RE: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

[Guest guest]

the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

Keller FD x 2

CFWCMC

Roanoke FD

BCAA ??

IVFD

Collevyville FD

Irvibf FD x 2

Hurst FD x 2

jim davis

baylor grapevine

je.hill@... wrote:

I have the first quarter of the Paramedic training curriculum approved and

online in the form of our Intermediate course. If you are a Basic, you have to

complete that one, because it IS the first quarter of our Paramedic class. The

" Paramedic " class course approval is planned to be requested probably in

February. It has not been requested yet.

Jane Hill

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Associates, and others. TechPro EMS Academy will donate $100 in cash

for one of these exciting drawings. These drawings will be

restricted to EMSAT members only. Be sure to bring your friends to

join and to enter!!! "

I hope to see you there!!!!

Jane Hill

[Guest guest]

Jim:

Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats the

phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone by in the

morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received recently from one

of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

> the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

>

> Keller FD x 2

> CFWCMC

> Roanoke FD

> BCAA ??

> IVFD

> Collevyville FD

> Irvibf FD x 2

> Hurst FD x 2

>

> jim davis

> baylor grapevine

>

[Guest guest]

I guess it would be to easy to use a bring one take one type policy?

Crosby

EMT-B

Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

It sounds like we need some legislation on this issue. Something

requiring the hospital to return the device(s) upon their completed use and

decontamination would be along the lines of my thoughts.

When I graduated high school I went to work for a local hospital in

shipping / receiving. It was not unusual for us to ship backboards and

other devices back to EMS agencies and FRO's if they remained in the ER for

an extended period of time.

Tater

TX1@... wrote:

Jim:

Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats the

phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone by in

the

morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received recently from

one

of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

> the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

>

> Keller FD x 2

> CFWCMC

> Roanoke FD

> BCAA ??

> IVFD

> Collevyville FD

> Irvibf FD x 2

> Hurst FD x 2

>

> jim davis

> baylor grapevine

>

[Guest guest]

I guess it would be to easy to use a bring one take one type policy?

Crosby

EMT-B

Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

It sounds like we need some legislation on this issue. Something

requiring the hospital to return the device(s) upon their completed use and

decontamination would be along the lines of my thoughts.

When I graduated high school I went to work for a local hospital in

shipping / receiving. It was not unusual for us to ship backboards and

other devices back to EMS agencies and FRO's if they remained in the ER for

an extended period of time.

Tater

TX1@... wrote:

Jim:

Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats the

phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone by in

the

morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received recently from

one

of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

> the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

>

> Keller FD x 2

> CFWCMC

> Roanoke FD

> BCAA ??

> IVFD

> Collevyville FD

> Irvibf FD x 2

> Hurst FD x 2

>

> jim davis

> baylor grapevine

>

[Guest guest]

I guess it would be to easy to use a bring one take one type policy?

Crosby

EMT-B

Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

It sounds like we need some legislation on this issue. Something

requiring the hospital to return the device(s) upon their completed use and

decontamination would be along the lines of my thoughts.

When I graduated high school I went to work for a local hospital in

shipping / receiving. It was not unusual for us to ship backboards and

other devices back to EMS agencies and FRO's if they remained in the ER for

an extended period of time.

Tater

TX1@... wrote:

Jim:

Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats the

phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone by in

the

morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received recently from

one

of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

> the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

>

> Keller FD x 2

> CFWCMC

> Roanoke FD

> BCAA ??

> IVFD

> Collevyville FD

> Irvibf FD x 2

> Hurst FD x 2

>

> jim davis

> baylor grapevine

>

[Guest guest]

You are right , hospital bill thousands and thousands of dollars;

however, they eat more than 60% of what they bill because people don't have

insurance or people don't pay. Hospitals do us a favor by keeping the

equipment together in an area and providing us a place to clean the

equipment. I think that is sufficient.

Since EMS brought that patient to the hospital, shouldn't they pick up some

of the cost if the patient can't pay?

Todd

Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

It sounds like we need some legislation on this issue. Something

requiring the hospital to return the device(s) upon their completed use and

decontamination would be along the lines of my thoughts.

When I graduated high school I went to work for a local hospital in

shipping / receiving. It was not unusual for us to ship backboards and

other devices back to EMS agencies and FRO's if they remained in the ER for

an extended period of time.

Tater

TX1@... wrote:

Jim:

Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats the

phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone by in

the

morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received recently from

one

of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

> the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

>

> Keller FD x 2

> CFWCMC

> Roanoke FD

> BCAA ??

> IVFD

> Collevyville FD

> Irvibf FD x 2

> Hurst FD x 2

>

> jim davis

> baylor grapevine

>

[Guest guest]

You are right , hospital bill thousands and thousands of dollars;

however, they eat more than 60% of what they bill because people don't have

insurance or people don't pay. Hospitals do us a favor by keeping the

equipment together in an area and providing us a place to clean the

equipment. I think that is sufficient.

Since EMS brought that patient to the hospital, shouldn't they pick up some

of the cost if the patient can't pay?

Todd

Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

It sounds like we need some legislation on this issue. Something

requiring the hospital to return the device(s) upon their completed use and

decontamination would be along the lines of my thoughts.

When I graduated high school I went to work for a local hospital in

shipping / receiving. It was not unusual for us to ship backboards and

other devices back to EMS agencies and FRO's if they remained in the ER for

an extended period of time.

Tater

TX1@... wrote:

Jim:

Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats the

phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone by in

the

morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received recently from

one

of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

> the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

>

> Keller FD x 2

> CFWCMC

> Roanoke FD

> BCAA ??

> IVFD

> Collevyville FD

> Irvibf FD x 2

> Hurst FD x 2

>

> jim davis

> baylor grapevine

>

[Guest guest]

You are right , hospital bill thousands and thousands of dollars;

however, they eat more than 60% of what they bill because people don't have

insurance or people don't pay. Hospitals do us a favor by keeping the

equipment together in an area and providing us a place to clean the

equipment. I think that is sufficient.

Since EMS brought that patient to the hospital, shouldn't they pick up some

of the cost if the patient can't pay?

Todd

Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

It sounds like we need some legislation on this issue. Something

requiring the hospital to return the device(s) upon their completed use and

decontamination would be along the lines of my thoughts.

When I graduated high school I went to work for a local hospital in

shipping / receiving. It was not unusual for us to ship backboards and

other devices back to EMS agencies and FRO's if they remained in the ER for

an extended period of time.

Tater

TX1@... wrote:

Jim:

Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats the

phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone by in

the

morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received recently from

one

of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

> the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

>

> Keller FD x 2

> CFWCMC

> Roanoke FD

> BCAA ??

> IVFD

> Collevyville FD

> Irvibf FD x 2

> Hurst FD x 2

>

> jim davis

> baylor grapevine

>

[Guest guest]

I believe that was required by OSHA and Texas is not an OSHA state.

If we could get hospitals to decon the equipment, that would be great. I have

worked out a deal with UPS to ship products to my headquarters...on an account

that is only valid if the Ship To: address is ours...but they won't take

bio-contaminated equipment...

Getting the equipment cleaned would solve my problem...then again, our RAC has

taken this on and we are developing some processes to help with this...including

better equipment security and working together to get the equipment back to

where it belongs...

Dudley

Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

Why should it be the hospital's responsibility? If the ambulance can find

the ER to drop the patient off then it should be able to find the ER to get

it's supplies, eh?

Todd

Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

It sounds like we need some legislation on this issue. Something

requiring the hospital to return the device(s) upon their completed use and

decontamination would be along the lines of my thoughts.

When I graduated high school I went to work for a local hospital in

shipping / receiving. It was not unusual for us to ship backboards and

other devices back to EMS agencies and FRO's if they remained in the ER for

an extended period of time.

Tater

TX1@... wrote:

Jim:

Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats the

phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone by in

the

morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received recently from

one

of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

> the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

>

> Keller FD x 2

> CFWCMC

> Roanoke FD

> BCAA ??

> IVFD

> Collevyville FD

> Irvibf FD x 2

> Hurst FD x 2

>

> jim davis

> baylor grapevine

>

[Guest guest]

I believe that was required by OSHA and Texas is not an OSHA state.

If we could get hospitals to decon the equipment, that would be great. I have

worked out a deal with UPS to ship products to my headquarters...on an account

that is only valid if the Ship To: address is ours...but they won't take

bio-contaminated equipment...

Getting the equipment cleaned would solve my problem...then again, our RAC has

taken this on and we are developing some processes to help with this...including

better equipment security and working together to get the equipment back to

where it belongs...

Dudley

Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

Why should it be the hospital's responsibility? If the ambulance can find

the ER to drop the patient off then it should be able to find the ER to get

it's supplies, eh?

Todd

Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

It sounds like we need some legislation on this issue. Something

requiring the hospital to return the device(s) upon their completed use and

decontamination would be along the lines of my thoughts.

When I graduated high school I went to work for a local hospital in

shipping / receiving. It was not unusual for us to ship backboards and

other devices back to EMS agencies and FRO's if they remained in the ER for

an extended period of time.

Tater

TX1@... wrote:

Jim:

Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats the

phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone by in

the

morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received recently from

one

of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

> the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

>

> Keller FD x 2

> CFWCMC

> Roanoke FD

> BCAA ??

> IVFD

> Collevyville FD

> Irvibf FD x 2

> Hurst FD x 2

>

> jim davis

> baylor grapevine

>

[Guest guest]

Ok this one hit a nerve. It should be the hospitals responsibility

because we are their customers. While not every patient we bring in may

not pay, many many do. If we make a transfer using a piece of their

equipment or possibly carrying one of their employees with us, would we

say as we dropped the patient off " See ya so sad not our responsibility

to get you back home " Nope, so why does the hospital not have the

responsibility at the very minimum to help us locate these expensive

pieces of equipment and ship them back even COD? I for one have had

enough and have started tracking this equipment better. If it becomes

lost after arriving at the hospital, I will after a resonable amount of

time invoice the hospital for the equipment.

Henry

Todd Willingham wrote:

> Why should it be the hospital's responsibility? If the ambulance can

> find

> the ER to drop the patient off then it should be able to find the ER

> to get

> it's supplies, eh?

>

> Todd

> Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

>

>

> It sounds like we need some legislation on this issue. Something

> requiring the hospital to return the device(s) upon their completed

> use and

> decontamination would be along the lines of my thoughts.

>

> When I graduated high school I went to work for a local hospital in

> shipping / receiving. It was not unusual for us to ship backboards

> and

> other devices back to EMS agencies and FRO's if they remained in the

> ER for

> an extended period of time.

>

>

>

> Tater

>

>

>

> TX1@... wrote:

> Jim:

>

> Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats

> the

> phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone

> by in

> the

> morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received

> recently from

> one

> of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

>

>

>

> In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

> james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

>

>

> > the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

> >

> > Keller FD x 2

> > CFWCMC

> > Roanoke FD

> > BCAA ??

> > IVFD

> > Collevyville FD

> > Irvibf FD x 2

> > Hurst FD x 2

> >

> > jim davis

> > baylor grapevine

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Ok this one hit a nerve. It should be the hospitals responsibility

because we are their customers. While not every patient we bring in may

not pay, many many do. If we make a transfer using a piece of their

equipment or possibly carrying one of their employees with us, would we

say as we dropped the patient off " See ya so sad not our responsibility

to get you back home " Nope, so why does the hospital not have the

responsibility at the very minimum to help us locate these expensive

pieces of equipment and ship them back even COD? I for one have had

enough and have started tracking this equipment better. If it becomes

lost after arriving at the hospital, I will after a resonable amount of

time invoice the hospital for the equipment.

Henry

Todd Willingham wrote:

> Why should it be the hospital's responsibility? If the ambulance can

> find

> the ER to drop the patient off then it should be able to find the ER

> to get

> it's supplies, eh?

>

> Todd

> Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

>

>

> It sounds like we need some legislation on this issue. Something

> requiring the hospital to return the device(s) upon their completed

> use and

> decontamination would be along the lines of my thoughts.

>

> When I graduated high school I went to work for a local hospital in

> shipping / receiving. It was not unusual for us to ship backboards

> and

> other devices back to EMS agencies and FRO's if they remained in the

> ER for

> an extended period of time.

>

>

>

> Tater

>

>

>

> TX1@... wrote:

> Jim:

>

> Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats

> the

> phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone

> by in

> the

> morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received

> recently from

> one

> of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

>

>

>

> In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

> james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

>

>

> > the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

> >

> > Keller FD x 2

> > CFWCMC

> > Roanoke FD

> > BCAA ??

> > IVFD

> > Collevyville FD

> > Irvibf FD x 2

> > Hurst FD x 2

> >

> > jim davis

> > baylor grapevine

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Nope its the other 40% that they receive. We should not be required to

eat that cost. You take a $150 back board and see what percent of your

charge for that call is . On top of that you may not be paid for the

call. So now you have gas employee time wear on your ambulance and the

cost of the board. Now the call cost you $400.

Henry

Sam Sam wrote:

> You are right , hospital bill thousands and thousands of

> dollars;

> however, they eat more than 60% of what they bill because people don't

> have

> insurance or people don't pay. Hospitals do us a favor by keeping the

>

> equipment together in an area and providing us a place to clean the

> equipment. I think that is sufficient.

> Since EMS brought that patient to the hospital, shouldn't they pick up

> some

> of the cost if the patient can't pay?

> Todd

> Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

>

>

> It sounds like we need some legislation on this issue. Something

> requiring the hospital to return the device(s) upon their completed

> use and

> decontamination would be along the lines of my thoughts.

>

> When I graduated high school I went to work for a local hospital in

> shipping / receiving. It was not unusual for us to ship backboards

> and

> other devices back to EMS agencies and FRO's if they remained in the

> ER for

> an extended period of time.

>

>

>

> Tater

>

>

>

> TX1@... wrote:

> Jim:

>

> Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure beats

> the

> phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not gone

> by in

> the

> morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received

> recently from

> one

> of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

>

>

>

> In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

> james_dav_bmcg@... writes:

>

>

> > the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

> >

> > Keller FD x 2

> > CFWCMC

> > Roanoke FD

> > BCAA ??

> > IVFD

> > Collevyville FD

> > Irvibf FD x 2

> > Hurst FD x 2

> >

> > jim davis

> > baylor grapevine

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Maxine, you know that's not what the writer really ment. We do charge

for our calls and take into consideration for soft goods or disposable

items. A backboard is not disposable.

Henry

" Pate, Maxine " wrote:

> That person was an EMS patient before he became a

> hospital patient. Won't he also receive a bill from

> EMS? Will he be charged for the transport? For

> supplies used and procedures done? Will he be

> charged for the backboarding procedure done? For

> the backboard itself? Doesn't the EMS agency take

> into consideration the cost of replenishing and

> maintaining supplies and equipment when they set

> their fees?

>

>

>

> I don't recall leaving equipment as a courtesy to

> the hospital, but rather because it was in the best

> interest of the patient. Why would we want the

> hospital to remove a backboard, or any other splint

> or piece of equipment, from a patient before they

> were sure it could be done without causing harm to

> the patient?

>

>

>

> " What do you mean, you want to take x-rays and

> consult with an orthopedist before you take that

> traction splint off of that fractured femur? Heck,

> no! I'm ready to leave and I want my equipment

> back! "

>

>

>

> Maxine Pate

>

> ---- Original message ----

>

> Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2005 11:51:12 -0800 (PST)

>

>

>

> Subject: Re: Backboards @ baylor

> grapevine

>

> To:

>

> > It should be the hospitals responsibility

> because the EMS service brought them a patient.

> The hospitals bill thousands and thousands of

> dollars to the patients that EMS brings in to

> them. If the hospitals are not willing to do this

> they can simply remove all of the equipment EMS

> brings in with the patient prior to EMS departure.

>

> >

>

> > I’ve transported patients to hospitals many

> miles away from the point of origin. I have also

> transported patients to hospitals that I never set

> foot in again. It should not be the responsibility

> of EMS to retrieve their equipment after the

> hospital is finished with it. EMS leaves this

> equipment with the patient as a courtesy to the

> hospital. If the hospital can not return the

> courtesy maybe the patients need to be take

> somewhere else as appropriate.

>

> >

>

> > Tater

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Maxine, you know that's not what the writer really ment. We do charge

for our calls and take into consideration for soft goods or disposable

items. A backboard is not disposable.

Henry

" Pate, Maxine " wrote:

> That person was an EMS patient before he became a

> hospital patient. Won't he also receive a bill from

> EMS? Will he be charged for the transport? For

> supplies used and procedures done? Will he be

> charged for the backboarding procedure done? For

> the backboard itself? Doesn't the EMS agency take

> into consideration the cost of replenishing and

> maintaining supplies and equipment when they set

> their fees?

>

>

>

> I don't recall leaving equipment as a courtesy to

> the hospital, but rather because it was in the best

> interest of the patient. Why would we want the

> hospital to remove a backboard, or any other splint

> or piece of equipment, from a patient before they

> were sure it could be done without causing harm to

> the patient?

>

>

>

> " What do you mean, you want to take x-rays and

> consult with an orthopedist before you take that

> traction splint off of that fractured femur? Heck,

> no! I'm ready to leave and I want my equipment

> back! "

>

>

>

> Maxine Pate

>

> ---- Original message ----

>

> Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2005 11:51:12 -0800 (PST)

>

>

>

> Subject: Re: Backboards @ baylor

> grapevine

>

> To:

>

> > It should be the hospitals responsibility

> because the EMS service brought them a patient.

> The hospitals bill thousands and thousands of

> dollars to the patients that EMS brings in to

> them. If the hospitals are not willing to do this

> they can simply remove all of the equipment EMS

> brings in with the patient prior to EMS departure.

>

> >

>

> > I’ve transported patients to hospitals many

> miles away from the point of origin. I have also

> transported patients to hospitals that I never set

> foot in again. It should not be the responsibility

> of EMS to retrieve their equipment after the

> hospital is finished with it. EMS leaves this

> equipment with the patient as a courtesy to the

> hospital. If the hospital can not return the

> courtesy maybe the patients need to be take

> somewhere else as appropriate.

>

> >

>

> > Tater

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Maxine, you know that's not what the writer really ment. We do charge

for our calls and take into consideration for soft goods or disposable

items. A backboard is not disposable.

Henry

" Pate, Maxine " wrote:

> That person was an EMS patient before he became a

> hospital patient. Won't he also receive a bill from

> EMS? Will he be charged for the transport? For

> supplies used and procedures done? Will he be

> charged for the backboarding procedure done? For

> the backboard itself? Doesn't the EMS agency take

> into consideration the cost of replenishing and

> maintaining supplies and equipment when they set

> their fees?

>

>

>

> I don't recall leaving equipment as a courtesy to

> the hospital, but rather because it was in the best

> interest of the patient. Why would we want the

> hospital to remove a backboard, or any other splint

> or piece of equipment, from a patient before they

> were sure it could be done without causing harm to

> the patient?

>

>

>

> " What do you mean, you want to take x-rays and

> consult with an orthopedist before you take that

> traction splint off of that fractured femur? Heck,

> no! I'm ready to leave and I want my equipment

> back! "

>

>

>

> Maxine Pate

>

> ---- Original message ----

>

> Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2005 11:51:12 -0800 (PST)

>

>

>

> Subject: Re: Backboards @ baylor

> grapevine

>

> To:

>

> > It should be the hospitals responsibility

> because the EMS service brought them a patient.

> The hospitals bill thousands and thousands of

> dollars to the patients that EMS brings in to

> them. If the hospitals are not willing to do this

> they can simply remove all of the equipment EMS

> brings in with the patient prior to EMS departure.

>

> >

>

> > I’ve transported patients to hospitals many

> miles away from the point of origin. I have also

> transported patients to hospitals that I never set

> foot in again. It should not be the responsibility

> of EMS to retrieve their equipment after the

> hospital is finished with it. EMS leaves this

> equipment with the patient as a courtesy to the

> hospital. If the hospital can not return the

> courtesy maybe the patients need to be take

> somewhere else as appropriate.

>

> >

>

> > Tater

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Maxine,

I agree with your statements that we leave the equipment because it is

medically necessary ( I was being facetious in my previous post). I do stand by

my statement that the hospitals should be more diligent in their care and

security of EMS equipment. I think services should bill hospitals for lost or

“stolen” goods that were left at the ER. Like I said, I’ve shipped numerous

backboards back to EMS services that were out of our area from the hospital. It

didn’t cost us much, and it was a courtesy we provided to our customers.

Do you consider backboards to be disposable items? What would the hospital do

if your service kept an IV pump that was sent on a LDT?

Tater

" Pate, Maxine " wrote:

That person was an EMS patient before he became a

hospital patient. Won't he also receive a bill from

EMS? Will he be charged for the transport? For

supplies used and procedures done? Will he be

charged for the backboarding procedure done? For

the backboard itself? Doesn't the EMS agency take

into consideration the cost of replenishing and

maintaining supplies and equipment when they set

their fees?

I don't recall leaving equipment as a courtesy to

the hospital, but rather because it was in the best

interest of the patient. Why would we want the

hospital to remove a backboard, or any other splint

or piece of equipment, from a patient before they

were sure it could be done without causing harm to

the patient?

" What do you mean, you want to take x-rays and

consult with an orthopedist before you take that

traction splint off of that fractured femur? Heck,

no! I'm ready to leave and I want my equipment

back! "

Maxine Pate

---- Original message ----

Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2005 11:51:12 -0800 (PST)

Subject: Re: Backboards @ baylor

grapevine

To:

> It should be the hospitals responsibility

because the EMS service brought them a patient.

The hospitals bill thousands and thousands of

dollars to the patients that EMS brings in to

them. If the hospitals are not willing to do this

they can simply remove all of the equipment EMS

brings in with the patient prior to EMS departure.

>

> I’ve transported patients to hospitals many

miles away from the point of origin. I have also

transported patients to hospitals that I never set

foot in again. It should not be the responsibility

of EMS to retrieve their equipment after the

hospital is finished with it. EMS leaves this

equipment with the patient as a courtesy to the

hospital. If the hospital can not return the

courtesy maybe the patients need to be take

somewhere else as appropriate.

>

> Tater

[Guest guest]

Steve,

You are probably right...you didn't see anybody take it, but hell,

lets blame those EMS guys because I am sure that they did it. It is

always someone else's fault. Give me a break...

D. Stone

>

>

> " I think services should bill hospitals for lost or " stolen "

goods that

> were left at the ER. "

>

> That isn't our job to keep track of your equipment. If we are

busy

> stuff goes walking, in fact I see a lot of EMS crews overstocking

> (shopping) with our stuff. Should the hospitals charge EMS

services for

> that. We now have our pulse ox's and some of our gear attached

because

> it went walking.

>

> Last night we had a code and when they went to bag the PT all

the masks

> in the bag were gone. In my opinion An EMS crew took it. They

probably

> used it on a call since we don't restock it for them; they then

went

> into the room and took it out of the bag.

>

[Guest guest]

Why do EMS personnel eat their own? How can it be that what started off as

a courtesy from a facility to a number of agencies regarding equipment has

turned into a finger pointing and accusation/sniveling contest.

What amazes me the most about our " Profession " is that for any reason, we

" professionals " turn on each other and ancillary personnel.

Perhaps the lifespan of EMS workers is only 5-7 years not because of a

stressful job, but because of the mistrust, back-biting and in-fighting that we

do.

The appropriate response to the " you have equipment at..... " facility

is--------Thank you.

[Guest guest]

http://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owadisp.show_document?p_table=INTERPRETATIONS & p_\

id=24609

Your question is: " who is responsible for cleaning this equipment? "

Simply, it is every employer's responsibility to ensure a safe and

healthful workplace for its employees. More specifically, according to the

Bloodborne Pathogens Standard, each employer with employees who may have

an occupational exposure to blood or other potentially infectious

materials (OPIM) is responsible for eliminating or reducing the potential

hazard. In this case, where equipment is shared between first responders

and emergency department or general hospital staff, each employer has

responsibilities for protecting employees from exposure to blood or body

fluids.

The equipment to which you are referring belongs to the first responders

or emergency medical service (EMS) personnel and is to be returned to them

for reuse. If a hospital places such equipment, contaminated, in the

hallways or in closets awaiting pickup, it is exposing its employees and

anyone in the area to potential bloodborne pathogens.

According to paragraph (d)(4)(i) of the standard, " (e)mployers shall

ensure that (the) worksite is maintained in a clean and sanitary

condition. " Paragraph (d)(4)(ii) provides that " all equipment and

environmental and working surfaces shall be cleaned and decontaminated

after contact with blood or other potentially infectious materials

[emphasis added]. " Additionally, " ©ontaminated work surfaces shall be

decontaminated with an appropriate disinfectant after completion of

procedures; immediately or as soon as feasible when surfaces are overtly

contaminated or after any spill of blood or other potentially infectious

materials; and at the end of the work shift if the surface may have become

contaminated since the last cleaning. "

OSHA would regard a hospital as having met its obligations with respect to

its own employees either by cleaning and decontaminating the equipment in

accordance with (d)(4)(i) of the standard, or, alternatively, by

preventing employee contact with such equipment by placing it in durable,

leakproof, and labeled or color-coded containers and handling it in a

manner similar to that prescribed for contaminated laundry [paragraph

1910.1030(d)(4)(iv)] and contaminated laboratory equipment [paragraph

1910.1030(e)(2)(ii)(]. The first responders' employer must then ensure

that its employees take proper precautions when retrieving and

decontaminating the equipment. The Centers for Disease Control and

Prevention (CDC) indicate, in their Infection Control Practices, that

communication between two parties with regard to handling and

decontamination of supplies and materials is of the utmost importance.

Steve Schecter, NREMT-B,

This message is intended only for the use of the Addressee and may contain

information that is PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL. If you are not the

intended recipient of this message, dissemination of this communication is

prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please erase

all copies of the message and its attachments and notify the sender

immediately.

[Guest guest]

One of our Paramedics is a public school teacher.

She was in a meeting recently where one of her

superiors said that teaching is the only profession

that eats it's own. Had a good chuckle over that

one. Just proves how little our public educators

actually know! Now don't eat me--that was a joke!

Maxine Pate

---- Original message ----

Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2005 16:13:10 EST

From: fremsdallas@...

>Why do EMS personnel eat their own?

[Guest guest]

I don't recall reading any " facts " about the missing masks in your original

post, just your opinion. What I want to know is why someone would steal just the

masks and not the whole BVM. If you're going to be a thieving bastard, why be

half-ass about it? Donnie is right though. It is always someones elses fault.

Yours truly,

Ken

Steve Schecter wrote:

Hi Donnie,

I am in EMS. I was just stating the facts as I see it. In my mind it

makes no senses for a Dr. or a nurse to open a BVM bag, and then take out

the masks then place them back where the found them. When they want

anything, they usually ask the PCT’s, since they do not know where

anything is, and it is less work for them that way.

Best Regards,

Steve

Donnie said:

> Steve,

>

> You are probably right...you didn't see anybody take it, but hell,

> lets blame those EMS guys because I am sure that they did it. It is

> always someone else's fault. Give me a break...

>

>

> D. Stone

>

Steve Schecter, NREMT-B,

This message is intended only for the use of the Addressee and may contain

information that is PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL. If you are not the

intended recipient of this message, dissemination of this communication is

prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please erase

all copies of the message and its attachments and notify the sender

immediately.

[Guest guest]

Isn't it usually better to blame somebody else for theft than admitting

that you forgot to restock?

Crosby

EMT-B

" The man who does not read good books has no advantage over the man who

can't read them. "

-Mark Twain

________________________________

From: [mailto: ] On

Behalf Of Ken Musick

Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 10:43 PM

To:

Subject: Re: Re: Backboards @ baylor grapevine

I don't recall reading any " facts " about the missing masks in your

original post, just your opinion. What I want to know is why someone

would steal just the masks and not the whole BVM. If you're going to be

a thieving bastard, why be half-ass about it? Donnie is right though.

It is always someones elses fault.

Yours truly,

Ken

Steve Schecter wrote:

Hi Donnie,

I am in EMS. I was just stating the facts as I see it. In my mind it

makes no senses for a Dr. or a nurse to open a BVM bag, and then take

out

the masks then place them back where the found them. When they want

anything, they usually ask the PCT's, since they do not know where

anything is, and it is less work for them that way.

Best Regards,

Steve

Donnie said:

> Steve,

>

> You are probably right...you didn't see anybody take it, but hell,

> lets blame those EMS guys because I am sure that they did it. It is

> always someone else's fault. Give me a break...

>

>

> D. Stone

>

Steve Schecter, NREMT-B,

This message is intended only for the use of the Addressee and may

contain

information that is PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL. If you are not the

intended recipient of this message, dissemination of this communication

is

prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please

erase

all copies of the message and its attachments and notify the sender

immediately.

[Guest guest]

I wonder why the hospitals can't lock the boards up in a shed, closet, room, or

whatever. Then, when an EMS wants in the room a designated hospital official

enters said storage with EMS and ensures they only take what is theirs.

Sometimes the simplest solutions aren't used.

Tater

Donnie wrote:

Amen, . But, on the other hand...it would behoove the EMS

service to return soon to pick up their equipment as there are many

thieves that like to take other services' backboards. This is

something that should be closely monitored as backboards seem to grow

legs and walk off. It doesn't matter if you paint or engrave the

board with your service's name, it still ends up missing.

With that said, I also believe that the hospital should be held more

accountable for the equipment left at their facility. There should

be some sort of tracking so that these boards can find their way home.

D. Stone

> Jim:

>

> Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure

beats the

> phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not

gone by in

> the

> morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received

recently from

> one

> of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

>

>

>

> In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

> james_dav_bmcg@y... writes:

>

>

> > the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

> >

> > Keller FD x 2

> > CFWCMC

> > Roanoke FD

> > BCAA ??

> > IVFD

> > Collevyville FD

> > Irvibf FD x 2

> > Hurst FD x 2

> >

> > jim davis

> > baylor grapevine

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I wonder why the hospitals can't lock the boards up in a shed, closet, room, or

whatever. Then, when an EMS wants in the room a designated hospital official

enters said storage with EMS and ensures they only take what is theirs.

Sometimes the simplest solutions aren't used.

Tater

Donnie wrote:

Amen, . But, on the other hand...it would behoove the EMS

service to return soon to pick up their equipment as there are many

thieves that like to take other services' backboards. This is

something that should be closely monitored as backboards seem to grow

legs and walk off. It doesn't matter if you paint or engrave the

board with your service's name, it still ends up missing.

With that said, I also believe that the hospital should be held more

accountable for the equipment left at their facility. There should

be some sort of tracking so that these boards can find their way home.

D. Stone

> Jim:

>

> Thanks for that notice. While my agency is not listed, it sure

beats the

> phone call of " you have three back boards here, if they are not

gone by in

> the

> morning, they are going in the dumpster " phone call I received

recently from

> one

> of our major hospitals in the metroplex.

>

>

>

> In a message dated 11/17/05 8:54:22 PM Central Standard Time,

> james_dav_bmcg@y... writes:

>

>

> > the following agencies have backboards @ batlor grapevine

> >

> > Keller FD x 2

> > CFWCMC

> > Roanoke FD

> > BCAA ??

> > IVFD

> > Collevyville FD

> > Irvibf FD x 2

> > Hurst FD x 2

> >

> > jim davis

> > baylor grapevine

> >

>

>

>

>

>