Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Larry, Camera companies and automobile manufacturers are by their very nature for profit endeavors. They have great ability to affect the marketability of their products (new and innovative designs, safety equipment, and creature comforts). They can refuse to sell you a product if you can’t (or won’t) pay their asking price. They do not have to have approval from an insurance company, HMO, PPO, or Medicare to set their pricing. They are not forced to provide an expensive service to every customer that walks on the showroom floor. You are comparing apples and oranges my friend, Tater Larry wrote: Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong for-profit corporations? Nuf said, Larry > >> All employees and medical directors were given the opportunity to purchase >> stock at very favorable terms several months ago in anticipation of the >> company going public. I hope everyone took advantage of this generous >> offer. >> >> The entire company will be owned by the shareholders as a result of the >> public offering. > > While this is technically true, look at the division of voting rights > amongst the classes of shareholders, and how much of the actual > control is being given up to stockholders. Not that this isn't common > - and not that it's nefarious or any other such thing... but the > simple fact is that the offering is designed to raise money without > giving up any substantial control of the company. Thus, even if > employees owned ALL of the Class A stock, they'd still only have 2.3 > percent or so of voting power, so " employee owned " doesn't mean > anything for employees actually being able to exercise influence or > control. > > Buyer beware. And, taxpayer beware. If you contract with AMR/EMCare, > you're contracting with someone whose first and foremost dedication > will be to profit and stockholder value, NOT what's best for your > community. AMR/EMCare *WILL NOT* stay in unprofitable areas without > cutting service levels to the point that profit can be made, or > they'll pull out like AMR and many other private EMS organizations > have done in the past. I'm not saying anything about ethics, or that > being unethical - in fact, I'd venture to say that EMCare running AMR > makes them significantly less likely to make poor medical decisions... > but they'll have to choose profit over providing continuing care each > and every time. > > Mike :/ > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Corporations exist for only one purpose, to return value to the shareholder. Corporations are obliged to maximize profit because the investor has the expectation that they will receive a return on their investment and they have ability to scrutinize the mechanics of how the corporation returns this dividend to the shareholder. Shareholders are not normally inclined to be concerned with patient care so what happens is that corporations minimize costs by staffing the fewest possible trucks to get the job done while staying in compliance. Corporate EMS wants the 18 to 21 year old employee base because they demand less pay and will work long hours while posting in BFE without complaint. Unfortunately, by the time this age group gets enough experience to truly good at what they do and decide that they are being mistreated for profit, they have enrolled in a EMT-P to RN bridge course and they exit the field for a better paying job. Re: Re: AMR to go public Larry, Camera companies and automobile manufacturers are by their very nature for profit endeavors. They have great ability to affect the marketability of their products (new and innovative designs, safety equipment, and creature comforts). They can refuse to sell you a product if you can’t (or won’t) pay their asking price. They do not have to have approval from an insurance company, HMO, PPO, or Medicare to set their pricing. They are not forced to provide an expensive service to every customer that walks on the showroom floor. You are comparing apples and Larry wrote: Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong for-profit corporations? Nuf said, Larry > >> All employees and medical directors were given the opportunity to purchase >> stock at very favorable terms several months ago in anticipation of the >> company going public. I hope everyone took advantage of this generous >> offer. >> >> The entire company will be owned by the shareholders as a result of the >> public offering. > > While this is technically true, look at the division of voting rights > amongst the classes of shareholders, and how much of the actual > control is being given up to stockholders. Not that this isn't common > - and not that it's nefarious or any other such thing... but the > simple fact is that the offering is designed to raise money without > giving up any substantial control of the company. Thus, even if > employees owned ALL of the Class A stock, they'd still only have 2.3 > percent or so of voting power, so " employee owned " doesn't mean > anything for employees actually being able to exercise influence or > control. > > Buyer beware. And, taxpayer beware. If you contract with AMR/EMCare, > you're contracting with someone whose first and foremost dedication > will be to profit and stockholder value, NOT what's best for your > community. AMR/EMCare *WILL NOT* stay in unprofitable areas without > cutting service levels to the point that profit can be made, or > they'll pull out like AMR and many other private EMS organizations > have done in the past. I'm not saying anything about ethics, or that > being unethical - in fact, I'd venture to say that EMCare running AMR > makes them significantly less likely to make poor medical decisions... > but they'll have to choose profit over providing continuing care each > and every time. > > Mike :/ > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Corporations exist for only one purpose, to return value to the shareholder. Corporations are obliged to maximize profit because the investor has the expectation that they will receive a return on their investment and they have ability to scrutinize the mechanics of how the corporation returns this dividend to the shareholder. Shareholders are not normally inclined to be concerned with patient care so what happens is that corporations minimize costs by staffing the fewest possible trucks to get the job done while staying in compliance. Corporate EMS wants the 18 to 21 year old employee base because they demand less pay and will work long hours while posting in BFE without complaint. Unfortunately, by the time this age group gets enough experience to truly good at what they do and decide that they are being mistreated for profit, they have enrolled in a EMT-P to RN bridge course and they exit the field for a better paying job. Re: Re: AMR to go public Larry, Camera companies and automobile manufacturers are by their very nature for profit endeavors. They have great ability to affect the marketability of their products (new and innovative designs, safety equipment, and creature comforts). They can refuse to sell you a product if you can’t (or won’t) pay their asking price. They do not have to have approval from an insurance company, HMO, PPO, or Medicare to set their pricing. They are not forced to provide an expensive service to every customer that walks on the showroom floor. You are comparing apples and Larry wrote: Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong for-profit corporations? Nuf said, Larry > >> All employees and medical directors were given the opportunity to purchase >> stock at very favorable terms several months ago in anticipation of the >> company going public. I hope everyone took advantage of this generous >> offer. >> >> The entire company will be owned by the shareholders as a result of the >> public offering. > > While this is technically true, look at the division of voting rights > amongst the classes of shareholders, and how much of the actual > control is being given up to stockholders. Not that this isn't common > - and not that it's nefarious or any other such thing... but the > simple fact is that the offering is designed to raise money without > giving up any substantial control of the company. Thus, even if > employees owned ALL of the Class A stock, they'd still only have 2.3 > percent or so of voting power, so " employee owned " doesn't mean > anything for employees actually being able to exercise influence or > control. > > Buyer beware. And, taxpayer beware. If you contract with AMR/EMCare, > you're contracting with someone whose first and foremost dedication > will be to profit and stockholder value, NOT what's best for your > community. AMR/EMCare *WILL NOT* stay in unprofitable areas without > cutting service levels to the point that profit can be made, or > they'll pull out like AMR and many other private EMS organizations > have done in the past. I'm not saying anything about ethics, or that > being unethical - in fact, I'd venture to say that EMCare running AMR > makes them significantly less likely to make poor medical decisions... > but they'll have to choose profit over providing continuing care each > and every time. > > Mike :/ > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Corporations exist for only one purpose, to return value to the shareholder. Corporations are obliged to maximize profit because the investor has the expectation that they will receive a return on their investment and they have ability to scrutinize the mechanics of how the corporation returns this dividend to the shareholder. Shareholders are not normally inclined to be concerned with patient care so what happens is that corporations minimize costs by staffing the fewest possible trucks to get the job done while staying in compliance. Corporate EMS wants the 18 to 21 year old employee base because they demand less pay and will work long hours while posting in BFE without complaint. Unfortunately, by the time this age group gets enough experience to truly good at what they do and decide that they are being mistreated for profit, they have enrolled in a EMT-P to RN bridge course and they exit the field for a better paying job. Re: Re: AMR to go public Larry, Camera companies and automobile manufacturers are by their very nature for profit endeavors. They have great ability to affect the marketability of their products (new and innovative designs, safety equipment, and creature comforts). They can refuse to sell you a product if you can’t (or won’t) pay their asking price. They do not have to have approval from an insurance company, HMO, PPO, or Medicare to set their pricing. They are not forced to provide an expensive service to every customer that walks on the showroom floor. You are comparing apples and Larry wrote: Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong for-profit corporations? Nuf said, Larry > >> All employees and medical directors were given the opportunity to purchase >> stock at very favorable terms several months ago in anticipation of the >> company going public. I hope everyone took advantage of this generous >> offer. >> >> The entire company will be owned by the shareholders as a result of the >> public offering. > > While this is technically true, look at the division of voting rights > amongst the classes of shareholders, and how much of the actual > control is being given up to stockholders. Not that this isn't common > - and not that it's nefarious or any other such thing... but the > simple fact is that the offering is designed to raise money without > giving up any substantial control of the company. Thus, even if > employees owned ALL of the Class A stock, they'd still only have 2.3 > percent or so of voting power, so " employee owned " doesn't mean > anything for employees actually being able to exercise influence or > control. > > Buyer beware. And, taxpayer beware. If you contract with AMR/EMCare, > you're contracting with someone whose first and foremost dedication > will be to profit and stockholder value, NOT what's best for your > community. AMR/EMCare *WILL NOT* stay in unprofitable areas without > cutting service levels to the point that profit can be made, or > they'll pull out like AMR and many other private EMS organizations > have done in the past. I'm not saying anything about ethics, or that > being unethical - in fact, I'd venture to say that EMCare running AMR > makes them significantly less likely to make poor medical decisions... > but they'll have to choose profit over providing continuing care each > and every time. > > Mike :/ > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Odd...I guess folks never leave the municipal environment for bettering themselves...hmmmm...didn't realize that those last 3 or 4 employees I lost to PA, Medical and RN school actually working for a private company....hmmmmm Dudley PS: Being mistreated for profit??? If you check out your best, long-term profitable EMS agencies (including government agencies that don't bleed red ink annually...although we don't call that " profit " ) you will see that they treat their employees better than just about anyone else...because you cannot mistreat employees and expect to make a profit...hmmmm...seems I should write a book... Re: Re: AMR to go public Larry, Camera companies and automobile manufacturers are by their very nature for profit endeavors. They have great ability to affect the marketability of their products (new and innovative designs, safety equipment, and creature comforts). They can refuse to sell you a product if you can?t (or won?t) pay their asking price. They do not have to have approval from an insurance company, HMO, PPO, or Medicare to set their pricing. They are not forced to provide an expensive service to every customer that walks on the showroom floor. You are comparing apples and Larry wrote: Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong for-profit corporations? Nuf said, Larry > >> All employees and medical directors were given the opportunity to purchase >> stock at very favorable terms several months ago in anticipation of the >> company going public. I hope everyone took advantage of this generous >> offer. >> >> The entire company will be owned by the shareholders as a result of the >> public offering. > > While this is technically true, look at the division of voting rights > amongst the classes of shareholders, and how much of the actual > control is being given up to stockholders. Not that this isn't common > - and not that it's nefarious or any other such thing... but the > simple fact is that the offering is designed to raise money without > giving up any substantial control of the company. Thus, even if > employees owned ALL of the Class A stock, they'd still only have 2.3 > percent or so of voting power, so " employee owned " doesn't mean > anything for employees actually being able to exercise influence or > control. > > Buyer beware. And, taxpayer beware. If you contract with AMR/EMCare, > you're contracting with someone whose first and foremost dedication > will be to profit and stockholder value, NOT what's best for your > community. AMR/EMCare *WILL NOT* stay in unprofitable areas without > cutting service levels to the point that profit can be made, or > they'll pull out like AMR and many other private EMS organizations > have done in the past. I'm not saying anything about ethics, or that > being unethical - in fact, I'd venture to say that EMCare running AMR > makes them significantly less likely to make poor medical decisions... > but they'll have to choose profit over providing continuing care each > and every time. > > Mike :/ > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Odd...I guess folks never leave the municipal environment for bettering themselves...hmmmm...didn't realize that those last 3 or 4 employees I lost to PA, Medical and RN school actually working for a private company....hmmmmm Dudley PS: Being mistreated for profit??? If you check out your best, long-term profitable EMS agencies (including government agencies that don't bleed red ink annually...although we don't call that " profit " ) you will see that they treat their employees better than just about anyone else...because you cannot mistreat employees and expect to make a profit...hmmmm...seems I should write a book... Re: Re: AMR to go public Larry, Camera companies and automobile manufacturers are by their very nature for profit endeavors. They have great ability to affect the marketability of their products (new and innovative designs, safety equipment, and creature comforts). They can refuse to sell you a product if you can?t (or won?t) pay their asking price. They do not have to have approval from an insurance company, HMO, PPO, or Medicare to set their pricing. They are not forced to provide an expensive service to every customer that walks on the showroom floor. You are comparing apples and Larry wrote: Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong for-profit corporations? Nuf said, Larry > >> All employees and medical directors were given the opportunity to purchase >> stock at very favorable terms several months ago in anticipation of the >> company going public. I hope everyone took advantage of this generous >> offer. >> >> The entire company will be owned by the shareholders as a result of the >> public offering. > > While this is technically true, look at the division of voting rights > amongst the classes of shareholders, and how much of the actual > control is being given up to stockholders. Not that this isn't common > - and not that it's nefarious or any other such thing... but the > simple fact is that the offering is designed to raise money without > giving up any substantial control of the company. Thus, even if > employees owned ALL of the Class A stock, they'd still only have 2.3 > percent or so of voting power, so " employee owned " doesn't mean > anything for employees actually being able to exercise influence or > control. > > Buyer beware. And, taxpayer beware. If you contract with AMR/EMCare, > you're contracting with someone whose first and foremost dedication > will be to profit and stockholder value, NOT what's best for your > community. AMR/EMCare *WILL NOT* stay in unprofitable areas without > cutting service levels to the point that profit can be made, or > they'll pull out like AMR and many other private EMS organizations > have done in the past. I'm not saying anything about ethics, or that > being unethical - in fact, I'd venture to say that EMCare running AMR > makes them significantly less likely to make poor medical decisions... > but they'll have to choose profit over providing continuing care each > and every time. > > Mike :/ > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Odd...I guess folks never leave the municipal environment for bettering themselves...hmmmm...didn't realize that those last 3 or 4 employees I lost to PA, Medical and RN school actually working for a private company....hmmmmm Dudley PS: Being mistreated for profit??? If you check out your best, long-term profitable EMS agencies (including government agencies that don't bleed red ink annually...although we don't call that " profit " ) you will see that they treat their employees better than just about anyone else...because you cannot mistreat employees and expect to make a profit...hmmmm...seems I should write a book... Re: Re: AMR to go public Larry, Camera companies and automobile manufacturers are by their very nature for profit endeavors. They have great ability to affect the marketability of their products (new and innovative designs, safety equipment, and creature comforts). They can refuse to sell you a product if you can?t (or won?t) pay their asking price. They do not have to have approval from an insurance company, HMO, PPO, or Medicare to set their pricing. They are not forced to provide an expensive service to every customer that walks on the showroom floor. You are comparing apples and Larry wrote: Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong for-profit corporations? Nuf said, Larry > >> All employees and medical directors were given the opportunity to purchase >> stock at very favorable terms several months ago in anticipation of the >> company going public. I hope everyone took advantage of this generous >> offer. >> >> The entire company will be owned by the shareholders as a result of the >> public offering. > > While this is technically true, look at the division of voting rights > amongst the classes of shareholders, and how much of the actual > control is being given up to stockholders. Not that this isn't common > - and not that it's nefarious or any other such thing... but the > simple fact is that the offering is designed to raise money without > giving up any substantial control of the company. Thus, even if > employees owned ALL of the Class A stock, they'd still only have 2.3 > percent or so of voting power, so " employee owned " doesn't mean > anything for employees actually being able to exercise influence or > control. > > Buyer beware. And, taxpayer beware. If you contract with AMR/EMCare, > you're contracting with someone whose first and foremost dedication > will be to profit and stockholder value, NOT what's best for your > community. AMR/EMCare *WILL NOT* stay in unprofitable areas without > cutting service levels to the point that profit can be made, or > they'll pull out like AMR and many other private EMS organizations > have done in the past. I'm not saying anything about ethics, or that > being unethical - in fact, I'd venture to say that EMCare running AMR > makes them significantly less likely to make poor medical decisions... > but they'll have to choose profit over providing continuing care each > and every time. > > Mike :/ > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we pick that time out of the air. Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... Dudley Re: Re: AMR to go public Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of consumers that have the ability to purchase it. Apples and Oranges. Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and playing catchup to provide service that they should have been providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private provider's intentions were all along. Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government run. Mike > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong > for-profit corporations? > > Nuf said, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we pick that time out of the air. Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... Dudley Re: Re: AMR to go public Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of consumers that have the ability to purchase it. Apples and Oranges. Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and playing catchup to provide service that they should have been providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private provider's intentions were all along. Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government run. Mike > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong > for-profit corporations? > > Nuf said, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we pick that time out of the air. Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... Dudley Re: Re: AMR to go public Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of consumers that have the ability to purchase it. Apples and Oranges. Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and playing catchup to provide service that they should have been providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private provider's intentions were all along. Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government run. Mike > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong > for-profit corporations? > > Nuf said, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Careful...your SSM is showing... _____ From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of THEDUDMAN@... Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 5:41 PM To: Subject: Re: Re: AMR to go public 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we pick that time out of the air. Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... Dudley Re: Re: AMR to go public Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of consumers that have the ability to purchase it. Apples and Oranges. Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and playing catchup to provide service that they should have been providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private provider's intentions were all along. Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government run. Mike > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong > for-profit corporations? > > Nuf said, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Careful...your SSM is showing... _____ From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of THEDUDMAN@... Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 5:41 PM To: Subject: Re: Re: AMR to go public 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we pick that time out of the air. Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... Dudley Re: Re: AMR to go public Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of consumers that have the ability to purchase it. Apples and Oranges. Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and playing catchup to provide service that they should have been providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private provider's intentions were all along. Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government run. Mike > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong > for-profit corporations? > > Nuf said, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Careful...your SSM is showing... _____ From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of THEDUDMAN@... Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 5:41 PM To: Subject: Re: Re: AMR to go public 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we pick that time out of the air. Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... Dudley Re: Re: AMR to go public Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of consumers that have the ability to purchase it. Apples and Oranges. Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and playing catchup to provide service that they should have been providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private provider's intentions were all along. Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government run. Mike > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong > for-profit corporations? > > Nuf said, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Depends. Best trauma care? Or best ancillary services (those things that aren't NEEDED, but are WANTED)? Mike > 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we pick that time out of the air. > > Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... > > > > Dudley > > Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company > part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do > transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " > EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to > purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. > > 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not > predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make > a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. > > As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - > they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and > operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists > price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products > to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as > to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt > themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long > for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot > less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of > consumers that have the ability to purchase it. > > Apples and Oranges. > > Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and > generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a > for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to > make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will > have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we > usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have > been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and > playing catchup to provide service that they should have been > providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to > someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private > provider's intentions were all along. > > Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why > it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government > run. > > Mike > > > > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, > > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong > > for-profit corporations? > > > > Nuf said, > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Depends. Best trauma care? Or best ancillary services (those things that aren't NEEDED, but are WANTED)? Mike > 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we pick that time out of the air. > > Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... > > > > Dudley > > Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company > part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do > transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " > EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to > purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. > > 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not > predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make > a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. > > As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - > they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and > operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists > price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products > to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as > to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt > themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long > for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot > less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of > consumers that have the ability to purchase it. > > Apples and Oranges. > > Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and > generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a > for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to > make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will > have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we > usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have > been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and > playing catchup to provide service that they should have been > providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to > someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private > provider's intentions were all along. > > Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why > it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government > run. > > Mike > > > > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, > > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong > > for-profit corporations? > > > > Nuf said, > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Depends. Best trauma care? Or best ancillary services (those things that aren't NEEDED, but are WANTED)? Mike > 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we pick that time out of the air. > > Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... > > > > Dudley > > Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company > part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do > transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " > EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to > purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. > > 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not > predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make > a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. > > As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - > they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and > operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists > price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products > to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as > to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt > themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long > for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot > less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of > consumers that have the ability to purchase it. > > Apples and Oranges. > > Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and > generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a > for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to > make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will > have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we > usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have > been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and > playing catchup to provide service that they should have been > providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to > someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private > provider's intentions were all along. > > Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why > it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government > run. > > Mike > > > > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies (Honda, > > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by strong > > for-profit corporations? > > > > Nuf said, > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 > 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we pick that time out of the air. M> Guarantee me that those trucks get the calls you expect. I've slept through many a friday night only to run my ass off on a wednesday evening instead. It's gambling. If you play anything other than averages (average call volume, average call load, etc.) then you might as well toss darts. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 > 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we pick that time out of the air. M> Guarantee me that those trucks get the calls you expect. I've slept through many a friday night only to run my ass off on a wednesday evening instead. It's gambling. If you play anything other than averages (average call volume, average call load, etc.) then you might as well toss darts. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Private corporations run more profitable hospitals hands down, however, profitable does not always equate to quality care. Healthcare used to be a service, not a business. We lost something when that changed. That said, I would still seek out a HCA over a community hospital as private hospitals continue to raise the professional standard of RNs, RTs, and even EMTs. In the last 15 years I have seen so many healthcare job requirements become mandatory that used to be optional (mostly in corporate hospitals)...ACLS, TNCC, ENPC & even CPR (gasp!). I work for a corporate hospital (not the one mentioned above) and I receive a cash bonus every time I take and pass a new (work related) course or renew a certificate. I always have more CEUs than I can track and somehow along the way I learn something new & improve my skills. My " evil corporation " has taken care of me so that I can take better care of my patients (who happen to be their customers). Does anybody agree or disagree? Respectfully, Kip Stubbs, CHT, DMT, EMT-I > > Careful...your SSM is showing... > > _____ > > From: [mailto:texasems- l ] On > Behalf Of THEDUDMAN@a... > Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 5:41 PM > To: > Subject: Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do > agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday > night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some > agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I > guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we > pick that time out of the air. > > Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most > profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... > > > > Dudley > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Private corporations run more profitable hospitals hands down, however, profitable does not always equate to quality care. Healthcare used to be a service, not a business. We lost something when that changed. That said, I would still seek out a HCA over a community hospital as private hospitals continue to raise the professional standard of RNs, RTs, and even EMTs. In the last 15 years I have seen so many healthcare job requirements become mandatory that used to be optional (mostly in corporate hospitals)...ACLS, TNCC, ENPC & even CPR (gasp!). I work for a corporate hospital (not the one mentioned above) and I receive a cash bonus every time I take and pass a new (work related) course or renew a certificate. I always have more CEUs than I can track and somehow along the way I learn something new & improve my skills. My " evil corporation " has taken care of me so that I can take better care of my patients (who happen to be their customers). Does anybody agree or disagree? Respectfully, Kip Stubbs, CHT, DMT, EMT-I > > Careful...your SSM is showing... > > _____ > > From: [mailto:texasems- l ] On > Behalf Of THEDUDMAN@a... > Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 5:41 PM > To: > Subject: Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do > agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday > night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some > agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I > guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we > pick that time out of the air. > > Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most > profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... > > > > Dudley > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 14, 2005 Report Share Posted December 14, 2005 Private corporations run more profitable hospitals hands down, however, profitable does not always equate to quality care. Healthcare used to be a service, not a business. We lost something when that changed. That said, I would still seek out a HCA over a community hospital as private hospitals continue to raise the professional standard of RNs, RTs, and even EMTs. In the last 15 years I have seen so many healthcare job requirements become mandatory that used to be optional (mostly in corporate hospitals)...ACLS, TNCC, ENPC & even CPR (gasp!). I work for a corporate hospital (not the one mentioned above) and I receive a cash bonus every time I take and pass a new (work related) course or renew a certificate. I always have more CEUs than I can track and somehow along the way I learn something new & improve my skills. My " evil corporation " has taken care of me so that I can take better care of my patients (who happen to be their customers). Does anybody agree or disagree? Respectfully, Kip Stubbs, CHT, DMT, EMT-I > > Careful...your SSM is showing... > > _____ > > From: [mailto:texasems- l ] On > Behalf Of THEDUDMAN@a... > Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 5:41 PM > To: > Subject: Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do > agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or Saturday > night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some > agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or 0600? I > guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift when we > pick that time out of the air. > > Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, most > profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... > > > > Dudley > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2005 Report Share Posted December 15, 2005 Hello Steve, you never know who is lurking out there. Henry Steve McCormick wrote: > Careful...your SSM is showing... > > _____ > > From: [mailto: ] > On > Behalf Of THEDUDMAN@... > Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 5:41 PM > To: > Subject: Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do > agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or > Saturday > night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some > agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or > 0600? I > guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift > when we > pick that time out of the air. > > Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, > most > profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... > > > > Dudley > > Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company > part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do > transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " > > EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to > purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. > > 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not > predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make > a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. > > As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - > they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and > operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists > price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products > to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as > > to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt > themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long > > for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot > > less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of > > consumers that have the ability to purchase it. > > Apples and Oranges. > > Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and > generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a > for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to > make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will > have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we > usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have > > been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and > playing catchup to provide service that they should have been > providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to > > someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private > provider's intentions were all along. > > Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why > > it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government > run. > > Mike > > > > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies > > (Honda, > > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by > strong > > for-profit corporations? > > > > Nuf said, > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2005 Report Share Posted December 15, 2005 Hello Steve, you never know who is lurking out there. Henry Steve McCormick wrote: > Careful...your SSM is showing... > > _____ > > From: [mailto: ] > On > Behalf Of THEDUDMAN@... > Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 5:41 PM > To: > Subject: Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do > agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or > Saturday > night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some > agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or > 0600? I > guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift > when we > pick that time out of the air. > > Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, > most > profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... > > > > Dudley > > Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company > part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do > transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " > > EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to > purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. > > 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not > predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make > a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. > > As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - > they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and > operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists > price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products > to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as > > to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt > themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long > > for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot > > less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of > > consumers that have the ability to purchase it. > > Apples and Oranges. > > Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and > generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a > for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to > make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will > have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we > usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have > > been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and > playing catchup to provide service that they should have been > providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to > > someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private > provider's intentions were all along. > > Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why > > it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government > run. > > Mike > > > > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies > > (Honda, > > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by > strong > > for-profit corporations? > > > > Nuf said, > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2005 Report Share Posted December 15, 2005 Hello Steve, you never know who is lurking out there. Henry Steve McCormick wrote: > Careful...your SSM is showing... > > _____ > > From: [mailto: ] > On > Behalf Of THEDUDMAN@... > Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2005 5:41 PM > To: > Subject: Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > 911 calls and emergency transfers are not predictable??? Then why do > agencies make sure they have more trucks in the evening...Friday or > Saturday > night is the nights we make sure to tell students to ride...and some > agencies do shift change at noon while others at 0900 or 0700 or > 0600? I > guess we are just hoping to not get a call right before end of shift > when we > pick that time out of the air. > > Here is another apples and oranges equation for you...are the best, > most > profitable hospitals run by municipalities or private corporations.... > > > > Dudley > > Re: Re: AMR to go public > > > Come on, doc! I happen to work for a profitable EMS company > part-time. Our difference? We don't do 911, and we don't do > transfers. We do event medicine. For the work we do, it's " elective " > > EMS - even if it's required by contract, the customer is required to > purchase service, and we're providing it at a built-in profit rate. > > 911, on the other hand, and to an extent emergnecy transfers, are not > predictable enough to be able to guarantee profits, and once you make > a commitment to serve an area, you run the risk of doing so at a loss. > > As for the large corporations - Microsoft, Sony, Honda, Canon, etc. - > they sell a product (or service or both) that's entirely elective and > operate in a fully competitive market. While there certainly exists > price pressures, in the long run these companies price their products > to make money, and market their products to consumers in such a way as > > to create sales. It's rather hard to convince someone to hurt > themselves or get themselves sick and ignore primary medical care long > > for the sole purpose of biling them to take them for care. It's a lot > > less hard to create a need for a product and market it to a segment of > > consumers that have the ability to purchase it. > > Apples and Oranges. > > Bottom line? 911, and emergency transfers, are unpredictable and > generally carry enough " business risK " for loss vs profit that a > for-profit company will be forced, at some point or some level, to > make choices that involve profit vs service level - and profit will > have to win; otherwise, you'll see the company pull out - like we > usually do with for-profit EMS... then the governments that would have > > been providing the service all along are " behind the curve " and > playing catchup to provide service that they should have been > providing all along, but decided to " cheap out " on and contract out to > > someone else - regardless of how good the government or the private > provider's intentions were all along. > > Private EMS isn't evil, it's just not a safe investment - which is why > > it needs to be government mandated, government funded, and government > run. > > Mike > > > > Are your best camera companies (Sony, Canon) or automobile companies > > (Honda, > > Toyota) run by municipalities and non-profit organizations or by > strong > > for-profit corporations? > > > > Nuf said, > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2005 Report Share Posted December 15, 2005 CHT = Certified Hyperbaric Technologist DMT = Diver Medical Technologist -Alfonso R. Ochoa > > i have a question. what's a CHT? what's a DMT? > > jim davis > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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