Re: Re: Musings about the future of EMS

[Guest guest]

I used to be very active and very vocal on this listserver but have been

lurking in the background for a long time now. I read the postings but very

seldom reply or make comments.

I have to agree with Dr. Bledsoe. I am a member of EMSAT. Actually, I have

been a member of EMSAT twice. I joined several years ago. I disagreed with

some ositions taken by one of the previous officers and did not renew my

membership. After talking with Gene Gandy, I renewed the following year and am

a

member now.

Dr. Bledsoe is right, as is Gene Gandy. We need your membership and we need

EMSAT's representation. Please join.

> Larry:

>

> I was for several years a major critic of EMSAT. However, there have been

> significant changes and I joined (although not a registered EMS provider).

> EMSAT is at a time of transition. There is a finite amount of money and that

> is going towards lobbying the legislature and other more pressing needs. It

> costs money to buy ads, send mailers, and so on and at the current time must

> rely on word of mouth. EMSAT is not after the fee--nobody gets paid and

> besides I pay more for a single trip to the dry cleaners than annual EMSAT

> dues. EMSAT is not like TMA or the other professional associations as the

> membership is largely volunteer EMS providers and the membersip does not

> have incomes over $200,000 annually like the physicians--so there is always

> a shortage of funds. EMSAT has had numerous public meetings and internet

> queries asking opinions. I for one have opined that way. I know each of the

> Board of Directors. They have recently posted position papers and these are

> a must read. Their hearts are pure, their goal is better EMS for Texas, and

> I support each (although we do not agree). An EMS association in Texas will

> never have more than a fraction of the registered EMS providers as long as

> the major EMS providers are big fire departments (Dallas, Houston, San

> ). These people see EMS as a secondary job and not a place to spend

> their money (as opposed to IAFF). EMSAT has been much better about public

> disclosure. The legislature is not in sesion so there is not much to post.

> The " put up or shut up " phrase is a phrase of frustration and desperation.

> These board members and other proponents have put in hundreds or thousands

> of hours of time for absolutely no money. I understand their frustration.

> The web page is much better--but still produced by volunteers. EMSAT must

> exceed a critical mass to become effective and we ask that you trust the BOD

> and send your money and make your voice known. With your support and money

> EMSAT can be a force to be reckoned with (see http://www.wisconsinems.com.

>

> Join EMSAT. Texas EMS has never been at a more critical juncture and Texas

> EMS needs a unified voice.

>

> E. Bledsoe, DO, FACEP

> Midlothian, TX

>

>

[Guest guest]

I used to be very active and very vocal on this listserver but have been

lurking in the background for a long time now. I read the postings but very

seldom reply or make comments.

I have to agree with Dr. Bledsoe. I am a member of EMSAT. Actually, I have

been a member of EMSAT twice. I joined several years ago. I disagreed with

some ositions taken by one of the previous officers and did not renew my

membership. After talking with Gene Gandy, I renewed the following year and am

a

member now.

Dr. Bledsoe is right, as is Gene Gandy. We need your membership and we need

EMSAT's representation. Please join.

> Larry:

>

> I was for several years a major critic of EMSAT. However, there have been

> significant changes and I joined (although not a registered EMS provider).

> EMSAT is at a time of transition. There is a finite amount of money and that

> is going towards lobbying the legislature and other more pressing needs. It

> costs money to buy ads, send mailers, and so on and at the current time must

> rely on word of mouth. EMSAT is not after the fee--nobody gets paid and

> besides I pay more for a single trip to the dry cleaners than annual EMSAT

> dues. EMSAT is not like TMA or the other professional associations as the

> membership is largely volunteer EMS providers and the membersip does not

> have incomes over $200,000 annually like the physicians--so there is always

> a shortage of funds. EMSAT has had numerous public meetings and internet

> queries asking opinions. I for one have opined that way. I know each of the

> Board of Directors. They have recently posted position papers and these are

> a must read. Their hearts are pure, their goal is better EMS for Texas, and

> I support each (although we do not agree). An EMS association in Texas will

> never have more than a fraction of the registered EMS providers as long as

> the major EMS providers are big fire departments (Dallas, Houston, San

> ). These people see EMS as a secondary job and not a place to spend

> their money (as opposed to IAFF). EMSAT has been much better about public

> disclosure. The legislature is not in sesion so there is not much to post.

> The " put up or shut up " phrase is a phrase of frustration and desperation.

> These board members and other proponents have put in hundreds or thousands

> of hours of time for absolutely no money. I understand their frustration.

> The web page is much better--but still produced by volunteers. EMSAT must

> exceed a critical mass to become effective and we ask that you trust the BOD

> and send your money and make your voice known. With your support and money

> EMSAT can be a force to be reckoned with (see http://www.wisconsinems.com.

>

> Join EMSAT. Texas EMS has never been at a more critical juncture and Texas

> EMS needs a unified voice.

>

> E. Bledsoe, DO, FACEP

> Midlothian, TX

>

>

[Guest guest]

Larry:

I was for several years a major critic of EMSAT. However, there have been

significant changes and I joined (although not a registered EMS provider).

EMSAT is at a time of transition. There is a finite amount of money and that

is going towards lobbying the legislature and other more pressing needs. It

costs money to buy ads, send mailers, and so on and at the current time must

rely on word of mouth. EMSAT is not after the fee--nobody gets paid and

besides I pay more for a single trip to the dry cleaners than annual EMSAT

dues. EMSAT is not like TMA or the other professional associations as the

membership is largely volunteer EMS providers and the membersip does not

have incomes over $200,000 annually like the physicians--so there is always

a shortage of funds. EMSAT has had numerous public meetings and internet

queries asking opinions. I for one have opined that way. I know each of the

Board of Directors. They have recently posted position papers and these are

a must read. Their hearts are pure, their goal is better EMS for Texas, and

I support each (although we do not agree). An EMS association in Texas will

never have more than a fraction of the registered EMS providers as long as

the major EMS providers are big fire departments (Dallas, Houston, San

). These people see EMS as a secondary job and not a place to spend

their money (as opposed to IAFF). EMSAT has been much better about public

disclosure. The legislature is not in sesion so there is not much to post.

The " put up or shut up " phrase is a phrase of frustration and desperation.

These board members and other proponents have put in hundreds or thousands

of hours of time for absolutely no money. I understand their frustration.

The web page is much better--but still produced by volunteers. EMSAT must

exceed a critical mass to become effective and we ask that you trust the BOD

and send your money and make your voice known. With your support and money

EMSAT can be a force to be reckoned with (see http://www.wisconsinems.com.

Join EMSAT. Texas EMS has never been at a more critical juncture and Texas

EMS needs a unified voice.

E. Bledsoe, DO, FACEP

Midlothian, TX

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

Gene,

Welcome to Texas, where unions or labor associations have traditionally

failed. Not because of any need for them but because of the way they present

themselves. Instead of telling me what I can do for EMSAT, how about telling

me what you are doing for me? Not what you want to or intend to do.

There has been a dozen times I've pulled out the checkbook to join but

never did for several reasons. These are my thoughts and not intended to

represent anyone else.

1) I can't remember ever seeing a request for members that didn't include

the price of membership. Yes, it is a reasonable fee, but it makes me wonder

if all EMSAT is after is the fee.

2) EMSAT claims to represent all of EMS. How do you do that I've never seen

you ask questions or do polls of EMS workers or is it only done with

members?

3) Trust is something earned, have you? How? We as a group are gun shy when

it comes to trust. Trust me says the city manager...

4) You say EMSAT doesn't have the support of the majority, hmmm you should

be wondering why not? That just gives me more doubts.

5) EMSAT claims to be representing me in Austin and spending its own money.

Ok how about posting an itinerary so I know when, where, how and who?

6) " Put up or shut up " only makes me worried about EMSAT's ego. Are we

supposed to believe you are our one and only hope? Instead of banging your

chest and growling try convincing me that EMSAT is a true and worthy entity.

7) The EMSAT webpage is nice but tells me little about EMSAT's involvement

in EMS other than what they have already done. I'd like to know more about

what EMSAT is working on or looking into.

Everything is writen in a positive professional way but has a sterile feel

to me.

8) In order for me to make an informative decision I need all the info. Has

EMSAT given me everything I need to know?

Gene, personally there is nothing I would want to see more in EMS than a

strong organization that would represent me and my brothers n sisters. So,

my question to EMSAT is " why whine, why complain, " get out and do a grass

roots membership drive. I'd attend a town hall meeting, if there was one.

Did EMSAT put the cart before the horse by not having the membership first?

Again take this with a grain of salt it's not intended as an insult or even

a challenge. It's just my way of answering your post. I'm sitting here now

looking at my checkbook. Do I put it away or get to writing? These are my

thoughts and I hope they help.

Larry Feagin EMT-P

Waxahachie, Tx

> Folks,

>

> In the last several days we have been involved in an interesting

dialog

> about EMS pay and related subjects.

>

> Many have posted interesting and insightful thoughts about where

we're

> going, why our pay is in the toilet, the various paradigms and

models for running

> EMS services, pros and cons of pure SSM, partial SSM, hybrid SSM,

and no SSM.

> Educational requirements for EMS people, what we should call

them, and a

> myriad of other bitches and moans about our chosen profession.

>

> I asked that people join EMSAT, the one organization that looks

out for the

> interests of all first responders, ECAs, EMTs, EMT-Is, Certified

Paramedics,

> and Licensed Paramedics.

>

> I asked that 10 people join before the end of the day.

>

> We had ONE (1) person join.

>

> Friends, why whine? Why complain? Why bother to write about

the evils and

> ills besetting EMS in Texas when you won't join the only

organization that

> is dedicated to your welfare?

>

> I'm wondering why EMSAT is even trying to exist. We obviously do

not have

> the support and trust of the EMS community. We cannot be a

viable force for

> change if we do not have the support of the majority of certified

and licensed

> EMS personnel.

>

> There are over 50,000 of you. Yet, we have less than 1% of you

as members.

> What do you think that says to us who are busting our butts to

represent

> you, spending our own money on trips to Austin, hotel rooms,

meals, gasoline,

> and you won't spend $35 to join us and become a part of our

team?

>

> What do you think it says to a member of the Texas Legislature

when they

> find out that we have so few members?

>

> I hear so much crying and whining about our plight. I want to do

something

> about it. But I and the other people at EMSAT need your help.

We exist for

> YOU. Not for us. If you don't support us by joining, we cannot

do much to

> help.

>

> Once again I issue the challenge. Put up or shut up. Join or

stop whining

> about the problems with EMS.

>

> Without members, we're a paper tiger. We need to be a roaring

lion. We

> could be if just 1% of the certified/licensed EMS people in Texas

would join.

>

> What's your excuse?

>

> You can join at _www.emsatoftx.org_ (http://www.emsatoftx.org) .

>

> Gene Gandy, JD, LP

> Vice-President

> EMSAT

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Larry:

I was for several years a major critic of EMSAT. However, there have been

significant changes and I joined (although not a registered EMS provider).

EMSAT is at a time of transition. There is a finite amount of money and that

is going towards lobbying the legislature and other more pressing needs. It

costs money to buy ads, send mailers, and so on and at the current time must

rely on word of mouth. EMSAT is not after the fee--nobody gets paid and

besides I pay more for a single trip to the dry cleaners than annual EMSAT

dues. EMSAT is not like TMA or the other professional associations as the

membership is largely volunteer EMS providers and the membersip does not

have incomes over $200,000 annually like the physicians--so there is always

a shortage of funds. EMSAT has had numerous public meetings and internet

queries asking opinions. I for one have opined that way. I know each of the

Board of Directors. They have recently posted position papers and these are

a must read. Their hearts are pure, their goal is better EMS for Texas, and

I support each (although we do not agree). An EMS association in Texas will

never have more than a fraction of the registered EMS providers as long as

the major EMS providers are big fire departments (Dallas, Houston, San

). These people see EMS as a secondary job and not a place to spend

their money (as opposed to IAFF). EMSAT has been much better about public

disclosure. The legislature is not in sesion so there is not much to post.

The " put up or shut up " phrase is a phrase of frustration and desperation.

These board members and other proponents have put in hundreds or thousands

of hours of time for absolutely no money. I understand their frustration.

The web page is much better--but still produced by volunteers. EMSAT must

exceed a critical mass to become effective and we ask that you trust the BOD

and send your money and make your voice known. With your support and money

EMSAT can be a force to be reckoned with (see http://www.wisconsinems.com.

Join EMSAT. Texas EMS has never been at a more critical juncture and Texas

EMS needs a unified voice.

E. Bledsoe, DO, FACEP

Midlothian, TX

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

Gene,

Welcome to Texas, where unions or labor associations have traditionally

failed. Not because of any need for them but because of the way they present

themselves. Instead of telling me what I can do for EMSAT, how about telling

me what you are doing for me? Not what you want to or intend to do.

There has been a dozen times I've pulled out the checkbook to join but

never did for several reasons. These are my thoughts and not intended to

represent anyone else.

1) I can't remember ever seeing a request for members that didn't include

the price of membership. Yes, it is a reasonable fee, but it makes me wonder

if all EMSAT is after is the fee.

2) EMSAT claims to represent all of EMS. How do you do that I've never seen

you ask questions or do polls of EMS workers or is it only done with

members?

3) Trust is something earned, have you? How? We as a group are gun shy when

it comes to trust. Trust me says the city manager...

4) You say EMSAT doesn't have the support of the majority, hmmm you should

be wondering why not? That just gives me more doubts.

5) EMSAT claims to be representing me in Austin and spending its own money.

Ok how about posting an itinerary so I know when, where, how and who?

6) " Put up or shut up " only makes me worried about EMSAT's ego. Are we

supposed to believe you are our one and only hope? Instead of banging your

chest and growling try convincing me that EMSAT is a true and worthy entity.

7) The EMSAT webpage is nice but tells me little about EMSAT's involvement

in EMS other than what they have already done. I'd like to know more about

what EMSAT is working on or looking into.

Everything is writen in a positive professional way but has a sterile feel

to me.

8) In order for me to make an informative decision I need all the info. Has

EMSAT given me everything I need to know?

Gene, personally there is nothing I would want to see more in EMS than a

strong organization that would represent me and my brothers n sisters. So,

my question to EMSAT is " why whine, why complain, " get out and do a grass

roots membership drive. I'd attend a town hall meeting, if there was one.

Did EMSAT put the cart before the horse by not having the membership first?

Again take this with a grain of salt it's not intended as an insult or even

a challenge. It's just my way of answering your post. I'm sitting here now

looking at my checkbook. Do I put it away or get to writing? These are my

thoughts and I hope they help.

Larry Feagin EMT-P

Waxahachie, Tx

> Folks,

>

> In the last several days we have been involved in an interesting

dialog

> about EMS pay and related subjects.

>

> Many have posted interesting and insightful thoughts about where

we're

> going, why our pay is in the toilet, the various paradigms and

models for running

> EMS services, pros and cons of pure SSM, partial SSM, hybrid SSM,

and no SSM.

> Educational requirements for EMS people, what we should call

them, and a

> myriad of other bitches and moans about our chosen profession.

>

> I asked that people join EMSAT, the one organization that looks

out for the

> interests of all first responders, ECAs, EMTs, EMT-Is, Certified

Paramedics,

> and Licensed Paramedics.

>

> I asked that 10 people join before the end of the day.

>

> We had ONE (1) person join.

>

> Friends, why whine? Why complain? Why bother to write about

the evils and

> ills besetting EMS in Texas when you won't join the only

organization that

> is dedicated to your welfare?

>

> I'm wondering why EMSAT is even trying to exist. We obviously do

not have

> the support and trust of the EMS community. We cannot be a

viable force for

> change if we do not have the support of the majority of certified

and licensed

> EMS personnel.

>

> There are over 50,000 of you. Yet, we have less than 1% of you

as members.

> What do you think that says to us who are busting our butts to

represent

> you, spending our own money on trips to Austin, hotel rooms,

meals, gasoline,

> and you won't spend $35 to join us and become a part of our

team?

>

> What do you think it says to a member of the Texas Legislature

when they

> find out that we have so few members?

>

> I hear so much crying and whining about our plight. I want to do

something

> about it. But I and the other people at EMSAT need your help.

We exist for

> YOU. Not for us. If you don't support us by joining, we cannot

do much to

> help.

>

> Once again I issue the challenge. Put up or shut up. Join or

stop whining

> about the problems with EMS.

>

> Without members, we're a paper tiger. We need to be a roaring

lion. We

> could be if just 1% of the certified/licensed EMS people in Texas

would join.

>

> What's your excuse?

>

> You can join at _www.emsatoftx.org_ (http://www.emsatoftx.org) .

>

> Gene Gandy, JD, LP

> Vice-President

> EMSAT

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Larry and ,

Just look around you and tell me of anyhone else who is trying to better EMS

just because it needs done. $35.00 is not very much money when you consider

the dues of other professional orgnanizations. But it takes money to move

the big money boys at the State House.

Board Member

EMSAT

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

>

>

> Gene,

> Welcome to Texas, where unions or labor associations have

traditionally

> failed. Not because of any need for them but because of the way they

present

> themselves. Instead of telling me what I can do for EMSAT, how about

telling

> me what you are doing for me? Not what you want to or intend to do.

> There has been a dozen times I've pulled out the checkbook to join but

> never did for several reasons. These are my thoughts and not intended to

> represent anyone else.

> 1) I can't remember ever seeing a request for members that didn't include

> the price of membership. Yes, it is a reasonable fee, but it makes me

wonder

> if all EMSAT is after is the fee.

> 2) EMSAT claims to represent all of EMS. How do you do that I've never

seen

> you ask questions or do polls of EMS workers or is it only done with

> members?

> 3) Trust is something earned, have you? How? We as a group are gun shy

when

> it comes to trust. Trust me says the city manager...

> 4) You say EMSAT doesn't have the support of the majority, hmmm you should

> be wondering why not? That just gives me more doubts.

> 5) EMSAT claims to be representing me in Austin and spending its own

money.

> Ok how about posting an itinerary so I know when, where, how and who?

> 6) " Put up or shut up " only makes me worried about EMSAT's ego. Are we

> supposed to believe you are our one and only hope? Instead of banging your

> chest and growling try convincing me that EMSAT is a true and worthy

entity.

> 7) The EMSAT webpage is nice but tells me little about EMSAT's involvement

> in EMS other than what they have already done. I'd like to know more about

> what EMSAT is working on or looking into.

> Everything is writen in a positive professional way but has a sterile feel

> to me.

> 8) In order for me to make an informative decision I need all the info.

Has

> EMSAT given me everything I need to know?

> Gene, personally there is nothing I would want to see more in EMS than

a

> strong organization that would represent me and my brothers n sisters. So,

> my question to EMSAT is " why whine, why complain, " get out and do a grass

> roots membership drive. I'd attend a town hall meeting, if there was one.

> Did EMSAT put the cart before the horse by not having the membership

first?

> Again take this with a grain of salt it's not intended as an insult or

even

> a challenge. It's just my way of answering your post. I'm sitting here now

> looking at my checkbook. Do I put it away or get to writing? These are my

> thoughts and I hope they help.

> Larry Feagin EMT-P

> Waxahachie, Tx

>

>

> > Folks,

> >

> > In the last several days we have been involved in an interesting

> dialog

> > about EMS pay and related subjects.

> >

> > Many have posted interesting and insightful thoughts about where

> we're

> > going, why our pay is in the toilet, the various paradigms and

> models for running

> > EMS services, pros and cons of pure SSM, partial SSM, hybrid SSM,

> and no SSM.

> > Educational requirements for EMS people, what we should call

> them, and a

> > myriad of other bitches and moans about our chosen profession.

> >

> > I asked that people join EMSAT, the one organization that looks

> out for the

> > interests of all first responders, ECAs, EMTs, EMT-Is, Certified

> Paramedics,

> > and Licensed Paramedics.

> >

> > I asked that 10 people join before the end of the day.

> >

> > We had ONE (1) person join.

> >

> > Friends, why whine? Why complain? Why bother to write about

> the evils and

> > ills besetting EMS in Texas when you won't join the only

> organization that

> > is dedicated to your welfare?

> >

> > I'm wondering why EMSAT is even trying to exist. We obviously do

> not have

> > the support and trust of the EMS community. We cannot be a

> viable force for

> > change if we do not have the support of the majority of certified

> and licensed

> > EMS personnel.

> >

> > There are over 50,000 of you. Yet, we have less than 1% of you

> as members.

> > What do you think that says to us who are busting our butts to

> represent

> > you, spending our own money on trips to Austin, hotel rooms,

> meals, gasoline,

> > and you won't spend $35 to join us and become a part of our

> team?

> >

> > What do you think it says to a member of the Texas Legislature

> when they

> > find out that we have so few members?

> >

> > I hear so much crying and whining about our plight. I want to do

> something

> > about it. But I and the other people at EMSAT need your help.

> We exist for

> > YOU. Not for us. If you don't support us by joining, we cannot

> do much to

> > help.

> >

> > Once again I issue the challenge. Put up or shut up. Join or

> stop whining

> > about the problems with EMS.

> >

> > Without members, we're a paper tiger. We need to be a roaring

> lion. We

> > could be if just 1% of the certified/licensed EMS people in Texas

> would join.

> >

> > What's your excuse?

> >

> > You can join at _www.emsatoftx.org_ (http://www.emsatoftx.org) .

> >

> > Gene Gandy, JD, LP

> > Vice-President

> > EMSAT

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Larry and ,

Just look around you and tell me of anyhone else who is trying to better EMS

just because it needs done. $35.00 is not very much money when you consider

the dues of other professional orgnanizations. But it takes money to move

the big money boys at the State House.

Board Member

EMSAT

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

>

>

> Gene,

> Welcome to Texas, where unions or labor associations have

traditionally

> failed. Not because of any need for them but because of the way they

present

> themselves. Instead of telling me what I can do for EMSAT, how about

telling

> me what you are doing for me? Not what you want to or intend to do.

> There has been a dozen times I've pulled out the checkbook to join but

> never did for several reasons. These are my thoughts and not intended to

> represent anyone else.

> 1) I can't remember ever seeing a request for members that didn't include

> the price of membership. Yes, it is a reasonable fee, but it makes me

wonder

> if all EMSAT is after is the fee.

> 2) EMSAT claims to represent all of EMS. How do you do that I've never

seen

> you ask questions or do polls of EMS workers or is it only done with

> members?

> 3) Trust is something earned, have you? How? We as a group are gun shy

when

> it comes to trust. Trust me says the city manager...

> 4) You say EMSAT doesn't have the support of the majority, hmmm you should

> be wondering why not? That just gives me more doubts.

> 5) EMSAT claims to be representing me in Austin and spending its own

money.

> Ok how about posting an itinerary so I know when, where, how and who?

> 6) " Put up or shut up " only makes me worried about EMSAT's ego. Are we

> supposed to believe you are our one and only hope? Instead of banging your

> chest and growling try convincing me that EMSAT is a true and worthy

entity.

> 7) The EMSAT webpage is nice but tells me little about EMSAT's involvement

> in EMS other than what they have already done. I'd like to know more about

> what EMSAT is working on or looking into.

> Everything is writen in a positive professional way but has a sterile feel

> to me.

> 8) In order for me to make an informative decision I need all the info.

Has

> EMSAT given me everything I need to know?

> Gene, personally there is nothing I would want to see more in EMS than

a

> strong organization that would represent me and my brothers n sisters. So,

> my question to EMSAT is " why whine, why complain, " get out and do a grass

> roots membership drive. I'd attend a town hall meeting, if there was one.

> Did EMSAT put the cart before the horse by not having the membership

first?

> Again take this with a grain of salt it's not intended as an insult or

even

> a challenge. It's just my way of answering your post. I'm sitting here now

> looking at my checkbook. Do I put it away or get to writing? These are my

> thoughts and I hope they help.

> Larry Feagin EMT-P

> Waxahachie, Tx

>

>

> > Folks,

> >

> > In the last several days we have been involved in an interesting

> dialog

> > about EMS pay and related subjects.

> >

> > Many have posted interesting and insightful thoughts about where

> we're

> > going, why our pay is in the toilet, the various paradigms and

> models for running

> > EMS services, pros and cons of pure SSM, partial SSM, hybrid SSM,

> and no SSM.

> > Educational requirements for EMS people, what we should call

> them, and a

> > myriad of other bitches and moans about our chosen profession.

> >

> > I asked that people join EMSAT, the one organization that looks

> out for the

> > interests of all first responders, ECAs, EMTs, EMT-Is, Certified

> Paramedics,

> > and Licensed Paramedics.

> >

> > I asked that 10 people join before the end of the day.

> >

> > We had ONE (1) person join.

> >

> > Friends, why whine? Why complain? Why bother to write about

> the evils and

> > ills besetting EMS in Texas when you won't join the only

> organization that

> > is dedicated to your welfare?

> >

> > I'm wondering why EMSAT is even trying to exist. We obviously do

> not have

> > the support and trust of the EMS community. We cannot be a

> viable force for

> > change if we do not have the support of the majority of certified

> and licensed

> > EMS personnel.

> >

> > There are over 50,000 of you. Yet, we have less than 1% of you

> as members.

> > What do you think that says to us who are busting our butts to

> represent

> > you, spending our own money on trips to Austin, hotel rooms,

> meals, gasoline,

> > and you won't spend $35 to join us and become a part of our

> team?

> >

> > What do you think it says to a member of the Texas Legislature

> when they

> > find out that we have so few members?

> >

> > I hear so much crying and whining about our plight. I want to do

> something

> > about it. But I and the other people at EMSAT need your help.

> We exist for

> > YOU. Not for us. If you don't support us by joining, we cannot

> do much to

> > help.

> >

> > Once again I issue the challenge. Put up or shut up. Join or

> stop whining

> > about the problems with EMS.

> >

> > Without members, we're a paper tiger. We need to be a roaring

> lion. We

> > could be if just 1% of the certified/licensed EMS people in Texas

> would join.

> >

> > What's your excuse?

> >

> > You can join at _www.emsatoftx.org_ (http://www.emsatoftx.org) .

> >

> > Gene Gandy, JD, LP

> > Vice-President

> > EMSAT

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Larry,

I'm not a member of EMSAT, but that's due to competing professional

organization dues (the ones from my vocation trump the ones for my

advocation). But my decision to not join at this time is purely financial.

That said, yes there are a number of different organizations that represent

the interest of emergency services and/or emergency responders. But, there

is a major difference in how they represent the interest.

As a state employee I can tell you that folks like Texas DSHS, Dept. of

Insurance, Fire Commission, etc., are representing your interests from the

eyes of the agency and the sytem they are overseeing. Though they see many

problems, they are hamstrung in that they can't advocate for any positions

dealing with legislation. Not only that, they can only respond to questions

asked by legislators. They will answer them truthfully and fully tell them

what's what from the agency's standpoint. But only when asked.

There are several organizations that are fire related, IAFF and SFFMA to

think of two off the bat. One is for the paid firefighters and the other

volunteers. Both are great organizations. (I was a member through my former

department in one and am making an assumption for the other.) But, they

represent the fire service as their main viewpoint (which is normal since

they are fire related organizations). EMS issues may be on the agenda, but

secondary to their fire department priorities (as it should be).

Others are national organizations which may do a great job of taking your

issues to the national level and Capital Hill. That is their focus, their

mission and their skills. We need those organizations to do what they do in

Washington. However, if they are to keep doing a great job in Washington,

then they probably don't have the capabilities to have similar resources in

Austin and the other state capitals.

EMSAT, though limited by fiscal resources, does try to play a part in what

goes on in Austin at the state government level. They do it because they

have a passion for it. They care about the street medics - paid and

volunteer. I've talked to them at the conference and have seen them in

action at public hearings in Austin. I haven't seen TAEMT around in a long,

long time, so EMSAT is the only player in the game that I can tell is trying

to do the things and say the things that I wish I could say to my

legislators.

Will I join EMSAT? Yes at some point when my finances will allow it. Do I

support them in their quest? You bet.

Can I disagree and have conversations about our differing viewpoints? I

haven't been stopped by anyone from having a conversation. We may still

disagree afterwards but we do so as gentlemen and with respect.

I know you feel like you are undecided. I can tell you that I not aware of

anyone else who's pushing an EMS only agenda in Austin. While EMSAT folks

are human (which means they may not be perfect and may not do things exactly

as I would do them), they are willing to go to bat for the EMS profession

and the practitioners within EMS.

Again, I'm not a member but I did want to give you a few more things to chew

over in making your decision.

Barry Sharp

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

> Larry and ,

>

> Just look around you and tell me of anyhone else who is trying to

better EMS

> just because it needs done. $35.00 is not very much money when

you consider

> the dues of other professional orgnanizations. But it takes money

to move

> the big money boys at the State House.

>

>

> Board Member

> EMSAT

>

,

After reading Dr. B's post I was ready to join but now after

yours I'm back to being undecided. As far as who else is trying to

better EMS? I'd have to say there are many in this group alone. Not

to mention all the other organizations that has claimed to be, such

as TDH, NR, NAEMT, AAS and many others. As I stated before I wonder

which is more important to EMSAT my membership or my 35$? I'm sure

EMSAT is feeling frustrated for not receiving the support they

deserve but the question should be why aren't they? To me so far

EMSAT has not made me feel like as an individual I would make much

of a difference. Money is important in the process but so is my

reputation. Is EMSAT just the sum of their parts or??? If EMSAT

wants more members then here's your chance. I doubt if I'm the only

one sitting on the fence. If you want me try inspiring me with

EMSAT's vision. I say all this without malice and I'm hoping for a

response that answers my questions and inspires me to join. EMS is

in dire need of a true EMS advocate that represents EMS. Have a

great day...

Larry Feagin EMT-P

Waxahachie, TX

[Guest guest]

Larry,

I'm not a member of EMSAT, but that's due to competing professional

organization dues (the ones from my vocation trump the ones for my

advocation). But my decision to not join at this time is purely financial.

That said, yes there are a number of different organizations that represent

the interest of emergency services and/or emergency responders. But, there

is a major difference in how they represent the interest.

As a state employee I can tell you that folks like Texas DSHS, Dept. of

Insurance, Fire Commission, etc., are representing your interests from the

eyes of the agency and the sytem they are overseeing. Though they see many

problems, they are hamstrung in that they can't advocate for any positions

dealing with legislation. Not only that, they can only respond to questions

asked by legislators. They will answer them truthfully and fully tell them

what's what from the agency's standpoint. But only when asked.

There are several organizations that are fire related, IAFF and SFFMA to

think of two off the bat. One is for the paid firefighters and the other

volunteers. Both are great organizations. (I was a member through my former

department in one and am making an assumption for the other.) But, they

represent the fire service as their main viewpoint (which is normal since

they are fire related organizations). EMS issues may be on the agenda, but

secondary to their fire department priorities (as it should be).

Others are national organizations which may do a great job of taking your

issues to the national level and Capital Hill. That is their focus, their

mission and their skills. We need those organizations to do what they do in

Washington. However, if they are to keep doing a great job in Washington,

then they probably don't have the capabilities to have similar resources in

Austin and the other state capitals.

EMSAT, though limited by fiscal resources, does try to play a part in what

goes on in Austin at the state government level. They do it because they

have a passion for it. They care about the street medics - paid and

volunteer. I've talked to them at the conference and have seen them in

action at public hearings in Austin. I haven't seen TAEMT around in a long,

long time, so EMSAT is the only player in the game that I can tell is trying

to do the things and say the things that I wish I could say to my

legislators.

Will I join EMSAT? Yes at some point when my finances will allow it. Do I

support them in their quest? You bet.

Can I disagree and have conversations about our differing viewpoints? I

haven't been stopped by anyone from having a conversation. We may still

disagree afterwards but we do so as gentlemen and with respect.

I know you feel like you are undecided. I can tell you that I not aware of

anyone else who's pushing an EMS only agenda in Austin. While EMSAT folks

are human (which means they may not be perfect and may not do things exactly

as I would do them), they are willing to go to bat for the EMS profession

and the practitioners within EMS.

Again, I'm not a member but I did want to give you a few more things to chew

over in making your decision.

Barry Sharp

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

> Larry and ,

>

> Just look around you and tell me of anyhone else who is trying to

better EMS

> just because it needs done. $35.00 is not very much money when

you consider

> the dues of other professional orgnanizations. But it takes money

to move

> the big money boys at the State House.

>

>

> Board Member

> EMSAT

>

,

After reading Dr. B's post I was ready to join but now after

yours I'm back to being undecided. As far as who else is trying to

better EMS? I'd have to say there are many in this group alone. Not

to mention all the other organizations that has claimed to be, such

as TDH, NR, NAEMT, AAS and many others. As I stated before I wonder

which is more important to EMSAT my membership or my 35$? I'm sure

EMSAT is feeling frustrated for not receiving the support they

deserve but the question should be why aren't they? To me so far

EMSAT has not made me feel like as an individual I would make much

of a difference. Money is important in the process but so is my

reputation. Is EMSAT just the sum of their parts or??? If EMSAT

wants more members then here's your chance. I doubt if I'm the only

one sitting on the fence. If you want me try inspiring me with

EMSAT's vision. I say all this without malice and I'm hoping for a

response that answers my questions and inspires me to join. EMS is

in dire need of a true EMS advocate that represents EMS. Have a

great day...

Larry Feagin EMT-P

Waxahachie, TX

[Guest guest]

Larry,

I'm not a member of EMSAT, but that's due to competing professional

organization dues (the ones from my vocation trump the ones for my

advocation). But my decision to not join at this time is purely financial.

That said, yes there are a number of different organizations that represent

the interest of emergency services and/or emergency responders. But, there

is a major difference in how they represent the interest.

As a state employee I can tell you that folks like Texas DSHS, Dept. of

Insurance, Fire Commission, etc., are representing your interests from the

eyes of the agency and the sytem they are overseeing. Though they see many

problems, they are hamstrung in that they can't advocate for any positions

dealing with legislation. Not only that, they can only respond to questions

asked by legislators. They will answer them truthfully and fully tell them

what's what from the agency's standpoint. But only when asked.

There are several organizations that are fire related, IAFF and SFFMA to

think of two off the bat. One is for the paid firefighters and the other

volunteers. Both are great organizations. (I was a member through my former

department in one and am making an assumption for the other.) But, they

represent the fire service as their main viewpoint (which is normal since

they are fire related organizations). EMS issues may be on the agenda, but

secondary to their fire department priorities (as it should be).

Others are national organizations which may do a great job of taking your

issues to the national level and Capital Hill. That is their focus, their

mission and their skills. We need those organizations to do what they do in

Washington. However, if they are to keep doing a great job in Washington,

then they probably don't have the capabilities to have similar resources in

Austin and the other state capitals.

EMSAT, though limited by fiscal resources, does try to play a part in what

goes on in Austin at the state government level. They do it because they

have a passion for it. They care about the street medics - paid and

volunteer. I've talked to them at the conference and have seen them in

action at public hearings in Austin. I haven't seen TAEMT around in a long,

long time, so EMSAT is the only player in the game that I can tell is trying

to do the things and say the things that I wish I could say to my

legislators.

Will I join EMSAT? Yes at some point when my finances will allow it. Do I

support them in their quest? You bet.

Can I disagree and have conversations about our differing viewpoints? I

haven't been stopped by anyone from having a conversation. We may still

disagree afterwards but we do so as gentlemen and with respect.

I know you feel like you are undecided. I can tell you that I not aware of

anyone else who's pushing an EMS only agenda in Austin. While EMSAT folks

are human (which means they may not be perfect and may not do things exactly

as I would do them), they are willing to go to bat for the EMS profession

and the practitioners within EMS.

Again, I'm not a member but I did want to give you a few more things to chew

over in making your decision.

Barry Sharp

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

> Larry and ,

>

> Just look around you and tell me of anyhone else who is trying to

better EMS

> just because it needs done. $35.00 is not very much money when

you consider

> the dues of other professional orgnanizations. But it takes money

to move

> the big money boys at the State House.

>

>

> Board Member

> EMSAT

>

,

After reading Dr. B's post I was ready to join but now after

yours I'm back to being undecided. As far as who else is trying to

better EMS? I'd have to say there are many in this group alone. Not

to mention all the other organizations that has claimed to be, such

as TDH, NR, NAEMT, AAS and many others. As I stated before I wonder

which is more important to EMSAT my membership or my 35$? I'm sure

EMSAT is feeling frustrated for not receiving the support they

deserve but the question should be why aren't they? To me so far

EMSAT has not made me feel like as an individual I would make much

of a difference. Money is important in the process but so is my

reputation. Is EMSAT just the sum of their parts or??? If EMSAT

wants more members then here's your chance. I doubt if I'm the only

one sitting on the fence. If you want me try inspiring me with

EMSAT's vision. I say all this without malice and I'm hoping for a

response that answers my questions and inspires me to join. EMS is

in dire need of a true EMS advocate that represents EMS. Have a

great day...

Larry Feagin EMT-P

Waxahachie, TX

[Guest guest]

Larry,

I am sorry if I muddied the water. It is not your $35.00 that we need as

much as your name on a membership role. It is numbers we need as much if

not more that money. Right Now I would bet that less than 1% of the Texas

Certified and Lisc. pre-hospital personnel are members of EMSAT. WE want

to be able to go the State House and say we Represent 50,000 thousand votes

in the state of Texas and we have a cause. Is money important? Sure, but

numbers are just as important if not more so.

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

>

> > Larry and ,

> >

> > Just look around you and tell me of anyhone else who is trying to

> better EMS

> > just because it needs done. $35.00 is not very much money when

> you consider

> > the dues of other professional orgnanizations. But it takes money

> to move

> > the big money boys at the State House.

> >

> >

> > Board Member

> > EMSAT

> >

> ,

> After reading Dr. B's post I was ready to join but now after

> yours I'm back to being undecided. As far as who else is trying to

> better EMS? I'd have to say there are many in this group alone. Not

> to mention all the other organizations that has claimed to be, such

> as TDH, NR, NAEMT, AAS and many others. As I stated before I wonder

> which is more important to EMSAT my membership or my 35$? I'm sure

> EMSAT is feeling frustrated for not receiving the support they

> deserve but the question should be why aren't they? To me so far

> EMSAT has not made me feel like as an individual I would make much

> of a difference. Money is important in the process but so is my

> reputation. Is EMSAT just the sum of their parts or??? If EMSAT

> wants more members then here's your chance. I doubt if I'm the only

> one sitting on the fence. If you want me try inspiring me with

> EMSAT's vision. I say all this without malice and I'm hoping for a

> response that answers my questions and inspires me to join. EMS is

> in dire need of a true EMS advocate that represents EMS. Have a

> great day...

> Larry Feagin EMT-P

> Waxahachie, TX

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Larry,

I am sorry if I muddied the water. It is not your $35.00 that we need as

much as your name on a membership role. It is numbers we need as much if

not more that money. Right Now I would bet that less than 1% of the Texas

Certified and Lisc. pre-hospital personnel are members of EMSAT. WE want

to be able to go the State House and say we Represent 50,000 thousand votes

in the state of Texas and we have a cause. Is money important? Sure, but

numbers are just as important if not more so.

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

>

> > Larry and ,

> >

> > Just look around you and tell me of anyhone else who is trying to

> better EMS

> > just because it needs done. $35.00 is not very much money when

> you consider

> > the dues of other professional orgnanizations. But it takes money

> to move

> > the big money boys at the State House.

> >

> >

> > Board Member

> > EMSAT

> >

> ,

> After reading Dr. B's post I was ready to join but now after

> yours I'm back to being undecided. As far as who else is trying to

> better EMS? I'd have to say there are many in this group alone. Not

> to mention all the other organizations that has claimed to be, such

> as TDH, NR, NAEMT, AAS and many others. As I stated before I wonder

> which is more important to EMSAT my membership or my 35$? I'm sure

> EMSAT is feeling frustrated for not receiving the support they

> deserve but the question should be why aren't they? To me so far

> EMSAT has not made me feel like as an individual I would make much

> of a difference. Money is important in the process but so is my

> reputation. Is EMSAT just the sum of their parts or??? If EMSAT

> wants more members then here's your chance. I doubt if I'm the only

> one sitting on the fence. If you want me try inspiring me with

> EMSAT's vision. I say all this without malice and I'm hoping for a

> response that answers my questions and inspires me to join. EMS is

> in dire need of a true EMS advocate that represents EMS. Have a

> great day...

> Larry Feagin EMT-P

> Waxahachie, TX

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Larry,

I am sorry if I muddied the water. It is not your $35.00 that we need as

much as your name on a membership role. It is numbers we need as much if

not more that money. Right Now I would bet that less than 1% of the Texas

Certified and Lisc. pre-hospital personnel are members of EMSAT. WE want

to be able to go the State House and say we Represent 50,000 thousand votes

in the state of Texas and we have a cause. Is money important? Sure, but

numbers are just as important if not more so.

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

>

> > Larry and ,

> >

> > Just look around you and tell me of anyhone else who is trying to

> better EMS

> > just because it needs done. $35.00 is not very much money when

> you consider

> > the dues of other professional orgnanizations. But it takes money

> to move

> > the big money boys at the State House.

> >

> >

> > Board Member

> > EMSAT

> >

> ,

> After reading Dr. B's post I was ready to join but now after

> yours I'm back to being undecided. As far as who else is trying to

> better EMS? I'd have to say there are many in this group alone. Not

> to mention all the other organizations that has claimed to be, such

> as TDH, NR, NAEMT, AAS and many others. As I stated before I wonder

> which is more important to EMSAT my membership or my 35$? I'm sure

> EMSAT is feeling frustrated for not receiving the support they

> deserve but the question should be why aren't they? To me so far

> EMSAT has not made me feel like as an individual I would make much

> of a difference. Money is important in the process but so is my

> reputation. Is EMSAT just the sum of their parts or??? If EMSAT

> wants more members then here's your chance. I doubt if I'm the only

> one sitting on the fence. If you want me try inspiring me with

> EMSAT's vision. I say all this without malice and I'm hoping for a

> response that answers my questions and inspires me to join. EMS is

> in dire need of a true EMS advocate that represents EMS. Have a

> great day...

> Larry Feagin EMT-P

> Waxahachie, TX

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dac pretty well summed it up.

Having been perceived as the critic of EMSAT in the past, I feel the need to

state my case and say that I have gone from 'critic' to 'somewhat cynical',

though approaching with an open mind. I am a dues paying member of EMSAT and

have been for the past 2 years. I am opinionated, and don't fear voicing my

opinion in a relatively diplomatic way. For many on this list, and many who

are not on the list but knowledgable of EMSAT, there were in the past many

reasons to NOT suport EMSAT. I had some of my own, but after the last

election; most were gone.

I have disagreed with some of the positions that the board has taken in the

past, but I also realize that the intent behind their decisions was for the

betterment of Texas EMS in general. That said, I have also had numerous

conversations, both in person, via telephone and email with many of the

board members themselves, and come away with a different pserspective. The

current board members are more receptive than some in the past, their goals

are more precise than some of those in the past.

EMSAT does need numbers, it's not the money per se, it is the numbers. The

35.00 doesn't go far, it does help offset some of the expenses of running

the operation day to day. But to approach a politician and say, " We are

here, and we represent 50K pissed of Texans " , tends to get a bit more

attention.

Gene has done an excellent job of putting forth more information since the

last election, the web site has improved 110%, position papers have been

posted, and Gene will on occasion post here with the lastest and greatest

information from EMSAT.

I want you to join, but not solely to get your money, I want you to join, so

that we can move forward together, so that not only will you share the

responsibility, but so that you will also share in the feeling of

achievement when things go right.

All I have ever asked is that the board be open, and make decisons based

upon what is best for EMS, to date, the current board has done that.

Am I still cynical? Sure, but less and less each day. Am I still

opinionated? LOL, oh yeah. WIll I join again next year? Yeah, no doubt about

it.

I don't want to push you off the fence, I just want to help you off on the

right side....

If I can help in any way, email me privately.

Mike

[Guest guest]

Dac pretty well summed it up.

Having been perceived as the critic of EMSAT in the past, I feel the need to

state my case and say that I have gone from 'critic' to 'somewhat cynical',

though approaching with an open mind. I am a dues paying member of EMSAT and

have been for the past 2 years. I am opinionated, and don't fear voicing my

opinion in a relatively diplomatic way. For many on this list, and many who

are not on the list but knowledgable of EMSAT, there were in the past many

reasons to NOT suport EMSAT. I had some of my own, but after the last

election; most were gone.

I have disagreed with some of the positions that the board has taken in the

past, but I also realize that the intent behind their decisions was for the

betterment of Texas EMS in general. That said, I have also had numerous

conversations, both in person, via telephone and email with many of the

board members themselves, and come away with a different pserspective. The

current board members are more receptive than some in the past, their goals

are more precise than some of those in the past.

EMSAT does need numbers, it's not the money per se, it is the numbers. The

35.00 doesn't go far, it does help offset some of the expenses of running

the operation day to day. But to approach a politician and say, " We are

here, and we represent 50K pissed of Texans " , tends to get a bit more

attention.

Gene has done an excellent job of putting forth more information since the

last election, the web site has improved 110%, position papers have been

posted, and Gene will on occasion post here with the lastest and greatest

information from EMSAT.

I want you to join, but not solely to get your money, I want you to join, so

that we can move forward together, so that not only will you share the

responsibility, but so that you will also share in the feeling of

achievement when things go right.

All I have ever asked is that the board be open, and make decisons based

upon what is best for EMS, to date, the current board has done that.

Am I still cynical? Sure, but less and less each day. Am I still

opinionated? LOL, oh yeah. WIll I join again next year? Yeah, no doubt about

it.

I don't want to push you off the fence, I just want to help you off on the

right side....

If I can help in any way, email me privately.

Mike

[Guest guest]

Dac pretty well summed it up.

Having been perceived as the critic of EMSAT in the past, I feel the need to

state my case and say that I have gone from 'critic' to 'somewhat cynical',

though approaching with an open mind. I am a dues paying member of EMSAT and

have been for the past 2 years. I am opinionated, and don't fear voicing my

opinion in a relatively diplomatic way. For many on this list, and many who

are not on the list but knowledgable of EMSAT, there were in the past many

reasons to NOT suport EMSAT. I had some of my own, but after the last

election; most were gone.

I have disagreed with some of the positions that the board has taken in the

past, but I also realize that the intent behind their decisions was for the

betterment of Texas EMS in general. That said, I have also had numerous

conversations, both in person, via telephone and email with many of the

board members themselves, and come away with a different pserspective. The

current board members are more receptive than some in the past, their goals

are more precise than some of those in the past.

EMSAT does need numbers, it's not the money per se, it is the numbers. The

35.00 doesn't go far, it does help offset some of the expenses of running

the operation day to day. But to approach a politician and say, " We are

here, and we represent 50K pissed of Texans " , tends to get a bit more

attention.

Gene has done an excellent job of putting forth more information since the

last election, the web site has improved 110%, position papers have been

posted, and Gene will on occasion post here with the lastest and greatest

information from EMSAT.

I want you to join, but not solely to get your money, I want you to join, so

that we can move forward together, so that not only will you share the

responsibility, but so that you will also share in the feeling of

achievement when things go right.

All I have ever asked is that the board be open, and make decisons based

upon what is best for EMS, to date, the current board has done that.

Am I still cynical? Sure, but less and less each day. Am I still

opinionated? LOL, oh yeah. WIll I join again next year? Yeah, no doubt about

it.

I don't want to push you off the fence, I just want to help you off on the

right side....

If I can help in any way, email me privately.

Mike

[Guest guest]

Larry,

I'll try to answer your post as best I can. Please read down and see my

comments inserted into the body of your post.

Gene Gandy

Vice-President

EMSAT

In a message dated 9/16/2004 4:01:12 PM Central Daylight Time,

medic34255@... writes:

> Larry and ,

>

> Just look around you and tell me of anyhone else who is trying to

better EMS

> just because it needs done. $35.00 is not very much money when

you consider

> the dues of other professional orgnanizations. But it takes money

to move

> the big money boys at the State House.

>

>

> Board Member

> EMSAT

>

,

After reading Dr. B's post I was ready to join but now after

yours I'm back to being undecided. As far as who else is trying to

better EMS? I'd have to say there are many in this group alone.

When you say that there are many in this group, and I assume you mean those

on this Yahoo Group, that are attempting to better EMS, I would have to agree

with you. But I would ask this question. How are they doing it? To say

that one wants to better EMS is one thing, but to do something concrete to do

it is quite another. EMSAT is an organization that has the mission to better

EMS through actual involvement with the legislative process. We do that by

hiring a lobbyist who works for your interests, by keeping up with legislative

and regulatory matters and appearing at hearings, contacting state senators

and representatives, and so forth. How are the others you mention bettering

EMS?

Not

to mention all the other organizations that has claimed to be, such

as TDH, NR, NAEMT, AAS and many others.

TDH does not exist any longer, the National Registry is a credentialing

organization and has nothing to do with EMS at the state level in Texas, NAEMT

is

a national organization of which EMSAT is a part, and it exerts its influence

at the national level just as EMSAT does at the state level.

In order to make any headway with legislation, an organization must have

membership and the money to carry on its functions. Money pays for the

lobbyist. It pays for letters to senators and representatives, paper,

envelopes,

stamps, phone calls, faxes, and so forth. The members of the Board contribute

their time, hotel expenses, gasoline, wear and tear on automobiles, and get

nothing in return. Just for your information, it costs me at least $500 every

time I attend a board meeting in Austin or attend a legislative hearing to

testify. I get no reimbursement for that nor do I want any. However, I do

want us to have enough money to pay our Executive Director and our Lobbyist,

pay

the phone bills, our fees to the State of Texas for being a 501©(3)

organization, our accountants for doing our audits, and so forth.

As I stated before I wonder

which is more important to EMSAT my membership or my 35$?

Both are essential for EMSAT's survival.

I'm sure

EMSAT is feeling frustrated for not receiving the support they

deserve but the question should be why aren't they?

That's the enduring question. Why doesn't EMSAT receive the support it

needs? EMSAT is expected to work miracles without any money or support. Then,

when it's the suggessful 900 pound gorilla, everyone will want to join. But

it will not be able to be successful without members.

I don't know what EMSAT could do to make you feel like you would make a

difference except to invite you to join and participate. Nobody who has ever

wanted to participate in our work has ever been turned away. We'll find

something for you to do. All you have to do is join and ask. We need people

to

serve on the legislative committee, the membership committee, the events

committee, to help us at the Conference, you name it. There's something for

you to

do.

We are an open organization. All members are invited to our Board Meetings.

We listen to our members. And we ask them to work with us on projects.

But you have to join. We cannot put you to work if you're not a member.

If I can answer any questions or provide any further insights into what

EMSAT is and does, please call me. My cellular is , and I'm

available most of the time except when I'm on a call or teaching a class or

(rarely)

asleep.

Gene G.

To me so far

EMSAT has not made me feel like as an individual I would make much

of a difference. Money is important in the process but so is my

reputation. Is EMSAT just the sum of their parts or??? If EMSAT

wants more members then here's your chance. I doubt if I'm the only

one sitting on the fence. If you want me try inspiring me with

EMSAT's vision. I say all this without malice and I'm hoping for a

response that answers my questions and inspires me to join. EMS is

in dire need of a true EMS advocate that represents EMS. Have a

great day...

Larry Feagin EMT-P

Waxahachie, TX

[Guest guest]

Larry,

I'll try to answer your post as best I can. Please read down and see my

comments inserted into the body of your post.

Gene Gandy

Vice-President

EMSAT

In a message dated 9/16/2004 4:01:12 PM Central Daylight Time,

medic34255@... writes:

> Larry and ,

>

> Just look around you and tell me of anyhone else who is trying to

better EMS

> just because it needs done. $35.00 is not very much money when

you consider

> the dues of other professional orgnanizations. But it takes money

to move

> the big money boys at the State House.

>

>

> Board Member

> EMSAT

>

,

After reading Dr. B's post I was ready to join but now after

yours I'm back to being undecided. As far as who else is trying to

better EMS? I'd have to say there are many in this group alone.

When you say that there are many in this group, and I assume you mean those

on this Yahoo Group, that are attempting to better EMS, I would have to agree

with you. But I would ask this question. How are they doing it? To say

that one wants to better EMS is one thing, but to do something concrete to do

it is quite another. EMSAT is an organization that has the mission to better

EMS through actual involvement with the legislative process. We do that by

hiring a lobbyist who works for your interests, by keeping up with legislative

and regulatory matters and appearing at hearings, contacting state senators

and representatives, and so forth. How are the others you mention bettering

EMS?

Not

to mention all the other organizations that has claimed to be, such

as TDH, NR, NAEMT, AAS and many others.

TDH does not exist any longer, the National Registry is a credentialing

organization and has nothing to do with EMS at the state level in Texas, NAEMT

is

a national organization of which EMSAT is a part, and it exerts its influence

at the national level just as EMSAT does at the state level.

In order to make any headway with legislation, an organization must have

membership and the money to carry on its functions. Money pays for the

lobbyist. It pays for letters to senators and representatives, paper,

envelopes,

stamps, phone calls, faxes, and so forth. The members of the Board contribute

their time, hotel expenses, gasoline, wear and tear on automobiles, and get

nothing in return. Just for your information, it costs me at least $500 every

time I attend a board meeting in Austin or attend a legislative hearing to

testify. I get no reimbursement for that nor do I want any. However, I do

want us to have enough money to pay our Executive Director and our Lobbyist,

pay

the phone bills, our fees to the State of Texas for being a 501©(3)

organization, our accountants for doing our audits, and so forth.

As I stated before I wonder

which is more important to EMSAT my membership or my 35$?

Both are essential for EMSAT's survival.

I'm sure

EMSAT is feeling frustrated for not receiving the support they

deserve but the question should be why aren't they?

That's the enduring question. Why doesn't EMSAT receive the support it

needs? EMSAT is expected to work miracles without any money or support. Then,

when it's the suggessful 900 pound gorilla, everyone will want to join. But

it will not be able to be successful without members.

I don't know what EMSAT could do to make you feel like you would make a

difference except to invite you to join and participate. Nobody who has ever

wanted to participate in our work has ever been turned away. We'll find

something for you to do. All you have to do is join and ask. We need people

to

serve on the legislative committee, the membership committee, the events

committee, to help us at the Conference, you name it. There's something for

you to

do.

We are an open organization. All members are invited to our Board Meetings.

We listen to our members. And we ask them to work with us on projects.

But you have to join. We cannot put you to work if you're not a member.

If I can answer any questions or provide any further insights into what

EMSAT is and does, please call me. My cellular is , and I'm

available most of the time except when I'm on a call or teaching a class or

(rarely)

asleep.

Gene G.

To me so far

EMSAT has not made me feel like as an individual I would make much

of a difference. Money is important in the process but so is my

reputation. Is EMSAT just the sum of their parts or??? If EMSAT

wants more members then here's your chance. I doubt if I'm the only

one sitting on the fence. If you want me try inspiring me with

EMSAT's vision. I say all this without malice and I'm hoping for a

response that answers my questions and inspires me to join. EMS is

in dire need of a true EMS advocate that represents EMS. Have a

great day...

Larry Feagin EMT-P

Waxahachie, TX

[Guest guest]

Do all EMT's know about this organization? I found it purely by accident

while browsing the web last fall. This information should be posted on the

bulletin boards outside EMS classes. Catch them while they're new and really

gung-ho. Send it along with everyone's renewal certifications.

Meredith

Re: Re: Musings about the future of EMS

Larry,

I'll try to answer your post as best I can. Please read down and see my

comments inserted into the body of your post.

Gene Gandy

Vice-President

EMSAT

In a message dated 9/16/2004 4:01:12 PM Central Daylight Time,

medic34255@... writes:

> Larry and ,

>

> Just look around you and tell me of anyhone else who is trying to

better EMS

> just because it needs done. $35.00 is not very much money when

you consider

> the dues of other professional orgnanizations. But it takes money

to move

> the big money boys at the State House.

>

>

> Board Member

> EMSAT

>

,

After reading Dr. B's post I was ready to join but now after

yours I'm back to being undecided. As far as who else is trying to

better EMS? I'd have to say there are many in this group alone.

When you say that there are many in this group, and I assume you mean those

on this Yahoo Group, that are attempting to better EMS, I would have to agree

with you. But I would ask this question. How are they doing it? To say

that one wants to better EMS is one thing, but to do something concrete to do

it is quite another. EMSAT is an organization that has the mission to better

EMS through actual involvement with the legislative process. We do that by

hiring a lobbyist who works for your interests, by keeping up with

legislative

and regulatory matters and appearing at hearings, contacting state senators

and representatives, and so forth. How are the others you mention bettering

EMS?

Not

to mention all the other organizations that has claimed to be, such

as TDH, NR, NAEMT, AAS and many others.

TDH does not exist any longer, the National Registry is a credentialing

organization and has nothing to do with EMS at the state level in Texas, NAEMT

is

a national organization of which EMSAT is a part, and it exerts its influence

at the national level just as EMSAT does at the state level.

In order to make any headway with legislation, an organization must have

membership and the money to carry on its functions. Money pays for the

lobbyist. It pays for letters to senators and representatives, paper,

envelopes,

stamps, phone calls, faxes, and so forth. The members of the Board

contribute

their time, hotel expenses, gasoline, wear and tear on automobiles, and get

nothing in return. Just for your information, it costs me at least $500

every

time I attend a board meeting in Austin or attend a legislative hearing to

testify. I get no reimbursement for that nor do I want any. However, I do

want us to have enough money to pay our Executive Director and our Lobbyist,

pay

the phone bills, our fees to the State of Texas for being a 501©(3)

organization, our accountants for doing our audits, and so forth.

As I stated before I wonder

which is more important to EMSAT my membership or my 35$?

Both are essential for EMSAT's survival.

I'm sure

EMSAT is feeling frustrated for not receiving the support they

deserve but the question should be why aren't they?

That's the enduring question. Why doesn't EMSAT receive the support it

needs? EMSAT is expected to work miracles without any money or support.

Then,

when it's the suggessful 900 pound gorilla, everyone will want to join. But

it will not be able to be successful without members.

I don't know what EMSAT could do to make you feel like you would make a

difference except to invite you to join and participate. Nobody who has ever

wanted to participate in our work has ever been turned away. We'll find

something for you to do. All you have to do is join and ask. We need people

to

serve on the legislative committee, the membership committee, the events

committee, to help us at the Conference, you name it. There's something for

you to

do.

We are an open organization. All members are invited to our Board Meetings.

We listen to our members. And we ask them to work with us on projects.

But you have to join. We cannot put you to work if you're not a member.

If I can answer any questions or provide any further insights into what

EMSAT is and does, please call me. My cellular is , and I'm

available most of the time except when I'm on a call or teaching a class or

(rarely)

asleep.

Gene G.

To me so far

EMSAT has not made me feel like as an individual I would make much

of a difference. Money is important in the process but so is my

reputation. Is EMSAT just the sum of their parts or??? If EMSAT

wants more members then here's your chance. I doubt if I'm the only

one sitting on the fence. If you want me try inspiring me with

EMSAT's vision. I say all this without malice and I'm hoping for a

response that answers my questions and inspires me to join. EMS is

in dire need of a true EMS advocate that represents EMS. Have a

great day...

Larry Feagin EMT-P

Waxahachie, TX

[Guest guest]

Larry,

I read your post and AGREE totally, but it's time... know what I mean. I did

the very same thing you did and I finally " wrote the check " . We don't know each

other and maybe we will never meet but I need your help just as if we were

working a call together. I, we, need you and others like you. Go ahead brother

write the check, ask the questions, lead and follow, cover my back... it's time

Lonnie

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

Gene,

Welcome to Texas, where unions or labor associations have traditionally

failed. Not because of any need for them but because of the way they present

themselves. Instead of telling me what I can do for EMSAT, how about telling

me what you are doing for me? Not what you want to or intend to do.

There has been a dozen times I've pulled out the checkbook to join but

never did for several reasons. These are my thoughts and not intended to

represent anyone else.

1) I can't remember ever seeing a request for members that didn't include

the price of membership. Yes, it is a reasonable fee, but it makes me wonder

if all EMSAT is after is the fee.

2) EMSAT claims to represent all of EMS. How do you do that I've never seen

you ask questions or do polls of EMS workers or is it only done with

members?

3) Trust is something earned, have you? How? We as a group are gun shy when

it comes to trust. Trust me says the city manager...

4) You say EMSAT doesn't have the support of the majority, hmmm you should

be wondering why not? That just gives me more doubts.

5) EMSAT claims to be representing me in Austin and spending its own money.

Ok how about posting an itinerary so I know when, where, how and who?

6) " Put up or shut up " only makes me worried about EMSAT's ego. Are we

supposed to believe you are our one and only hope? Instead of banging your

chest and growling try convincing me that EMSAT is a true and worthy entity.

7) The EMSAT webpage is nice but tells me little about EMSAT's involvement

in EMS other than what they have already done. I'd like to know more about

what EMSAT is working on or looking into.

Everything is writen in a positive professional way but has a sterile feel

to me.

8) In order for me to make an informative decision I need all the info. Has

EMSAT given me everything I need to know?

Gene, personally there is nothing I would want to see more in EMS than a

strong organization that would represent me and my brothers n sisters. So,

my question to EMSAT is " why whine, why complain, " get out and do a grass

roots membership drive. I'd attend a town hall meeting, if there was one.

Did EMSAT put the cart before the horse by not having the membership first?

Again take this with a grain of salt it's not intended as an insult or even

a challenge. It's just my way of answering your post. I'm sitting here now

looking at my checkbook. Do I put it away or get to writing? These are my

thoughts and I hope they help.

Larry Feagin EMT-P

Waxahachie, Tx

> Folks,

>

> In the last several days we have been involved in an interesting

dialog

> about EMS pay and related subjects.

>

> Many have posted interesting and insightful thoughts about where

we're

> going, why our pay is in the toilet, the various paradigms and

models for running

> EMS services, pros and cons of pure SSM, partial SSM, hybrid SSM,

and no SSM.

> Educational requirements for EMS people, what we should call

them, and a

> myriad of other bitches and moans about our chosen profession.

>

> I asked that people join EMSAT, the one organization that looks

out for the

> interests of all first responders, ECAs, EMTs, EMT-Is, Certified

Paramedics,

> and Licensed Paramedics.

>

> I asked that 10 people join before the end of the day.

>

> We had ONE (1) person join.

>

> Friends, why whine? Why complain? Why bother to write about

the evils and

> ills besetting EMS in Texas when you won't join the only

organization that

> is dedicated to your welfare?

>

> I'm wondering why EMSAT is even trying to exist. We obviously do

not have

> the support and trust of the EMS community. We cannot be a

viable force for

> change if we do not have the support of the majority of certified

and licensed

> EMS personnel.

>

> There are over 50,000 of you. Yet, we have less than 1% of you

as members.

> What do you think that says to us who are busting our butts to

represent

> you, spending our own money on trips to Austin, hotel rooms,

meals, gasoline,

> and you won't spend $35 to join us and become a part of our

team?

>

> What do you think it says to a member of the Texas Legislature

when they

> find out that we have so few members?

>

> I hear so much crying and whining about our plight. I want to do

something

> about it. But I and the other people at EMSAT need your help.

We exist for

> YOU. Not for us. If you don't support us by joining, we cannot

do much to

> help.

>

> Once again I issue the challenge. Put up or shut up. Join or

stop whining

> about the problems with EMS.

>

> Without members, we're a paper tiger. We need to be a roaring

lion. We

> could be if just 1% of the certified/licensed EMS people in Texas

would join.

>

> What's your excuse?

>

> You can join at _www.emsatoftx.org_ (http://www.emsatoftx.org) .

>

> Gene Gandy, JD, LP

> Vice-President

> EMSAT

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Larry,

I read your post and AGREE totally, but it's time... know what I mean. I did

the very same thing you did and I finally " wrote the check " . We don't know each

other and maybe we will never meet but I need your help just as if we were

working a call together. I, we, need you and others like you. Go ahead brother

write the check, ask the questions, lead and follow, cover my back... it's time

Lonnie

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

Gene,

Welcome to Texas, where unions or labor associations have traditionally

failed. Not because of any need for them but because of the way they present

themselves. Instead of telling me what I can do for EMSAT, how about telling

me what you are doing for me? Not what you want to or intend to do.

There has been a dozen times I've pulled out the checkbook to join but

never did for several reasons. These are my thoughts and not intended to

represent anyone else.

1) I can't remember ever seeing a request for members that didn't include

the price of membership. Yes, it is a reasonable fee, but it makes me wonder

if all EMSAT is after is the fee.

2) EMSAT claims to represent all of EMS. How do you do that I've never seen

you ask questions or do polls of EMS workers or is it only done with

members?

3) Trust is something earned, have you? How? We as a group are gun shy when

it comes to trust. Trust me says the city manager...

4) You say EMSAT doesn't have the support of the majority, hmmm you should

be wondering why not? That just gives me more doubts.

5) EMSAT claims to be representing me in Austin and spending its own money.

Ok how about posting an itinerary so I know when, where, how and who?

6) " Put up or shut up " only makes me worried about EMSAT's ego. Are we

supposed to believe you are our one and only hope? Instead of banging your

chest and growling try convincing me that EMSAT is a true and worthy entity.

7) The EMSAT webpage is nice but tells me little about EMSAT's involvement

in EMS other than what they have already done. I'd like to know more about

what EMSAT is working on or looking into.

Everything is writen in a positive professional way but has a sterile feel

to me.

8) In order for me to make an informative decision I need all the info. Has

EMSAT given me everything I need to know?

Gene, personally there is nothing I would want to see more in EMS than a

strong organization that would represent me and my brothers n sisters. So,

my question to EMSAT is " why whine, why complain, " get out and do a grass

roots membership drive. I'd attend a town hall meeting, if there was one.

Did EMSAT put the cart before the horse by not having the membership first?

Again take this with a grain of salt it's not intended as an insult or even

a challenge. It's just my way of answering your post. I'm sitting here now

looking at my checkbook. Do I put it away or get to writing? These are my

thoughts and I hope they help.

Larry Feagin EMT-P

Waxahachie, Tx

> Folks,

>

> In the last several days we have been involved in an interesting

dialog

> about EMS pay and related subjects.

>

> Many have posted interesting and insightful thoughts about where

we're

> going, why our pay is in the toilet, the various paradigms and

models for running

> EMS services, pros and cons of pure SSM, partial SSM, hybrid SSM,

and no SSM.

> Educational requirements for EMS people, what we should call

them, and a

> myriad of other bitches and moans about our chosen profession.

>

> I asked that people join EMSAT, the one organization that looks

out for the

> interests of all first responders, ECAs, EMTs, EMT-Is, Certified

Paramedics,

> and Licensed Paramedics.

>

> I asked that 10 people join before the end of the day.

>

> We had ONE (1) person join.

>

> Friends, why whine? Why complain? Why bother to write about

the evils and

> ills besetting EMS in Texas when you won't join the only

organization that

> is dedicated to your welfare?

>

> I'm wondering why EMSAT is even trying to exist. We obviously do

not have

> the support and trust of the EMS community. We cannot be a

viable force for

> change if we do not have the support of the majority of certified

and licensed

> EMS personnel.

>

> There are over 50,000 of you. Yet, we have less than 1% of you

as members.

> What do you think that says to us who are busting our butts to

represent

> you, spending our own money on trips to Austin, hotel rooms,

meals, gasoline,

> and you won't spend $35 to join us and become a part of our

team?

>

> What do you think it says to a member of the Texas Legislature

when they

> find out that we have so few members?

>

> I hear so much crying and whining about our plight. I want to do

something

> about it. But I and the other people at EMSAT need your help.

We exist for

> YOU. Not for us. If you don't support us by joining, we cannot

do much to

> help.

>

> Once again I issue the challenge. Put up or shut up. Join or

stop whining

> about the problems with EMS.

>

> Without members, we're a paper tiger. We need to be a roaring

lion. We

> could be if just 1% of the certified/licensed EMS people in Texas

would join.

>

> What's your excuse?

>

> You can join at _www.emsatoftx.org_ (http://www.emsatoftx.org) .

>

> Gene Gandy, JD, LP

> Vice-President

> EMSAT

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Larry,

I read your post and AGREE totally, but it's time... know what I mean. I did

the very same thing you did and I finally " wrote the check " . We don't know each

other and maybe we will never meet but I need your help just as if we were

working a call together. I, we, need you and others like you. Go ahead brother

write the check, ask the questions, lead and follow, cover my back... it's time

Lonnie

Re: Musings about the future of EMS

Gene,

Welcome to Texas, where unions or labor associations have traditionally

failed. Not because of any need for them but because of the way they present

themselves. Instead of telling me what I can do for EMSAT, how about telling

me what you are doing for me? Not what you want to or intend to do.

There has been a dozen times I've pulled out the checkbook to join but

never did for several reasons. These are my thoughts and not intended to

represent anyone else.

1) I can't remember ever seeing a request for members that didn't include

the price of membership. Yes, it is a reasonable fee, but it makes me wonder

if all EMSAT is after is the fee.

2) EMSAT claims to represent all of EMS. How do you do that I've never seen

you ask questions or do polls of EMS workers or is it only done with

members?

3) Trust is something earned, have you? How? We as a group are gun shy when

it comes to trust. Trust me says the city manager...

4) You say EMSAT doesn't have the support of the majority, hmmm you should

be wondering why not? That just gives me more doubts.

5) EMSAT claims to be representing me in Austin and spending its own money.

Ok how about posting an itinerary so I know when, where, how and who?

6) " Put up or shut up " only makes me worried about EMSAT's ego. Are we

supposed to believe you are our one and only hope? Instead of banging your

chest and growling try convincing me that EMSAT is a true and worthy entity.

7) The EMSAT webpage is nice but tells me little about EMSAT's involvement

in EMS other than what they have already done. I'd like to know more about

what EMSAT is working on or looking into.

Everything is writen in a positive professional way but has a sterile feel

to me.

8) In order for me to make an informative decision I need all the info. Has

EMSAT given me everything I need to know?

Gene, personally there is nothing I would want to see more in EMS than a

strong organization that would represent me and my brothers n sisters. So,

my question to EMSAT is " why whine, why complain, " get out and do a grass

roots membership drive. I'd attend a town hall meeting, if there was one.

Did EMSAT put the cart before the horse by not having the membership first?

Again take this with a grain of salt it's not intended as an insult or even

a challenge. It's just my way of answering your post. I'm sitting here now

looking at my checkbook. Do I put it away or get to writing? These are my

thoughts and I hope they help.

Larry Feagin EMT-P

Waxahachie, Tx

> Folks,

>

> In the last several days we have been involved in an interesting

dialog

> about EMS pay and related subjects.

>

> Many have posted interesting and insightful thoughts about where

we're

> going, why our pay is in the toilet, the various paradigms and

models for running

> EMS services, pros and cons of pure SSM, partial SSM, hybrid SSM,

and no SSM.

> Educational requirements for EMS people, what we should call

them, and a

> myriad of other bitches and moans about our chosen profession.

>

> I asked that people join EMSAT, the one organization that looks

out for the

> interests of all first responders, ECAs, EMTs, EMT-Is, Certified

Paramedics,

> and Licensed Paramedics.

>

> I asked that 10 people join before the end of the day.

>

> We had ONE (1) person join.

>

> Friends, why whine? Why complain? Why bother to write about

the evils and

> ills besetting EMS in Texas when you won't join the only

organization that

> is dedicated to your welfare?

>

> I'm wondering why EMSAT is even trying to exist. We obviously do

not have

> the support and trust of the EMS community. We cannot be a

viable force for

> change if we do not have the support of the majority of certified

and licensed

> EMS personnel.

>

> There are over 50,000 of you. Yet, we have less than 1% of you

as members.

> What do you think that says to us who are busting our butts to

represent

> you, spending our own money on trips to Austin, hotel rooms,

meals, gasoline,

> and you won't spend $35 to join us and become a part of our

team?

>

> What do you think it says to a member of the Texas Legislature

when they

> find out that we have so few members?

>

> I hear so much crying and whining about our plight. I want to do

something

> about it. But I and the other people at EMSAT need your help.

We exist for

> YOU. Not for us. If you don't support us by joining, we cannot

do much to

> help.

>

> Once again I issue the challenge. Put up or shut up. Join or

stop whining

> about the problems with EMS.

>

> Without members, we're a paper tiger. We need to be a roaring

lion. We

> could be if just 1% of the certified/licensed EMS people in Texas

would join.

>

> What's your excuse?

>

> You can join at _www.emsatoftx.org_ (http://www.emsatoftx.org) .

>

> Gene Gandy, JD, LP

> Vice-President

> EMSAT

>

>

>