Deans.

If we want an alternative to NREMT, we should look to the private testing

services. There are many and they are quite good at what they do. NREMT

wants

us to believe that it's the ONLY testing organization that can do EMS

testing

competently. Don't believe it. There are plenty of others.

Gene G.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/8/2006 9:46:29 A.M. Central Standard Time,

mhudson@... writes:

Would DSHS pay attention to any petition signed by 20,000 EMS certificants?

My first question is could you even get a legitimate verifiable petition

like that. ly if you could DSHS would not be the one I'd take it to the

State legislature would be and if you had even 2,500 I have a feeling that

they'd listen.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino@...

(Cell Phone)

(Home Phone)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless

I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for

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stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the

original author.

[Guest guest]

Dudley.

They are still working on that site, I will let you all know as soon as they

get the contract sign and they give us a start date.

Maxie