Guest guest Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 In a message dated 3/15/2005 9:18:15 PM Eastern Standard Time, gretchen@... writes: > instead of thinking, " Oh I can't sleep " to look at it as a good chance to > think about some problem I've been trying to solve. Sounds like a good practical idea, Gretchen. I usually sleep well, but if I don't I''ll give it a try. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 I have terrible insomnia, too. Many times I'm lying in bed still awake at 3:00 o'clock. I've tried Benadryl, but it seems to make me wider awake. I've tried another OTC product with a different ingredient, but it doesn't work, either. Valerian and melatonin don't work. My problem is that I can't turn my mind off. To paraphrase a commercial, it's like my brain is a TV, and I don't have the remote. What does work for me is Ambien. It works like a charm. I can cut a 5 mg tablet in half, and it puts me right to sleep. Trouble is, you can't take it all the time, or you become dependent on it, or so my rheumy said. So I save it for travel or times when I really need to get up early. My newest trick is a CD alarm clock. I bought a couple of CD's that have ocean sounds and music and are supposed to be relaxing. Or I play Enya, Merchant, or Nora . So far this is not helping a lot. Since I have trouble going to sleep, I also have trouble getting up in the morning. Ten o'clock is my usual time lately. Since I'm retired, I have nothing to compell me to get up early. This might create a vicious circle, but even when I do have to get up early, I still have trouble getting to sleep that night. Does anyone have any suggestions? Sue > > I buy the generic 25 mg hot pink pills from Costco. (Called " Kirkland > allergy medicine " on the label). Ingredient is just one: > diphenhydramine hydrochloride. I take 2 of them about a half hour > before bedtime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 I have terrible insomnia, too. Many times I'm lying in bed still awake at 3:00 o'clock. I've tried Benadryl, but it seems to make me wider awake. I've tried another OTC product with a different ingredient, but it doesn't work, either. Valerian and melatonin don't work. My problem is that I can't turn my mind off. To paraphrase a commercial, it's like my brain is a TV, and I don't have the remote. What does work for me is Ambien. It works like a charm. I can cut a 5 mg tablet in half, and it puts me right to sleep. Trouble is, you can't take it all the time, or you become dependent on it, or so my rheumy said. So I save it for travel or times when I really need to get up early. My newest trick is a CD alarm clock. I bought a couple of CD's that have ocean sounds and music and are supposed to be relaxing. Or I play Enya, Merchant, or Nora . So far this is not helping a lot. Since I have trouble going to sleep, I also have trouble getting up in the morning. Ten o'clock is my usual time lately. Since I'm retired, I have nothing to compell me to get up early. This might create a vicious circle, but even when I do have to get up early, I still have trouble getting to sleep that night. Does anyone have any suggestions? Sue > > I buy the generic 25 mg hot pink pills from Costco. (Called " Kirkland > allergy medicine " on the label). Ingredient is just one: > diphenhydramine hydrochloride. I take 2 of them about a half hour > before bedtime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 I have terrible insomnia, too. Many times I'm lying in bed still awake at 3:00 o'clock. I've tried Benadryl, but it seems to make me wider awake. I've tried another OTC product with a different ingredient, but it doesn't work, either. Valerian and melatonin don't work. My problem is that I can't turn my mind off. To paraphrase a commercial, it's like my brain is a TV, and I don't have the remote. What does work for me is Ambien. It works like a charm. I can cut a 5 mg tablet in half, and it puts me right to sleep. Trouble is, you can't take it all the time, or you become dependent on it, or so my rheumy said. So I save it for travel or times when I really need to get up early. My newest trick is a CD alarm clock. I bought a couple of CD's that have ocean sounds and music and are supposed to be relaxing. Or I play Enya, Merchant, or Nora . So far this is not helping a lot. Since I have trouble going to sleep, I also have trouble getting up in the morning. Ten o'clock is my usual time lately. Since I'm retired, I have nothing to compell me to get up early. This might create a vicious circle, but even when I do have to get up early, I still have trouble getting to sleep that night. Does anyone have any suggestions? Sue > > I buy the generic 25 mg hot pink pills from Costco. (Called " Kirkland > allergy medicine " on the label). Ingredient is just one: > diphenhydramine hydrochloride. I take 2 of them about a half hour > before bedtime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 > I have terrible insomnia, too. When I can't sleep, I find what works best (other than drugs; chlortrimeton works for me),is instead of thinking, " Oh I can't sleep " to look at it as a good chance to think about some problem I've been trying to solve. By problem, I don't mean financial problems or worries; I mean some intellectual problem that is interesting. For example, what is the evolutionary rationale for insulin resistance? What is the evolutionary significance of baldness? How could we continue to offer good health care without bankrupting everyone? That usually does it. Focusing on some problem like that sort of frees the mind from the worries that are keeping me awake, and I usually get to sleep before I've solved the problem (unfortunately). Even if it doesn't work, at least you've accomplished something useful in that time. Gretchen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 Yes, Ambien is what they gave me when I went to the sleep lab for my study and yes, it worked like a charm. -- otherwise they would have seen me tossing and turning all night and I never would've gotten to sleep at all so they could study me! But...yes, we don't want to take it every night. (Well, we do, actually...) Vicki Re: Insomia > > I have terrible insomnia, too. Many times I'm lying in bed still awake > at 3:00 o'clock. I've tried Benadryl, but it seems to make me wider > awake. I've tried another OTC product with a different ingredient, but > it doesn't work, either. Valerian and melatonin don't work. My problem > is that I can't turn my mind off. To paraphrase a commercial, it's > like > my brain is a TV, and I don't have the remote. > > What does work for me is Ambien. It works like a charm. I can cut a 5 > mg tablet in half, and it puts me right to sleep. Trouble is, you > can't > take it all the time, or you become dependent on it, or so my rheumy > said. So I save it for travel or times when I really need to get up > early. > > My newest trick is a CD alarm clock. I bought a couple of CD's that > have ocean sounds and music and are supposed to be relaxing. Or I play > Enya, Merchant, or Nora . So far this is not helping a > lot. > > Since I have trouble going to sleep, I also have trouble getting up in > the morning. Ten o'clock is my usual time lately. Since I'm retired, I > have nothing to compell me to get up early. This might create a > vicious > circle, but even when I do have to get up early, I still have trouble > getting to sleep that night. > > Does anyone have any suggestions? > > Sue > > >> >> I buy the generic 25 mg hot pink pills from Costco. (Called " Kirkland >> allergy medicine " on the label). Ingredient is just one: >> diphenhydramine hydrochloride. I take 2 of them about a half hour >> before bedtime. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 DEKEP@... wrote: > In a message dated 3/15/2005 9:18:15 PM Eastern Standard Time, > gretchen@... writes: > > > instead of thinking, " Oh I can't sleep " to look at it as a good > chance to > > think about some problem I've been trying to solve. > > Sounds like a good practical idea, Gretchen. I usually sleep well, but > if I > don't I''ll give it a try. > > . My mind is usually fogged up by the time I go to bed, even if I'm having insomnia problems. So trying to solve anything at all just tends to make me feel confused and anxious. My solution for sleepless nights is to do a few gentle stretches, then get into bed (with my CPAP on) and do Pranayama. Basically, think of it like the final relaxation (savassana) in a yoga class. I just settle myself on my back with everything straightened out and " go into my breathing " . My favorite relaxing breath is 4 in - hold 8 - exhale 8. I haven't been having problems lately as long as I (1) take my meds, and (2) wait until I'm sleepy before I go to bed. But I've found that doing breathing and relaxation with my eyes closed can be nearly as restful as actually sleeping. -- el (andreafrankel at sbcglobal dot net) " wake now! Discover that YOU are the song that the morning brings... " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 DEKEP@... wrote: > In a message dated 3/15/2005 9:18:15 PM Eastern Standard Time, > gretchen@... writes: > > > instead of thinking, " Oh I can't sleep " to look at it as a good > chance to > > think about some problem I've been trying to solve. > > Sounds like a good practical idea, Gretchen. I usually sleep well, but > if I > don't I''ll give it a try. > > . My mind is usually fogged up by the time I go to bed, even if I'm having insomnia problems. So trying to solve anything at all just tends to make me feel confused and anxious. My solution for sleepless nights is to do a few gentle stretches, then get into bed (with my CPAP on) and do Pranayama. Basically, think of it like the final relaxation (savassana) in a yoga class. I just settle myself on my back with everything straightened out and " go into my breathing " . My favorite relaxing breath is 4 in - hold 8 - exhale 8. I haven't been having problems lately as long as I (1) take my meds, and (2) wait until I'm sleepy before I go to bed. But I've found that doing breathing and relaxation with my eyes closed can be nearly as restful as actually sleeping. -- el (andreafrankel at sbcglobal dot net) " wake now! Discover that YOU are the song that the morning brings... " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 But, Gretchen, you forget that you have a scientific mind and can have thoughts such as these. Unfortunately, I don't have such a mind. When I lie there awake, I'm not thinking about problems or worries; thoughts about every aspect of my life come popping into my head. If I imagine my mind as a blackboard and try to erase all the thoughts, I just think about my years of teaching. And so on and on. Also, when I lie there awake, I have to get up and pee umpteen times. If I get to sleep right away, I have to get up only once. But I think you're on to something when you talk about focusing. I will try to focus on one thing, and see if it's possible for me to do that. Sue > > When I can't sleep, I find what works best (other than drugs; > chlortrimeton > works for me),is instead of thinking, " Oh I can't sleep " to look at it > as a > good chance to think about some problem I've been trying to solve. By > problem, I don't mean financial problems or worries; I mean some > intellectual problem that is interesting. For example, what is the > evolutionary rationale for insulin resistance? What is the evolutionary > significance of baldness? How could we continue to offer good health > care > without bankrupting everyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 But, Gretchen, you forget that you have a scientific mind and can have thoughts such as these. Unfortunately, I don't have such a mind. When I lie there awake, I'm not thinking about problems or worries; thoughts about every aspect of my life come popping into my head. If I imagine my mind as a blackboard and try to erase all the thoughts, I just think about my years of teaching. And so on and on. Also, when I lie there awake, I have to get up and pee umpteen times. If I get to sleep right away, I have to get up only once. But I think you're on to something when you talk about focusing. I will try to focus on one thing, and see if it's possible for me to do that. Sue > > When I can't sleep, I find what works best (other than drugs; > chlortrimeton > works for me),is instead of thinking, " Oh I can't sleep " to look at it > as a > good chance to think about some problem I've been trying to solve. By > problem, I don't mean financial problems or worries; I mean some > intellectual problem that is interesting. For example, what is the > evolutionary rationale for insulin resistance? What is the evolutionary > significance of baldness? How could we continue to offer good health > care > without bankrupting everyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 But, Gretchen, you forget that you have a scientific mind and can have thoughts such as these. Unfortunately, I don't have such a mind. When I lie there awake, I'm not thinking about problems or worries; thoughts about every aspect of my life come popping into my head. If I imagine my mind as a blackboard and try to erase all the thoughts, I just think about my years of teaching. And so on and on. Also, when I lie there awake, I have to get up and pee umpteen times. If I get to sleep right away, I have to get up only once. But I think you're on to something when you talk about focusing. I will try to focus on one thing, and see if it's possible for me to do that. Sue > > When I can't sleep, I find what works best (other than drugs; > chlortrimeton > works for me),is instead of thinking, " Oh I can't sleep " to look at it > as a > good chance to think about some problem I've been trying to solve. By > problem, I don't mean financial problems or worries; I mean some > intellectual problem that is interesting. For example, what is the > evolutionary rationale for insulin resistance? What is the evolutionary > significance of baldness? How could we continue to offer good health > care > without bankrupting everyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 This is what I learned many years ago, in the 60s, in yoga classes was...lay in bed and concentrate on your toes, imagine your toes being very relaxed and go up from there. It may sound funny but if you really do it I can never make it past my ankles. There are some nights I cant concentrate like that. My mind goes nuts. No matter what I do I cant concentrate and cant sleep. I agree about the peeing, Except even when I go right to sleep I get up at least 3 times a night. DOesnt matter if I drink anything or not. I think if I could sleep all ni ght I would sure feel better. I must have a bladder the size of a pea. I have noticed that my bgs seem to be lower when I get a semi decent night's sleep. jan haney t2 I will try to focus on one thing, and see if it's possible for me to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 This is what I learned many years ago, in the 60s, in yoga classes was...lay in bed and concentrate on your toes, imagine your toes being very relaxed and go up from there. It may sound funny but if you really do it I can never make it past my ankles. There are some nights I cant concentrate like that. My mind goes nuts. No matter what I do I cant concentrate and cant sleep. I agree about the peeing, Except even when I go right to sleep I get up at least 3 times a night. DOesnt matter if I drink anything or not. I think if I could sleep all ni ght I would sure feel better. I must have a bladder the size of a pea. I have noticed that my bgs seem to be lower when I get a semi decent night's sleep. jan haney t2 I will try to focus on one thing, and see if it's possible for me to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 > But, Gretchen, you forget that you have a scientific mind and can have > thoughts such as these. Unfortunately, I don't have such a mind. But surely there are other absorbing things you can think about. Try to memorize something you like. Do a crossword puzzle in your head. See if you can plan an imaginary Scrabble game in your head. Anything to focus your mind on one thing. Gretchen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 > This is what I learned many years ago, in the 60s, in yoga classes was...lay in bed and concentrate on your toes, imagine your toes being very relaxed and go up from there. It may sound funny but if you really do it I can never make it past my ankles. Another YMMV. Sue doesn't want to solve scientific puzzles <G>. When I try the yoga thing, I get up past my head and think, " Now what?'' Gretchen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 I was taught to tighten/stiffen up every part of one's body including fingers, toes, eyes etc etc & then loosen them up one at a time starting with the toes & working up to the head. I always found that when I got to my head I had been clenching my teeth & pressing my tongue against the roof of my mouth so tightly that when I let them go I was immediately relaxed & sleepy. Then I was to count backwards from 200 & usually I'd drift off mid count. Doesn't always work but most times it helps. However it doesn't help me STAY asleep for longer than 4 hrs. cappie Greater Boston Area T-2 10/02 1/05 A1c: 5.4 = 115 mean glu 50-100 carb diet, walking, Metformin ALA/EPO, Coq10, B12, ALC, Vit C Cal/mag, low dose Biotin, full spectrum E, Chromium P, Policosanol, fish oil cap, fresh flax seed, multi vitamin, Lovastatin 20 mg, Enalapril 10 mg 3/05:140 lbs (highest weight 309), 5' tall /age 67, cappie@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 I was taught to tighten/stiffen up every part of one's body including fingers, toes, eyes etc etc & then loosen them up one at a time starting with the toes & working up to the head. I always found that when I got to my head I had been clenching my teeth & pressing my tongue against the roof of my mouth so tightly that when I let them go I was immediately relaxed & sleepy. Then I was to count backwards from 200 & usually I'd drift off mid count. Doesn't always work but most times it helps. However it doesn't help me STAY asleep for longer than 4 hrs. cappie Greater Boston Area T-2 10/02 1/05 A1c: 5.4 = 115 mean glu 50-100 carb diet, walking, Metformin ALA/EPO, Coq10, B12, ALC, Vit C Cal/mag, low dose Biotin, full spectrum E, Chromium P, Policosanol, fish oil cap, fresh flax seed, multi vitamin, Lovastatin 20 mg, Enalapril 10 mg 3/05:140 lbs (highest weight 309), 5' tall /age 67, cappie@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 Reading something fairly mindless and undemanding usually works for me - something like Nora - enough plot to stay interested, but no real surprises. When I was in law school I had to read vast portions of the Internal Revenue Code - slept through one whole semester that way. CarolR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 I have a meditation cd which for over a year I never heard the entire thing. I kept falling asleep. Carol, I enjoy Nora too. Do you read her as j.d.robb? Carol(England) Type 2 Dx: 19 May 2004 Metformin 500mg x 3 Perindopril Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 Last night I had time to try everyone's suggestions before finally drifting off between two and three a. m., LOL. I guess I'm a hopeless case. Of course I didn't want to get up this morning since it was rainy and dreary, also. I will keep trying, but sometimes when you try too hard to do something, you can't. Sue > But surely there are other absorbing things you can think about. Try to > memorize something you like. Do a crossword puzzle in your head. See > if you > can plan an imaginary Scrabble game in your head. Anything to focus > your > mind on one thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 > sometimes when you try too > hard to do something, you can't. Exactly. That's why I find occupying my mind with something else works. For me the worst is when I have to get up early, say at 5 a.m., for some important appointment. I spend all night tossing and turning and worrying about it . . . until about 4:30, when I fall into a sound sleep. Gretchen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 > sometimes when you try too > hard to do something, you can't. Exactly. That's why I find occupying my mind with something else works. For me the worst is when I have to get up early, say at 5 a.m., for some important appointment. I spend all night tossing and turning and worrying about it . . . until about 4:30, when I fall into a sound sleep. Gretchen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 AH Gretchen I do the same thing & it doesn't have to be an important appointment--just any time Ive made plans for the next day. I went to the Flower Show yesterday even tho I woke up at 2:30 am & could not go back to sleep again till just before I was supposed to get up at 6am. Of course by the time I got home, I was completely exhausted & went to bed about 7pm & slept like a top till about 4am which was so nice. I enjoyed the show too--today I got out my spring floral displays & I'm pretending that snow outside my sliding patio door is not real! cappie Greater Boston Area T-2 10/02 1/05 A1c: 5.4 = 115 mean glu 50-100 carb diet, walking, Metformin ALA/EPO, Coq10, B12, ALC, Vit C Cal/mag, low dose Biotin, full spectrum E, Chromium P, Policosanol, fish oil cap, fresh flax seed, multi vitamin, Lovastatin 20 mg, Enalapril 10 mg 3/05:140 lbs (highest weight 309), 5' tall /age 67, cappie@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 AH Gretchen I do the same thing & it doesn't have to be an important appointment--just any time Ive made plans for the next day. I went to the Flower Show yesterday even tho I woke up at 2:30 am & could not go back to sleep again till just before I was supposed to get up at 6am. Of course by the time I got home, I was completely exhausted & went to bed about 7pm & slept like a top till about 4am which was so nice. I enjoyed the show too--today I got out my spring floral displays & I'm pretending that snow outside my sliding patio door is not real! cappie Greater Boston Area T-2 10/02 1/05 A1c: 5.4 = 115 mean glu 50-100 carb diet, walking, Metformin ALA/EPO, Coq10, B12, ALC, Vit C Cal/mag, low dose Biotin, full spectrum E, Chromium P, Policosanol, fish oil cap, fresh flax seed, multi vitamin, Lovastatin 20 mg, Enalapril 10 mg 3/05:140 lbs (highest weight 309), 5' tall /age 67, cappie@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 Gretchen wrote: > > But, Gretchen, you forget that you have a scientific mind and can have > > thoughts such as these. Unfortunately, I don't have such a mind. > > But surely there are other absorbing things you can think about. Try to > memorize something you like. Do a crossword puzzle in your head. See > if you > can plan an imaginary Scrabble game in your head. Anything to focus your > mind on one thing. For me, the trick is to focus on something absorbing but NOT challenging. Pranayama is perfect for this. Here's the simplest form: focus on the feeling of the air moving into your nostrils, throat, lungs, and the feel of your ribcage expanding during the inhalation; then on the exhalation, focus on the same things plus any feeling of release and relaxation as your ribcage lowers. Mentally say " in " or " one " on the inhalation, and " out " or " two " on the exhalation. It sounds too simple to work, but it does. You can find all kinds of physical things to focus on during breathing. Don't force yourself to try to feel relaxed; just sit back and observe yourself breathing. -- el (andreafrankel at sbcglobal dot net) " wake now! Discover that YOU are the song that the morning brings... " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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