Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 Trixxi: I considered myself a sex addict for a time and I am not gay, but my ex was bi-leaning towards gay or asexual. I had to somehow rationalize why I wanted sex more than he did (2x per month). Did the whole " questionnaire " and comparison thing with my so-called " friends " in AA. In the end, I simply found a sexual match. He's ready whenever I am and vice-versa. So much for my " addiction " butterbean-@... wrote: original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10012 > I think using the term " honest program " to be verbally tactless has to be > one of the stupidest excuses for some cretin to say anything he/she wants, > without disregard for others. > Just another AA slogan bent way out of proportion LIKE EVERY OTHER 12 STEP > SLOGAN. > Yeck! Never again..... > Oh, and as far as G/L/B/T geared 12-step centers are concerned, Pride > Institute in (WHAT A SHOCK) Eden Prairie, MN was the LAST 12-step hell hotel > I will EVER stick my foot into. They don't just find you as a druggie or a > drunk, they go WAY out of their minds to find other things like " SEX > ADDICTION " . Needless to say, alot of gays are promiscuous...it's part of > the nature of gay culture. But good ol' Pride Institute will slap a " sex > addict " label on you REAL quick if they find out about 'cruising' and > 'non-monogamous' behavior. > SO - no more partying, no more " sex for fun " ...what the hell is there to > do....??? > Go to a #$%! meeting and hug everyone that you REALLY want to go jump in the > sack with! > HA! > ~Trixxi > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 Whatever happened to defining things as a passion? Was Michelangelo a sculpting addict? Was Edgar Poe addicted to writing? Is Martha addicted to crafts? When I recontextualized my " addictions " to passions, the attached guilt went away, and I was able to enjoy them once again. Apple " wendy rose " wrote: original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10015 > Trixxi: > > I considered myself a sex addict for a time and I am not gay, but my ex > was bi-leaning towards gay or asexual. I had to somehow rationalize > why I wanted sex more than he did (2x per month). Did the whole > " questionnaire " and comparison thing with my so-called " friends " in AA. > > In the end, I simply found a sexual match. He's ready whenever I am > and vice-versa. So much for my " addiction " > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 Apple: My address is PO Box 82442 Albuquerque, New Mexico 87198!!!!! Where can I send you a check? I can't wait to start " sticking around " meetings again. Oh boy, oh boy, you have made my day! Let's go! Kathy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 Apple: Well said ! I have found being passionate is healthy providing the object of my passion is one that is not self-defeating. Some say that I traded my drug addiction in for a running addiction. Bullshit! Re: " Honest Program " > Whatever happened to defining things as a passion? Was Michelangelo a > sculpting addict? Was Edgar Poe addicted to writing? Is Martha > addicted to crafts? When I recontextualized my " addictions " to > passions, the attached guilt went away, and I was able to enjoy them > once again. > Apple > > " wendy rose " wrote: > original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10015 > > Trixxi: > > > > I considered myself a sex addict for a time and I am not gay, but my > ex > > was bi-leaning towards gay or asexual. I had to somehow rationalize > > why I wanted sex more than he did (2x per month). Did the whole > > " questionnaire " and comparison thing with my so-called " friends " in > AA. > > > > In the end, I simply found a sexual match. He's ready whenever I am > > and vice-versa. So much for my " addiction " > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -- Talk to your group with your own voice! > -- /VoiceChatPage?listName=12-step-free & m=1 > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 I agree. I spend NUMEROUS hours online and have heard rumors of " internet addication " b.s. but if I didn't have this p.c. I would be REAL tempted to stroll off someplace potentially dangerous due to boredom. ~Trixxi Re: " Honest Program " > > > > Whatever happened to defining things as a passion? Was Michelangelo a > > sculpting addict? Was Edgar Poe addicted to writing? Is Martha > > addicted to crafts? When I recontextualized my " addictions " to > > passions, the attached guilt went away, and I was able to enjoy them > > once again. > > Apple > > > > " wendy rose " wrote: > > original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10015 > > > Trixxi: > > > > > > I considered myself a sex addict for a time and I am not gay, but my > > ex > > > was bi-leaning towards gay or asexual. I had to somehow rationalize > > > why I wanted sex more than he did (2x per month). Did the whole > > > " questionnaire " and comparison thing with my so-called " friends " in > > AA. > > > > > > In the end, I simply found a sexual match. He's ready whenever I am > > > and vice-versa. So much for my " addiction " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > -- Talk to your group with your own voice! > > -- /VoiceChatPage?listName=12-step-free & m=1 > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -- Create a poll/survey for your group! > -- /vote?listname=12-step-free & m=1 > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 " apple " wrote: original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10022 > Whatever happened to defining things as a passion? Was Michelangelo a > sculpting addict? Was Edgar Poe addicted to writing? Is Martha > addicted to crafts? When I recontextualized my " addictions " to > passions, the attached guilt went away, and I was able to enjoy them > once again. > Apple > Golden Delicious Apple: Yes indeed. When I was checking out my former hospital's bullshit website, I clicked on the link to Media Anonymous. God, those people are creepy! " We are powerless over media... " They define media as just about anything from Dungeons and Dragons to the internet to novels, probably Etch-a-Sketches as well. I wonder if they get up at meetings and say, " By the grace of God and the program of Media Anonymous, I haven't read anything or had any new ideas for 10 years, 6 months and 13 days! " By the way, do they have the " Washington Apple Guy " commercials where you are? I find them rather disturbing. Didn't have them in Texas and when I got here to California to get away from my junkie associates, I got this icky feeling from seeing that fat guy riding around on his moped giving apples to lethargic people. But after 8 months, I've gotten to tolerate them fairly well. Crunch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 " james klingbeil " wrote: original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10029 > Apple: > > Well said ! I have found being passionate is healthy providing the object > of my passion is one that is not self-defeating. Some say that I traded my > drug addiction in for a running addiction. > Bullshit! I'm a passionate runner too ! In fact, I'm running my first ten miler on Saturday. The Hot Chocolate Ten Miler to be exact, sponsored by the New York Road Runner's Club. Race is in Central Park, NYC. (the Big Apple) By the way, the DECALS CAME IN!!!! THEY LOOK GREAT!!!! I HAVE 4000 OF THEM... E-MAIL ME YOUR ADDRESSES FOLKS. I have yours . Apple Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 nope, never seen 'em. Sounds pretty strange tho. Apple > > By the way, do they have the " Washington Apple Guy " commercials where > you are? I find them rather disturbing. Didn't have them in Texas and > when I got here to California to get away from my junkie associates, I > got this icky feeling from seeing that fat guy riding around on his > moped giving apples to lethargic people. But after 8 months, I've > gotten to tolerate them fairly well. Crunch! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 Decals? What do they say??? ~Trixxi Re: " Honest Program " > " james klingbeil " wrote: > original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10029 > > Apple: > > > > Well said ! I have found being passionate is healthy providing the > object > > of my passion is one that is not self-defeating. Some say that I > traded my > > drug addiction in for a running addiction. > > Bullshit! > > I'm a passionate runner too ! In fact, I'm running my first ten > miler on Saturday. The Hot Chocolate Ten Miler to be exact, sponsored > by the New York Road Runner's Club. Race is in Central Park, NYC. (the > Big Apple) > > By the way, the DECALS CAME IN!!!! THEY LOOK GREAT!!!! I HAVE 4000 OF > THEM... E-MAIL ME YOUR ADDRESSES FOLKS. I have yours . > Apple > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > A Proud Member of the One & Only Associate Network > http://clickhere./click/1709 > > eGroups.com Home: /group/12-step-free/ > - Simplifying group communications > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 Get Honest! God I hate that term. It simply means your not telling me what I want to hear therefore your not being honest. They define whats honest and not you. If you knew how many lies Ive told because I was told I wasnt being honest enough you would die. Louree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 Hi Trixxi, folks, The guy who runs the 12-step hell-hole I was in was also my sponsor for a long time, and when I first met him, he insisted I was " more homosexual than heterosexual " , based on a few meetings and his " feelings " - something he later changed his mind about when I started to fall in love with all the skinny anorexic girls I met in OA. He insisted that I shouldn't be bothered about this because it was " genetic " like his beloved hobby horse, " addictive disease " . Later, he forged an alliance with psychiatrist Glasser, creator of " Reality Therapy " . the stted views of Glasser I contend flatly contradict those of the whole 12-step/disease model juggernaut, but it seems to be commonplace with nutty shrinks that they are able to reconcile what are in reality irreconciable views if they value a professional friendship highly enough. Glasser insists that homosexuality is not a mentally healthy lifestyle and insists thay gay patients should be encouraged to be more " masculine " , which to him means not be gay (and conversely for lesbians), and my ex-sponsor has apparently adopted this view with his inmates. I met a lawyer the other day, American , I am happy to report, who seems to be making a apeciality of suing my ex-sponsor; apparently a former patient is suing on the basis of my ex-sponsor's heterosexist techniques. Pete butterbean-@... wrote: original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10012 > I think using the term " honest program " to be verbally tactless has to be > one of the stupidest excuses for some cretin to say anything he/she wants, > without disregard for others. > Just another AA slogan bent way out of proportion LIKE EVERY OTHER 12 STEP > SLOGAN. > Yeck! Never again..... > Oh, and as far as G/L/B/T geared 12-step centers are concerned, Pride > Institute in (WHAT A SHOCK) Eden Prairie, MN was the LAST 12-step hell hotel > I will EVER stick my foot into. They don't just find you as a druggie or a > drunk, they go WAY out of their minds to find other things like " SEX > ADDICTION " . Needless to say, alot of gays are promiscuous...it's part of > the nature of gay culture. But good ol' Pride Institute will slap a " sex > addict " label on you REAL quick if they find out about 'cruising' and > 'non-monogamous' behavior. > SO - no more partying, no more " sex for fun " ...what the hell is there to > do....??? > Go to a #$%! meeting and hug everyone that you REALLY want to go jump in the > sack with! > HA! > ~Trixxi > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 1999 Report Share Posted December 2, 1999 Right on, and thanks for saying this! Sometimes it seems like we are in the middle of a " cultural wave " in which Puritanism is coming back disguised as (pseudo-)scientific addiction talk. (Puritanism: the haunting fear that somebody, somewhere, might be having a good time -- as Ambrose Bierce put it, approximately.) Instead of " Don't do that, you'll go to hell " it's " Don't do that, you'll lose control. " And it's quite noticeable that what is considered addictive changes over time, with changing fashions in personal morality. For example, Stanton Peele's first book " Love and Addiction " (1975) was mostly about relationships that are too monogamous -- too exclusive! And people actually worried about " workaholism " back then, and being addicted to the empty pursuit of material goods. Imagine that! Probably all sounds rather quaint to you kids :-) --wally -----Original Message----- >Whatever happened to defining things as a passion? Was Michelangelo a >sculpting addict? Was Edgar Poe addicted to writing? Is Martha > addicted to crafts? When I recontextualized my " addictions " to >passions, the attached guilt went away, and I was able to enjoy them >once again. >Apple > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 1999 Report Share Posted December 3, 1999 butterbean-@... wrote: original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10041 > Decals? What do they say??? > ~Trixxi The decals are four inch round vinyl stickers with a protective coating. The adhesive is the super sticky kind. (hard to peel off). It's a blue background with white edge, and a white edged triangle inside. (The AA logo). Inside and just below the triangle in slightly lighter blue (so it's subtle) is the message: Some things about The Program never felt quite right. (now I know why!) www.AAdeprogramming.com Apple Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 1999 Report Share Posted December 3, 1999 There will be " suggested dontation " instructions inside the package, as well as fun prankster tips. For example, sticking them in strange places, like the middle of the woods, so steppers who may find it think THEIR HIGHER POWER put it there! There are no coincidences! ha ha ha... , hey, what is your last name, or should I just send it to Kathy? Sounds kinda Twelve Step Free Anonymous. Please send it too, maybe go to my site and send it to that address. Apple balihai33-@... wrote: original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10044 > Apple: My address is PO Box 82442 Albuquerque, New Mexico 87198!!!!! Where > can I send you a check? I can't wait to start " sticking around " meetings > again. Oh boy, oh boy, you have made my day! Let's go! Kathy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 1999 Report Share Posted December 3, 1999 Apple: My address is P.O. Box 448 Sheridan WY 82801. Please send me a few as well. Thanks. Since Wyoming only has a total pop. of 475k, that many stickers will work just fine :-----) Thanks Original Message ----- To: <12-step-freeegroups> Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 9:28 PM Subject: Re: " Honest Program " > Apple: My address is PO Box 82442 Albuquerque, New Mexico 87198!!!!! Where > can I send you a check? I can't wait to start " sticking around " meetings > again. Oh boy, oh boy, you have made my day! Let's go! Kathy > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > A Proud Member of the One & Only Associate Network > http://clickhere./click/1709 > > -- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar! > -- /cal?listname=12-step-free & m=1 > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 1999 Report Share Posted December 3, 1999 I like that word *passion* Works very well in defining my feelings in my relationship. Sounds, warm, inviting and comfortable-PERFECT! No guilt here! Thanks! " apple " wrote: original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10022 > Whatever happened to defining things as a passion? Was Michelangelo a > sculpting addict? Was Edgar Poe addicted to writing? Is Martha > addicted to crafts? When I recontextualized my " addictions " to > passions, the attached guilt went away, and I was able to enjoy them > once again. > Apple > > " wendy rose " wrote: > original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=100 15 > > Trixxi: > > > > I considered myself a sex addict for a time and I am not gay, but my > ex > > was bi-leaning towards gay or asexual. I had to somehow rationalize > > why I wanted sex more than he did (2x per month). Did the whole > > " questionnaire " and comparison thing with my so-called " friends " in > AA. > > > > In the end, I simply found a sexual match. He's ready whenever I am > > and vice-versa. So much for my " addiction " > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 1999 Report Share Posted December 3, 1999 Hey, I'll buy some of them from you! How much do they cost? ~Trixxi Re: " Honest Program " > butterbean-@... wrote: > original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10041 > > Decals? What do they say??? > > ~Trixxi > > The decals are four inch round vinyl stickers with a protective > coating. The adhesive is the super sticky kind. (hard to peel off). > It's a blue background with white edge, and a white edged triangle > inside. (The AA logo). Inside and just below the triangle in slightly > lighter blue (so it's subtle) is the message: > > Some things about The Program never felt quite right. > > (now I know why!) > > www.AAdeprogramming.com > > > Apple > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -- Talk to your group with your own voice! > -- /VoiceChatPage?listName=12-step-free & m=1 > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 1999 Report Share Posted December 3, 1999 Cheap. I haven't figured out the price yet. Will get to it next week. I plan to send them in batches of 20 ea. Send me your address if you want 'em. Apple butterbean-@... wrote: original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10067 > Hey, I'll buy some of them from you! How much do they cost? > ~Trixxi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 1999 Report Share Posted December 3, 1999 One of my " favorite " meetings (being that it was the one that probably more than any other led me eventually to leave) was " Q & A Night, " when everyone present would write down questions and give them to the chairperson, who would ask them one by one and people who had been around awhile would usually answer them. Never have I heard more bullshitty, evasive, retarded " answers " to questions than in that meeting. I have found it disturbing that out of the @100 people who attended there, almost every single one of them bought the program party line wholesale, believing it like the planet under their feet. There were people who had been there for years, and some even were critical of " the bullshit " (and there certainly was plenty of it) but still they stayed, endlessly following sponsor's orders, believing wholeheartedly that they would surely die if they left. I guess sentences like " we are like men who have lost their legs--they never grow new ones " are effective brainwashing tools. I'm pretty angry about all the time and energy I wasted on all that crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 4, 1999 Report Share Posted December 4, 1999 it is brainwashing. its all a system of limiting your world and choices you believe you make for yourself. if you can make some stay in your group, (even if they dont enjoy being there any longer) all because they have been told they will kill themselves, go to jail, die, or be institutionalized if they choose to leave, thats a very powerful tool any cult would be proud to have. than to top it off, they teach you cant believe in your own thinking. all very sick. and of course when people leave, they are wigged out because they have never been taught or learned in ANY AA meeting ever held (or been told they COULD learn) how to be self respecting, self responsible, and self sufficient and still choose to be sober. if a jinx to et them up for failure, guarantee it by not providing the skill to survive without them or acknowledge that that ability exists dave .. eudaimon8413311-@... wrote: original article:/group/12-step-free/?start=10089 > One of my " favorite " meetings (being that it was the one that probably more > than any other led me eventually to leave) was " Q & A Night, " when everyone > present would write down questions and give them to the chairperson, who > would ask them one by one and people who had been around awhile would usually > answer them. Never have I heard more bullshitty, evasive, retarded " answers " > to questions than in that meeting. I have found it disturbing that out of the > @100 people who attended there, almost every single one of them bought the > program party line wholesale, believing it like the planet under their feet. > There were people who had been there for years, and some even were critical > of " the bullshit " (and there certainly was plenty of it) but still they > stayed, endlessly following sponsor's orders, believing wholeheartedly that > they would surely die if they left. I guess sentences like " we are like men > who have lost their legs--they never grow new ones " are effective > brainwashing tools. I'm pretty angry about all the time and energy I wasted > on all that crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 4, 1999 Report Share Posted December 4, 1999 In regards to my NUMEROUS incarcerations in 12-step Hell Hotels, I NEVER EVER bothered to get a sponsor. I just always thought " why in blazes do I need yet ANOTHER idiot bitching at me for whatever I was or was not doing? " ACTUALLY the honest thing is that I really never took the 12-step propeganda seriously. I " used " to think things like " why in #$! don't I buy this treatment " and " why do I think 12 step meetings are more boring than reading the telephone book? " . Well, being on this list has pretty much answered those questions. ~Trixxi Re: " Honest Program " > One of my " favorite " meetings (being that it was the one that probably more > than any other led me eventually to leave) was " Q & A Night, " when everyone > present would write down questions and give them to the chairperson, who > would ask them one by one and people who had been around awhile would usually > answer them. Never have I heard more bullshitty, evasive, retarded " answers " > to questions than in that meeting. I have found it disturbing that out of the > @100 people who attended there, almost every single one of them bought the > program party line wholesale, believing it like the planet under their feet. > There were people who had been there for years, and some even were critical > of " the bullshit " (and there certainly was plenty of it) but still they > stayed, endlessly following sponsor's orders, believing wholeheartedly that > they would surely die if they left. I guess sentences like " we are like men > who have lost their legs--they never grow new ones " are effective > brainwashing tools. I'm pretty angry about all the time and energy I wasted > on all that crap. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Get the most popular downloads on the Web. They¹re new! > They¹re hot! They're FREE! Utilities, drivers, games. > It's all here. http://clickhere./click/1613 > > > -- Create a poll/survey for your group! > -- /vote?listname=12-step-free & m=1 > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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