Guest guest Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 Very good information here. There is also a chart in the book Pumping Insulin by Walsh (he also writes a book called Using Insulin for those on injections), that shows approximately how much one gram of carb will raise your blood sugar based on body weight. These are just estimates, and you will still need to experiment: If your weight is 50 lbs (23 kg),1 gram will raise you about 8 mg/dl (0.44 mmol). If your weight is 75 lbs (34 kg),1 gram will raise you about 7 mg/dl (0.39 mmol). If your weight is 90 lbs (41 kg),1 gram will raise you about 6 mg/dl (0.33 mmol). If your weight is 120 lbs (55 kg), 1 gram will raise you about 5 mg/dl (0.28 mmol). If your weight is 160 lbs (73 kg), 1 gram will raise you about 4 mg/dl (0.22 mmol). If your weight is 200 lbs (91 kg), 1 gram will raise you about 3 mg/dl (0.17 mmol). I do not know if this would change with insulin resistence. I find this chart is fairly accurate for me. If you are dosing insulin according to carbs, however, be careful that you do it right. I grossly miscalculated tonight at dinner (so much so that I must have been distracted while bolusing, because I only bolused for about 30% of the meal I was eating), and ended up very high (high teens), and it's harder to correct a mistake like that than to make sure you don't make it in the first place. Many people pre-bolus with their meals (take their insulin 20-30 minutes before eating), because Humalog does not peak for about an hour and a half to two hours in most people and this allows it to better match the carbohydrates which are usually broken down a lot faster than even fast acting insulin can work. Pre-bolusing can help a lot reducing spikes, but you shouldn't pre-bolus if you are low to begin with. Some people also count protein in addition to carbohydrates, and some even fat, especially if they can use the extended and combination bolus features on a pump, but this gets beyond my experience. Also, in addition to high blood sugars causing complications, there is beginning to be evidence that glucose variability also has a large role to play. There is a *lot* more information about these types of techniques in Walsh's book, which I am scanning. Jen carb effect on blood glucose All diabetics should know how carbohydrates affect their blood sugar level or glucose level. All carbohydrates consumed are converted into the simplest sugar glucose, which is utilized by the body for energy fuel. The conversion rate for carbohydrates into glucose is practically 100%. In other words all the carbohydrates consumed are converted by the liver into glucose, the fuel that runs all of the body systems including organs, nerves, muscles, bones and tendons. Excess glucose in the blood stream not used to fuel the bodily processes are converted into fat with the storage hormone insulin, which is also used to deliver glucose to every cell in the body. Insulin is the deliverer of glucose. Without insulin glucose would not be sent to each cell. Without insulin the cell would die. On the other hand if too much glucose is in the blood stream, meaning high bs levels, it causes the rate of glycation to rapidly increase and the excessive glucose is stuck on the red blood cell in the form of sorbitol. This prevents the red blood cell from transporting oxygen to the body cells, starving them of this vital nutrient. In effect the red blood cell is now dead. Remember high blood glucose levels is the primary cause of diabetic complications. Without oxygen the cells will slowly die. In other words high bs levels cause internal suffocation at a higher rate of the bodily tissues and organs. Besides carbohydrates, there are two more sources of glucose available. Protein is converted to glucose at a conversion of approximately 60%. . This means for every 100 grams of protein consumed about 60 grams of it is converted to glucose. About 10% of fat consumed is converted to glucose. While all three sources fat, protein and carbohydrates provide glucose for the body, the most dramatic rise in the bs level is always accompanied and mostly affected by the consumption of carbohydrates. Each individual diabetic can perform a simple experiment to know almost exactly how many bs points will be raised by a single consumed gram of carbohydrate. Knowing this fact about yourself can predict very closely what your bs point level will be two hours after consuming carbs, provided one accurately counts the number of grams of carbs consumed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 Insulin resistance does change the bs level quite a bit for me. How one gram of carb affects one's bs level can only be determined by experimentation. After many experiments I have determined that 1 gram of carb raises my bs level 7.25-7.50 points on average, which is much higher than the the 3.0 points in Walsh's chart for a 190 pound person. Also consumption of large amounts of fat delays the metabolism time of carbs, and this causes the bs to spike higher much later than the researched time of 72minutes plus or minus 25 minutes. One's bs usually spikes with carb consumption alone later in 47-97 minutes. For practical purposes this usually means one's bs level will spike around an hour or an hour and a half later after eating. This is not so if one consumes large amounts of fat or drink large quantities of alcohol. This is why I eat and drink, then I calculate the amount of carbs consumed, then inject Humalog insulin afterwards, since the peak action of injected Humalog occurs around an hour to an hour and a half later after injecrtion. While recorded guidelines are helpful, if one really wants to know the effect of carb consumption, only experimentation can reveal actual effects on one's bs levels. carb effect on blood glucose All diabetics should know how carbohydrates affect their blood sugar level or glucose level. All carbohydrates consumed are converted into the simplest sugar glucose, which is utilized by the body for energy fuel. The conversion rate for carbohydrates into glucose is practically 100%. In other words all the carbohydrates consumed are converted by the liver into glucose, the fuel that runs all of the body systems including organs, nerves, muscles, bones and tendons. Excess glucose in the blood stream not used to fuel the bodily processes are converted into fat with the storage hormone insulin, which is also used to deliver glucose to every cell in the body. Insulin is the deliverer of glucose. Without insulin glucose would not be sent to each cell. Without insulin the cell would die. On the other hand if too much glucose is in the blood stream, meaning high bs levels, it causes the rate of glycation to rapidly increase and the excessive glucose is stuck on the red blood cell in the form of sorbitol. This prevents the red blood cell from transporting oxygen to the body cells, starving them of this vital nutrient. In effect the red blood cell is now dead. Remember high blood glucose levels is the primary cause of diabetic complications. Without oxygen the cells will slowly die. In other words high bs levels cause internal suffocation at a higher rate of the bodily tissues and organs. Besides carbohydrates, there are two more sources of glucose available. Protein is converted to glucose at a conversion of approximately 60%. . This means for every 100 grams of protein consumed about 60 grams of it is converted to glucose. About 10% of fat consumed is converted to glucose. While all three sources fat, protein and carbohydrates provide glucose for the body, the most dramatic rise in the bs level is always accompanied and mostly affected by the consumption of carbohydrates. Each individual diabetic can perform a simple experiment to know almost exactly how many bs points will be raised by a single consumed gram of carbohydrate. Knowing this fact about yourself can predict very closely what your bs point level will be two hours after consuming carbs, provided one accurately counts the number of grams of carbs consumed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 The faster peak of carbs (an hour to an hour and a half) compared to the peak of Humalog (two hours for most people) is why some people take insulin before sitting down to a meal. Studies show that although Humalog appears in peak levels in the bloodstream after an hour, the peak effect on blood sugar occurs at two hours (Lilly, however, cites the one hour peak to make it appear faster-acting than it really is). You can go to http://www.diabetesnet.com/diabetes_treatments/insulin_kin_dyn.php to read about this difference. You just have to be careful not to take insulin and then forget to eat, as this would casue a low. To deal with the delaying effect of fat on absorption, when I was on shots I used to split the dose and take about 80% before eating and then 20% an hour to two hours later. This would work well for the short term but if I ate a dinner high in fat I frequently used to experience highs in the morning (even higher than my " normal " highs). With the pump I've found I can use a combination bolus, which gives part of the insulin immediately like a shot and then spreads the rest of the dose out over an extended period of time, over a four hour period, combined with a temporary increase in basal rate for six hours before bed if it's been dinner, works well. Jen carb effect on blood glucose All diabetics should know how carbohydrates affect their blood sugar level or glucose level. All carbohydrates consumed are converted into the simplest sugar glucose, which is utilized by the body for energy fuel. The conversion rate for carbohydrates into glucose is practically 100%. In other words all the carbohydrates consumed are converted by the liver into glucose, the fuel that runs all of the body systems including organs, nerves, muscles, bones and tendons. Excess glucose in the blood stream not used to fuel the bodily processes are converted into fat with the storage hormone insulin, which is also used to deliver glucose to every cell in the body. Insulin is the deliverer of glucose. Without insulin glucose would not be sent to each cell. Without insulin the cell would die. On the other hand if too much glucose is in the blood stream, meaning high bs levels, it causes the rate of glycation to rapidly increase and the excessive glucose is stuck on the red blood cell in the form of sorbitol. This prevents the red blood cell from transporting oxygen to the body cells, starving them of this vital nutrient. In effect the red blood cell is now dead. Remember high blood glucose levels is the primary cause of diabetic complications. Without oxygen the cells will slowly die. In other words high bs levels cause internal suffocation at a higher rate of the bodily tissues and organs. Besides carbohydrates, there are two more sources of glucose available. Protein is converted to glucose at a conversion of approximately 60%. . This means for every 100 grams of protein consumed about 60 grams of it is converted to glucose. About 10% of fat consumed is converted to glucose. While all three sources fat, protein and carbohydrates provide glucose for the body, the most dramatic rise in the bs level is always accompanied and mostly affected by the consumption of carbohydrates. Each individual diabetic can perform a simple experiment to know almost exactly how many bs points will be raised by a single consumed gram of carbohydrate. Knowing this fact about yourself can predict very closely what your bs point level will be two hours after consuming carbs, provided one accurately counts the number of grams of carbs consumed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 In talking about taking dosages before eating, I have wondered for those of us who are type 2 and take a combination of Metformin and Glyburide, if it's better to take these before a meal or after one, or whether it makes any real difference. For the most part I've been taking mine after a meal but then I find I have to wait until 2-1/2 hours to get an accurate post prandial reading. When I am finally assigned an endocrinologist up here in our new area I will ask him for his opinion on this but was curious to see what listers think on this. BTW, while I'm here, anyone have any experience here with Scan medical coverage? I signed up for Scan after some giant fiascos with Secure Horizons forced me to change, and it took Scan no time in getting our cards and necessary info packets out, giving me a thus far favorable impression about them. We had signed up for Secure Horizons at the end of 2006 and it took them forever to get our cards out. Then we moved in February so would have to change plans which should have been no big deal, but Secure Horizons never got it right, never got our new cards out and left us in limbo after repeated calls and promises that they'll take care of it. Three mistakes in a row for them, they're history for us. Just hope Scan is better. Now that we are covered I can finally hook up with our GP and get referrals for other specialists I need to see regularly. Even though not under a doc's care right now I'm doing fine, sugars are staying fine, and as an added bonus, I don't know HOW but after not weighing myself since before our move here to the LA area, I've managed to lose 10 pounds and my sugars are getting staying better-regulated. Must be all the walking i do. I didn't even realize I was losing any weight but noticed I'm not as tired and that my sugars have better balance but was afraid for a long time to check my weight always fearing the worst. So that was a nice surprise. Bill Powers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 Hi Bill, I have been taking Metformin for a good many years, and I was advised at the time it was prescribe, to take it after each meal, according to the personal prescription. I could be wrong, but I think it states on the box, when it should be taken. Although, you should have been informed by both, your doctor and pharmacist. As for Glyburide,the other tablet, I can't answer, as I haven't taken that one. Rowe that Re: carb effect on blood glucose In talking about taking dosages before eating, I have wondered for those of us who are type 2 and take a combination of Metformin and Glyburide, if it's better to take these before a meal or after one, or whether it makes any real difference. For the most part I've been taking mine after a meal but then I find I have to wait until 2-1/2 hours to get an accurate post prandial reading. When I am finally assigned an endocrinologist up here in our new area I will ask him for his opinion on this but was curious to see what listers think on this. BTW, while I'm here, anyone have any experience here with Scan medical coverage? I signed up for Scan after some giant fiascos with Secure Horizons forced me to change, and it took Scan no time in getting our cards and necessary info packets out, giving me a thus far favorable impression about them. We had signed up for Secure Horizons at the end of 2006 and it took them forever to get our cards out. Then we moved in February so would have to change plans which should have been no big deal, but Secure Horizons never got it right, never got our new cards out and left us in limbo after repeated calls and promises that they'll take care of it. Three mistakes in a row for them, they're history for us. Just hope Scan is better. Now that we are covered I can finally hook up with our GP and get referrals for other specialists I need to see regularly. Even though not under a doc's care right now I'm doing fine, sugars are staying fine, and as an added bonus, I don't know HOW but after not weighing myself since before our move here to the LA area, I've managed to lose 10 pounds and my sugars are getting staying better-regulated. Must be all the walking i do. I didn't even realize I was losing any weight but noticed I'm not as tired and that my sugars have better balance but was afraid for a long time to check my weight always fearing the worst. So that was a nice surprise. Bill Powers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 6, 2007 Report Share Posted April 6, 2007 Bill I take Metformin and Glyburide. When I was first put on these meds I was told to take the Glyburide and Metformin about 15 minutes apart in the morning and then eat breakfast about 20 minutes after taking the second pill. I take nothing before lunch but take another Metformin about a half hour before dinner. I do have a friend who says he takes his pills after eating, and that seems to work for him. So obviously different doctors give different advice. Becky _____ From: blind-diabetics [mailto:blind-diabetics ] On Behalf Of Bill Powers Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2007 12:17 PM To: blind-diabetics Subject: Re: carb effect on blood glucose In talking about taking dosages before eating, I have wondered for those of us who are type 2 and take a combination of Metformin and Glyburide, if it's better to take these before a meal or after one, or whether it makes any real difference. For the most part I've been taking mine after a meal but then I find I have to wait until 2-1/2 hours to get an accurate post prandial reading. When I am finally assigned an endocrinologist up here in our new area I will ask him for his opinion on this but was curious to see what listers think on this. BTW, while I'm here, anyone have any experience here with Scan medical coverage? I signed up for Scan after some giant fiascos with Secure Horizons forced me to change, and it took Scan no time in getting our cards and necessary info packets out, giving me a thus far favorable impression about them. We had signed up for Secure Horizons at the end of 2006 and it took them forever to get our cards out. Then we moved in February so would have to change plans which should have been no big deal, but Secure Horizons never got it right, never got our new cards out and left us in limbo after repeated calls and promises that they'll take care of it. Three mistakes in a row for them, they're history for us. Just hope Scan is better. Now that we are covered I can finally hook up with our GP and get referrals for other specialists I need to see regularly. Even though not under a doc's care right now I'm doing fine, sugars are staying fine, and as an added bonus, I don't know HOW but after not weighing myself since before our move here to the LA area, I've managed to lose 10 pounds and my sugars are getting staying better-regulated. Must be all the walking i do. I didn't even realize I was losing any weight but noticed I'm not as tired and that my sugars have better balance but was afraid for a long time to check my weight always fearing the worst. So that was a nice surprise. Bill Powers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 6, 2007 Report Share Posted April 6, 2007 Thanks Becky, for your post. Very interesting that there can be such variances in prescribing Metformin and Glyburide, some taking them after meals, some spacing 15 minutes apart, etc. I've never heard of doing the latter but the doc must have had some reason for prescribing it that way. My prescription doesn't indicate that, just says " take 1 tablet with each meal and at bedtime " for the Metformin, take twice daily for the Glyburide though it does not specify when. Bill Powers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 6, 2007 Report Share Posted April 6, 2007 Hi Bill, I take metformin, and I always take it before a meal, just before! I find that works best. At first the doctor told me to take it half hour before a meal, but that didn't work at all. It seems to take about half an hour to release. Re: carb effect on blood glucose In talking about taking dosages before eating, I have wondered for those of us who are type 2 and take a combination of Metformin and Glyburide, if it's better to take these before a meal or after one, or whether it makes any real difference. For the most part I've been taking mine after a meal but then I find I have to wait until 2-1/2 hours to get an accurate post prandial reading. When I am finally assigned an endocrinologist up here in our new area I will ask him for his opinion on this but was curious to see what listers think on this. BTW, while I'm here, anyone have any experience here with Scan medical coverage? I signed up for Scan after some giant fiascos with Secure Horizons forced me to change, and it took Scan no time in getting our cards and necessary info packets out, giving me a thus far favorable impression about them. We had signed up for Secure Horizons at the end of 2006 and it took them forever to get our cards out. Then we moved in February so would have to change plans which should have been no big deal, but Secure Horizons never got it right, never got our new cards out and left us in limbo after repeated calls and promises that they'll take care of it. Three mistakes in a row for them, they're history for us. Just hope Scan is better. Now that we are covered I can finally hook up with our GP and get referrals for other specialists I need to see regularly. Even though not under a doc's care right now I'm doing fine, sugars are staying fine, and as an added bonus, I don't know HOW but after not weighing myself since before our move here to the LA area, I've managed to lose 10 pounds and my sugars are getting staying better-regulated. Must be all the walking i do. I didn't even realize I was losing any weight but noticed I'm not as tired and that my sugars have better balance but was afraid for a long time to check my weight always fearing the worst. So that was a nice surprise. Bill Powers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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