Guest guest Posted January 11, 2005 Report Share Posted January 11, 2005 Hi there, I hope everyone had a good New Year's celebration! I've been trying to catch up on reading the posts that I missed over the holiday period. Phew, it's a lot of reading. Hats off to the moderators and faithful contributors to this site. Your steadfastness is to be admired. Now for my questions - Do you think that the only real cure for Atrial Fib. is " the full meal deal " of ablating all the pulmonary ostia? Do you think there is still a place for only ablating a site in the left atrium either in or near one of the pulmonary openings? If I were to have this type of ablation done, what is the liklihood that another site in the left atrium would pick up and cause its owm irregularity? It seems likely that the smaller centres are tentatively venturing into the left atrium so are starting with the less extensive ablating. I guess with the smaller amount of ablating there is less risk involved in the procedure? Is it still considered a success if you end up with a reduced dose of medication? Maybe your liver and kidneys would thank you at least! Your insights are always appreciated and food for thought! Germaine Canada propafenone, atenolol, warfarin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2005 Report Share Posted January 11, 2005 Hi there, happy new year to you. I am a little bit out of touch since having my PVA in 2001, at last things are moving on with more Dr's involved in the treatments of AF. At that time I met with Prof Hassigurre and Dr Jias in France, it was explained to me that they had patients from all walks of life. I was given an example of a Farmer who was in his 60s and had AF for over 30years and an airline stewardess of 25 years who had only had AF for a year. You would have thought that the Farmer would have electrical disease in all of his pulmonary veins and in the atria and in fact he only had one vein that was diseased. The stewardess on the other hand had all the veins faulty with electrical problems. At that time in 2001, there was no way of telling how many veins were faulty or how many points would need ablating. I was assured at that time the only way was to have a full EP test done in my heart. Like wise with me I use to be very fit and lean, but I had all four veins faulty and two spots in the Atria. This is completely no substantiated but just a guess and not educated at all. I had terrible trouble trying to control my AF. I am an engineer by training and I have always observed that if you had a tricky hard to find fault then usually there was one or more faults with the equipment. I do not know if you can use that observation to your body, it may have some truth in it. Perhaps other may want to comment on that. I think that is what your after. C > Now for my questions - Do you think that the only real cure for > Atrial Fib. is " the full meal deal " of ablating all the pulmonary > ostia? Do you think there is still a place for only ablating a site > in the left atrium either in or near one of the pulmonary openings? > If I were to have this type of ablation done, what is the liklihood > that another site in the left atrium would pick up and cause its owm > irregularity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2005 Report Share Posted January 11, 2005 In a message dated 1/11/05 9:07:34 AM Pacific Standard Time, bookman00@... writes: > A slightly over-ablated atriun seems to me to be preferable to going back > in for a touch up. You might not say that if you had an over-ablated heart that caused permanent heart damage ... touch-ups and safety are highly preferable to me. Your mileage may vary. Toni CA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2005 Report Share Posted January 11, 2005 Re: Ablation " full meal deal? " >>SNIP<< | This is completely no substantiated but just a guess and not educated at all. I had terrible trouble trying to control my AF. I am an engineer by training and I have always observed that if you had a tricky hard to find fault then usually there was one or more faults with the equipment. I do not know if you can use that observation to your body, it may have some truth in it. Perhaps other may want to comment on that. Your body is entirely too complicated for anyone, even the most trained, to be certain that a single cause is definitely at fault. Most often the doctors see symptoms, which cause more problems, and you can be chasing symptoms forever, which is still common. As far as equipment, compared to the complexity of your bodies, no machine or piece of hardware, despite its high tech and ultra expensive design, will ever come close to matching that complexity. So, you are right about the equipment in the light of the above comment, but not that there is any fault with the equipment. It just isn't, and never will be, good enough. Doctors are really good at making educated guesses, some just better than others due to more experience and training. My take on it in a nutshell is this: The laws of nature, if understood, can allow a person to be the master of his environment. People, while still conforming to that law of physics, are the exception in that we, in our limited understanding of the complex chemistry that is us, will never be understood completely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2005 Report Share Posted January 11, 2005 That makes sense to me - does not make me very hopeful of controlling or curing AF but it certainly makes sense. Re: Ablation " full meal deal? " > > > >>SNIP<< > > | This is completely no substantiated but just a guess and not educated at all. I had terrible trouble trying to control my AF. I am > an engineer by training and I have always observed that if you had a tricky hard to find fault then usually there was one or more > faults with the equipment. I do not know if you can use that observation to your body, it may have some truth in it. Perhaps other > may want to comment on that. > > Your body is entirely too complicated for anyone, even the most trained, to be certain that a single cause is definitely at > fault. Most often the doctors see symptoms, which cause more problems, and you can be chasing symptoms forever, which is still > common. As far as equipment, compared to the complexity of your bodies, no machine or piece of hardware, despite its high tech and > ultra expensive design, will ever come close to matching that complexity. So, you are right about the equipment in the light of the > above comment, but not that there is any fault with the equipment. It just isn't, and never will be, good enough. Doctors are > really good at making educated guesses, some just better than others due to more experience and training. > > My take on it in a nutshell is this: The laws of nature, if understood, can allow a person to be the master of his environment. > People, while still conforming to that law of physics, are the exception in that we, in our limited understanding of the complex > chemistry that is us, will never be understood completely. > > > > > > Web Page - http://www.afibsupport.com > List owner: AFIBsupport-owner > For help on how to use the group, including how to drive it via email, > send a blank email to AFIBsupport-help > > Nothing in this message should be considered as medical advice, or should be acted upon without consultation with one's physician. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2005 Report Share Posted January 11, 2005 The question was ,how do you know how many Veins or foci will need to be contused with radio Frequency waves. I was trying to qualify and answer this and I would love to be proved wrong . I said If your AF is hard to control then as with equipment that I have worked on , it may be that there is more than one fault. Again this is only a guess on my part and I do not have any evidence to prove this. It may mean if your AF is troublesome you may have lots of electrical disease in your heart. I cannot understand your reply below.!! What has this to do with the amount of electrical problems in ones heart. I do take your point that the body is far more complex than any other bit of equipment on this earth but I did say it was a guess on my part. C Uk > >> Your body is entirely too complicated for anyone, even the most > trained, to be certain that a single cause is definitely at >> fault. Most often the doctors see symptoms, which cause more problems, > and you can be chasing symptoms forever, which is still >> common. As far as equipment, compared to the complexity of your bodies, > no machine or piece of hardware, despite its high tech and >> ultra expensive design, will ever come close to matching that complexity. > So, you are right about the equipment in the light of the >> above comment, but not that there is any fault with the equipment. It > just isn't, and never will be, good enough. Doctors are >> really good at making educated guesses, some just better than others due > to more experience and training. >> >> My take on it in a nutshell is this: The laws of nature, if > understood, can allow a person to be the master of his environment. >> People, while still conforming to that law of physics, are the exception > in that we, in our limited understanding of the complex >> chemistry that is us, will never be understood completely. >> >> >> >> >> >> Web Page - http://www.afibsupport.com >> List owner: AFIBsupport-owner >> For help on how to use the group, including how to drive it via email, >> send a blank email to AFIBsupport-help >> >> Nothing in this message should be considered as medical advice, or should > be acted upon without consultation with one's physician. >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2005 Report Share Posted January 11, 2005 Bill Manson " Here's what I understand about hockey: Bulky men wearing helmets and carrying sticks in their gauntleted hands skate around for a while on my TV; then some guy comes on and sells trucks. " -- King Re: Ablation " full meal deal? " You might not say that if you had an over-ablated heart that caused permanent heart damage ... touch-ups and safety are highly preferable to me. Your mileage may vary. Toni, you've hit on absolute truth. More than most places on the internet, this is the list where " Your mileage may vary. " sums it all up. Between the differences in the condition and the differences in our reactions to it, all is variation. Bill Manson " Here's what I understand about hockey: Bulky men wearing helmets and carrying sticks in their gauntleted hands skate around for a while on my TV; then some guy comes on and sells trucks. " -- King Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.