Re: new labs; entering the fray...

[Guest guest]

>>I think I will start myself of 15mgs Armour. My main question - when on

thyroid meds, do we go for full replacement, or do we stop short of that?

For instance, if I take 1 grain, will I simply be suppressing my TSH but

not getting enough hormone that my body needs? How can you tell when you

are optimal? Is it by having a FT3 and FT4 at the top of the range and when

you are symptom-free?<<

Your Ferritin is low, and needs to be addressed as that can cause weird symptoms

when taking Armour. I would say if you have Hashi's you need to go for FULL

replacement. Totally resting the thyroid and totally suppressing the TSH is the

only thing that will calm the Hashi antibodies. Your Free's on the testing can

be skewed if you have Hashi's, I would go by symptoms. You know you are at the

correct dosage when you have no more hypo symptoms.

*Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV

Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/

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[Guest guest]

your labs do not look good and if that is what your DR thinks, you may want

to make a change. number one, your ferritin is too low. That will make you

tired, have aching joints, make you feel hyper when you try to up the

thyroid meds to the right level. That will also make what your body uses

different than what the tests look like. Take 325 mgs of ferrous sulfate 2x

a day. Stop all bread, and preprocessed food that might have wheat in it.

Add b-12 lozenges of 2500 mcg plus a stong b complex vitamin that is in a

capsule, not a hard pill. Any non gnc vitamin store will have it. Take 75

mgs of coq10 from either hsn.com or someplace with top grade coq10, not a

discount drug store. Add a good mult vitamin to that, not a hard pill again,

but a capsule. Start with the 15 mgs cut in half taking 1 half at the time

you get up dissolving it under the tongue and the other part the same way

after 12 noon meal, about 1 hour later than when you eat. Take the 15 mgs

for 2 weeks and tell us how you feel. It should be that you will need to

increase the thyroid meds then another 15 mgs. Your tsh is too high, your

free t4 low, but your free t3 WAY low. go to www.goodhormonehealth.com and

read the articles on anemia

>

>Reply-To: NaturalThyroidHormones

>To: NaturalThyroidHormones

>Subject: new labs; entering the fray...

>Date: Tue, 09 Nov 2004 10:18:21 -0500

>Ok, I am going to try Armour again, even tho I'm nervous as I had a bad

reaction to it last time. I may have gone up too much too soon (even tho it

was a low dose of 30 mgs). Here are my labs from 11/6:

TSH: 3.12 (.4 - 5.5)

FT4: 1.3 (.8 - 1.8)

FT3: 298 (230 - 420)

Ferritin 2 weeks ago: 44 (10 - 154)

RBC, Hemoglobin and Hematocrit are all at the bottom of the normal range.

My a.m. serum cortisol was just above the normal range (I am waiting to get

back the 24-hour cortisol result).

I think I will start myself of 15mgs Armour. My main question - when on

thyroid meds, do we go for full replacement, or do we stop short of that?

For instance, if I take 1 grain, will I simply be suppressing my TSH but

not getting enough hormone that my body needs? How can you tell when you

are optimal? Is it by having a FT3 and FT4 at the top of the range and when

you are symptom-free?

My endo is reluctant to give me anything, saying my labs look good. But she

will allow me to take Armour if I want. What concerns me is that she

doesn't know how to treat, even if she is cooperative in some areas. She

denies that my ferritin is low. Nevertheless, I am taking Solgar Gentle

Iron (2 caps per day - hope this is safe). Also, I wonder if I need some

Cortef or something... Any thoughts?

[Guest guest]

How the heck does one know if they're got Hashi's or even Graves, etc if never

tested or dx'd by any doctors for it? heck, I can't even get any doctors to

order free T3 or free T4 for me.

C

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

>>I think I will start myself of 15mgs Armour. My main question - when on

thyroid meds, do we go for full replacement, or do we stop short of that?

For instance, if I take 1 grain, will I simply be suppressing my TSH but

not getting enough hormone that my body needs? How can you tell when you

are optimal? Is it by having a FT3 and FT4 at the top of the range and when

you are symptom-free?<<

Your Ferritin is low, and needs to be addressed as that can cause weird

symptoms when taking Armour. I would say if you have Hashi's you need to go for

FULL replacement. Totally resting the thyroid and totally suppressing the TSH is

the only thing that will calm the Hashi antibodies. Your Free's on the testing

can be skewed if you have Hashi's, I would go by symptoms. You know you are at

the correct dosage when you have no more hypo symptoms.

[Guest guest]

Achey joints & tiredness mean low ferritin levels?

C

RE: new labs; entering the fray...

your labs do not look good and if that is what your DR thinks, you may want

to make a change. number one, your ferritin is too low. That will make you

tired, have aching joints, make you feel hyper when you try to up the

thyroid meds to the right level. That will also make what your body uses

different than what the tests look like. Take 325 mgs of ferrous sulfate 2x

a day. Stop all bread, and preprocessed food that might have wheat in it.

Add b-12 lozenges of 2500 mcg plus a stong b complex vitamin that is in a

capsule, not a hard pill. Any non gnc vitamin store will have it. Take 75

mgs of coq10 from either hsn.com or someplace with top grade coq10, not a

discount drug store. Add a good mult vitamin to that, not a hard pill again,

but a capsule. Start with the 15 mgs cut in half taking 1 half at the time

you get up dissolving it under the tongue and the other part the same way

after 12 noon meal, about 1 hour later than when you eat. Take the 15 mgs

for 2 weeks and tell us how you feel. It should be that you will need to

increase the thyroid meds then another 15 mgs. Your tsh is too high, your

free t4 low, but your free t3 WAY low. go to www.goodhormonehealth.com and

read the articles on anemia

[Guest guest]

yes, as do many other things. But that is classic for low ferritin

RE: new labs; entering the fray...

your labs do not look good and if that is what your DR thinks, you may want

to make a change. number one, your ferritin is too low. That will make you

tired, have aching joints, make you feel hyper when you try to up the

thyroid meds to the right level. That will also make what your body uses

different than what the tests look like. Take 325 mgs of ferrous sulfate 2x

a day. Stop all bread, and preprocessed food that might have wheat in it.

Add b-12 lozenges of 2500 mcg plus a stong b complex vitamin that is in a

capsule, not a hard pill. Any non gnc vitamin store will have it. Take 75

mgs of coq10 from either hsn.com or someplace with top grade coq10, not a

discount drug store. Add a good mult vitamin to that, not a hard pill again,

but a capsule. Start with the 15 mgs cut in half taking 1 half at the time

you get up dissolving it under the tongue and the other part the same way

after 12 noon meal, about 1 hour later than when you eat. Take the 15 mgs

for 2 weeks and tell us how you feel. It should be that you will need to

increase the thyroid meds then another 15 mgs. Your tsh is too high, your

free t4 low, but your free t3 WAY low. go to www.goodhormonehealth.com and

read the articles on anemia

[Guest guest]

So how do I know if I've got low ferritin? No doctor's ever ordered those kinds

of lab tests for me.

C

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

yes, as do many other things. But that is classic for low ferritin

[Guest guest]

demand it. It is very important for thyroid people

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

yes, as do many other things. But that is classic for low ferritin

[Guest guest]

>>How the heck does one know if they're got Hashi's or even Graves, etc if never

tested or dx'd by any doctors for it? heck, I can't even get any doctors to

order free T3 or free T4 for me. <<

You should ask your doctor to run thyroid antibody tests, or if they have ask to

see the lab results. I also was never tested for them, But I know both from

family history and symptoms over the years that I do have Hashi's.

*Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV

Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/

---

Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Version: 6.0.788 / Virus Database: 533 - Release Date: 11/1/2004

[Guest guest]

Well my doctors obviously don't think it's important since none of them ordered

lab tests for it so far.

Should I add it to the lab order I have here for TSH & T4 my dr. checked that I

haven't had a blood draw for yet?

She told me to take the order to any lab of my choice. But I haven't done it yet

as I haven't had a car but do now. Have to get it registered at the DMV first

tho. Haven't got much energy to get going on that tho, let alone get myself out

of the house for anything else either.

What else should I add to the lab order? Will the lab I take it to honor my

requests for additional tests even tho the doctor didn't order it in her name?

Isn't that forgery or fraud or something?

What do I do with the lab results if my doctor doesn't know how to read them,

didn't order them, etc.?

C

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

demand it. It is very important for thyroid people

[Guest guest]

you should add free t3, free t4, ferritin, anyone else want to add something

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

demand it. It is very important for thyroid people

[Guest guest]

Antibodies? Is that another thing I ought to add to this lab order my doctor

gave me for getting tests for T4 & TSH only? What else should I add to this lab

order that I haven't had a blood draw for yet?

Should I also add tests for:

antibodies (where's that on the order? what to ask for?)

Ferritin (What to check or ask for?

mercury toxcity (ditto?)

Adrenal exhaustion (ditto?)

T3 free & T4 free. (I can write that in under the " Other tests/instructions " at

the bottom of the order I guess.)

What other tests should I add to the order, if any? And should I call my doctor

& tell her I'm adding these other things to be tested or not?

Caroline

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

You should ask your doctor to run thyroid antibody tests, or if they have ask

to see the lab results. I also was never tested for them, But I know both from

family history and symptoms over the years that I do have Hashi's.

[Guest guest]

Okay I wrote those on a post-it note attached to the lab order. I'll wait now to

see what the others here have to add, if anything.

TY,

Caroline

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

you should add free t3, free t4, ferritin, anyone else want to add something

----- Original Message -----

From: Caroline Pollak

Should I add it to the lab order I have here for TSH & T4 my dr. checked

that I haven't had a blood draw for yet?

[Guest guest]

Caroline, what it might do is make the dr mad, which may mean you end

up paying for what she herself didn't order. I suspect that is why I

have one charge at my lab because I added FT3 (just a checkmark) and

they had a copy there, to match up later, with what the lab actually

ran. lol.

On Tue, 9 Nov 2004 10:45:04 -0800

" Caroline Pollak " wrote:

> Well my doctors obviously don't think it's important since none

>of them ordered lab tests for it so far.

>

> Should I add it to the lab order I have here for TSH & T4 my dr.

>checked that I haven't had a blood draw for yet?

> She told me to take the order to any lab of my choice. What else should I add

to the lab order? Will the lab I take it to

>honor my requests for additional tests even tho the doctor didn't

>order it in her name? Isn't that forgery or fraud or something?

>

> What do I do with the lab results if my doctor doesn't know how to

>read them, didn't order them, etc.?

> C

[Guest guest]

Caroline, you might call your doctor and ASK her abbot thyroid antibodies. You

may have been tested for these already and not even known it. If not, then ask

her to add that to your slip.

*Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV

Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/

---

Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Version: 6.0.788 / Virus Database: 533 - Release Date: 11/1/2004

[Guest guest]

Never was tested for thyroid antibodies that I know of by an previous doctors.

Certainly not by my new doctor who just ordered lab tests for me which I haven't

even had a blood draw for yet. All she ordered is TSH & T4. Also definitely not

by the two doctors before her. I could add it to my lab order tho without asking

her. But after I get a full list of everything to order, then I'll call her &

tell her I'm ordering them on her lab order.

TY,

Caroline

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

Caroline, you might call your doctor and ASK her abbot thyroid antibodies. You

may have been tested for these already and not even known it. If not, then ask

her to add that to your slip.

[Guest guest]

I believe the labs expect my Medicare or supplemental ins. to pay for the lab

tests. The doctor doesn't submit the price of those to the insurance companies.

But the labs do.

Yes my dr. might get mad if I don't call & ask her to add the extra lab tests

for me. So I will call her first. But the lab will still bill Medicare for me.

C

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

Caroline, what it might do is make the dr mad, which may mean you end

up paying for what she herself didn't order. I suspect that is why I

have one charge at my lab because I added FT3 (just a checkmark) and

they had a copy there, to match up later, with what the lab actually

ran. lol.

[Guest guest]

I think that you'd fare better with this new dr by not adding a lot of

stuff to the labsheet to be tested. I would speak to her about them,

but be forewarned that if she doesn't think they are necessary, then

you'll know that as soon as you ask.

SandyE~Houston

On Tue, 9 Nov 2004 12:25:55 -0800

" Caroline Pollak " wrote:

> I believe the labs expect my Medicare or supplemental ins. to

>pay for the lab tests. The doctor doesn't submit the price of those

>to the insurance companies. But the labs do.

>

> Yes my dr. might get mad if I don't call & ask her to add the extra

>lab tests for me. So I will call her first. But the lab will still

>bill Medicare for me.

> C

> Re: new labs; entering the

>fray...

>

>

> Caroline, what it might do is make the dr mad, which may mean you

>end

> up paying for what she herself didn't order. I suspect that is

>why I

> have one charge at my lab because I added FT3 (just a checkmark)

>and

> they had a copy there, to match up later, with what the lab

>actually

> ran. lol.

>

>

[Guest guest]

P.S. If you'll email me privately, I've got a couple of astro charts here for

you & Jimmy to discuss w/you. Sorry I haven't got your email addy.

C

[Guest guest]

She didn't think the free T3 & free T4 were necessary to add when I asked her to

& she flat out refused to saying they weren't necessary. So why would she think

other things would be? However, I was planning to call her first before adding

any tho, which I stated in a previous email.

It's only 12:30pm here now & I'm so exhausted now from being up since 8:30

reading emails here, eating breakfast & taking all my pills an hour apart, I'm

going to go back to bed now. Seems I'm getting more & more tired & sleepy every

day here on this Armour only.

Can't do another thing today. Not even drive to the DMV to register my new car

or go to the health food store for more of my calcium formula I ran out of days

ago as I'd planned. Manana for all that. I'm too pooped to pop...going to bed

now.

TY,

C

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

I think that you'd fare better with this new dr by not adding a lot of

stuff to the labsheet to be tested. I would speak to her about them,

but be forewarned that if she doesn't think they are necessary, then

you'll know that as soon as you ask.

SandyE~Houston

[Guest guest]

who is this for

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

P.S. If you'll email me privately, I've got a couple of astro charts here for

you & Jimmy to discuss w/you. Sorry I haven't got your email addy.

C

[Guest guest]

If she didn't think they were necessary, I'd just hold off on asking

her anything, and wait till you've had time enuff, at least 6-8 weeks

before getting any testing done, but that is just me. You have to

remember that I'm a rogue of sorts and I'n honestly not interested in

what labs say till I am face to face with a dr who knows how

antibodies, which I do have can skew the TSH, which is their means of

seeing where I'm at (even though they're wrong). :-)

SandyE~Houston

On Tue, 9 Nov 2004 12:40:23 -0800

" Caroline Pollak " wrote:

> She didn't think the free T3 & free T4 were necessary to add

>when I asked her to & she flat out refused to saying they weren't

>necessary. So why would she think other things would be? However, I

>was planning to call her first before adding any tho, which I stated

>in a previous email.

>

> It's only 12:30pm here now & I'm so exhausted now from being up

>since 8:30 reading emails here, eating breakfast & taking all my

>pills an hour apart, I'm going to go back to bed now. Seems I'm

>getting more & more tired & sleepy every day here on this Armour

>only.

>

>

> I think that you'd fare better with this new dr by not adding a

>lot of

> stuff to the labsheet to be tested. I would speak to her about

>them,

> but be forewarned that if she doesn't think they are necessary,

>then

> you'll know that as soon as you ask.

>

> SandyE~Houston

>

>

[Guest guest]

Sorry jamy, that was for me. CAroline just didn't have my regular

email to send it any other way.

SandyE~Houston

On Tue, 9 Nov 2004 12:45:07 -0800

" Jamy " wrote:

>

> who is this for

> Re: new labs; entering the

>fray...

>

>

> P.S. If you'll email me privately, I've got a couple of astro

>charts here for you & Jimmy to discuss w/you. Sorry I haven't got

>your email addy.

> C

>

>

[Guest guest]

It's taken care of, thanx.

C

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

who is this for

----- Original

[Guest guest]

Well I can't exactly not ask her anything. I mean I have to get the blood draw

for the T4 & TSH tests she ordered on this lab order I have here. So you're

saying I shouldn't put anything else on the order? Just leave it as is & get

only the T4 & TSH tested for now?

You know I'm rather inclined to agree with you. I'm sure there'll be antibodies

since my immune system is so screwed up. I think I'm going to end up trying to

find a good thyroid doctor anyway. So why bother for now? She wants to see me in

a couple of weeks, (a month from my 10-28 first visit) not 6-8 weeks. personally

I think I'm wasting my time even bothering with her anymore. I should be using

my time to find a really good doctor from one of the lists here. I don't know

why the others keep saying to give this doctor a chance. I don't think she knows

what she's doing, really. But maybe I'm just down on doctors altogether because

none of the ones I've ever seen seems to know what they were doing & never

tested me for anything much.

C

Re: new labs; entering the fray...

If she didn't think they were necessary, I'd just hold off on asking

her anything, and wait till you've had time enuff, at least 6-8 weeks

before getting any testing done, but that is just me. You have to

remember that I'm a rogue of sorts and I'n honestly not interested in

what labs say till I am face to face with a dr who knows how

antibodies, which I do have can skew the TSH, which is their means of

seeing where I'm at (even though they're wrong). :-)

SandyE~Houston

[Guest guest]

It depends. With my endo's office I went in for my blood test and

also requested that they test my Ferritin, TIBC and a CBC. They did.

Keep in mind I went in there without an appointment too. And they

didn't check with the Dr.

Louise

> Well my doctors obviously don't think it's important since none of

them ordered lab tests for it so far.

>

> Should I add it to the lab order I have here for TSH & T4 my dr.

checked that I haven't had a blood draw for yet?

> She told me to take the order to any lab of my choice. But I

haven't done it yet as I haven't had a car but do now. Have to get it

registered at the DMV first tho. Haven't got much energy to get going

on that tho, let alone get myself out of the house for anything else

either.

>

> What else should I add to the lab order? Will the lab I take it to

honor my requests for additional tests even tho the doctor didn't

order it in her name? Isn't that forgery or fraud or something?

>

> What do I do with the lab results if my doctor doesn't know how to

read them, didn't order them, etc.?

> C

> Re: new labs; entering the

fray...

>

> demand it. It is very important for thyroid people

>

>

>