Re: chocolate to everyone in this group....

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 10/16/2004 11:10:27 PM Eastern Standard Time,

artisticgroom@... writes:

> I WANT fudge!!!

>

brownies....with pot in them...baron and janie can get together and do

this...

cindi

[Guest guest]

<Laurie licks her lips in anticipation>

>brownies....with pot in them...baron and >janie can get together and do

>this...

>cindi

Re: chocolate to everyone in this group....

In a message dated 10/16/2004 11:10:27 PM Eastern Standard Time,

artisticgroom@... writes:

> I WANT fudge!!!

>

brownies....with pot in them...baron and janie can get together and do

this...

cindi

[Guest guest]

Oh but what a nice fudgey chocolatey monster it is! I'll take that kind over the

starvation/deprivation/restriction monster any day of the year. We only live

once & life is too short to deprive oneself of everything that makes us happy.

Re: chocolate to everyone in this group....

i've started a monster...

[Guest guest]

Haven't read them yet, but will, but this is really a scary thought, Janie,

as in What if you really aren't all that iron poor, but are taking a ton of

iron. Iron overload is detrimental to the heart. On the other hand, anemia

is devastating, so this is so confusing for me, since I posted that other

article about another type of testing for iron status. I had always thought

that the ferritin was the hallmark or iron status.

Re: chocolate to everyone in this

group....

>

>

> The following was in the second link below and it's

> important!: " These data suggest that serum ferritin appears to be

> sensitive to thyroid status, especially in women. Further, increased

> or decreased ferritin concentrations may not be an index of iron

> stores in thyroid disorders. "

>

> Janie

>

> > http://intl-jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/84/9/3099

> > http://medind.nic.in/imvw/imvw17820.html

> > http://www.thyroid-info.com/articles/hemachromatosis-iron.htm

[Guest guest]

wrote:

>is devastating, so this is so confusing for me, since I posted that other

>article about another type of testing for iron status. I had always thought

>that the ferritin was the hallmark or iron status.

>

>

Not in an inflammatory condition becuase it is an acute phase reactant - ie it

responds to inflammatory processes such as Hashis , RA or infection etc by

rising -which is why some test for inflammation eg antibodies or ESR need to be

done to interpret a high ferrition

Also ferritin will need to be checked freqiuently if it is mid range to check

that this is not masking low iron stores.

Low ferritin plus suggestive RBC indices or serum iron status will of course

need iron.

the best test for iron stores remains a bone marrow biopsy

Alison

http://www.alisonashwell.com

new work uploaded

http://www.artwanted/alisonashwell

[Guest guest]

wrote:

>>The following was in the second link below and it's

>>important!: " These data suggest that serum ferritin appears to be

>>sensitive to thyroid status, especially in women. Further, increased

>>or decreased ferritin concentrations may not be an index of iron

>>stores in thyroid disorders. "

>>

>>

>>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

i wasn't able to get that link to come up but i googled the quote and

got a cached abstract - i am surprised the 50 controls did not have a

higher ferritin than 183 in a mixed group- i wasn't able to find out

more on their experiment - eg if the controls were screened for thyroid

disease and anaemia, general good health. additionaly it would be

interesting to know the number of vegetarians in the sample given that

it was done in India.

also its not a big sample given the attempt to categorise both hyper and

hypo thyroidism effects in men and women -[essentially 4 populations

within the test group] I would be surprised if the statistics stand up

on sample size alone.

--

Alison

http://www.alisonashwell.com

new work uploaded

http://www.artwanted/alisonashwell

[Guest guest]

So if you've got inflammation that means you've likely got Hashi's?

Re: Re: chocolate to everyone in this

group....

Not in an inflammatory condition becuase it is an acute phase reactant - ie it

responds to inflammatory processes such as Hashis , RA or infection etc by

rising -which is why some test for inflammation eg antibodies or ESR need to be

done to interpret a high ferrition

[Guest guest]

Caroline Pollak wrote:

>So if you've got inflammation that means you've likely got Hashi's?

>

>

>

>

>

no-if you have hashis or another autoimmune problem you have to have

more info before interpreting a ferritin result

--

Alison

http://www.alisonashwell.com

new work uploaded

http://www.artwanted/alisonashwell

[Guest guest]

Ooh, bone marrow biopsy, painful!! No thanks. I have bragged about my

ferritin, yet, because I know that I have had so much inflammation, on and

off, I'm wondering if it's not a falso thing. I always have a 60 to 70

ferritin, despite the way I feel at times. I have strong allergies,

constant sinus infections, and asthma, along with thyroid irritation and

discomfort there from one time to the next. Then, each one goes away

briefly, but there's usually something going on with one of them almost ALL

the time. I think that this would warrant an ESR, as I've had thyroid

antibodies soring for quite sometime. Maybe at some point I'll be able to

run other antibody testing, as in the antigliadin, the specific ones for

lupus (ANA was negative), and whatever else, but for now, the ESR will have

to do, I guess. Maybe my ferritin is telling me a false story, who knows.

Aaaggghhhh, this is so confusing, and it's like drowning in all this info

sometimes.

Re: Re: chocolate to everyone in this

group....

>

> wrote:

>

> >is devastating, so this is so confusing for me, since I posted that other

> >article about another type of testing for iron status. I had always

thought

> >that the ferritin was the hallmark or iron status.

> >

> >

> Not in an inflammatory condition becuase it is an acute phase reactant -

ie it responds to inflammatory processes such as Hashis , RA or infection

etc by rising -which is why some test for inflammation eg antibodies or ESR

need to be done to interpret a high ferrition

>

> Also ferritin will need to be checked freqiuently if it is mid range to

check that this is not masking low iron stores.

> Low ferritin plus suggestive RBC indices or serum iron status will of

course need iron.

> the best test for iron stores remains a bone marrow biopsy

>

>

> Alison

[Guest guest]

The article I THINK that this quote refers to is an article by a doctor, but

not a full blown doctor study. So there is more than one source for this.

I can't remember the name of the testing that it referred to as being more

of the hallmark for iron testing, but it wasn't the TIBC or the

Transferritin, it was something I wasn't familiar with. Can't remember,

duh!

Re: Re: chocolate to everyone in this

group....

>

> wrote:

>

> >>The following was in the second link below and it's

> >>important!: " These data suggest that serum ferritin appears to be

> >>sensitive to thyroid status, especially in women. Further, increased

> >>or decreased ferritin concentrations may not be an index of iron

> >>stores in thyroid disorders. "

> >

>

> i wasn't able to get that link to come up but i googled the quote and

> got a cached abstract - i am surprised the 50 controls did not have a

> higher ferritin than 183 in a mixed group- i wasn't able to find out

> more on their experiment - eg if the controls were screened for thyroid

> disease and anaemia, general good health. additionaly it would be

> interesting to know the number of vegetarians in the sample given that

> it was done in India.

> also its not a big sample given the attempt to categorise both hyper and

> hypo thyroidism effects in men and women -[essentially 4 populations

> within the test group] I would be surprised if the statistics stand up

> on sample size alone.

>

> --

> Alison