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I forgot to mention the antibody tests. While you are

getting the frees, also request the 2 thyroid antibody

tests -- also very important!

Marlena

---

wrote:

> Many many thanks Marlena. I'll have a look at the

> book list now. I also found something else via the

> group from the Wellness Medical Clinic that was

> useful. It's so encouraging to even have a clue

> what the problem is! At least it's a step in the

> right direction! I'm going to ask for the Free T3

> and Free T4 tests do be done:-)))

>

> I'll be back as soon as I've got the test reports.

> In the meantime I'll keep an eye on the group (I've

> got the posts coming through as e-mails), and wish

> everyone all the best with their treatment.

>

> Love Chris

> Re: test

> > results -- need ideas

> >

> >

> > > Hi Topper,

> > > Yes, I completely understand. This is an

> obscure

> > test

> > > and no one is familiar with it, so it's hard

> for

> > you

> > > to comment!

> > >

> > > All I can say is that it reflects how I feel

> > more than

> > > the blood tests did that I took in June when

> I

> > was on

> > > 2.5 grains. TSH was 0.011 and frees were

> both

> > just

> > > under the mid-range (and I still felt

> terrible).

> > T4

> > > didn't look higher (in its own range) than

> my T3

> > so I

> > > didn't think I was having a conversion

> problem,

> > I just

> > > thought I needed a higher dosage!

> > >

> > > I need to find out the explanation of why my

> > doctor

> > > says this particular test measures how much

> > hormone

> > > the body is actually using -- how much the

> > tissues are

> > > actually getting affected by, regardless of

> how

> > much

> > > is available in the blood. Some people can't

> > fully use

> > > what is available in the blood (for various

> > reasons)

> > > -- so for that reason, the free's seem the

> best

> > out of

> > > all the blood tests but still not always

> > conclusive,

> > > IMO!

> > >

> > > Marlena

> > >

> > > --- topper2@... wrote:

> > >

> > > > My problem is that I've never seen

> anything on

> > urine

> > > > testing for thyroid

> > > > hormones. Since these do not specify that

> they

> > are

> > > > Free Ts we have to

> > > > assume that they are totals. Which means

> you

> > don't

> > > > know how much hormone

> > > > is available for use. Your T4 here is

> showing

> > very

> > > > high... but how much

> > > > of it is bound and unusable? If a lot of

> it is

> > > > bound, for whatever

> > > > reason, then there isn't enough available

> for

> > > > conversion, which could be

> > > > why the T3 is so low in it's range....

> Then,

> > if we

> > > > continue to assume

> > > > that these are totals, your available T3

> is

> > actually

> > > > below range???

> > > >

> > > > I can't say that the urine tests are more,

> or

> > less,

> > > > accurate than the

> > > > blood tests, we just don't know for sure

> what

> > was

> > > > tested (total or free,

> > > > or if they can even differentiate between

> free

> > and

> > > > bound hormone) and how

> > > > those numbers, in their ranges, compare to

> > what

> > > > we've learned about blood

> > > > levels and ranges.

> > > >

> > > > We know that you aren't feeling as well as

> you

> > > > should... but we don't

> > > > know why, yet.... Using a totally

> different

> > testing

> > > > method leaves us in

> > > > the dark... we have no comparison, no

> > experience, to

> > > > know how to

> > > > interpret them.

> > > >

> > > > Just my thoughts.....

> > > >

> > > > Topper ()

> > > >

> > > > On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 -0700 (PDT)

> > Marlena

> > > > writes:

> > > > Ok y'all, so I finally got my most recent

> > thyroid

> > > > results in but I'm not sure where to go

> from

> > here.

> > > > My

> > > > doctor is pretty holistic and uses a more

> > obsure

> > > > test

> > > > from a lab called Vitamin Diagnostics. It

> is a

> > 24 hr

> > > > urine collection. Supposedly it tests the

> > amount of

> > > > hormone your body is actually using ...

> anyway

> > here

> > > > are my results:

> > > >

> > > > 11/2004 (before treatment):

> > > > T3 621 range 800-1800

> > > > T4 1698 range 1800-3000

> > > >

> > > > 7/05 (since treatment ... it takes a month

> to

> > get

> > > > the

> > > > results!)

> > > > T3 894 range 800-1800

> > > > T4 3124 range 1800-3000

> > > >

> > > > So it looks like I'm not converting well.

> Now

> > I'm on

> > > > 3

> > > > grains of Armour plus 3.5 mcg sustained

> > release T3.

> > > > (I

> > > > was actually taking 3 1/4 grains of Armour

> and

> > 25mcg

> > > > of SR T3 at the time of the test (which

> was

> > over a

> > > > month ago), but soon after felt so bad and

> > > > eventually

> > > > overstimulated that I cut way back) ... I

> know

> > my

> > > > consistency hasn't been that good, but I

> had

> > to cut

> > > > back -- the T3 doesn't have such a long

> life

> > so it

> > > > seemed ok to me plus the decrease in T4

> was

> > probably

> > > > good ... I'm also working with a medical

> > intuitive

> > > > who

> > > > is helping me to figure things out a bit

> --

> > she told

> > > > me that the 25 mcg was way too high (which

> > > > correlated

> > > > with my symptoms -- which for me was a

> > feverish

> > > > feeling and ultra fatigue, fast heartbeat

> --

> > not

> > > > extra

> > > > energy that's for sure). This doesn't make

> > sense

> > > > with

> > > > my low T3 test result. It would seem that

> my

> > body

> > > > would want more T3... from my results I'm

> > guessing

> > > > that my original thyroid production is

> down to

> > zero

> > > > or

> > > > almost zero (my last TSH while on 2.5

> grains

> > was

> > > > .011)

> > > > ... I'm just so frustrated ... I felt

> better

> > on no

> > > > medication whatsoever! And it's scary to

> me to

> > be

> > > > completely dependent on something that

> isn't

> > even

> > > > working for me! I've done all the research

> and

> > been

> > > > the model patient -- doing everything I'm

> > supposed

> > > > to

> > > > be doing ... I really don't know where to

> go

> > from

> > > > here.

> > > > I do all the things one is supposed to do

> to

> > enhance

> > > > conversion too ...

> > > >

> > > > My doctor is not telling me anything

> > conclusive

> > > > about

> > > > where I should go from here ...

> > > >

> > > > The weird thing is that I feel worse than

> > before I

> > > > started treatment ... and my latest

> adrenal

> > test

> > > > results seem to show that my adrenals are

> > actually

> > > > doing ok (although this was an ACTH

> > stimulation test

> > > > to check adrenal reserve and my doctor has

> to

> > talk

> > > > to

> > > > the lab to get a conclusive interpretation

> of

> > the 2

> > > > 24

> > > > hr urine collection results which tests a

> > breakdown

> > > > of

> > > > all the adrenal hormones... and he won't

> be

> > able to

> > > > do

> > > > this for another 2 weeks!). I'm really

> > confused as

> > > > to

> > > > why I would feel worse [for 8 months now

> --

> > I'm

> > > > going

> > > > crazy -- things were pretty bad before

> > treatment for

> > > > 10+ years but I was still functioning --

> now

> > I'm not

> > > > nearly as functional as before ...]

> > > >

> > > > Every adrenal hormone in the test

> increased by

> > a

> > > > good

> > > > amount after the stimulation -- which it's

> > supposed

> > > > to

> > > > do -- except the aldosterone. It was a

> good

> > number

> > > > to

> > > > begin with but then it went down just a

> little

> > after

> > > > the stimulation. It is supposed to go up

> ...

> > but

> > > > what

> > > > I don't understand is that apparently the

> more

> > salt

> > > > you eat, the lower the aldosterone ...

> > aldosterone's

> > > > job is to keep salt in your body, so the

> more

> > you

> > > > eat,

> > > > the less is needed. Therefore I would

> think

> > that

> > > > having the surge of cortisol after the

> test

> > would

> > > > increase salt retention and therefore

> lower

> > > > aldosterone -- like happened with me --

> > however it

> > > > says that it is supposed to increase so

> ...

> > does

> > > > anyone know about this?

> > > >

> > > > I know I'm writing a letter that will be

> > difficult

> > > > to

> > > > respond to -- sorry, I just need to vent

> ...

> > > >

> > > > Marlena

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> ____________________________________________________

> > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your

> home

> > page

> > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

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Share on other sites

I forgot to mention the antibody tests. While you are

getting the frees, also request the 2 thyroid antibody

tests -- also very important!

Marlena

---

wrote:

> Many many thanks Marlena. I'll have a look at the

> book list now. I also found something else via the

> group from the Wellness Medical Clinic that was

> useful. It's so encouraging to even have a clue

> what the problem is! At least it's a step in the

> right direction! I'm going to ask for the Free T3

> and Free T4 tests do be done:-)))

>

> I'll be back as soon as I've got the test reports.

> In the meantime I'll keep an eye on the group (I've

> got the posts coming through as e-mails), and wish

> everyone all the best with their treatment.

>

> Love Chris

> Re: test

> > results -- need ideas

> >

> >

> > > Hi Topper,

> > > Yes, I completely understand. This is an

> obscure

> > test

> > > and no one is familiar with it, so it's hard

> for

> > you

> > > to comment!

> > >

> > > All I can say is that it reflects how I feel

> > more than

> > > the blood tests did that I took in June when

> I

> > was on

> > > 2.5 grains. TSH was 0.011 and frees were

> both

> > just

> > > under the mid-range (and I still felt

> terrible).

> > T4

> > > didn't look higher (in its own range) than

> my T3

> > so I

> > > didn't think I was having a conversion

> problem,

> > I just

> > > thought I needed a higher dosage!

> > >

> > > I need to find out the explanation of why my

> > doctor

> > > says this particular test measures how much

> > hormone

> > > the body is actually using -- how much the

> > tissues are

> > > actually getting affected by, regardless of

> how

> > much

> > > is available in the blood. Some people can't

> > fully use

> > > what is available in the blood (for various

> > reasons)

> > > -- so for that reason, the free's seem the

> best

> > out of

> > > all the blood tests but still not always

> > conclusive,

> > > IMO!

> > >

> > > Marlena

> > >

> > > --- topper2@... wrote:

> > >

> > > > My problem is that I've never seen

> anything on

> > urine

> > > > testing for thyroid

> > > > hormones. Since these do not specify that

> they

> > are

> > > > Free Ts we have to

> > > > assume that they are totals. Which means

> you

> > don't

> > > > know how much hormone

> > > > is available for use. Your T4 here is

> showing

> > very

> > > > high... but how much

> > > > of it is bound and unusable? If a lot of

> it is

> > > > bound, for whatever

> > > > reason, then there isn't enough available

> for

> > > > conversion, which could be

> > > > why the T3 is so low in it's range....

> Then,

> > if we

> > > > continue to assume

> > > > that these are totals, your available T3

> is

> > actually

> > > > below range???

> > > >

> > > > I can't say that the urine tests are more,

> or

> > less,

> > > > accurate than the

> > > > blood tests, we just don't know for sure

> what

> > was

> > > > tested (total or free,

> > > > or if they can even differentiate between

> free

> > and

> > > > bound hormone) and how

> > > > those numbers, in their ranges, compare to

> > what

> > > > we've learned about blood

> > > > levels and ranges.

> > > >

> > > > We know that you aren't feeling as well as

> you

> > > > should... but we don't

> > > > know why, yet.... Using a totally

> different

> > testing

> > > > method leaves us in

> > > > the dark... we have no comparison, no

> > experience, to

> > > > know how to

> > > > interpret them.

> > > >

> > > > Just my thoughts.....

> > > >

> > > > Topper ()

> > > >

> > > > On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 -0700 (PDT)

> > Marlena

> > > > writes:

> > > > Ok y'all, so I finally got my most recent

> > thyroid

> > > > results in but I'm not sure where to go

> from

> > here.

> > > > My

> > > > doctor is pretty holistic and uses a more

> > obsure

> > > > test

> > > > from a lab called Vitamin Diagnostics. It

> is a

> > 24 hr

> > > > urine collection. Supposedly it tests the

> > amount of

> > > > hormone your body is actually using ...

> anyway

> > here

> > > > are my results:

> > > >

> > > > 11/2004 (before treatment):

> > > > T3 621 range 800-1800

> > > > T4 1698 range 1800-3000

> > > >

> > > > 7/05 (since treatment ... it takes a month

> to

> > get

> > > > the

> > > > results!)

> > > > T3 894 range 800-1800

> > > > T4 3124 range 1800-3000

> > > >

> > > > So it looks like I'm not converting well.

> Now

> > I'm on

> > > > 3

> > > > grains of Armour plus 3.5 mcg sustained

> > release T3.

> > > > (I

> > > > was actually taking 3 1/4 grains of Armour

> and

> > 25mcg

> > > > of SR T3 at the time of the test (which

> was

> > over a

> > > > month ago), but soon after felt so bad and

> > > > eventually

> > > > overstimulated that I cut way back) ... I

> know

> > my

> > > > consistency hasn't been that good, but I

> had

> > to cut

> > > > back -- the T3 doesn't have such a long

> life

> > so it

> > > > seemed ok to me plus the decrease in T4

> was

> > probably

> > > > good ... I'm also working with a medical

> > intuitive

> > > > who

> > > > is helping me to figure things out a bit

> --

> > she told

> > > > me that the 25 mcg was way too high (which

> > > > correlated

> > > > with my symptoms -- which for me was a

> > feverish

> > > > feeling and ultra fatigue, fast heartbeat

> --

> > not

> > > > extra

> > > > energy that's for sure). This doesn't make

> > sense

> > > > with

> > > > my low T3 test result. It would seem that

> my

> > body

> > > > would want more T3... from my results I'm

> > guessing

> > > > that my original thyroid production is

> down to

> > zero

> > > > or

> > > > almost zero (my last TSH while on 2.5

> grains

> > was

> > > > .011)

> > > > ... I'm just so frustrated ... I felt

> better

> > on no

> > > > medication whatsoever! And it's scary to

> me to

> > be

> > > > completely dependent on something that

> isn't

> > even

> > > > working for me! I've done all the research

> and

> > been

> > > > the model patient -- doing everything I'm

> > supposed

> > > > to

> > > > be doing ... I really don't know where to

> go

> > from

> > > > here.

> > > > I do all the things one is supposed to do

> to

> > enhance

> > > > conversion too ...

> > > >

> > > > My doctor is not telling me anything

> > conclusive

> > > > about

> > > > where I should go from here ...

> > > >

> > > > The weird thing is that I feel worse than

> > before I

> > > > started treatment ... and my latest

> adrenal

> > test

> > > > results seem to show that my adrenals are

> > actually

> > > > doing ok (although this was an ACTH

> > stimulation test

> > > > to check adrenal reserve and my doctor has

> to

> > talk

> > > > to

> > > > the lab to get a conclusive interpretation

> of

> > the 2

> > > > 24

> > > > hr urine collection results which tests a

> > breakdown

> > > > of

> > > > all the adrenal hormones... and he won't

> be

> > able to

> > > > do

> > > > this for another 2 weeks!). I'm really

> > confused as

> > > > to

> > > > why I would feel worse [for 8 months now

> --

> > I'm

> > > > going

> > > > crazy -- things were pretty bad before

> > treatment for

> > > > 10+ years but I was still functioning --

> now

> > I'm not

> > > > nearly as functional as before ...]

> > > >

> > > > Every adrenal hormone in the test

> increased by

> > a

> > > > good

> > > > amount after the stimulation -- which it's

> > supposed

> > > > to

> > > > do -- except the aldosterone. It was a

> good

> > number

> > > > to

> > > > begin with but then it went down just a

> little

> > after

> > > > the stimulation. It is supposed to go up

> ...

> > but

> > > > what

> > > > I don't understand is that apparently the

> more

> > salt

> > > > you eat, the lower the aldosterone ...

> > aldosterone's

> > > > job is to keep salt in your body, so the

> more

> > you

> > > > eat,

> > > > the less is needed. Therefore I would

> think

> > that

> > > > having the surge of cortisol after the

> test

> > would

> > > > increase salt retention and therefore

> lower

> > > > aldosterone -- like happened with me --

> > however it

> > > > says that it is supposed to increase so

> ...

> > does

> > > > anyone know about this?

> > > >

> > > > I know I'm writing a letter that will be

> > difficult

> > > > to

> > > > respond to -- sorry, I just need to vent

> ...

> > > >

> > > > Marlena

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> ____________________________________________________

> > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your

> home

> > page

> > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I forgot to mention the antibody tests. While you are

getting the frees, also request the 2 thyroid antibody

tests -- also very important!

Marlena

---

wrote:

> Many many thanks Marlena. I'll have a look at the

> book list now. I also found something else via the

> group from the Wellness Medical Clinic that was

> useful. It's so encouraging to even have a clue

> what the problem is! At least it's a step in the

> right direction! I'm going to ask for the Free T3

> and Free T4 tests do be done:-)))

>

> I'll be back as soon as I've got the test reports.

> In the meantime I'll keep an eye on the group (I've

> got the posts coming through as e-mails), and wish

> everyone all the best with their treatment.

>

> Love Chris

> Re: test

> > results -- need ideas

> >

> >

> > > Hi Topper,

> > > Yes, I completely understand. This is an

> obscure

> > test

> > > and no one is familiar with it, so it's hard

> for

> > you

> > > to comment!

> > >

> > > All I can say is that it reflects how I feel

> > more than

> > > the blood tests did that I took in June when

> I

> > was on

> > > 2.5 grains. TSH was 0.011 and frees were

> both

> > just

> > > under the mid-range (and I still felt

> terrible).

> > T4

> > > didn't look higher (in its own range) than

> my T3

> > so I

> > > didn't think I was having a conversion

> problem,

> > I just

> > > thought I needed a higher dosage!

> > >

> > > I need to find out the explanation of why my

> > doctor

> > > says this particular test measures how much

> > hormone

> > > the body is actually using -- how much the

> > tissues are

> > > actually getting affected by, regardless of

> how

> > much

> > > is available in the blood. Some people can't

> > fully use

> > > what is available in the blood (for various

> > reasons)

> > > -- so for that reason, the free's seem the

> best

> > out of

> > > all the blood tests but still not always

> > conclusive,

> > > IMO!

> > >

> > > Marlena

> > >

> > > --- topper2@... wrote:

> > >

> > > > My problem is that I've never seen

> anything on

> > urine

> > > > testing for thyroid

> > > > hormones. Since these do not specify that

> they

> > are

> > > > Free Ts we have to

> > > > assume that they are totals. Which means

> you

> > don't

> > > > know how much hormone

> > > > is available for use. Your T4 here is

> showing

> > very

> > > > high... but how much

> > > > of it is bound and unusable? If a lot of

> it is

> > > > bound, for whatever

> > > > reason, then there isn't enough available

> for

> > > > conversion, which could be

> > > > why the T3 is so low in it's range....

> Then,

> > if we

> > > > continue to assume

> > > > that these are totals, your available T3

> is

> > actually

> > > > below range???

> > > >

> > > > I can't say that the urine tests are more,

> or

> > less,

> > > > accurate than the

> > > > blood tests, we just don't know for sure

> what

> > was

> > > > tested (total or free,

> > > > or if they can even differentiate between

> free

> > and

> > > > bound hormone) and how

> > > > those numbers, in their ranges, compare to

> > what

> > > > we've learned about blood

> > > > levels and ranges.

> > > >

> > > > We know that you aren't feeling as well as

> you

> > > > should... but we don't

> > > > know why, yet.... Using a totally

> different

> > testing

> > > > method leaves us in

> > > > the dark... we have no comparison, no

> > experience, to

> > > > know how to

> > > > interpret them.

> > > >

> > > > Just my thoughts.....

> > > >

> > > > Topper ()

> > > >

> > > > On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 -0700 (PDT)

> > Marlena

> > > > writes:

> > > > Ok y'all, so I finally got my most recent

> > thyroid

> > > > results in but I'm not sure where to go

> from

> > here.

> > > > My

> > > > doctor is pretty holistic and uses a more

> > obsure

> > > > test

> > > > from a lab called Vitamin Diagnostics. It

> is a

> > 24 hr

> > > > urine collection. Supposedly it tests the

> > amount of

> > > > hormone your body is actually using ...

> anyway

> > here

> > > > are my results:

> > > >

> > > > 11/2004 (before treatment):

> > > > T3 621 range 800-1800

> > > > T4 1698 range 1800-3000

> > > >

> > > > 7/05 (since treatment ... it takes a month

> to

> > get

> > > > the

> > > > results!)

> > > > T3 894 range 800-1800

> > > > T4 3124 range 1800-3000

> > > >

> > > > So it looks like I'm not converting well.

> Now

> > I'm on

> > > > 3

> > > > grains of Armour plus 3.5 mcg sustained

> > release T3.

> > > > (I

> > > > was actually taking 3 1/4 grains of Armour

> and

> > 25mcg

> > > > of SR T3 at the time of the test (which

> was

> > over a

> > > > month ago), but soon after felt so bad and

> > > > eventually

> > > > overstimulated that I cut way back) ... I

> know

> > my

> > > > consistency hasn't been that good, but I

> had

> > to cut

> > > > back -- the T3 doesn't have such a long

> life

> > so it

> > > > seemed ok to me plus the decrease in T4

> was

> > probably

> > > > good ... I'm also working with a medical

> > intuitive

> > > > who

> > > > is helping me to figure things out a bit

> --

> > she told

> > > > me that the 25 mcg was way too high (which

> > > > correlated

> > > > with my symptoms -- which for me was a

> > feverish

> > > > feeling and ultra fatigue, fast heartbeat

> --

> > not

> > > > extra

> > > > energy that's for sure). This doesn't make

> > sense

> > > > with

> > > > my low T3 test result. It would seem that

> my

> > body

> > > > would want more T3... from my results I'm

> > guessing

> > > > that my original thyroid production is

> down to

> > zero

> > > > or

> > > > almost zero (my last TSH while on 2.5

> grains

> > was

> > > > .011)

> > > > ... I'm just so frustrated ... I felt

> better

> > on no

> > > > medication whatsoever! And it's scary to

> me to

> > be

> > > > completely dependent on something that

> isn't

> > even

> > > > working for me! I've done all the research

> and

> > been

> > > > the model patient -- doing everything I'm

> > supposed

> > > > to

> > > > be doing ... I really don't know where to

> go

> > from

> > > > here.

> > > > I do all the things one is supposed to do

> to

> > enhance

> > > > conversion too ...

> > > >

> > > > My doctor is not telling me anything

> > conclusive

> > > > about

> > > > where I should go from here ...

> > > >

> > > > The weird thing is that I feel worse than

> > before I

> > > > started treatment ... and my latest

> adrenal

> > test

> > > > results seem to show that my adrenals are

> > actually

> > > > doing ok (although this was an ACTH

> > stimulation test

> > > > to check adrenal reserve and my doctor has

> to

> > talk

> > > > to

> > > > the lab to get a conclusive interpretation

> of

> > the 2

> > > > 24

> > > > hr urine collection results which tests a

> > breakdown

> > > > of

> > > > all the adrenal hormones... and he won't

> be

> > able to

> > > > do

> > > > this for another 2 weeks!). I'm really

> > confused as

> > > > to

> > > > why I would feel worse [for 8 months now

> --

> > I'm

> > > > going

> > > > crazy -- things were pretty bad before

> > treatment for

> > > > 10+ years but I was still functioning --

> now

> > I'm not

> > > > nearly as functional as before ...]

> > > >

> > > > Every adrenal hormone in the test

> increased by

> > a

> > > > good

> > > > amount after the stimulation -- which it's

> > supposed

> > > > to

> > > > do -- except the aldosterone. It was a

> good

> > number

> > > > to

> > > > begin with but then it went down just a

> little

> > after

> > > > the stimulation. It is supposed to go up

> ...

> > but

> > > > what

> > > > I don't understand is that apparently the

> more

> > salt

> > > > you eat, the lower the aldosterone ...

> > aldosterone's

> > > > job is to keep salt in your body, so the

> more

> > you

> > > > eat,

> > > > the less is needed. Therefore I would

> think

> > that

> > > > having the surge of cortisol after the

> test

> > would

> > > > increase salt retention and therefore

> lower

> > > > aldosterone -- like happened with me --

> > however it

> > > > says that it is supposed to increase so

> ...

> > does

> > > > anyone know about this?

> > > >

> > > > I know I'm writing a letter that will be

> > difficult

> > > > to

> > > > respond to -- sorry, I just need to vent

> ...

> > > >

> > > > Marlena

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> ____________________________________________________

> > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your

> home

> > page

> > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

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Thanks Marlena - will do! I've just discovered that my doctor is on holiday (the nurse does the blood tests) so I suspect I'll get met with a big question mark when I ask for these, but at least I can ask the doctor the following week. It's great to have something to go on. I'm so encouraged - I'd been going on for a couple of years thinking there was nothing that could be done, with no idea of why I was getting these symptoms, and 'running down' so just to have hope is a wonderful turnaround:-)))) Many many thanks. Love Chris

Re: test> > results -- need ideas> > > > > > > Hi Topper,> > > Yes, I completely understand. This is an> obscure> > test> > > and no one is familiar with it, so it's hard> for> > you> > > to comment!> > >> > > All I can say is that it reflects how I feel> > more than> > > the blood tests did that I took in June when> I> > was on> > > 2.5 grains. TSH was 0.011 and frees were> both> > just> > > under the mid-range (and I still felt> terrible).> > T4> > > didn't look higher (in its own range) than> my T3> > so I> > > didn't think I was having a conversion> problem,> > I just> > > thought I needed a higher dosage!> > >> > > I need to find out the explanation of why my> > doctor> > > says this particular test measures how much> > hormone> > > the body is actually using -- how much the> > tissues are> > > actually getting affected by, regardless of> how> > much> > > is available in the blood. Some people can't> > fully use> > > what is available in the blood (for various> > reasons)> > > -- so for that reason, the free's seem the> best> > out of> > > all the blood tests but still not always> > conclusive,> > > IMO!> > >> > > Marlena> > >> > > --- topper2@... wrote:> > >> > > > My problem is that I've never seen> anything on> > urine> > > > testing for thyroid> > > > hormones. Since these do not specify that> they> > are> > > > Free Ts we have to> > > > assume that they are totals. Which means> you> > don't> > > > know how much hormone> > > > is available for use. Your T4 here is> showing> > very> > > > high... but how much> > > > of it is bound and unusable? If a lot of> it is> > > > bound, for whatever> > > > reason, then there isn't enough available> for> > > > conversion, which could be> > > > why the T3 is so low in it's range....> Then,> > if we> > > > continue to assume> > > > that these are totals, your available T3> is> > actually> > > > below range???> > > >> > > > I can't say that the urine tests are more,> or> > less,> > > > accurate than the> > > > blood tests, we just don't know for sure> what> > was> > > > tested (total or free,> > > > or if they can even differentiate between> free> > and> > > > bound hormone) and how> > > > those numbers, in their ranges, compare to> > what> > > > we've learned about blood> > > > levels and ranges.> > > >> > > > We know that you aren't feeling as well as> you> > > > should... but we don't> > > > know why, yet.... Using a totally> different> > testing> > > > method leaves us in> > > > the dark... we have no comparison, no> > experience, to> > > > know how to> > > > interpret them.> > > >> > > > Just my thoughts.....> > > >> > > > Topper ()> > > >> > > > On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 -0700 (PDT)> > Marlena> > > > writes:> > > > Ok y'all, so I finally got my most recent> > thyroid> > > > results in but I'm not sure where to go> from> > here.> > > > My> > > > doctor is pretty holistic and uses a more> > obsure> > > > test> > > > from a lab called Vitamin Diagnostics. It> is a> > 24 hr> > > > urine collection. Supposedly it tests the> > amount of> > > > hormone your body is actually using ...> anyway> > here> > > > are my results:> > > >> > > > 11/2004 (before treatment):> > > > T3 621 range 800-1800> > > > T4 1698 range 1800-3000> > > >> > > > 7/05 (since treatment ... it takes a month> to> > get> > > > the> > > > results!)> > > > T3 894 range 800-1800> > > > T4 3124 range 1800-3000> > > >> > > > So it looks like I'm not converting well.> Now> > I'm on> > > > 3> > > > grains of Armour plus 3.5 mcg sustained> > release T3.> > > > (I> > > > was actually taking 3 1/4 grains of Armour> and> > 25mcg> > > > of SR T3 at the time of the test (which> was> > over a> > > > month ago), but soon after felt so bad and> > > > eventually> > > > overstimulated that I cut way back) ... I> know> > my> > > > consistency hasn't been that good, but I> had> > to cut> > > > back -- the T3 doesn't have such a long> life> > so it> > > > seemed ok to me plus the decrease in T4> was> > probably> > > > good ... I'm also working with a medical> > intuitive> > > > who> > > > is helping me to figure things out a bit> --> > she told> > > > me that the 25 mcg was way too high (which> > > > correlated> > > > with my symptoms -- which for me was a> > feverish> > > > feeling and ultra fatigue, fast heartbeat> --> > not> > > > extra> > > > energy that's for sure). This doesn't make> > sense> > > > with> > > > my low T3 test result. It would seem that> my> > body> > > > would want more T3... from my results I'm> > guessing> > > > that my original thyroid production is> down to> > zero> > > > or> > > > almost zero (my last TSH while on 2.5> grains> > was> > > > .011)> > > > ... I'm just so frustrated ... I felt> better> > on no> > > > medication whatsoever! And it's scary to> me to> > be> > > > completely dependent on something that> isn't> > even> > > > working for me! I've done all the research> and> > been> > > > the model patient -- doing everything I'm> > supposed> > > > to> > > > be doing ... I really don't know where to> go> > from> > > > here.> > > > I do all the things one is supposed to do> to> > enhance> > > > conversion too ...> > > >> > > > My doctor is not telling me anything> > conclusive> > > > about> > > > where I should go from here ...> > > >> > > > The weird thing is that I feel worse than> > before I> > > > started treatment ... and my latest> adrenal> > test> > > > results seem to show that my adrenals are> > actually> > > > doing ok (although this was an ACTH> > stimulation test> > > > to check adrenal reserve and my doctor has> to> > talk> > > > to> > > > the lab to get a conclusive interpretation> of> > the 2> > > > 24> > > > hr urine collection results which tests a> > breakdown> > > > of> > > > all the adrenal hormones... and he won't> be> > able to> > > > do> > > > this for another 2 weeks!). I'm really> > confused as> > > > to> > > > why I would feel worse [for 8 months now> --> > I'm> > > > going> > > > crazy -- things were pretty bad before> > treatment for> > > > 10+ years but I was still functioning --> now> > I'm not> > > > nearly as functional as before ...]> > > >> > > > Every adrenal hormone in the test> increased by> > a> > > > good> > > > amount after the stimulation -- which it's> > supposed> > > > to> > > > do -- except the aldosterone. It was a> good> > number> > > > to> > > > begin with but then it went down just a> little> > after> > > > the stimulation. It is supposed to go up> ...> > but> > > > what> > > > I don't understand is that apparently the> more> > salt> > > > you eat, the lower the aldosterone ...> > aldosterone's> > > > job is to keep salt in your body, so the> more> > you> > > > eat,> > > > the less is needed. Therefore I would> think> > that> > > > having the surge of cortisol after the> test> > would> > > > increase salt retention and therefore> lower> > > > aldosterone -- like happened with me --> > however it> > > > says that it is supposed to increase so> ...> > does> > > > anyone know about this?> > > >> > > > I know I'm writing a letter that will be> > difficult> > > > to> > > > respond to -- sorry, I just need to vent> ...> > > >> > > > Marlena> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> ____________________________________________________> > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your> home> > page> > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >

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Thanks Marlena - will do! I've just discovered that my doctor is on holiday (the nurse does the blood tests) so I suspect I'll get met with a big question mark when I ask for these, but at least I can ask the doctor the following week. It's great to have something to go on. I'm so encouraged - I'd been going on for a couple of years thinking there was nothing that could be done, with no idea of why I was getting these symptoms, and 'running down' so just to have hope is a wonderful turnaround:-)))) Many many thanks. Love Chris

Re: test> > results -- need ideas> > > > > > > Hi Topper,> > > Yes, I completely understand. This is an> obscure> > test> > > and no one is familiar with it, so it's hard> for> > you> > > to comment!> > >> > > All I can say is that it reflects how I feel> > more than> > > the blood tests did that I took in June when> I> > was on> > > 2.5 grains. TSH was 0.011 and frees were> both> > just> > > under the mid-range (and I still felt> terrible).> > T4> > > didn't look higher (in its own range) than> my T3> > so I> > > didn't think I was having a conversion> problem,> > I just> > > thought I needed a higher dosage!> > >> > > I need to find out the explanation of why my> > doctor> > > says this particular test measures how much> > hormone> > > the body is actually using -- how much the> > tissues are> > > actually getting affected by, regardless of> how> > much> > > is available in the blood. Some people can't> > fully use> > > what is available in the blood (for various> > reasons)> > > -- so for that reason, the free's seem the> best> > out of> > > all the blood tests but still not always> > conclusive,> > > IMO!> > >> > > Marlena> > >> > > --- topper2@... wrote:> > >> > > > My problem is that I've never seen> anything on> > urine> > > > testing for thyroid> > > > hormones. Since these do not specify that> they> > are> > > > Free Ts we have to> > > > assume that they are totals. Which means> you> > don't> > > > know how much hormone> > > > is available for use. Your T4 here is> showing> > very> > > > high... but how much> > > > of it is bound and unusable? If a lot of> it is> > > > bound, for whatever> > > > reason, then there isn't enough available> for> > > > conversion, which could be> > > > why the T3 is so low in it's range....> Then,> > if we> > > > continue to assume> > > > that these are totals, your available T3> is> > actually> > > > below range???> > > >> > > > I can't say that the urine tests are more,> or> > less,> > > > accurate than the> > > > blood tests, we just don't know for sure> what> > was> > > > tested (total or free,> > > > or if they can even differentiate between> free> > and> > > > bound hormone) and how> > > > those numbers, in their ranges, compare to> > what> > > > we've learned about blood> > > > levels and ranges.> > > >> > > > We know that you aren't feeling as well as> you> > > > should... but we don't> > > > know why, yet.... Using a totally> different> > testing> > > > method leaves us in> > > > the dark... we have no comparison, no> > experience, to> > > > know how to> > > > interpret them.> > > >> > > > Just my thoughts.....> > > >> > > > Topper ()> > > >> > > > On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 -0700 (PDT)> > Marlena> > > > writes:> > > > Ok y'all, so I finally got my most recent> > thyroid> > > > results in but I'm not sure where to go> from> > here.> > > > My> > > > doctor is pretty holistic and uses a more> > obsure> > > > test> > > > from a lab called Vitamin Diagnostics. It> is a> > 24 hr> > > > urine collection. Supposedly it tests the> > amount of> > > > hormone your body is actually using ...> anyway> > here> > > > are my results:> > > >> > > > 11/2004 (before treatment):> > > > T3 621 range 800-1800> > > > T4 1698 range 1800-3000> > > >> > > > 7/05 (since treatment ... it takes a month> to> > get> > > > the> > > > results!)> > > > T3 894 range 800-1800> > > > T4 3124 range 1800-3000> > > >> > > > So it looks like I'm not converting well.> Now> > I'm on> > > > 3> > > > grains of Armour plus 3.5 mcg sustained> > release T3.> > > > (I> > > > was actually taking 3 1/4 grains of Armour> and> > 25mcg> > > > of SR T3 at the time of the test (which> was> > over a> > > > month ago), but soon after felt so bad and> > > > eventually> > > > overstimulated that I cut way back) ... I> know> > my> > > > consistency hasn't been that good, but I> had> > to cut> > > > back -- the T3 doesn't have such a long> life> > so it> > > > seemed ok to me plus the decrease in T4> was> > probably> > > > good ... I'm also working with a medical> > intuitive> > > > who> > > > is helping me to figure things out a bit> --> > she told> > > > me that the 25 mcg was way too high (which> > > > correlated> > > > with my symptoms -- which for me was a> > feverish> > > > feeling and ultra fatigue, fast heartbeat> --> > not> > > > extra> > > > energy that's for sure). This doesn't make> > sense> > > > with> > > > my low T3 test result. It would seem that> my> > body> > > > would want more T3... from my results I'm> > guessing> > > > that my original thyroid production is> down to> > zero> > > > or> > > > almost zero (my last TSH while on 2.5> grains> > was> > > > .011)> > > > ... I'm just so frustrated ... I felt> better> > on no> > > > medication whatsoever! And it's scary to> me to> > be> > > > completely dependent on something that> isn't> > even> > > > working for me! I've done all the research> and> > been> > > > the model patient -- doing everything I'm> > supposed> > > > to> > > > be doing ... I really don't know where to> go> > from> > > > here.> > > > I do all the things one is supposed to do> to> > enhance> > > > conversion too ...> > > >> > > > My doctor is not telling me anything> > conclusive> > > > about> > > > where I should go from here ...> > > >> > > > The weird thing is that I feel worse than> > before I> > > > started treatment ... and my latest> adrenal> > test> > > > results seem to show that my adrenals are> > actually> > > > doing ok (although this was an ACTH> > stimulation test> > > > to check adrenal reserve and my doctor has> to> > talk> > > > to> > > > the lab to get a conclusive interpretation> of> > the 2> > > > 24> > > > hr urine collection results which tests a> > breakdown> > > > of> > > > all the adrenal hormones... and he won't> be> > able to> > > > do> > > > this for another 2 weeks!). I'm really> > confused as> > > > to> > > > why I would feel worse [for 8 months now> --> > I'm> > > > going> > > > crazy -- things were pretty bad before> > treatment for> > > > 10+ years but I was still functioning --> now> > I'm not> > > > nearly as functional as before ...]> > > >> > > > Every adrenal hormone in the test> increased by> > a> > > > good> > > > amount after the stimulation -- which it's> > supposed> > > > to> > > > do -- except the aldosterone. It was a> good> > number> > > > to> > > > begin with but then it went down just a> little> > after> > > > the stimulation. It is supposed to go up> ...> > but> > > > what> > > > I don't understand is that apparently the> more> > salt> > > > you eat, the lower the aldosterone ...> > aldosterone's> > > > job is to keep salt in your body, so the> more> > you> > > > eat,> > > > the less is needed. Therefore I would> think> > that> > > > having the surge of cortisol after the> test> > would> > > > increase salt retention and therefore> lower> > > > aldosterone -- like happened with me --> > however it> > > > says that it is supposed to increase so> ...> > does> > > > anyone know about this?> > > >> > > > I know I'm writing a letter that will be> > difficult> > > > to> > > > respond to -- sorry, I just need to vent> ...> > > >> > > > Marlena> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> ____________________________________________________> > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your> home> > page> > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >

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Thanks Marlena - will do! I've just discovered that my doctor is on holiday (the nurse does the blood tests) so I suspect I'll get met with a big question mark when I ask for these, but at least I can ask the doctor the following week. It's great to have something to go on. I'm so encouraged - I'd been going on for a couple of years thinking there was nothing that could be done, with no idea of why I was getting these symptoms, and 'running down' so just to have hope is a wonderful turnaround:-)))) Many many thanks. Love Chris

Re: test> > results -- need ideas> > > > > > > Hi Topper,> > > Yes, I completely understand. This is an> obscure> > test> > > and no one is familiar with it, so it's hard> for> > you> > > to comment!> > >> > > All I can say is that it reflects how I feel> > more than> > > the blood tests did that I took in June when> I> > was on> > > 2.5 grains. TSH was 0.011 and frees were> both> > just> > > under the mid-range (and I still felt> terrible).> > T4> > > didn't look higher (in its own range) than> my T3> > so I> > > didn't think I was having a conversion> problem,> > I just> > > thought I needed a higher dosage!> > >> > > I need to find out the explanation of why my> > doctor> > > says this particular test measures how much> > hormone> > > the body is actually using -- how much the> > tissues are> > > actually getting affected by, regardless of> how> > much> > > is available in the blood. Some people can't> > fully use> > > what is available in the blood (for various> > reasons)> > > -- so for that reason, the free's seem the> best> > out of> > > all the blood tests but still not always> > conclusive,> > > IMO!> > >> > > Marlena> > >> > > --- topper2@... wrote:> > >> > > > My problem is that I've never seen> anything on> > urine> > > > testing for thyroid> > > > hormones. Since these do not specify that> they> > are> > > > Free Ts we have to> > > > assume that they are totals. Which means> you> > don't> > > > know how much hormone> > > > is available for use. Your T4 here is> showing> > very> > > > high... but how much> > > > of it is bound and unusable? If a lot of> it is> > > > bound, for whatever> > > > reason, then there isn't enough available> for> > > > conversion, which could be> > > > why the T3 is so low in it's range....> Then,> > if we> > > > continue to assume> > > > that these are totals, your available T3> is> > actually> > > > below range???> > > >> > > > I can't say that the urine tests are more,> or> > less,> > > > accurate than the> > > > blood tests, we just don't know for sure> what> > was> > > > tested (total or free,> > > > or if they can even differentiate between> free> > and> > > > bound hormone) and how> > > > those numbers, in their ranges, compare to> > what> > > > we've learned about blood> > > > levels and ranges.> > > >> > > > We know that you aren't feeling as well as> you> > > > should... but we don't> > > > know why, yet.... Using a totally> different> > testing> > > > method leaves us in> > > > the dark... we have no comparison, no> > experience, to> > > > know how to> > > > interpret them.> > > >> > > > Just my thoughts.....> > > >> > > > Topper ()> > > >> > > > On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 -0700 (PDT)> > Marlena> > > > writes:> > > > Ok y'all, so I finally got my most recent> > thyroid> > > > results in but I'm not sure where to go> from> > here.> > > > My> > > > doctor is pretty holistic and uses a more> > obsure> > > > test> > > > from a lab called Vitamin Diagnostics. It> is a> > 24 hr> > > > urine collection. Supposedly it tests the> > amount of> > > > hormone your body is actually using ...> anyway> > here> > > > are my results:> > > >> > > > 11/2004 (before treatment):> > > > T3 621 range 800-1800> > > > T4 1698 range 1800-3000> > > >> > > > 7/05 (since treatment ... it takes a month> to> > get> > > > the> > > > results!)> > > > T3 894 range 800-1800> > > > T4 3124 range 1800-3000> > > >> > > > So it looks like I'm not converting well.> Now> > I'm on> > > > 3> > > > grains of Armour plus 3.5 mcg sustained> > release T3.> > > > (I> > > > was actually taking 3 1/4 grains of Armour> and> > 25mcg> > > > of SR T3 at the time of the test (which> was> > over a> > > > month ago), but soon after felt so bad and> > > > eventually> > > > overstimulated that I cut way back) ... I> know> > my> > > > consistency hasn't been that good, but I> had> > to cut> > > > back -- the T3 doesn't have such a long> life> > so it> > > > seemed ok to me plus the decrease in T4> was> > probably> > > > good ... I'm also working with a medical> > intuitive> > > > who> > > > is helping me to figure things out a bit> --> > she told> > > > me that the 25 mcg was way too high (which> > > > correlated> > > > with my symptoms -- which for me was a> > feverish> > > > feeling and ultra fatigue, fast heartbeat> --> > not> > > > extra> > > > energy that's for sure). This doesn't make> > sense> > > > with> > > > my low T3 test result. It would seem that> my> > body> > > > would want more T3... from my results I'm> > guessing> > > > that my original thyroid production is> down to> > zero> > > > or> > > > almost zero (my last TSH while on 2.5> grains> > was> > > > .011)> > > > ... I'm just so frustrated ... I felt> better> > on no> > > > medication whatsoever! And it's scary to> me to> > be> > > > completely dependent on something that> isn't> > even> > > > working for me! I've done all the research> and> > been> > > > the model patient -- doing everything I'm> > supposed> > > > to> > > > be doing ... I really don't know where to> go> > from> > > > here.> > > > I do all the things one is supposed to do> to> > enhance> > > > conversion too ...> > > >> > > > My doctor is not telling me anything> > conclusive> > > > about> > > > where I should go from here ...> > > >> > > > The weird thing is that I feel worse than> > before I> > > > started treatment ... and my latest> adrenal> > test> > > > results seem to show that my adrenals are> > actually> > > > doing ok (although this was an ACTH> > stimulation test> > > > to check adrenal reserve and my doctor has> to> > talk> > > > to> > > > the lab to get a conclusive interpretation> of> > the 2> > > > 24> > > > hr urine collection results which tests a> > breakdown> > > > of> > > > all the adrenal hormones... and he won't> be> > able to> > > > do> > > > this for another 2 weeks!). I'm really> > confused as> > > > to> > > > why I would feel worse [for 8 months now> --> > I'm> > > > going> > > > crazy -- things were pretty bad before> > treatment for> > > > 10+ years but I was still functioning --> now> > I'm not> > > > nearly as functional as before ...]> > > >> > > > Every adrenal hormone in the test> increased by> > a> > > > good> > > > amount after the stimulation -- which it's> > supposed> > > > to> > > > do -- except the aldosterone. It was a> good> > number> > > > to> > > > begin with but then it went down just a> little> > after> > > > the stimulation. It is supposed to go up> ...> > but> > > > what> > > > I don't understand is that apparently the> more> > salt> > > > you eat, the lower the aldosterone ...> > aldosterone's> > > > job is to keep salt in your body, so the> more> > you> > > > eat,> > > > the less is needed. Therefore I would> think> > that> > > > having the surge of cortisol after the> test> > would> > > > increase salt retention and therefore> lower> > > > aldosterone -- like happened with me --> > however it> > > > says that it is supposed to increase so> ...> > does> > > > anyone know about this?> > > >> > > > I know I'm writing a letter that will be> > difficult> > > > to> > > > respond to -- sorry, I just need to vent> ...> > > >> > > > Marlena> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> ____________________________________________________> > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your> home> > page> > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >

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I definitely think there is hope!

---

wrote:

> Thanks Marlena - will do! I've just discovered that

> my doctor is on holiday (the nurse does the blood

> tests) so I suspect I'll get met with a big question

> mark when I ask for these, but at least I can ask

> the doctor the following week. It's great to have

> something to go on. I'm so encouraged - I'd been

> going on for a couple of years thinking there was

> nothing that could be done, with no idea of why I

> was getting these symptoms, and 'running down' so

> just to have hope is a wonderful turnaround:-))))

> Many many thanks. Love Chris

> Re:

> test

> > > results -- need ideas

> > >

> > >

> > > > Hi Topper,

> > > > Yes, I completely understand. This is an

> > obscure

> > > test

> > > > and no one is familiar with it, so it's

> hard

> > for

> > > you

> > > > to comment!

> > > >

> > > > All I can say is that it reflects how I

> feel

> > > more than

> > > > the blood tests did that I took in June

> when

> > I

> > > was on

> > > > 2.5 grains. TSH was 0.011 and frees were

> > both

> > > just

> > > > under the mid-range (and I still felt

> > terrible).

> > > T4

> > > > didn't look higher (in its own range)

> than

> > my T3

> > > so I

> > > > didn't think I was having a conversion

> > problem,

> > > I just

> > > > thought I needed a higher dosage!

> > > >

> > > > I need to find out the explanation of

> why my

> > > doctor

> > > > says this particular test measures how

> much

> > > hormone

> > > > the body is actually using -- how much

> the

> > > tissues are

> > > > actually getting affected by, regardless

> of

> > how

> > > much

> > > > is available in the blood. Some people

> can't

> > > fully use

> > > > what is available in the blood (for

> various

> > > reasons)

> > > > -- so for that reason, the free's seem

> the

> > best

> > > out of

> > > > all the blood tests but still not always

> > > conclusive,

> > > > IMO!

> > > >

> > > > Marlena

> > > >

> > > > --- topper2@... wrote:

> > > >

> > > > > My problem is that I've never seen

> > anything on

> > > urine

> > > > > testing for thyroid

> > > > > hormones. Since these do not specify

> that

> > they

> > > are

> > > > > Free Ts we have to

> > > > > assume that they are totals. Which

> means

> > you

> > > don't

> > > > > know how much hormone

> > > > > is available for use. Your T4 here is

> > showing

> > > very

> > > > > high... but how much

> > > > > of it is bound and unusable? If a lot

> of

> > it is

> > > > > bound, for whatever

> > > > > reason, then there isn't enough

> available

> > for

> > > > > conversion, which could be

> > > > > why the T3 is so low in it's range....

> > Then,

> > > if we

> > > > > continue to assume

> > > > > that these are totals, your available

> T3

> > is

> > > actually

> > > > > below range???

> > > > >

> > > > > I can't say that the urine tests are

> more,

> > or

> > > less,

> > > > > accurate than the

> > > > > blood tests, we just don't know for

> sure

> > what

> > > was

> > > > > tested (total or free,

> > > > > or if they can even differentiate

> between

> > free

> > > and

> > > > > bound hormone) and how

> > > > > those numbers, in their ranges,

> compare to

> > > what

> > > > > we've learned about blood

> > > > > levels and ranges.

> > > > >

> > > > > We know that you aren't feeling as

> well as

> > you

> > > > > should... but we don't

> > > > > know why, yet.... Using a totally

> > different

> > > testing

> > > > > method leaves us in

> > > > > the dark... we have no comparison, no

> > > experience, to

> > > > > know how to

> > > > > interpret them.

> > > > >

> > > > > Just my thoughts.....

> > > > >

> > > > > Topper ()

> > > > >

> > > > > On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 -0700

> (PDT)

> > > Marlena

> > > > > writes:

> > > > > Ok y'all, so I finally got my most

> recent

> > > thyroid

> > > > > results in but I'm not sure where to

> go

> > from

> > > here.

> > > > > My

> > > > > doctor is pretty holistic and uses a

> more

> > > obsure

> > > > > test

> > > > > from a lab called Vitamin Diagnostics.

> It

> > is a

> > > 24 hr

> > > > > urine collection. Supposedly it tests

> the

> > > amount of

> > > > > hormone your body is actually using

> ...

> > anyway

> > > here

> > > > > are my results:

> > > > >

> > > > > 11/2004 (before treatment):

> > > > > T3 621 range 800-1800

> > > > > T4 1698 range 1800-3000

> > > > >

> > > > > 7/05 (since treatment ... it takes a

> month

> > to

> > > get

> > > > > the

> > > > > results!)

> > > > > T3 894 range 800-1800

> > > > > T4 3124 range 1800-3000

> > > > >

> > > > > So it looks like I'm not converting

> well.

> > Now

> > > I'm on

> > > > > 3

> > > > > grains of Armour plus 3.5 mcg

> sustained

> > > release T3.

> > > > > (I

> > > > > was actually taking 3 1/4 grains of

> Armour

> > and

> > > 25mcg

> > > > > of SR T3 at the time of the test

> (which

> > was

> > > over a

> > > > > month ago), but soon after felt so bad

> and

> > > > > eventually

> > > > > overstimulated that I cut way back)

> ... I

> > know

> > > my

> > > > > consistency hasn't been that good, but

> I

> > had

> > > to cut

> > > > > back -- the T3 doesn't have such a

> long

> > life

> > > so it

> > > > > seemed ok to me plus the decrease in

> T4

> > was

> > > probably

> > > > > good ... I'm also working with a

> medical

> > > intuitive

> > > > > who

> > > > > is helping me to figure things out a

> bit

> > --

> > > she told

> > > > > me that the 25 mcg was way too high

> (which

> > > > > correlated

> > > > > with my symptoms -- which for me was a

> > > feverish

> > > > > feeling and ultra fatigue, fast

> heartbeat

> > --

> > > not

> > > > > extra

> > > > > energy that's for sure). This doesn't

> make

> > > sense

> > > > > with

> > > > > my low T3 test result. It would seem

> that

> > my

> > > body

> > > > > would want more T3... from my results

> I'm

> > > guessing

> > > > > that my original thyroid production is

> > down to

> > > zero

> > > > > or

> > > > > almost zero (my last TSH while on 2.5

> > grains

> > > was

> > > > > .011)

> > > > > ... I'm just so frustrated ... I felt

> > better

> > > on no

> > > > > medication whatsoever! And it's scary

> to

> > me to

> > > be

> > > > > completely dependent on something that

> > isn't

> > > even

> > > > > working for me! I've done all the

> research

> > and

> > > been

> > > > > the model patient -- doing everything

> I'm

> > > supposed

> > > > > to

> > > > > be doing ... I really don't know where

> to

> > go

> > > from

> > > > > here.

> > > > > I do all the things one is supposed to

> do

> > to

> > > enhance

> > > > > conversion too ...

> > > > >

> > > > > My doctor is not telling me anything

> > > conclusive

> > > > > about

> > > > > where I should go from here ...

> > > > >

> > > > > The weird thing is that I feel worse

> than

> > > before I

> > > > > started treatment ... and my latest

> > adrenal

> > > test

> > > > > results seem to show that my adrenals

> are

> > > actually

> > > > > doing ok (although this was an ACTH

> > > stimulation test

> > > > > to check adrenal reserve and my doctor

> has

> > to

> > > talk

> > > > > to

> > > > > the lab to get a conclusive

> interpretation

> > of

> > > the 2

> > > > > 24

> > > > > hr urine collection results which

> tests a

> > > breakdown

> > > > > of

> > > > > all the adrenal hormones... and he

> won't

> > be

> > > able to

> > > > > do

> > > > > this for another 2 weeks!). I'm really

> > > confused as

> > > > > to

> > > > > why I would feel worse [for 8 months

> now

> > --

> > > I'm

> > > > > going

> > > > > crazy -- things were pretty bad before

> > > treatment for

> > > > > 10+ years but I was still functioning

> --

> > now

> > > I'm not

> > > > > nearly as functional as before ...]

> > > > >

> > > > > Every adrenal hormone in the test

> > increased by

> > > a

> > > > > good

> > > > > amount after the stimulation -- which

> it's

> > > supposed

> > > > > to

> > > > > do -- except the aldosterone. It was a

> > good

> > > number

> > > > > to

> > > > > begin with but then it went down just

> a

> > little

> > > after

> > > > > the stimulation. It is supposed to go

> up

> > ...

> > > but

> > > > > what

> > > > > I don't understand is that apparently

> the

> > more

> > > salt

> > > > > you eat, the lower the aldosterone ...

> > > aldosterone's

> > > > > job is to keep salt in your body, so

> the

> > more

> > > you

> > > > > eat,

> > > > > the less is needed. Therefore I would

> > think

> > > that

> > > > > having the surge of cortisol after the

> > test

> > > would

> > > > > increase salt retention and therefore

> > lower

> > > > > aldosterone -- like happened with me

> --

> > > however it

> > > > > says that it is supposed to increase

> so

> > ...

> > > does

> > > > > anyone know about this?

> > > > >

> > > > > I know I'm writing a letter that will

> be

> > > difficult

> > > > > to

> > > > > respond to -- sorry, I just need to

> vent

> > ...

> > > > >

> > > > > Marlena

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> ____________________________________________________

> > > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it

> your

> > home

> > > page

> > > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

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Share on other sites

I definitely think there is hope!

---

wrote:

> Thanks Marlena - will do! I've just discovered that

> my doctor is on holiday (the nurse does the blood

> tests) so I suspect I'll get met with a big question

> mark when I ask for these, but at least I can ask

> the doctor the following week. It's great to have

> something to go on. I'm so encouraged - I'd been

> going on for a couple of years thinking there was

> nothing that could be done, with no idea of why I

> was getting these symptoms, and 'running down' so

> just to have hope is a wonderful turnaround:-))))

> Many many thanks. Love Chris

> Re:

> test

> > > results -- need ideas

> > >

> > >

> > > > Hi Topper,

> > > > Yes, I completely understand. This is an

> > obscure

> > > test

> > > > and no one is familiar with it, so it's

> hard

> > for

> > > you

> > > > to comment!

> > > >

> > > > All I can say is that it reflects how I

> feel

> > > more than

> > > > the blood tests did that I took in June

> when

> > I

> > > was on

> > > > 2.5 grains. TSH was 0.011 and frees were

> > both

> > > just

> > > > under the mid-range (and I still felt

> > terrible).

> > > T4

> > > > didn't look higher (in its own range)

> than

> > my T3

> > > so I

> > > > didn't think I was having a conversion

> > problem,

> > > I just

> > > > thought I needed a higher dosage!

> > > >

> > > > I need to find out the explanation of

> why my

> > > doctor

> > > > says this particular test measures how

> much

> > > hormone

> > > > the body is actually using -- how much

> the

> > > tissues are

> > > > actually getting affected by, regardless

> of

> > how

> > > much

> > > > is available in the blood. Some people

> can't

> > > fully use

> > > > what is available in the blood (for

> various

> > > reasons)

> > > > -- so for that reason, the free's seem

> the

> > best

> > > out of

> > > > all the blood tests but still not always

> > > conclusive,

> > > > IMO!

> > > >

> > > > Marlena

> > > >

> > > > --- topper2@... wrote:

> > > >

> > > > > My problem is that I've never seen

> > anything on

> > > urine

> > > > > testing for thyroid

> > > > > hormones. Since these do not specify

> that

> > they

> > > are

> > > > > Free Ts we have to

> > > > > assume that they are totals. Which

> means

> > you

> > > don't

> > > > > know how much hormone

> > > > > is available for use. Your T4 here is

> > showing

> > > very

> > > > > high... but how much

> > > > > of it is bound and unusable? If a lot

> of

> > it is

> > > > > bound, for whatever

> > > > > reason, then there isn't enough

> available

> > for

> > > > > conversion, which could be

> > > > > why the T3 is so low in it's range....

> > Then,

> > > if we

> > > > > continue to assume

> > > > > that these are totals, your available

> T3

> > is

> > > actually

> > > > > below range???

> > > > >

> > > > > I can't say that the urine tests are

> more,

> > or

> > > less,

> > > > > accurate than the

> > > > > blood tests, we just don't know for

> sure

> > what

> > > was

> > > > > tested (total or free,

> > > > > or if they can even differentiate

> between

> > free

> > > and

> > > > > bound hormone) and how

> > > > > those numbers, in their ranges,

> compare to

> > > what

> > > > > we've learned about blood

> > > > > levels and ranges.

> > > > >

> > > > > We know that you aren't feeling as

> well as

> > you

> > > > > should... but we don't

> > > > > know why, yet.... Using a totally

> > different

> > > testing

> > > > > method leaves us in

> > > > > the dark... we have no comparison, no

> > > experience, to

> > > > > know how to

> > > > > interpret them.

> > > > >

> > > > > Just my thoughts.....

> > > > >

> > > > > Topper ()

> > > > >

> > > > > On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 -0700

> (PDT)

> > > Marlena

> > > > > writes:

> > > > > Ok y'all, so I finally got my most

> recent

> > > thyroid

> > > > > results in but I'm not sure where to

> go

> > from

> > > here.

> > > > > My

> > > > > doctor is pretty holistic and uses a

> more

> > > obsure

> > > > > test

> > > > > from a lab called Vitamin Diagnostics.

> It

> > is a

> > > 24 hr

> > > > > urine collection. Supposedly it tests

> the

> > > amount of

> > > > > hormone your body is actually using

> ...

> > anyway

> > > here

> > > > > are my results:

> > > > >

> > > > > 11/2004 (before treatment):

> > > > > T3 621 range 800-1800

> > > > > T4 1698 range 1800-3000

> > > > >

> > > > > 7/05 (since treatment ... it takes a

> month

> > to

> > > get

> > > > > the

> > > > > results!)

> > > > > T3 894 range 800-1800

> > > > > T4 3124 range 1800-3000

> > > > >

> > > > > So it looks like I'm not converting

> well.

> > Now

> > > I'm on

> > > > > 3

> > > > > grains of Armour plus 3.5 mcg

> sustained

> > > release T3.

> > > > > (I

> > > > > was actually taking 3 1/4 grains of

> Armour

> > and

> > > 25mcg

> > > > > of SR T3 at the time of the test

> (which

> > was

> > > over a

> > > > > month ago), but soon after felt so bad

> and

> > > > > eventually

> > > > > overstimulated that I cut way back)

> ... I

> > know

> > > my

> > > > > consistency hasn't been that good, but

> I

> > had

> > > to cut

> > > > > back -- the T3 doesn't have such a

> long

> > life

> > > so it

> > > > > seemed ok to me plus the decrease in

> T4

> > was

> > > probably

> > > > > good ... I'm also working with a

> medical

> > > intuitive

> > > > > who

> > > > > is helping me to figure things out a

> bit

> > --

> > > she told

> > > > > me that the 25 mcg was way too high

> (which

> > > > > correlated

> > > > > with my symptoms -- which for me was a

> > > feverish

> > > > > feeling and ultra fatigue, fast

> heartbeat

> > --

> > > not

> > > > > extra

> > > > > energy that's for sure). This doesn't

> make

> > > sense

> > > > > with

> > > > > my low T3 test result. It would seem

> that

> > my

> > > body

> > > > > would want more T3... from my results

> I'm

> > > guessing

> > > > > that my original thyroid production is

> > down to

> > > zero

> > > > > or

> > > > > almost zero (my last TSH while on 2.5

> > grains

> > > was

> > > > > .011)

> > > > > ... I'm just so frustrated ... I felt

> > better

> > > on no

> > > > > medication whatsoever! And it's scary

> to

> > me to

> > > be

> > > > > completely dependent on something that

> > isn't

> > > even

> > > > > working for me! I've done all the

> research

> > and

> > > been

> > > > > the model patient -- doing everything

> I'm

> > > supposed

> > > > > to

> > > > > be doing ... I really don't know where

> to

> > go

> > > from

> > > > > here.

> > > > > I do all the things one is supposed to

> do

> > to

> > > enhance

> > > > > conversion too ...

> > > > >

> > > > > My doctor is not telling me anything

> > > conclusive

> > > > > about

> > > > > where I should go from here ...

> > > > >

> > > > > The weird thing is that I feel worse

> than

> > > before I

> > > > > started treatment ... and my latest

> > adrenal

> > > test

> > > > > results seem to show that my adrenals

> are

> > > actually

> > > > > doing ok (although this was an ACTH

> > > stimulation test

> > > > > to check adrenal reserve and my doctor

> has

> > to

> > > talk

> > > > > to

> > > > > the lab to get a conclusive

> interpretation

> > of

> > > the 2

> > > > > 24

> > > > > hr urine collection results which

> tests a

> > > breakdown

> > > > > of

> > > > > all the adrenal hormones... and he

> won't

> > be

> > > able to

> > > > > do

> > > > > this for another 2 weeks!). I'm really

> > > confused as

> > > > > to

> > > > > why I would feel worse [for 8 months

> now

> > --

> > > I'm

> > > > > going

> > > > > crazy -- things were pretty bad before

> > > treatment for

> > > > > 10+ years but I was still functioning

> --

> > now

> > > I'm not

> > > > > nearly as functional as before ...]

> > > > >

> > > > > Every adrenal hormone in the test

> > increased by

> > > a

> > > > > good

> > > > > amount after the stimulation -- which

> it's

> > > supposed

> > > > > to

> > > > > do -- except the aldosterone. It was a

> > good

> > > number

> > > > > to

> > > > > begin with but then it went down just

> a

> > little

> > > after

> > > > > the stimulation. It is supposed to go

> up

> > ...

> > > but

> > > > > what

> > > > > I don't understand is that apparently

> the

> > more

> > > salt

> > > > > you eat, the lower the aldosterone ...

> > > aldosterone's

> > > > > job is to keep salt in your body, so

> the

> > more

> > > you

> > > > > eat,

> > > > > the less is needed. Therefore I would

> > think

> > > that

> > > > > having the surge of cortisol after the

> > test

> > > would

> > > > > increase salt retention and therefore

> > lower

> > > > > aldosterone -- like happened with me

> --

> > > however it

> > > > > says that it is supposed to increase

> so

> > ...

> > > does

> > > > > anyone know about this?

> > > > >

> > > > > I know I'm writing a letter that will

> be

> > > difficult

> > > > > to

> > > > > respond to -- sorry, I just need to

> vent

> > ...

> > > > >

> > > > > Marlena

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> ____________________________________________________

> > > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it

> your

> > home

> > > page

> > > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

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Thanks Marlena:-))))))))))) Love Chris

Re: > test> > > results -- need ideas> > > > > > > > > > Hi Topper,> > > > Yes, I completely understand. This is an> > obscure> > > test> > > > and no one is familiar with it, so it's> hard> > for> > > you> > > > to comment!> > > >> > > > All I can say is that it reflects how I> feel> > > more than> > > > the blood tests did that I took in June> when> > I> > > was on> > > > 2.5 grains. TSH was 0.011 and frees were> > both> > > just> > > > under the mid-range (and I still felt> > terrible).> > > T4> > > > didn't look higher (in its own range)> than> > my T3> > > so I> > > > didn't think I was having a conversion> > problem,> > > I just> > > > thought I needed a higher dosage!> > > >> > > > I need to find out the explanation of> why my> > > doctor> > > > says this particular test measures how> much> > > hormone> > > > the body is actually using -- how much> the> > > tissues are> > > > actually getting affected by, regardless> of> > how> > > much> > > > is available in the blood. Some people> can't> > > fully use> > > > what is available in the blood (for> various> > > reasons)> > > > -- so for that reason, the free's seem> the> > best> > > out of> > > > all the blood tests but still not always> > > conclusive,> > > > IMO!> > > >> > > > Marlena> > > >> > > > --- topper2@... wrote:> > > >> > > > > My problem is that I've never seen> > anything on> > > urine> > > > > testing for thyroid> > > > > hormones. Since these do not specify> that> > they> > > are> > > > > Free Ts we have to> > > > > assume that they are totals. Which> means> > you> > > don't> > > > > know how much hormone> > > > > is available for use. Your T4 here is> > showing> > > very> > > > > high... but how much> > > > > of it is bound and unusable? If a lot> of> > it is> > > > > bound, for whatever> > > > > reason, then there isn't enough> available> > for> > > > > conversion, which could be> > > > > why the T3 is so low in it's range....> > Then,> > > if we> > > > > continue to assume> > > > > that these are totals, your available> T3> > is> > > actually> > > > > below range???> > > > >> > > > > I can't say that the urine tests are> more,> > or> > > less,> > > > > accurate than the> > > > > blood tests, we just don't know for> sure> > what> > > was> > > > > tested (total or free,> > > > > or if they can even differentiate> between> > free> > > and> > > > > bound hormone) and how> > > > > those numbers, in their ranges,> compare to> > > what> > > > > we've learned about blood> > > > > levels and ranges.> > > > >> > > > > We know that you aren't feeling as> well as> > you> > > > > should... but we don't> > > > > know why, yet.... Using a totally> > different> > > testing> > > > > method leaves us in> > > > > the dark... we have no comparison, no> > > experience, to> > > > > know how to> > > > > interpret them.> > > > >> > > > > Just my thoughts.....> > > > >> > > > > Topper ()> > > > >> > > > > On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 -0700> (PDT)> > > Marlena> > > > > writes:> > > > > Ok y'all, so I finally got my most> recent> > > thyroid> > > > > results in but I'm not sure where to> go> > from> > > here.> > > > > My> > > > > doctor is pretty holistic and uses a> more> > > obsure> > > > > test> > > > > from a lab called Vitamin Diagnostics.> It> > is a> > > 24 hr> > > > > urine collection. Supposedly it tests> the> > > amount of> > > > > hormone your body is actually using> ...> > anyway> > > here> > > > > are my results:> > > > >> > > > > 11/2004 (before treatment):> > > > > T3 621 range 800-1800> > > > > T4 1698 range 1800-3000> > > > >> > > > > 7/05 (since treatment ... it takes a> month> > to> > > get> > > > > the> > > > > results!)> > > > > T3 894 range 800-1800> > > > > T4 3124 range 1800-3000> > > > >> > > > > So it looks like I'm not converting> well.> > Now> > > I'm on> > > > > 3> > > > > grains of Armour plus 3.5 mcg> sustained> > > release T3.> > > > > (I> > > > > was actually taking 3 1/4 grains of> Armour> > and> > > 25mcg> > > > > of SR T3 at the time of the test> (which> > was> > > over a> > > > > month ago), but soon after felt so bad> and> > > > > eventually> > > > > overstimulated that I cut way back)> ... I> > know> > > my> > > > > consistency hasn't been that good, but> I> > had> > > to cut> > > > > back -- the T3 doesn't have such a> long> > life> > > so it> > > > > seemed ok to me plus the decrease in> T4> > was> > > probably> > > > > good ... I'm also working with a> medical> > > intuitive> > > > > who> > > > > is helping me to figure things out a> bit> > --> > > she told> > > > > me that the 25 mcg was way too high> (which> > > > > correlated> > > > > with my symptoms -- which for me was a> > > feverish> > > > > feeling and ultra fatigue, fast> heartbeat> > --> > > not> > > > > extra> > > > > energy that's for sure). This doesn't> make> > > sense> > > > > with> > > > > my low T3 test result. It would seem> that> > my> > > body> > > > > would want more T3... from my results> I'm> > > guessing> > > > > that my original thyroid production is> > down to> > > zero> > > > > or> > > > > almost zero (my last TSH while on 2.5> > grains> > > was> > > > > .011)> > > > > ... I'm just so frustrated ... I felt> > better> > > on no> > > > > medication whatsoever! And it's scary> to> > me to> > > be> > > > > completely dependent on something that> > isn't> > > even> > > > > working for me! I've done all the> research> > and> > > been> > > > > the model patient -- doing everything> I'm> > > supposed> > > > > to> > > > > be doing ... I really don't know where> to> > go> > > from> > > > > here.> > > > > I do all the things one is supposed to> do> > to> > > enhance> > > > > conversion too ...> > > > >> > > > > My doctor is not telling me anything> > > conclusive> > > > > about> > > > > where I should go from here ...> > > > >> > > > > The weird thing is that I feel worse> than> > > before I> > > > > started treatment ... and my latest> > adrenal> > > test> > > > > results seem to show that my adrenals> are> > > actually> > > > > doing ok (although this was an ACTH> > > stimulation test> > > > > to check adrenal reserve and my doctor> has> > to> > > talk> > > > > to> > > > > the lab to get a conclusive> interpretation> > of> > > the 2> > > > > 24> > > > > hr urine collection results which> tests a> > > breakdown> > > > > of> > > > > all the adrenal hormones... and he> won't> > be> > > able to> > > > > do> > > > > this for another 2 weeks!). I'm really> > > confused as> > > > > to> > > > > why I would feel worse [for 8 months> now> > --> > > I'm> > > > > going> > > > > crazy -- things were pretty bad before> > > treatment for> > > > > 10+ years but I was still functioning> --> > now> > > I'm not> > > > > nearly as functional as before ...]> > > > >> > > > > Every adrenal hormone in the test> > increased by> > > a> > > > > good> > > > > amount after the stimulation -- which> it's> > > supposed> > > > > to> > > > > do -- except the aldosterone. It was a> > good> > > number> > > > > to> > > > > begin with but then it went down just> a> > little> > > after> > > > > the stimulation. It is supposed to go> up> > ...> > > but> > > > > what> > > > > I don't understand is that apparently> the> > more> > > salt> > > > > you eat, the lower the aldosterone ...> > > aldosterone's> > > > > job is to keep salt in your body, so> the> > more> > > you> > > > > eat,> > > > > the less is needed. Therefore I would> > think> > > that> > > > > having the surge of cortisol after the> > test> > > would> > > > > increase salt retention and therefore> > lower> > > > > aldosterone -- like happened with me> --> > > however it> > > > > says that it is supposed to increase> so> > ...> > > does> > > > > anyone know about this?> > > > >> > > > > I know I'm writing a letter that will> be> > > difficult> > > > > to> > > > > respond to -- sorry, I just need to> vent> > ...> > > > >> > > > > Marlena> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> >> ____________________________________________________> > > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it> your> > home> > > page> > > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >

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Thanks Marlena:-))))))))))) Love Chris

Re: > test> > > results -- need ideas> > > > > > > > > > Hi Topper,> > > > Yes, I completely understand. This is an> > obscure> > > test> > > > and no one is familiar with it, so it's> hard> > for> > > you> > > > to comment!> > > >> > > > All I can say is that it reflects how I> feel> > > more than> > > > the blood tests did that I took in June> when> > I> > > was on> > > > 2.5 grains. TSH was 0.011 and frees were> > both> > > just> > > > under the mid-range (and I still felt> > terrible).> > > T4> > > > didn't look higher (in its own range)> than> > my T3> > > so I> > > > didn't think I was having a conversion> > problem,> > > I just> > > > thought I needed a higher dosage!> > > >> > > > I need to find out the explanation of> why my> > > doctor> > > > says this particular test measures how> much> > > hormone> > > > the body is actually using -- how much> the> > > tissues are> > > > actually getting affected by, regardless> of> > how> > > much> > > > is available in the blood. Some people> can't> > > fully use> > > > what is available in the blood (for> various> > > reasons)> > > > -- so for that reason, the free's seem> the> > best> > > out of> > > > all the blood tests but still not always> > > conclusive,> > > > IMO!> > > >> > > > Marlena> > > >> > > > --- topper2@... wrote:> > > >> > > > > My problem is that I've never seen> > anything on> > > urine> > > > > testing for thyroid> > > > > hormones. Since these do not specify> that> > they> > > are> > > > > Free Ts we have to> > > > > assume that they are totals. Which> means> > you> > > don't> > > > > know how much hormone> > > > > is available for use. Your T4 here is> > showing> > > very> > > > > high... but how much> > > > > of it is bound and unusable? If a lot> of> > it is> > > > > bound, for whatever> > > > > reason, then there isn't enough> available> > for> > > > > conversion, which could be> > > > > why the T3 is so low in it's range....> > Then,> > > if we> > > > > continue to assume> > > > > that these are totals, your available> T3> > is> > > actually> > > > > below range???> > > > >> > > > > I can't say that the urine tests are> more,> > or> > > less,> > > > > accurate than the> > > > > blood tests, we just don't know for> sure> > what> > > was> > > > > tested (total or free,> > > > > or if they can even differentiate> between> > free> > > and> > > > > bound hormone) and how> > > > > those numbers, in their ranges,> compare to> > > what> > > > > we've learned about blood> > > > > levels and ranges.> > > > >> > > > > We know that you aren't feeling as> well as> > you> > > > > should... but we don't> > > > > know why, yet.... Using a totally> > different> > > testing> > > > > method leaves us in> > > > > the dark... we have no comparison, no> > > experience, to> > > > > know how to> > > > > interpret them.> > > > >> > > > > Just my thoughts.....> > > > >> > > > > Topper ()> > > > >> > > > > On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 -0700> (PDT)> > > Marlena> > > > > writes:> > > > > Ok y'all, so I finally got my most> recent> > > thyroid> > > > > results in but I'm not sure where to> go> > from> > > here.> > > > > My> > > > > doctor is pretty holistic and uses a> more> > > obsure> > > > > test> > > > > from a lab called Vitamin Diagnostics.> It> > is a> > > 24 hr> > > > > urine collection. Supposedly it tests> the> > > amount of> > > > > hormone your body is actually using> ...> > anyway> > > here> > > > > are my results:> > > > >> > > > > 11/2004 (before treatment):> > > > > T3 621 range 800-1800> > > > > T4 1698 range 1800-3000> > > > >> > > > > 7/05 (since treatment ... it takes a> month> > to> > > get> > > > > the> > > > > results!)> > > > > T3 894 range 800-1800> > > > > T4 3124 range 1800-3000> > > > >> > > > > So it looks like I'm not converting> well.> > Now> > > I'm on> > > > > 3> > > > > grains of Armour plus 3.5 mcg> sustained> > > release T3.> > > > > (I> > > > > was actually taking 3 1/4 grains of> Armour> > and> > > 25mcg> > > > > of SR T3 at the time of the test> (which> > was> > > over a> > > > > month ago), but soon after felt so bad> and> > > > > eventually> > > > > overstimulated that I cut way back)> ... I> > know> > > my> > > > > consistency hasn't been that good, but> I> > had> > > to cut> > > > > back -- the T3 doesn't have such a> long> > life> > > so it> > > > > seemed ok to me plus the decrease in> T4> > was> > > probably> > > > > good ... I'm also working with a> medical> > > intuitive> > > > > who> > > > > is helping me to figure things out a> bit> > --> > > she told> > > > > me that the 25 mcg was way too high> (which> > > > > correlated> > > > > with my symptoms -- which for me was a> > > feverish> > > > > feeling and ultra fatigue, fast> heartbeat> > --> > > not> > > > > extra> > > > > energy that's for sure). This doesn't> make> > > sense> > > > > with> > > > > my low T3 test result. It would seem> that> > my> > > body> > > > > would want more T3... from my results> I'm> > > guessing> > > > > that my original thyroid production is> > down to> > > zero> > > > > or> > > > > almost zero (my last TSH while on 2.5> > grains> > > was> > > > > .011)> > > > > ... I'm just so frustrated ... I felt> > better> > > on no> > > > > medication whatsoever! And it's scary> to> > me to> > > be> > > > > completely dependent on something that> > isn't> > > even> > > > > working for me! I've done all the> research> > and> > > been> > > > > the model patient -- doing everything> I'm> > > supposed> > > > > to> > > > > be doing ... I really don't know where> to> > go> > > from> > > > > here.> > > > > I do all the things one is supposed to> do> > to> > > enhance> > > > > conversion too ...> > > > >> > > > > My doctor is not telling me anything> > > conclusive> > > > > about> > > > > where I should go from here ...> > > > >> > > > > The weird thing is that I feel worse> than> > > before I> > > > > started treatment ... and my latest> > adrenal> > > test> > > > > results seem to show that my adrenals> are> > > actually> > > > > doing ok (although this was an ACTH> > > stimulation test> > > > > to check adrenal reserve and my doctor> has> > to> > > talk> > > > > to> > > > > the lab to get a conclusive> interpretation> > of> > > the 2> > > > > 24> > > > > hr urine collection results which> tests a> > > breakdown> > > > > of> > > > > all the adrenal hormones... and he> won't> > be> > > able to> > > > > do> > > > > this for another 2 weeks!). I'm really> > > confused as> > > > > to> > > > > why I would feel worse [for 8 months> now> > --> > > I'm> > > > > going> > > > > crazy -- things were pretty bad before> > > treatment for> > > > > 10+ years but I was still functioning> --> > now> > > I'm not> > > > > nearly as functional as before ...]> > > > >> > > > > Every adrenal hormone in the test> > increased by> > > a> > > > > good> > > > > amount after the stimulation -- which> it's> > > supposed> > > > > to> > > > > do -- except the aldosterone. It was a> > good> > > number> > > > > to> > > > > begin with but then it went down just> a> > little> > > after> > > > > the stimulation. It is supposed to go> up> > ...> > > but> > > > > what> > > > > I don't understand is that apparently> the> > more> > > salt> > > > > you eat, the lower the aldosterone ...> > > aldosterone's> > > > > job is to keep salt in your body, so> the> > more> > > you> > > > > eat,> > > > > the less is needed. Therefore I would> > think> > > that> > > > > having the surge of cortisol after the> > test> > > would> > > > > increase salt retention and therefore> > lower> > > > > aldosterone -- like happened with me> --> > > however it> > > > > says that it is supposed to increase> so> > ...> > > does> > > > > anyone know about this?> > > > >> > > > > I know I'm writing a letter that will> be> > > difficult> > > > > to> > > > > respond to -- sorry, I just need to> vent> > ...> > > > >> > > > > Marlena> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> >> ____________________________________________________> > > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it> your> > home> > > page> > > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >

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