Re: Angry!!! arrrrrrrrrrhhh !!!

[Guest guest]

Boy, I can relate! The only thing my derm is good for is writing

prescriptions for minocin and noritate(which, I am now convinced, does

nothing for me). She never mentions diet, supplements, stress

triggers, h.pylori, photoderm... and every time I go in there (about

once every 6 weeks) I ask her opinion on some issue I've read about

here. She never knows what the heck I'm talking about. When I went to

see my GP recently (the one who referred me to this derm) I asked her

if there were any derms in Ottawa who were experts on rosacea. She

looked at me like I was nuts. She said, " all dermatologists know how

to treat rosacea " . I beg to differ. The more I continue on in my

struggles with rosacea, the more I realize, help is not too likely to

come from the medical communicty. (At least not the ones to which I

have access!)(Boy I wish Dr. Sy had a practice in my town!)But as it

is, I'm gonna have to do it myself. Thank goodness for this group! At

least we can pool our experiences and share our hard-earned knowledge!

> Well, I waited for this appointment for more than 2

> months having had really high expectations, since I

> was told that Im goin to see one of the best derms in

> the city (Montreal).

>

> Well the fact that I had to wait for more than two

> hours to see a derm altho I came right on time is

> nothing compared to what I heard from the derm once it

> was finally my turn to see the doc.

>

> When I mentionted photoderm she have me that stupid-

> sheepish look and told me she never even heard about

> such procedure... When I told her about low dosage

> long term accutane course (10mg) for controlling

> rosacea and my oily skin, she gave me yet another

> blank look in her eyes. She informed me that she never

> heard nor prescribed low accutane dosages for anyone

> and that she is not sure if that works at all and that

> she is goin to check some med litterature and inform

> me next time about her findings (Note: next time is in

> another 2 months!!!)

>

> Then the best part comes. After I told her about my

> redness and extremely sensitive skin , she offered me

> a prescription for RETIN-A!!! I was like wooowww, hold

> on isnt that goin to be too harsh for my rosacea skin.

> She told me no, the only side-effect that I might get

> from Retin-A is a bit dry skin and that irritation is

> not an issue...

>

> When I told her that my redness and oiliness really

> bothers me, she told me , she " understands " yet she

> cant really do anything about that since that my

> naturaly complexion I was born with. NATURAL

> Complexion!!!! I had a flowless skin just few years

> ago and Im sick and tired of feeling hot and red, yet

> the only thing the derm could tell me is that

> basically I have to live with my skin condition and

> accept it!!! WTF???!!!

> When the appointment was over I felt like breaking or

> punching something, I still do. The derm I've waited

> to see for so long , turned out to be one of the

> dumbest and ignorant docs Ive ever had a " pleasure " to

> meet with....damn it! I guess the fight goes on and on

> and on.....

> Now Im goin to have to look for yet another derm... so

> tired of all that B.S.

>

>

> P.S. ANYONE FROM Montreal in here???? Anyone knows any

> good derm in this city??

>

>

> Regards,

> SC.

>

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

I would like someone to tell me if Dermatology is a difficult field,

because so many of us seem to have bad experiences. My horror stories

are opposite to your's. Rather than wanting Accutance, one derm

dumped me because I didn't want to take it. Another wanted to put me

on either Accutane or the Birth Control pill. When I said that the

latter choice was " interesting " my true meaning went right over his

head. Another derm suggested I get a facial. None of them thought I

had cea or even know the facts about it.

To wait forever for an uninformed derm is so unfair. You can't

express an opinion in the 5 minutes they allow you. And don't even

think about mentioning alternative or herbal anything. How hard is it

to read and keep up to date and have COMPASSION??

I live in the Niagara region so I don't know about Derms in your

area. I will be seeing a derm in Mississauga next month. If you get

desperate (like me) and want one in the GTA, let me know.

Maybe we should start a good derm directory.

> Well, I waited for this appointment for more than 2

> months having had really high expectations, since I

> was told that Im goin to see one of the best derms in

> the city (Montreal).

>

> Well the fact that I had to wait for more than two

> hours to see a derm altho I came right on time is

> nothing compared to what I heard from the derm once it

> was finally my turn to see the doc.

>

> When I mentionted photoderm she have me that stupid-

> sheepish look and told me she never even heard about

> such procedure... When I told her about low dosage

> long term accutane course (10mg) for controlling

> rosacea and my oily skin, she gave me yet another

> blank look in her eyes. She informed me that she never

> heard nor prescribed low accutane dosages for anyone

> and that she is not sure if that works at all and that

> she is goin to check some med litterature and inform

> me next time about her findings (Note: next time is in

> another 2 months!!!)

>

> Then the best part comes. After I told her about my

> redness and extremely sensitive skin , she offered me

> a prescription for RETIN-A!!! I was like wooowww, hold

> on isnt that goin to be too harsh for my rosacea skin.

> She told me no, the only side-effect that I might get

> from Retin-A is a bit dry skin and that irritation is

> not an issue...

>

> When I told her that my redness and oiliness really

> bothers me, she told me , she " understands " yet she

> cant really do anything about that since that my

> naturaly complexion I was born with. NATURAL

> Complexion!!!! I had a flowless skin just few years

> ago and Im sick and tired of feeling hot and red, yet

> the only thing the derm could tell me is that

> basically I have to live with my skin condition and

> accept it!!! WTF???!!!

> When the appointment was over I felt like breaking or

> punching something, I still do. The derm I've waited

> to see for so long , turned out to be one of the

> dumbest and ignorant docs Ive ever had a " pleasure " to

> meet with....damn it! I guess the fight goes on and on

> and on.....

> Now Im goin to have to look for yet another derm... so

> tired of all that B.S.

>

>

> P.S. ANYONE FROM Montreal in here???? Anyone knows any

> good derm in this city??

>

>

> Regards,

> SC.

>

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I understand and share your frustration. Some comments:

My rough guess is that at least 50% and maybe as high as 70% of derms

are unfamiliar with photoderm, primarily because there have been

relatively few publications on it. My further guess is that a

majority of those who have heard of it think that it is a waste of

time and money. (In some cases, they are correct.)

Concerning low-dose accutane, the conventional wisdom, based on

treating acne, not rosacea, is that accutane must be administered at

a weight-derived dosage for 6 months in order to have some lasting

effect. My (former) derm wanted to treat my daily flushing via this

approach, and I refused, primarily due to an email exchange I had

with Dr Odom at UCSF Med School who had recently reported

success in treating rosacea with pulsed, low-dose accutane. Indeed,

it is his opinion that low-dose accutane is safer than long-term use

of antibiotics, and he is inclined to not even order blood work

(required for standard dosage) at this low level. (I probably should

not quote him on this for legal reasons, but he really helped me

come

to the right conclusion: treating flushing with accutane is

questionable, to say the least).

I once asked my (former) derm if there was a 'center of expertise' on

rosacea that I should consult. He said (of course) not, because any

derm can treat rosacea. Actually, this is a true statement: I have

read a good deal of the literature, and I am confident that I could

do just as good a job treating the majority of rosacea cases based on

my reading of the literature and numerous posts on this forum. (BTW,

recognizing rosacea, particularly in younger patients, can be tricky

....). But we are all here because the treatment that works on 90+%

of rosaceans, namely 3 months of oral antibiotics + noritate, has not

worked for us. My derm knew the literature, and we went down

standard second-phase treatments: antihistamines, beta-blockers,

...., and finally accutane. But I will add that the real problem is

that the underlying mechanism for rosacea is far from understood

(Geoffrey Nase probably knows more than anyone at this point ...),

and

hence derms are reduced to trial-and-error in problematic cases like

ours. Compassionate derms feel our pain, not the flushing, but the

frustration of 'why can't you just fix it ...'. My flushing has

gotten much better, but I have said many times to my wife that no one

can appreciate how depressing it is to go through constant flushing

with no clue whatsoever about what is causing it. My (former) derm

was very competent, but he never REALLY understood what it means to

deal with this disease: not only the appearance and self-confidence

issues, but the incessant facial burning. When my wife took our

young son to see him, he told her I had a real attitude problem .. he

was right again, but for reasons that he and I will never agree on.

Rick

> Well, I waited for this appointment for more than 2

> months having had really high expectations, since I

> was told that Im goin to see one of the best derms in

> the city (Montreal).

>

> Well the fact that I had to wait for more than two

> hours to see a derm altho I came right on time is

> nothing compared to what I heard from the derm once it

> was finally my turn to see the doc.

>

> When I mentionted photoderm she have me that stupid-

> sheepish look and told me she never even heard about

> such procedure... When I told her about low dosage

> long term accutane course (10mg) for controlling

> rosacea and my oily skin, she gave me yet another

> blank look in her eyes. She informed me that she never

> heard nor prescribed low accutane dosages for anyone

> and that she is not sure if that works at all and that

> she is goin to check some med litterature and inform

> me next time about her findings (Note: next time is in

> another 2 months!!!)

>

> Then the best part comes. After I told her about my

> redness and extremely sensitive skin , she offered me

> a prescription for RETIN-A!!! I was like wooowww, hold

> on isnt that goin to be too harsh for my rosacea skin.

> She told me no, the only side-effect that I might get

> from Retin-A is a bit dry skin and that irritation is

> not an issue...

>

> When I told her that my redness and oiliness really

> bothers me, she told me , she " understands " yet she

> cant really do anything about that since that my

> naturaly complexion I was born with. NATURAL

> Complexion!!!! I had a flowless skin just few years

> ago and Im sick and tired of feeling hot and red, yet

> the only thing the derm could tell me is that

> basically I have to live with my skin condition and

> accept it!!! WTF???!!!

> When the appointment was over I felt like breaking or

> punching something, I still do. The derm I've waited

> to see for so long , turned out to be one of the

> dumbest and ignorant docs Ive ever had a " pleasure " to

> meet with....damn it! I guess the fight goes on and on

> and on.....

> Now Im goin to have to look for yet another derm... so

> tired of all that B.S.

>

>

> P.S. ANYONE FROM Montreal in here???? Anyone knows any

> good derm in this city??

>

>

> Regards,

> SC.

>

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

<<...I've gotten more help from this group than all of those doctors

combined.>>

I myself have suffered due to what I consider improper treatment at the

hands of various medical professionals. I have been prescribed 2.5%

hydrocortisone on (3) separate occasions-- and was left using the product

indefinitely. I have been told that my symptoms were due to MALE MENOPAUSE,

and that I should " wait it out " . I have been told to see a psychiatrist;

that my symptoms indicative of some mental disorder.

I am not making this up.

The Russian rosacea web site mentions that rosacea patients in Russia are

frequently referred to psychiatrists. Well, friends and neighbors, it also

happens in the US, and almost certainly in other countries as well.

I have seen my own symptoms reduced from a major show-stopper to a minor

annoyance, through the help of this group, and my own due diligence. I would

never have considered photoderm except for the posts by Dr. Nase and various

other members of this forum.

Here's my advice to anyone who receives false/questionable suggestions from

a practitioner: tell the practitioner that you are leaving, go to the front

desk, pay them for the visit, walk out the door, and leave the area.

Anger can only cause more pain.

_________________________________________________________________

Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

[Guest guest]

<<...I've gotten more help from this group than all of those doctors

combined.>>

I myself have suffered due to what I consider improper treatment at the

hands of various medical professionals. I have been prescribed 2.5%

hydrocortisone on (3) separate occasions-- and was left using the product

indefinitely. I have been told that my symptoms were due to MALE MENOPAUSE,

and that I should " wait it out " . I have been told to see a psychiatrist;

that my symptoms indicative of some mental disorder.

I am not making this up.

The Russian rosacea web site mentions that rosacea patients in Russia are

frequently referred to psychiatrists. Well, friends and neighbors, it also

happens in the US, and almost certainly in other countries as well.

I have seen my own symptoms reduced from a major show-stopper to a minor

annoyance, through the help of this group, and my own due diligence. I would

never have considered photoderm except for the posts by Dr. Nase and various

other members of this forum.

Here's my advice to anyone who receives false/questionable suggestions from

a practitioner: tell the practitioner that you are leaving, go to the front

desk, pay them for the visit, walk out the door, and leave the area.

Anger can only cause more pain.

_________________________________________________________________

Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

[Guest guest]

<<...I've gotten more help from this group than all of those doctors

combined.>>

I myself have suffered due to what I consider improper treatment at the

hands of various medical professionals. I have been prescribed 2.5%

hydrocortisone on (3) separate occasions-- and was left using the product

indefinitely. I have been told that my symptoms were due to MALE MENOPAUSE,

and that I should " wait it out " . I have been told to see a psychiatrist;

that my symptoms indicative of some mental disorder.

I am not making this up.

The Russian rosacea web site mentions that rosacea patients in Russia are

frequently referred to psychiatrists. Well, friends and neighbors, it also

happens in the US, and almost certainly in other countries as well.

I have seen my own symptoms reduced from a major show-stopper to a minor

annoyance, through the help of this group, and my own due diligence. I would

never have considered photoderm except for the posts by Dr. Nase and various

other members of this forum.

Here's my advice to anyone who receives false/questionable suggestions from

a practitioner: tell the practitioner that you are leaving, go to the front

desk, pay them for the visit, walk out the door, and leave the area.

Anger can only cause more pain.

_________________________________________________________________

Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

[Guest guest]

On Fri, 22 Dec 2000 13:02:15 -0600, ................

>I myself have suffered due to what I consider improper treatment at the

>hands of various medical professionals. I have been prescribed 2.5%

>hydrocortisone on (3) separate occasions-- and was left using the product

>indefinitely. I have been told that my symptoms were due to MALE MENOPAUSE,

>and that I should " wait it out " . I have been told to see a psychiatrist;

>that my symptoms indicative of some mental disorder.

>

>I am not making this up.

PMFJI.....

I just joined this group few days ago. I am known as 'Geezer' (aka

), widowed, male, age 70.

I am a lifelong sufferer of OCD, anxiety, depression and Social Phobia.

I don't really know when my rosacea began.....possibly during my early

sixties. I am slowly developing the WC Fields nose, have rash and red

bumps around my nostrils, upper lip, lower chin, and at the hairline

behind my ears, and sometimes (now) on my forehead.

I do believe that a flare up can be caused by a mental condition and

even nervous tension. Right now for instance, I'm having a general

flare-up ....... and the itching is driving me crazy. This is due to

anxiety & depression because my wife of 44 years passed away suddenly of

a rare illness on Christmas day four years ago.

After the holidays I expect to return to a more 'normal' state of mind

where my daily Prozac helps keep the depression in check. After that

I'll get a flare-up from time-to-time.....generally from unknown

reasons.

I see a psychiatrist regularly but never see a general practitioner or

dermatologist. The rosacea is not diagnosed so I take no medications

for it.

I might make a New Years resolution to see a dermatologist.....then

again might not....don't like doctors..! Only times I've been seriously

ill is after medical treatment.....have a 'serious' allergy to

penicillin, flu shots, milk,......and believe it or not, I once broke a

bone in my foot and found I was allergic to whatever was in the

cast...!!!

Just wanted to throw in my .02 cents regarding mental conditions and

rosacea....

BTW, if anyone knows of an over-the-counter medication I would be very

thankful.

Geezer (aka ) .... http://skally.net/solo-net/

______________________________________________________________________

" When a person has too many possessions, that person becomes

the possessed. That one must care and protect them. There is not

time for the spirit, for the mountains, for the seasons, for the

dawn and for the twilight when the spirit world is closest to our

own. "

______________________________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

On Fri, 22 Dec 2000 13:02:15 -0600, ................

>I myself have suffered due to what I consider improper treatment at the

>hands of various medical professionals. I have been prescribed 2.5%

>hydrocortisone on (3) separate occasions-- and was left using the product

>indefinitely. I have been told that my symptoms were due to MALE MENOPAUSE,

>and that I should " wait it out " . I have been told to see a psychiatrist;

>that my symptoms indicative of some mental disorder.

>

>I am not making this up.

PMFJI.....

I just joined this group few days ago. I am known as 'Geezer' (aka

), widowed, male, age 70.

I am a lifelong sufferer of OCD, anxiety, depression and Social Phobia.

I don't really know when my rosacea began.....possibly during my early

sixties. I am slowly developing the WC Fields nose, have rash and red

bumps around my nostrils, upper lip, lower chin, and at the hairline

behind my ears, and sometimes (now) on my forehead.

I do believe that a flare up can be caused by a mental condition and

even nervous tension. Right now for instance, I'm having a general

flare-up ....... and the itching is driving me crazy. This is due to

anxiety & depression because my wife of 44 years passed away suddenly of

a rare illness on Christmas day four years ago.

After the holidays I expect to return to a more 'normal' state of mind

where my daily Prozac helps keep the depression in check. After that

I'll get a flare-up from time-to-time.....generally from unknown

reasons.

I see a psychiatrist regularly but never see a general practitioner or

dermatologist. The rosacea is not diagnosed so I take no medications

for it.

I might make a New Years resolution to see a dermatologist.....then

again might not....don't like doctors..! Only times I've been seriously

ill is after medical treatment.....have a 'serious' allergy to

penicillin, flu shots, milk,......and believe it or not, I once broke a

bone in my foot and found I was allergic to whatever was in the

cast...!!!

Just wanted to throw in my .02 cents regarding mental conditions and

rosacea....

BTW, if anyone knows of an over-the-counter medication I would be very

thankful.

Geezer (aka ) .... http://skally.net/solo-net/

______________________________________________________________________

" When a person has too many possessions, that person becomes

the possessed. That one must care and protect them. There is not

time for the spirit, for the mountains, for the seasons, for the

dawn and for the twilight when the spirit world is closest to our

own. "

______________________________________________________________________