Re: Alcoholism is NOTHING like diabetes (of special interest to Pete)

[Guest guest]

Hi Rita

The alcoholism=diabetes thing really does makes no sense. As you

wrtie, most diabetes is acquried where the disease ppl claim

alcoholism is inherited. Ironically the analogy might be closer in

that most alcoholism is acquired!

P.

>

>

> It used to totally piss me off in treatment whenever the

imbecile counselors used to say " Alcoholism is a disease very similar

to diabetes " -- I have lost several family members to complications

from diabetes and it is a REAL disease, absolutely nothing like

problem drinking! (Diabetes is not caused by eating too much sugar,

and blood sugar levels in diabetics can fluctuate tremendously, with

damaging results, regardless of avoiding sugar and following diet and

medication protocols. OTOH blood alcohol levels cannot ever rise

above zero, or near-zero, without the individual ingesting alcohol!)

>

> Anyway, for anyone interested, here is a brief summary of the

latest research discovery on diabetes, with a link to a longer version

at the bottom. When and if scientists ever find a hormone or other

biological marker that makes blood alcohol levels rise without the

conscious participation of the patient, maybe I'll start considering

the " alcoholism is a disease " idea.

>

> ~Rita

>

> *** Hormone may be key to diabetes

>

> (AP) - Scientists have discovered a hormone that may explain the

link between diabetes and obesity - a tantalizing finding that could

someday lead to new treatments for the disease. The hormone, dubbed

resistin, is produced by fat cells and prompts tissues to resist

insulin, the substance the body needs to process blood sugar,

researchers said. Diabetics produce too little insulin or cannot use

it efficiently. Obesity is one of the biggest risk factors for Type

II, or adult-onset, diabetes. The adult-onset form of the disease

accounts for more than 90% of all cases of diabetes. The University of

Pennsylvania scientists identified resistin in mice and found genetic

evidence that the same hormone exists in humans, though they have yet

to isolate it. Mice given resistin were not able to process blood

sugar as well as those that were not given the hormone. And mice given

a drug that lowers resistin levels were better able to process blood

sugar and use insulin.

>

> Full article at:

>

> http://www.infobeat.com/fullArticle?article=405870020

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------

> --== Sent via Deja.com ==--

> http://www.deja.com/

[Guest guest]

I should add that, rereading my post, I don't think the blanket grouper

argument that people spouting nonsense are a small minority doesn't hold true

with something like this. Combine a destructive substance user with a

coercive healing program that clearly promotes self-servingness and fear of

relapse-the result is the kind of grouper statements that I quoted.

[Guest guest]

Good God,

The excesses of these ppl knows no bounds. As it is, the

non-availability of opiates as a form of treatment as a result of the

drug war is a tragedy as great as addiction and the drug war itself...

P.

> One thing that drove me up the wall in AA was their insensitivity

towards

> anyone with any serious disease, and that diabetes line that seems

to be

> everywhere spells this out. The first meetings I went to were right

after my

> father died, and somewhere along the line I let it slip that he had

died of

> cancer and had (obviously) been on potent pain medication right

before he

> died. The response I got was almost always something like " your

father must

> have been an addict, only addicts take that kind of stuff, how

horrible it

> was that he enabled you with those drugs in the house " . Sometimes

the person

> would start asking the specifics of the pills, get excited, start

laughing,

> etc.

>

> " Recovery " message boards all over the net have ardent groupers who

spell out

> this crap in a different way. They spend a lot of time talking

about how

> EVIL medication is (not just " cunning, baffling, and powerful " ), how

evil and

> deceptive the pharmaceutical companies are, and how the government

needs to

> step in (after putting all these helpless victims in expensive

rehabs at

> taxpayers expense) and ban morphine et al. from any use whatsoever.

Because

> THEY got addicted to it, noone should be able to take it legally,

and then

> THEY would rule out the medical profession as a source to get drugs

from.

> Screw anyone who legitimately needs the stuff, they must be addicts.

Perhaps

> throw the doctor in jail too, or at least label him a sick and

sadonistic

> creature for ever believing that the " alkie " was really in pain.

Never have

> I heard someone say that, perhaps, it was wrong for them to lie and

> manipulate people in order to get drugs.

[Guest guest]

Good God,

The excesses of these ppl knows no bounds. As it is, the

non-availability of opiates as a form of treatment as a result of the

drug war is a tragedy as great as addiction and the drug war itself...

P.

> One thing that drove me up the wall in AA was their insensitivity

towards

> anyone with any serious disease, and that diabetes line that seems

to be

> everywhere spells this out. The first meetings I went to were right

after my

> father died, and somewhere along the line I let it slip that he had

died of

> cancer and had (obviously) been on potent pain medication right

before he

> died. The response I got was almost always something like " your

father must

> have been an addict, only addicts take that kind of stuff, how

horrible it

> was that he enabled you with those drugs in the house " . Sometimes

the person

> would start asking the specifics of the pills, get excited, start

laughing,

> etc.

>

> " Recovery " message boards all over the net have ardent groupers who

spell out

> this crap in a different way. They spend a lot of time talking

about how

> EVIL medication is (not just " cunning, baffling, and powerful " ), how

evil and

> deceptive the pharmaceutical companies are, and how the government

needs to

> step in (after putting all these helpless victims in expensive

rehabs at

> taxpayers expense) and ban morphine et al. from any use whatsoever.

Because

> THEY got addicted to it, noone should be able to take it legally,

and then

> THEY would rule out the medical profession as a source to get drugs

from.

> Screw anyone who legitimately needs the stuff, they must be addicts.

Perhaps

> throw the doctor in jail too, or at least label him a sick and

sadonistic

> creature for ever believing that the " alkie " was really in pain.

Never have

> I heard someone say that, perhaps, it was wrong for them to lie and

> manipulate people in order to get drugs.

[Guest guest]

> I have seen on various TV shows on people who are in chronic pain

> because of illness. Morphine does not get them " high " because there

is

> existing pain. It eliminates the pain. In the absence of pain,

> morphine gives a high. I know morphine was given to soldiers in

combat

> to use in case of being seriously wounded. Seems very sensible to

me.

Hi Apple

Sometimes morphine doesnt even give a high even when youre not in

pain. Drug effects are often surprisingly individualistic and

conditioned by social expectation and einforcement. Opiates can

produce nausea initially; you have to learn to like them!

P.

[Guest guest]

It is not so much than morpine given for pain does not cause a high

(not sure whether this is true, or all that bad if it were true),

rather it does not cause addictive behavior.

Even the recreational use of heroin by US soldiers in Vietnam was not

associated with much addictive behavior when the returned home.

> > I have seen on various TV shows on people who are in chronic pain

> > because of illness. Morphine does not get them " high " because

there

> is

> > existing pain. It eliminates the pain. In the absence of pain,

> > morphine gives a high. I know morphine was given to soldiers in

> combat

> > to use in case of being seriously wounded. Seems very sensible to

> me.

>

[Guest guest]

It is not so much than morpine given for pain does not cause a high

(not sure whether this is true, or all that bad if it were true),

rather it does not cause addictive behavior.

Even the recreational use of heroin by US soldiers in Vietnam was not

associated with much addictive behavior when the returned home.

> > I have seen on various TV shows on people who are in chronic pain

> > because of illness. Morphine does not get them " high " because

there

> is

> > existing pain. It eliminates the pain. In the absence of pain,

> > morphine gives a high. I know morphine was given to soldiers in

> combat

> > to use in case of being seriously wounded. Seems very sensible to

> me.

>

[Guest guest]

It is not so much than morpine given for pain does not cause a high

(not sure whether this is true, or all that bad if it were true),

rather it does not cause addictive behavior.

Even the recreational use of heroin by US soldiers in Vietnam was not

associated with much addictive behavior when the returned home.

> > I have seen on various TV shows on people who are in chronic pain

> > because of illness. Morphine does not get them " high " because

there

> is

> > existing pain. It eliminates the pain. In the absence of pain,

> > morphine gives a high. I know morphine was given to soldiers in

> combat

> > to use in case of being seriously wounded. Seems very sensible to

> me.

>