Guest guest Posted May 11, 2009 Report Share Posted May 11, 2009 Here's what I do. If a patient has an order for PT and the patient wishes to see me, I do an eval, generate a plan of treatment and fax it to the MD for signature. Sometimes I call the MD, especially if it's at an ALF facility. Depending on insurance, it's no so much the order that matters as much as the plan of treatment. Whichever discipline is seeing the patient a signed plan of treatment must be generated by that discipline and signed. Ron Carson MHS, OT Hope Therapy Services, LLC www.HopeTherapyServices.com ===============<Original Message>=============== On 5/11/2009, bogardtherapy@... said: JB> Can an OT perform services if the order has been written for PT, if JB> the OT is trained in the area such as shoulder, or the PT is JB> booked/or none on staff at the time. JB> JB> Bogard, M.S., CCC-SLP JB> Bogard Therapy & Rehab JB> 949 Hwy 79 JB> Dover, TN 37058 JB> JB> _________________________________________________________________ JB> Hotmail® goes with you. JB> http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Mobile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_Mob\ ile1_052009 JB> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 12, 2009 Report Share Posted May 12, 2009 , Anyone can try to provide physical therapy services or medical or surgical services. The question is whether it is legal. Providing physical therapy services or any other service without the appropriate state mandated requirements necessary to provide that particular professional service could be argued as illegal. You will want to first make sure you know what your state requires for one to provide physical therapy. In most states it happens to be a license to practice physical therapy. Sumesh , PT, DPT Hamilton Physical Therapy ________________________________ To: ptmanager Sent: Monday, May 11, 2009 12:18:41 PM Subject: OT/PT Can an OT perform services if the order has been written for PT, if the OT is trained in the area such as shoulder, or the PT is booked/or none on staff at the time. Bogard, M.S., CCC-SLP Bogard Therapy & Rehab 949 Hwy 79 Dover, TN 37058 ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ Hotmail® goes with you. http://windowslive. com/Tutorial/ Hotmail/Mobile? ocid=TXT_ TAGLM_WL_ HM_Tutorial_ Mobile1_052009 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 12, 2009 Report Share Posted May 12, 2009 , Anyone can try to provide physical therapy services or medical or surgical services. The question is whether it is legal. Providing physical therapy services or any other service without the appropriate state mandated requirements necessary to provide that particular professional service could be argued as illegal. You will want to first make sure you know what your state requires for one to provide physical therapy. In most states it happens to be a license to practice physical therapy. Sumesh , PT, DPT Hamilton Physical Therapy ________________________________ To: ptmanager Sent: Monday, May 11, 2009 12:18:41 PM Subject: OT/PT Can an OT perform services if the order has been written for PT, if the OT is trained in the area such as shoulder, or the PT is booked/or none on staff at the time. Bogard, M.S., CCC-SLP Bogard Therapy & Rehab 949 Hwy 79 Dover, TN 37058 ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ Hotmail® goes with you. http://windowslive. com/Tutorial/ Hotmail/Mobile? ocid=TXT_ TAGLM_WL_ HM_Tutorial_ Mobile1_052009 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 12, 2009 Report Share Posted May 12, 2009 Ron, I am not sure of the laws in your state, but that is illegal in mine. Good luck with that. Our usual suggestion is that the physician is called to change the order to OT and await the physician's response. Lane Blondheim, PT, MT Active Health and Rehab Montgomery, AL > > Here's what I do. If a patient has an order for PT and the patient > wishes to see me, I do an eval, generate a plan of treatment and fax it > to the MD for signature. Sometimes I call the MD, especially if it's at > an ALF facility. > > Depending on insurance, it's no so much the order that matters as much > as the plan of treatment. Whichever discipline is seeing the patient a > signed plan of treatment must be generated by that discipline and > signed. > > > Ron Carson MHS, OT > Hope Therapy Services, LLC > www.HopeTherapyServices.com > > ===============<Original Message>=============== > > On 5/11/2009, bogardtherapy@... said: > > > JB> Can an OT perform services if the order has been written for PT, if > JB> the OT is trained in the area such as shoulder, or the PT is > JB> booked/or none on staff at the time. > > JB> > JB> Bogard, M.S., CCC-SLP > JB> Bogard Therapy & Rehab > JB> 949 Hwy 79 > JB> Dover, TN 37058 > JB> > > > > JB> _________________________________________________________________ > JB> Hotmail® goes with you. > JB> http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Mobile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_Mob\ ile1_052009 > > JB> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 12, 2009 Report Share Posted May 12, 2009 No, Staffing issues do not negate the law Ron Barbato PT Director, Rehabilitation Services, EMH (V) - OT/PT Can an OT perform services if the order has been written for PT, if the OT is trained in the area such as shoulder, or the PT is booked/or none on staff at the time. Bogard, M.S., CCC-SLP Bogard Therapy & Rehab 949 Hwy 79 Dover, TN 37058 _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail® goes with you. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Mobile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tuto rial_Mobile1_052009 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 12, 2009 Report Share Posted May 12, 2009 No, Staffing issues do not negate the law Ron Barbato PT Director, Rehabilitation Services, EMH (V) - OT/PT Can an OT perform services if the order has been written for PT, if the OT is trained in the area such as shoulder, or the PT is booked/or none on staff at the time. Bogard, M.S., CCC-SLP Bogard Therapy & Rehab 949 Hwy 79 Dover, TN 37058 _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail® goes with you. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Mobile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tuto rial_Mobile1_052009 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 Ron, You would have to look at your particular state practive act. In Alabama, performing an eval that is not ordered is subject to fine or license revocation. Repeat offenders are subject to other legal activities. Your state may be fine to perform direct access by an OT. I do believe that you are the one who needs to be familiar with your state acts/laws, etc. as I do not know which state you reside or practice in. Best of intentions, Lane Lane Blondheim, PT, MT Active Health and Rehab Montgomery, AL > >> > >> Here's what I do. If a patient has an order for PT and the patient > >> wishes to see me, I do an eval, generate a plan of treatment and fax it > >> to the MD for signature. Sometimes I call the MD, especially if it's at > >> an ALF facility. > >> > >> Depending on insurance, it's no so much the order that matters as much > >> as the plan of treatment. Whichever discipline is seeing the patient a > >> signed plan of treatment must be generated by that discipline and > >> signed. > >> > >> > >> Ron Carson MHS, OT > >> Hope Therapy Services, LLC > >> www.HopeTherapyServices.com > >> > >> ===============<Original Message>=============== > >> > >> On 5/11/2009, bogardtherapy@ said: > >> > >> > >> JB> Can an OT perform services if the order has been written for PT, if > >> JB> the OT is trained in the area such as shoulder, or the PT is > >> JB> booked/or none on staff at the time. > >> > >> JB> > >> JB> Bogard, M.S., CCC-SLP > >> JB> Bogard Therapy & Rehab > >> JB> 949 Hwy 79 > >> JB> Dover, TN 37058 > >> JB> > >> > >> > >> > >> JB> _________________________________________________________________ > >> JB> Hotmail® goes with you. > >> JB> http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Mobile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_Mob\ ile1_052009 > >> > >> JB> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 Re: the lymphedema / hand question - our lymphedema is performed solely by OTs, but Hand Therapy has in the recent past had both OT/PTs. We specifically have " Hand Therapy " as a selection on our prescriptions. If the script came in with OT or PT selected (instead of Hand), the patient would be scheduled on the appropriate discipline. The evaluator would then specifically ask the MD on the eval (which we get back signed) if it was OK for Hand Therapy to treat, including both OT/PT. We never had an MD say no. We never had the other discipline scheduled until we got that OK (even if verbally to start.) For the eval itself.... If the PT hand therapist performs the eval, and then an OT hand therapist follows treatment, the OT would review the PT's eval, plan, and goals, and specifically document in their first treatment note that the PT plan/goals were reviewed and agreed with. Occasionally the OT might add a goal or do an additional assessment, but our Hand Therapists worked so closely together it was rare when there were major plan disagreements. It got trickier with us because we also have a COTA, who can only follow an OTs plan, so she had to be sure that the OT saw the pt. before being placed on her schedule. That's how we personally worked it out. Currently we only have OTs in HT, so it makes it much easier for everyone involved. a Hranicka, OT/L Clinical Program Leader Occupational Therapy, HealthPlace Physical & Hand Therapy Tuality Healthcare Hillsboro, OR erica.hranicka@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 Re: hand therapy, I was wondering what folks have been charging for splinting. I work in an acute hospital setting, with satellite outpatient offices. I have been trying to locate specific codes that would be reimbursed through Medicare. Does anyone have any specific codes for specific splints, that would be appropriate in MA and in an acute hospital setting? Thanks Colette Fellows OTR/L ________________________________ From: PTManager [mailto:PTManager ] On Behalf Of erica.hranicka@... Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2009 12:53 PM To: PTManager Subject: Re: OT/PT Re: the lymphedema / hand question - our lymphedema is performed solely by OTs, but Hand Therapy has in the recent past had both OT/PTs. We specifically have " Hand Therapy " as a selection on our prescriptions. If the script came in with OT or PT selected (instead of Hand), the patient would be scheduled on the appropriate discipline. The evaluator would then specifically ask the MD on the eval (which we get back signed) if it was OK for Hand Therapy to treat, including both OT/PT. We never had an MD say no. We never had the other discipline scheduled until we got that OK (even if verbally to start.) For the eval itself.... If the PT hand therapist performs the eval, and then an OT hand therapist follows treatment, the OT would review the PT's eval, plan, and goals, and specifically document in their first treatment note that the PT plan/goals were reviewed and agreed with. Occasionally the OT might add a goal or do an additional assessment, but our Hand Therapists worked so closely together it was rare when there were major plan disagreements. It got trickier with us because we also have a COTA, who can only follow an OTs plan, so she had to be sure that the OT saw the pt. before being placed on her schedule. That's how we personally worked it out. Currently we only have OTs in HT, so it makes it much easier for everyone involved. a Hranicka, OT/L Clinical Program Leader Occupational Therapy, HealthPlace Physical & Hand Therapy Tuality Healthcare Hillsboro, OR erica.hranicka@... <mailto:erica.hranicka%40tuality.org> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 I may be wrong, but I don't think the below practice falls within Medicare's guidelines. My Intermediaries Therapy Services LCD states: =================================================================== Outpatient therapy services shall be furnished under a plan established by: · The physical therapist who will provide the physical therapy services; · The occupational therapist who will provide the occupational therapy services; ==================================================================== To me, this means that each discipline must establish their OWN plan of treatment. One profession agreeing with another's plan is NOT the same as establishing a plan. In fact, I believe that a plan of treatment can only be established with an evaluation. An OT agreeing with a PT's plan is not the same as the OT establishing their own plan. It's a difficult situation. Ron Carson MHS, OT Hope Therapy Services, LLC www.HopeTherapyServices.com ===============<Original Message>=============== On 5/13/2009, erica.hranicka@... said: ehto> For the eval itself.... If the PT hand therapist performs the eval, and ehto> then an OT hand therapist follows treatment, the OT would review the PT's ehto> eval, plan, and goals, and specifically document in their first treatment ehto> note that the PT plan/goals were reviewed and agreed with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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