Re: Tactical Medicine and other specialties

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/6/2006 2:15:41 P.M. Central Daylight Time,

manemtp@... writes:

Totally agree. I've seen a decay in maturity, and work ethic. Simple

things, like showing up on time, and being in proper uniform have declined

to the point of absurdity. It shames me to be associated with some of our

peers.

Mike you're describing the classic generations old " the youth are the ruin

of the Nation " statements that my Mother would say about the generation that

preceded me (she was 42 when I was born so I'm a mid generation baby).

My parents were born in 1922 and 1929 so for most of my 40ish peers these

would be their grand parents so I was raised with a skewed ethic's set as it

were.

Many of my parents peers will tell you that the world over all has gone to

pot since their day and that if back when they were 19ish (I have four teens so

I know and understand your point) or so they did what today's teens do

they'd get their butts kicked over and over hence they didn't do it. We spared

the

rod and spoiled the child in many ways in the US over the past 50 years or

so!

the decay in maturity and loss of work ethic and all of the things you

mention are well a social statement of life in these United states as a whole a

they are an observation of life in EMS.

I doubt we can fix the problems of the world so the question as I see it is

how do we work with what we get?

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino@...

(Cell Phone)

(Home Phone)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

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[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/6/2006 2:21:27 P.M. Central Daylight Time,

paramedic1@... writes:

We'll never grow up to be medical professionals if we ignore the patient,

and focus on the toys.

Ah but we can't even agree if we are " medical " or " public safety " or as I

like to think some hybrid of the two.

we fight over fire versus 3rd service and wether or not we need a Class A

Dress uniform and things like that all the time and then when we do talk patient

care many ignore science completely in favor of " what feels right " .

If a guy like Bledsoe shows EMS 50 studies that say XYZ does not work or may

in fact cause harm we bounce back to the old mantra of " we always did it

this way " or something to that effect.

The focus on toys is not unique to EMS but let's face it it's only one of

several character flaws that " EMS " as a whole has to face.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino@...

(Cell Phone)

(Home Phone)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless

I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for

its

stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the

original author.

[Guest guest]

Wes;

The challenge should be the medical knowledge you were supposed to gain in

your initial and continuing education.

I asked my daughter who is an EMT-Basic in Virginia about her training. In my

opinion the EMT-Basic training went fast with little time to absorb. She too

informed me she felt the same way. I have instructed others and have found the

same.

There is a lot of challenge in the EMS field. The perpetual question: How do

we thin the population without throwing the babies out with the bath water?

You are not alone.

ExLngHrn@... wrote:

I just read Dr. Bledsoe's posting about the alleged hijinks of several

tactical medics in the Houston area.

I recognize that there are times and places where additional training in

tactical medicine or other " special operations " such as HazMat or ropes are

needed in EMS. However, it seems like we have too many people who place the

special operations aspect of their job ahead of the medical aspect of their job.

Remember, we're here to provide patient care. The additional

training/qualifications are supposedly there to help us gain additional

knowledge and skills to provide patient care in difficult to access situations.

I've asked some of my colleagues why they get additional training in some of

these disciplines. I'm almost always told that it's " for the challenge. " Pardon

me for saying this, but the medicine and patient care aspects are a sufficient

challenge -- assuming you took it seriously to begin with.

I'm sure I'll get some flames, but I had to get this off of my chest.

-Wes Ogilvie

Attorney/EMT

Austin, Texas

__________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

Wes, It doesn't have anything to do with the additional training, it has to

do with the people. I'm not sure maturity can be taught!

Mike

Tactical Medicine and other " specialties "

I just read Dr. Bledsoe's posting about the alleged hijinks of several

tactical medics in the Houston area.

I recognize that there are times and places where additional training in

tactical medicine or other " special operations " such as HazMat or ropes are

needed in EMS. However, it seems like we have too many people who place the

special operations aspect of their job ahead of the medical aspect of their

job. Remember, we're here to provide patient care. The additional

training/qualifications are supposedly there to help us gain additional

knowledge and skills to provide patient care in difficult to access

situations.

I've asked some of my colleagues why they get additional training in some of

these disciplines. I'm almost always told that it's " for the challenge. "

Pardon me for saying this, but the medicine and patient care aspects are a

sufficient challenge -- assuming you took it seriously to begin with.

I'm sure I'll get some flames, but I had to get this off of my chest.

-Wes Ogilvie

Attorney/EMT

Austin, Texas

__________________________________________________________

Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and

IM. All on demand. Always Free.

[Guest guest]

I've never said otherwise. It just troubles me that many (fortunately, not all)

in EMS lack the maturity to recognize that excellent patient care is enough of a

challenge REGARDLESS of the surroundings.

-Wes

Tactical Medicine and other " specialties "

I just read Dr. Bledsoe's posting about the alleged hijinks of several

tactical medics in the Houston area.

I recognize that there are times and places where additional training in

tactical medicine or other " special operations " such as HazMat or ropes are

needed in EMS. However, it seems like we have too many people who place the

special operations aspect of their job ahead of the medical aspect of their

job. Remember, we're here to provide patient care. The additional

training/qualifications are supposedly there to help us gain additional

knowledge and skills to provide patient care in difficult to access

situations.

I've asked some of my colleagues why they get additional training in some of

these disciplines. I'm almost always told that it's " for the challenge. "

Pardon me for saying this, but the medicine and patient care aspects are a

sufficient challenge -- assuming you took it seriously to begin with.

I'm sure I'll get some flames, but I had to get this off of my chest.

-Wes Ogilvie

Attorney/EMT

Austin, Texas

__________________________________________________________

Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and

IM. All on demand. Always Free.

[Guest guest]

Wes,

You have indeed hit on one of our biggest problems in EMS.

We don't see " patient care " as something to be good at, something to

improve and stive for excellence. Nor do many of us respect BLS level

skills and care as worthy of development. Now the ALS technician level

skills like IVs, EKGs, Intubation, Medication administration, those

things we can see, feel, touch, and they are COOL things to do. So we

can see trying to be better at that. But general patient care skills,

critical thinking, and assessment, particularly at the BLS level, is

" beneath " many of us. And those are the very areas we fail at most

miserably.

We'll never grow up to be medical professionals if we ignore the

patient, and focus on the toys.

=Steve , LP=

ExLngHrn@... wrote:

> I've never said otherwise. It just troubles me that many (fortunately, not

all) in EMS lack the maturity to recognize that excellent patient care is enough

of a challenge REGARDLESS of the surroundings.

>

> -Wes

>

> Tactical Medicine and other " specialties "

>

> I just read Dr. Bledsoe's posting about the alleged hijinks of several

> tactical medics in the Houston area.

>

> I recognize that there are times and places where additional training in

> tactical medicine or other " special operations " such as HazMat or ropes are

> needed in EMS. However, it seems like we have too many people who place the

> special operations aspect of their job ahead of the medical aspect of their

> job. Remember, we're here to provide patient care. The additional

> training/qualifications are supposedly there to help us gain additional

> knowledge and skills to provide patient care in difficult to access

> situations.

>

> I've asked some of my colleagues why they get additional training in some of

> these disciplines. I'm almost always told that it's " for the challenge. "

> Pardon me for saying this, but the medicine and patient care aspects are a

> sufficient challenge -- assuming you took it seriously to begin with.

>

> I'm sure I'll get some flames, but I had to get this off of my chest.

>

> -Wes Ogilvie

> Attorney/EMT

> Austin, Texas

> __________________________________________________________

> Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and

> IM. All on demand. Always Free.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Totally agree. I've seen a decay in maturity, and work ethic. Simple

things, like showing up on time, and being in proper uniform have declined

to the point of absurdity. It shames me to be associated with some of our

peers. THE PATIENT above all. Maybe that should be Texas EMS's Mantra.

Don't you find it easy to just rant?

The solution for me, is simply put, a personal choice. I do a good job at

what I do, and give 110% because I care, or I wouldn't be doing it. But

that's a conscious decision on my part. I learn more, not because someone

tells me to, but because I want to. Doing a half a$$ job isn't what I'm

about. Do it right, or don't do it. Be an adult.

anyway.

Mike

Tactical Medicine and other " specialties "

I just read Dr. Bledsoe's posting about the alleged hijinks of several

tactical medics in the Houston area.

I recognize that there are times and places where additional training in

tactical medicine or other " special operations " such as HazMat or ropes are

needed in EMS. However, it seems like we have too many people who place the

special operations aspect of their job ahead of the medical aspect of their

job. Remember, we're here to provide patient care. The additional

training/qualifications are supposedly there to help us gain additional

knowledge and skills to provide patient care in difficult to access

situations.

I've asked some of my colleagues why they get additional training in some of

these disciplines. I'm almost always told that it's " for the challenge. "

Pardon me for saying this, but the medicine and patient care aspects are a

sufficient challenge -- assuming you took it seriously to begin with.

I'm sure I'll get some flames, but I had to get this off of my chest.

-Wes Ogilvie

Attorney/EMT

Austin, Texas

__________________________________________________________

Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and

IM. All on demand. Always Free.

[Guest guest]

I totally agree with you on that. People do not care about there job. I know

when I started I couldn't find a job. It is not that way anymore everyone is

hiring. If you get fired all you have to do is move on down the road. I feel

that pay has big part with that. When we do not require a lot of education to

be paramedic what kind of person do we expect to take those positions. I feel

that education is the key to aquiring proffesional people and raising pay.

" A. " wrote: Totally agree. I've seen

a decay in maturity, and work ethic. Simple

things, like showing up on time, and being in proper uniform have declined

to the point of absurdity. It shames me to be associated with some of our

peers. THE PATIENT above all. Maybe that should be Texas EMS's Mantra.

Don't you find it easy to just rant?

The solution for me, is simply put, a personal choice. I do a good job at

what I do, and give 110% because I care, or I wouldn't be doing it. But

that's a conscious decision on my part. I learn more, not because someone

tells me to, but because I want to. Doing a half a$$ job isn't what I'm

about. Do it right, or don't do it. Be an adult.

anyway.

Mike

Tactical Medicine and other " specialties "

I just read Dr. Bledsoe's posting about the alleged hijinks of several

tactical medics in the Houston area.

I recognize that there are times and places where additional training in

tactical medicine or other " special operations " such as HazMat or ropes are

needed in EMS. However, it seems like we have too many people who place the

special operations aspect of their job ahead of the medical aspect of their

job. Remember, we're here to provide patient care. The additional

training/qualifications are supposedly there to help us gain additional

knowledge and skills to provide patient care in difficult to access

situations.

I've asked some of my colleagues why they get additional training in some of

these disciplines. I'm almost always told that it's " for the challenge. "

Pardon me for saying this, but the medicine and patient care aspects are a

sufficient challenge -- assuming you took it seriously to begin with.

I'm sure I'll get some flames, but I had to get this off of my chest.

-Wes Ogilvie

Attorney/EMT

Austin, Texas

__________________________________________________________

Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and

IM. All on demand. Always Free.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/6/2006 9:18:26 P.M. Central Daylight Time,

preyn2@... writes:

Lead by example. Nobody gets out of bed in the morning and makes a

conscious decision to screw up; our default course of action is to do the right

thing

100% of the time. The kids we all complain about will do the right thing

when we,

their adult supervision, tell them what to do and show them that it's

important by setting the example for them.

While I hope you are right and I even tend to agree with you at times like

our forefathers (or in my case my Mother) maybe I'm too close to it seeing my

kids do what they do but even they at times surprise me and " do the right

thing " .

You do have a valid point as 20 years ago I too was a snot nosed kid that

thought he knew it all now I know I know nothing really.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino@...

(Cell Phone)

(Home Phone)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless

I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for

its

stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the

original author.

[Guest guest]

--- lnmolino@... wrote:

> Mike you're describing the classic generations

> old " the youth are the ruin

> of the Nation " statements that my Mother would

> say about the generation that

> preceded me (she was 42 when I was born so I'm

> a mid generation baby).

This statement, or one similar, has been made by

everyone at one time or another. We all talk

trash about " those damn rookies " , just as the

people who were already here when we arrived

talked trash about us.

" This sorry generation " is fighting in

Afganistan, Iraq, and countless other places

around the world today, and by many accounts

they're doing it at great sacrifice under

terrible conditions, yet they serve honorably.

Twenty years ago I was a snot-nosed punk; today

others are snot-nosed punks. I think I turned

out OK, just as many people I've called

snot-nosed punks turned out just fine.

Lead by example. Nobody gets out of bed in the

morning and makes a conscious decision to screw

up; our default course of action is to do the

right thing 100% of the time. The kids we all

complain about will do the right thing when we,

their adult supervision, tell them what to do and

show them that it's important by setting the

example for them.

phil

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

>>>Lead by example.

There are volumes spoken in those few words.

Mike