Re: Things that make you go Hmmmm....

[Guest guest]

Me again,

Who's got more opinions then me anyway? I think genetic engineering to

cure diseases and stop pain and suffering is great. As far as stem cell

research I'm for that too. I don't think anyone is deliberately getting

pregnant just to " raise " stem cells. As unfortunate as abortion is, I

agree, taking stem cells from a discarded fetus is the same as an organ

donor. And should be allowed legally. I say legally because I know

outside US boarders this type of research does take place.

JD in " sweating to the hits " in AZ

On Wed, 20 Jun 2001 15:28:39 -0700 " Mark Sarmac "

writes:

> Earlier also we had a brief discussion on cloning and making

> " designer

> babies " now I'm curious, since genetic engineering does sound like

> it's

> going to eradicate NF2, why shouldn't we be for it? If a couple,

> both

> plagued with NF2, want to have a child and have the means to have a

> child

> WITHOUT NF2 because of genetic engineering, why not?

>

> Again, I'm curious to know what you all think about that.

> Mark

>

>

> ----Original Message Follows----

> From: cinnyd@...

> Reply-To: NF2_Crew

> To: NF2_Crew

> Subject: RE: Things that make you go " Hmmmm.... "

> Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 15:19:46 US/Eastern

>

> excellent topic mark!! I read an article about an alternative way

> of

> getting

> those cells but I havent a clue to what it was, dang it. ok, my

> opinion is

> while i am not pro abortion, it is legal, it does occur, taking the

> cells of

> a

> fetus that wud otherwise be 'thrown away " (man that is hard to

> think abt)

> is

> not much different than donating an organ to save a life. in other

> words,

> some

> good for mankind cud come from it. twud be nice if there wereno

> aborted

> fetus

> available but that will neverbe the case.

>

>

>

>

>

> Glad someone mentioned abortion cuz it's a topic I want to see a

> discussion

> > in here. Stem-cells maybe a viable treatment or a cure for us,

> but they

> need

> > to extract them from aborted fetusus' (plural: feti?) Anyways,

> I'm just

> > curious to know what people think here. IMHO (In My Humble

> Opinion) since

> > the fetus is unwanted anyways and is discarded, why not use it's

> cells

> for a

> > better purpose? But then, who are we to choose one life over

> another?

> What

> > do you all think?

> >

> > Just curious,

> > Mark

> >

> >

> > ----Original Message Follows----

> >

> > Reply-To: NF2_Crew

> > To: NF2_Crew

> > Subject: RE: just funning ya

> > Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 11:12:26 -0700

> >

> > Cool!! How about we start it off with Abortion, then spring into

> Gun

> > control. then we could take a huge portion of affirmative action.

> >

> >

> > Now that our relisious 'discussion' hassimmered down with all

> parties

> > calling a

> > truce, anyone care to discuss politics ? hehehe

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

I think that was...Mark and nne Cambell, from...I thought it was NY maybe not. ?

PS I think they dropped off the crew, or are very quiet )

[Guest guest]

I agree Marie. Oregon has had a physician assisted suicide on the ballot, 3

times now. I bet that raises a lot of eyebrows too.~~Lowi

Re: Things that make you go " Hmmmm.... "

[Guest guest]

I've only been on the crew since November, but I seem to remember a couple

who posted from WA or MD who had a baby that was tested for NF2 prior to the

fertilized egg being implanted in the uterus. The terminology is not

correct, I'm sure, but I've never claimed to be a scientist. Anyhow, I bet

someone else remembers this a lot better and could share the information

with us.

My own opinion:

I never had an opinion on genetics testing/engineering until October 2, 2000

(D-Day) when my 13 year old son was diagnosed. Now I am very interested in

seeing a cure for any/all genetics disorders ASAP. I don't know how far

or to what extent! (I haven't thought about it that hard - it hurts my brain

to think that hard!!)

But for my boy, I'd lay down my life!!

[Guest guest]

Hey guys,

Stemcell research is being done from the umbilical cord, you know - the bit

that nobody wants after the baby is born. Ya that's right the bit they

through out into the rubbish bin.....

.....

RE: just funning ya

> >Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 11:12:26 -0700

> >

> >Cool!! How about we start it off with Abortion, then spring into Gun

> >control. then we could take a huge portion of affirmative action.

> >

> >

> >Now that our relisious 'discussion' hassimmered down with all parties

> >calling a

> >truce, anyone care to discuss politics ? hehehe

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

This post will upset some of you. If you are adamantly pro-abortion, you

may want to skip it. The subject was brought up, and I am responding. You

all know I have never given short answers. I'm into essay questions.

On the subject of abortion/stem cell research. The good news is that

there are hospitals now that are harvesting stem cells in their delivery

rooms these days after a live and healthy birth of a child. I know this

because my best friend has another friend who does this kind of work in a

very busy hospital in our area.

Now I'll come straight out and say I'm pro-life. 100%. I make no

apologies for it. That said, stop a second and thing about some questions on

this issue. If you do a search to find out about abortion clinic standards,

you'll find several articles that will gross you out. Stories of clinics

with such filth that if you took your pet there for healthcare, you would

probably go elsewhere. Stories of aborted babies being disposed of

improperly. Even a story or two about clinics selling aborted babies for

research or parts (this was amazingly reported a few years back on one of

those news programs like 20/20). You'll also find many articles discussing

the abortion industry's fight to prevent itself from being regulated as other

health clinics are. In some states, clinics claim an exception to the

established health regulations by calling themselves business offices.

Unless the regulation of this money-making industry becomes more standardized

and more enforced, you should probably question whether the stem cells that

might offer your treatment (or cure?) were harvested under poor sanitary

circumstances.

Also, stem cell research is pretty new. Since some percentage of

abortions are being done because the baby is suspected of or known to have a

" defect " (such as NF) and therefore unwanted, has anyone tested the stem

cells in some way to make certain the genetic problems are not in them as

well? I don't know if anyone has or not. Maybe someone has. If not, people

could be getting more than they bargained for.

Read some articles from people who got out of the abortion industry

because they just couldn't do it anymore and you'll find why you don't see

the programs on abortion clinics that you do on every other subject under the

sun. Ever wonder about that? It certainly isn't because the media is afraid

to invade women's privacy. They stuck microphones in the faces of people at

every major bombing and shooting in the last 20 or 30 years and asked them

questions like, " How do you feel about just seeing your child's body carried

out? " They don't report the truth about abortion because they are liberal

and believe in abortion rights.

I'm pro-life for many reasons. One of them is that Fred's mother

essentially told him a long time ago during a discussion we had on abortion

that if she had known he had NF2 she would have had an abortion. I happen to

think his life is worthwhile. We all think Hitler was such a monster. He

tried to form a perfect society by murdering everyone he felt was imperfect.

He began with the Jews, but he also decided that anyone with birth defects or

handicaps was unfit to live. If we abort our babies because we suspect or

even know that they have a defect, how are we different than he was? It

sounds to me like we're just creating our perfect little society one baby at

a time instead of having an evil government do it for us if we abort our weak

or genetically imperfect babies. Go back in your mind to Hitler's Germany

and tell me, how many of the people on this list and the people we love would

be alive under that regime? There would be no NF2Crew in his Germany.

The biggest reason I'm pro-life is that I believe life is a precious gift

from God and not something to be thrown back in His face because we didn't

get what we were expecting. (Anybody ever read that essay, " A trip to

Holland " ? If I had it I would post it here.) Every one of my children is a

blessing. The two with NF2 are no less precious than the one who does not

have it. I suspect many of you will say " AMEN " to that as it applies to you

and your children. I'll go now. God bless.

...Donna (Coming out of the shadows for the week but soon to go back

into lurking.)

[Guest guest]

I've read that too (Stem Cells can be done from the umbilical cord)

but, they say embryonic stem cells are much better.

Mark

----Original Message Follows----

Reply-To: NF2_Crew

To: <NF2_Crew >

Subject: Re: Things that make you go " Hmmmm.... "

Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 14:58:37 +1000

Hey guys,

Stemcell research is being done from the umbilical cord, you know - the bit

that nobody wants after the baby is born. Ya that's right the bit they

through out into the rubbish bin.....

.....

RE: just funning ya

> >Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 11:12:26 -0700

> >

> >Cool!! How about we start it off with Abortion, then spring into Gun

> >control. then we could take a huge portion of affirmative action.

> >

> >

> >Now that our relisious 'discussion' hassimmered down with all parties

> >calling a

> >truce, anyone care to discuss politics ? hehehe

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

TIME had the most interesting article and raised some provacative questions

about cloning ... one being, if you can clone a person once, why not 100 times?

100 Hitlers!!!!!!

Mark Sarmac wrote:

> Earlier also we had a brief discussion on cloning and making " designer

> babies " now I'm curious, since genetic engineering does sound like it's

> going to eradicate NF2, why shouldn't we be for it? If a couple, both

> plagued with NF2, want to have a child and have the means to have a child

> WITHOUT NF2 because of genetic engineering, why not?

>

> Again, I'm curious to know what you all think about that.

> Mark

>

> ----Original Message Follows----

> From: cinnyd@...

> Reply-To: NF2_Crew

> To: NF2_Crew

> Subject: RE: Things that make you go " Hmmmm.... "

> Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 15:19:46 US/Eastern

>

> excellent topic mark!! I read an article about an alternative way of

> getting

> those cells but I havent a clue to what it was, dang it. ok, my opinion is

> while i am not pro abortion, it is legal, it does occur, taking the cells of

> a

> fetus that wud otherwise be 'thrown away " (man that is hard to think abt)

> is

> not much different than donating an organ to save a life. in other words,

> some

> good for mankind cud come from it. twud be nice if there wereno aborted

> fetus

> available but that will neverbe the case.

>

> Glad someone mentioned abortion cuz it's a topic I want to see a discussion

> > in here. Stem-cells maybe a viable treatment or a cure for us, but they

> need

> > to extract them from aborted fetusus' (plural: feti?) Anyways, I'm just

> > curious to know what people think here. IMHO (In My Humble Opinion) since

> > the fetus is unwanted anyways and is discarded, why not use it's cells

> for a

> > better purpose? But then, who are we to choose one life over another?

> What

> > do you all think?

> >

> > Just curious,

> > Mark

> >

> >

> > ----Original Message Follows----

> >

> > Reply-To: NF2_Crew

> > To: NF2_Crew

> > Subject: RE: just funning ya

> > Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 11:12:26 -0700

> >

> > Cool!! How about we start it off with Abortion, then spring into Gun

> > control. then we could take a huge portion of affirmative action.

> >

> >

> > Now that our relisious 'discussion' hassimmered down with all parties

> > calling a

> > truce, anyone care to discuss politics ? hehehe

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

AMEN CRYSTALBUZZ!!!! You have to re-teach a " Hitler clone " to have these

sadistic, malicious, personalities.

----Original Message Follows----

Reply-To: NF2_Crew

To: NF2_Crew

Subject: RE: Things that make you go " Hmmmm.... "

Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 22:07:44 -0700

Twind are basicly clones. and they definatly have diffrent personalities.

There might be 100 hitler bodies but only the origional has the hitler

personality.

TIME had the most interesting article and raised some provacative questions

about cloning ... one being, if you can clone a person once, why not 100

times?

100 Hitlers!!!!!!

Mark Sarmac wrote:

> Earlier also we had a brief discussion on cloning and making " designer

> babies " now I'm curious, since genetic engineering does sound like it's

> going to eradicate NF2, why shouldn't we be for it? If a couple, both

> plagued with NF2, want to have a child and have the means to have a child

> WITHOUT NF2 because of genetic engineering, why not?

>

> Again, I'm curious to know what you all think about that.

> Mark

>

> ----Original Message Follows----

> From: cinnyd@...

> Reply-To: NF2_Crew

> To: NF2_Crew

> Subject: RE: Things that make you go " Hmmmm.... "

> Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 15:19:46 US/Eastern

>

> excellent topic mark!! I read an article about an alternative way of

> getting

> those cells but I havent a clue to what it was, dang it. ok, my opinion

is

> while i am not pro abortion, it is legal, it does occur, taking the cells

of

> a

> fetus that wud otherwise be 'thrown away " (man that is hard to think

abt)

> is

> not much different than donating an organ to save a life. in other words,

> some

> good for mankind cud come from it. twud be nice if there wereno aborted

> fetus

> available but that will neverbe the case.

>

> Glad someone mentioned abortion cuz it's a topic I want to see a

discussion

> > in here. Stem-cells maybe a viable treatment or a cure for us, but

they

> need

> > to extract them from aborted fetusus' (plural: feti?) Anyways, I'm

just

> > curious to know what people think here. IMHO (In My Humble Opinion)

since

> > the fetus is unwanted anyways and is discarded, why not use it's cells

> for a

> > better purpose? But then, who are we to choose one life over another?

> What

> > do you all think?

> >

> > Just curious,

> > Mark

> >

> >

> > ----Original Message Follows----

> >

> > Reply-To: NF2_Crew

> > To: NF2_Crew

> > Subject: RE: just funning ya

> > Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 11:12:26 -0700

> >

> > Cool!! How about we start it off with Abortion, then spring into Gun

> > control. then we could take a huge portion of affirmative action.

> >

> >

> > Now that our relisious 'discussion' hassimmered down with all parties

> > calling a

> > truce, anyone care to discuss politics ? hehehe

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Twind are basicly clones. and they definatly have diffrent personalities.

There might be 100 hitler bodies but only the origional has the hitler

personality.

TIME had the most interesting article and raised some provacative questions

about cloning ... one being, if you can clone a person once, why not 100

times?

100 Hitlers!!!!!!

Mark Sarmac wrote:

> Earlier also we had a brief discussion on cloning and making " designer

> babies " now I'm curious, since genetic engineering does sound like it's

> going to eradicate NF2, why shouldn't we be for it? If a couple, both

> plagued with NF2, want to have a child and have the means to have a child

> WITHOUT NF2 because of genetic engineering, why not?

>

> Again, I'm curious to know what you all think about that.

> Mark

>

> ----Original Message Follows----

> From: cinnyd@...

> Reply-To: NF2_Crew

> To: NF2_Crew

> Subject: RE: Things that make you go " Hmmmm.... "

> Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 15:19:46 US/Eastern

>

> excellent topic mark!! I read an article about an alternative way of

> getting

> those cells but I havent a clue to what it was, dang it. ok, my opinion is

> while i am not pro abortion, it is legal, it does occur, taking the cells

of

> a

> fetus that wud otherwise be 'thrown away " (man that is hard to think abt)

> is

> not much different than donating an organ to save a life. in other words,

> some

> good for mankind cud come from it. twud be nice if there wereno aborted

> fetus

> available but that will neverbe the case.

>

> Glad someone mentioned abortion cuz it's a topic I want to see a

discussion

> > in here. Stem-cells maybe a viable treatment or a cure for us, but they

> need

> > to extract them from aborted fetusus' (plural: feti?) Anyways, I'm just

> > curious to know what people think here. IMHO (In My Humble Opinion)

since

> > the fetus is unwanted anyways and is discarded, why not use it's cells

> for a

> > better purpose? But then, who are we to choose one life over another?

> What

> > do you all think?

> >

> > Just curious,

> > Mark

> >

> >

> > ----Original Message Follows----

> >

> > Reply-To: NF2_Crew

> > To: NF2_Crew

> > Subject: RE: just funning ya

> > Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 11:12:26 -0700

> >

> > Cool!! How about we start it off with Abortion, then spring into Gun

> > control. then we could take a huge portion of affirmative action.

> >

> >

> > Now that our relisious 'discussion' hassimmered down with all parties

> > calling a

> > truce, anyone care to discuss politics ? hehehe

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >