too much vitamin E?

[Guest guest]

Hello all,

I have been giving my 21 month old non-verbal son Bobby 1 ProEFA

capsule a day in his cereal since he was 18 months old. We

occasionally had some babbling, but not much. No other apparent

reactions to the ProEFA, physically or behaviorally like has been

mentioned on this list.

His cognitive milestones were right on or early until about 12 months,

but since then he's not changed very much. His doctor's visits show

that he can problem-solve, doesn't appear to have hearing problems, be

apraxic, or have any other neuro-muscular problems like hypotonia, etc.

He's physically advanced (hitting 2+ year old physical milestones at

18 months) but doesn't say a single word, point to stuff, do imaginary

play, etc. He does let me know by whining and jumpiong up and down when

he's hungry. But, he's very cuddly and affectionate with the family

and responds appropriately for his age to other kids and adults. We're

going to start the Early Intervention program through Georgia in

September after his 2 year check-up if he doesn't make amazing speech

progress by then.

Anyway.....about two weeks ago I upped the dose to 2 ProEFA capsules a

day, but I realized that his Poly-Vi-Sol daily liquid multivitamin also

has 50% of his vitamin E for the day.

My question is: can a 30 pound, very active toddler get too much

vitamin E? I couldn't find anthing online about vitamin E toxicity and

toddlers, so I'm asking here.

Thanks for any help y'all can give!

(Bobby's mama)

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

-here's an archive:

From: " kiddietalk " <kiddietalk@...>

Date: Mon Dec 8, 2003 9:26 am

Subject: Re: Your thoughts about Vit E in ProEFA

Thanks Kathy!

And I'm glad then my archive is correct -so instead of just

saying " ditto " :

2 capsules of ProEFA has 27 IU of Vitamin E/which means 1 capsule

has 13.5 IU of Vitamin E -so keeping 13.5 or 27 IU in mind -I did a

quick search at google and in the archives and as you will see below

found " I looked for toxic dosages of Vitamin E and found that:

It's " relatively nontoxic, even in massive doses "

http://www.emedicine.com/med/topic2384.htm :

and

" Vitamin E is available in softgels, tablets, capsules, and topical

oils. Doses for oral vitamin E generally range from 50 IU to 1,000

IU. "

" The Tolerable Upper Intake Limit (UL) for alpha-tocopherol is set

at 1000 mg (1500 IU). Doses higher than this can cause nausea, gas,

diarrhea, heart palpitations, and increase the tendency to bleed. "

http://www.usadrug.com/IMCAccess/ConsSupplements/VitaminEcs.shtml

" Vitamin E, one of the most important lipid-

soluble antioxidant nutrients, is found in nut oils, sunflower

seeds, whole grains, wheat germ, and spinach. Severe deficiency, as

may occur in persons with abetalipoproteinemia or fat malabsorption,

profoundly affects the central nervous system and can cause ataxia

and a peripheral neuropathy resembling Friedreich ataxia. Patients

receiving large doses of vitamin E may experience a halt in

progression of the disease. "

http://www.emedicine.com/med/topic2383.htm

" What is the health risk of too much vitamin E?

The health risk of too much vitamin E is low (23). A recent review

of the safety of vitamin E in the elderly indicated that taking

vitamin E supplements for up to four months at doses of 530 mg or

800 IU (35 times the current RDA) had no significant effect on

general health, body weight, levels of body proteins, lipid levels,

liver or kidney function, thyroid hormones, amount or kinds of blood

cells, and bleeding time (24). Even though this study provides

evidence that taking a vitamin E supplement containing 530 mg or 800

IU for four months is safe, the long term safety of vitamin E

supplementation has not been tested. The Institute of Medicine has

set an upper tolerable intake level for vitamin E at 1,000 mg (1,500

IU) for any form of supplementary alpha-tocopherol per day because

the nutrient can act as an anticoagulant and increase the risk of

bleeding problems. Upper tolerable intake levels " represent the

maximum intake of a nutrient that is likely to pose no risk of

adverse health effects in almost all individuals in the general

population " (5). "

http://www.cc.nih.gov/ccc/supplements/vite.html#risk

So again -with one capsule of " normal " fish oil a day like ProEFA -

most of us would consume 15 IUs of Vitamin E (2 = 30 IU) (just to

remind from above:

" The Tolerable Upper Intake Limit (UL) for alpha-tocopherol is set

at 1000 mg (1500 IU) "

1000 - 30 = (probably room for Poly-Vi-Sol)

And another thing to keep in mind...if a child is on fish oil...then

he or she will need extra Vitamin E because....

" There is some concern that a diet rich in fish oil taken for many

months may induce a deficiency of vitamin E. People who eat a diet

high in fish or who take fish oil supplements may want to consider

taking vitamin E supplements. "

http://www.usadrug.com/IMCAccess/ConsSupplements/VitaminEcs.shtml

And...this is why Nordic Naturals 'raised' the vitamin E in the

ProEFA up from 8 IUs to 15 IUs per capsule.

Only thing -if no change on the 1 ProEFA from 18 months

2 ProEFAs probably won't make any difference.

Bobby's proabably one of the few where fish oils probably aren't the answer to

accelerate therapy -just healthy for him.

(however - therapy will still be the answer for speech!)

=====

[Guest guest]

Thanks for answering, .

Just to be fair to the doc, I brought up the vitamin E question when I saw that

my son was getting so much (good) vitamin A that he was turning orange. It just

caused me to stop and check everything very carefully, and only A and E seemed

to be of potential concern. I saw that A was fine with these products, but the

E, if fat soluble, would have been on the high side. Not crazy high, but a

little concerning. Add to that this particular doc had an aunt who was into

health-foods and died of a bad liver at age 40. They came to suspect it may have

been mega doses of certain vitamins, especially E.

Thank you for addressing my concerns. I haven't changed the doses of what I'm

giving him at all. Just wanted to check.

I will say that the doses on your chart are higher than some I've seen, but I

think people have started to become more concerned about vitamin E recently.

If the NV is food-source and water soluble, though, I think we're fine.

Thanks again,

>

> Hi ! The NV is a water soluble form of vitamin e -all of the vitamins

and any other nutrients and all the essential amino acids in NV are from whole

foods and the entire food is water soluble due to the processing since it's a

powder. I was told they would not have been able to make it water soluble if it

was created as a liquid -so we should all be happy it's a powder because I know

I am! Here are again the ingredients

http://pursuitofresearch.org/ingredients.html So it would be like worrying about

getting too much vitamin C from eating too many apples. When nutrients are from

food sources it is less likely there are any issues -it's when you supplement

them from the bottle there can be issues.

>

> As far as the fat soluble 15 IUs in each capsule of fish oil you mentioned -I

always go by the chart here http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/vitamine/ for upper

tolerable levels as I know in this group for a year or so we were using 200 IU

to 400 IU with for the most part a 1:1 ratio of alpha to gamma tocopherol with

no reports of side effects until speak which had way higher dosages with if I

can recall close to a 3:1 ratio of alpha over the gamma -so in many ways a very

different tocopherol in dosage and formula.

>

> But again if you go by http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/vitamine/ even a 3

year old can have " up to " 300 IU a day and be within upper tolerable levels.

It's not going to format here in plain text -but I will copy and paste it below

-but again check out the site.

>

> Table 3: Tolerable Upper Intake Levels (ULs) for Vitamin E [6]

> Age Male Female Pregnancy Lactation

> 1-3 years 200 mg

> (300 IU) 200 mg

> (300 IU)

> 4-8 years 300 mg

> (450 IU) 300 mg

> (450 IU)

> 9-13 years 600 mg

> (900 IU) 600 mg

> (900 IU)

> 14-18 years 800 mg

> (1,200 IU) 800 mg

> (1,200 IU) 800 mg

> (1,200 IU) 800 mg

> (1,200 IU)

> 19+ years 1,000 mg

> (1,500 IU) 1,000 mg

> (1,500 IU) 1,000 mg

> (1,500 IU) 1,000 mg

> (1,500 IU)

>

> Final advice...it's OK if your ped isn't super knowledgeable about nutrition

yet as most of the info is just getting into the better doctor offices and

mainly on a PhD level -but you should find someone to work with that is a

medical doctor with a knowledge in nutrition as well to speak with. It makes me

smile how many docs can be so quick to prescribe meds and worry about vitamins.

Not saying you shouldn't worry about too much of anything -you can die from too

much water too -too much water you drown..but even if your child is a peanut

-you need someone that is a respected professional that can assure you not only

are you providing your child with essential nutrients which is awesome -but you

are probably feeding your child healthier than 99 percent of the world right

now. And yes -I can say it -but you need to hear it from a professional- and if

you find one who fits the description (again it will most likely be a better

doctor from a leading hospital system and possibly a PhD) you will hear just

that because that is what I have heard- and from a number now. And here's why

feeding your child the essential nutrients from whole food sources in theory is

so important for our population http://pursuitofresearch.org/science.html and

why I started http://www.wholefoodtherapy.com ;to let the world know it's

important for all. To eat is human but to digest is divine is something Dr.

Suhas just told me - he's one of the docs behind NV

http://pursuitofresearch.org/advisors.html

>

> =====

>