Re: Fw: WOW - This you need to see:

March 24, 2003

I'd like to go on and interject here, since I do have a legal background.

Yes, most Americans believe in God. I dare even say that most Americans claim

to be Christian. However, this country was not founded solely on majority

rule. If it was, our government would just institute opinion polling to

determine national policies. Our Constitution establishes for a republic

governed by elected officials. The Consitution and the Bill of Rights in

particular are designed to protect the rights of the minority as well.

Just something to consider if you support school prayer. Whose prayer?

Non-denominational doesn't mean Protestant. If you're willing to support

rotating prayers from a variety of faiths, I'll listen to your proposal. But

I am really curious as to how many of the school prayer advocates would

support Muslim, Wiccan, Buddhist prayers.

To me, religion is something too important to be influenced by government. Be

careful of what you ask for, you just might get it. The Iranians asked for a

religious government, and they got the Ayatollah. The Afghans asked for it,

and they got Mullah .

-Wes Ogilvie, JD

(speaking solely for myself)

March 24, 2003

Talk about off-topic! Here is the deal, if you get past the media hype you will

see that prayer in school is not illegal it is just teacher or school LEAD

prayer that is illegal! Think about this, do you want your children led in a

prayer of a religion you do not believe in? Really, do you? The constitution

does not guarantee the freedom of certain religions, it guarantees the freedom

of religion, but if I am not a Christian and I do not want my children to be

Christian how if this freedom protected by a school lead Christian prayer??????

An important part of being American is being able to let others have the freedom

we want for ourselves!

Steve Dralle, EMT-P EMSC

San , Texas

These are my opinions and may or may not be those of my employers.

Since the Pledge of Allegiance

and

The Lord's Prayer

are not allowed in most

public schools anymore

because the word " God " is mentioned....

a kid in Arizona wrote the attached

NEW

School

prayer.

I liked it....

Now I sit me down in school

Where praying is against the rule

For this great nation under God

Finds mention of Him very odd.

If Scripture now the class recites,

It violates the Bill of Rights.

And anytime my head I bow

Becomes a Federal matter now.

Our hair can be purple, orange or green,

That's no offense; it's a freedom scene.

The law is specific, the law is precise.

Prayers spoken aloud are a serious vice.

For praying in a public hall

Might offend someone with no faith at all.

In silence alone we must meditate,

God's name is prohibited by the state.

We're allowed to cuss and dress like freaks,

And pierce our noses, tongues and cheeks.

They've outlawed guns, but FIRST the Bible.

To quote the Good Book makes me liable.

We can elect a pregnant Senior Queen,

And the 'unwed daddy,' our Senior King.

It's " inappropriate " to teach right from wrong,

We're taught that such " judgments " do not belong.

We can get our condoms and birth controls,

Study witchcraft, vampires and totem poles.

But the Ten Commandments are not allowed,

No word of God must reach this crowd.

It's scary here I must confess,

When chaos reigns the school's a mess.

So, Lord, this silent plea I make:

Should I be shot; My soul please take!

Amen

If you aren't ashamed to do this,

please pass this on.

Jesus said,

" If you are ashamed of me, "

I will be ashamed of you before my Father. "

Not ashamed. Passing this on . .

March 24, 2003

Thank you Steve.

Also, the original Pledge of Allegiance did not have the line " under God " in

it. The author, Francis Bellamy (1855 - 1931) a Baptist Minister,

understood the seperation of Church and State. He also toned down the

pledge, because he wanted to push equality for women and non-white

Americans. But he knew that it would be rejected. BTW, he was a Christian

Socialist.

http://history.vineyard.net/pledge.htm

Micheal

--

Micheal Mc Evoy, FF/NREMT-B, WFR

Bertram Community EMS

Bertram Volunteer Fire Department

Bertram, Texas

>

> Talk about off-topic! Here is the deal, if you get past the media hype

> you will see that prayer in school is not illegal it is just teacher or

> school LEAD prayer that is illegal! Think about this, do you want your

> children led in a prayer of a religion you do not believe in? Really,

> do you? The constitution does not guarantee the freedom of certain

> religions, it guarantees the freedom of religion, but if I am not a

> Christian and I do not want my children to be Christian how if this

> freedom protected by a school lead Christian prayer??????

>

> An important part of being American is being able to let others have

> the freedom we want for ourselves!

>

> Steve Dralle, EMT-P EMSC

> San , Texas

>

> These are my opinions and may or may not be those of my employers.

>

> Since the Pledge of Allegiance

>

> and

>

> The Lord's Prayer

>

> are not allowed in most

> public schools anymore

>

<snip>

March 24, 2003

Wher I grew up, we always started the day with remembering God. Both

Muslim prayer and some Christian prayer begining with " O Lord " and

ending with " holy! holy! hol! " were recited. You were free to say

either or none. We said both any way.

Shahla

> Thank you Steve.

> Also, the original Pledge of Allegiance did not have the

line " under God " in

> it. The author, Francis Bellamy (1855 - 1931) a Baptist Minister,

> understood the seperation of Church and State. He also toned down

the

> pledge, because he wanted to push equality for women and non-white

> Americans. But he knew that it would be rejected. BTW, he was a

Christian

> Socialist.

>

> http://history.vineyard.net/pledge.htm

>

> Micheal

> --

> Micheal Mc Evoy, FF/NREMT-B, WFR

> Bertram Community EMS

> Bertram Volunteer Fire Department

> Bertram, Texas

>

> >

> > Talk about off-topic! Here is the deal, if you get past the

media hype

> > you will see that prayer in school is not illegal it is just

teacher or

> > school LEAD prayer that is illegal! Think about this, do you

want your

> > children led in a prayer of a religion you do not believe in?

Really,

> > do you? The constitution does not guarantee the freedom of

certain

> > religions, it guarantees the freedom of religion, but if I am

not a

> > Christian and I do not want my children to be Christian how if

this

> > freedom protected by a school lead Christian prayer??????

> >

> > An important part of being American is being able to let others

have

> > the freedom we want for ourselves!

> >

> > Steve Dralle, EMT-P EMSC

> > San , Texas

> >

> > These are my opinions and may or may not be those of my

employers.

> >

> > Since the Pledge of Allegiance

> >

> > and

> >

> > The Lord's Prayer

> >

> > are not allowed in most

> > public schools anymore

> >

>

> <snip>

March 24, 2003

It's funny to me that those that complain about posts being " off topic "

go on to expound on the post after they complain. The original post is

no more off topic than the reply.

P.S. Since I am not complaining about the post being off topic I can

interject the following: Most Americans believe in one God no matter

what religion they are so therefore one nation " under God " should not be

a problem.

RE: Fw: WOW - This you need to see:

Thank you Steve.

Also, the original Pledge of Allegiance did not have the line " under

God " in

it. The author, Francis Bellamy (1855 - 1931) a Baptist Minister,

understood the seperation of Church and State. He also toned down the

pledge, because he wanted to push equality for women and non-white

Americans. But he knew that it would be rejected. BTW, he was a

Christian

Socialist.

http://history.vineyard.net/pledge.htm

Micheal

--

Micheal Mc Evoy, FF/NREMT-B, WFR

Bertram Community EMS

Bertram Volunteer Fire Department

Bertram, Texas

>

> Talk about off-topic! Here is the deal, if you get past the media

hype

> you will see that prayer in school is not illegal it is just teacher

or

> school LEAD prayer that is illegal! Think about this, do you want

your

> children led in a prayer of a religion you do not believe in? Really,

> do you? The constitution does not guarantee the freedom of certain

> religions, it guarantees the freedom of religion, but if I am not a

> Christian and I do not want my children to be Christian how if this

> freedom protected by a school lead Christian prayer??????

>

> An important part of being American is being able to let others have

> the freedom we want for ourselves!

>

> Steve Dralle, EMT-P EMSC

> San , Texas

>

> These are my opinions and may or may not be those of my employers.

>

> Since the Pledge of Allegiance

>

> and

>

> The Lord's Prayer

>

> are not allowed in most

> public schools anymore

>

<snip>

March 26, 2003

That is true, we do not want our children lead in prayer by the school system

because it is possibly a religion that we don't believe in. But what if the

religion that we are pushing on our children is one that they don't believe in.

Isn't that violating their right to freedom of religion.

JB

RE: Fw: WOW - This you need to see:

Talk about off-topic! Here is the deal, if you get past the media hype you

will see that prayer in school is not illegal it is just teacher or school LEAD

prayer that is illegal! Think about this, do you want your children led in a

prayer of a religion you do not believe in? Really, do you? The constitution

does not guarantee the freedom of certain religions, it guarantees the freedom

of religion, but if I am not a Christian and I do not want my children to be

Christian how if this freedom protected by a school lead Christian prayer??????

An important part of being American is being able to let others have the

freedom we want for ourselves!

Steve Dralle, EMT-P EMSC

San , Texas

These are my opinions and may or may not be those of my employers.

Since the Pledge of Allegiance

and

The Lord's Prayer

are not allowed in most

public schools anymore

because the word " God " is mentioned....

a kid in Arizona wrote the attached

NEW

School

prayer.

I liked it....

Now I sit me down in school

Where praying is against the rule

For this great nation under God

Finds mention of Him very odd.

If Scripture now the class recites,

It violates the Bill of Rights.

And anytime my head I bow

Becomes a Federal matter now.

Our hair can be purple, orange or green,

That's no offense; it's a freedom scene.

The law is specific, the law is precise.

Prayers spoken aloud are a serious vice.

For praying in a public hall

Might offend someone with no faith at all.

In silence alone we must meditate,

God's name is prohibited by the state.

We're allowed to cuss and dress like freaks,

And pierce our noses, tongues and cheeks.

They've outlawed guns, but FIRST the Bible.

To quote the Good Book makes me liable.

We can elect a pregnant Senior Queen,

And the 'unwed daddy,' our Senior King.

It's " inappropriate " to teach right from wrong,

We're taught that such " judgments " do not belong.

We can get our condoms and birth controls,

Study witchcraft, vampires and totem poles.

But the Ten Commandments are not allowed,

No word of God must reach this crowd.

It's scary here I must confess,

When chaos reigns the school's a mess.

So, Lord, this silent plea I make:

Should I be shot; My soul please take!

Amen

If you aren't ashamed to do this,

please pass this on.

Jesus said,

" If you are ashamed of me, "

I will be ashamed of you before my Father. "

Not ashamed. Passing this on . .

March 26, 2003

" Under God " . Has anyone ever researched how many different names God, The lord,

Allah and so on you will find, he really has. What is the big deal. He is

Mighty, The Merciful, The Wise and The Great, Why can't people just deal with it

and leave things alone.

JB

RE: Fw: WOW - This you need to see:

Thank you Steve.

Also, the original Pledge of Allegiance did not have the line " under God " in

it. The author, Francis Bellamy (1855 - 1931) a Baptist Minister,

understood the seperation of Church and State. He also toned down the

pledge, because he wanted to push equality for women and non-white

Americans. But he knew that it would be rejected. BTW, he was a Christian

Socialist.

http://history.vineyard.net/pledge.htm

Micheal

--

Micheal Mc Evoy, FF/NREMT-B, WFR

Bertram Community EMS

Bertram Volunteer Fire Department

Bertram, Texas

>

> Talk about off-topic! Here is the deal, if you get past the media hype

> you will see that prayer in school is not illegal it is just teacher or

> school LEAD prayer that is illegal! Think about this, do you want your

> children led in a prayer of a religion you do not believe in? Really,

> do you? The constitution does not guarantee the freedom of certain

> religions, it guarantees the freedom of religion, but if I am not a

> Christian and I do not want my children to be Christian how if this

> freedom protected by a school lead Christian prayer??????

>

> An important part of being American is being able to let others have

> the freedom we want for ourselves!

>

> Steve Dralle, EMT-P EMSC

> San , Texas

>

> These are my opinions and may or may not be those of my employers.

>

> Since the Pledge of Allegiance

>

> and

>

> The Lord's Prayer

>

> are not allowed in most

> public schools anymore

>

<snip>

March 26, 2003

Sir you are correct in everything but two issues. The Iranians and the Afghans.

they wanted a government ruled by the rules of The Muslim Faith and not by two

individuals that interpreted the Quoran to benefit their life style. The same

with the most of the Arabs from the gulf region.