Re: I've been diagnosed with a dissociative disorder

[Guest guest]

Hi,Mark.I'm probably going to have to get back to you later with a better

response to your questions,especially with some references.I've been reading

about this stuff when I can and saving lots of links,so I'll find the better

ones for you.

I think it's important to point out what might not have been too clear from

my posts,which is that I was diagnosed with " Depersonalization Disorder " and

because of my high score in the DID range,with " Dissociation Disorder Not

Otherwise Specified " which isn't the same as having DID.I think it's something

like 40% of the people initially diagnosed with DDNOS are found to actually have

DID later in therapy.I don't know if that will be the case with me.It's a

complicated disorder.A dual diagnosis of Complex PTSD and DDNOS is very common

in survivors of child abuse--having full blown DID with a constellation of

separate,distinct personalities is less common but not as rare as many

think.Well,we all know here that child abuse isn't as uncommon as society wants

to believe.

Mark,although I certainly couldn't say exactly what your symptoms mean

because I'm not a clinician,it would help me to better direct you to some

resources if you could tell me more about what they are.Something that happens

to you periodically through out the day sounds like it reccurs enough to cause

you distress.I know it's hard to pin down when it's something you've been

experiencing for such a long time that it's like your personal normal.

If this helps,the difference between DID and DDNOS is that in DID,different

personalities within the same person were developed to " handle " different

aspects of the abuse and they are the ones who " hold " the memory of a specific

abuse and come forward to deal with triggers when they happen.Like,one

personality might be a tough guy who has no fear of the abuser,so when the

person with DID encounters someone who is like the abuser in their attitude or

the situation etc,it's the tough guy alter who comes forward and deals with the

triggering individual.That is called " switching " and it usually isn't as

dramatic as it's been portrayed in the popular media: other people might not

even realize they're dealing with the tough guy; it might just appear as if the

person with DID has suddenly become much more assertive or has more of a swagger

or bravado.Some people with DID are " co-conscious " with their alters,that

is,they are aware of them and of their functions and when say " tough guy " comes

forward,they are still there but more like a witness to how " tough guy " is

handling the situation.One of the goals of therapy for DID is to become

" co-conscious " with alters so that you're not losing time when they come forward

and so that all of the alters are functioning somewhat in tandem with the core

personality.

In DDNOS,instead of alters with their own personalities and functions,what

you have is fractured ego states or fragments.These are more like the feelings

or ego states of whatever you experienced when the original abuse happened to

you and when you are triggered,they kind of take you over.They haven't been

fully integrated into your awareness and are still just as they were when you

were abused: helpless terror or abject horror/despair...extreme wounded

frustration...profound horrifying sadness...paralyzing anxiety...they take

control of you and you dissociate into them instead of being able to just shrug

them off as a passing feeling/reaction that is appropriate to the present day

situation or person that has triggered them or it.It's like being possessed by a

feeling state that you can't reason yourself out of or that comes over you

before you can reason yourself out of it.The goal of therapy for DDNOS is to

identify these dissociated ego states and their sources and to integrate them

into your adult personality that has more evolved skills at its disposal for

handling triggering stress.

What you have described sounds more like the above but it would be really

irresponsible for me to say that's it for sure--you'd only know if you got a

proper diagnosis.I'd be happy to dialogue with you on these subjects and to

sound them out together.It's actually really hard to give a clear synopsis of

what it feels like to dissociate/depersonalize/derealize.And there's lots of

misinformation on the internet,outdated treatments,contradictions.That's why I

want to come back to you with what I think is the best info.

My therapist and I are going to take an eclectic approach using a

combination of " ego state " therapy,cognitive/assertiveness skills training to

help me to learn how to establish my own sense of safety instead of becoming

paralyzed when I dissociate into my fragments and grief/trauma work to help me

come to some acceptance of what happened to me.We're going to have to figure out

together what works or doesn't and to keep adapting it as we go along.

I have to get going now...I never have enough time on here to really

respond to posts...I feel like I'm usually going in slow motion! Too many

thoughts in my head all at once....

Take care and thanks for your kind words,

> >

> > I've posted fairly recently about some intense issues I'm dealing with (or

trying to) in regards to being " raised " by a BPD/probably co-morbid psychopathic

nada and that I had decided to attempt therapy after a delay of some 16 years if

I could find a therapist I thought I could work with.

> >

> > I did find someone and based on symptoms I was reporting (I'm at the

point where I just want to know what is up with me as a consequence of my

childhood,even though I was entertaining scary thoughts of being told that I

also have BPD even though I have no rages or black/white thinking and I don't

routinely project my feelings onto others,still I guess there's always this fear

of being " blamed " by being told I'm the same as nada somehow)--anyway,the

therapist I chose decided to conduct a long interview session ( an inventory

that was developed to test for this) to see how I scored on the scale of

dissociative disorders.

> >

> > The result is that I score for " severe depersonalization disorder " and

am in the high range for a score of " dissociative identity disorder " formerly

known as " multiple personality disorder " .Most people who score in the range I

did actually have DID but my diagnosis is for " Dissociative Disorder Not

Otherwise Specified " because I don't have full blown alters ie split off

personalities who assume executive control of my functioning at times.

> >

> > I also have Complex PTSD,which often co-occurs with a dissociative

disorder.

> >

> > I apologize if this post is a bit rambling or not very concise.I

last saw my therapist earlier in the week when we discussed what this diagnosis

is going to mean and what we're going to do and I've been crying off and on ever

since...understanding that the damage is real and the abuse is real; nada did

this to me.

> >

> > I've been doing some reading on the subject and have learned that

unlike BPD,a dissociative disorder has NO genetic basis.You can only " get " DID

or DDNOS from repeated,prolonged trauma in childhood.Nobody is genetically

predisposed to dissociate due to perceived stress (like in BPD)--our brains are

wired to dissociate only when we encounter actual life threatening

incidents,such as actual disasters like car accidents or when we are subjected

to trauma that threatens our sense of psychological integrity,such as sexual

assault.Normally,such a traumatic incident is a one-off event and we recover

from the dissociation and return to our regular functioning although we may

continue to have symptoms of PTSD if we are unable to process the trauma,like

flashbacks or nightmares.

> >

> > Dissociation (going outside of yourself/leaving your body/feeling

unreal/feeling numb/losing time) is a normal adaptive response to a traumatic

event,but when the trauma is repetitive and ongoing and happens when no flight

or fight response is possible and happens when you're a child whose brain is

still developing,it becomes a reflexive response to anything that triggers

memories or associations with the repeated traumas.A one-off dissociation

doesn't become an automatic reflex,but when the developing brain is subjected to

repeated trauma from which there is no escape,dissociating becomes habitual and

assumes part of the brain's functioning.What was intended by nature to be an

adaptive response becomes maladaptive because the individual no longer has

conscious control over it-- but this can only occur when the trauma is

repetitive enough and overwhelming enough that the response of dissociation must

be employed over and over again resulting in dissociation becoming a reflex.

> >

> > In other words,99% of people who have DID were repetitively abused as

children.They were NOT born that way! The other 1% have rare,severe brain

injuries from an accident.And they weren't born that way,either.

> >

> > Someone who presents with this kind of severe dissociation is someone

who has been badly,repeatedly abused.There is no genetic cause for it,aside from

perhaps having parents who are genetically Cluster B or psychotic.

> >

> > Personally,I don't lose huge chunks of time or find myself in some

place I don't remember going to,although at some points in my childhood I did.My

dissociation is a kind of constant low grade where I feel like I can't quite

catch up with time or can't be quite present in the moment.I often feel spacey

or like I'm floating.I often feel at a remove from myself or from events that

are happening around me,like I am not in sync with what is going on or with how

I think or feel.Life often seems dreamlike to me,like an echo of how I felt

every time I was traumatized as a child that never goes away: life never comes

into full relief for me like it's real and happening now; it seems more like a

supposition of existence,something that may or may not be really happening.I

have the sense of drifting and of being more of an observer of my own life than

a participant.Time has little meaning for me and I have to force myself to

adhere to a clock schedule,such as being on time for something like work.I feel

like I'm in a trance and have to always do the same thing every morning like

shower at seven,be dressed when the clock says eight,leave the house when the

clock says eight fifteen or else I drift and will not be on time.It's especially

bad in the morning when I get up.

> >

> > I generally just don't feel embodied.I feel more like a ghost.I have

this odd sense that life is passing me by and I can't catch up.I don't feel like

I am enough to BE in my own life,like I am not really there in it.It's like I am

not quite alive.

> >

> > I lose little bits of time here and there when I am triggered by

something and go completely blank.It's like I'm just not there anymore.This is

misinterpreted by others as indifference rather than a moment of complete

dissociation.It usually happens in some affective context and has caused me alot

of grief in close relationships,yet when I have openly said that I was

dissociating I've rarely been understood.I misplace items alot and have to keep

important documents in the same drawer of my filing cabinet or I will never find

them.Many times I've reached for my toothbrush in the morning only to find it's

gone and it's in some weird place like the medicine cabinet or the window sill

and I have no memory of putting it there or I go to get milk for my cereal at

breakfast and it's not in the fridge but on the counter where it's been since

the morning before and I hadn't even noticed...this happens so often and it

scares me and frustrates me.It's like I am senile.I have to keep my keys in the

front door lock or I will lose them.

> >

> > At work I have to constantly remind myself of what I need to do and

if I get distracted by some unforeseen task I nearly panic quietly and

internally trying to remember where I was before I got interrupted.It's

embarassing to have to keep constant notes to remind me of what I need to do

even though it's basic stuff so I hide them in a drawer or keep them in my

pocket.I know that I'm not a stupid person but it makes me feel stupid to have

to remind myself of these basic things.I have to constantly force myself to

focus on tasks because I am always floating and nothing seems quite real.

> >

> > The worst part is feeling like I have to struggle to grasp my own

emotions,like I can't quite experience them.I am dissociated from my

emotions--they are not in tune with my thoughts.I can think " I have a reason to

be sad " without being able to actually feel sad.

> >

> > I don't feel present,most of the time,in my own body.My own thought

process seems more like an observer observing than of me thinking about me.It's

like there's this second hand person that I can't integrate into myself.I know

that it's still me,it just doesn't FEEL like me.

> >

> > Anyway.I feel overwhelmed by all of this and sobered by the prospect

of addressing these problems in therapy.I'm going to do it and I was told my

prognosis is very good.It's hard getting started,hopefully once I do I will feel

better.

> >

> > I feel like this was a very self indulgent post.I would not wish

these feelings on anyone but if any of you can relate to any of this,I'd

appreciate your thoughts.

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

I've just had the chance to read your first post and subsequent posts in this

thread. I'm so sad for all you've been through and this diagnosis must be

difficult to digest. You have indeed survived so much, but the fact that you

recognize that as not being enough is a powerful step toward healing. I'm so

glad you have found a good therapist to help you through.

In spite the disconnect between your emotions, presence, body -- the fact that

you are so aware of this and able to clearly articulate your experience is also

huge. In fact, you explain it so clearly that I hope you will journal the

process you go through - I think that may help you - and possibly others down

the road should you choose to " share. "

I have no great words of wisdom to impart. I've had only brief experience with

dissociation (depersonalization and disrealization), but what you describe is

exactly what I felt. I'm still not sure what brought me " back, " but I think it

was reaching a place of feeling safe or relief from some of the duress. Others

have offered such great advice on finding ways to ground yourself that the only

thing I can only add the mix is the benefits I've found from therapeutic

massage. I also can attest to the benefits of the martial arts, yoga, and

meditation.

I do want to commend you, though, not only for your strength and courage in

facing the road ahead, but what you have accomplished up to this point. Yes,

you're psyche may have been forced to use drastic means to shield itself from

things no child should have had cope with, but I think you're ready to start to

remove that shield, or will be very soon. What you reveal in your posts, but

may not realize is ALL the ways you have found to manage and function and be

productive, in spite of all you've dealt with. You seem to be a little

uncomfortable or embarrassed at having to be so regimented, but I think it's

terrifc that you've found what works and you DO IT and you keep moving forward.

Many, many would have not have been able to do that - and it says to me that you

have the strength to move forward and heal. And, you're smart enough to

recognize your limitations and are making wise choices (re: promotion).

I know this is raising complications in your relationship, but maybe it will be

possible at some point when your are comfortable and if your partner is to have

her join in a few sessions with your therapist (or she could have a few alone).

T might be able to help her understand....... and I think you must be pretty

tired at this point of trying to explain yourself (to anyone). I think you are

a remarkable person and you deserve a loving supporting relationship. You are

worth it.

Peace, hope, healing. And (((((hug))))).

Suzy

[Guest guest]

Can I just say, don't underestimate the satisfaction of breaking boards!

My son is working on (Tae Kwon Do) second degree black belt and I've often

wanted to jump into the class and break a few - I'd be crap at the rest of the

moves, but I'm pretty sure I could do this one without training after a

frustrating day....

Suzy

[Guest guest]

Tee hee hee,xrisacct,those are great examples of how to employ reductio ad

absurdum as reductio ad ridiculum.Sometimes it's the only way to get others to

see how flawed their " logic " is.I use this technique sometimes myself when my

self esteem is at a level that allows me to remember to do it.

Have you studied philosophy or ever thought of becoming a lawyer? (not the

ambulance chasing type or corporate shill,but a real one like a Clarence

Darrow?)

>

>

> > WHAT!!??? I thought when I read that,hey you jerk,let's see how

effing

> > " magnanimous " you'd be feeling for the rest of your life if it was YOU.

> >

>

>

> Truly spoken by an armchair general, in this case assigned to your life. It

doesn't affect him, so saying that is pretty easy.

>

> Years ago I started rejecting advice and admonitions if they weren't

accompanied by a way to do it. I still ask people now about that " hey ,can you

do it yourself " ? Just as Jesus did. If they can't I point out they have no

place to judge, or bug me.

>

> People do this with my diabetes too-they'll try and tell me what to do with

it, despite 27 years and a good a1c. I have asked them if they will sign a

document accepting responsibility for my financial, emotional, and physical well

being being. When they say " no " , I state

> " Well, if you are not gonna take responsibility for my decisions, you have no

right to make them " .

>

> That spooks them, and they shut up.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi again,Mark...A couple of things: if you bookmark (save) the website for this

forum,it makes it alot easier to see who posted when on the actual board,instead

of receiving e-mails individually or as a digest in your inbox.

I have links to more info about dissociative disorders,so just let me know if

you'd like me to post them for you.I just don't want to disturb you with some of

them that mention co-morbidities like schizophrenia/personality disorders that

can go with something like DID.

It might be more helpful to you right now to just go directly to a forum I

found where there are members who have both DID or DDNOS.My therapist

recommended I do this to orient myself somewhat and to get feedback from people

who are living with these conditions.I haven't actually joined the forum I'm

going to link yet.When you go in,you are on a guest only page and you have to

apply to answer a questionnaire to be approved for membership.You can ask

questions in the guest forum and from my reading there,I got the impression that

any sincere question from someone like yourself who is looking for some answers

will be welcomed.The people there were very friendly.

Here it is:

http://z3.invisionfree.com/A_Minds_Journey/index.php?s=f6f14f68b1034192db94ec1dd\

4987e23 & showforum=51

Maybe reading some of the posts there will also give you a clearer idea of

what's going on with you.I know it did for me.And of course I am also open to

any questions you have.

Take care,

> >

> > I've posted fairly recently about some intense issues I'm dealing with (or

trying to) in regards to being " raised " by a BPD/probably co-morbid psychopathic

nada and that I had decided to attempt therapy after a delay of some 16 years if

I could find a therapist I thought I could work with.

> >

> > I did find someone and based on symptoms I was reporting (I'm at the

point where I just want to know what is up with me as a consequence of my

childhood,even though I was entertaining scary thoughts of being told that I

also have BPD even though I have no rages or black/white thinking and I don't

routinely project my feelings onto others,still I guess there's always this fear

of being " blamed " by being told I'm the same as nada somehow)--anyway,the

therapist I chose decided to conduct a long interview session ( an inventory

that was developed to test for this) to see how I scored on the scale of

dissociative disorders.

> >

> > The result is that I score for " severe depersonalization disorder " and

am in the high range for a score of " dissociative identity disorder " formerly

known as " multiple personality disorder " .Most people who score in the range I

did actually have DID but my diagnosis is for " Dissociative Disorder Not

Otherwise Specified " because I don't have full blown alters ie split off

personalities who assume executive control of my functioning at times.

> >

> > I also have Complex PTSD,which often co-occurs with a dissociative

disorder.

> >

> > I apologize if this post is a bit rambling or not very concise.I

last saw my therapist earlier in the week when we discussed what this diagnosis

is going to mean and what we're going to do and I've been crying off and on ever

since...understanding that the damage is real and the abuse is real; nada did

this to me.

> >

> > I've been doing some reading on the subject and have learned that

unlike BPD,a dissociative disorder has NO genetic basis.You can only " get " DID

or DDNOS from repeated,prolonged trauma in childhood.Nobody is genetically

predisposed to dissociate due to perceived stress (like in BPD)--our brains are

wired to dissociate only when we encounter actual life threatening

incidents,such as actual disasters like car accidents or when we are subjected

to trauma that threatens our sense of psychological integrity,such as sexual

assault.Normally,such a traumatic incident is a one-off event and we recover

from the dissociation and return to our regular functioning although we may

continue to have symptoms of PTSD if we are unable to process the trauma,like

flashbacks or nightmares.

> >

> > Dissociation (going outside of yourself/leaving your body/feeling

unreal/feeling numb/losing time) is a normal adaptive response to a traumatic

event,but when the trauma is repetitive and ongoing and happens when no flight

or fight response is possible and happens when you're a child whose brain is

still developing,it becomes a reflexive response to anything that triggers

memories or associations with the repeated traumas.A one-off dissociation

doesn't become an automatic reflex,but when the developing brain is subjected to

repeated trauma from which there is no escape,dissociating becomes habitual and

assumes part of the brain's functioning.What was intended by nature to be an

adaptive response becomes maladaptive because the individual no longer has

conscious control over it-- but this can only occur when the trauma is

repetitive enough and overwhelming enough that the response of dissociation must

be employed over and over again resulting in dissociation becoming a reflex.

> >

> > In other words,99% of people who have DID were repetitively abused as

children.They were NOT born that way! The other 1% have rare,severe brain

injuries from an accident.And they weren't born that way,either.

> >

> > Someone who presents with this kind of severe dissociation is someone

who has been badly,repeatedly abused.There is no genetic cause for it,aside from

perhaps having parents who are genetically Cluster B or psychotic.

> >

> > Personally,I don't lose huge chunks of time or find myself in some

place I don't remember going to,although at some points in my childhood I did.My

dissociation is a kind of constant low grade where I feel like I can't quite

catch up with time or can't be quite present in the moment.I often feel spacey

or like I'm floating.I often feel at a remove from myself or from events that

are happening around me,like I am not in sync with what is going on or with how

I think or feel.Life often seems dreamlike to me,like an echo of how I felt

every time I was traumatized as a child that never goes away: life never comes

into full relief for me like it's real and happening now; it seems more like a

supposition of existence,something that may or may not be really happening.I

have the sense of drifting and of being more of an observer of my own life than

a participant.Time has little meaning for me and I have to force myself to

adhere to a clock schedule,such as being on time for something like work.I feel

like I'm in a trance and have to always do the same thing every morning like

shower at seven,be dressed when the clock says eight,leave the house when the

clock says eight fifteen or else I drift and will not be on time.It's especially

bad in the morning when I get up.

> >

> > I generally just don't feel embodied.I feel more like a ghost.I have

this odd sense that life is passing me by and I can't catch up.I don't feel like

I am enough to BE in my own life,like I am not really there in it.It's like I am

not quite alive.

> >

> > I lose little bits of time here and there when I am triggered by

something and go completely blank.It's like I'm just not there anymore.This is

misinterpreted by others as indifference rather than a moment of complete

dissociation.It usually happens in some affective context and has caused me alot

of grief in close relationships,yet when I have openly said that I was

dissociating I've rarely been understood.I misplace items alot and have to keep

important documents in the same drawer of my filing cabinet or I will never find

them.Many times I've reached for my toothbrush in the morning only to find it's

gone and it's in some weird place like the medicine cabinet or the window sill

and I have no memory of putting it there or I go to get milk for my cereal at

breakfast and it's not in the fridge but on the counter where it's been since

the morning before and I hadn't even noticed...this happens so often and it

scares me and frustrates me.It's like I am senile.I have to keep my keys in the

front door lock or I will lose them.

> >

> > At work I have to constantly remind myself of what I need to do and

if I get distracted by some unforeseen task I nearly panic quietly and

internally trying to remember where I was before I got interrupted.It's

embarassing to have to keep constant notes to remind me of what I need to do

even though it's basic stuff so I hide them in a drawer or keep them in my

pocket.I know that I'm not a stupid person but it makes me feel stupid to have

to remind myself of these basic things.I have to constantly force myself to

focus on tasks because I am always floating and nothing seems quite real.

> >

> > The worst part is feeling like I have to struggle to grasp my own

emotions,like I can't quite experience them.I am dissociated from my

emotions--they are not in tune with my thoughts.I can think " I have a reason to

be sad " without being able to actually feel sad.

> >

> > I don't feel present,most of the time,in my own body.My own thought

process seems more like an observer observing than of me thinking about me.It's

like there's this second hand person that I can't integrate into myself.I know

that it's still me,it just doesn't FEEL like me.

> >

> > Anyway.I feel overwhelmed by all of this and sobered by the prospect

of addressing these problems in therapy.I'm going to do it and I was told my

prognosis is very good.It's hard getting started,hopefully once I do I will feel

better.

> >

> > I feel like this was a very self indulgent post.I would not wish

these feelings on anyone but if any of you can relate to any of this,I'd

appreciate your thoughts.

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I have DID. I would be happy to email with anyone about if they'd like to

email me personallly...please feel free to.

In a message dated 10/6/2009 10:47:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

mwhitinger@... writes:

,

I don't know a lot about the DID, but have read a little. I have thought

that I might have it. Do you have any references that I could read; any

definitions or therapy approaches that have been recommended?

On a positive note, just remember what you said,

" Dissociation. " Dissociation.<WBR>..is a normal adaptive response

event. "

And i would add, a normal response to a traumatic event...IN ORDER TO

SURVIVE. It was your psychie's way of surviving the trauma. So try and be kind

to yourself while discovering more about this.

The part i relate to happpens periodically throughout the day. For most of

my life i just thought it was my normal moods, but now i'm becoming more

" aware " that these episodes might be flashbacks, or even altered states. For

me they can last for days or minutes or hours. I'm still not sure if they

are totally different states, but when i snap out of the depression or

anxiety states, I feel myself looking back at it and thinking, what came over

me? Why was i so anxious, scared, and helpless.

It does feel a little like what you're describing, but maybe not as

severe. It's hard to pinpoint, and that's why it would be interesting to get a

diagnosis and see if the treatment applies.

I would be happy to dialogue with you about it. I'm sorry i can't tell you

more, but 3 years ago i remember picking up a book on it in the book

store. I'm not sure of the exact title, something like Dealing with DID, or

something like that. When I'm in the bookstore next, I'll do a search on it and

let you know.

Does your Therapist know the treatment approach; what you're supposed to

do?

Good luck, and realize that someone is here to talk about it.

Mark

P.S. I'm kind of new here and have only posted a few times, but I haven't

been able to find my original post, or find out if anyone else commented.

Maybe I have to write down the day of the post or something.

>

> I've posted fairly recently about some intense issues I'm dealing with

(or trying to) in regards to being " raised " by a BPD/probably co-morbid

psychopathic nada and that I had decided to attempt therapy after a delay of

some 16 years if I could find a therapist I thought I could work with.

>

> I did find someone and based on symptoms I was reporting (I'm at the

point where I just want to know what is up with me as a consequence of my

childhood,even though I was entertaining scary thoughts of being told that I

also have BPD even though I have no rages or black/white thinking and I don't

routinely project my feelings onto others,still I guess there's always this

fear of being " blamed " by being told I'm the same as nada

somehow)--anyway, I did find someone and based on symptoms I was reporting (I'm

at the

point where I just want to know what is up with me as a consequence of my

childhood,even though I was enter

>

> The result is that I score for " severe depersonalization disorder " and

am in the high range for a score of " dissociative identity disorder "

formerly known as " multiple personality disorder " .Most people who score in the

range I did actually have DID but my diagnosis is for " Dissociative Disorder

Not Otherwise Specified " because I don't have full blown alters ie split off

personalities who assume executive control of my functioning at times.

>

> I also have Complex PTSD,which often co-occurs with a dissociative

disorder.

>

> I apologize if this post is a bit rambling or not very concise.I last

saw my therapist earlier in the week when we discussed what this diagnosis is

going to mean and what we're going to do and I've been crying off and on

ever since...understandi I apologize if this post is a bit rambling or not

very concise.I last

>

> I've been doing some reading on the subject and have learned that unlike

BPD,a dissociative disorder has NO genetic basis.You can only " get " DID or

DDNOS from repeated,prolonged trauma in childhood.Nobody is genetically

predisposed to dissociate due to perceived stress (like in BPD)--our brains

are wired to dissociate only when we encounter actual life threatening

incidents,such as actual disasters like car accidents or when we are subjected

to trauma that threatens our sense of psychological integrity,such as sexual

assault.Normally, I've been doing some reading on the subject and have

learned that unlike BPD,a dissociative disorder has NO genetic basis.You can

only " get " DID or DDNOS from repeated,prolonged trauma in childhood.Nobody

is genetically predisposed to

>

> Dissociation (going outside of yourself/leaving your body/feeling

unreal/feeling numb/losing time) is a normal adaptive response to a traumatic

event,but when the trauma is repetitive and ongoing and happens when no flight

or fight response is possible and happens when you're a child whose brain

is still developing,it becomes a reflexive response to anything that

triggers memories or associations with the repeated traumas.A one-off

dissociation doesn't become an automatic reflex,but when the developing brain

is

subjected to repeated trauma from which there is no escape,dissociating becomes

habitual and assumes part of the brain's functioning. Dissociation (going

outside of yourself/leaving your body/feeling unreal/feeling numb/losing

time) is a normal adaptive response to a traumatic event,but when the trauma

is repetitive and ongoing and happens when no flight or fight response is

possible and happens when you're a child whose brain is still developing,it

becomes a reflexive

>

> In other words,99% of people who have DID were repetitively abused as

children.They were NOT born that way! The other 1% have rare,severe brain

injuries from an accident.And they weren't born that way,either.

>

> Someone who presents with this kind of severe dissociation is someone

who has been badly,repeatedly abused.There is no genetic cause for it,aside

from perhaps having parents who are genetically Cluster B or psychotic.

>

> Personally,I don't lose huge chunks of time or find myself in some place

I don't remember going to,although at some points in my childhood I did.My

dissociation is a kind of constant low grade where I feel like I can't

quite catch up with time or can't be quite present in the moment.I often feel

spacey or like I'm floating.I often feel at a remove from myself or from

events that are happening around me,like I am not in sync with what is going

on or with how I think or feel.Life often seems dreamlike to me,like an

echo of how I felt every time I was traumatized as a child that never goes

away: life never comes into full relief for me like it's real and happening

now; it seems more like a supposition of existence,something that may or may

not be really happening.I have the sense of drifting and of being more of

an observer of my own life than a participant.can't be quite present in the

moment.I often feel spacey or like I'm floating.I often feel at a remove

from myself or from events that are happening around me,like I am not in

sync with what is going on or with how I think or feel.Life often seems

dreamlike to me,like an echo of how I felt every time I was traumatized as a

child that never goes away: life never comes into full relief for me like it's

re

>

> I generally just don't feel embodied.I feel more like a ghost.I have

this odd sense that life is passing me by and I can't catch up.I don't feel

like I am enough to BE in my own life,like I am not really there in it.It's

like I am not quite alive.

>

> I lose little bits of time here and there when I am triggered by

something and go completely blank.It's like I'm just not there anymore.This is

misinterpreted by others as indifference rather than a moment of complete

dissociation. I lose little bits of time here and there when I am triggered by

something and go completely blank. I lose little bits of time here and there

when I am triggered by something and go completely blank.It's like I'm

just not there anymore.This is misinterpreted by others as indifference rather

than a moment of complete dissociation.<WBR>It usually happens in some

affective context and has caused me alot of grief in close

relationships,<WBR>yet when I have openly said that I was dissociating I've

rarely been

understood.I misplace items alot and have to keep important documents in the

same

drawer of my filing cabinet or I will never find them.Many times I've

reached for my toothbrush in the morning only to find it's gone and it's in

some weird place like the medicine cabinet or the window sill and I have

>

> At work I have to constantly remind myself of what I need to do and if I

get distracted by some unforeseen task I nearly panic quietly and

internally trying to remember where I was before I got interrupted. At work I

have

to constantly remind myself of what I need to do and if I get distracted by

some unforeseen task I nearly panic quietly and internally trying to

remember where I was before I got interrupted.<WBR>It's embarassing to have to

keep constant notes to remind me of what I need to do even though it's basic

stuff so I hide them in a drawer or keep them in my pocket.I know th

>

> The worst part is feeling like I have to struggle to grasp my own

emotions,like I can't quite experience them.I am dissociated from my

emotions--they are not in tune with my thoughts.I can think " I have a reason to

be sad "

without being able to actually feel sad.

>

> I don't feel present,most of the time,in my own body.My own thought

process seems more like an observer observing than of me thinking about me.It's

like there's this second hand person that I can't integrate into myself.I

know that it's still me,it just doesn't FEEL like me.

>

> Anyway.I feel overwhelmed by all of this and sobered by the prospect of

addressing these problems in therapy.I'm going to do it and I was told my

prognosis is very good.It's hard getting started,hopefully once I do I will

feel better.

>

> I feel like this was a very self indulgent post.I would not wish these

feelings on anyone but if any of you can relate to any of this,I'd

appreciate your thoughts.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Suzy,thank you so much for this very nice pep talk.Maybe one of the hardest

parts of any recovery is coming out of denial and dealing.Even though I wasn't

exactly shocked by this diagnosis,I had some denial via brain washing by

nada/foo like the rest of us here,that my childhood wasn't " so bad " and I hadn't

even realized the extent to which I had continued to carry that with me.The crux

of that being,for me,SELF denial at a profound psychological level,within my own

psyche.

Thanks for putting a positive perspective on my not accepting the

promotion.I feel under some pressure to perform and it makes me feel very

inadequate when I know that I have these limits--but you're right,there is

always some wisdom in recognizing our own limits.

But the more I consider the reality of where I am now symptoms wise and

what I did as a kid to cope,the more sense it makes to me.One of my problems has

been trying to force myself to live by the yardsticks of people who haven't had

my experiences which is another sort of denial.Dissociation can't be just willed

away.It has to be worked through.I don't intend to resign myself to being like

this for the rest of my life,but it's a relief in many ways to stop trying to be

like I am not and to turn my efforts towards fixing how I don't want to be.And

it's a lot more real!

At a point a bit later,yes,I would like to have my therapist explain what

all of it means to my girlfriend.She could explain it better than I can.I'm used

to all of this but I want to wait until I am more firmly on the path to handling

this myself before we do that since I think she is going to need

reassurance,mostly from me,that it's not all as dire as it might sound.I will

encourage her to see the therapist herself on her own to talk,if she needs

to.She's not quite at the point of being able to accept that there is stuff she

could understand better--she thinks I've dealt with it pretty well.It's like a

secret that has been let out that I never meant purposefully to keep from her.I

think she needs to digest it all in smaller increments than I have needed

to.We'll just have to see how it all turns out.

Thanks so much again for your kindness and support.

>

> ,

>

> I've just had the chance to read your first post and subsequent posts in this

thread. I'm so sad for all you've been through and this diagnosis must be

difficult to digest. You have indeed survived so much, but the fact that you

recognize that as not being enough is a powerful step toward healing. I'm so

glad you have found a good therapist to help you through.

>

> In spite the disconnect between your emotions, presence, body -- the fact that

you are so aware of this and able to clearly articulate your experience is also

huge. In fact, you explain it so clearly that I hope you will journal the

process you go through - I think that may help you - and possibly others down

the road should you choose to " share. "

>

> I have no great words of wisdom to impart. I've had only brief experience

with dissociation (depersonalization and disrealization), but what you describe

is exactly what I felt. I'm still not sure what brought me " back, " but I think

it was reaching a place of feeling safe or relief from some of the duress.

Others have offered such great advice on finding ways to ground yourself that

the only thing I can only add the mix is the benefits I've found from

therapeutic massage. I also can attest to the benefits of the martial arts,

yoga, and meditation.

>

> I do want to commend you, though, not only for your strength and courage in

facing the road ahead, but what you have accomplished up to this point. Yes,

you're psyche may have been forced to use drastic means to shield itself from

things no child should have had cope with, but I think you're ready to start to

remove that shield, or will be very soon. What you reveal in your posts, but

may not realize is ALL the ways you have found to manage and function and be

productive, in spite of all you've dealt with. You seem to be a little

uncomfortable or embarrassed at having to be so regimented, but I think it's

terrifc that you've found what works and you DO IT and you keep moving forward.

Many, many would have not have been able to do that - and it says to me that you

have the strength to move forward and heal. And, you're smart enough to

recognize your limitations and are making wise choices (re: promotion).

>

> I know this is raising complications in your relationship, but maybe it will

be possible at some point when your are comfortable and if your partner is to

have her join in a few sessions with your therapist (or she could have a few

alone). T might be able to help her understand....... and I think you must be

pretty tired at this point of trying to explain yourself (to anyone). I think

you are a remarkable person and you deserve a loving supporting relationship.

You are worth it.

>

> Peace, hope, healing. And (((((hug))))).

>

> Suzy

>

[Guest guest]

,thank you for your advice.I do have some hiring/firing authority right now

as well as input on strategy.The promotion I turned down would have involved

liasing with regional execs and at times with the CEO/CFO.What troubles me is

not being able to predict in advance what kind of state I'd be in for such

meetings.I have some days when some aspect or memory of abuse is bothering me

and on those days,I'm just not switched on and with it.Nor can I totally fake

being so.Where I am right now,I can " get away " with it but if the stakes were

higher...it could mess up my career.

I think my main objective right now is trying to heal,which is exciting

in itself because one day that's going to put me in the driver's seat and then I

can freely decide what I am capable of.It's hard to explain how much I live in

dread of my dissociation and how that works.

Like you said,it will all happen when it's supposed to.And that could

very well be something I can't even envision yet.

Thanks again for your kind support,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I've posted fairly recently about some intense issues I'm dealing

with (or trying to) in regards to being " raised " by a BPD/probably co-morbid

psychopathic nada and that I had decided to attempt therapy after a delay of

some 16 years if I could find a therapist I thought I could work with.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I did find someone and based on symptoms I was reporting (I'm at

the point where I just want to know what is up with me as a consequence of my

childhood,even though I was entertaining scary thoughts of being told that I

also have BPD even though I have no rages or black/white thinking and I don't

routinely project my feelings onto others,still I guess there's always this fear

of being " blamed " by being told I'm the same as nada somehow)--anyway,the

therapist I chose decided to conduct a long interview session ( an inventory

that was developed to test for this) to see how I scored on the scale of

dissociative disorders.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The result is that I score for " severe depersonalization

disorder " and am in the high range for a score of " dissociative identity

disorder " formerly known as " multiple personality disorder " .Most people who

score in the range I did actually have DID but my diagnosis is for " Dissociative

Disorder Not Otherwise Specified " because I don't have full blown alters ie

split off personalities who assume executive control of my functioning at times.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I also have Complex PTSD,which often co-occurs with a

dissociative disorder.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I apologize if this post is a bit rambling or not very

concise.I last saw my therapist earlier in the week when we discussed what this

diagnosis is going to mean and what we're going to do and I've been crying off

and on ever since...understanding that the damage is real and the abuse is real;

nada did this to me.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I've been doing some reading on the subject and have learned

that unlike BPD,a dissociative disorder has NO genetic basis.You can only " get "

DID or DDNOS from repeated,prolonged trauma in childhood.Nobody is genetically

predisposed to dissociate due to perceived stress (like in BPD)--our brains are

wired to dissociate only when we encounter actual life threatening

incidents,such as actual disasters like car accidents or when we are subjected

to trauma that threatens our sense of psychological integrity,such as sexual

assault.Normally,such a traumatic incident is a one-off event and we recover

from the dissociation and return to our regular functioning although we may

continue to have symptoms of PTSD if we are unable to process the trauma,like

flashbacks or nightmares.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dissociation (going outside of yourself/leaving your

body/feeling unreal/feeling numb/losing time) is a normal adaptive response to a

traumatic event,but when the trauma is repetitive and ongoing and happens when

no flight or fight response is possible and happens when you're a child whose

brain is still developing,it becomes a reflexive response to anything that

triggers memories or associations with the repeated traumas.A one-off

dissociation doesn't become an automatic reflex,but when the developing brain is

subjected to repeated trauma from which there is no escape,dissociating becomes

habitual and assumes part of the brain's functioning.What was intended by nature

to be an adaptive response becomes maladaptive because the individual no longer

has conscious control over it-- but this can only occur when the trauma is

repetitive enough and overwhelming enough that the response of dissociation must

be employed over and over again resulting in dissociation becoming a reflex.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > In other words,99% of people who have DID were repetitively

abused as children.They were NOT born that way! The other 1% have rare,severe

brain injuries from an accident.And they weren't born that way,either.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Someone who presents with this kind of severe dissociation is

someone who has been badly,repeatedly abused.There is no genetic cause for

it,aside from perhaps having parents who are genetically Cluster B or psychotic.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Personally,I don't lose huge chunks of time or find myself in

some place I don't remember going to,although at some points in my childhood I

did.My dissociation is a kind of constant low grade where I feel like I can't

quite catch up with time or can't be quite present in the moment.I often feel

spacey or like I'm floating.I often feel at a remove from myself or from events

that are happening around me,like I am not in sync with what is going on or with

how I think or feel.Life often seems dreamlike to me,like an echo of how I felt

every time I was traumatized as a child that never goes away: life never comes

into full relief for me like it's real and happening now; it seems more like a

supposition of existence,something that may or may not be really happening.I

have the sense of drifting and of being more of an observer of my own life than

a participant.Time has little meaning for me and I have to force myself to

adhere to a clock schedule,such as being on time for something like work.I feel

like I'm in a trance and have to always do the same thing every morning like

shower at seven,be dressed when the clock says eight,leave the house when the

clock says eight fifteen or else I drift and will not be on time.It's especially

bad in the morning when I get up.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I generally just don't feel embodied.I feel more like a

ghost.I have this odd sense that life is passing me by and I can't catch up.I

don't feel like I am enough to BE in my own life,like I am not really there in

it.It's like I am not quite alive.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I lose little bits of time here and there when I am

triggered by something and go completely blank.It's like I'm just not there

anymore.This is misinterpreted by others as indifference rather than a moment of

complete dissociation.It usually happens in some affective context and has

caused me alot of grief in close relationships,yet when I have openly said that

I was dissociating I've rarely been understood.I misplace items alot and have to

keep important documents in the same drawer of my filing cabinet or I will never

find them.Many times I've reached for my toothbrush in the morning only to find

it's gone and it's in some weird place like the medicine cabinet or the window

sill and I have no memory of putting it there or I go to get milk for my cereal

at breakfast and it's not in the fridge but on the counter where it's been since

the morning before and I hadn't even noticed...this happens so often and it

scares me and frustrates me.It's like I am senile.I have to keep my keys in the

front door lock or I will lose them.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > At work I have to constantly remind myself of what I need

to do and if I get distracted by some unforeseen task I nearly panic quietly and

internally trying to remember where I was before I got interrupted.It's

embarassing to have to keep constant notes to remind me of what I need to do

even though it's basic stuff so I hide them in a drawer or keep them in my

pocket.I know that I'm not a stupid person but it makes me feel stupid to have

to remind myself of these basic things.I have to constantly force myself to

focus on tasks because I am always floating and nothing seems quite real.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The worst part is feeling like I have to struggle to grasp

my own emotions,like I can't quite experience them.I am dissociated from my

emotions--they are not in tune with my thoughts.I can think " I have a reason to

be sad " without being able to actually feel sad.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I don't feel present,most of the time,in my own body.My own

thought process seems more like an observer observing than of me thinking about

me.It's like there's this second hand person that I can't integrate into

myself.I know that it's still me,it just doesn't FEEL like me.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Anyway.I feel overwhelmed by all of this and sobered by the

prospect of addressing these problems in therapy.I'm going to do it and I was

told my prognosis is very good.It's hard getting started,hopefully once I do I

will feel better.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I feel like this was a very self indulgent post.I would not

wish these feelings on anyone but if any of you can relate to any of this,I'd

appreciate your thoughts.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

Thanks for sharing that with us.  It sounds like now you at least have an idea

about why you feel the way you do in life--that it isn't that there is some

problem with who you are.  You are just in an almost constant traumatic state. 

I imagine that might feel at least like maybe you can get a handle on it.  It

does not surprise me at all, given the extreme kinds of trauma you experienced

growing up, that that would be the way you might react.  How else could you

really survive all of that?

What you describe sounds a lot like how I felt in childhood and, to some extent,

how I felt until perhaps a year ago--the difference sounds mainly to me like in

the degree and in the constancy of that feeling.  It's interesting to me how

trauma, in some way, has the same kind of feeling to it even when the trauma is

different.

I know it gets better.  I think it gets a lot better.  I hope it gets better for

you soon, and that the process of getting there is not too painful.

Take care,

Ashana

Keep up with people you care about with Yahoo! India Mail. Learn how.

http://in.overview.mail.yahoo.com/connectmore

[Guest guest]

As I read this response about not accepting the promotion, it made me think of

holding a child back a year. Friends have a son that was born just a couple of

weeks before their school cut off date for entering kindergarten; the friends

made the decision to hold their son back for one year. It was a very wise

decision because this young man has gone on to excel in school and extra

activities. So maybe this is your holding period, that a promotion at a later

date (or not) would be more beneficial to you. Just an idea

May we all heal, blessings, mg

>

> Suzy,thank you so much for this very nice pep talk.Maybe one of the hardest

parts of any recovery is coming out of denial and dealing.Even though I wasn't

exactly shocked by this diagnosis,I had some denial via brain washing by

nada/foo like the rest of us here,that my childhood wasn't " so bad " and I hadn't

even realized the extent to which I had continued to carry that with me.The crux

of that being,for me,SELF denial at a profound psychological level,within my own

psyche.

>

> Thanks for putting a positive perspective on my not accepting the

promotion.I feel under some pressure to perform and it makes me feel very

inadequate when I know that I have these limits--but you're right,there is

always some wisdom in recognizing our own limits.

>

> But the more I consider the reality of where I am now symptoms wise and

what I did as a kid to cope,the more sense it makes to me.One of my problems has

been trying to force myself to live by the yardsticks of people who haven't had

my experiences which is another sort of denial.Dissociation can't be just willed

away.It has to be worked through.I don't intend to resign myself to being like

this for the rest of my life,but it's a relief in many ways to stop trying to be

like I am not and to turn my efforts towards fixing how I don't want to be.And

it's a lot more real!

>

> At a point a bit later,yes,I would like to have my therapist explain

what all of it means to my girlfriend.She could explain it better than I can.I'm

used to all of this but I want to wait until I am more firmly on the path to

handling this myself before we do that since I think she is going to need

reassurance,mostly from me,that it's not all as dire as it might sound.I will

encourage her to see the therapist herself on her own to talk,if she needs

to.She's not quite at the point of being able to accept that there is stuff she

could understand better--she thinks I've dealt with it pretty well.It's like a

secret that has been let out that I never meant purposefully to keep from her.I

think she needs to digest it all in smaller increments than I have needed

to.We'll just have to see how it all turns out.

>

> Thanks so much again for your kindness and support.

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

When you are ready you might want to consider doing some type of bodywork to

help with the disassociative disorder. (If you have not already pursued it) I

have had boughts of DID myself and what really connected my head to my body was

Rolfing. There are certified Rolfers all over the country and it is very

effective in connecting body and mind and emotions. Although it may not be

touted as that type of work, it does have a profound effect on connecting your

mind to your body. Rolfing combined with therapy helped me to really notice the

sensations in my body which led me to the emotions which I could then learn to

express. There are other methods of body work - simple massage, Feldenkries,

Myofacial Release, etc that you might find you prefer, but for me the Rolfing

was key. It also helped tremendously with several physical issues.

Hope you are well,

Jaye

> >

> > ,

> >

> > I've just had the chance to read your first post and subsequent posts in

this thread. I'm so sad for all you've been through and this diagnosis must be

difficult to digest. You have indeed survived so much, but the fact that you

recognize that as not being enough is a powerful step toward healing. I'm so

glad you have found a good therapist to help you through.

> >

> > In spite the disconnect between your emotions, presence, body -- the fact

that you are so aware of this and able to clearly articulate your experience is

also huge. In fact, you explain it so clearly that I hope you will journal the

process you go through - I think that may help you - and possibly others down

the road should you choose to " share. "

> >

> > I have no great words of wisdom to impart. I've had only brief experience

with dissociation (depersonalization and disrealization), but what you describe

is exactly what I felt. I'm still not sure what brought me " back, " but I think

it was reaching a place of feeling safe or relief from some of the duress.

Others have offered such great advice on finding ways to ground yourself that

the only thing I can only add the mix is the benefits I've found from

therapeutic massage. I also can attest to the benefits of the martial arts,

yoga, and meditation.

> >

> > I do want to commend you, though, not only for your strength and courage in

facing the road ahead, but what you have accomplished up to this point. Yes,

you're psyche may have been forced to use drastic means to shield itself from

things no child should have had cope with, but I think you're ready to start to

remove that shield, or will be very soon. What you reveal in your posts, but

may not realize is ALL the ways you have found to manage and function and be

productive, in spite of all you've dealt with. You seem to be a little

uncomfortable or embarrassed at having to be so regimented, but I think it's

terrifc that you've found what works and you DO IT and you keep moving forward.

Many, many would have not have been able to do that - and it says to me that you

have the strength to move forward and heal. And, you're smart enough to

recognize your limitations and are making wise choices (re: promotion).

> >

> > I know this is raising complications in your relationship, but maybe it will

be possible at some point when your are comfortable and if your partner is to

have her join in a few sessions with your therapist (or she could have a few

alone). T might be able to help her understand....... and I think you must be

pretty tired at this point of trying to explain yourself (to anyone). I think

you are a remarkable person and you deserve a loving supporting relationship.

You are worth it.

> >

> > Peace, hope, healing. And (((((hug))))).

> >

> > Suzy

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

When you are ready you might want to consider doing some type of bodywork to

help with the disassociative disorder. (If you have not already pursued it) I

have had boughts of DID myself and what really connected my head to my body was

Rolfing. There are certified Rolfers all over the country and it is very

effective in connecting body and mind and emotions. Although it may not be

touted as that type of work, it does have a profound effect on connecting your

mind to your body. Rolfing combined with therapy helped me to really notice the

sensations in my body which led me to the emotions which I could then learn to

express. There are other methods of body work - simple massage, Feldenkries,

Myofacial Release, etc that you might find you prefer, but for me the Rolfing

was key. It also helped tremendously with several physical issues.

Hope you are well,

Jaye

> >

> > ,

> >

> > I've just had the chance to read your first post and subsequent posts in

this thread. I'm so sad for all you've been through and this diagnosis must be

difficult to digest. You have indeed survived so much, but the fact that you

recognize that as not being enough is a powerful step toward healing. I'm so

glad you have found a good therapist to help you through.

> >

> > In spite the disconnect between your emotions, presence, body -- the fact

that you are so aware of this and able to clearly articulate your experience is

also huge. In fact, you explain it so clearly that I hope you will journal the

process you go through - I think that may help you - and possibly others down

the road should you choose to " share. "

> >

> > I have no great words of wisdom to impart. I've had only brief experience

with dissociation (depersonalization and disrealization), but what you describe

is exactly what I felt. I'm still not sure what brought me " back, " but I think

it was reaching a place of feeling safe or relief from some of the duress.

Others have offered such great advice on finding ways to ground yourself that

the only thing I can only add the mix is the benefits I've found from

therapeutic massage. I also can attest to the benefits of the martial arts,

yoga, and meditation.

> >

> > I do want to commend you, though, not only for your strength and courage in

facing the road ahead, but what you have accomplished up to this point. Yes,

you're psyche may have been forced to use drastic means to shield itself from

things no child should have had cope with, but I think you're ready to start to

remove that shield, or will be very soon. What you reveal in your posts, but

may not realize is ALL the ways you have found to manage and function and be

productive, in spite of all you've dealt with. You seem to be a little

uncomfortable or embarrassed at having to be so regimented, but I think it's

terrifc that you've found what works and you DO IT and you keep moving forward.

Many, many would have not have been able to do that - and it says to me that you

have the strength to move forward and heal. And, you're smart enough to

recognize your limitations and are making wise choices (re: promotion).

> >

> > I know this is raising complications in your relationship, but maybe it will

be possible at some point when your are comfortable and if your partner is to

have her join in a few sessions with your therapist (or she could have a few

alone). T might be able to help her understand....... and I think you must be

pretty tired at this point of trying to explain yourself (to anyone). I think

you are a remarkable person and you deserve a loving supporting relationship.

You are worth it.

> >

> > Peace, hope, healing. And (((((hug))))).

> >

> > Suzy

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Dear ,

I am so sad for the little girl who had to suffer through so much and the woman

who is now forced to deal with the consequences of that suffering. You have my

sympathy and heartfelt good wishes. I am also very encouraged and hopeful - I do

believe you will recover to a far greater extent than you can even imagine right

now. To defeat an enemy you must first see it and know its name, which is

exactly what you are doing right now - learning about the enemy that is keeping

you from the happier and more fulfilling life you can lead. Keep faith in

yourself and in the sheer power of the human body and mind. Kindly keep tending

to your body, mind and spirit. I believe, wholeheartedly, that recovery is

possible.

Best wishes,

Arianna

>

> I've posted fairly recently about some intense issues I'm dealing with (or

trying to) in regards to being " raised " by a BPD/probably co-morbid psychopathic

nada and that I had decided to attempt therapy after a delay of some 16 years if

I could find a therapist I thought I could work with.

>

> I did find someone and based on symptoms I was reporting (I'm at the point

where I just want to know what is up with me as a consequence of my

childhood,even though I was entertaining scary thoughts of being told that I

also have BPD even though I have no rages or black/white thinking and I don't

routinely project my feelings onto others,still I guess there's always this fear

of being " blamed " by being told I'm the same as nada somehow)--anyway,the

therapist I chose decided to conduct a long interview session ( an inventory

that was developed to test for this) to see how I scored on the scale of

dissociative disorders.

>

> The result is that I score for " severe depersonalization disorder " and am

in the high range for a score of " dissociative identity disorder " formerly known

as " multiple personality disorder " .Most people who score in the range I did

actually have DID but my diagnosis is for " Dissociative Disorder Not Otherwise

Specified " because I don't have full blown alters ie split off personalities who

assume executive control of my functioning at times.

>

> I also have Complex PTSD,which often co-occurs with a dissociative

disorder.

>

> I apologize if this post is a bit rambling or not very concise.I last

saw my therapist earlier in the week when we discussed what this diagnosis is

going to mean and what we're going to do and I've been crying off and on ever

since...understanding that the damage is real and the abuse is real; nada did

this to me.

>

> I've been doing some reading on the subject and have learned that

unlike BPD,a dissociative disorder has NO genetic basis.You can only " get " DID

or DDNOS from repeated,prolonged trauma in childhood.Nobody is genetically

predisposed to dissociate due to perceived stress (like in BPD)--our brains are

wired to dissociate only when we encounter actual life threatening

incidents,such as actual disasters like car accidents or when we are subjected

to trauma that threatens our sense of psychological integrity,such as sexual

assault.Normally,such a traumatic incident is a one-off event and we recover

from the dissociation and return to our regular functioning although we may

continue to have symptoms of PTSD if we are unable to process the trauma,like

flashbacks or nightmares.

>

> Dissociation (going outside of yourself/leaving your body/feeling

unreal/feeling numb/losing time) is a normal adaptive response to a traumatic

event,but when the trauma is repetitive and ongoing and happens when no flight

or fight response is possible and happens when you're a child whose brain is

still developing,it becomes a reflexive response to anything that triggers

memories or associations with the repeated traumas.A one-off dissociation

doesn't become an automatic reflex,but when the developing brain is subjected to

repeated trauma from which there is no escape,dissociating becomes habitual and

assumes part of the brain's functioning.What was intended by nature to be an

adaptive response becomes maladaptive because the individual no longer has

conscious control over it-- but this can only occur when the trauma is

repetitive enough and overwhelming enough that the response of dissociation must

be employed over and over again resulting in dissociation becoming a reflex.

>

> In other words,99% of people who have DID were repetitively abused as

children.They were NOT born that way! The other 1% have rare,severe brain

injuries from an accident.And they weren't born that way,either.

>

> Someone who presents with this kind of severe dissociation is someone

who has been badly,repeatedly abused.There is no genetic cause for it,aside from

perhaps having parents who are genetically Cluster B or psychotic.

>

> Personally,I don't lose huge chunks of time or find myself in some

place I don't remember going to,although at some points in my childhood I did.My

dissociation is a kind of constant low grade where I feel like I can't quite

catch up with time or can't be quite present in the moment.I often feel spacey

or like I'm floating.I often feel at a remove from myself or from events that

are happening around me,like I am not in sync with what is going on or with how

I think or feel.Life often seems dreamlike to me,like an echo of how I felt

every time I was traumatized as a child that never goes away: life never comes

into full relief for me like it's real and happening now; it seems more like a

supposition of existence,something that may or may not be really happening.I

have the sense of drifting and of being more of an observer of my own life than

a participant.Time has little meaning for me and I have to force myself to

adhere to a clock schedule,such as being on time for something like work.I feel

like I'm in a trance and have to always do the same thing every morning like

shower at seven,be dressed when the clock says eight,leave the house when the

clock says eight fifteen or else I drift and will not be on time.It's especially

bad in the morning when I get up.

>

> I generally just don't feel embodied.I feel more like a ghost.I have

this odd sense that life is passing me by and I can't catch up.I don't feel like

I am enough to BE in my own life,like I am not really there in it.It's like I am

not quite alive.

>

> I lose little bits of time here and there when I am triggered by

something and go completely blank.It's like I'm just not there anymore.This is

misinterpreted by others as indifference rather than a moment of complete

dissociation.It usually happens in some affective context and has caused me alot

of grief in close relationships,yet when I have openly said that I was

dissociating I've rarely been understood.I misplace items alot and have to keep

important documents in the same drawer of my filing cabinet or I will never find

them.Many times I've reached for my toothbrush in the morning only to find it's

gone and it's in some weird place like the medicine cabinet or the window sill

and I have no memory of putting it there or I go to get milk for my cereal at

breakfast and it's not in the fridge but on the counter where it's been since

the morning before and I hadn't even noticed...this happens so often and it

scares me and frustrates me.It's like I am senile.I have to keep my keys in the

front door lock or I will lose them.

>

> At work I have to constantly remind myself of what I need to do and

if I get distracted by some unforeseen task I nearly panic quietly and

internally trying to remember where I was before I got interrupted.It's

embarassing to have to keep constant notes to remind me of what I need to do

even though it's basic stuff so I hide them in a drawer or keep them in my

pocket.I know that I'm not a stupid person but it makes me feel stupid to have

to remind myself of these basic things.I have to constantly force myself to

focus on tasks because I am always floating and nothing seems quite real.

>

> The worst part is feeling like I have to struggle to grasp my own

emotions,like I can't quite experience them.I am dissociated from my

emotions--they are not in tune with my thoughts.I can think " I have a reason to

be sad " without being able to actually feel sad.

>

> I don't feel present,most of the time,in my own body.My own thought

process seems more like an observer observing than of me thinking about me.It's

like there's this second hand person that I can't integrate into myself.I know

that it's still me,it just doesn't FEEL like me.

>

> Anyway.I feel overwhelmed by all of this and sobered by the prospect of

addressing these problems in therapy.I'm going to do it and I was told my

prognosis is very good.It's hard getting started,hopefully once I do I will feel

better.

>

> I feel like this was a very self indulgent post.I would not wish

these feelings on anyone but if any of you can relate to any of this,I'd

appreciate your thoughts.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks,Ashana.That's how I feel: that way too often I'm having a trauma

reaction.It's my awareness of how inappropriate it is most of the time to

present day situations as well as where it comes from that is especially

painful.I had wanted to believe that achieving some measure of success career

wise/relationship wise would be the " cure " that would allow me to leave the past

behind,sort of like walking away from a plane crash...but in my case that isn't

going to be enough.

I'm going to have to work my way to a healing that genuinely comes from

me.My experience of derealization (seeing the world like it's more of a movie

than real time real life,for example) was actually much worse before I began to

confront all these memories.Now it's more like knowing I had the flu but not

being able to conjure up exactly how it felt to have it.I used to worry that the

derealization was pretty much intractable but it wasn't.That gives me hope that

I will be able to do something to ease the feelings of depersonalization as

well.

And yes,it is interesting how trauma effects the human brain in so many

similar ways.I find the whole thing fascinating,especially how states of

consciousness can co-exist with awareness/unawareness.

If you don't mind me asking,have you noticed a difference within

yourself from therapy and/or because you've spent some time coming to grips with

your own internal emotional landscape?

Thanks again for your feedback and support.I agree with you: I think it

does get alot better,if you work on it.Takes time though!

>

> ,

>

> Thanks for sharing that with us.  It sounds like now you at least have an idea

about why you feel the way you do in life--that it isn't that there is some

problem with who you are.  You are just in an almost constant traumatic state. 

I imagine that might feel at least like maybe you can get a handle on it.  It

does not surprise me at all, given the extreme kinds of trauma you experienced

growing up, that that would be the way you might react.  How else could you

really survive all of that?

>

> What you describe sounds a lot like how I felt in childhood and, to some

extent, how I felt until perhaps a year ago--the difference sounds mainly to me

like in the degree and in the constancy of that feeling.  It's interesting to me

how trauma, in some way, has the same kind of feeling to it even when the trauma

is different.

>

> I know it gets better.  I think it gets a lot better.  I hope it gets better

for you soon, and that the process of getting there is not too painful.

>

> Take care,

> Ashana

>

>

> Keep up with people you care about with Yahoo! India Mail. Learn how.

http://in.overview.mail.yahoo.com/connectmore

>

>

[Guest guest]

That's a good way to put it,mg.Sometimes we all just need a " holding period " !

Sometimes trying to force yourself to do something you're not quite ready for

amounts to over taxing your own strengths and actually causes much more energy

drain/frustration than it's worth.But when we are ready,we can excel on our own

steam.

Take care,

> >

> > Suzy,thank you so much for this very nice pep talk.Maybe one of the hardest

parts of any recovery is coming out of denial and dealing.Even though I wasn't

exactly shocked by this diagnosis,I had some denial via brain washing by

nada/foo like the rest of us here,that my childhood wasn't " so bad " and I hadn't

even realized the extent to which I had continued to carry that with me.The crux

of that being,for me,SELF denial at a profound psychological level,within my own

psyche.

> >

> > Thanks for putting a positive perspective on my not accepting the

promotion.I feel under some pressure to perform and it makes me feel very

inadequate when I know that I have these limits--but you're right,there is

always some wisdom in recognizing our own limits.

> >

> > But the more I consider the reality of where I am now symptoms wise

and what I did as a kid to cope,the more sense it makes to me.One of my problems

has been trying to force myself to live by the yardsticks of people who haven't

had my experiences which is another sort of denial.Dissociation can't be just

willed away.It has to be worked through.I don't intend to resign myself to being

like this for the rest of my life,but it's a relief in many ways to stop trying

to be like I am not and to turn my efforts towards fixing how I don't want to

be.And it's a lot more real!

> >

> > At a point a bit later,yes,I would like to have my therapist explain

what all of it means to my girlfriend.She could explain it better than I can.I'm

used to all of this but I want to wait until I am more firmly on the path to

handling this myself before we do that since I think she is going to need

reassurance,mostly from me,that it's not all as dire as it might sound.I will

encourage her to see the therapist herself on her own to talk,if she needs

to.She's not quite at the point of being able to accept that there is stuff she

could understand better--she thinks I've dealt with it pretty well.It's like a

secret that has been let out that I never meant purposefully to keep from her.I

think she needs to digest it all in smaller increments than I have needed

to.We'll just have to see how it all turns out.

> >

> > Thanks so much again for your kindness and support.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you for the ideas,Jaye.I'm going to do some kind of body work at a

later date--and the day I am able to do that is going to be my own little moment

of triumph.Right now I have major issues with being touched by a stranger

because of the sex abuse.I either have brief disturbing flashbacks or am just

assailed by this nasty,generalized nightmare feeling that I can't shake off for

hours.But I agree with you that bodywork could be very beneficial later on.I'll

keep Rolfing in mind--that also helps to free up muscle tension,doesn't it? I'm

sure that feeling less tense physically would do alot for feeling less tense

emotionally--that freeing up the one would free up the other.Sounds good...

Thank you for sharing what helped you,I appreciate it lots.

> > >

> > > ,

> > >

> > > I've just had the chance to read your first post and subsequent posts in

this thread. I'm so sad for all you've been through and this diagnosis must be

difficult to digest. You have indeed survived so much, but the fact that you

recognize that as not being enough is a powerful step toward healing. I'm so

glad you have found a good therapist to help you through.

> > >

> > > In spite the disconnect between your emotions, presence, body -- the fact

that you are so aware of this and able to clearly articulate your experience is

also huge. In fact, you explain it so clearly that I hope you will journal the

process you go through - I think that may help you - and possibly others down

the road should you choose to " share. "

> > >

> > > I have no great words of wisdom to impart. I've had only brief experience

with dissociation (depersonalization and disrealization), but what you describe

is exactly what I felt. I'm still not sure what brought me " back, " but I think

it was reaching a place of feeling safe or relief from some of the duress.

Others have offered such great advice on finding ways to ground yourself that

the only thing I can only add the mix is the benefits I've found from

therapeutic massage. I also can attest to the benefits of the martial arts,

yoga, and meditation.

> > >

> > > I do want to commend you, though, not only for your strength and courage

in facing the road ahead, but what you have accomplished up to this point. Yes,

you're psyche may have been forced to use drastic means to shield itself from

things no child should have had cope with, but I think you're ready to start to

remove that shield, or will be very soon. What you reveal in your posts, but

may not realize is ALL the ways you have found to manage and function and be

productive, in spite of all you've dealt with. You seem to be a little

uncomfortable or embarrassed at having to be so regimented, but I think it's

terrifc that you've found what works and you DO IT and you keep moving forward.

Many, many would have not have been able to do that - and it says to me that you

have the strength to move forward and heal. And, you're smart enough to

recognize your limitations and are making wise choices (re: promotion).

> > >

> > > I know this is raising complications in your relationship, but maybe it

will be possible at some point when your are comfortable and if your partner is

to have her join in a few sessions with your therapist (or she could have a few

alone). T might be able to help her understand....... and I think you must be

pretty tired at this point of trying to explain yourself (to anyone). I think

you are a remarkable person and you deserve a loving supporting relationship.

You are worth it.

> > >

> > > Peace, hope, healing. And (((((hug))))).

> > >

> > > Suzy

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Arianna,thank you so much for your good wishes and hopefulness.I have thought so

many times since I was a small child that my life " was over " --looking back now

at how young I was each time I thought this,I see how unnecessary and sad that

was.A much,much more helpful thought is: my life is only beginning...I feel like

I am awakening from a zombie's trance.

I do feel like I can't even imagine yet what liberation is going to be

for me,but it can happen.

Thank you for the encouragement!

> >

> > I've posted fairly recently about some intense issues I'm dealing with (or

trying to) in regards to being " raised " by a BPD/probably co-morbid psychopathic

nada and that I had decided to attempt therapy after a delay of some 16 years if

I could find a therapist I thought I could work with.

> >

> > I did find someone and based on symptoms I was reporting (I'm at the

point where I just want to know what is up with me as a consequence of my

childhood,even though I was entertaining scary thoughts of being told that I

also have BPD even though I have no rages or black/white thinking and I don't

routinely project my feelings onto others,still I guess there's always this fear

of being " blamed " by being told I'm the same as nada somehow)--anyway,the

therapist I chose decided to conduct a long interview session ( an inventory

that was developed to test for this) to see how I scored on the scale of

dissociative disorders.

> >

> > The result is that I score for " severe depersonalization disorder " and

am in the high range for a score of " dissociative identity disorder " formerly

known as " multiple personality disorder " .Most people who score in the range I

did actually have DID but my diagnosis is for " Dissociative Disorder Not

Otherwise Specified " because I don't have full blown alters ie split off

personalities who assume executive control of my functioning at times.

> >

> > I also have Complex PTSD,which often co-occurs with a dissociative

disorder.

> >

> > I apologize if this post is a bit rambling or not very concise.I

last saw my therapist earlier in the week when we discussed what this diagnosis

is going to mean and what we're going to do and I've been crying off and on ever

since...understanding that the damage is real and the abuse is real; nada did

this to me.

> >

> > I've been doing some reading on the subject and have learned that

unlike BPD,a dissociative disorder has NO genetic basis.You can only " get " DID

or DDNOS from repeated,prolonged trauma in childhood.Nobody is genetically

predisposed to dissociate due to perceived stress (like in BPD)--our brains are

wired to dissociate only when we encounter actual life threatening

incidents,such as actual disasters like car accidents or when we are subjected

to trauma that threatens our sense of psychological integrity,such as sexual

assault.Normally,such a traumatic incident is a one-off event and we recover

from the dissociation and return to our regular functioning although we may

continue to have symptoms of PTSD if we are unable to process the trauma,like

flashbacks or nightmares.

> >

> > Dissociation (going outside of yourself/leaving your body/feeling

unreal/feeling numb/losing time) is a normal adaptive response to a traumatic

event,but when the trauma is repetitive and ongoing and happens when no flight

or fight response is possible and happens when you're a child whose brain is

still developing,it becomes a reflexive response to anything that triggers

memories or associations with the repeated traumas.A one-off dissociation

doesn't become an automatic reflex,but when the developing brain is subjected to

repeated trauma from which there is no escape,dissociating becomes habitual and

assumes part of the brain's functioning.What was intended by nature to be an

adaptive response becomes maladaptive because the individual no longer has

conscious control over it-- but this can only occur when the trauma is

repetitive enough and overwhelming enough that the response of dissociation must

be employed over and over again resulting in dissociation becoming a reflex.

> >

> > In other words,99% of people who have DID were repetitively abused as

children.They were NOT born that way! The other 1% have rare,severe brain

injuries from an accident.And they weren't born that way,either.

> >

> > Someone who presents with this kind of severe dissociation is someone

who has been badly,repeatedly abused.There is no genetic cause for it,aside from

perhaps having parents who are genetically Cluster B or psychotic.

> >

> > Personally,I don't lose huge chunks of time or find myself in some

place I don't remember going to,although at some points in my childhood I did.My

dissociation is a kind of constant low grade where I feel like I can't quite

catch up with time or can't be quite present in the moment.I often feel spacey

or like I'm floating.I often feel at a remove from myself or from events that

are happening around me,like I am not in sync with what is going on or with how

I think or feel.Life often seems dreamlike to me,like an echo of how I felt

every time I was traumatized as a child that never goes away: life never comes

into full relief for me like it's real and happening now; it seems more like a

supposition of existence,something that may or may not be really happening.I

have the sense of drifting and of being more of an observer of my own life than

a participant.Time has little meaning for me and I have to force myself to

adhere to a clock schedule,such as being on time for something like work.I feel

like I'm in a trance and have to always do the same thing every morning like

shower at seven,be dressed when the clock says eight,leave the house when the

clock says eight fifteen or else I drift and will not be on time.It's especially

bad in the morning when I get up.

> >

> > I generally just don't feel embodied.I feel more like a ghost.I have

this odd sense that life is passing me by and I can't catch up.I don't feel like

I am enough to BE in my own life,like I am not really there in it.It's like I am

not quite alive.

> >

> > I lose little bits of time here and there when I am triggered by

something and go completely blank.It's like I'm just not there anymore.This is

misinterpreted by others as indifference rather than a moment of complete

dissociation.It usually happens in some affective context and has caused me alot

of grief in close relationships,yet when I have openly said that I was

dissociating I've rarely been understood.I misplace items alot and have to keep

important documents in the same drawer of my filing cabinet or I will never find

them.Many times I've reached for my toothbrush in the morning only to find it's

gone and it's in some weird place like the medicine cabinet or the window sill

and I have no memory of putting it there or I go to get milk for my cereal at

breakfast and it's not in the fridge but on the counter where it's been since

the morning before and I hadn't even noticed...this happens so often and it

scares me and frustrates me.It's like I am senile.I have to keep my keys in the

front door lock or I will lose them.

> >

> > At work I have to constantly remind myself of what I need to do and

if I get distracted by some unforeseen task I nearly panic quietly and

internally trying to remember where I was before I got interrupted.It's

embarassing to have to keep constant notes to remind me of what I need to do

even though it's basic stuff so I hide them in a drawer or keep them in my

pocket.I know that I'm not a stupid person but it makes me feel stupid to have

to remind myself of these basic things.I have to constantly force myself to

focus on tasks because I am always floating and nothing seems quite real.

> >

> > The worst part is feeling like I have to struggle to grasp my own

emotions,like I can't quite experience them.I am dissociated from my

emotions--they are not in tune with my thoughts.I can think " I have a reason to

be sad " without being able to actually feel sad.

> >

> > I don't feel present,most of the time,in my own body.My own thought

process seems more like an observer observing than of me thinking about me.It's

like there's this second hand person that I can't integrate into myself.I know

that it's still me,it just doesn't FEEL like me.

> >

> > Anyway.I feel overwhelmed by all of this and sobered by the prospect

of addressing these problems in therapy.I'm going to do it and I was told my

prognosis is very good.It's hard getting started,hopefully once I do I will feel

better.

> >

> > I feel like this was a very self indulgent post.I would not wish

these feelings on anyone but if any of you can relate to any of this,I'd

appreciate your thoughts.

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

I have absolute faith and belief in you - I believe you WILL heal from this -

you've made great strides already (even though I'm sure it doesn's always feel

that way). It's such a relief to let yourself just be YOU and not what others

expect you to be. It seems so simple, such a given, but can be really hard to

learn to do.

Our experiences differ dramatically, but I did find as I learned about PDs and

went through therapy that I learned a whole lot of things about myself and why I

am who I am (and do what I do). Some I feel pretty good about and opted to

" keep " , others I recognized as things I wanted to change and continue to work at

it. On the whole, I'm doing pretty okay with that, though it will likely always

be a work in progress. So, when you start peeling away your defenses and coping

tools, and start seeing the YOU underneath, I have a feeling you're gonna feel

pretty good about that person. Seems to me there's a really nice person there!

As for your partner, you'll know when the time is right to bring her " in " more.

I think that understanding what you have been through is one thing (well, to the

extent that anyone can), but understanding how hard it is to disentangle from

what you've had to do to survive it is quite another. My husband was shocked

when I started having panic attacks - triggered by an event not related to nada,

but apparently bringing long-surpressed stuff to the surface. Only then did he

truly begin to appreciate the impact that nada's craziness had on me. (That,

and watching the Betty Broderick movie.)

Again, I wish you the best. Be patient with yourself - it takes time.

Suzy

[Guest guest]

oh, so do I !! , you are such a strong person !! You'll do just

fine !!

Jackie

,

I have absolute faith and belief in you - I believe you WILL heal from

this - you've made great strides already (even though I'm sure it doesn's

always feel that way). It's such a relief to let yourself just be YOU and

not what others expect you to be. It seems so simple, such a given, but can

be really hard to learn to do.

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I have noticed a difference from both therapy and from the work I've done myself

outside of that.  This is especially true of the last 9 months or so, when I got

serious about the nada stuff and when I started seeing a new therapist.  What I

noticed most was that my memory improved, it was easier to start tasks and

complete them--I started to have a lot less of those moments where you go into a

room and can't remember when you went there.  I am not necessarily happier, but

I have a greater sense of clarity more often.  I also started to have less of a

sense of there being a veil between me and the rest of the world.

I often have that sense you describe--of knowing you had the flu but not knowing

how it felt to have it.  I don't have that feeling about anything that occurs in

the present, but I do have it about the past.  I usually have that feeling about

an event before I'm really ready to engage with it at an emotional level--and

here, I don't mean afraid of doing it, but really not prepared.  Like, there is

too much on my plate just then, or I have other traumatic experiences to deal

with, or I'm tired or sick, or I need to talk to my sister that day.  It goes

away when I'm ready to deal with it, and then what I get instead is the

emotions--which are often very intense and very difficult to deal with.  What

I'm wondering is if right now nearly everything reminds you of something

traumatic, and if what is behind that sense of being removed from your feelings

is really how overwhelming the original trauma was and still is and, as more

trauma gets deal with,

fewer things will trigger that kind of reaction.

Take good care,

Ashana

Yahoo! India has a new look. Take a sneak peek http://in.yahoo.com/trynew

[Guest guest]

Jackie,I wanted to thank you for being so sweet and nice.You are yourself a very

strong person; I can see from your posts that you have overcome so much,you are

amazing and you have so much personal integrity.Really,really,sincerely.

>

> oh, so do I !! , you are such a strong person !! You'll do just

> fine !!

>

> Jackie

>

>

>

> ,

>

> I have absolute faith and belief in you - I believe you WILL heal from

> this - you've made great strides already (even though I'm sure it doesn's

> always feel that way). It's such a relief to let yourself just be YOU and

> not what others expect you to be. It seems so simple, such a given, but can

> be really hard to learn to do.

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks again,Ashana.I'm at the point myself of " getting serious about the nada

stuff " .It's good to hear from someone who has noticed a difference.For

me,perhaps for you?,achieving a greater sense of clarity is much more grounding

than some kind of elusive general " happiness " .It's more real and I think will

prove to be more enduring--after all,we can't be happy all the time but we CAN

be authentic.And it's own our authenticity that aligns us with our own

beingness,right?

I think I've found a safe place,with a competent therapist,where I can

process my trauma and just having that will help me to handle it more and more

on my own.That is my goal: to learn how to rely on myself and to trust in my own

perceptions/worth/competence/abilities.I do NOT want to be the puppet of my

triggers and to keep reliving my pain ad nauseam.

Thanks again for your feedback.

>

> Hi ,

>

> I have noticed a difference from both therapy and from the work I've done

myself outside of that.  This is especially true of the last 9 months or so,

when I got serious about the nada stuff and when I started seeing a new

therapist.  What I noticed most was that my memory improved, it was easier to

start tasks and complete them--I started to have a lot less of those moments

where you go into a room and can't remember when you went there.  I am not

necessarily happier, but I have a greater sense of clarity more often.  I also

started to have less of a sense of there being a veil between me and the rest of

the world.

>

> I often have that sense you describe--of knowing you had the flu but not

knowing how it felt to have it.  I don't have that feeling about anything that

occurs in the present, but I do have it about the past.  I usually have that

feeling about an event before I'm really ready to engage with it at an emotional

level--and here, I don't mean afraid of doing it, but really not prepared. 

Like, there is too much on my plate just then, or I have other traumatic

experiences to deal with, or I'm tired or sick, or I need to talk to my sister

that day.  It goes away when I'm ready to deal with it, and then what I get

instead is the emotions--which are often very intense and very difficult to deal

with.  What I'm wondering is if right now nearly everything reminds you of

something traumatic, and if what is behind that sense of being removed from your

feelings is really how overwhelming the original trauma was and still is and, as

more trauma gets deal with,

> fewer things will trigger that kind of reaction.

>

> Take good care,

> Ashana

>

>

> Yahoo! India has a new look. Take a sneak peek

http://in.yahoo.com/trynew

>

>

[Guest guest]

thank you, are are very sweet, but I am in awe of you....you have over come

SO much, and are such a good person despite your childhood, a true role

model !!

Jackie

Jackie,I wanted to thank you for being so sweet and nice.You are yourself a

very strong person; I can see from your posts that you have overcome so

much,you are amazing and you have so much personal

integrity.Really,really,sincerely.