Guest guest Posted February 9, 2006 Report Share Posted February 9, 2006 > > Hi , > Thank you for responding to the my chaotic post. You are most welcome. > >Na/Ca ratio is extremely low. This indicates low thyroid. > As I understand it if the thyroid is not functioning, the > adrenals try to take over and become exhausted. So you > likely need to treat adrenals first and in short order > add some thyroid support.< > > Ultrasound showed three goiters, they happened to be benign. A blood test showed low TSH as 0.06 from 0.30 - 4.70. T4 Free was 10.2 from 9.1 - 23.8, and Free T3 was 4.3 from 2.5 - 5.7. I was not put on anything. Learning from books, to diagnose oneself, is very difficult. According to one chart of symptoms, I identified 14 symptoms to hypothyroid, and 15 symptoms to hyperthyroid. Seven of them appear in both disorders. Tomorrow, I get another test for TSH. Sounds like a complex situation. I am not an expert on thyroid - I am only now trying to learn about my own thyroid situation. What I do know is that TSH is not very meaningful in diagnosing thyroid conditions (despite what endocrinologists will tell you). You should also be tested for thyroid antibodies. Your best bet would be to join one or more of the thyroid groups and post your test results there: http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormones/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/hypothyroidism/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/thyroid/ > I take swiss one " 50 " multivitamins, B6 200 mg, zinc 30mg, folic acid 2mg, and acidophulus 10b, and metamucil with lactalose. Adrenaline support along with something for the thyroid is what I like to deal with first; for only exercise helping me to cope, but what to take?. Then I need to make sure there is no more amalgam is present to chelate. Since you are mercury toxic, you will need a lot more supplementation to feel better. Do you have Andy's book? See p. 133 for the basics - you at least need to start some vitamin C, E, B complex, EFAs, magnesium and other minerals. Are you splitting the B6 into several doses? Look into tyrosine for adrenaline support. Those would be a good start. Yes, you do need to make sure you have no amalgam before chelating. I assume the metamucil with lactulose is for constipation. You might try some ground flax seed for additional fiber. Also an ayurvedic supplement called triphala has been very helpful for me. Adding magnesium citrate or glycinate is also worth a try. I am not sure if the lactulose will help you or cause more problems. How does it seem to you? It is a sugar and could increase dysbiosis. > Even though I don't understand most of my deficiencies, but I was surprised to have low sodium; for I do add too much salt whenever I get brain fog, and headach. If I don't, my blood pressure drops to around 90 over 60. Low blood pressure is probably due to adrenal problems. Eating more salt and/or other electrolytes will probably help you with brain fog and other symptoms. I also need a lot of salt. Some people need more potassium. Just to clarify, the essential element levels on the hair test are not the same as your body level of those elements. For some elements, if they are high on the hair test, that means they are low in the body. All you can say with any confidence (according to Andy) is that certain patterns or ratios are associated with certain problems. For example, the low K/Ca means low thyroid, but the true levels of K and Ca and all the others may be quite different (a lot higher or lower) than what you see on the hair test. -- > Sorry for the long post. > I appreciate your resposes, and thank you for sharing your expertise. > > Sardar > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 >What I do know is that TSH is not very meaningful in diagnosing thyroid conditions (despite whatendocrinologists will tell you).You should also be tested for thyroid antibodies.< Hi Staphanie, It is confusing to have symptoms of both, hypo, and hyperthyroid. Though they are alternating. I just had thyroid antibody test, thank you for suggesting it. >I assume the metamucil with lactulose is for constipation. You might try some ground flax seed for additional fiber. Also an ayurvedic supplement called triphala has been very helpful for me. Adding magnesium citrate or glycinate is also worth a try.< I don't have problem with constipatipation; a specialist recommended to help with bloating. >I am not sure if the lactulose will help you or cause more problems. How does it seem to you? It is a sugar and could increase dysbiosis.< I think it made it worse, either by the aspartime in sugar free metamucil or by the lactulose. I didn't know the latter had sugar. I only took it for one week. >Are you splitting the B6 into several doses? Look into tyrosine for adrenaline support. Those would be a good start.< Twice a day at 100 mg, and will add other supplements- especially tyrosine. Thanks Sardar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 > Ultrasound showed three goiters, they happened to be benign. A >blood test showed low TSH as 0.06 from 0.30 - 4.70. Low TSH does not rule out hypothyroidism. If the hypothyroidism is centrally mediated (pituitary and hypothalmus dysfunction) the TSH can be low, normal, or high. Doctors can look that up in their textbooks if they want. Most don't seem to be aware of it. My TSH was low for years on end but it turned out thay I was hypothyroid and thyroid hormone helps. > T4 Free was 10.2 from 9.1 - 23.8, and Free T3 was 4.3 from 2.5 - >5.7. The free T3 should be in the upper 1/4 and the free T4 should be in the upper third of the reference ranges. Your T4 is in the lower half of the normal range and your T3 is in the lower 2/3 of the normal range. > I was not put on anything. Learning from books, to diagnose >oneself, is very difficult. Difficult to say the least. And the worst part is it's very difficult to find doctors who understand this. My endocrinologist didn't have a clue. > According to one chart of symptoms, I identified 14 symptoms to >hypothyroid, and 15 symptoms to hyperthyroid. Seven of them appear >in both disorders. Tomorrow, I get another test for TSH. > Testing TSH won't help. It might be useful to test for anti thyroid antibodies at some point. > I take swiss one " 50 " multivitamins, B6 200 mg, zinc 30mg, folic >acid 2mg, and acidophulus 10b, and metamucil with lactalose. When you get Andy's book it will be easier to see how much these need to be increased and what needs to be added. >Adrenaline support along with something for the thyroid is what I >like to deal with first; for only exercise helping me to cope, but >what to take?. Then I need to make sure there is no more amalgam is >present to chelate. > Very important. > Even though I don't understand most of my deficiencies, but I was >surprised to have low sodium; for I do add too much salt whenever I >get brain fog, and headach. If I don't, my blood pressure drops to >around 90 over 60. > I'm like this too. I basically have to take sodium in some form every day. I suspect that you will find that you will need to replace cortisol (with low dose cortef) before you will be able to take any thyroid hormone. I was super lucky to find a doctor who understood this problem and who gave me both at the same time. There are not very many doctors around who understand this problem. Searching is about all you can do. If we know your location someone might know a doctor close by. J > Sorry for the long post. > I appreciate your resposes, and thank you for sharing your expertise. > > Sardar > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 > The free T3 should be in the upper 1/4 and the free T4 should be in > the upper third of the reference ranges. > Your T4 is in the lower half of the normal range and your T3 is in > the lower 2/3 of the normal range. , Why is it that noone is consistent about these guidelines for T3 and T4. I've heard upper 1/3 and upper 1/2 of the range, but never upper 1/4 for T3. I don't know what ranges to use. I know I just have to read more, but the thyroid groups just overwhelm me. Will get my latest lab results next week - maybe they'll be so far out of range this time, that all this fine tuning as to the proper range will be moot :-) -- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 > > > > The free T3 should be in the upper 1/4 and the free T4 should be in > > the upper third of the reference ranges. > > Your T4 is in the lower half of the normal range and your T3 is in > > the lower 2/3 of the normal range. > > , > > Why is it that noone is consistent about these guidelines for > T3 and T4. I've heard upper 1/3 and upper 1/2 of the range, but > never upper 1/4 for T3. I don't know what ranges to use. > I got that from in the autism mercury group. I'm assuming that she has a better memory than me for remembering what Andy said, but we might not have it right. If I ever find a post from Andy about it I'll try to remember to save it. Only problem is I'm not sure where I could put it where I can remember to find it. I wouldn't expect Andy and the thyroid group people to have exactly the same guidelines. At least they are in the same ball park (even if I don't have it quite right!!). The thyroid groups are so overwhelming that I haven't been there for ages. Best > I know I just have to read more, but the thyroid groups just > overwhelm me. Will get my latest lab results next week - maybe > they'll be so far out of range this time, that all this fine > tuning as to the proper range will be moot :-) > > -- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2006 Report Share Posted February 11, 2006 > > > > > > > The free T3 should be in the upper 1/4 and the free T4 should be in > > > the upper third of the reference ranges. > > > Your T4 is in the lower half of the normal range and your T3 is in > > > the lower 2/3 of the normal range. > > > > , > > > > Why is it that noone is consistent about these guidelines for > > T3 and T4. I've heard upper 1/3 and upper 1/2 of the range, but > > never upper 1/4 for T3. I don't know what ranges to use. > > > > > I got that from in the autism mercury group. I'm assuming > that she has a better memory than me for remembering what Andy said, > but we might not have it right. If I ever find a post from Andy about > it I'll try to remember to save it. Only problem is I'm not sure > where I could put it where I can remember to find it. Of course Andy would have an opinion about this - why didn't I look for it in the first place?! Thanks as always, . http://onibasu.com/archives/am/156470.html > I wouldn't expect Andy and the thyroid group people to have exactly > the same guidelines. At least they are in the same ball park (even if > I don't have it quite right!!). > > The thyroid groups are so overwhelming that I haven't been there for ages. > > Best > > > > > > I know I just have to read more, but the thyroid groups just > > overwhelm me. Will get my latest lab results next week - maybe > > they'll be so far out of range this time, that all this fine > > tuning as to the proper range will be moot :-) > > > > -- > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2006 Report Share Posted February 11, 2006 >Low TSH does not rule out hypothyroidism. If the hypothyroidism is centrally mediated (pituitary and hypothalmus dysfunction) the TSH can be low, normal, or high.< , The confusion is that my symptoms alternate between hypo, and hyper e.g, one week I lose weight (hyper) up to 7 ibs, later I gain some of it(hypo). Some times, chilly feeling (hypo), even in summer months, other times hot and cold alternate(hyper). Hoarse voice, memory problem, and worsening of allergies (hypos). And yet, too much appetite, hyperactive, and nerviouseness (hypers). I didn't keep track of the symptoms to how often one present verses the other, and whcih one is more predominant. I confused the doctors, may be the labs too. Hopefully, the thyroid antibody gives me different result. Sardar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2006 Report Share Posted February 11, 2006 > Ultrasound showed three goiters, they happened to be benign. A blood test showed low TSH as 0.06 from 0.30-4.70. T4 Free was 10.2 from 9.1 - 23.8, and Free T3 was 4.3 from 2.5 - 5.7.< Because of T4 Free, and Free T3 were normal, the doctor said it is okay if the TSH is low- so she didn't recommend any treatment. >My endocrinologist didn't have a clue.< I consulted two of them, and they were clueless. >I suspect that you will find that you will need to replace cortisol (with low dose cortef) before you will be able to take any thyroid hormone. I was super lucky to find a doctor who understood this problem and who gave me both at the same time. There are not very many doctors around who understand this problem. Searching is about all you can do. If we know your location someone might know a doctor close by.< Sorry I missed this part of your post when I responded. Getting thyroid hormone is it by prescription? Yesterday started on L-Tyrosine 500 mg 2 capsules 3 times daily, for the first time. It is too early, but I feel a little better. I live in Toronto; it would be great if there is someone who has knowledge not only a certificate. >Testing TSH won't help. It might be useful to test for anti thyroid antibodies at some point.< The result of antibodies test comes back on friday. >I'm like this too. I basically have to take sodium in some form every day.< J I heard taking too much sodium bad for goiter, but that is the best help for my brain fog. Sardar > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2006 Report Share Posted February 11, 2006 >> Sorry I missed this part of your post when I responded. Getting >>thyroid hormone is it by prescription? Yes >> Yesterday started on L-Tyrosine 500 mg 2 capsules 3 times daily, This may help, but it is one tiny piece of a large puzzle. >>for the first time. It is too early, but I feel a little better. >>I live in Toronto; it would be great if there is someone who has >>knowledge not only a certificate. This book is useful: https://www.endfatigue.com/home.nsf It may be available in your local library (I am in Canada too). If you look at the above website you will find lists of practitioners, some MDs, some who have taken Teitelbaum's courses. You may also find the CFS/fibromyalgia studies (on that site) interesting. J > > > Ultrasound showed three goiters, they happened to be benign. A blood test showed low TSH as 0.06 from 0.30-4.70. T4 Free was 10.2 from 9.1 - 23.8, and Free T3 was 4.3 from 2.5 - 5.7.< > > Because of T4 Free, and Free T3 were normal, the doctor said it is okay if the TSH is low- so she didn't recommend any treatment. > > >My endocrinologist didn't have a clue.< > > I consulted two of them, and they were clueless. > > >I suspect that you will find that you will need to replace cortisol > (with low dose cortef) before you will be able to take any thyroid > hormone. I was super lucky to find a doctor who understood this > problem and who gave me both at the same time. There are not very > many doctors around who understand this problem. Searching is about > all you can do. If we know your location someone might know a doctor > close by.< > > Sorry I missed this part of your post when I responded. Getting thyroid hormone is it by prescription? Yesterday started on L-Tyrosine 500 mg 2 capsules 3 times daily, for the first time. It is too early, but I feel a little better. I live in Toronto; it would be great if there is someone who has knowledge not only a certificate. > > >Testing TSH won't help. It might be useful to test for anti thyroid > antibodies at some point.< > > The result of antibodies test comes back on friday. > > >I'm like this too. I basically have to take sodium in some form every > day.< > > J > > I heard taking too much sodium bad for goiter, but that is the best help for my brain fog. > Sardar > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 19, 2006 Report Share Posted March 19, 2006 >I suspect that you will find that you will need to replace cortisol (with low dose cortef) before you will be able to take any thyroid hormone. I was super lucky to find a doctor who understood this problem and who gave me both at the same time.< J I have asked you so many questions, many of them were repeated, sorry for my confusion. This time regarding cortef; when you say " he gave me both " is that mean cortef and armour? I am going to ask for prescription, and I like to get it right this time. Thank you so much, Sardar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 19, 2006 Report Share Posted March 19, 2006 > > > >I suspect that you will find that you will need to replace cortisol > (with low dose cortef) before you will be able to take any thyroid > hormone. I was super lucky to find a doctor who understood this > problem and who gave me both at the same time.< > J > > > I have asked you so many questions, many of them were repeated, sorry > for my confusion. TK--- is off line for awhile so may not respond. This time regarding cortef; when you say " he gave > me both " is that mean cortef and armour? TK--- Yes I am going to ask for > prescription, and I like to get it right this time. > > Thank you so much, > > Sardar > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 19, 2006 Report Share Posted March 19, 2006 >This time regarding cortef; when you say " he gave me both " is that mean cortef and armour?< >TK--- Yes< Can both of them be taken together? Sardar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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