Re: My Experience with Eating Disorder Myths and Labels (Long Post)

December 28, 2009

Hi Abby: I initially ignored your comment, which said that Brittany must

have been anorexic or bulimic, because she died from a heart attack. I

appreciated Katcha's comment that 'heart attacks' can be caused by many things,

notably prescription drug side effects or accidental overdose, as well as other

medical conditions. I'll wait for the toxicology report on Brittany to

clarify what caused her heart attack. Many anorexics die from suicidal

prescription drug overdoses due to unresolved depression. Although singer

Carpenter died from a heart attack induced by chronic use of Ipecac syrup (to

induce vomiting), not all thin actresses are anorexic or bulimic.

However, last night I began thinking about comments on this and other boards,

which imply that thin actresses or any thin person must have anorexia or

bulimia. I wondered how those commments affect members of this board who

struggle with more disordered eating habits like restricting, bingeing and even

throwing up after eating. I wonder whether the shame associated with those

labels makes members with those 'disordered' habits less apt to post about their

struggles on this board.

NOT ALL THIN PEOPLE HAVE ANOREXIA OR BULIMIA. Anorexia is so much more than

'thinness'. Many celiacs are very thin. They want to gain weight, but pain after

eating or even malabsorption problems keep them from consuming enough calories.

Many people who undergo chemotherapy or longterm treatment with other drugs

which cause nausea become very thin. Some people with multiple food allergies

have difficulty finding satisfying foods. Some thin people actually eat normally

and prefer to stay thin because they fear weight related illnesses.

I struggled for many years with bingeing, as did others on this board who

restricted what they ate. I did not restrict to lose weight, because I was

already thin. I exercised to maintain my weight. However, I had chronic

constipation, due to undiagnosed celiac disease. So I followed all the eating

rules for 'regularity' such as high fiber, lots of liquids, no processed sugar

or flour, etc. and felt deprived enough to binge, especially when the

'regularity' diet did NOT resolve my irregularity. I thought " This diet is not

helping, so why bother? " and binged on the restricted foods.

As a young child I frequent got sick and threw up in the middle of the night. I

now suspect either food allergies or intestinal bugs caused what was labeled

'stomach flu' back then. However, after my first longterm diet in college, I

started to binge eat and often felt so sick that I resisted the urge to throw

up, until a 'friend' suggested that I stop fighting that urge and just throw up

to feel better. So I began to throw up after binge eating. I did not throw up to

'get rid of the calories' or prevent weight gain. I was already thin. Was I

anorexic/bulimic? I'm uncertain, but those labels didn't help her understand how

to resolve bingeing or resist throwing up.

Several years later I joined an eating disorders group and learned how to eat

when hungry and stop when satisfied. However I still felt sick after eating

several different foods. When I told one doctor about my symptoms, she

(mis)diagnosed 'gastritis' and prescribed acid blockers, which I took for many

years until I realized they didn't address the cause of my reflux. When I told

my therapist that I never forced myself to throw up, but just felt ill after

eating, she told me to see my doctor. When I told another doctor that I felt ill

enough to throw up after meals, she told me to see an ED therapist.

Eventually I described my intestinal symptoms (constipation, bloating and

cramping pain) to my doctor. She gave me the 'IBS' label and yet another diet,

which only exacerbated my symptoms. So between the IBS diet and the 'regularity'

diet, I continued to restrict and rebel with binges followed by extreme reflux

followed by throwing up to cope with the acid free reflux. Was I 'bulimic'?

Maybe, but that label did nothing to resolve my problems.

Eventually I suspected and tested for celiac disease. That diagnosis led me to

test for food allergies and intestinal infections, which explained my post

eating discomfort, nausea and extreme reflux. I thought that abstaining from all

my food allergens and treating the intestinal infection would eliminate my

binge/purge habit. However longterm use of acid blockers (and age) had impaired

my stomach's ability to produce its own acid. So I easily refluxed and I

contracted one stomach 'bug' after another during the past 5 years. I started

taking supplemental betaine hydrochloride to improve digestion and raise my

stomach acid level high enough to kill food born bacteria. All that helped

lessen my binge/purge episodes. However, I had practiced bingeing for years and

had accumulated even more medical dietary restrictions. So I still occasionally

rebelled against restrictions with binges. Was I still bulimic at that point?

I was still thin enough to be considered 'anorexic' by people, who assume all

thin people are anorexic, when I contracted clostridium difficile (c-diff) after

treatment for candida with an antifungal almost a year ago. Nevertheless, before

my c-diff diagnosis, I had committed to do whatever was necessary to abstain

from bingeing and purging. Despite treatment with flagyl which caused 3 weeks

of constant nausea, I resisted throwing up and learned to cope with nausea.

During late October this year (after more treatment for recurrent c-diff), I

weighed less than I have in years, although I had not binged or purged for over

7 months. I've managed to regain a few pounds, but I don't want to regularly

overeat enough to feel uncomfortably full, because I don't want to throw up and

lose necessary nutrients and calories.

I apologize for my long story, but I wanted to share how medical problems can

also influence disordered eating habits as well as 'thinness' associated with

anorexia and bulimia. I hope that sharing my story makes others, who bear

'eating disorder' labels, feel more comfortable about sharing their stories on

this board.

SUE

PS The most outrageous ED myth is perpetuated by a popular ED website. They

state that eating disorders cause celiac disease. In my experience and from what

I've heard from other celiacs, the opposite is true. Celiac disease influence

people to use disordered eating habits, such as restricting then bingeing and/or

purging to cope with undiagnosed CD symptoms.

>

> I don't know anything about Brittany , but normal, healthy, far from

> pre-menopausal women don't have heart attacks. i'd bet " dollars to donuts "

> as my mom would say (i have no idea what the expression means, but i think

> it's hiliarious, especially for our group) that she was anorexic and/or

> bulemic. that is a common reason for a heart attack in a young woman.

December 28, 2009

Sue, thank you for bringing that to my attention. I have long wondered if the

members here who are on the 'other side' of the IE coin don't get the support

they need for whatever reason. I know I can not relate to their experiences as

much as I can to the 'heavier' side of the IE coin. I seriously wonder if it

would be more helpful if a support site for their needs would be created and

available? I have made a few Yahoo Groups and would be happy to assist anyone

who would like to do that for this real need. Not that I want to NOT welcome any

and everyone who finds this group helpful, but more in the spirit of helping

more if that is possible.

Katcha (moderator)

> However, last night I began thinking about comments on this and other boards,

which imply that thin actresses or any thin person must have anorexia or

bulimia. I wondered how those commments affect members of this board who

struggle with more disordered eating habits like restricting, bingeing and even

throwing up after eating. I wonder whether the shame associated with those

labels makes members with those 'disordered' habits less apt to post about their

struggles on this board.

December 28, 2009

Sue,Thanks for pointing that out, and my apologies for implying (or outright stating, if that's what i did) that Brittany must be anorexic or bulemic. I actually have no idea who she is, and don't know anything about her personal life... I just was thinking that it's outside of the realm of what we would expect for a 32 year old woman to have a heart attack... but you are absolutely right that there are other possible causes. I was wrong in what I said.

For what it's worth, I don't assume that all thin people have eating disorders. I guess I assumed that this actress (or otherwise famous person) had an eating disorder based on others' comments, which I should not have done.I work with many teens that wish they were not so thin, and are eating as much as they can in a desperate attempt to gain weight. And I have certainly struggled with so many eating issue for so many years, much of the time when I was quite thin (I am only just barely overweight now, though my normal weight is about 20 pounds less than what I am now).

So I apologize if/that I made you and any others uncomfortable. I know that we are all here because we share issues around eating, not because of what we look like. Regards,

Abby

Sue, thank you for bringing that to my attention. I have long wondered if the members here who are on the 'other side' of the IE coin don't get the support they need for whatever reason. I know I can not relate to their experiences as much as I can to the 'heavier' side of the IE coin. I seriously wonder if it would be more helpful if a support site for their needs would be created and available? I have made a few Yahoo Groups and would be happy to assist anyone who would like to do that for this real need. Not that I want to NOT welcome any and everyone who finds this group helpful, but more in the spirit of helping more if that is possible.

Katcha (moderator)

> However, last night I began thinking about comments on this and other boards, which imply that thin actresses or any thin person must have anorexia or bulimia. I wondered how those commments affect members of this board who struggle with more disordered eating habits like restricting, bingeing and even throwing up after eating. I wonder whether the shame associated with those labels makes members with those 'disordered' habits less apt to post about their struggles on this board.

December 28, 2009

Hi Katcha: Are you saying that no member of this board ever shared that they

used anorexic or bulimic habits or said they were given an ED label? I don't

consider people with those habits 'the other side'. I see disordered eating as a

continuum which includes anorexic 'restrictors', anorexic compensators (who may

either purge, exercise or abuse laxatives, normal weight bulimic compensators,

situational or occasional purgers, bulimic dieters (who fast, diet or exercise

to compensate for diet slips), chronic dieters (who 'graze' instead of bingeing

and then diet to compensate), noncompensatory bulimics (overweight to obese

bingers), occasional dieters and finally normal eaters. I suspect most members

of this group fall somewhere along that continuum.

If you have ever restricted or dieted to compensate for overeating or if you

have even binged, you can relate to people who use more disordered eating

habits. I think creating a separate group for people with more extreme eating

habits just perpetuates the 'them vs. us' mentality. I often read comments by

obese people who binge eat and say " Well at least I don't purge. " I also read

comments by overweight people who say that they could never compensate for

overeating like bulimics. However, they compensate with diets and restriction

after overeating or even binge episodes. I even read comments from people who

develop obesity related diseases (like diabetes, heart disease, etc.) and claim

that anorexia and bulimia are more dangerous than overweight. Weight is not the

issue. Eating habits and disordered eating beliefs create the problems, which

intuitive eating can resolve.

I have met people who have been on both sides of the weight spectrum. One friend

went from dangerously overweight with diabetes to fearfully underweight with

unhealthy compensatory habits (abusing laxatives to 'undo' binges). Many IE book

authors (like Geneen Roth) have been on both sides of the weight spectrum. Judy

Wardell Halliday, who founded ThinWithin, struggled with bulimia for many years.

Yet they went on to write inspiring, encouraging IE related books. I truly

believe we can all support and learn from one another, if we avoid the 'them vs.

us' mentality. I just want to tell IE members who struggle with binge eating,

restrictive diets or even compensatory methods like purging, exercising or

laxative abuse that they are welcome and understood here.

SUE

>

> Sue, thank you for bringing that to my attention. I have long wondered if the

members here who are on the 'other side' of the IE coin don't get the support

they need for whatever reason. I know I can not relate to their experiences as

much as I can to the 'heavier' side of the IE coin. I seriously wonder if it

would be more helpful if a support site for their needs would be created and

available? I have made a few Yahoo Groups and would be happy to assist anyone

who would like to do that for this real need. Not that I want to NOT welcome any

and everyone who finds this group helpful, but more in the spirit of helping

more if that is possible.

>

> Katcha (moderator)

December 28, 2009

Thanks, Abby, for your comments. I most appreciated your last statement " we are

all here because we share issues around eating, not because of what we look

like " . You said in one sentence what I needed 3 long paragraphs to say in my

reply to Katcha. LOL

SUE

>

> Sue,

>

> Thanks for pointing that out, and my apologies for implying (or outright

> stating, if that's what i did) that Brittany must be anorexic or

> bulemic. I actually have no idea who she is, and don't know anything about

> her personal life... I just was thinking that it's outside of the realm of

> what we would expect for a 32 year old woman to have a heart attack... but

> you are absolutely right that there are other possible causes. I was wrong

> in what I said.

>

> For what it's worth, I don't assume that all thin people have eating

> disorders. I guess I assumed that this actress (or otherwise famous person)

> had an eating disorder based on others' comments, which I should not have

> done.I work with many teens that wish they were not so thin, and are eating

> as much as they can in a desperate attempt to gain weight. And I have

> certainly struggled with so many eating issue for so many years, much of the

> time when I was quite thin (I am only just barely overweight now, though my

> normal weight is about 20 pounds less than what I am now).

>

> So I apologize if/that I made you and any others uncomfortable. I know that

> we are all here because we share issues around eating, not because of what

> we look like.

>

> Regards,

>

> Abby

December 28, 2009

This is very interest topic. I normally don't comment this kind of topic. For

several reasons. For one because my sister is naturally thins but however, years

ago before she and I got closer. She was dying from straving herself to death as

you can see her bone in her body so easy. Even just little stress then she

would not able to eat for few days at a time. Is she interest to stay thin?

Nope, she never did. She can't afford a doctor to treats her. Since no medicare

insurance at the time.

It was struggled for long years for both of her and myself. Her being thin and

with me being overweights. Yet she and I find a way to meet in half way to

support each other no matter what. People who knows her and surprised that I

have managed find a way to get her eat even just little at a time. For myself I

could not able to find a therapist or counselor that I can feel comfort enough

to babbling whatever my feels would be from time to time. I have come trust my

sister as she trust me.

This has been almost 8 years since I have managed keep her eating even just

little or only one meal a day. That better than none at all that's when she feel

less pressure from me to push her keep eating. She had able to eat on her own

without myself remind her to eat something.

She and I are each other support systems for years.

Eliza

December 30, 2009

Hi everyone,

Well Britany may or may not have had an eating disorder, but there were rumors circulating that she might have. My sympathy goes out to her in either case. But we all know there are movie actors who can't maintain that extreme thinness naturally, and it's important to point that out because they are role models to the younger generation. If any celebrity has an eating disorder, my heart goes out to him or her, but the young people need to know the truth because those are their role models; maybe people need to know that these celebrities who would do anything to remain super slim aren't good role models when it comes to health. I don't know if it applies to Britany , but I know she looked too thin to be healthy in a picture I saw of her.

If anyone on this board has struggled with restricting/binging/purging, so have I and I have the utmost empathy.

Laurie

To: IntuitiveEating_Support Sent: Mon, December 28, 2009 11:40:18 PMSubject: Re: Re: My Experience with Eating Disorder Myths and Labels (Long Post)

Sue,

Thanks for pointing that out, and my apologies for implying (or outright stating, if that's what i did) that Brittany must be anorexic or bulemic. I actually have no idea who she is, and don't know anything about her personal life... I just was thinking that it's outside of the realm of what we would expect for a 32 year old woman to have a heart attack... but you are absolutely right that there are other possible causes. I was wrong in what I said.

For what it's worth, I don't assume that all thin people have eating disorders. I guess I assumed that this actress (or otherwise famous person) had an eating disorder based on others' comments, which I should not have done.I work with many teens that wish they were not so thin, and are eating as much as they can in a desperate attempt to gain weight. And I have certainly struggled with so many eating issue for so many years, much of the time when I was quite thin (I am only just barely overweight now, though my normal weight is about 20 pounds less than what I am now).

So I apologize if/that I made you and any others uncomfortable. I know that we are all here because we share issues around eating, not because of what we look like.

Regards,

Abby

On Mon, Dec 28, 2009 at 9:39 PM, jain_daugh <jain_daughsisqtel (DOT) net> wrote:

Sue, thank you for bringing that to my attention. I have long wondered if the members here who are on the 'other side' of the IE coin don't get the support they need for whatever reason. I know I can not relate to their experiences as much as I can to the 'heavier' side of the IE coin. I seriously wonder if it would be more helpful if a support site for their needs would be created and available? I have made a few Yahoo Groups and would be happy to assist anyone who would like to do that for this real need. Not that I want to NOT welcome any and everyone who finds this group helpful, but more in the spirit of helping more if that is possible.Katcha (moderator)

> However, last night I began thinking about comments on this and other boards, which imply that thin actresses or any thin person must have anorexia or bulimia. I wondered how those commments affect members of this board who struggle with more disordered eating habits like restricting, bingeing and even throwing up after eating. I wonder whether the shame associated with those labels makes members with those 'disordered' habits less apt to post about their struggles on this board.

December 30, 2009

Hi Laurie: Do you still struggle with any of those disordered eating habits even

occasionally? Or have you completely eliminated restricting and/or bingeing

and/or purging? If so, what helped you eliminate those habits? Did you have

formal ED therapy? If so, what about that therapy helped you? What was not

helpful about the therapy?

I think talking openly about what helped us change disordered eating habits

might encourage or inspire others on this board who still struggle with those

habits.

SUE

> If anyone on this board has struggled with restricting/binging/purging, so

have I and I have the utmost empathy.

>

> Laurie

December 30, 2009

Hi Sue,

I wish I could be of greater help than I can be because I spent 18 years restricting very, very severely and then binging periodically; I didn't purge by vomiting, but I did take enough laxative one time to end up on the hospital, and after a binge I restricted even more severely than ever before; I also took diet pills.

What changed everything for me was Geneen Roths's book, and then later Overcoming overeating.

But the reason I don't think my experience will help is I was able to stop dieting but I had too great a reaction to that 18 years of deprivation and I swung to the opposite extreme of eating way, way more than my body needed and I did this for almost a year and gained lots of weight before my cravings diminished, and then I was able to eat more so when hungry. But I didn't stop at full for all those 15 years of non-dieting. It's not til just a couple months ago that I started to become successful at stopping when just full.

I had too many childhood abuse issues which I'd been trying to avoid by overeating, and I just had too many issues with my food being controlled when I was growing up, etc. My path to getting this right is much longer than I'd wish on anyone else.

But now I can do it :.)

Sorry I can't help except to say I got so incredibly fed up with dieting and restricting.

Laurie

To: IntuitiveEating_Support Sent: Wed, December 30, 2009 6:02:27 PMSubject: Re: My Experience with Eating Disorder Myths and Labels (Long Post)

Hi Laurie: Do you still struggle with any of those disordered eating habits even occasionally? Or have you completely eliminated restricting and/or bingeing and/or purging? If so, what helped you eliminate those habits? Did you have formal ED therapy? If so, what about that therapy helped you? What was not helpful about the therapy? I think talking openly about what helped us change disordered eating habits might encourage or inspire others on this board who still struggle with those habits.SUE> If anyone on this board has struggled with restricting/ binging/purging, so have I and I have the utmost empathy.> > Laurie

December 30, 2009

Hello everyone. Well I can relate with most all disordered eating habits. I

have had had lots of help, but as of now really seeking to find a way to love

myself, one small step at a time has really helped. I personally have found

this through how I believe God loves me. Now that I am a bit more stable in

that area, I have been able to embrace IE, when about a year ago now, I could

not. I do still struggle with the bingeing/purging, and restricting. Although,

they are much less frequent, and the binges are much smaller. Where I am still

struggling is the basic restricting the diet mentality....

Tonight was an example, I left work and worked out a little and didn't end up

eating until around 8, so I waited a little to long. Then I grabbed a couple

tortillia chips, real ones...haha This is a food I would not normally keep in

my house, but I have been able to eat some, and stop when I'm full, when I am

" present " while eating. Tonight, I grabbed a couple, while I was making the

rest of my meal, and by the time I was finished with the rest of my meal I

decided it wasn't ok......meaning I felt like a ate wrong or bad or something,

so I decided to purge. Looking back, I was to hungry and not present, but most

importantly I am still struggling with all food being ok to have. That's just

tough. I haven't been counting calories or anything like that, so I have made

major progress. Eating when I'm hungry and stopping when I'm full is what I'm

focusing on at this point, which has been working.

My food sponsor that I work with has really encouraged me to except where I am

with my food, and do what I can. Eat what I can, and if some foods don't work

right now, that's ok. That has given me some peace, and I have just been

focusing on the fact that I CAN have any food I want. It sure is a process of

retraining my brain. I have also been focusing on staying present, staying in

my skin. I know for me whenever I want to engage in any impulsive behavior with

food that focusing on the fact that that is a red flag, and that I need to stay

in my body. The is a red flag that I am trying to escape something in my life,

a feeling. So, focusing on staying present has really helped. Having courage to

stay in my skin instead of checking out with food. I love this group and it's

really helpful to hear about anyone learning IE because those, or maybe all of

us have experienced in some way a disconnect from our body, hunger/fullness

cues. It gives me courage to hear about others listening to their bodies and

overcoming food obsessions, and food rules. Thank you to everyone!

>

> > If anyone on this board has struggled with restricting/ binging/purging, so

have I and I have the utmost empathy.

> >

> > Laurie

>

December 30, 2009

Thanks, Laurie. You may never know how many other IE members you helped by

sharing your experiences with restricting, bingeing and purging (with

laxatives). However, one other member posted about her experiences right after

you posted this. That's a great start ... I suspect more will 'come out of the

ED closet, the more we share about how IE helped us overcome disordered eating

habits.

I know others who used laxatives to purge. However, I was forced fed laxatives

and endured too many enemas as a child, because my mom was obsessed with

'fixing' my regularity. So I never liked laxatives. Too bad my pediatrician

didn't test me for celiac disease or food allergies. Abstaining from allergens

and treating intestinal infections resolved my 'regularity' problem,

unfortunately 50 years later.

Geneen Roth's books and " Overcoming Overeating " also facilitated my recovery

journey. However, I couldn't completely eliminate dieting until I did a Weigh

Down class and continued with ThinWithin. Nevertheless, health related

restrictions (from diets doctors gave me for 'gastritis' and " IBS " , which were

both misdiagnoses) still kept me somewhat in 'diet mode' until I learned the

true causes of my gastro symptoms. Then I knew exactly what to avoid eating to

prevent allergy reactions and how to find nonallergen substitutes for my

favorite foods.

Although I've been binge free for over 9 months now, I'm still working on

stopping at comfortably full. I do well at some meals, but at least once a day,

I eat to the point of obviously full and sometimes uncomfortably full. However,

I had to learn to endure the discomfort of overly full in order to resist

purging after meals, so that I could also eliminate bingeing. If I didn't allow

myself to throw up, I certainly didn't want to binge. Now I'm trying to learn

to stop BEFORE 'overly full'.

I also had childhood abuse and an overly controlling mom issues, which

influenced my sensitivity to any kind of restriction. I spent about 35 years

struggling with disordered eating habits before I learned to rely on my

intuitive, physical sensations of hunger and fullness to tell me when to start

and stop eating. However, even my IE journey was interrupted by occasional

slips back into disordered eating habits. Nevertheless, I knew that for me, IE

was the only path to normal eating.

I appreciate your honesty which, I believed, will inspire other IE board

members. We'll see ...

SUE

>

> Hi Sue,

> I wish I could be of greater help than I can be because I spent 18 years

restricting very, very severely and then binging periodically; I didn't purge by

vomiting, but I did take enough laxative one time to end up on the hospital, and

after a binge I restricted even more severely than ever before; I also took diet

pills.

>

> What changed everything for me was Geneen Roths's book, and then later

Overcoming overeating.

> But the reason I don't think my experience will help is I was able to stop

dietingÂ but I had too great a reaction to that 18 years of deprivation and I

swung to the opposite extreme of eating way, way more than my body needed and I

did this for almost a year and gained lots of weight before my cravings

diminished, and then I was able to eat more so when hungry.Â But I didn't stop

at full for all those 15 years of non-dieting.Â It's not til just a couple

months ago that I started to become successful at stopping when just full.

>

> I had too many childhood abuse issues which I'd been trying to avoid by

overeating, and I just had too many issues with my food being controlled when I

was growing up, etc.Â My path to getting this right is much longer than I'd

wish on anyone else.

>

> But now I can do it :.)

>

> Sorry I can't help except to say I got so incredibly fed up with dieting and

restricting.

>

> Laurie

December 30, 2009

Thanks, , for sharing your experienced with disordered eating habits. I

also had to reach a certain point in my recovery before I could actually apply

IE principles to my eating habits. ThinWithin taught me to treat myself with at

least as much grace as God showed me. Learning to forgive myself when I

'slipped' and learn from disordered eating slips greatly facilitated my recovery

process.

I also experienced overeating when I let myself get too hungry. Like you, I

want to grab something to eat, anything to stop the intense hunger, while I

prepare my meal. However, I also want to eat all of the meal I prepared. Then I

overeat and feel uncomfortably full. However, I had to learn to forgive myself

for overeating and tolerate that uncomfortably full feeling in order to

completely stop purging.

In my head I knew the discomfort would pass. I also knew that the extra food

would just keep me from being hungry again for awhile. So I didn't have to worry

about weight gain. However, if I listened to panicky self-talk about eating

something 'bad', I could easily want to get rid of the discomfort from

overeating, rather than learn from the experience. So I learned to challenge

those 'bad' food thoughts even when I overate. I knew the food didn't make me

overeat, but I just let myself get too hungry and needed to learn from the

experience.

Have you read the IE book? The authors (Tribole and Resch) describe into great

detail how to 'reject the diet mentality', 'make peace with food' and 'challenge

the food police' (which is often our own self-talk). If you have not read that

book, I encourage you to do so. If you have, perhaps rereading will help you

now.

Thanks again for sharing your experiences.

SUE

>

> Hello everyone. Well I can relate with most all disordered eating habits. I