Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 In a message dated 2/21/00 7:12:40 AM Pacific Standard Time, debk@... writes: << Out of 39 posts over the past 2 days on this list, 16 have been off-topic. That is almost half. >> Low carb cats are off topic? Get a life and a sense of humor! I happen to think that most of our posts are right on topic - learning to live again! We may digress a bit and actually laugh at ourselves, but this is a very serious and caring group of longer-term postops. We share very intimate and important information, but our style is not for everyone. Just like most of the other OSSG groups are not for me! BobA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 At 11:59 AM 02/21/2000 , you wrote: >From: raltman813@... >Low carb cats are off topic? Get a life and a sense of humor! <snip> >but our style is not for everyone. >BobA I guess expressing my opinion and then getting insulted for it is definitely not my style. Thanks for making it even more abundantly clear. Deb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 Perhaps there should be a rule that OT or Off Topic is indicated in the header or subject line. I like cats but I apparently missed why the subject even started so I didn't really understand why it was being discussed. I personally feel that that telling Deb to get a life and a sense of humor was a bit harsh. A sense of humor is in the eye of the beholder. And of course beauty is in the eye of the beer-holder.... Kathy Re: Off Topic Posts > > > At 11:59 AM 02/21/2000 , you wrote: > >From: raltman813@... > >Low carb cats are off topic? Get a life and a sense of humor! > <snip> > >but our style is not for everyone. > >BobA > > I guess expressing my opinion and then getting insulted for it is > definitely not my style. Thanks for making it even more abundantly clear. > > Deb > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > You have a voice mail message waiting for you at iHello.com: > http://click./1/1381/5/_/_/_/951154718/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 I have to agree. Perhaps these kinds of messages would be better off sent privately. Many people like to read the list to gain information about the long term effects of weight loss surgery, rather than share cat jokes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 I agree Bob... I love the posts!! Its not our falut that she belongs to so many other mailing lists. >From: raltman813@... > >Low carb cats are off topic? >Get a life and a sense of humor! I happen to think that most of our posts are >right on topic - learning to live again! We may digress a bit and actually >laugh at ourselves, but this is a very serious and caring group of >longer-term postops. We share very intimate and important information, but >our style is not for everyone. Just like most of the other OSSG groups are >not for me! > >BobA > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 i agree! i dont even own a cat! cant fer the life of me figure the corilation between a cat, nekkid pics and weight loss. wheres all the long term loss info? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 So sorry to see anyone leave this list, as so many people have contributed so much to my own personal recovery. But I can certainly understand how the volume of e-mail can become overwhelming. Still, I think that because of the seriousness of the nature of what we've all gone through, we need to temper things with a bit of levity. If anyone has been offended by some of the banter here, I do apologize for my part. But I also know that I never would have made it through without some of the help I've gotten with no undeserved criticism or judgement from anyone. I really appreciate everyone here. I was under the impression that this list was strictly moderated. So, I thought that if we were posting anything that was offensive or objectionable, those posts would be screened and eliminated. So, you guys out there, if we're getting too out of line, please let us know, ok? Huh, , are we going overboard?....after all, it is all in good fun. And, if there are too many posts for some people, maybe then this is not the list for you. You do, after all, have the ability to change to digest or delete what may or may not be pertinent to your own situation. Otherwise, this has always been and hopefully will continue to be a place where we can let our hair down (or fur!!--as the case may be) and have a little fun while we all deal with the issues which have made this such an incredible experience for all of us. Ah, well, just my 2 cents (as one of us so aptly puts it).... --El Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 Thank you Bob--I thought things were going ok. Just needed some assurance... --El Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 I think that we would all agree with you here, Dan. The majority should rule, after all the list belongs to everyone. But I also think that everyone would agree that no question has ever gone unanswered and that in all seriousness, some pretty good and helpful advice has always been offered. If a little levity happens to get thrown in along the way, I get to laugh a little in my misery. Thanks for helping me see the humor in all this. --El Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 Some good points there, Trish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 , No need to apologize, just purr! BobA Biliopancreatic Diversion (A Very Distal RNY) on 10/8/98 220 Pounds Gone Forever, But Not Forgotten! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 I am a guilty party to the cat jests here. I know the other party's name...but, I'm sworn to secrecy!<G> In my view of the list, it does tend to scale peaks and valleys of info that most find germane and pertinent to the topic at hand. Yet, there's always enough room for the informal jab here and there...I don't think it's off topic if the matter is presented with the sole intent to " lighten up " the moment. The topics of the past week engaged a few members in some pretty anxious moments. I would hope that those that are a bit out of sorts about venturing into the ludicrous might consider that the two guys that try to contribute during these crisis...may just be trying to help matters by tossing in a little humor. Really. The List is for group participation. I do think the other guilty party to this issue with Cats would agree that our contributions are there...although I've been indisposed for the past few weeks...and that we both recognize when some of our FRIENDS are in a bit of misery or despondency. I'm not really sure how Debbi or Conmay would contribute during these sort of times...but, the one sure cure for some tough moments is a bit of nonesense and humor. Or...the List could go dry, staid and arrid which I do not feel meets the informal intent of the List or what I personally would consider to be a very informative List with a great deal of personality. But, I do own two other lists and knowing that the majority rules do apply, I'm more than happy to abide by the desires of the List members majority. I'm certain that unamed co-hort would agree as well....and then again, maybe not. It's your call...y'all. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 Just my opinion, but most of the posts I read were not exclusively cat jokes... often the posts were on topic & included a cat joke. Most of the cat jokes surrounded the topic that others were wiilling to pay out of their own pocket to attend the bariatric conference, promote our group on the behalf of all of us, and then share with all of us the details of the conference. There is a temendous amount of giving on this list. What I don't understand is why I don't recall any prior posts from those who are now coming forth to complain. The lurkers seem to complain the loudest... perhaps they would like to introduce themselves as a one year post op & contribute to our common support. I just don't understand why some feel that they have a right to recieve information & the benefit from others. I am so very grateful for the information I get from this group, & would not consider biting the hand that feeds me. I am extremely lucky that this group is *very* knowledgable & all of the regular posters have contributed really valuable information. Also, I do not understand why someone who wants to unsubscribe doesn't just do that... I don't understand why they expect someone else to unsubscribe them. As you can see, I don't understand a lot of things. This is a support group, and a certain camraderie is realistic. I really like reading friendships develop, and ribbing. I have benefited from fabulous long term loss information in this group. I am grateful beyond words ...but I don't recall reading long term loss info yet from those coming forth to complain. I believe I've gotten so much info from this group... if I thought I was wasting my time, I wouldn't complain, I would simply unsubscribe. Wouldn't you? Trish >From: grs7552@... > >i agree! i dont even own a cat! cant fer the life of me figure the >corilation between a cat, nekkid pics and weight loss. wheres all the long >term loss info? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 I certainly could be one of the unnamed co-horts! I contribute my part in defense of cats. And oddly, it all started innocently enough with a protein recipe. No, no cats in the blender, however it was noted they a passive cat makes fine blender lid! Therapeutic massage and all. I agree 100% with what Dan said about our caring about one another. I can't tell you how many caring notes I got while I was out of it in surgery & recovery recently! Very caring group. I shudder to think that we've become a clique! I think MOUNTAINS of good post-op info flows through these lines, and our kidding around simply makes a point. They say humor causes increased memory. Everyone gives me a hard time at my stance on protein supplement and sugars. They joke and we all laugh but you know, it has forced me to double check my figures and my words. It has caused many of our members to experiment with those items and some have gotten over plateaus or improved in many areas. Our joking may seem too far off for some, but of course, from my point of view, I see so much growth that I haven't been able to see the harm. If I have offended anyone with my joshin' about the boys on the list or cats, I do sincerely apologize. Thanks, www.vitalady.com Re: Off Topic Posts > > > I am a guilty party to the cat jests here. I know the other party's > name...but, I'm sworn to secrecy!<G> > > In my view of the list, it does tend to scale peaks and valleys of info > that most find germane and pertinent to the topic at hand. Yet, there's > always enough room for the informal jab here and there...I don't think > it's off topic if the matter is presented with the sole intent to > " lighten up " the moment. The topics of the past week engaged a few > members in some pretty anxious moments. I would hope that those that > are a bit out of sorts about venturing into the ludicrous might consider > that the two guys that try to contribute during these crisis...may just > be trying to help matters by tossing in a little humor. > > Really. The List is for group participation. I do think the other > guilty party to this issue with Cats would agree that our contributions > are there...although I've been indisposed for the past few weeks...and > that we both recognize when some of our FRIENDS are in a bit of misery > or despondency. I'm not really sure how Debbi or Conmay would > contribute during these sort of times...but, the one sure cure for some > tough moments is a bit of nonesense and humor. Or...the List could go > dry, staid and arrid which I do not feel meets the informal intent of > the List or what I personally would consider to be a very informative > List with a great deal of personality. > > But, I do own two other lists and knowing that the majority rules do > apply, I'm more than happy to abide by the desires of the List members > majority. I'm certain that unamed co-hort would agree as well....and > then again, maybe not. It's your call...y'all. > > Dan > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as 2.9% > Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW! > http://click./1/915/5/_/_/_/951181501/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 Dan and that other *nameless* cat jabber ..<g> I would HOPE that if any single member of the group would step back and take a look at what you two in particular..and lots of us in general contribute in the way of " long term " info..a little leeway might be given ..I personally haven't jumped n the middle of the cat thing..but hey something going on Dalmatians and I'll hop in..LOL..I think the people objecting may be taking life a *little* too seriously..for goodness sake..lighten up! love ya even if you DO do wicked cat jokes! De Re: Off Topic Posts > > > I am a guilty party to the cat jests here. I know the other party's > name...but, I'm sworn to secrecy!<G> > > In my view of the list, it does tend to scale peaks and valleys of info > that most find germane and pertinent to the topic at hand. Yet, there's > always enough room for the informal jab here and there...I don't think > it's off topic if the matter is presented with the sole intent to > " lighten up " the moment. The topics of the past week engaged a few > members in some pretty anxious moments. I would hope that those that > are a bit out of sorts about venturing into the ludicrous might consider > that the two guys that try to contribute during these crisis...may just > be trying to help matters by tossing in a little humor. > > Really. The List is for group participation. I do think the other > guilty party to this issue with Cats would agree that our contributions > are there...although I've been indisposed for the past few weeks...and > that we both recognize when some of our FRIENDS are in a bit of misery > or despondency. I'm not really sure how Debbi or Conmay would > contribute during these sort of times...but, the one sure cure for some > tough moments is a bit of nonesense and humor. Or...the List could go > dry, staid and arrid which I do not feel meets the informal intent of > the List or what I personally would consider to be a very informative > List with a great deal of personality. > > But, I do own two other lists and knowing that the majority rules do > apply, I'm more than happy to abide by the desires of the List members > majority. I'm certain that unamed co-hort would agree as well....and > then again, maybe not. It's your call...y'all. > > Dan > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as 2.9% > Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW! > http://click./1/915/5/_/_/_/951181501/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 Trish- Such a nice post! So supportive! Makes us all sound so very NICE! And yet, I know that I'm one of the worst offenders for off topic goofin' off. I am so thankful for the checks 'n balance system we have here. Keep me honest in my ranting & raving about nutrition! and I know I've made everyone so self conscious about SUGAR that they see my face when they see a donut. Or something. Never mind. Whatever. If you didn't gain 5# due to my endless rankings about sugar, then YAHOOOOO! It's worth every lousy joke we've ever made. If someone has broken a bad habit or not gotten into self destruct mode because someone here has lifted 'em out of it, then I think that's great! Perhaps it's time for another roll call to see how much wt we've lost again. A whole crop of lurkers have " come of age " since then and can add to that number. Then we can all sit back in awe and see why we're here, besides poking fun. I've never heard ONE person on this list criticize another or boast about wt lost or not lost, nor have I seen any deliberate cruelty. I've seen a LOT Of caring and been on the receiving end of much of it. Anyone up for another roll call? De? Gotcher calculator handy? Thanks, www.vitalady.com Re: Off Topic Posts > > > Just my opinion, but most of the posts I read were not exclusively cat > jokes... often the posts were on topic & included a cat joke. Most of > the cat jokes surrounded the topic that others were wiilling to pay > out of their own pocket to attend the bariatric conference, promote > our group on the behalf of all of us, and then share with all of us > the details of the conference. There is a temendous amount of giving > on this list. > > What I don't understand is why I don't recall any prior posts from > those who are now coming forth to complain. The lurkers seem to > complain the loudest... perhaps they would like to introduce > themselves as a one year post op & contribute to our common support. > I just don't understand why some feel that they have a right to > recieve information & the benefit from others. I am so very grateful > for the information I get from this group, & would not consider biting > the hand that feeds me. I am extremely lucky that this group is > *very* knowledgable & all of the regular posters have contributed > really valuable information. Also, I do not understand why someone > who wants to unsubscribe doesn't just do that... I don't understand > why they expect someone else to unsubscribe them. As you can see, I > don't understand a lot of things. > > This is a support group, and a certain camraderie is realistic. I > really like reading friendships develop, and ribbing. I have > benefited from fabulous long term loss information in this group. I > am grateful beyond words ...but I don't recall reading long term > loss info yet from those coming forth to complain. I believe I've > gotten so much info from this group... if I thought I was wasting my > time, I wouldn't complain, I would simply unsubscribe. Wouldn't you? > Trish > > >From: grs7552@... > > > >i agree! i dont even own a cat! cant fer the life of me figure the > >corilation between a cat, nekkid pics and weight loss. wheres all the long > >term loss info? > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Shabang!com is the place to get your FREE eStore, Absolutely FREE > Forever. If you have any desires to sell your products or services > online, or you want to expand your customer base for FREE, Come check > out Shabang!com FREE eStores! > http://click./1/1299/5/_/_/_/951182138/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 And further, (like I'm ever done talking!!), these two nameless Anti-Cat forces not only contribute, but also deal with some deep & sticky issues. And that's something that's hard for ANYONE, I expect, but particularly for those of the male persuasion. If they need to toss in a cat or two to make it easier to talk about, HEY, then it got talked about. Always a plus, I say. Thanks, www.vitalady.com Re: Off Topic Posts > > > I am a guilty party to the cat jests here. I know the other party's > name...but, I'm sworn to secrecy!<G> > > In my view of the list, it does tend to scale peaks and valleys of info > that most find germane and pertinent to the topic at hand. Yet, there's > always enough room for the informal jab here and there...I don't think > it's off topic if the matter is presented with the sole intent to > " lighten up " the moment. The topics of the past week engaged a few > members in some pretty anxious moments. I would hope that those that > are a bit out of sorts about venturing into the ludicrous might consider > that the two guys that try to contribute during these crisis...may just > be trying to help matters by tossing in a little humor. > > Really. The List is for group participation. I do think the other > guilty party to this issue with Cats would agree that our contributions > are there...although I've been indisposed for the past few weeks...and > that we both recognize when some of our FRIENDS are in a bit of misery > or despondency. I'm not really sure how Debbi or Conmay would > contribute during these sort of times...but, the one sure cure for some > tough moments is a bit of nonesense and humor. Or...the List could go > dry, staid and arrid which I do not feel meets the informal intent of > the List or what I personally would consider to be a very informative > List with a great deal of personality. > > But, I do own two other lists and knowing that the majority rules do > apply, I'm more than happy to abide by the desires of the List members > majority. I'm certain that unamed co-hort would agree as well....and > then again, maybe not. It's your call...y'all. > > Dan > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as 2.9% > Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW! > http://click./1/915/5/_/_/_/951181501/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 I agree with , Dan and others who have commented. This list has provided me with a great deal of support both in WLS issues and other issues not necessarily directly related to weight loss, but issues that now have to be dealth with in new ways. Humor can make that pill alot easier to swallow sometimes. I hope that I have been fortunate to give back at least what I have gotten from this list. I vote to keep the occasional humor and cat joke. Carolyn Re: Off Topic Posts > > >I certainly could be one of the unnamed co-horts! I contribute my part in >defense of cats. And oddly, it all started innocently enough with a protein >recipe. No, no cats in the blender, however it was noted they a passive cat >makes fine blender lid! Therapeutic massage and all. > >I agree 100% with what Dan said about our caring about one another. I can't >tell you how many caring notes I got while I was out of it in surgery & >recovery recently! Very caring group. I shudder to think that we've become >a clique! I think MOUNTAINS of good post-op info flows through these lines, >and our kidding around simply makes a point. They say humor causes >increased memory. > >Everyone gives me a hard time at my stance on protein supplement and sugars. >They joke and we all laugh but you know, it has forced me to double check my >figures and my words. It has caused many of our members to experiment with >those items and some have gotten over plateaus or improved in many areas. >Our joking may seem too far off for some, but of course, from my point of >view, I see so much growth that I haven't been able to see the harm. > >If I have offended anyone with my joshin' about the boys on the list or >cats, I do sincerely apologize. > >Thanks, > > >www.vitalady.com > > > > > Re: Off Topic Posts > > >> >> >> I am a guilty party to the cat jests here. I know the other party's >> name...but, I'm sworn to secrecy!<G> >> >> In my view of the list, it does tend to scale peaks and valleys of info >> that most find germane and pertinent to the topic at hand. Yet, there's >> always enough room for the informal jab here and there...I don't think >> it's off topic if the matter is presented with the sole intent to >> " lighten up " the moment. The topics of the past week engaged a few >> members in some pretty anxious moments. I would hope that those that >> are a bit out of sorts about venturing into the ludicrous might consider >> that the two guys that try to contribute during these crisis...may just >> be trying to help matters by tossing in a little humor. >> >> Really. The List is for group participation. I do think the other >> guilty party to this issue with Cats would agree that our contributions >> are there...although I've been indisposed for the past few weeks...and >> that we both recognize when some of our FRIENDS are in a bit of misery >> or despondency. I'm not really sure how Debbi or Conmay would >> contribute during these sort of times...but, the one sure cure for some >> tough moments is a bit of nonesense and humor. Or...the List could go >> dry, staid and arrid which I do not feel meets the informal intent of >> the List or what I personally would consider to be a very informative >> List with a great deal of personality. >> >> But, I do own two other lists and knowing that the majority rules do >> apply, I'm more than happy to abide by the desires of the List members >> majority. I'm certain that unamed co-hort would agree as well....and >> then again, maybe not. It's your call...y'all. >> >> Dan >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as 2.9% >> Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW! >> http://click./1/915/5/_/_/_/951181501/ >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Get your money connected @ OnMoney.com - the first Web site that lets you >see, consolidate, and manage all of your finances all in one place. >http://click./1/1636/5/_/_/_/951182614/ >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2000 Report Share Posted February 21, 2000 Prrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr. Bob, you're nuts. But then, I find I like that in a purrrson... Thanks, www.vitalady.com Re: Off Topic Posts > From: raltman813@... > > , > > No need to apologize, just purr! > > BobA > Biliopancreatic Diversion (A Very Distal RNY) on 10/8/98 > 220 Pounds Gone Forever, But Not Forgotten! > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as 2.9% > Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW! > http://click./1/915/5/_/_/_/951198559/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2000 Report Share Posted February 22, 2000 Dear Graduates, I would totally agree that humor is a great release. I also would like to point out that I understood that the Graduate list is for members one year post-op, and you are not supposed to contribute until you get to that point. I must tell you that I have been a member of the main OSSG list for probably 1 and 1/2 years, and I read it pretty religiously, just about every night, and I NEVER fail to find some helpful or inspiring information from other members. This is especially useful, since I live too far away from my doctor's support group, and therefore, this is all I have, being fairly isolated otherwise. I am tremendously grateful for all of the wonderful help given, and I have learned much from others, and this has contributed to my success. As I near the one year mark, I have other issues that I think about, and have found that the Graduate OSSG list MAY be able to provide more information - more relevant to my current status, wondering about tummy tucks, post op adjustments, etc. I do lurk, simply because I was informed NOT to contribute until the one year mark. I still read the OSSG list, and I enjoy searching for those really good letters, and messages. Some just seem so very helpful. As many of you know, there is a tremendous amount of mail between these 2 lists, and because I have a lot of responsibilities at home, I only have so much time. And you are right, we can just leave the list. But, then, I would lose my chance to learn from others. Since this is a free country, I think any of us should be able to express our opinion as well, without being criticized. Just my 2 cents, since I do read some sense of criticism over my letter. Connie K in upstate NY RNY- 3/10/99 Fobi Pouch by Dr. Lirio 328---->185 (11 and 1/2 months post op) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2000 Report Share Posted February 22, 2000 In a message dated 2/22/00 7:40:03 PM Pacific Standard Time, conmay18@... writes: << without being criticized. Just my 2 cents, since I do read some sense of criticism over my letter. Connie K in upstate NY >> Connie, I apologize if some of our posts get a little too " inside " in our humor. We do tend to forget that there are many who follow the Graduate list to learn about what its like to be a year or more postop. I think we do share a lot of meaningful and important information including a lot of very personal and painful experiences. We also get a little goofy sometimes with our cat jokes, but we all have to laugh at a lot of what happened to us. I found the main OSSG list too full of preop exchanges and I found the Graduate list much more pertinent to my current postop status and growth. I hope you will stay with and contribute your experiences. BobA Biliopancreatic Diversion (A Very Distal RNY) on 10/8/98 220 Pounds Gone Forever, But Not Forgotten! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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