Guest guest Posted September 21, 2004 Report Share Posted September 21, 2004 Hi Steph! Tanner was able to talk before he started kindergarten. You can hear him over a few years here http://www.debtsmart.com/talk/tanner.html Most of our children here are talking by kindergarten to some extent. Was Tanner talking close to age appropriate? No, he was and still is a bit behind on his expressive ability. His sentences were and most times still are shorter and less complex than others his age. If your child does not have an impairment of speech and just has a simple delay -then of course he would be able to take verbal based tests. I'm talking about the rising group of children in the world who do not have just a delay -but have an impairment. There is no such thing (we wish there was) as " childhood " apraxia. Apraxia, like stuttering and other impairments of speech, are impairments our children learn to overcome. And as I've posted many times -perhaps these impairments come with positives for even greater learning due to increased memory ability. Tanner is very bright and has always been a top student, and great in social skills. He is very good at knowing how to blend in. How to say just enough to fit into the group without being the one who does most of the talking. Tanner used to be shy in groups while in preschool and nonverbal. Today Tanner is friends with everyone both at school and here in the neighborhood -far from shy today. Tanner's funny, playful, a good sport most of the time, and friends with children his own age and even children a year or two older. Tanner is in second grade now and still receives top grades in all subjects. He wrote last year that he loves to write sentences. Nonverbal or not -Tanner can write any of his thoughts. Because Tanner's speech is babyish most of the time for his age -even though he's a straight A student even at the end of last year his teacher was still saying " It's just amazing how well he's doing " It's " amazing " because to hear him talk, most assume he would be slower. Speech like vision or hearing doesn't auto link to cognitive ability. A child with an impairment vs. a delay of speech may be able to talk, and be able to blend in to be just like most, most of the time. Most of the time is still not all of the time. As a parent or one with that child all the time, you will know the other side. Just because a child can " talk " which is relative - still doesn't mean that a verbal based IQ test will be appropriate. Did you read what the verbal based test was like when Tanner was transitioning into kindergarten? He only needed to say " one word " http://www.cherab.org/information/familiesrelate/letter.html (read updates towards bottom of page) There will always be words no matter how well Tanner (or any like him with a speech impairment) does going ahead that he may not be able to say. If you wear glasses or contacts and someone gave you a visual based IQ test and didn't let you use your glasses or contacts that is like giving a verbal disabled child a verbal test. No matter the degree of the disability or impairment -it's an unfair advantage. If the child can write -let them write the answer. It's also considered by the US Department of Civil Rights a violation of our children's Civil Rights to give a child with a verbal disability a verbal based IQ test no matter what the results. If my child was visually or hearing impaired would I hear " It's only one picture he needs to see " or " It's only one word he needs to hear " There are words that Tanner has blocks with -has more trouble with than others. If your child is unable to speak up for him or herself there is something you should all know. The laws are not clear enough yet, and most will give verbal based tests to school aged children. So in other words -unless you fight it -that's just what your child will get. And when the results come back " low average " like they did for my son Tanner who is a whiz at school and a straight A student in an accelerated academics school, a child who scores way above age level in nonverbal IQ tests, then maybe you'll know why I am as strongly against verbal based testing for the verbal disabled as I am. http://www.cherab.org/news/verbaldisabledtest.html (by the way -that test was the one I refer to by Dr. Rosenthal. It's such an important study to not only study -but follow! Our kids are auto put in this study by society -the opposite way. It's up to us to help them fight the stigma. And I can tell you as I've told Dr. Rosenthal that his study does work with our kids. Tanner proves it! Again any graduate students interested in being part of this study email me at lisa@... ) ===== Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 21, 2004 Report Share Posted September 21, 2004 Thanks , I am still just starting to deal witht The apraxia part of Taft's struggles as the last year has been focused mainly on his phyiscal. Taft has an actual dx of motor apraxia (neuro included verbal in that dx) Anyway, I am just trying to figure out exactly how this is going to effect him, as I want to be prepared when those test do come up. I guess right now Im just thinking speech is speech and wouldn't have thought about the test later on. He has had five playgroup teachers at EI and four of them have talked to him like he is sooo slow. I know that he is bright and it irritates the heck out of me he was able to point out all of his shapes today when asked but he won't do anything for them because they expect nothing. So I am already preparing to find ways to 'up' the expectations for him. I did have a talk with his new playgroup teacher and she has been getting a lot more words out of him because she has him actually try, they literally would skip over him when they were suppose to request bubbles at circle time and just tell him to sign please. ahhh. Taft is weird because he without a question has oral and motor apraxia. but im not so sure about verbal? is that even possible? He has very few words and doesn't talk on own but if you ask him a question he will respond right away with the correct word 'approx' he has no trouble finding the words when asked a question but he rarely trys to talk. Would that fit Verbal apraxia? I don't know my neuro just said if he has words by two he will be talking with 95% intelligibilty at five. Not much help in my opinion. OH well, thanks so much for the information. I hope my post wasn't coming across as rude, im truly just trying to feel myself around this. I have no doubt Taft can overcome apraxia but im thankful I can use all of your children for 'research' . Im just trying to take care of my five P's (proper planning prevents poor preformance) in order for when Taft starts school testing in a few months. thanks. Steph & Taft 31 months > Tanner was able to talk before he started kindergarten. You can hear > him over a few years here > http://www.debtsmart.com/talk/tanner.html > > Most of our children here are talking by kindergarten to some > extent. Was Tanner talking close to age appropriate? No, he was > and still is a bit behind on his expressive ability. His sentences > were and most times still are shorter and less complex than others > his age. If your child does not have an impairment of speech and > just has a simple delay -then of course he would be able to take > verbal based tests. I'm talking about the rising group of children > in the world who do not have just a delay -but have an impairment. > There is no such thing (we wish there was) as " childhood " apraxia. > Apraxia, like stuttering and other impairments of speech, are > impairments our children learn to overcome. And as I've posted many > times -perhaps these impairments come with positives for even > greater learning due to increased memory ability. > > Tanner is very bright and has always been a top student, and great > in social skills. He is very good at knowing how to blend in. How > to say just enough to fit into the group without being the one who > does most of the talking. Tanner used to be shy in groups while in > preschool and nonverbal. Today Tanner is friends with everyone both > at school and here in the neighborhood -far from shy today. > Tanner's funny, playful, a good sport most of the time, and friends > with children his own age and even children a year or two older. > > Tanner is in second grade now and still receives top grades in all > subjects. He wrote last year that he loves to write sentences. > Nonverbal or not -Tanner can write any of his thoughts. Because > Tanner's speech is babyish most of the time for his age -even though > he's a straight A student even at the end of last year his teacher > was still saying " It's just amazing how well he's doing " > It's " amazing " because to hear him talk, most assume he would be > slower. Speech like vision or hearing doesn't auto link to > cognitive ability. > > A child with an impairment vs. a delay of speech may be able to > talk, and be able to blend in to be just like most, most of the > time. Most of the time is still not all of the time. As a parent > or one with that child all the time, you will know the other side. > Just because a child can " talk " which is relative - still doesn't > mean that a verbal based IQ test will be appropriate. Did you read > what the verbal based test was like when Tanner was transitioning > into kindergarten? He only needed to say " one word " > http://www.cherab.org/information/familiesrelate/letter.html > (read updates towards bottom of page) > > There will always be words no matter how well Tanner (or any like > him with a speech impairment) does going ahead that he may not be > able to say. If you wear glasses or contacts and someone gave you a > visual based IQ test and didn't let you use your glasses or contacts > that is like giving a verbal disabled child a verbal test. No > matter the degree of the disability or impairment -it's an unfair > advantage. If the child can write -let them write the answer. It's > also considered by the US Department of Civil Rights a violation of > our children's Civil Rights to give a child with a verbal disability > a verbal based IQ test no matter what the results. If my child was > visually or hearing impaired would I hear " It's only one picture he > needs to see " or " It's only one word he needs to hear " There are > words that Tanner has blocks with -has more trouble with than others. > > If your child is unable to speak up for him or herself there is > something you should all know. > > The laws are not clear enough yet, and most will give verbal based > tests to school aged children. So in other words -unless you fight > it -that's just what your child will get. And when the results come > back " low average " like they did for my son Tanner who is a whiz at > school and a straight A student in an accelerated academics school, > a child who scores way above age level in nonverbal IQ tests, then > maybe you'll know why I am as strongly against verbal based testing > for the verbal disabled as I am. > http://www.cherab.org/news/verbaldisabledtest.html > > (by the way -that test was the one I refer to by Dr. > Rosenthal. It's such an important study to not only study -but > follow! Our kids are auto put in this study by society -the opposite way. > It's up to us to help them fight the stigma. And I can tell you as > I've told Dr. Rosenthal that his study does work with our kids. > Tanner proves it! Again any graduate students interested in being > part of this study email me at lisa@c... ) > > ===== > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 21, 2004 Report Share Posted September 21, 2004 Attention Steph and Taft 31 months!!! My daughter was just diagnosed with Motor Apraxia. She will be 3 on Sunday Sept 26th. I would love to chat withyou regarding your son. You know just what he is like, symptoms he has, and really just how he is at doing things. My also has Hypotonia. Her limbs are just so floppy . This really concerns me. Anyway I hope to hear from you. I have bought and read the book The Late talker but it did not seem to have that much about the motor apaxia and hypotonia. Look forward to hearing from you. Angie and 3 yr verbal motor apraxia, hypotonia, Sensory Intergration disorder [ ] Re: KiddieTalk?? Thanks , I am still just starting to deal witht The apraxia part of Taft's struggles as the last year has been focused mainly on his phyiscal. Taft has an actual dx of motor apraxia (neuro included verbal in that dx) Anyway, I am just trying to figure out exactly how this is going to effect him, as I want to be prepared when those test do come up. I guess right now Im just thinking speech is speech and wouldn't have thought about the test later on. He has had five playgroup teachers at EI and four of them have talked to him like he is sooo slow. I know that he is bright and it irritates the heck out of me he was able to point out all of his shapes today when asked but he won't do anything for them because they expect nothing. So I am already preparing to find ways to 'up' the expectations for him. I did have a talk with his new playgroup teacher and she has been getting a lot more words out of him because she has him actually try, they literally would skip over him when they were suppose to request bubbles at circle time and just tell him to sign please. ahhh. Taft is weird because he without a question has oral and motor apraxia. but im not so sure about verbal? is that even possible? He has very few words and doesn't talk on own but if you ask him a question he will respond right away with the correct word 'approx' he has no trouble finding the words when asked a question but he rarely trys to talk. Would that fit Verbal apraxia? I don't know my neuro just said if he has words by two he will be talking with 95% intelligibilty at five. Not much help in my opinion. OH well, thanks so much for the information. I hope my post wasn't coming across as rude, im truly just trying to feel myself around this. I have no doubt Taft can overcome apraxia but im thankful I can use all of your children for 'research' . Im just trying to take care of my five P's (proper planning prevents poor preformance) in order for when Taft starts school testing in a few months. thanks. Steph & Taft 31 months > Tanner was able to talk before he started kindergarten. You can hear > him over a few years here > http://www.debtsmart.com/talk/tanner.html > > Most of our children here are talking by kindergarten to some > extent. Was Tanner talking close to age appropriate? No, he was > and still is a bit behind on his expressive ability. His sentences > were and most times still are shorter and less complex than others > his age. If your child does not have an impairment of speech and > just has a simple delay -then of course he would be able to take > verbal based tests. I'm talking about the rising group of children > in the world who do not have just a delay -but have an impairment. > There is no such thing (we wish there was) as " childhood " apraxia. > Apraxia, like stuttering and other impairments of speech, are > impairments our children learn to overcome. And as I've posted many > times -perhaps these impairments come with positives for even > greater learning due to increased memory ability. > > Tanner is very bright and has always been a top student, and great > in social skills. He is very good at knowing how to blend in. How > to say just enough to fit into the group without being the one who > does most of the talking. Tanner used to be shy in groups while in > preschool and nonverbal. Today Tanner is friends with everyone both > at school and here in the neighborhood -far from shy today. > Tanner's funny, playful, a good sport most of the time, and friends > with children his own age and even children a year or two older. > > Tanner is in second grade now and still receives top grades in all > subjects. He wrote last year that he loves to write sentences. > Nonverbal or not -Tanner can write any of his thoughts. Because > Tanner's speech is babyish most of the time for his age -even though > he's a straight A student even at the end of last year his teacher > was still saying " It's just amazing how well he's doing " > It's " amazing " because to hear him talk, most assume he would be > slower. Speech like vision or hearing doesn't auto link to > cognitive ability. > > A child with an impairment vs. a delay of speech may be able to > talk, and be able to blend in to be just like most, most of the > time. Most of the time is still not all of the time. As a parent > or one with that child all the time, you will know the other side. > Just because a child can " talk " which is relative - still doesn't > mean that a verbal based IQ test will be appropriate. Did you read > what the verbal based test was like when Tanner was transitioning > into kindergarten? He only needed to say " one word " > http://www.cherab.org/information/familiesrelate/letter.html > (read updates towards bottom of page) > > There will always be words no matter how well Tanner (or any like > him with a speech impairment) does going ahead that he may not be > able to say. If you wear glasses or contacts and someone gave you a > visual based IQ test and didn't let you use your glasses or contacts > that is like giving a verbal disabled child a verbal test. No > matter the degree of the disability or impairment -it's an unfair > advantage. If the child can write -let them write the answer. It's > also considered by the US Department of Civil Rights a violation of > our children's Civil Rights to give a child with a verbal disability > a verbal based IQ test no matter what the results. If my child was > visually or hearing impaired would I hear " It's only one picture he > needs to see " or " It's only one word he needs to hear " There are > words that Tanner has blocks with -has more trouble with than others. > > If your child is unable to speak up for him or herself there is > something you should all know. > > The laws are not clear enough yet, and most will give verbal based > tests to school aged children. So in other words -unless you fight > it -that's just what your child will get. And when the results come > back " low average " like they did for my son Tanner who is a whiz at > school and a straight A student in an accelerated academics school, > a child who scores way above age level in nonverbal IQ tests, then > maybe you'll know why I am as strongly against verbal based testing > for the verbal disabled as I am. > http://www.cherab.org/news/verbaldisabledtest.html > > (by the way -that test was the one I refer to by Dr. > Rosenthal. It's such an important study to not only study -but > follow! Our kids are auto put in this study by society -the opposite way. > It's up to us to help them fight the stigma. And I can tell you as > I've told Dr. Rosenthal that his study does work with our kids. > Tanner proves it! Again any graduate students interested in being > part of this study email me at lisa@c... ) > > ===== > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2004 Report Share Posted September 22, 2004 Hi! I wanted to respond to you guys. My daughter was also diagnosed with 'limb, oral and verbal' apraxia. She will be 2 on October 5. She actually is doing very well in the limb area because she seems VERY motivated to do physical things. But she has just started " talking " but it is all in vowels and often with her mouth closed. Her area that seems the most severe is the oral. We just recently have gotten her to open her mouth on purpose and stick her tongue out on purpose. I was wondering the same question as Steph -- is it possible to have the limb and/or oral without vebal? Have you guys been working on signs and/or pecs? I would love to chat with you both also. I haven't found very many people who have a diagnoses of global/motor apraxia. Sherrie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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