Re: this makes me want to barf

[Guest guest]

Well, they have been tryin' to make those whinin'

women shut their mouths forever by saying they are

nutz. What else isn't new? It is very threatening and

scary in this world to have all those ridiculous

things in one's records. So, shut yer moufs, girls and

suffer in silence. The boys (and their animus women

wannabees) don't like women complaining about sex

hurting.

Besides they have to write about something so they can

get their names in the journals, even if they make it

all up.

My opinion

Arline

--- femifesto wrote:

> HOW LONG are they going to continue to blame women's

> health problems

> on psychiatric disorders?!? I really can't take it

> anymore.

>

>

http://www.reuters.com/article/healthNews/idUSFLE57419920070405

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hi Jule,Read it again. 46.8 percent of the women themselves reported sexual/physcial abuse. That's a whopping amount of people who could ....... potentially...... be suffering from the long term affects of PTSD.As a PTSD sufferer, I would hate to remain 'uncured' if my pelvic pain was indeed directly related to my mental status. I think its wise to cover all bases to rid a woman of such terrible pain as pelvic pain.The last paragraph says that ruling this out as a potential contributor should be part of the 'comprehensive evaluation of patients with pelivc pain'. It doesn't say that all pelvic pain conditions are caused by physchiatric disorders.Just some thoughts from one who knows the pain of PTSD.DUstyfemifesto wrote: HOW LONG are they

going to continue to blame women's health problems on psychiatric disorders?!? I really can't take it anymore.http://www.reuters.com/article/healthNews/idUSFLE57419920070405**IF REPLYING TO THIS POST, PLEASE REMOVE ORIGINAL POST, Thanks for your cooperation! *****

[Guest guest]

Hi , I don't know if you know this but years ago I did an internet survey. We had over 380 responses so the data is pretty credible. The incidence of sexual abuse was not even as great as the average population. These docs look for any excuse to avoid actually having to find a cause and treatment. Just think of the word hysterectomy where hyster means uterus from the word hysterical. So basically they are equating the miraculous organ that every person on earth spent their first seven to nine months developing, the organ w/o which life would be impossible, with the word hysteria! Love, Sandi

Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out

new cars at Yahoo! Autos.

[Guest guest]

Well-- I suppose it is possible for PTSD to make the

vestibule nerves to proliferate???

But to be honest, I doubt it. If, however, somebody

would show some actual honest to gosh scientific

proof, I might consider it.

> I think its wise to cover all bases

to rid a woman of such terrible pain as pelvic pain.<

If only that were happening--?

Arline

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

I agree Arline. The problem is that these docs aren't testing at all. Oh, excuse me...I forgot the invaluable Q tip test!!! This high tech Q tip test is my huge pet peeve. Let's see how much you scream if I poke you here ( where I already said I have pain and visible inflammation). I know that there is Enterolab, and Igenex, and for those going on the nerve theory there is an EMG. A few tests are out there...but the drs don't prescribe them and they are out of network. What we need is a list of diagnostic procedures for docs to order to try to get to the root cause. Sandi

Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out

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[Guest guest]

VERY FUNNY COMMENT ABOUT THE Q-TIP TEST Sandi. I laughed when I read this post because you are so right. How radiculous is that?!

Mindy>> I agree Arline. The problem is that these docs aren't testing at all. Oh, excuse me...I forgot the invaluable Q tip test!!! This high tech Q tip test is my huge pet peeve. Let's see how much you scream if I poke you here ( where I already said I have pain and visible inflammation). > > I know that there is Enterolab, and Igenex, and for those going on the nerve theory there is an EMG. A few tests are out there...but the drs don't prescribe them and they are out of network. What we need is a list of diagnostic procedures for docs to order to try to get to the root cause.> > Sandi> > > > ---------------------------------> Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?> Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.>

[Guest guest]

The article doesn't claim that PTSD makes the vestibular nerves proliferate.However, since you brought it up - Tension and body guarding as a result of tense muscles can affect nerves etc anywhere in your body, even the pelvic floor - as those of us who have benefitted from physical therapy for pelvic floor issues know. Perhaps the tension of bad nerves causes one to tense lower back muscles, or constantly tap the foot with a repeated motion - or any one of many of the tight, rigid muscle binding motions that 'bad nerves' people suffer from.BABB wrote: Well-- I suppose it is possible for PTSD to make thevestibule nerves to proliferate???But to be honest, I doubt it. If, however, somebodywould show some actual honest to gosh scientificproof, I might

consider it.> I think its wise to cover all bases to rid a woman of such terrible pain as pelvic pain.<If only that were happening--?Arline__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

The word hysterectomy has it's origin from the Greek hysteros, meaning uterus, and "ectomy" meaning removal. Hysterectomy, therefore, refers to the surgical removal of the uterus (womb).Sandi Sharp wrote: Hi , I don't know if you know this but years ago I did an internet survey. We had over 380 responses so the data is pretty credible. The incidence of sexual abuse was not even as great as the average population. These docs look for any excuse to avoid actually having to find a cause and treatment. Just think of the word hysterectomy where hyster means uterus from the word hysterical. So basically they are equating

the miraculous organ that every person on earth spent their first seven to nine months developing, the organ w/o which life would be impossible, with the word hysteria! Love, Sandi Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos.

Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out

new cars at Yahoo! Autos.

[Guest guest]

Hi Dawn, There is a strong mind body connection. Our internet study did not show a link between SEXUAL abuse and v pain. We did not look at physical abuse too. Some people even wrote to ask us what sexual abuse is --- they said they didn't remember any event but perhaps they forgot. It also depends on how one defines physical abuse. I grew up in the 70s and spanking was very common. Back then, my parents spanked me a few times when I was bad. I wouldn't consider that physical abuse although today perhaps someone would. Most all kids then were disciplined that way. Sandi

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[Guest guest]

I guess this is an important subject to me!!! Kristy said that they can see inflammation on MRI. I remember that on my MRIs too, although that is a pretty expensive way to look for inflammation. I think it was slightly fuzzier where there was some slight inflammation. But I don't believe that one can rule out inflammation if it is not visible on MRI. I think this was just a finding that the MRI picked up. I do not recommend MRIs to look for inflammation of external areas. I would expect our providers to see the area slightly red or puffy and not need an MRI to back up what they can see externally.Sandi

Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out

new cars at Yahoo! Autos.

[Guest guest]

Dawn, I am not at all taking about tight muscles.

However if one has repeated severe muscle spasms

(different thing again) there is a physical problem

somewhere beyond stress I am sure. I am not talking

about muscle spasms either though.

Arline

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

What is ptsd?

M.

> >

> > Well-- I suppose it is possible for PTSD to make the

> > vestibule nerves to proliferate???

> >

> > But to be honest, I doubt it. If, however, somebody

> > would show some actual honest to gosh scientific

> > proof, I might consider it.

> >

> > > I think its wise to cover all bases

> > to rid a woman of such terrible pain as pelvic pain.<

> >

> > If only that were happening--?

> >

> > Arline

>

[Guest guest]

post traumatic stress disorder, i believe.missyfour wrote: What is ptsd? M. > > > > Well-- I suppose it is possible for PTSD to make the > > vestibule nerves to proliferate??? > > > > But to be honest, I doubt it. If, however, somebody > > would show some actual honest to gosh scientific > > proof, I might consider it. > > > > > I think its wise to cover all

bases > > to rid a woman of such terrible pain as pelvic pain.< > > > > If only that were happening--? > > > > Arline >

Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out

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[Guest guest]

The statistics I sent in the websites kinda do bear out that a great number of women are victims of abuse - be it sexual, verbal , physical or otherwise.I would say that if a woman presented with pelvic pain and had no visible signs of damage or illness or disease that a doc would be remiss if he DIDN"T ask about abuse. It would be a very logical question to ask - as women can be and are raped and beaten and once healed from these events - the signs are not visible in an exam. So the doc is damned if he does ask and damned if he doesn't if the reason turns out to be a PTSD related issue or a sexual or physical abuse issue.One of the first questions I was asked after a nervous breakdown was had I been abused in any way. One of the first questions I was asked at my very early diagnosis of high blood pressure was "how are things at home - are you troubled by your life in any way". Its a very logical question - for to take

control away from a woman in that way (abuse) robs them of their sense of self, shuts down sensory reaction to everything but fear reactions and since consensual sex is supposed to be pleasurable/desirable - it would be fairly logical for a doc/boyfriend/husband to wonder if some brutal act had robbed a woman of her ability to enjoy the good things in life.We don't know what men are asked when being evaluated by docs for pelvic/erectile problems because we aren't men. But I'm betting the talk goes to past abuse, traumas etc. (as in war vets who can no longer perform due to PTSD). I'm responding in support of screening women for abuse and trauma only because I have been a victim of abuse and I know for certain that many of my physical problems are directly related to my PTSD. I have seen mental health specialists for a lot of years and come to understand a great deal about my actions and reactions and the pain

I've caused my self for such ludicrous things as blaming myself for not protecting younger sibs or my mother - when I myself was only a child. Sandi Sharp wrote: One more thing...it is not that docs insinuate or even just ask about abuse that upsets me. I said I know a woman who was an incest victim and she had horrible pain that went away after she had therapy. What gets me upset is just what said in her latest post..that the medical community disproportionately focuses on the abuse as a cause when statistics just don't bear that out! No one is arguing with you. Just presenting another view. I totally understand the mind body connection. Sandi Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos.

Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out

new cars at Yahoo! Autos.

[Guest guest]

However, in our analysis which was very thorough and is published in a medical journal, we found that many women weren't even clear as to whether they were even sexually abused.

Sandi,

I'm interested in hearing how this study came to be and in which journal it

was published.

Hollis

[Guest guest]

The statistics I sent in the websites kinda do bear out that a great number of women are victims of abuse - be it sexual, verbal , physical or otherwise.

I would say that if a woman presented with pelvic pain and had no visible signs of damage or illness or disease that a doc would be remiss if he DIDN"T ask about abuse. It would be a very logical question to ask - as women can be and are raped and beaten and once healed from these events - the signs are not visible in an exam. So the doc is damned if he does ask and damned if he doesn't if the reason turns out to be a PTSD related issue or a sexual or physical abuse issue.

I think it's interesting that, after literally over a hundred health care practitioners

that i've seen over the last several decades, it was only about two years ago

that i was asked for the first and only time if i had ever dealt with sexual

abuse. The question was asked by a nurse doing an intake before the ob/

gyn entered the room. When i told her that -- and that i thought it was great

that she was screening for this -- she said something which i had never

considered: that, for an abused woman whose abuser is constantly keeping

tabs on her, the examination room of her ob/gyn's office could well be one

of the very few times that she could be alone and speak freely. Good point.

I agree that coupling a history of sexual abuse with a diagnosis of vulvar

pain problems, end of story, does a great disservice to getting to root of

the myriad underlying causes of vulvar pain and DOES stigmatize the whole

issue. Yet, i also know that the statistics on sexual, physical, emtional, and verbal abuse are appalling. I think that screening should be done by

all doctors, regardless of their specialty. It makes the most sense, really,

if family practitioners were in the forefront of this, since their speciality

is the closest we now have to the old family doctor and they see people

for health problems most frequently.

My family practitioner has never brought up the subject. I'll have to

ask him about this the next time i see him.

Hollis

[Guest guest]

But why ask only for sexual problems? Why not for migraines or Fibro or arthritis? I am not against doctors asking but then they should ask for all chronic problems...Not just ones that involve sexual organs. There is no link between sexual abuse and vulvar pain ON AVERAGE. Not saying it doesn't happen to certain individuals. My hope is that when you treat your PTSD all your problems will go away. I also hope that research stops focusing on psychological causes for vulvar pain in general. You wouldn't want them to focus on psychological causes for cancer or diabetes. We need research on the physical not the psychological causes.

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[Guest guest]

Yeah, but statistics also say that like one out of four woman are the

victims of some type of sexual abuse in their life time, so it stands to

reason that the same percentage(at least) of woman with vulvar issues would

be victims of abuse, so should doctors ask all woman?? Doctors are required

to report suspected abuse (at least of children I know of) but to ask about

it when/if no signs are present? I do not believe having VV makes one more

likely to have been abused and I would not like my doctor to ask me about

it, but I do know that here at the university of michigan hospital I have

never been in an examination room that did not have a poster or leaflet

giving info for woman who have been abused and numbers to call for

help...mind and body are linked, but is its my doctors responsibility to

pry for information in my personal life?? I'm not sure, and tend to think

NO, many abused woman avoid the doctor and examinations, so if a woman is

seeking help at the doctor, why not ask for it..granted I have never been

in that situation and hopefully never will be, Anne

--On Tuesday, May 01, 2007 10:28 PM -0700 Anonymous

wrote:

>

>

>

>

> The statistics I sent in the websites kinda do bear out that a great

> number of women are victims of abuse - be it sexual, verbal , physical or

> otherwise.

>

> I would say that if a woman presented with pelvic pain and had no visible

> signs of damage or illness or disease that a doc would be remiss if he

> DIDN " T ask about abuse. It would be a very logical question to ask - as

> women can be and are raped and beaten and once healed from these events -

> the signs are not visible in an exam. So the doc is damned if he does

> ask and damned if he doesn't if the reason turns out to be a PTSD related

> issue or a sexual or physical abuse issue.

>

> One of the first questions I was asked after a nervous breakdown was had

> I been abused in any way. One of the first questions I was asked at my

> very early diagnosis of high blood pressure was " how are things at home -

> are you troubled by your life in any way " . Its a very logical question

> - for to take control away from a woman in that way (abuse) robs them of

> their sense of self, shuts down sensory reaction to everything but fear

> reactions and since consensual sex is supposed to be

> pleasurable/desirable - it would be fairly logical for a

> doc/boyfriend/husband to wonder if some brutal act had robbed a woman of

> her ability to enjoy the good things in life.

>

> We don't know what men are asked when being evaluated by docs for

> pelvic/erectile problems because we aren't men. But I'm betting the

> talk goes to past abuse, traumas etc. (as in war vets who can no longer

> perform due to PTSD).

>

> I'm responding in support of screening women for abuse and trauma only

> because I have been a victim of abuse and I know for certain that many of

> my physical problems are directly related to my PTSD. I have seen

> mental health specialists for a lot of years and come to understand a

> great deal about my actions and reactions and the pain I've caused my

> self for such ludicrous things as blaming myself for not protecting

> younger sibs or my mother - when I myself was only a child.

>

> Sandi Sharp wrote:

>

>

> One more thing...it is not that docs insinuate or even just ask about

> abuse that upsets me. I said I know a woman who was an incest victim and

> she had horrible pain that went away after she had therapy. What gets me

> upset is just what said in her latest post..that the medical

> community disproportionately focuses on the abuse as a cause when

> statistics just don't bear that out!

>

> No one is arguing with you. Just presenting another view. I totally

> understand the mind body connection.

>

> Sandi

>

>

>

> __________________________________________________

> Ahhh...imagining that irresistible " new car " smell?

> Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos.

>

>

>

>

> __________________________________________________

> Ahhh...imagining that irresistible " new car " smell?

> Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos.

[Guest guest]

There are some things that are obvious to me in all

these speculations. It can never be proven that this

is a cause of vulvodynia, it can never be known that

this is the cure, and a lot of money can be spent

unnecessarily if it isn't the cause. So I think we

should think about just why this is such a big thing

again in the life of the physician and supposed

researchers these days and certainly in their

literature.

A whole industry based on people making money

convincing women that they were sexually abused but

they don't remember it came to fame in the eighties

and nineties. That in itself is abuse. People were

even suing their parents for the non remembered sexual

abuse. These crazies (supposed therapists who often

haven't even had Psych 101 but have for example done

their learning in a drug rehab (for example)) actually

exist and do great damage to people.

I think it is abuse to be asked everytime I walk into

a new doctor's office if I have been sexually abused.

My sex life now or in the past in the first place I

don't think is any of their business. I believe it is

just one more new fad they like to get on the record

so they can protect themselves from potential fantasy

lawsuits in the future so they can blame almost

anything on it. There is no privacy you know or maybe

you don't know.

I hate abuse and know that it exists. What I really

hate even more are the feather merchants who make a

living off of it and take advantage of it for their

own purposes.

If one needs to have some kind of counseling that is

what one should do as privately as possible with a

real qualified psychologist with a great

recommendation from somebody without telling your

darned doctors. I suggest that you don't give your

psychologist permission to talk to your doctor or to

tell him anything you said. Often they do this to just

to ingratiate themselves with other professionals.

Be careful and thoughtful before you buy into the

blaming of abuse for your diabetes, (etc.) Think about

real physical diseases that show things like

antibodies in good tests.

Do as you like.

My opinion

Arline

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

And if the doc does ask and the answer is yes, what is

he going to do about it?

Arline

> >

> > The statistics I sent in the websites kinda do

> bear out that a great number

> > of women are victims of abuse - be it sexual,

> verbal , physical or otherwise.

> >

> > I would say that if a woman presented with pelvic

> pain and had no visible

> > signs of damage or illness or disease that a doc

> would be remiss if he DIDN " T

> > ask about abuse.

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

I think it is so wrong to say that if a woman has pelvic pain but no

" physical signs of damage or illness or disease " the doctor should

automatically think of abuse, this makes it sound like if there isn't

anything obviously wrong it must be mental, when the actual DIAGNOSIS, the

thing that makes VVS what it is, is that it is pain with NO OBVIOUS

PHYSICAL reason, while a doctor should address the mental implications of

vulvar pain, its vital that doctors and we ourselves recognize that vulvar

pain is REAL, a REAL PHYSICAL, that is MEDICAL, problem, with its own

distinct causes, no amount of therapy is going to make my purely physical

problem go away, if anything my vvs has CAUSED my aversion to physical

contact and mental hang ups, previously I had a great, healthy, active sex

life, getting a pap smear was as easy and routine as brushing my teeth and

now I have to grit my teeth just to get through one, doctors do always ask

how my sex life was before vvs, just to determine how/when my problem

developed, but why would they need to ask for abuse?? Anne

--

>

>

>

>

> In a message dated 5/2/2007 1:28:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

> mslatrobe@... writes:

>

>

>

>

> The statistics I sent in the websites kinda do bear out that a great

> number of women are victims of abuse - be it sexual, verbal , physical or

> otherwise.

>

> I would say that if a woman presented with pelvic pain and had no visible

> signs of damage or illness or disease that a doc would be remiss if he

> DIDN " T ask about abuse. It would be a very logical question to ask - as

> women can be and are raped and beaten and once healed from these events -

> the signs are not visible in an exam. So the doc is damned if he does

> ask and damned if he doesn't if the reason turns out to be a PTSD related

> issue or a sexual or physical abuse issue.

>

>

>

>

>

>

> I think it's interesting that, after literally over a hundred health care

> practitioners

> that i've seen over the last several decades, it was only about two years

> ago

> that i was asked for the first and only time if i had ever dealt with

> sexual

> abuse. The question was asked by a nurse doing an intake before the ob/

> gyn entered the room. When i told her that -- and that i thought it was

> great

> that she was screening for this -- she said something which i had never

> considered: that, for an abused woman whose abuser is constantly keeping

> tabs on her, the examination room of her ob/gyn's office could well be

> one

> of the very few times that she could be alone and speak freely. Good

> point.

>

> I agree that coupling a history of sexual abuse with a diagnosis of

> vulvar

> pain problems, end of story, does a great disservice to getting to root

> of

> the myriad underlying causes of vulvar pain and DOES stigmatize the whole

> issue. Yet, i also know that the statistics on sexual, physical,

> emtional,

> and verbal abuse are appalling. I think that screening should be done by

> all doctors, regardless of their specialty. It makes the most sense,

> really,

> if family practitioners were in the forefront of this, since their

> speciality

> is the closest we now have to the old family doctor and they see people

> for health problems most frequently.

>

> My family practitioner has never brought up the subject. I'll have to

> ask him about this the next time i see him.

>

> Hollis

>

>

[Guest guest]

The same thing that cops and other health care providers do. Give you

information on were to go and who you can get help from. Women's

support services and the like. They give you phone numbers and place to

call. They give you encouragement that you can get out.

My doc has a form I fill out every year asking questions like, Do you

fear for your life? Are you afraid of being hurt by someone? Vauge

questions that allow them to start a conversation with you.

There is a big push here lately to make sure all the health care

providers and support staff are aware of possible abuse in all of it's

forms and who to contact if they believe there is a problem.

BABB wrote:

>

> And if the doc does ask and the answer is yes, what is

> he going to do about it?

>

> Arline

[Guest guest]

" There is a big push here lately to make sure all the

health care

providers and support staff are aware of possible

abuse in all of it's

forms and who to contact if they believe there is a

problem. "

I know. That is precisely what I am talking about and

I don't think for a microsecond it is a humanitarian

attempt at healing the little woman. Medicine is " big

bidness " . They are expanding and as far as I am

concerned--imploding.

How wonderful it would be for example if they would

push for full healthcare for everyone or push for full

funding by the insurance companies for mental and

emotional problems which are only paid for at less

than half the rate of others illnesses.

I read yesterday that this administration started a

data base sometime in the recent past few years where

they keep track of all people in the US who are taking

any kind of antipsychotic med, anti depressants, etc.

Where do you suppose they got the information??

Do you suppose this is done to help the little ladies?

Not in a pig's eye.

Arline

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

The current Chimp-in-chief is a different story.

The training I went through dealt with recognizing any sort of abuse in

any patient. Children, men, folks who are mentally unable to care for

themselves, the elderly. I do believe they are trying to help people

here and not hunt for extra money from that. Not to long ago, they

made the drug reps stop buying lunch for the doctors and nurses. I

believe their good intent.

BABB wrote:

>

> I know. That is precisely what I am talking about and

> I don't think for a microsecond it is a humanitarian

> attempt at healing the little woman. Medicine is " big

> bidness " . They are expanding and as far as I am

> concerned--imploding.

[Guest guest]

Some patients who have fibro are often asked if they have been

abused in any way. And yes, I've met a few others that from the

point of arthritis that have been asked if they have been abused

in any way as well.

I met a woman who had symptoms of Diabetes and she knew it was

Diabetes but when she told the drs what she was noticing and

asked to be tested for Diabetes they wouldn't do it. They

decided that she was making it up. Well, when she found another

dr to get help they listened and they tested her and sure enough

she had Diabetes. Until I met her I thought that everyone who

had symptoms of Diabetes would not be treated like this.

Kristy

__________________________________________________