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Re: ? on how to order ALA and ? on biofilm and ALA

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Dear experts on ALA as a chelator,

Thank you ahead of time for your time and response to these two questions:

1. My son started the biofilm protocol about two weeks ago, and now I'm planning to add ALA, do you know if there would be any interference with the remedies since there are binding agents in the biofilm protocol and ALA is also a binding agent?

2. What kind of ALA to order? There is ALA with Vit C and fillers, ALA with magnesium sulfate and ALA with magnesium apartate - this is from the compounded chelator website recommended in the AC protocol.

Thank you

Karla

Subject: Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replicationTo: mb12 valtrex Date: Thursday, November 19, 2009, 6:39 PM

, when I said you had symptoms of it, I didn't mean you had it. Sorry for the misunderstanding. > > >> > > Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replicationNatasa,> > > > > > Thanks for the interesting studies. Admittedly there is a lot we still

don't know about the intertwine of viruses and metals, how chelators or antivirals specific mechanism of action operate. My dream would be to hear you and Andy discuss this. I'm not setting you up, it's just that I learn best when I hear two well informed people discuss things. He is very adamant that the benefit of chelators is 100% due to the removal of metals. In the what causes what arena, does metal removal clear viruses, or does virus treatment remove metals he has stated that metal removal clears viruses and said he will debate anyone anytime on this issue. And we do have those metal dumps where each time there would be an improvement.> > > > > > Dmsa, although we always used under 10 mgs, did something for her I could never put my finger on, right from the very first round. There is no good reason to believe the Dmsa removed any significant metals on that first round and there could be other explanations, but I offer it

as one explanation. I still contend there is good evidence to believe that the chelators main or strongest action is in removing the metals but there's nothing to say the chelators could not do both, remove metals and somehow affect the viruses.> > > > > > Also in practice, again, I know noone who has treated viral issues alone, who fits my definition of recovered and is still not medically managed. I've known more than a few with full viral treatment for years, who have had to eventually chelate. I was on the NIDS board for 2 years and the same 2 parents only reported any significant improvement and I offer if Dr. Goldberg was curing through antiviral treatment people would be beating a path to his door, they are not. Dr. McCandless has also said, that only her one patient reported in her book to be so helped by antivirals, ever. That was not the norm.> > > > > > While I believe antiviral/immune

treatment is very helpful and btw am grateful to Goldberg for bringing this to light, I do not see it as the main treatment for ASD. I think it is a valuable adjunct treatment. I still contend you have to do both, remove the metals and treat the viruses/immune system.> > > > > > If you'd consent to discussing this with Andy, I'd love to hear from you as I truly think it would be an invaluable service to others.> > > > > > > > > Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replication> > > > > > > > > "Could it be that the chelators work as antiretrovirals by removing mercury? "> > > > > > , that

is not the case, that is not how chelators work here. They work by removing ions from cation-binding viral proteins, causing unfolding/loss of protein functionality. For example by opening zinc-finger proteins and similar. There are other mechanisms observed, such as inhibiting viral DNA synthesis through RNA reductase deactivation, see attached> > > > > > btw some of these studies are in vitro, no mercury in sight, so the answer is NO they do not work as antivirals through chelating mercury, at least not exclusively (meaning to say that who knows maybe heavy metals are also directly utilised by some viruses)> > > > > > And whatever is observed to happen in HIV only is only because HIV is studied lot more than others. There are no studies that show other viral proteins would not be unfolding in the same way when chelators added. Having said that there are studies on herpes/CMV and others that indicate

same things going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus.> > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus was investigated using the indirect immunofluorescence (FA) technique in LLC-MK2 cells to titrate infectivity. Rotavirus infectivity was stabilized by calcium and strontium ions in solution but not by magnesium ions. Rotavirus isolates were found to be much less stable at 37 degrees C than at + 4 degrees C or 20 degrees. A study of virus morphology at intervals during the course of the experiment and treatment with the chelating agents EDTA and EGTA suggests that loss of infectivity coincides with the removal of the outer capsid layer and that calcium may be required to maintain virus integrity. Arch Virol. 1981;67(1):1- 9. Shirley JA, Beards GM, Thouless ME, Flewett TH> > > > >

> > > > Biochemical studies of primate retroviruses.> > > In the present paper, recent biochemical studies of retroviruses carried out in our laboratory are summarized. Protein compositions, peptide maps of internal structural proteins, neighborhoods of major structural proteins, and serological properties of reverse transcriptases of type D virus isolates from human cells (including Graffi's isolate termed PMFV and also isolates from HeLa- and HEp-2 cells) were compared with those of type D viruses from Old World (Mason-Pfizer virus of rhesus monkeys, langur virus) and New World (squirrel monkey retrovirus) monkeys. The results provide various new informations on, and further demonstrate the diversity of primate type D viruses. Other studies showed that tumor promoting agents (phorbol ester TPA, indole alkaloid teleocidin) are able to considerably increase, in a transient manner, the production of type C and type D primate

retroviruses in persistently infected human cells. From experiments demonstrating a> disintegrating activity of chelating agents (EDTA, EGTA) and certain psychoactive drugs (including trifluoperazine) on various primate and nonprimate retroviruses it is concluded that divalent cations, probably Ca2+ ions, and possibly also cation-binding proteins are associated with retroviral membranes and that complexing of these components results in loss of viral infectivity. Wunderlich Very, Uckert W, Sydow G Arch Geschwulstforsch. 1983;53(3):267- 78.> > >> >>

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Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replication> > > > > > > > > "Could it be that the chelators work as antiretrovirals by removing mercury? "> > > > > > , that is not the case, that is not how chelators work here. They work by removing ions from cation-binding viral proteins, causing unfolding/loss of protein functionality. For example by opening zinc-finger proteins and similar. There are other mechanisms observed, such as inhibiting viral DNA synthesis through RNA reductase deactivation, see attached> > > > > > btw some of these studies are in vitro, no mercury in sight, so the answer is NO they do not work as antivirals through chelating mercury, at least not exclusively (meaning to say that who knows maybe heavy metals are also directly utilised by some viruses)> > > > > > And whatever is observed to happen in HIV only is only because HIV is studied lot more than others. There are no studies that show other viral proteins would not be unfolding in the same way when chelators added. Having said that there are studies on herpes/CMV and others that indicate same things going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus.> > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus was investigated using the indirect immunofluorescence (FA) technique in LLC-MK2 cells to titrate infectivity. Rotavirus infectivity was stabilized by calcium and strontium ions in solution but not by magnesium ions. Rotavirus isolates were found to be much less stable at 37 degrees C than at + 4 degrees C or 20 degrees. A study of virus morphology at intervals during the course of the experiment and treatment with the chelating agents EDTA and EGTA suggests that loss of infectivity coincides with the removal of the outer capsid layer and that calcium may be required to maintain virus integrity. Arch Virol. 1981;67(1):1- 9. Shirley JA, Beards GM, Thouless ME, Flewett TH> > > > > > > > > Biochemical studies of primate retroviruses.> > > In the present paper, recent biochemical studies of retroviruses carried out in our laboratory are summarized. Protein compositions, peptide maps of internal structural proteins, neighborhoods of major structural proteins, and serological properties of reverse transcriptases of type D virus isolates from human cells (including Graffi's isolate termed PMFV and also isolates from HeLa- and HEp-2 cells) were compared with those of type D viruses from Old World (Mason-Pfizer virus of rhesus monkeys, langur virus) and New World (squirrel monkey retrovirus) monkeys. The results provide various new informations on, and further demonstrate the diversity of primate type D viruses. Other studies showed that tumor promoting agents (phorbol ester TPA, indole alkaloid teleocidin) are able to considerably increase, in a transient manner, the production of type C and type D primate retroviruses in persistently infected human cells. From experiments demonstrating a> disintegrating activity of chelating agents (EDTA, EGTA) and certain psychoactive drugs (including trifluoperazine) on various primate and nonprimate retroviruses it is concluded that divalent cations, probably Ca2+ ions, and possibly also cation-binding proteins are associated with retroviral membranes and that complexing of these components results in loss of viral infectivity. Wunderlich Very, Uckert W, Sydow G Arch Geschwulstforsch. 1983;53(3):267- 78.> > >> >>

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How do you know when you should add ALA?

Amy A.

To: mb12 valtrex Sent: Sun, November 22, 2009 5:40:53 AMSubject: Re: ? on how to order ALA and ? on biofilm and ALA



Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replication> > > > > > > > > "Could it be that the chelators work as antiretrovirals by removing mercury? "> > > > > > , that is not the case, that is not how chelators work here. They work by removing ions from cation-binding viral proteins, causing unfolding/loss of protein functionality. For example by opening zinc-finger proteins and similar. There are other mechanisms observed, such as inhibiting viral DNA synthesis through RNA reductase deactivation, see attached> > > > > > btw some of these studies

are in vitro, no mercury in sight, so the answer is NO they do not work as antivirals through chelating mercury, at least not exclusively (meaning to say that who knows maybe heavy metals are also directly utilised by some viruses)> > > > > > And whatever is observed to happen in HIV only is only because HIV is studied lot more than others. There are no studies that show other viral proteins would not be unfolding in the same way when chelators added. Having said that there are studies on herpes/CMV and others that indicate same things going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus.> > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus was investigated using the indirect immunofluorescence (FA) technique in LLC-MK2 cells to titrate infectivity. Rotavirus infectivity was stabilized by

calcium and strontium ions in solution but not by magnesium ions. Rotavirus isolates were found to be much less stable at 37 degrees C than at + 4 degrees C or 20 degrees. A study of virus morphology at intervals during the course of the experiment and treatment with the chelating agents EDTA and EGTA suggests that loss of infectivity coincides with the removal of the outer capsid layer and that calcium may be required to maintain virus integrity. Arch Virol. 1981;67(1):1- 9. Shirley JA, Beards GM, Thouless ME, Flewett TH> > > > > > > > > Biochemical studies of primate retroviruses.> > > In the present paper, recent biochemical studies of retroviruses carried out in our laboratory are summarized. Protein compositions, peptide maps of internal structural proteins, neighborhoods of major structural proteins, and serological properties of reverse transcriptases of type D virus isolates from human cells

(including Graffi's isolate termed PMFV and also isolates from HeLa- and HEp-2 cells) were compared with those of type D viruses from Old World (Mason-Pfizer virus of rhesus monkeys, langur virus) and New World (squirrel monkey retrovirus) monkeys. The results provide various new informations on, and further demonstrate the diversity of primate type D viruses. Other studies showed that tumor promoting agents (phorbol ester TPA, indole alkaloid teleocidin) are able to considerably increase, in a transient manner, the production of type C and type D primate retroviruses in persistently infected human cells. From experiments demonstrating a> disintegrating activity of chelating agents (EDTA, EGTA) and certain psychoactive drugs (including trifluoperazine) on various primate and nonprimate retroviruses it is concluded that divalent cations, probably Ca2+ ions, and possibly also cation-binding proteins are associated with retroviral membranes and that

complexing of these components results in loss of viral infectivity. Wunderlich Very, Uckert W, Sydow G Arch Geschwulstforsch. 1983;53(3):267- 78.> > >> >>

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Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replication> > > > > > > > > "Could it be that the chelators work as antiretrovirals by removing mercury? "> > > > > > , that is not the case, that is not how chelators work here. They work by removing ions from cation-binding viral proteins, causing unfolding/loss of protein functionality. For example by opening zinc-finger proteins and similar. There are other mechanisms observed, such as inhibiting viral DNA synthesis through RNA reductase deactivation, see attached> > > > > > btw some of these studies are in vitro, no mercury in sight, so the answer is NO they do not work as antivirals through chelating mercury, at least not exclusively (meaning to say that who knows maybe heavy metals are also directly utilised by some viruses)> > > > > > And whatever is observed to happen in HIV only is only because HIV is studied lot more than others. There are no studies that show other viral proteins would not be unfolding in the same way when chelators added. Having said that there are studies on herpes/CMV and others that indicate same things going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus.> > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus was investigated using the indirect immunofluorescence (FA) technique in LLC-MK2 cells to titrate infectivity. Rotavirus infectivity was stabilized by calcium and strontium ions in solution but not by magnesium ions. Rotavirus isolates were found to be much less stable at 37 degrees C than at + 4 degrees C or 20 degrees. A study of virus morphology at intervals during the course of the experiment and treatment with the chelating agents EDTA and EGTA suggests that loss of infectivity coincides with the removal of the outer capsid layer and that calcium may be required to maintain virus integrity. Arch Virol. 1981;67(1):1- 9. Shirley JA, Beards GM, Thouless ME, Flewett TH> > > > > > > > > Biochemical studies of primate retroviruses.> > > In the present paper, recent biochemical studies of retroviruses carried out in our laboratory are summarized. Protein compositions, peptide maps of internal structural proteins, neighborhoods of major structural proteins, and serological properties of reverse transcriptases of type D virus isolates from human cells (including Graffi's isolate termed PMFV and also isolates from HeLa- and HEp-2 cells) were compared with those of type D viruses from Old World (Mason-Pfizer virus of rhesus monkeys, langur virus) and New World (squirrel monkey retrovirus) monkeys. The results provide various new informations on, and further demonstrate the diversity of primate type D viruses. Other studies showed that tumor promoting agents (phorbol ester TPA, indole alkaloid teleocidin) are able to considerably increase, in a transient manner, the production of type C and type D primate retroviruses in persistently infected human cells. From experiments demonstrating a> disintegrating activity of chelating agents (EDTA, EGTA) and certain psychoactive drugs (including trifluoperazine) on various primate and nonprimate retroviruses it is concluded that divalent cations, probably Ca2+ ions, and possibly also cation-binding proteins are associated with retroviral membranes and that complexing of these components results in loss of viral infectivity. Wunderlich Very, Uckert W, Sydow G Arch Geschwulstforsch. 1983;53(3):267- 78.> > >> >>

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Thank you

Biofilm agents: 2 interfase, 2 monolaurin, 4 dropperful quintessence, 6 Para Biotic plus, 1scoop microsilica, and a dose of YES oils.

Thank you again

Karla

Subject: Re: ? on how to order ALA and ? on biofilm and ALATo: mb12 valtrex Date: Sunday, November 22, 2009, 2:40 AM



Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replication> > > > > > > > > "Could it be that the chelators work as antiretrovirals by removing mercury? "> > > > > > , that is not the case, that is not how chelators work here. They work by removing ions from cation-binding viral proteins, causing unfolding/loss of protein functionality. For example by opening zinc-finger proteins and similar. There are other mechanisms observed, such as inhibiting viral DNA synthesis through RNA reductase deactivation, see attached> > > > > > btw some of these studies

are in vitro, no mercury in sight, so the answer is NO they do not work as antivirals through chelating mercury, at least not exclusively (meaning to say that who knows maybe heavy metals are also directly utilised by some viruses)> > > > > > And whatever is observed to happen in HIV only is only because HIV is studied lot more than others. There are no studies that show other viral proteins would not be unfolding in the same way when chelators added. Having said that there are studies on herpes/CMV and others that indicate same things going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus.> > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus was investigated using the indirect immunofluorescence (FA) technique in LLC-MK2 cells to titrate infectivity. Rotavirus infectivity was stabilized by

calcium and strontium ions in solution but not by magnesium ions. Rotavirus isolates were found to be much less stable at 37 degrees C than at + 4 degrees C or 20 degrees. A study of virus morphology at intervals during the course of the experiment and treatment with the chelating agents EDTA and EGTA suggests that loss of infectivity coincides with the removal of the outer capsid layer and that calcium may be required to maintain virus integrity. Arch Virol. 1981;67(1):1- 9. Shirley JA, Beards GM, Thouless ME, Flewett TH> > > > > > > > > Biochemical studies of primate retroviruses.> > > In the present paper, recent biochemical studies of retroviruses carried out in our laboratory are summarized. Protein compositions, peptide maps of internal structural proteins, neighborhoods of major structural proteins, and serological properties of reverse transcriptases of type D virus isolates from human cells

(including Graffi's isolate termed PMFV and also isolates from HeLa- and HEp-2 cells) were compared with those of type D viruses from Old World (Mason-Pfizer virus of rhesus monkeys, langur virus) and New World (squirrel monkey retrovirus) monkeys. The results provide various new informations on, and further demonstrate the diversity of primate type D viruses. Other studies showed that tumor promoting agents (phorbol ester TPA, indole alkaloid teleocidin) are able to considerably increase, in a transient manner, the production of type C and type D primate retroviruses in persistently infected human cells. From experiments demonstrating a> disintegrating activity of chelating agents (EDTA, EGTA) and certain psychoactive drugs (including trifluoperazine) on various primate and nonprimate retroviruses it is concluded that divalent cations, probably Ca2+ ions, and possibly also cation-binding proteins are associated with retroviral membranes and that

complexing of these components results in loss of viral infectivity. Wunderlich Very, Uckert W, Sydow G Arch Geschwulstforsch. 1983;53(3):267- 78.> > >> >>

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Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replication> > > > > > > > > "Could it be that the chelators work as antiretrovirals by removing mercury? "> > > > > > , that is not the case, that is not how chelators work here. They work by removing ions from cation-binding viral proteins, causing unfolding/loss of protein functionality. For example by opening zinc-finger proteins and similar. There are other mechanisms observed, such as inhibiting viral DNA synthesis through RNA reductase deactivation, see attached> > > > > > btw some of these studies are in vitro, no mercury in sight, so the answer is NO they do not work as antivirals through chelating mercury, at least not exclusively (meaning to say that who knows maybe heavy metals are also directly utilised by some viruses)> > > > > > And whatever is observed to happen in HIV only is only because HIV is studied lot more than others. There are no studies that show other viral proteins would not be unfolding in the same way when chelators added. Having said that there are studies on herpes/CMV and others that indicate same things going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus.> > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus was investigated using the indirect immunofluorescence (FA) technique in LLC-MK2 cells to titrate infectivity. Rotavirus infectivity was stabilized by calcium and strontium ions in solution but not by magnesium ions. Rotavirus isolates were found to be much less stable at 37 degrees C than at + 4 degrees C or 20 degrees. A study of virus morphology at intervals during the course of the experiment and treatment with the chelating agents EDTA and EGTA suggests that loss of infectivity coincides with the removal of the outer capsid layer and that calcium may be required to maintain virus integrity. Arch Virol. 1981;67(1):1- 9. Shirley JA, Beards GM, Thouless ME, Flewett TH> > > > > > > > > Biochemical studies of primate retroviruses.> > > In the present paper, recent biochemical studies of retroviruses carried out in our laboratory are summarized. Protein compositions, peptide maps of internal structural proteins, neighborhoods of major structural proteins, and serological properties of reverse transcriptases of type D virus isolates from human cells (including Graffi's isolate termed PMFV and also isolates from HeLa- and HEp-2 cells) were compared with those of type D viruses from Old World (Mason-Pfizer virus of rhesus monkeys, langur virus) and New World (squirrel monkey retrovirus) monkeys. The results provide various new informations on, and further demonstrate the diversity of primate type D viruses. Other studies showed that tumor promoting agents (phorbol ester TPA, indole alkaloid teleocidin) are able to considerably increase, in a transient manner, the production of type C and type D primate retroviruses in persistently infected human cells. From experiments demonstrating a> disintegrating activity of chelating agents (EDTA, EGTA) and certain psychoactive drugs (including trifluoperazine) on various primate and nonprimate retroviruses it is concluded that divalent cations, probably Ca2+ ions, and possibly also cation-binding proteins are associated with retroviral membranes and that complexing of these components results in loss of viral infectivity. Wunderlich Very, Uckert W, Sydow G Arch Geschwulstforsch. 1983;53(3):267- 78.> > >> >>

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  • 2 weeks later...

Dear Listmates,

Those of you using ALA, can you share where you order it from?

Thanks

Karla

From: Liz <elizabethsoliday@ yahoo.com>Subject: Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replicationTo: mb12 valtrex@ yahoogroups. comDate: Thursday, November 19, 2009, 6:39 PM

, when I said you had symptoms of it, I didn't mean you had it. Sorry for the misunderstanding. > > >> > > Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replicationNatasa,> > > > > > Thanks for the interesting studies. Admittedly there is a lot we still don't know about the intertwine of viruses and metals, how chelators or antivirals specific mechanism of action operate. My dream would be to hear you and Andy discuss this. I'm not setting you up, it's just that I learn best when I hear two well informed people discuss things. He is very adamant that the benefit of chelators is 100% due to the removal of metals. In the what causes what arena, does metal

removal clear viruses, or does virus treatment remove metals he has stated that metal removal clears viruses and said he will debate anyone anytime on this issue. And we do have those metal dumps where each time there would be an improvement.> > > > > > Dmsa, although we always used under 10 mgs, did something for her I could never put my finger on, right from the very first round. There is no good reason to believe the Dmsa removed any significant metals on that first round and there could be other explanations, but I offer it as one explanation. I still contend there is good evidence to believe that the chelators main or strongest action is in removing the metals but there's nothing to say the chelators could not do both, remove metals and somehow affect the viruses.> > > > > > Also in practice, again, I know noone who has treated viral issues alone, who fits my definition of recovered and is still

not medically managed. I've known more than a few with full viral treatment for years, who have had to eventually chelate. I was on the NIDS board for 2 years and the same 2 parents only reported any significant improvement and I offer if Dr. Goldberg was curing through antiviral treatment people would be beating a path to his door, they are not. Dr. McCandless has also said, that only her one patient reported in her book to be so helped by antivirals, ever. That was not the norm.> > > > > > While I believe antiviral/immune treatment is very helpful and btw am grateful to Goldberg for bringing this to light, I do not see it as the main treatment for ASD. I think it is a valuable adjunct treatment. I still contend you have to do both, remove the metals and treat the viruses/immune system.> > > > > > If you'd consent to discussing this with Andy, I'd love to hear from you as I truly think it would be an

invaluable service to others.> > > > > > > > > Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replication> > > > > > > > > "Could it be that the chelators work as antiretrovirals by removing mercury? "> > > > > > , that is not the case, that is not how chelators work here. They work by removing ions from cation-binding viral proteins, causing unfolding/loss of protein functionality. For example by opening zinc-finger proteins and similar. There are other mechanisms observed, such as inhibiting viral DNA synthesis through RNA reductase deactivation, see attached> > > > > > btw some of these studies

are in vitro, no mercury in sight, so the answer is NO they do not work as antivirals through chelating mercury, at least not exclusively (meaning to say that who knows maybe heavy metals are also directly utilised by some viruses)> > > > > > And whatever is observed to happen in HIV only is only because HIV is studied lot more than others. There are no studies that show other viral proteins would not be unfolding in the same way when chelators added. Having said that there are studies on herpes/CMV and others that indicate same things going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus.> > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus was investigated using the indirect immunofluorescence (FA) technique in LLC-MK2 cells to titrate infectivity. Rotavirus infectivity was stabilized by

calcium and strontium ions in solution but not by magnesium ions. Rotavirus isolates were found to be much less stable at 37 degrees C than at + 4 degrees C or 20 degrees. A study of virus morphology at intervals during the course of the experiment and treatment with the chelating agents EDTA and EGTA suggests that loss of infectivity coincides with the removal of the outer capsid layer and that calcium may be required to maintain virus integrity. Arch Virol. 1981;67(1):1- 9. Shirley JA, Beards GM, Thouless ME, Flewett TH> > > > > > > > > Biochemical studies of primate retroviruses.> > > In the present paper, recent biochemical studies of retroviruses carried out in our laboratory are summarized. Protein compositions, peptide maps of internal structural proteins, neighborhoods of major structural proteins, and serological properties of reverse transcriptases of type D virus isolates from human cells

(including Graffi's isolate termed PMFV and also isolates from HeLa- and HEp-2 cells) were compared with those of type D viruses from Old World (Mason-Pfizer virus of rhesus monkeys, langur virus) and New World (squirrel monkey retrovirus) monkeys. The results provide various new informations on, and further demonstrate the diversity of primate type D viruses. Other studies showed that tumor promoting agents (phorbol ester TPA, indole alkaloid teleocidin) are able to considerably increase, in a transient manner, the production of type C and type D primate retroviruses in persistently infected human cells. From experiments demonstrating a> disintegrating activity of chelating agents (EDTA, EGTA) and certain psychoactive drugs (including trifluoperazine) on various primate and nonprimate retroviruses it is concluded that divalent cations, probably Ca2+ ions, and possibly also cation-binding proteins are associated with retroviral membranes and that

complexing of these components results in loss of viral infectivity. Wunderlich Very, Uckert W, Sydow G Arch Geschwulstforsch. 1983;53(3):267- 78.> > >> >>

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We use kirkmans hypoallergenic

40 and Mom to threeTash 23 ooops..new Mommy ( I'm a Grammy to Kyri 2 )Casey-Mae 14..sweet as pieElijah 3.5 .. ASD and beautiful

From: Liz <elizabethsoliday@ yahoo.com>Subject: Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replicationTo: mb12 valtrex@ yahoogroups. comDate: Thursday, November 19, 2009, 6:39 PM

, when I said you had symptoms of it, I didn't mean you had it. Sorry for the misunderstanding. > > >> > > Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replicationNatasa,> > > > > > Thanks for the interesting studies. Admittedly there is a lot we still don't know about the intertwine of viruses and metals, how chelators or antivirals specific mechanism of action operate. My dream would be to hear you and Andy discuss this. I'm not setting you up, it's just that I learn best when I hear two well informed people discuss things. He is very adamant that the benefit of chelators is 100% due to the removal of metals. In the what causes what arena, does metal

removal clear viruses, or does virus treatment remove metals he has stated that metal removal clears viruses and said he will debate anyone anytime on this issue. And we do have those metal dumps where each time there would be an improvement.> > > > > > Dmsa, although we always used under 10 mgs, did something for her I could never put my finger on, right from the very first round. There is no good reason to believe the Dmsa removed any significant metals on that first round and there could be other explanations, but I offer it as one explanation. I still contend there is good evidence to believe that the chelators main or strongest action is in removing the metals but there's nothing to say the chelators could not do both, remove metals and somehow affect the viruses.> > > > > > Also in practice, again, I know noone who has treated viral issues alone, who fits my definition of recovered and is still

not medically managed. I've known more than a few with full viral treatment for years, who have had to eventually chelate. I was on the NIDS board for 2 years and the same 2 parents only reported any significant improvement and I offer if Dr. Goldberg was curing through antiviral treatment people would be beating a path to his door, they are not. Dr. McCandless has also said, that only her one patient reported in her book to be so helped by antivirals, ever. That was not the norm.> > > > > > While I believe antiviral/immune treatment is very helpful and btw am grateful to Goldberg for bringing this to light, I do not see it as the main treatment for ASD. I think it is a valuable adjunct treatment. I still contend you have to do both, remove the metals and treat the viruses/immune system.> > > > > > If you'd consent to discussing this with Andy, I'd love to hear from you as I truly think it would be an

invaluable service to others.> > > > > > > > > Re: ALA - direct inhibitor of retroviral replication> > > > > > > > > "Could it be that the chelators work as antiretrovirals by removing mercury? "> > > > > > , that is not the case, that is not how chelators work here. They work by removing ions from cation-binding viral proteins, causing unfolding/loss of protein functionality. For example by opening zinc-finger proteins and similar. There are other mechanisms observed, such as inhibiting viral DNA synthesis through RNA reductase deactivation, see attached> > > > > > btw some of these studies

are in vitro, no mercury in sight, so the answer is NO they do not work as antivirals through chelating mercury, at least not exclusively (meaning to say that who knows maybe heavy metals are also directly utilised by some viruses)> > > > > > And whatever is observed to happen in HIV only is only because HIV is studied lot more than others. There are no studies that show other viral proteins would not be unfolding in the same way when chelators added. Having said that there are studies on herpes/CMV and others that indicate same things going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus.> > > The influence of divalent cations on the stability of human rotavirus was investigated using the indirect immunofluorescence (FA) technique in LLC-MK2 cells to titrate infectivity. Rotavirus infectivity was stabilized by

calcium and strontium ions in solution but not by magnesium ions. Rotavirus isolates were found to be much less stable at 37 degrees C than at + 4 degrees C or 20 degrees. A study of virus morphology at intervals during the course of the experiment and treatment with the chelating agents EDTA and EGTA suggests that loss of infectivity coincides with the removal of the outer capsid layer and that calcium may be required to maintain virus integrity. Arch Virol. 1981;67(1):1- 9. Shirley JA, Beards GM, Thouless ME, Flewett TH> > > > > > > > > Biochemical studies of primate retroviruses.> > > In the present paper, recent biochemical studies of retroviruses carried out in our laboratory are summarized. Protein compositions, peptide maps of internal structural proteins, neighborhoods of major structural proteins, and serological properties of reverse transcriptases of type D virus isolates from human cells

(including Graffi's isolate termed PMFV and also isolates from HeLa- and HEp-2 cells) were compared with those of type D viruses from Old World (Mason-Pfizer virus of rhesus monkeys, langur virus) and New World (squirrel monkey retrovirus) monkeys. The results provide various new informations on, and further demonstrate the diversity of primate type D viruses. Other studies showed that tumor promoting agents (phorbol ester TPA, indole alkaloid teleocidin) are able to considerably increase, in a transient manner, the production of type C and type D primate retroviruses in persistently infected human cells. From experiments demonstrating a> disintegrating activity of chelating agents (EDTA, EGTA) and certain psychoactive drugs (including trifluoperazine) on various primate and nonprimate retroviruses it is concluded that divalent cations, probably Ca2+ ions, and possibly also cation-binding proteins are associated with retroviral membranes and that

complexing of these components results in loss of viral infectivity. Wunderlich Very, Uckert W, Sydow G Arch Geschwulstforsch. 1983;53(3):267- 78.> > >> >>

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