Re: new psych trick?

[Guest guest]

,

Yes, oh yes. In fact, this little tactic is at the absolute crux of what made

me see nada's true colors. Some of it is projection, but in other ways, it's a

way of tearing you down so she can feel better about herself. Nadas can't rise

above the feelings of inferiority and need that they feel at their core, so if

they can bring you down to their level, then they can feel better about their

own inadequacy by " comforting " you. (It's just so twisted version of the

philosophy at the core of the book " Atlas Shrugged " by Ayn Rand - read it

sometime). It's so twisted, that in many ways, I believe nada's actually DO

believe they are " helping " you and just don't get why it feels so WRONG!

As for the crux in my situation - it had to do with a medical crisis (I've

posted about) in my late twenties. I was recently divorced, but managing well

enough on my own (states away from family) when I was diagnosed with malignant

melanoma. The prognosis was unclear. I was scared, but holding it together

enough to demand and get a second opinion with a specialist in NYC, travel to my

first consult, arrange surgery and treatment at his hospital, etc., all before

nada flew in (on my dime) to " save the day. " I won't relay all the ways she

showed her ----ss, and there were plenty, but it became clear that at the same

time I was supposed to recovery from major surgery and the still unclear

prognosis, I was supposed to make her feel better about fearing " HER child could

DIE! " And yet, and YET, she was upset because I didn't fall apart and act " like

I NEEDED her. " She just couldn't get why I couldn't be weak and needy for mommy

- she really was waiting for me to fall apart, so she could be the " savior. " It

was just so sick and twisted that it messed with my head plenty - and it changed

how I felt about her irrevocably.

Of course, she went home and told everyone how horribly I had treated her, all

the while relaying how much she enjoyed getting the chance to walk in Central

Park (as I lay throwing up my hospital room).

Sorry, , that's a long answer to your question, but as might be obvious - a

real sore point you touched on with me!

Suzy

[Guest guest]

,

Nadas like anything that will give them a hold over us. If you

feel weak or scared, that's something they can take advantage

of. It gives them a way to feel superior to you and a way for

them to make you feel dependent on them so it doesn't surprise

me that your nada would try to make you feel that way.

Undermining our selfhood is what a lot of nada behavior is all

about.

At 07:49 AM 09/22/2009 climberkayak wrote:

>Do any of your nadas try to encourage you to be weak or

>fearful? It would be like if you were afraid of spiders but

>had been working to overcome it. You talk to her and she says

>while being " supportive " , oh there's a spider over there, oh

>think about about how they skitter with their eight legs and

>look at you with all those eyes, and oh one could be about to

>land on your head any minute diving down from the ceiling on a

>strand of webbing! I think back to the times growing up and

>the present that if I'm having difficulty coping with something

>my nada tends to encourage me in that difficulty and if I start

>to pull out of it rather than encourage my success she says

>things to undermine that.

>

>One real life example I had a job that I ended up forced to

>resign, not fired, but pushed out by political pressures in the

>office. She has always said I was fired even though I correct

>her and right after it happened she tried to play into the

>sense of failure I feltin the guise of being sympathetic - that

>I was fired, just like her from some job she had. I was

>struggling with how to frame it myself at the time and had to

>keep reminding myself that I wasn't fired, that I could have

>stayed and fought it but chose not to, that she was wrong. But

>yet...years later she still if it comes up refers to it in that

>way.

>

>Projection doesn't seem like the right word for this...what is

>it?

>

>

--

Katrina

[Guest guest]

- UNDERMINING. My mom has tried to undermine my relationship with my

husband, undermine my self-esteem, undermine my financial stability - by

picking, picking, picking away.

She told me she was " afraid " my marriage would collapse (at a time when it was

very strong and healthy).

When I made the Dean's List and was to accept an award at Honors Day, she

reminded me that I was fat and unattractive.

When we were ready to buy a house, she insisted on inserting herself into the

househunting process and arguing with every choice we made.

Whenever I got a little bit of savings, she would call for a big handout - but

would never curtail her own spending on TV shopping.

It was always something " small " - it was always justifiable - it was always

explainable. It was always detrimental to me in some way.

I'm done.

>

> Do any of your nadas try to encourage you to be weak or fearful? It would be

like if you were afraid of spiders but had been working to overcome it. You

talk to her and she says while being " supportive " , oh there's a spider over

there, oh think about about how they skitter with their eight legs and look at

you with all those eyes, and oh one could be about to land on your head any

minute diving down from the ceiling on a strand of webbing! I think back to the

times growing up and the present that if I'm having difficulty coping with

something my nada tends to encourage me in that difficulty and if I start to

pull out of it rather than encourage my success she says things to undermine

that.

>

> One real life example I had a job that I ended up forced to resign, not fired,

but pushed out by political pressures in the office. She has always said I was

fired even though I correct her and right after it happened she tried to play

into the sense of failure I feltin the guise of being sympathetic - that I was

fired, just like her from some job she had. I was struggling with how to frame

it myself at the time and had to keep reminding myself that I wasn't fired, that

I could have stayed and fought it but chose not to, that she was wrong. But

yet...years later she still if it comes up refers to it in that way.

>

> Projection doesn't seem like the right word for this...what is it?

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

Hi , I think that this is similar to how my nada has always insisted that I

am at least three years older than I am, before that birthday--maybe because

*she* fears being 'old'. This started in my late teens, and continues to this

day. Even in my head, as soon as I turned 28 I started calling myself 30, 38 I

started calling myself 40, etc. It's unnerving. -Charlie

> Do any of your nadas try to encourage you to be weak or fearful? It would be

like if you were afraid of spiders but had been working to overcome it. You

talk to her and she says while being " supportive " , oh there's a spider over

there, oh think about about how they skitter with their eight legs and look at

you with all those eyes, and oh one could be about to land on your head any

minute diving down from the ceiling on a strand of webbing! I think back to the

times growing up and the present that if I'm having difficulty coping with

something my nada tends to encourage me in that difficulty and if I start to

pull out of it rather than encourage my success she says things to undermine

that.

>

> One real life example I had a job that I ended up forced to resign, not fired,

but pushed out by political pressures in the office. She has always said I was

fired even though I correct her and right after it happened she tried to play

into the sense of failure I feltin the guise of being sympathetic - that I was

fired, just like her from some job she had. I was struggling with how to frame

it myself at the time and had to keep reminding myself that I wasn't fired, that

I could have stayed and fought it but chose not to, that she was wrong. But

yet...years later she still if it comes up refers to it in that way.

>

> Projection doesn't seem like the right word for this...what is it?

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I could go on and on here:

•When I was a kid, my nada always took me into the cellar during thunderstorms,

while my fada would stay upstairs with my sister to watch the lightning in front

of the picture window.

•My nada always told me I was shy and that I was a " behind-the-scenes " kind of

person.

•Recently, my nada, when introduced to my friend H. (a very successful business

woman), later took me aside & said, " What a go-getter H. is! She's amazing!

She's NOTHING like you. "

•My nada/fada would dictate what me & my husband should do with our house: " Fix

this, not that! " " Do this, not that! " Whenever WE took initiative, it was always

WRONG. " How much did you pay for that? " " You're over-improving the place. " " That

paint color is ugly. " etc, etc.

They wanted us to stay dependent and weak. Any show of strength was a threat.

>

> Do any of your nadas try to encourage you to be weak or fearful? It would be

like if you were afraid of spiders but had been working to overcome it. You

talk to her and she says while being " supportive " , oh there's a spider over

there, oh think about about how they skitter with their eight legs and look at

you with all those eyes, and oh one could be about to land on your head any

minute diving down from the ceiling on a strand of webbing! I think back to the

times growing up and the present that if I'm having difficulty coping with

something my nada tends to encourage me in that difficulty and if I start to

pull out of it rather than encourage my success she says things to undermine

that.

>

> One real life example I had a job that I ended up forced to resign, not fired,

but pushed out by political pressures in the office. She has always said I was

fired even though I correct her and right after it happened she tried to play

into the sense of failure I feltin the guise of being sympathetic - that I was

fired, just like her from some job she had. I was struggling with how to frame

it myself at the time and had to keep reminding myself that I wasn't fired, that

I could have stayed and fought it but chose not to, that she was wrong. But

yet...years later she still if it comes up refers to it in that way.

>

> Projection doesn't seem like the right word for this...what is it?

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Me too; I could go on and on with examples of how my nada would (and still will)

take opportunities to denigrate and criticize me in order to keep me (and Sister

too) feeling inferior, inept, weak, dependent on her and focused on pleasing

her.

Each small insult and criticism and manipulation taken individually seems

minuscule, excusable, deniable, and meaningless, but its the relentless

accumulation of these put-downs and controlling behaviors that does the damage,

like a slow drip of acid will corrode and eat through metal, eventually.

I could also give many examples of that nada behavior of repeatedly bringing up

subjects that I find painfully embarrassing or shameful.

To me, it reeks of cruelty and sadism. Its as though I had a open bleeding

wound in my arm, and nada keeps poking at it with her finger, asking " Does it

still hurt? " (poke) " Does it *still* hurt? "

Its like being raised by the worst schoolyard bully ever.

-Annie

> >

> > Do any of your nadas try to encourage you to be weak or fearful? It would

be like if you were afraid of spiders but had been working to overcome it. You

talk to her and she says while being " supportive " , oh there's a spider over

there, oh think about about how they skitter with their eight legs and look at

you with all those eyes, and oh one could be about to land on your head any

minute diving down from the ceiling on a strand of webbing! I think back to the

times growing up and the present that if I'm having difficulty coping with

something my nada tends to encourage me in that difficulty and if I start to

pull out of it rather than encourage my success she says things to undermine

that.

> >

> > One real life example I had a job that I ended up forced to resign, not

fired, but pushed out by political pressures in the office. She has always said

I was fired even though I correct her and right after it happened she tried to

play into the sense of failure I feltin the guise of being sympathetic - that I

was fired, just like her from some job she had. I was struggling with how to

frame it myself at the time and had to keep reminding myself that I wasn't

fired, that I could have stayed and fought it but chose not to, that she was

wrong. But yet...years later she still if it comes up refers to it in that way.

> >

> > Projection doesn't seem like the right word for this...what is it?

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

" When I made the Dean's List and was to accept an award at Honors Day, she

reminded me that I was fat and unattractive. " that is horrible. How

hurtful.

Nada tries to undermine my relationship with my husband too. She's always

telling me you never *really* know someone and constantly asks him if he's " in

it for the long haul " . When we asked her to stop asking him that she cried and

tried to turn it around, asking why we can't understand she's just looking out

for me. yeah right. Just because her marriage was a failure. Well no surprise

there- she was 25 and he was SIXTEEN when they started dating. How gross is

that? I am completely embarrassed about that. In fact, my husband is 3 years

younger then me and I almost wouldn't date him at all because he is younger. I

had such a hang up about it because I was so grossed out at nada's behavior. But

being 22 and 25 vs. 25 and 16- not the same. At least my dad was 22 when I was

born but that's still young to have a baby, I think.

Whenever something good happens nada finds a way to point out exactly why it's

not so good and all the bad that could possibly happen. It's like she can't be

happy for me. She can't accept a good thing happened and let it go at that.

> >

> > Do any of your nadas try to encourage you to be weak or fearful? It would

be like if you were afraid of spiders but had been working to overcome it. You

talk to her and she says while being " supportive " , oh there's a spider over

there, oh think about about how they skitter with their eight legs and look at

you with all those eyes, and oh one could be about to land on your head any

minute diving down from the ceiling on a strand of webbing! I think back to the

times growing up and the present that if I'm having difficulty coping with

something my nada tends to encourage me in that difficulty and if I start to

pull out of it rather than encourage my success she says things to undermine

that.

> >

> > One real life example I had a job that I ended up forced to resign, not

fired, but pushed out by political pressures in the office. She has always said

I was fired even though I correct her and right after it happened she tried to

play into the sense of failure I feltin the guise of being sympathetic - that I

was fired, just like her from some job she had. I was struggling with how to

frame it myself at the time and had to keep reminding myself that I wasn't

fired, that I could have stayed and fought it but chose not to, that she was

wrong. But yet...years later she still if it comes up refers to it in that way.

> >

> > Projection doesn't seem like the right word for this...what is it?

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Suzy I feel you- my nada can't understand why I am not falling apart because she

is sick with cancer. She's actually DISAPPOINTED that I can carry on with my

everyday life. You would think a mother would want her child to be able to keep

living, be happy and strong. And if I am upset I always have to comfort HER b/c

she's upset that I'm upset. It's so warped.

>

> ,

>

> Yes, oh yes. In fact, this little tactic is at the absolute crux of what made

me see nada's true colors. Some of it is projection, but in other ways, it's a

way of tearing you down so she can feel better about herself. Nadas can't rise

above the feelings of inferiority and need that they feel at their core, so if

they can bring you down to their level, then they can feel better about their

own inadequacy by " comforting " you. (It's just so twisted version of the

philosophy at the core of the book " Atlas Shrugged " by Ayn Rand - read it

sometime). It's so twisted, that in many ways, I believe nada's actually DO

believe they are " helping " you and just don't get why it feels so WRONG!

>

> As for the crux in my situation - it had to do with a medical crisis (I've

posted about) in my late twenties. I was recently divorced, but managing well

enough on my own (states away from family) when I was diagnosed with malignant

melanoma. The prognosis was unclear. I was scared, but holding it together

enough to demand and get a second opinion with a specialist in NYC, travel to my

first consult, arrange surgery and treatment at his hospital, etc., all before

nada flew in (on my dime) to " save the day. " I won't relay all the ways she

showed her ----ss, and there were plenty, but it became clear that at the same

time I was supposed to recovery from major surgery and the still unclear

prognosis, I was supposed to make her feel better about fearing " HER child could

DIE! " And yet, and YET, she was upset because I didn't fall apart and act " like

I NEEDED her. " She just couldn't get why I couldn't be weak and needy for mommy

- she really was waiting for me to fall apart, so she could be the " savior. " It

was just so sick and twisted that it messed with my head plenty - and it changed

how I felt about her irrevocably.

>

> Of course, she went home and told everyone how horribly I had treated her, all

the while relaying how much she enjoyed getting the chance to walk in Central

Park (as I lay throwing up my hospital room).

>

> Sorry, , that's a long answer to your question, but as might be obvious -

a real sore point you touched on with me!

>

> Suzy

>

[Guest guest]

Wow, looks like this issue hits a nerve with a lot of people. As always it's

validating but I'm sorry you guys are in the same boat also. One thing that

got clearer for me is the problem of " plausible deniability " .....these nadas do

most of these things under the guise of sympathy, helping us, relating(!) to us,

even emapthizing with us! I still even now find it hard to attribute knowingly

cruel and premeditative motives to these actions but that may be me holding on

to a last shred of illusion I don't know.

Thank you all for sharing - it is tremendously validating to see this through

others eyes too.

> > >

> > > Do any of your nadas try to encourage you to be weak or fearful? It would

be like if you were afraid of spiders but had been working to overcome it. You

talk to her and she says while being " supportive " , oh there's a spider over

there, oh think about about how they skitter with their eight legs and look at

you with all those eyes, and oh one could be about to land on your head any

minute diving down from the ceiling on a strand of webbing! I think back to the

times growing up and the present that if I'm having difficulty coping with

something my nada tends to encourage me in that difficulty and if I start to

pull out of it rather than encourage my success she says things to undermine

that.

> > >

> > > One real life example I had a job that I ended up forced to resign, not

fired, but pushed out by political pressures in the office. She has always said

I was fired even though I correct her and right after it happened she tried to

play into the sense of failure I feltin the guise of being sympathetic - that I

was fired, just like her from some job she had. I was struggling with how to

frame it myself at the time and had to keep reminding myself that I wasn't

fired, that I could have stayed and fought it but chose not to, that she was

wrong. But yet...years later she still if it comes up refers to it in that way.

> > >

> > > Projection doesn't seem like the right word for this...what is it?

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

UNDERMINING - yep that seems the word I was looking for. Because my nada

is so covert I guess I keep hoping that her hurtful actions aren't conscious or

are kind of instinctual. Yet when it comes to these undermining behaviors, it's

hard to believe she's innocent - it seems...calculated.

It's the picking away like you say, or Annie's description of the acid eroding

the metal, or the undermining of Suzy's incredible self-reliance while having

cancer...how can a mother do such things? My mind still boggles at it.

> >

> > Do any of your nadas try to encourage you to be weak or fearful? It would

be like if you were afraid of spiders but had been working to overcome it. You

talk to her and she says while being " supportive " , oh there's a spider over

there, oh think about about how they skitter with their eight legs and look at

you with all those eyes, and oh one could be about to land on your head any

minute diving down from the ceiling on a strand of webbing! I think back to the

times growing up and the present that if I'm having difficulty coping with

something my nada tends to encourage me in that difficulty and if I start to

pull out of it rather than encourage my success she says things to undermine

that.

> >

> > One real life example I had a job that I ended up forced to resign, not

fired, but pushed out by political pressures in the office. She has always said

I was fired even though I correct her and right after it happened she tried to

play into the sense of failure I feltin the guise of being sympathetic - that I

was fired, just like her from some job she had. I was struggling with how to

frame it myself at the time and had to keep reminding myself that I wasn't

fired, that I could have stayed and fought it but chose not to, that she was

wrong. But yet...years later she still if it comes up refers to it in that way.

> >

> > Projection doesn't seem like the right word for this...what is it?

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

My nada only complimented me when she was trying to suck up about something

to get her way on another issue, or when it was in front of a third party in

a way that made it seem like my accomplishments were really hers, or due to

her parenting or influence.

On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 8:47 PM, xrisacct@... wrote:

>

>

>

>

> --

> > Nadas like anything that will give them a hold over us. If you

> > feel weak or scared, that's something they can take advantage

> > of. It gives them a way to feel superior to you and a way for

> > them to make you feel dependent on them so it doesn't surprise

> > me that your nada would try to make you feel that way.

> > Undermining our selfhood is what a lot of nada behavior is all

> > about.

>

> In this spirit, have any of your nadas ever complimented you sincerely and

> consistently for an accomplishment that made you feel good about yourself,

> and built you up?

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

yep. or trying to make you feel guilty. i'm a photographer, and nada used to

make comments about how my pictures were better than the ones she took, only

she would say it very nastily, as if i should feel guilty about that? or

when i was training for some races and working out after the birth of my

first child, she would make remarks about how 'flat your tummy is now' and

then moan and groan about her own weight, as if i had any control over it?

everything a competition.

On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 9:12 PM, xrisacct@... wrote:

>

>

>

>

> >

> > My nada only complimented me when she was trying to suck up about

> something

> > to get her way on another issue, or when it was in front of a third party

> in

> > a way that made it seem like my accomplishments were really hers, or due

> to

> > her parenting or influence.

>

> Me too. Or she'd say that, and go into her " what I meant, really meant

> was... " and she'd take any compliment away from me.

>

> Anyone else get that? I don't take compliments seriously anymore, cuz of

> that, and the fact they usually start with a fight right afterwards, like

> they're trying to draw down your guard.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hmmm...

How about:

" Oh mom, you're so *cute* when you attack me for no reason... you really do have

that " Wicked Witch of the West " thing down perfectly! "

or

" Wait while I get my tape recorder, mom, this is too good to pass up... Ok...

can you start again at the beginning...? "

-Annie

> what is a tactful way to stop this, a tactful type of retort-anyone have any

suggestions?

>

[Guest guest]

I can't speak for other nadas, but I don't think mine does cruel things

with the sole intention of hurting me. I think she is mean, I know she does a

lot of horrible things on purpose, but I feel it all stems from her insecurity

and it's all aimed at making herself feel better. Selfish, messed up, awful.

But at the heart of it all I don't think she tries to hurt me just for the

purpose of hurting me. It's mainly backlash. Doesn't make it any better, but I

feel it's all part of this really weird mental illness.

> > > >

> > > > Do any of your nadas try to encourage you to be weak or fearful? It

would be like if you were afraid of spiders but had been working to overcome it.

You talk to her and she says while being " supportive " , oh there's a spider over

there, oh think about about how they skitter with their eight legs and look at

you with all those eyes, and oh one could be about to land on your head any

minute diving down from the ceiling on a strand of webbing! I think back to the

times growing up and the present that if I'm having difficulty coping with

something my nada tends to encourage me in that difficulty and if I start to

pull out of it rather than encourage my success she says things to undermine

that.

> > > >

> > > > One real life example I had a job that I ended up forced to resign, not

fired, but pushed out by political pressures in the office. She has always said

I was fired even though I correct her and right after it happened she tried to

play into the sense of failure I feltin the guise of being sympathetic - that I

was fired, just like her from some job she had. I was struggling with how to

frame it myself at the time and had to keep reminding myself that I wasn't

fired, that I could have stayed and fought it but chose not to, that she was

wrong. But yet...years later she still if it comes up refers to it in that way.

> > > >

> > > > Projection doesn't seem like the right word for this...what is it?

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Suzy, I'll have to check out Atlas Shrugged - I remember reading a different

book by Ayn Rand many years ago in college. It's all a hazy memory... What

you went through sounded so awful (understatement) but also you had such clarity

- at least you finally shook off the FOG for good sounds like. I find myself

going back into and out of the FOG's border a lot. Your nada is lucky that you

have anything to do with her at all after that. Most of the time I think they

are pretty careful to know where the limit is of too much - beyond that border

of plausible deniability.

And Mozz, yep, yep, yep it's the same with mine as well. Me having a problem

is terribly upsetting to her just like yours...

> >

> > ,

> >

> > Yes, oh yes. In fact, this little tactic is at the absolute crux of what

made me see nada's true colors. Some of it is projection, but in other ways,

it's a way of tearing you down so she can feel better about herself. Nadas

can't rise above the feelings of inferiority and need that they feel at their

core, so if they can bring you down to their level, then they can feel better

about their own inadequacy by " comforting " you. (It's just so twisted version

of the philosophy at the core of the book " Atlas Shrugged " by Ayn Rand - read it

sometime). It's so twisted, that in many ways, I believe nada's actually DO

believe they are " helping " you and just don't get why it feels so WRONG!

> >

> > As for the crux in my situation - it had to do with a medical crisis (I've

posted about) in my late twenties. I was recently divorced, but managing well

enough on my own (states away from family) when I was diagnosed with malignant

melanoma. The prognosis was unclear. I was scared, but holding it together

enough to demand and get a second opinion with a specialist in NYC, travel to my

first consult, arrange surgery and treatment at his hospital, etc., all before

nada flew in (on my dime) to " save the day. " I won't relay all the ways she

showed her ----ss, and there were plenty, but it became clear that at the same

time I was supposed to recovery from major surgery and the still unclear

prognosis, I was supposed to make her feel better about fearing " HER child could

DIE! " And yet, and YET, she was upset because I didn't fall apart and act " like

I NEEDED her. " She just couldn't get why I couldn't be weak and needy for mommy

- she really was waiting for me to fall apart, so she could be the " savior. " It

was just so sick and twisted that it messed with my head plenty - and it changed

how I felt about her irrevocably.

> >

> > Of course, she went home and told everyone how horribly I had treated her,

all the while relaying how much she enjoyed getting the chance to walk in

Central Park (as I lay throwing up my hospital room).

> >

> > Sorry, , that's a long answer to your question, but as might be obvious

- a real sore point you touched on with me!

> >

> > Suzy

> >

>

[Guest guest]

- The power to undermine us is a power we GIVE to our BPD parents. They

can't do this if we don't let them. (Eleanor Roosevelt said it best - " no one

can make you feel inferior without your permission. " Eleanor had a

mother-in-law who was straight from hell, so she spoke from experience.)

The best defense is to realize that a BPD's comments have NOTHING to do with us,

and EVERYTHING to do with her getting what she wants - control over us. Once we

realize that her comments are not being made " out of love " or " in our best

interest " or " because Mom knows us better than we know ourselves " we can dismiss

them as the ravings of a lunatic, trust to our own instincts, and go on about

our business. Give her the same amount of credibility you'd give some nutjob

who accosts you on the street. There's no point in trying to argue or make a

retort - and no requirement that you dignify her comments with any kind of

response. -

In WTOAdultChildren1 , " xrisacct@... " wrote:

>

>

> >

> > - UNDERMINING. My mom has tried to undermine my relationship with my

> > husband, undermine my self-esteem, undermine my financial stability - by

> > picking, picking, picking away.

>

>

> what is a tactful way to stop this, a tactful type of retort-anyone have any

suggestions?

>

[Guest guest]

NEVER !!!! Never any of my siblings, and not with my fada either ( he's won

an achievement award)

Jackie

>

> In this spirit, have any of your nadas ever complimented you sincerely and

> consistently for an accomplishment that made you feel good about yourself,

> and built you up?

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

That is so exactly it. We have to comfort them and make them feel better

because they are worried about us and that's upsetting to them because they just

love us soooooooo much! Right. (Big eye roll.)

For more on this - see my post " You'll love this story. "

Suzy

[Guest guest]

Well put, . Thing is, its easy to ignore the jabbering mentally ill

stranger on the street who calls you a slut or an idiot, not take it personally,

and even feel sorry for him.

Its a whole different ballgame when the insults, criticisms, and demands (for

obedience or whatever) are coming from your own parent.

It takes a great deal of personal growth, objectivity, distance, awareness,

emotional maturity, training, therapy, etc., to overcome the brainwashing and

damage we've received at their hands from birth, and make that enormous

mental/emotional shift to " compassionate detachment " so that their words have no

more effect on us than the crazy street guy's.

I think you are dead-on right; I too believe that that is the goal, but it takes

some of us (like me) a lot longer to achieve it, I guess.

-Annie

> >

> >

> > >

> > > - UNDERMINING. My mom has tried to undermine my relationship with

my

> > > husband, undermine my self-esteem, undermine my financial stability - by

> > > picking, picking, picking away.

> >

> >

> > what is a tactful way to stop this, a tactful type of retort-anyone have any

suggestions?

> >

>

[Guest guest]

When my nada compliments me, it is a " setup " ; she is softening me up for the Big

Kill....... a truly evil and nasty remark will be forth coming ..... launched

in my direction for a devastating effect on my emotional well being.

>

> NEVER !!!! Never any of my siblings, and not with my fada either ( he's won

> an achievement award)

>

>

> Jackie

>

>

> >

> > In this spirit, have any of your nadas ever complimented you sincerely and

> > consistently for an accomplishment that made you feel good about yourself,

> > and built you up?

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

ummmmm...no way

> In this spirit, have any of your nadas ever complimented you sincerely and

consistently for an accomplishment that made you feel good about yourself, and

built you up?

>

[Guest guest]

" What is your reason for saying that? "

" That's a very unkind thing to say. "

" How is this your business? "

>

>

> >

> > - UNDERMINING. My mom has tried to undermine my relationship with my

> > husband, undermine my self-esteem, undermine my financial stability - by

> > picking, picking, picking away.

>

>

> what is a tactful way to stop this, a tactful type of retort-anyone have any

suggestions?

>

[Guest guest]

Extremely rarely. I can remember one instance where she complimented me for my

intelligence. No one was there to hear but me, so she couldn't have done it to

show what a great mom she was (another tactic). It sounded weird and out of

place, because all I could think of when she said it was all those hundreds of

times she shouted at me to use my head.

It felt weird when she complimented me. She said it as though it was a

revelation for her, but for me it was a simple fact. I was just surprised that

she said something nice to me with no apparent ulterior motive.

My nada complimented me recently on the phone about something positive I'd done

that she'd heard about from family friends. She went on about it for a while,

and then proceeded to " remind " me about how she had always encouraged me in this

area when I was young (not true). This was clearly another case of " look how

wonderful I am because you did something right, I'm such a great mom and I live

vicariously through you. " Bleh. This is exactly why I don't tell her about my

achievements, or errors, for that matter.

qwerty

>

> In this spirit, have any of your nadas ever complimented you sincerely and

consistently for an accomplishment that made you feel good about yourself, and

built you up?

[Guest guest]

I know how you feel. On my nadas 80th birthday, my oldest brother ( the

Perfect One) his wife, me and my husband went there ( it's 425 miles from

where we live, so it's not like a drop by) to " celebrate " it...brother and I

took nada and fada out to nada favorite lunch restaurant...brother and I

split nada and fadas bill, then paid for our own ..brother thought it

easiest to just put the full bill on his CC and we'd divvy up later, but

hubby had already figured our share, and I wrote brother a check in the

restaurant and handed it to him....nada and fada saw this...and I said that

was our part plus our 1/2 or your part of the bill..and they walked

out...after we got into the car, nada turned and looked at me straight in

the eye ( hubby and I were in the 3rd seat, nada & fada in the second seat

and brother and SIL in front seat) and said " thanks for lunch....KEN !!! "

well, my names not Ken...and Ken never once volunteered that hubby and I

paid half...Ken just said you're welcome mom....I should have said

something, but I was just so shocked by that...she KNEW we paid half...I

really dont know why anything she does would ever shock me any more...

Jackie ( just when you think you've seen it all)

>

> No thanks from her at all. she still keeps praising my sister for it,

> though she wasn't 50 miles from the place when everything happened.

>

[Guest guest]

exactly! nada is a bottomless pit of envy. she always wants what someone

else has, is never satisfied. i'm sure it boils down to her low sense of

self worth, and trying to fill that void. any one elses accomplishments or

happyness are a threat. she is like the bully that thinks the only way they

can be fufilled is to take from everyone else. plus, my nada is very, very

uneducated and lazy.

On Wed, Sep 23, 2009 at 4:13 PM, xrisacct@... wrote:

>

>

>

>

> >

> > yep. or trying to make you feel guilty. i'm a photographer, and nada used

> to

> > make comments about how my pictures were better than the ones she took,

> only

> > she would say it very nastily, as if i should feel guilty about that?

>

> You were deliberately trying to make her feel bad about herself, right? I

> even get that now. Nothing I say, ever is taken at face value, ever. I

> always get the shaft. Everything I do centers on her.

>

> Recently, she went literally crazy for a few days, mainly because, as I

> figured out, she had had sex and gotten a urinary tract infection from a

> friend of hers, who has ties to LANL and has been responsible for some of

> the harassment against us in town. She, I guess for pity's sake, refused to

> get help, then blamed me for being unwilling to take her to the hospital

> when she did go, though we drove her and had kept offering.

>

> She'd been urinating a lot ,so I tested her bg, 198. I told her if she

> didn't start exercising, she better start picking out a coffin and a site.

> She got quiet. She did follow it for a few days, might even be now, and no

> longer has to take her blood pressure meds and no longer has high bg's.

>

> No thanks from her at all. she still keeps praising my sister for it,

> though she wasn't 50 miles from the place when everything happened.

>

> or

> > when i was training for some races and working out after the birth of my

> > first child, she would make remarks about how 'flat your tummy is now'

> and

> > then moan and groan about her own weight, as if i had any control over

> it?

>

> Taking the attention off of you, since you kept yourself in good health,

> and her self centered brain couldn't accept you could be healthy enough to

> stay healthy weight, right?

>

> My honey's mother and sister tried pulling something like that on her when

> I was at their home. They kept saying she was " skinny " , they both are

> morbidly obese or worse. I said she wasn't skinny, she was " healthy " , they

> both blanched, kept repeating, and I did a broken record each time. They

> never brought it up again. They can't stand the fact she is attractive. Her

> existence proves their obesity isn't genetic either, so out goes that excuse

> and " poor me " hoover.

>

> BTW, congratulations on keeping healthy. I was a fat kid, I haven't been

> since. It's not that difficult, either, but it sure can FEEL difficult

> sometimes, especially when other people try to hate you for it! But it does

> take effort, and self discipline, and you had both! Good job!

>

>

>