Guest guest Posted April 19, 2001 Report Share Posted April 19, 2001 >From: "" >Reply-To: 12-step-free >To: <12-step-free > >Subject: sugar addiction >Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2001 06:35:46 +1000 > , I hope you posted this with tongue in cheek. I thought obesity had at least something to do with the quantity of food eaten. True - Americans seem to eat like they are headed out to plow fields and work in a coal mine for 12 hours everyday, but don't do enough work to burn any calories. Or, is it that they have inherited a 'fat' gene that keeps that fork and spoon headed for their mouth? Another 'world's fastest growing disease?' I thought the whole damned "disease" idea was the 'world's fastest growing disease?' Oops. I forgot that powerlessness implies the inability to moderate any behavior you can think of as being pleasurable. I met a woman several years ago who stood in an AA meeting and bragged about being addiction-free at last. Over a ten year period she had been to successive 28 to 41 day treatment centers for alcohol addiction, smoking addiction, 'eating disorder' (addiction to Ex-Lax), codependency, sugar/refined flour addiction, and, yes, 35 days in-patient for ACOA 'issues.' Unfortunately, not only was she free of all these 'addictions,' she was also free of husband (divorced after the codependency treatment), alienated from her teenage children (after the decision to put the three of them on a strict macrobiotic diet), as well free of any relationship with her parents (the freeing experience of the ACOA treatment). I guess she is totally free of accountability to anyone. And, when I pointed this out - she freed herself from ever gracing my presence again. I suppose she took her show on the road. Later, I heard she lost her job as the result of another wonderful treatment she indulged - assertiveness training. However, she does manage to support her free and single self now by touting the idea of being free of everything, and getting commissions on referrals to treatment centers. If you have a complaint, HAVE WE GOT A DISEASE FOR YOU! Has anyone read Sontag's early book: "Illness as Metaphor" Cheers, >Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? >It seems that diabetes is the world's fastes growing disease, that one >addional glass of sugared soft drink a day for children increases the risk of diabetes by 60 % and that mature onset diabetes has increased by 300% over the last twenty years. In the last fifteen years the heavily promoted low hat - high carb - high sugar diet has seen obesity going up and up. Diabetes, uncontrolled excess insulin and obesity are all very dangerous risk factor for all sorts of things including both physical amd psychological problems. We are sowing seeds of great ill health, unhappiness and financial burden. Have you noticed how few products - including so called lite and low fat products - don't have sugar in them. I am told the only thing that stops a Big Mac being labelled confectionery is the dill pickle and that one can of Coke contains nine spoonfuls of sugar. If you don't think sugar is psychotropic go to a Mc's kids' party. One in four people have something wrong with their blood glucose metabolism. Yet this highly addictive stuff is legal and actively promoted without health warnings. The next generation of civil suits is surely here. > >Lawyers prepare your cases. > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2001 Report Share Posted April 19, 2001 >From: "" >Reply-To: 12-step-free >To: <12-step-free > >Subject: sugar addiction >Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2001 06:35:46 +1000 > , I hope you posted this with tongue in cheek. I thought obesity had at least something to do with the quantity of food eaten. True - Americans seem to eat like they are headed out to plow fields and work in a coal mine for 12 hours everyday, but don't do enough work to burn any calories. Or, is it that they have inherited a 'fat' gene that keeps that fork and spoon headed for their mouth? Another 'world's fastest growing disease?' I thought the whole damned "disease" idea was the 'world's fastest growing disease?' Oops. I forgot that powerlessness implies the inability to moderate any behavior you can think of as being pleasurable. I met a woman several years ago who stood in an AA meeting and bragged about being addiction-free at last. Over a ten year period she had been to successive 28 to 41 day treatment centers for alcohol addiction, smoking addiction, 'eating disorder' (addiction to Ex-Lax), codependency, sugar/refined flour addiction, and, yes, 35 days in-patient for ACOA 'issues.' Unfortunately, not only was she free of all these 'addictions,' she was also free of husband (divorced after the codependency treatment), alienated from her teenage children (after the decision to put the three of them on a strict macrobiotic diet), as well free of any relationship with her parents (the freeing experience of the ACOA treatment). I guess she is totally free of accountability to anyone. And, when I pointed this out - she freed herself from ever gracing my presence again. I suppose she took her show on the road. Later, I heard she lost her job as the result of another wonderful treatment she indulged - assertiveness training. However, she does manage to support her free and single self now by touting the idea of being free of everything, and getting commissions on referrals to treatment centers. If you have a complaint, HAVE WE GOT A DISEASE FOR YOU! Has anyone read Sontag's early book: "Illness as Metaphor" Cheers, >Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? >It seems that diabetes is the world's fastes growing disease, that one >addional glass of sugared soft drink a day for children increases the risk of diabetes by 60 % and that mature onset diabetes has increased by 300% over the last twenty years. In the last fifteen years the heavily promoted low hat - high carb - high sugar diet has seen obesity going up and up. Diabetes, uncontrolled excess insulin and obesity are all very dangerous risk factor for all sorts of things including both physical amd psychological problems. We are sowing seeds of great ill health, unhappiness and financial burden. Have you noticed how few products - including so called lite and low fat products - don't have sugar in them. I am told the only thing that stops a Big Mac being labelled confectionery is the dill pickle and that one can of Coke contains nine spoonfuls of sugar. If you don't think sugar is psychotropic go to a Mc's kids' party. One in four people have something wrong with their blood glucose metabolism. Yet this highly addictive stuff is legal and actively promoted without health warnings. The next generation of civil suits is surely here. > >Lawyers prepare your cases. > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 ----- Original Message ----- > Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? Not sure about sugar and carbs, but I have realized that I have a serious addiction to oxygen. I have repeatedly tried to stop breathing, but find that I am unable to do so. After just thirty seconds of not breathing, I find myself taking another breath. The scary thing is the withdrawal symptoms. During periods of not breathing, my face becomes red, I involuntarily flap my arms, and my field of vision starts to narrow. If I go long enough, I actually pass out, and my body *involuntarily* starts breathing. I even use oxygen in my sleep! My wife swears I breath constantly -- often in a very deep, measured manner -- throughout the night. On some occasions, if I stop breathing for more than a few moments, I start again with a mighty snort! Has anyone been able to break this vicious cycle of oxygen use and relapse? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 ----- Original Message ----- > Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? Not sure about sugar and carbs, but I have realized that I have a serious addiction to oxygen. I have repeatedly tried to stop breathing, but find that I am unable to do so. After just thirty seconds of not breathing, I find myself taking another breath. The scary thing is the withdrawal symptoms. During periods of not breathing, my face becomes red, I involuntarily flap my arms, and my field of vision starts to narrow. If I go long enough, I actually pass out, and my body *involuntarily* starts breathing. I even use oxygen in my sleep! My wife swears I breath constantly -- often in a very deep, measured manner -- throughout the night. On some occasions, if I stop breathing for more than a few moments, I start again with a mighty snort! Has anyone been able to break this vicious cycle of oxygen use and relapse? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 ----- Original Message ----- > Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? Not sure about sugar and carbs, but I have realized that I have a serious addiction to oxygen. I have repeatedly tried to stop breathing, but find that I am unable to do so. After just thirty seconds of not breathing, I find myself taking another breath. The scary thing is the withdrawal symptoms. During periods of not breathing, my face becomes red, I involuntarily flap my arms, and my field of vision starts to narrow. If I go long enough, I actually pass out, and my body *involuntarily* starts breathing. I even use oxygen in my sleep! My wife swears I breath constantly -- often in a very deep, measured manner -- throughout the night. On some occasions, if I stop breathing for more than a few moments, I start again with a mighty snort! Has anyone been able to break this vicious cycle of oxygen use and relapse? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 At 09:14 AM 4/20/01 -0700, you wrote: > Has anyone been able to break this vicious cycle of oxygen use and >relapse? I have known some people who stopped breathing for good. I must say, though, that I'm not sure they're better off. They seemed happier and more energetic before they stopped, frankly -- they just seemed to have more *life* somehow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 At 09:14 AM 4/20/01 -0700, you wrote: > Has anyone been able to break this vicious cycle of oxygen use and >relapse? I have known some people who stopped breathing for good. I must say, though, that I'm not sure they're better off. They seemed happier and more energetic before they stopped, frankly -- they just seemed to have more *life* somehow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 At 09:14 AM 4/20/01 -0700, you wrote: > Has anyone been able to break this vicious cycle of oxygen use and >relapse? I have known some people who stopped breathing for good. I must say, though, that I'm not sure they're better off. They seemed happier and more energetic before they stopped, frankly -- they just seemed to have more *life* somehow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 > Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? Too bad my mom isn't on this list. In her book, any food with even the slightest bit of sugar in it is out, even fresh fruits. She hasn't had a dessert for 15 years. She became convinced by a book she read (I can't remember which) and it has seemed to help her health. She is also wheat-free. Explaining to her that complex carbos still get broken down into glucose earns a blank stare. Still, they do release the glucose more slowly and evenly so there aren't the spikes in blood sugar levels as there are with refined simple carbos. There was a report in my local paper about 6 months ago regarding the link between obesity and diabetes. The authors of the study were questioning the generally held idea that obesity causes diabetes and put forth the theory that some obesity may be caused by the body's inability to process sugars properly - that in effect the diabetes was causing the obesity. Moderate exercise will *cut* high blood sugar very quickly. If you get a finger-stick that is high and walk briskly for 15 minutes and stick your finger again you'll be right back within normal range. Exercise is definitly part of the equasion somewhere. > > It seems that diabetes is the world's fastes growing disease, that one > addional glass of sugared soft drink a day for children increases the risk > of diabetes by 60 % and that mature onset diabetes has increased by 300% > over the last twenty years. In the last fifteen years the heavily promoted > low hat - high carb - high sugar diet has seen obesity going up and up. > Diabetes, uncontrolled excess insulin and obesity are all very dangerous > risk factor for all sorts of things including both physical amd > psychological problems. We are sowing seeds of great ill health, unhappiness > and financial burden. > Have you noticed how few products - including so called lite and low fat > products - don't have sugar in them. > I am told the only thing that stops a Big Mac being labelled confectionery > is the dill pickle and that one can of Coke contains nine spoonfuls of > sugar. If you don't think sugar is psychotropic go to a Mc's kids' > party. > > One in four people have something wrong with their blood glucose metabolism. > > Yet this highly addictive stuff is legal and actively promoted without > health warnings. The next generation of civil suits is surely here. > > Lawyers prepare your cases. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 > Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? Too bad my mom isn't on this list. In her book, any food with even the slightest bit of sugar in it is out, even fresh fruits. She hasn't had a dessert for 15 years. She became convinced by a book she read (I can't remember which) and it has seemed to help her health. She is also wheat-free. Explaining to her that complex carbos still get broken down into glucose earns a blank stare. Still, they do release the glucose more slowly and evenly so there aren't the spikes in blood sugar levels as there are with refined simple carbos. There was a report in my local paper about 6 months ago regarding the link between obesity and diabetes. The authors of the study were questioning the generally held idea that obesity causes diabetes and put forth the theory that some obesity may be caused by the body's inability to process sugars properly - that in effect the diabetes was causing the obesity. Moderate exercise will *cut* high blood sugar very quickly. If you get a finger-stick that is high and walk briskly for 15 minutes and stick your finger again you'll be right back within normal range. Exercise is definitly part of the equasion somewhere. > > It seems that diabetes is the world's fastes growing disease, that one > addional glass of sugared soft drink a day for children increases the risk > of diabetes by 60 % and that mature onset diabetes has increased by 300% > over the last twenty years. In the last fifteen years the heavily promoted > low hat - high carb - high sugar diet has seen obesity going up and up. > Diabetes, uncontrolled excess insulin and obesity are all very dangerous > risk factor for all sorts of things including both physical amd > psychological problems. We are sowing seeds of great ill health, unhappiness > and financial burden. > Have you noticed how few products - including so called lite and low fat > products - don't have sugar in them. > I am told the only thing that stops a Big Mac being labelled confectionery > is the dill pickle and that one can of Coke contains nine spoonfuls of > sugar. If you don't think sugar is psychotropic go to a Mc's kids' > party. > > One in four people have something wrong with their blood glucose metabolism. > > Yet this highly addictive stuff is legal and actively promoted without > health warnings. The next generation of civil suits is surely here. > > Lawyers prepare your cases. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 Hi -- Your mom sounds a bit like mine -- gets obssessively into various health and diet " regimens " , going bizarrely and rigidly overboard about them. There are many studies linking obesity/lack of exercise to increased risk of diabetes. And indeed lack of exercise (the very factor of Western lifestyle that has been steadily increasing in the last few decades) has many health risks. But there is NO evidence that eating sweets or table sugar per se causes or increases the risk for diabetes. It is a silly but fairly common misconception that diabetes means " sugar addiction " , and that diabetes is " kept in remission " by abstaining from white sugar. Both are false. But the 12-step/ " disease " types love to use this to bolster their already-meritless claim that " alcoholism is just like diabetes. " Diabetics can have severe and damaging blood glucose spikes without eating any table sugar or " sweets " at all. The same cannot be said re alcohol abusers -- when was the last time anyone documented someone's blood alcohol going way up without having consumed any alcoholic beverages?? ~Rita > > Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? > > Too bad my mom isn't on this list. In her book, any food with even > the slightest bit of sugar in it is out, even fresh fruits. She > hasn't had a dessert for 15 years. She became convinced by a book she > read (I can't remember which) and it has seemed to help her health. > She is also wheat-free. Explaining to her that complex carbos still > get broken down into glucose earns a blank stare. Still, they do > release the glucose more slowly and evenly so there aren't the spikes > in blood sugar levels as there are with refined simple carbos. > > There was a report in my local paper about 6 months ago regarding the > link between obesity and diabetes. The authors of the study were > questioning the generally held idea that obesity causes diabetes and > put forth the theory that some obesity may be caused by the body's > inability to process sugars properly - that in effect the diabetes was > causing the obesity. > > Moderate exercise will *cut* high blood sugar very quickly. If you > get a finger-stick that is high and walk briskly for 15 minutes and > stick your finger again you'll be right back within normal range. > Exercise is definitly part of the equasion somewhere. > > > > > > It seems that diabetes is the world's fastes growing disease, that > one > > addional glass of sugared soft drink a day for children increases > the risk > > of diabetes by 60 % and that mature onset diabetes has increased by > 300% > > over the last twenty years. In the last fifteen years the heavily > promoted > > low hat - high carb - high sugar diet has seen obesity going up and > up. > > Diabetes, uncontrolled excess insulin and obesity are all very > dangerous > > risk factor for all sorts of things including both physical amd > > psychological problems. We are sowing seeds of great ill health, > unhappiness > > and financial burden. > > Have you noticed how few products - including so called lite and > low fat > > products - don't have sugar in them. > > I am told the only thing that stops a Big Mac being labelled > confectionery > > is the dill pickle and that one can of Coke contains nine spoonfuls > of > > sugar. If you don't think sugar is psychotropic go to a Mc's > kids' > > party. > > > > One in four people have something wrong with their blood glucose > metabolism. > > > > Yet this highly addictive stuff is legal and actively promoted > without > > health warnings. The next generation of civil suits is surely here. > > > > Lawyers prepare your cases. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 Hi -- Your mom sounds a bit like mine -- gets obssessively into various health and diet " regimens " , going bizarrely and rigidly overboard about them. There are many studies linking obesity/lack of exercise to increased risk of diabetes. And indeed lack of exercise (the very factor of Western lifestyle that has been steadily increasing in the last few decades) has many health risks. But there is NO evidence that eating sweets or table sugar per se causes or increases the risk for diabetes. It is a silly but fairly common misconception that diabetes means " sugar addiction " , and that diabetes is " kept in remission " by abstaining from white sugar. Both are false. But the 12-step/ " disease " types love to use this to bolster their already-meritless claim that " alcoholism is just like diabetes. " Diabetics can have severe and damaging blood glucose spikes without eating any table sugar or " sweets " at all. The same cannot be said re alcohol abusers -- when was the last time anyone documented someone's blood alcohol going way up without having consumed any alcoholic beverages?? ~Rita > > Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? > > Too bad my mom isn't on this list. In her book, any food with even > the slightest bit of sugar in it is out, even fresh fruits. She > hasn't had a dessert for 15 years. She became convinced by a book she > read (I can't remember which) and it has seemed to help her health. > She is also wheat-free. Explaining to her that complex carbos still > get broken down into glucose earns a blank stare. Still, they do > release the glucose more slowly and evenly so there aren't the spikes > in blood sugar levels as there are with refined simple carbos. > > There was a report in my local paper about 6 months ago regarding the > link between obesity and diabetes. The authors of the study were > questioning the generally held idea that obesity causes diabetes and > put forth the theory that some obesity may be caused by the body's > inability to process sugars properly - that in effect the diabetes was > causing the obesity. > > Moderate exercise will *cut* high blood sugar very quickly. If you > get a finger-stick that is high and walk briskly for 15 minutes and > stick your finger again you'll be right back within normal range. > Exercise is definitly part of the equasion somewhere. > > > > > > It seems that diabetes is the world's fastes growing disease, that > one > > addional glass of sugared soft drink a day for children increases > the risk > > of diabetes by 60 % and that mature onset diabetes has increased by > 300% > > over the last twenty years. In the last fifteen years the heavily > promoted > > low hat - high carb - high sugar diet has seen obesity going up and > up. > > Diabetes, uncontrolled excess insulin and obesity are all very > dangerous > > risk factor for all sorts of things including both physical amd > > psychological problems. We are sowing seeds of great ill health, > unhappiness > > and financial burden. > > Have you noticed how few products - including so called lite and > low fat > > products - don't have sugar in them. > > I am told the only thing that stops a Big Mac being labelled > confectionery > > is the dill pickle and that one can of Coke contains nine spoonfuls > of > > sugar. If you don't think sugar is psychotropic go to a Mc's > kids' > > party. > > > > One in four people have something wrong with their blood glucose > metabolism. > > > > Yet this highly addictive stuff is legal and actively promoted > without > > health warnings. The next generation of civil suits is surely here. > > > > Lawyers prepare your cases. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 Hi -- Your mom sounds a bit like mine -- gets obssessively into various health and diet " regimens " , going bizarrely and rigidly overboard about them. There are many studies linking obesity/lack of exercise to increased risk of diabetes. And indeed lack of exercise (the very factor of Western lifestyle that has been steadily increasing in the last few decades) has many health risks. But there is NO evidence that eating sweets or table sugar per se causes or increases the risk for diabetes. It is a silly but fairly common misconception that diabetes means " sugar addiction " , and that diabetes is " kept in remission " by abstaining from white sugar. Both are false. But the 12-step/ " disease " types love to use this to bolster their already-meritless claim that " alcoholism is just like diabetes. " Diabetics can have severe and damaging blood glucose spikes without eating any table sugar or " sweets " at all. The same cannot be said re alcohol abusers -- when was the last time anyone documented someone's blood alcohol going way up without having consumed any alcoholic beverages?? ~Rita > > Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? > > Too bad my mom isn't on this list. In her book, any food with even > the slightest bit of sugar in it is out, even fresh fruits. She > hasn't had a dessert for 15 years. She became convinced by a book she > read (I can't remember which) and it has seemed to help her health. > She is also wheat-free. Explaining to her that complex carbos still > get broken down into glucose earns a blank stare. Still, they do > release the glucose more slowly and evenly so there aren't the spikes > in blood sugar levels as there are with refined simple carbos. > > There was a report in my local paper about 6 months ago regarding the > link between obesity and diabetes. The authors of the study were > questioning the generally held idea that obesity causes diabetes and > put forth the theory that some obesity may be caused by the body's > inability to process sugars properly - that in effect the diabetes was > causing the obesity. > > Moderate exercise will *cut* high blood sugar very quickly. If you > get a finger-stick that is high and walk briskly for 15 minutes and > stick your finger again you'll be right back within normal range. > Exercise is definitly part of the equasion somewhere. > > > > > > It seems that diabetes is the world's fastes growing disease, that > one > > addional glass of sugared soft drink a day for children increases > the risk > > of diabetes by 60 % and that mature onset diabetes has increased by > 300% > > over the last twenty years. In the last fifteen years the heavily > promoted > > low hat - high carb - high sugar diet has seen obesity going up and > up. > > Diabetes, uncontrolled excess insulin and obesity are all very > dangerous > > risk factor for all sorts of things including both physical amd > > psychological problems. We are sowing seeds of great ill health, > unhappiness > > and financial burden. > > Have you noticed how few products - including so called lite and > low fat > > products - don't have sugar in them. > > I am told the only thing that stops a Big Mac being labelled > confectionery > > is the dill pickle and that one can of Coke contains nine spoonfuls > of > > sugar. If you don't think sugar is psychotropic go to a Mc's > kids' > > party. > > > > One in four people have something wrong with their blood glucose > metabolism. > > > > Yet this highly addictive stuff is legal and actively promoted > without > > health warnings. The next generation of civil suits is surely here. > > > > Lawyers prepare your cases. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 > > Hi -- > > Your mom sounds a bit like mine -- gets obssessively into various health and diet " regimens " , going bizarrely and rigidly overboard about them. > > There are many studies linking obesity/lack of exercise to increased risk of diabetes. And indeed lack of exercise (the very factor of Western lifestyle that has been steadily increasing in the last few decades) has many health risks. But there is NO evidence that eating sweets or table sugar per se causes or increases the risk for diabetes. > > It is a silly but fairly common misconception that diabetes means " sugar addiction " , and that diabetes is " kept in remission " by abstaining from white sugar. Both are false. But the 12-step/ " disease " types love to use this to bolster their already-meritless claim that " alcoholism is just like diabetes. " Diabetics can have severe and damaging blood glucose spikes without eating any table sugar or " sweets " at all. The same cannot be said re alcohol abusers -- when was the last time anyone documented someone's blood alcohol going way up without having consumed any alcoholic beverages?? > > ~Rita He, he, he! No, I don't think that one has been documented! The only reason I know anything about it is because I had gestational diabetes. In my case I had plenty of insulin, but the pregnancy hormones suppress the insulin's effectiveness so I had to take extra insulin. It is true that even being very careful about diet some spikes would happen. Also, looking at the blood sugar meter is very convincing regarding the way complex carbos are broken down into glucose. Simple carbos like table sugar just hit the bloodstream faster - which is why it is important to keep some on hand in case of going too far the other way. I don't think it has anything to do with addiction. Some people say they are addicted to sweets, but I've never found that very convincing. I think they use the term in the sense of preferring to have them rather than not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 > > Hi -- > > Your mom sounds a bit like mine -- gets obssessively into various health and diet " regimens " , going bizarrely and rigidly overboard about them. > > There are many studies linking obesity/lack of exercise to increased risk of diabetes. And indeed lack of exercise (the very factor of Western lifestyle that has been steadily increasing in the last few decades) has many health risks. But there is NO evidence that eating sweets or table sugar per se causes or increases the risk for diabetes. > > It is a silly but fairly common misconception that diabetes means " sugar addiction " , and that diabetes is " kept in remission " by abstaining from white sugar. Both are false. But the 12-step/ " disease " types love to use this to bolster their already-meritless claim that " alcoholism is just like diabetes. " Diabetics can have severe and damaging blood glucose spikes without eating any table sugar or " sweets " at all. The same cannot be said re alcohol abusers -- when was the last time anyone documented someone's blood alcohol going way up without having consumed any alcoholic beverages?? > > ~Rita He, he, he! No, I don't think that one has been documented! The only reason I know anything about it is because I had gestational diabetes. In my case I had plenty of insulin, but the pregnancy hormones suppress the insulin's effectiveness so I had to take extra insulin. It is true that even being very careful about diet some spikes would happen. Also, looking at the blood sugar meter is very convincing regarding the way complex carbos are broken down into glucose. Simple carbos like table sugar just hit the bloodstream faster - which is why it is important to keep some on hand in case of going too far the other way. I don't think it has anything to do with addiction. Some people say they are addicted to sweets, but I've never found that very convincing. I think they use the term in the sense of preferring to have them rather than not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 > > Hi -- > > Your mom sounds a bit like mine -- gets obssessively into various health and diet " regimens " , going bizarrely and rigidly overboard about them. > > There are many studies linking obesity/lack of exercise to increased risk of diabetes. And indeed lack of exercise (the very factor of Western lifestyle that has been steadily increasing in the last few decades) has many health risks. But there is NO evidence that eating sweets or table sugar per se causes or increases the risk for diabetes. > > It is a silly but fairly common misconception that diabetes means " sugar addiction " , and that diabetes is " kept in remission " by abstaining from white sugar. Both are false. But the 12-step/ " disease " types love to use this to bolster their already-meritless claim that " alcoholism is just like diabetes. " Diabetics can have severe and damaging blood glucose spikes without eating any table sugar or " sweets " at all. The same cannot be said re alcohol abusers -- when was the last time anyone documented someone's blood alcohol going way up without having consumed any alcoholic beverages?? > > ~Rita He, he, he! No, I don't think that one has been documented! The only reason I know anything about it is because I had gestational diabetes. In my case I had plenty of insulin, but the pregnancy hormones suppress the insulin's effectiveness so I had to take extra insulin. It is true that even being very careful about diet some spikes would happen. Also, looking at the blood sugar meter is very convincing regarding the way complex carbos are broken down into glucose. Simple carbos like table sugar just hit the bloodstream faster - which is why it is important to keep some on hand in case of going too far the other way. I don't think it has anything to do with addiction. Some people say they are addicted to sweets, but I've never found that very convincing. I think they use the term in the sense of preferring to have them rather than not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 ----- Original Message ----- > > Has anyone been able to break this vicious cycle of oxygen use and > >relapse? > > I have known some people who stopped breathing for good. I must say, > though, that I'm not sure they're better off. They seemed happier and > more energetic before they stopped, frankly -- they just seemed to have > more *life* somehow. > > But think of the serenity they must experience, now that they no longer have to spend every waking (and sleeping) minute chasing oxygen to feed their addiction! You damn AA haters -- first you call it a cult, then you castigate people who have found true serenity! Everybody knows that people who have recovered from oxygen addiction are at peace -- everybody except you! Isn't that what everyone says when they have a celebration for somebody who has stopped breathing: " Gee, s/he looks so peaceful " ? You think everybody who's in recovery has turned into some sort of zombie, but this is a fact: Most people who have stopped breathing have every much as much of a life as AA oldtimers! B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 ----- Original Message ----- > > Has anyone been able to break this vicious cycle of oxygen use and > >relapse? > > I have known some people who stopped breathing for good. I must say, > though, that I'm not sure they're better off. They seemed happier and > more energetic before they stopped, frankly -- they just seemed to have > more *life* somehow. > > But think of the serenity they must experience, now that they no longer have to spend every waking (and sleeping) minute chasing oxygen to feed their addiction! You damn AA haters -- first you call it a cult, then you castigate people who have found true serenity! Everybody knows that people who have recovered from oxygen addiction are at peace -- everybody except you! Isn't that what everyone says when they have a celebration for somebody who has stopped breathing: " Gee, s/he looks so peaceful " ? You think everybody who's in recovery has turned into some sort of zombie, but this is a fact: Most people who have stopped breathing have every much as much of a life as AA oldtimers! B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 ----- Original Message ----- > > Has anyone been able to break this vicious cycle of oxygen use and > >relapse? > > I have known some people who stopped breathing for good. I must say, > though, that I'm not sure they're better off. They seemed happier and > more energetic before they stopped, frankly -- they just seemed to have > more *life* somehow. > > But think of the serenity they must experience, now that they no longer have to spend every waking (and sleeping) minute chasing oxygen to feed their addiction! You damn AA haters -- first you call it a cult, then you castigate people who have found true serenity! Everybody knows that people who have recovered from oxygen addiction are at peace -- everybody except you! Isn't that what everyone says when they have a celebration for somebody who has stopped breathing: " Gee, s/he looks so peaceful " ? You think everybody who's in recovery has turned into some sort of zombie, but this is a fact: Most people who have stopped breathing have every much as much of a life as AA oldtimers! B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 > Too bad my mom isn't on this list. In her book, any food with even > the slightest bit of sugar in it is out, even fresh fruits. She > hasn't had a dessert for 15 years. She became convinced by a book she > read (I can't remember which) and it has seemed to help her health. > She is also wheat-free. Explaining to her that complex carbos still > get broken down into glucose earns a blank stare. Wow, is it possible we are related? Actually, my mother is much better now. But when I was growing up, she was a health nut. She got her info from Adell who, incidentally, died quite young. We didn't get cookies. We got sesame seeds stuck together with some unidentifiable sticky substance. We didn't get chocolate. We got Carob. We didn't have regular old orange juice. It had yeast stirred into it. We used it to chase the cod liver oil. At the dinner table, there was a special plate set for the pile of vitamins we took every day. It was really bizarre. Sometimes I wonder if that had anything to do with me becoming bulimic. There I was at eighteen, let lose out into a world of endless twinkies and Frosted Flakes - with nothing weird mixed into the milk! Did I eat a lot of twinkies! For about two years I ate tons of sweets - nasty sweets like you buy at a convenience store. When it got to the point that I could taste the chemicals in those mass produced products more than I could the few real ingredients they had in them, I got tired of them. Even though I was still bulimic for years after that, it wasn't on sweets. The site of most confections turned my stomach, still does. Except ketchup. I wasn't introduced to the 12-steps, OA, or AA until my post-sugar stage. But a lady in OA still tried to convince me that I was addicted to sugar because I put ketchup on my french fries. I didn't put it on everything. Just the fries. I tried to tell her my sugar story to illustrate my learned distaste for most refined sugar products, but that just gave her more fuel. She said I should be very careful of such a cunning, baffling, and powerful substance. That if I wasn't careful, I'd find myself uncontrollably roaming the streets for the evil " Hot Donuts Now! " sign. Guess what? That never happened. The pattern of behavior I exhibited when I was bulimic was certainly destructive, but it didn't have anything to do with an " addiction " to a particular food. I had preferences for some foods over others, just as I do now. But they weren't addictions. The behaviors that earned me the label of bulimic were what needed to be addressed. Not the sugar. Joan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2001 Report Share Posted April 20, 2001 > Interesting that Diet Coke (which I find highly addictive) damages the > insulin receptors Can you elaborate on this, the part about the insulin receptors? I drink a lot of Diet Coke. I read somewhere that there are more Pepsi drinkers than Coca Cola drinkers but that more Coca Cola products are sold because people who drink Coke products drink a lot more of them than Pepsi drinkers do Pepsi. I wonder what that's about. Joan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2001 Report Share Posted April 21, 2001 I thought obesity had at least something to do with the quantity of food eaten. Obviously that is partly true as is the need for exercise, but I don't think it is quite so straightforward for a lot of people . I believe we are like a web of interconnected processes that all need to be rebalanced together. I am starting to appreciate the need for a holistic approach. It is the out of date analytical narrow overspecialized form of science that has got us into this mess. Get sick take a pill. By the way, what is so wrong with talking about dis-ease. I felt a lot less at ease a few years ago than I do now. Then I was too scared and ashamed of myself to socialise without a drink or many inside me. I also feel a lot healthier and fitter despite being older (and heavier dammit!). I haven't read Sontag's book. I will put it on the ever lengthening list. I liked the irony in your story about the 'professional recovery' lady but there are some pretty badly abused people in recovery and I don't think it is entirely fair to take one person out of context and condemn them all for their troubled pathway through life. I certainly can't throw stones. As if people that were not into 12 step recovery did not have those same problems of alienation from their families, marital breakdown and plenty more. Treatment centres giving commission sounds highly unethical to me. Is it legal? -----Original Message-----From: R. Adcock Sent: Sunday, 22 April 2001 12:16 AMTo: 12-step-free Subject: Re: Sugar Addiction , I first I had hoped you posted this with tongue in cheek. I thought obesity had at least something to do with the quantity of food eaten. True - Americans seem to eat like they are headed out to plow fields and work in a coal mine for 12 hours everyday, but don't do enough work to burn any calories. Or, is it that they have inherited a 'fat' gene that keeps that fork and spoon headed for their mouth? Another 'world's fastest growing disease?' I thought the whole damned "disease" idea was the 'world's fastest growing disease?' Oops. I forgot that powerlessness implies the inability to moderate any behavior you can think of as being pleasurable. I met a woman several years ago who stood in an AA meeting and bragged about being addiction-free at last. Over a ten year period she had been to successive 28 to 41 day treatment centers for alcohol addiction, smoking addiction, 'eating disorder' (addiction to Ex-Lax), codependency, sugar/refined flour addiction, and, yes, 35 days in-patient for ACOA 'issues.' Unfortunately, not only was she free of all these 'addictions,' she was also free of husband (divorced after the codependency treatment), alienated from her teenage children (after the decision to put the three of them on a strict macrobiotic diet), as well free of any relationship with her parents (the freeing experience of the ACOA treatment). I guess she is totally free of accountability to anyone. And, when I pointed this out - she freed herself from ever gracing my presence again. I suppose she took her show on the road. Later, I heard she lost her job as the result of another wonderful treatment she indulged - assertiveness training. However, she does manage to support her free and single self now by touting the idea of being free of everything, and getting commissions on referrals to treatment centers. If you have a complaint, HAVE WE GOT A DISEASE FOR YOU! Has anyone read Sontag's early book: "Illness as Metaphor" Cheers, >Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? >It seems that diabetes is the world's fastes growing disease, that one >addional glass of sugared soft drink a day for children increases the risk of diabetes by 60 % and that mature onset diabetes has increased by 300% over the last twenty years. In the last fifteen years the heavily promoted low hat - high carb - high sugar diet has seen obesity going up and up. Diabetes, uncontrolled excess insulin and obesity are all very dangerous risk factor for all sorts of things including both physical amd psychological problems. We are sowing seeds of great ill health, unhappiness and financial burden. Have you noticed how few products - including so called lite and low fat products - don't have sugar in them. I am told the only thing that stops a Big Mac being labelled confectionery is the dill pickle and that one can of Coke contains nine spoonfuls of sugar. If you don't think sugar is psychotropic go to a Mc's kids' party. Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2001 Report Share Posted April 21, 2001 I thought obesity had at least something to do with the quantity of food eaten. Obviously that is partly true as is the need for exercise, but I don't think it is quite so straightforward for a lot of people . I believe we are like a web of interconnected processes that all need to be rebalanced together. I am starting to appreciate the need for a holistic approach. It is the out of date analytical narrow overspecialized form of science that has got us into this mess. Get sick take a pill. By the way, what is so wrong with talking about dis-ease. I felt a lot less at ease a few years ago than I do now. Then I was too scared and ashamed of myself to socialise without a drink or many inside me. I also feel a lot healthier and fitter despite being older (and heavier dammit!). I haven't read Sontag's book. I will put it on the ever lengthening list. I liked the irony in your story about the 'professional recovery' lady but there are some pretty badly abused people in recovery and I don't think it is entirely fair to take one person out of context and condemn them all for their troubled pathway through life. I certainly can't throw stones. As if people that were not into 12 step recovery did not have those same problems of alienation from their families, marital breakdown and plenty more. Treatment centres giving commission sounds highly unethical to me. Is it legal? -----Original Message-----From: R. Adcock Sent: Sunday, 22 April 2001 12:16 AMTo: 12-step-free Subject: Re: Sugar Addiction , I first I had hoped you posted this with tongue in cheek. I thought obesity had at least something to do with the quantity of food eaten. True - Americans seem to eat like they are headed out to plow fields and work in a coal mine for 12 hours everyday, but don't do enough work to burn any calories. Or, is it that they have inherited a 'fat' gene that keeps that fork and spoon headed for their mouth? Another 'world's fastest growing disease?' I thought the whole damned "disease" idea was the 'world's fastest growing disease?' Oops. I forgot that powerlessness implies the inability to moderate any behavior you can think of as being pleasurable. I met a woman several years ago who stood in an AA meeting and bragged about being addiction-free at last. Over a ten year period she had been to successive 28 to 41 day treatment centers for alcohol addiction, smoking addiction, 'eating disorder' (addiction to Ex-Lax), codependency, sugar/refined flour addiction, and, yes, 35 days in-patient for ACOA 'issues.' Unfortunately, not only was she free of all these 'addictions,' she was also free of husband (divorced after the codependency treatment), alienated from her teenage children (after the decision to put the three of them on a strict macrobiotic diet), as well free of any relationship with her parents (the freeing experience of the ACOA treatment). I guess she is totally free of accountability to anyone. And, when I pointed this out - she freed herself from ever gracing my presence again. I suppose she took her show on the road. Later, I heard she lost her job as the result of another wonderful treatment she indulged - assertiveness training. However, she does manage to support her free and single self now by touting the idea of being free of everything, and getting commissions on referrals to treatment centers. If you have a complaint, HAVE WE GOT A DISEASE FOR YOU! Has anyone read Sontag's early book: "Illness as Metaphor" Cheers, >Does anyone have any views on sugar (and carbohydrate) addiction? >It seems that diabetes is the world's fastes growing disease, that one >addional glass of sugared soft drink a day for children increases the risk of diabetes by 60 % and that mature onset diabetes has increased by 300% over the last twenty years. In the last fifteen years the heavily promoted low hat - high carb - high sugar diet has seen obesity going up and up. Diabetes, uncontrolled excess insulin and obesity are all very dangerous risk factor for all sorts of things including both physical amd psychological problems. We are sowing seeds of great ill health, unhappiness and financial burden. Have you noticed how few products - including so called lite and low fat products - don't have sugar in them. I am told the only thing that stops a Big Mac being labelled confectionery is the dill pickle and that one can of Coke contains nine spoonfuls of sugar. If you don't think sugar is psychotropic go to a Mc's kids' party. Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2001 Report Share Posted April 21, 2001 Hi Joan, > > Wow, is it possible we are related? Actually, my mother is much > better now. But when I was growing up, she was a health nut. She got > her info from Adell who, incidentally, died quite young. We > didn't get cookies. We got sesame seeds stuck together with some > unidentifiable sticky substance. We didn't get chocolate. We got > Carob. We didn't have regular old orange juice. It had yeast stirred > into it. We used it to chase the cod liver oil. At the dinner table, > there was a special plate set for the pile of vitamins we took every > day. It was really bizarre. Thank goodness my mom didn't get into her food things until after I was grown and gone! For her it was partly a result of some medical problems she was having that she couldn't get her doctor to take seriously. When she felt like that source of help left her high and dry she started reading a lot of alternate health stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 21, 2001 Report Share Posted April 21, 2001 Hi Joan, > > Wow, is it possible we are related? Actually, my mother is much > better now. But when I was growing up, she was a health nut. She got > her info from Adell who, incidentally, died quite young. We > didn't get cookies. We got sesame seeds stuck together with some > unidentifiable sticky substance. We didn't get chocolate. We got > Carob. We didn't have regular old orange juice. It had yeast stirred > into it. We used it to chase the cod liver oil. At the dinner table, > there was a special plate set for the pile of vitamins we took every > day. It was really bizarre. Thank goodness my mom didn't get into her food things until after I was grown and gone! For her it was partly a result of some medical problems she was having that she couldn't get her doctor to take seriously. When she felt like that source of help left her high and dry she started reading a lot of alternate health stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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