Re: Nada's family/friends think I'm a terrible daughter and it gets to me! :(

[Guest guest]

they sound EXACTLY like my ex husbands family (the family is FULL of

BP/APD/NPD.) They won't see the light, it's how they are. If they are set on

denying reality then it seems that is how they are coping with a family of

abuse. The opinions of PD's, especially in reinforcing your value, should be

dismissed and I mean ALL opinions. I even dismiss the postive opinions of PD's

because they are not genuine and are often superficial. They can abuse you and

then compliment you on something totally irrelevant and meaningless (maybe as a

way to smooth things over so they can continue the abuse) and you are supposed

to be GRATEFUL. BS. I am sorry to hear that you have no real family, I have

never had a real family until my son came along. I have come to believe that we

choose our families, blood or not, and my family will grow when the time is

right. Friends are better family than most blood relatives anyway.

charlene~

________________________________

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Sunday, September 6, 2009 11:42:03 PM

Subject: Nada's family/friends think I'm a terrible daughter

and it gets to me!

Hello again,

Thanks to everyone so far who have responded to my last message. It is

comforting to know others are out there and can understand and offer words of

wisdom.

I know my problem isn't unusual, but for some reason it is more difficult for me

to deal with than many of the other things that come with having a Nada. I am NC

and very, very happy about this because I am free from Nada's projections,

insanity etc!

Problem is... her family (my aunts, uncles, etc) now think I (and my father and

sister) are such terrible, horrible people for being so mean to Nada and

" abandoning " her. It's so VERY clear that she has a problem! Her BPD she

obviously hides very well (she is undiagnosed but I am SURE) but she has had

suicide attempts and has clearly done/said weird things in front of my relatives

that should let them know that something is WRONG WITH HER. However, they

continue to think that I am such a bad, uncaring daughter who apparently should

do anything in the world for their mother (even suffer) in order to make them

happy!

I have tried to explain her problem to some of them, but they brush it off by

saying " There are two sides to every story... " and of course they mean HER

distortion campaign against me and my dad and sister. I said to one aunt, " You

don't understand all of the horrible things she 's done to me! " Her response?

" What about all of the horrible things you've done to her? " I was fricking 19

years old at the time probably!! Like it's MY RESPONSIBILITY to take care of HER

and her needs above protecting my own sanity???? Her needs that could never

possibly be met!!

This all just gets to me because these relatives are supposed to LOVE ME.

They're all pretty crazy themselves (My Nada has BPD because of the way her

mother treated her so I am sure they were all exposed too. Nadas brother killed

himself- he was crazy too!), but I am still hurt because I grew up knowing love

from these people who now believe I am a terrible person! I used to receive

calls and birthday cards etc and now I get nothing! It's just like a slap in the

face.

What's worse is I have college graduation and possibly a wedding coming up and I

feel like I will have NO FAMILY there for me. And at the same time, I also don't

even want them there because they believe Nadas bullcrap. I know I have my dad

and my sister and many supporting friends and I am grateful for that... but I'm

still hurt by the complete denial that my relatives are in!!

I'm sorry, I know my complaint was all contradictory... it's just all very

difficult to deal with.

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[Guest guest]

You could always have NADA usurp your graduation and wedding and try and live

vicariously through it while emberrising you endlessly. I had no family at my

wedding except for my mom and dad. Mom overtook her insulin and actually got

up on the alter with her camera during the cerermony no kidding. I recall she

did the same camera thing to me in highschool gradaution and I began crying on

the front row of the stage and had a full fledged panic attack. So the family

thing is overated especially with NADA involved trying to make it her day and

not yours.

I know the guilt is horrible. And it is upsetting when people believe her lies.

You need to brake away now. Please you dont want to be where I am now with DHS

investigating me for elder abuse because NADA made up stories and accusations.

Better family believe it than DHS or law enforcement. And yes it can go there.

Read my blog if you want to find out more about her my ordeal and the DHS

reporting by the nurse about me moments after NADA calmly explained in detail

her plans to murder me. WTF??? Anyway, be careful. I am 38 and now just

breaking away and caring for myself. It has destroyed big parts of my life. So

please don't wait.

www.bamafleurdelis.blogspot.com/

>

> Hello again,

> Thanks to everyone so far who have responded to my last message. It is

comforting to know others are out there and can understand and offer words of

wisdom.

>

> I know my problem isn't unusual, but for some reason it is more difficult for

me to deal with than many of the other things that come with having a Nada. I am

NC and very, very happy about this because I am free from Nada's projections,

insanity etc!

> Problem is... her family (my aunts, uncles, etc) now think I (and my father

and sister) are such terrible, horrible people for being so mean to Nada and

" abandoning " her. It's so VERY clear that she has a problem! Her BPD she

obviously hides very well (she is undiagnosed but I am SURE) but she has had

suicide attempts and has clearly done/said weird things in front of my relatives

that should let them know that something is WRONG WITH HER. However, they

continue to think that I am such a bad, uncaring daughter who apparently should

do anything in the world for their mother (even suffer) in order to make them

happy!

> I have tried to explain her problem to some of them, but they brush it off by

saying " There are two sides to every story... " and of course they mean HER

distortion campaign against me and my dad and sister. I said to one aunt, " You

don't understand all of the horrible things she 's done to me! " Her response?

" What about all of the horrible things you've done to her? " I was fricking 19

years old at the time probably!! Like it's MY RESPONSIBILITY to take care of HER

and her needs above protecting my own sanity???? Her needs that could never

possibly be met!!

>

> This all just gets to me because these relatives are supposed to LOVE ME.

They're all pretty crazy themselves (My Nada has BPD because of the way her

mother treated her so I am sure they were all exposed too. Nadas brother killed

himself- he was crazy too!), but I am still hurt because I grew up knowing love

from these people who now believe I am a terrible person! I used to receive

calls and birthday cards etc and now I get nothing! It's just like a slap in the

face.

> What's worse is I have college graduation and possibly a wedding coming up and

I feel like I will have NO FAMILY there for me. And at the same time, I also

don't even want them there because they believe Nadas bullcrap. I know I have my

dad and my sister and many supporting friends and I am grateful for that... but

I'm still hurt by the complete denial that my relatives are in!!

>

> I'm sorry, I know my complaint was all contradictory... it's just all very

difficult to deal with.

>

[Guest guest]

Chibividz,

In families with a disordered member, it is sometimes the whole family that is

disordered and not just the person who has the disorder.  Having certain

dysfunctional beliefs probably helped the rest of the family to cope with the

disorder at some point, but now those beliefs have become fossilized,

inflexible, and permanent.

One of the main beliefs that often becomes disordered has to do with

responsibility--and, I think this one can be disordered in families that have

both mental illness and addictions at work in them.  Responsibility is often

understood in a kind of a backwards way.  Individuals, including the ill person,

are not considered to be responsible for themselves.  On the other hand, family

members are expected to take responsibility for others in ways that are far

beyond what is reasonable or healthy.  When your relatives hold you equally

accountable for the past even though you are not equals, that is part of what is

probably going on.  When they let your nada's behavior slide and not yours, that

is also probably at work.

Disordered families are also often extremely rigid.  Individuals have roles,

just as they do in other families, but these roles are rigid and completely

inflexible.  If you are the comic relief, you are not allowed to ever stop

playing that role.  I think this gives family members a sense of predictableness

that can help them cope with the sudden traumas often associated with having a

member who is mentally ill.

Denial is also extremely important in these kinds of families.  Stepping out of

denial means addressing potentially unbearable pain--both the pain of the mental

illness and the pain caused by all of the various steps that the family has

taken to deal with it.

In going nc, you've disrupted the way your FOO functions on a number of levels

and this is probably very unsettling to them.  You've stepped out of denial,

suggesting it is possible to do so.  You've laid the responsibility where it

belongs, which calls into question their whole sense of how responsibility

should be attributed, and you may have stepped out of the role they've assigned

to you--whatever that role was, it probably did not involve going nc with nada. 

People need their beliefs about how things work.  They need to be able to

understand their own reality.  In going nc, I think you've probably suggested to

them that the way they understand reality is incorrect.  Rather than revise

their understanding, what it seems to me like they are doing is to try to get

you to accomodate to their understanding of the world so that no revisions are

necessary.

I'm not justifying what they are doing.  Clearly, if that's how your FOO

actually works, it's inaccurate and harmful to all of the members in the

long-term.  But it may help you to understand why they push you so hard to

change back to how things were--if that explanation seems to fit for you.

I'm sorry it sounds like it's not just your nada that is crazy.  I know how much

harder that makes it.

Also, congratulations on your graduation and your engagement.

Take good care,

Ashana

Love Cricket? Check out live scores, photos, video highlights and more.

Click here http://cricket.yahoo.com

[Guest guest]

>

> Chibividz,

>

> In families with a disordered member, it is sometimes the whole family that is

disordered and not just the person who has the disorder. Having certain

dysfunctional beliefs probably helped the rest of the family to cope with the

disorder at some point, but now those beliefs have become fossilized,

inflexible, and permanent.

>

> One of the main beliefs that often becomes disordered has to do with

responsibility--and, I think this one can be disordered in families that have

both mental illness and addictions at work in them. Responsibility is often

understood in a kind of a backwards way. Individuals, including the ill person,

are not considered to be responsible for themselves. On the other hand, family

members are expected to take responsibility for others in ways that are far

beyond what is reasonable or healthy. When your relatives hold you equally

accountable for the past even though you are not equals, that is part of what is

probably going on. When they let your nada's behavior slide and not yours, that

is also probably at work.

>

> Disordered families are also often extremely rigid. Individuals have roles,

just as they do in other families, but these roles are rigid and completely

inflexible. If you are the comic relief, you are not allowed to ever stop

playing that role. I think this gives family members a sense of predictableness

that can help them cope with the sudden traumas often associated with having a

member who is mentally ill.

>

> Denial is also extremely important in these kinds of families. Stepping out

of denial means addressing potentially unbearable pain--both the pain of the

mental illness and the pain caused by all of the various steps that the family

has taken to deal with it.

>

> In going nc, you've disrupted the way your FOO functions on a number of levels

and this is probably very unsettling to them. You've stepped out of denial,

suggesting it is possible to do so. You've laid the responsibility where it

belongs, which calls into question their whole sense of how responsibility

should be attributed, and you may have stepped out of the role they've assigned

to you--whatever that role was, it probably did not involve going nc with nada.

People need their beliefs about how things work. They need to be able to

understand their own reality. In going nc, I think you've probably suggested to

them that the way they understand reality is incorrect. Rather than revise

their understanding, what it seems to me like they are doing is to try to get

you to accomodate to their understanding of the world so that no revisions are

necessary.

>

> I'm not justifying what they are doing. Clearly, if that's how your FOO

actually works, it's inaccurate and harmful to all of the members in the

long-term. But it may help you to understand why they push you so hard to

change back to how things were--if that explanation seems to fit for you.

>

> I'm sorry it sounds like it's not just your nada that is crazy. I know how

much harder that makes it.

>

> Also, congratulations on your graduation and your engagement.

>

> Take good care,

> Ashana

>

>

> Love Cricket? Check out live scores, photos, video highlights and more.

Click here http://cricket.yahoo.com

>

>

[Guest guest]

Chibividz - Ashana's explanation makes perfect sense, and clarified some things

I hadn't thought about. So I'll just add one short point -

If you and your father don't have contact with your mom, then her side of the

family gets the job of putting up with her. Since they won't listen to reason,

but they do listen to her tirades and " pity-me " stories, they are buying into

her sickness - but they are probably also realizing that they are stuck with

her. And it would be much easier for them if you'd fall back into line, take on

the role of dutiful, nada-pleasing child, and take her off their hands. Even

crazy people know they don't want to be stuck with a Nada!

Of course, the main problem is that at NO point does anybody say, " Gee, maybe

she should take care of herself. "

So stand strong. Those folks may be your family, but they are NOT working in

your best interest.

And as to the wedding and graduation - plenty of people who write in here

(myself included) have gone to great lengths to avoid having our crazy relatives

at big ceremonies like grads and weddings. Boy, if you think your mom is

crazy-acting now, just ask her to help plan a formal wedding - she'll make

" Bridezilla " look tame. (We have some pictures from the wedding planning stage

- it looks like my mom's eyes are spinning in two different directions, LOL)

Your dad and close friends will be there for you. That is actually a LOT of

people - and bonus, they'll behave themselves! -

>

> Hello again,

> Thanks to everyone so far who have responded to my last message. It is

comforting to know others are out there and can understand and offer words of

wisdom.

>

> I know my problem isn't unusual, but for some reason it is more difficult for

me to deal with than many of the other things that come with having a Nada. I am

NC and very, very happy about this because I am free from Nada's projections,

insanity etc!

> Problem is... her family (my aunts, uncles, etc) now think I (and my father

and sister) are such terrible, horrible people for being so mean to Nada and

" abandoning " her. It's so VERY clear that she has a problem! Her BPD she

obviously hides very well (she is undiagnosed but I am SURE) but she has had

suicide attempts and has clearly done/said weird things in front of my relatives

that should let them know that something is WRONG WITH HER. However, they

continue to think that I am such a bad, uncaring daughter who apparently should

do anything in the world for their mother (even suffer) in order to make them

happy!

> I have tried to explain her problem to some of them, but they brush it off by

saying " There are two sides to every story... " and of course they mean HER

distortion campaign against me and my dad and sister. I said to one aunt, " You

don't understand all of the horrible things she 's done to me! " Her response?

" What about all of the horrible things you've done to her? " I was fricking 19

years old at the time probably!! Like it's MY RESPONSIBILITY to take care of HER

and her needs above protecting my own sanity???? Her needs that could never

possibly be met!!

>

> This all just gets to me because these relatives are supposed to LOVE ME.

They're all pretty crazy themselves (My Nada has BPD because of the way her

mother treated her so I am sure they were all exposed too. Nadas brother killed

himself- he was crazy too!), but I am still hurt because I grew up knowing love

from these people who now believe I am a terrible person! I used to receive

calls and birthday cards etc and now I get nothing! It's just like a slap in the

face.

> What's worse is I have college graduation and possibly a wedding coming up and

I feel like I will have NO FAMILY there for me. And at the same time, I also

don't even want them there because they believe Nadas bullcrap. I know I have my

dad and my sister and many supporting friends and I am grateful for that... but

I'm still hurt by the complete denial that my relatives are in!!

>

> I'm sorry, I know my complaint was all contradictory... it's just all very

difficult to deal with.

>

[Guest guest]

I understand your problem. Since they called me the terrible daughter and

told me I need to straighten up, I have been NC with them. I know they have

said horrible lies to my relatives ( my aunts, uncles and cousins all live

around that area) but I look at it this way 1) I used to spend summers up

there when I was younger. 12 summers to be exact. they should know me

pretty well and know I am NOT how nada and fada have suddenly painted me,

and 2) if they DO believe nada and fada, which I'm sure some do because I

never hear from the ones I used to hear from on a regular basis, then

obviously they aren't the fair open minded people *I* thought they were...if

they're so ready to believe something bad about me and not bother to get my

side of it...then I dont need them either...

Jackie

Hello again,

Thanks to everyone so far who have responded to my last message. It is

comforting to know others are out there and can understand and offer words

of wisdom.

I know my problem isn't unusual, but for some reason it is more difficult

for me to deal with than many of the other things that come with having a

Nada. I am NC and very, very happy about this because I am free from Nada's

projections, insanity etc!

Problem is... her family (my aunts, uncles, etc) now think I (and my father

and sister) are such terrible, horrible people for being so mean to Nada and

" abandoning " her. It's so VERY clear that she has a problem! Her BPD she

obviously hides very well (she is undiagnosed but I am SURE) but she has had

suicide attempts and has clearly done/said weird things in front of my

relatives that should let them know that something is WRONG WITH HER.

However, they continue to think that I am such a bad, uncaring daughter who

apparently should do anything in the world for their mother (even suffer) in

order to make them happy!

I have tried to explain her problem to some of them, but they brush it off

by saying " There are two sides to every story... " and of course they mean

HER distortion campaign against me and my dad and sister. I said to one

aunt, " You don't understand all of the horrible things she 's done to me! "

Her response? " What about all of the horrible things you've done to her? " I

was fricking 19 years old at the time probably!! Like it's MY RESPONSIBILITY

to take care of HER and her needs above protecting my own sanity???? Her

needs that could never possibly be met!!

This all just gets to me because these relatives are supposed to LOVE ME.

They're all pretty crazy themselves (My Nada has BPD because of the way her

mother treated her so I am sure they were all exposed too. Nadas brother

killed himself- he was crazy too!), but I am still hurt because I grew up

knowing love from these people who now believe I am a terrible person! I

used to receive calls and birthday cards etc and now I get nothing! It's

just like a slap in the face.

What's worse is I have college graduation and possibly a wedding coming up

and I feel like I will have NO FAMILY there for me. And at the same time, I

also don't even want them there because they believe Nadas bullcrap. I know

I have my dad and my sister and many supporting friends and I am grateful

for that... but I'm still hurt by the complete denial that my relatives are

in!!

I'm sorry, I know my complaint was all contradictory... it's just all very

difficult to deal with.

[Guest guest]

This is all very true, Jackie. Thank you. If they believe such lies then they

are not who I thought they were, and they DON'T really know me.

Sometimes I get verrrry mad about it and wanna yell things like that at them! I

get upset because normal behaviors that I had as a teenager (and I was a really

good teenager/daughter!) are apparently considered AWFUL. Like, HOW could I

upset my mother so badly by being embarrassed by her?? It's absolutely terrible

how I was expected to be perfect, even under these circumstances. REAL mothers

are supposed to understand these things. But I guess I was expected to cater to

Nadas needs. It was Nada who was out of line and not I. Real mothers don't smear

the reps of their children!!! When I REALLY think of living with a BPD mom I

can't believe how bizarre all of the situations are.

Sorry, I find that I get off track because so many situations run through my

mind. Anyway, what's sad about my relative situation is is that they believe I

am capable of such things. I say they're in denial. They can't bear to think

that their Nada (my grandmother) could be the reason for all their dysfunctions

(My uncle's suicide, and my Nadas BPD and emotional abuse). They also can't bear

to believe that my Nada has a problem. They'd rather blame us (me, my dad, and

sister)

I also agree that now they're the ones stuck dealing with Nada and wish we'd

just go back to suffering so they wouldn't have to hear about it anymore.

You'd think that the fact that me, my dad, and sister moved out would be enough

to show them that there was something wrong with Nada and not the rest of us!

(Nada likes to project on us, yes- so we're all " crazy " and she's not!)

Thanks all!

- Chibividz/

>

> I understand your problem. Since they called me the terrible daughter and

> told me I need to straighten up, I have been NC with them. I know they have

> said horrible lies to my relatives ( my aunts, uncles and cousins all live

> around that area) but I look at it this way 1) I used to spend summers up

> there when I was younger. 12 summers to be exact. they should know me

> pretty well and know I am NOT how nada and fada have suddenly painted me,

> and 2) if they DO believe nada and fada, which I'm sure some do because I

> never hear from the ones I used to hear from on a regular basis, then

> obviously they aren't the fair open minded people *I* thought they were...if

> they're so ready to believe something bad about me and not bother to get my

> side of it...then I dont need them either...

>

> Jackie

>

>

>

> Hello again,

> Thanks to everyone so far who have responded to my last message. It is

> comforting to know others are out there and can understand and offer words

> of wisdom.

>

> I know my problem isn't unusual, but for some reason it is more difficult

> for me to deal with than many of the other things that come with having a

> Nada. I am NC and very, very happy about this because I am free from Nada's

> projections, insanity etc!

> Problem is... her family (my aunts, uncles, etc) now think I (and my father

> and sister) are such terrible, horrible people for being so mean to Nada and

> " abandoning " her. It's so VERY clear that she has a problem! Her BPD she

> obviously hides very well (she is undiagnosed but I am SURE) but she has had

> suicide attempts and has clearly done/said weird things in front of my

> relatives that should let them know that something is WRONG WITH HER.

> However, they continue to think that I am such a bad, uncaring daughter who

> apparently should do anything in the world for their mother (even suffer) in

> order to make them happy!

> I have tried to explain her problem to some of them, but they brush it off

> by saying " There are two sides to every story... " and of course they mean

> HER distortion campaign against me and my dad and sister. I said to one

> aunt, " You don't understand all of the horrible things she 's done to me! "

> Her response? " What about all of the horrible things you've done to her? " I

> was fricking 19 years old at the time probably!! Like it's MY RESPONSIBILITY

> to take care of HER and her needs above protecting my own sanity???? Her

> needs that could never possibly be met!!

>

> This all just gets to me because these relatives are supposed to LOVE ME.

> They're all pretty crazy themselves (My Nada has BPD because of the way her

> mother treated her so I am sure they were all exposed too. Nadas brother

> killed himself- he was crazy too!), but I am still hurt because I grew up

> knowing love from these people who now believe I am a terrible person! I

> used to receive calls and birthday cards etc and now I get nothing! It's

> just like a slap in the face.

> What's worse is I have college graduation and possibly a wedding coming up

> and I feel like I will have NO FAMILY there for me. And at the same time, I

> also don't even want them there because they believe Nadas bullcrap. I know

> I have my dad and my sister and many supporting friends and I am grateful

> for that... but I'm still hurt by the complete denial that my relatives are

> in!!

>

> I'm sorry, I know my complaint was all contradictory... it's just all very

> difficult to deal with.

[Guest guest]

I think we've all experienced this... to some degree or another... the greatest

thing I've learned is that the majority of my FOO realize it's Nada now (and

they did even back then)... I try to keep the WHY DIDN'T ANYONE SAVE ME AS A

CHILD blues at bay... they will consume and distroy me... but, at 40, I'm

finally realizing how CONVINCING Nada was... and how much they did see through

her... but she scared the daylights out of all of them so it was easier for them

to take NO action than it was to save one little blonde girl.

Sad, sickening and true.

With that, I don't trust most of them to treat my child any better so I don't

put that into place. He has a whole 'nuter' family that he's close too...

that's enough. He knows Nada is nuts (amen for therapy) and that's good enough

for us.

Just because they should have, could have and it was the morally/ethically right

thing to do... they failed because of their own fears of her... I'd consider

that maybe your FOO folk are in the same boat. Even if they're not... it sure

makes it easier to think that....

Lynnette

> >

> > I understand your problem. Since they called me the terrible daughter and

> > told me I need to straighten up, I have been NC with them. I know they have

> > said horrible lies to my relatives ( my aunts, uncles and cousins all live

> > around that area) but I look at it this way 1) I used to spend summers up

> > there when I was younger. 12 summers to be exact. they should know me

> > pretty well and know I am NOT how nada and fada have suddenly painted me,

> > and 2) if they DO believe nada and fada, which I'm sure some do because I

> > never hear from the ones I used to hear from on a regular basis, then

> > obviously they aren't the fair open minded people *I* thought they were...if

> > they're so ready to believe something bad about me and not bother to get my

> > side of it...then I dont need them either...

> >

> > Jackie

> >

> >

> >

> > Hello again,

> > Thanks to everyone so far who have responded to my last message. It is

> > comforting to know others are out there and can understand and offer words

> > of wisdom.

> >

> > I know my problem isn't unusual, but for some reason it is more difficult

> > for me to deal with than many of the other things that come with having a

> > Nada. I am NC and very, very happy about this because I am free from Nada's

> > projections, insanity etc!

> > Problem is... her family (my aunts, uncles, etc) now think I (and my father

> > and sister) are such terrible, horrible people for being so mean to Nada and

> > " abandoning " her. It's so VERY clear that she has a problem! Her BPD she

> > obviously hides very well (she is undiagnosed but I am SURE) but she has had

> > suicide attempts and has clearly done/said weird things in front of my

> > relatives that should let them know that something is WRONG WITH HER.

> > However, they continue to think that I am such a bad, uncaring daughter who

> > apparently should do anything in the world for their mother (even suffer) in

> > order to make them happy!

> > I have tried to explain her problem to some of them, but they brush it off

> > by saying " There are two sides to every story... " and of course they mean

> > HER distortion campaign against me and my dad and sister. I said to one

> > aunt, " You don't understand all of the horrible things she 's done to me! "

> > Her response? " What about all of the horrible things you've done to her? " I

> > was fricking 19 years old at the time probably!! Like it's MY RESPONSIBILITY

> > to take care of HER and her needs above protecting my own sanity???? Her

> > needs that could never possibly be met!!

> >

> > This all just gets to me because these relatives are supposed to LOVE ME.

> > They're all pretty crazy themselves (My Nada has BPD because of the way her

> > mother treated her so I am sure they were all exposed too. Nadas brother

> > killed himself- he was crazy too!), but I am still hurt because I grew up

> > knowing love from these people who now believe I am a terrible person! I

> > used to receive calls and birthday cards etc and now I get nothing! It's

> > just like a slap in the face.

> > What's worse is I have college graduation and possibly a wedding coming up

> > and I feel like I will have NO FAMILY there for me. And at the same time, I

> > also don't even want them there because they believe Nadas bullcrap. I know

> > I have my dad and my sister and many supporting friends and I am grateful

> > for that... but I'm still hurt by the complete denial that my relatives are

> > in!!

> >

> > I'm sorry, I know my complaint was all contradictory... it's just all very

> > difficult to deal with.

>

[Guest guest]

and you're absolutely right, it's called denial...all teens go through rough

periods...that doesn't make them bad, they just need to find who they are

and such..

if your relatives have to spend any long amount of time with your nada, they

will easily see who the crazy one is !! but it is easer to blame others

than admit she's the problem. I am finding that to be true in my family.

My fada would rather tell me *I* the terrible one, the crazy one, the bad

one, then ever admit that his wife is mentally ill. He has always

'explained away " her behaviors and I remember after fights when I was in

high school, he'd tell me she really does love me, and I'd tell him people

dont treat people they love in this manner. He said it's hard to understand

but that's just her and I have to accept it...and when I did, everything was

wonderful with me and the family, once I decided I was not taking it any

more, I became the terrible one, the bad child..the disturbed one...

Jackie

Sometimes I get verrrry mad about it and wanna yell things like that at

them! I get upset because normal behaviors that I had as a teenager (and I

was a really good teenager/daughter!) are apparently considered AWFUL. Like,

HOW could I upset my mother so badly by being embarrassed by her?? It's

absolutely terrible how I was expected to be perfect, even under these

circumstances. REAL mothers are supposed to understand these things. But I

guess I was expected to cater to Nadas needs. It was Nada who was out of

line and not I. Real mothers don't smear the reps of their children!!! When

I REALLY think of living with a BPD mom I can't believe how bizarre all of

the situations are.

Sorry, I find that I get off track because so many situations run through my

mind. Anyway, what's sad about my relative situation is is that they

believe I am capable of such things. I say they're in denial. They can't

bear to think that their Nada (my grandmother) could be the reason for all

their dysfunctions (My uncle's suicide, and my Nadas BPD and emotional

abuse). They also can't bear to believe that my Nada has a problem. They'd

rather blame us (me, my dad, and sister)

I also agree that now they're the ones stuck dealing with Nada and wish we'd

just go back to suffering so they wouldn't have to hear about it anymore.

You'd think that the fact that me, my dad, and sister moved out would be

enough to show them that there was something wrong with Nada and not the

rest of us! (Nada likes to project on us, yes- so we're all " crazy " and

she's not!)

Thanks all!

- Chibividz/

[Guest guest]

very good description, Ashana !!

Jackie

Chibividz,

In families with a disordered member, it is sometimes the whole family that

is disordered and not just the person who has the disorder. Having certain

dysfunctional beliefs probably helped the rest of the family to cope with

the disorder at some point, but now those beliefs have become fossilized,

inflexible, and permanent.

One of the main beliefs that often becomes disordered has to do with

responsibility--and, I think this one can be disordered in families that

have both mental illness and addictions at work in them. Responsibility is

often understood in a kind of a backwards way. Individuals, including the

ill person, are not considered to be responsible for themselves. On the

other hand, family members are expected to take responsibility for others in

ways that are far beyond what is reasonable or healthy. When your relatives

hold you equally accountable for the past even though you are not equals,

that is part of what is probably going on. When they let your nada's

behavior slide and not yours, that is also probably at work.

Disordered families are also often extremely rigid. Individuals have roles,

just as they do in other families, but these roles are rigid and completely

inflexible. If you are the comic relief, you are not allowed to ever stop

playing that role. I think this gives family members a sense of

predictableness that can help them cope with the sudden traumas often

associated with having a member who is mentally ill.

Denial is also extremely important in these kinds of families. Stepping out

of denial means addressing potentially unbearable pain--both the pain of the

mental illness and the pain caused by all of the various steps that the

family has taken to deal with it.

In going nc, you've disrupted the way your FOO functions on a number of

levels and this is probably very unsettling to them. You've stepped out of

denial, suggesting it is possible to do so. You've laid the responsibility

where it belongs, which calls into question their whole sense of how

responsibility should be attributed, and you may have stepped out of the

role they've assigned to you--whatever that role was, it probably did not

involve going nc with nada. People need their beliefs about how things work.

They need to be able to understand their own reality. In going nc, I think

you've probably suggested to them that the way they understand reality is

incorrect. Rather than revise their understanding, what it seems to me like

they are doing is to try to get you to accomodate to their understanding of

the world so that no revisions are necessary.

I'm not justifying what they are doing. Clearly, if that's how your FOO

actually works, it's inaccurate and harmful to all of the members in the

long-term. But it may help you to understand why they push you so hard to

change back to how things were--if that explanation seems to fit for you.

I'm sorry it sounds like it's not just your nada that is crazy. I know how

much harder that makes it.

Also, congratulations on your graduation and your engagement.

Take good care,

Ashana