(No subject)

[Guest guest]

Azure (et al): Yes, it's great that there is this

forum where we can critically question the " AA way of

life " without being accused of some " character defect "

or other.

But who has made such an accusation? Has anyone here

accused anyone else of suffering from some " character

defect " because s/he said something critical of AA?

If so, I haven't see it, at least not in several

months since a REAL " troll " or two stomped off in a

huff.

The only " character defect " (and I certainly didn't

call it that) I may have accused anyone of is

narrowmindedness for denying someone else the right to

practice whatever program, combination of programs, or

lack of programs they wish in order to stay sober,

abstinent, clean, moderate, or whatever.

Read what I've actually said in prior posts and you'll

see that I'm just as critical of AA BS as anyone,

perhaps even more so. I honestly wish there were more

alternatives available locally.

However, I did not appreciate faulty and/or circular

logic, anti-intellectualism, foregone and non sequitor

conclusions, and ad hominem attacks when they were

used to support AA and don't appreciate them when used

to attack AA either.

Question and criticize AA all you want; I certainly

do. But state that because X, therefore %$ & ! in your

question or criticism, and your anti-AA stance won't

protect you from being criticized in return, not for

criticizing AA but for being illogical about it.

That's not being mean-spirited. That's being

effective and principled.

And again, labelling those still brainwashed but

trying to escape " trolls " and " apologists " only drives

them away. " Great " you say? Hey, they may get on

your nerves. You may be happy when they're gone. But

this forum may also be the only chance they get to

openly question AA to the extent that they're ready to

do so. All of the true apologists I've seen in the

last 10 months who are only using this listserve to

try to pull people back into AA have quit in

frustration, usually with a nice big " Go to Hell,

y'all " letter. Good riddence to them.

But for those who've become truly 12-step-free, think

back to when you finally knew you'd " arrived. " Would

you honestly deny that experience to someone still

stuck yo-yoing between white-knuckle AA " sobriety " and

chronic relapses into drunken misery? If so, let me

know, because then I will unsubscribe. I have no

desire to emulate those who would be so heartless.

Thanks. --CTT

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