Re: new member seeking recommendation

[Guest guest]

--- " skyepyper " wrote:

>

> I was taking

> darvocet for over 30 years with no ill effects. It kept my pain down enough

for me to at least be independent. But now

> that it is no longer available the only medications that

> the doctor can prescribe are either too weak or stronger than

> the darvocet. Hoping someone knows of medications of similar

> strength and effectiveness?

Hello Dan -

Welcome, although I'm sorry for the pain that brought you here.

I'm also sorry to hear that you've lost a medication that was effective for you.

However, regarding your question - strength is simply a matter of dosage. Every

medication can be adjusted to give you an equivalent " strength " simply by

adjusting the dose.

For example, I take an anti-seizure medication to help with my nerve pain, like

lots of us do here. There are several different medications in this class, but

the doses for equivalent pain control vary widely. For example, if you take

Neurontin, you're often having to take 2400 to 4000 mg a day. I take Gabitril,

which has the same (actually better for me!) effectiveness at just 12 mg a day.

4000 mg of Gabitril would kill you immediately. Is it " stronger " ? Should I be

scared of taking it for that reason? No, it's just a different med that has to

be taken at a different dose.

The same will be true of other types of opiates or opiods. Every individual

finds that each drug - even in the same class of drugs - works differently.

Each individual finds that each drug offers a different set of side effects -

some you may be able to tolerate, some you can't. You may just have to try

several different drugs, and you WILL have to experiment (under doctor's

control!) with different doses to see what works best for you, at which dose,

with the least side effects?

If you have a doctor who is willing to help you through this process, you are

lucky. You're doctor should be able to consult a very simple chart that tells

him/her what the equivalent effective dose is of any other opiate to the dose of

darvocet that you were taking. My current uses a specialist doctor's

application on his iPhone that gives him this info, but my previous doctor was

old-school and had a printed chart he consulted to adjust dosages across meds.

If your doctor isn't willing or isn't knowledgeable enough to prescribe other

opiates and work with you to find the right medication, then you need to find

another doctor ASAP.

But don't be afraid of a med just because it's " stronger " than another med -

that's a completely meaningless comparison. The size of the dose is all that

matters, and every drug comes in multiple dose sizes from very weak to very

strong. And if a drug isn't working, then either the dose needs to be

increased, or you need to try another drug.

Hope this information helps.

Cheryl in AZ

Moderator

[Guest guest]

I took darvocet for a long time. I found that about half a vicodin worked about

the same to me. But the others that have posted on the equivalents, your doctor

should be able to look it up. That is just what worked for me.

Carolyn Eddy

" Sweet Goat Mama "

[Guest guest]

Dear Dan:

The drug that is the next step up from the darvocet is vicodin (hydrocodone

usually with tylenol). It's a bit stronger, but most people are able to adjust

to it. The side affects are similar (as they are with most opiates). You might

consider tylenol number 3 (tylenol with codeine), which is also one of the

opiates on the low end of the scale. Ultram (tramadol) is another drug that you

might speak to your doctor about. I personally consider it along the same level

as darvocet, but it is not an opiate. It works like one, though.

I feel for you. Bone and joint problems are also my biggest pain issues and I

just cannot imagine your having to go without medication at all. Consider the

vicodin. Even if you find it a bit to strong at first, you should be able to

adjust to it quickly, especially if you have been on darvocet so long. Although

never drive on any pain med until you know how it is going to affect you (and

sometimes not even then, depending on the drug).

- PA

> Dan wrote:

I was taking darvocet for over 30 years with no ill effects. It kept my pain

down enough for me to at least be independent. But now that it is no longer

available the only medications that the doctor can prescribe are either too weak

or stronger than the darvocet.

[Guest guest]

Hi again everyone, Thanks very much for the advise.

My doctor (who is actually a nurse practitioner) was giving me the darvocet

wrote me a prescription for ultram and the vicoden. The ultram is not as good

for me as the darvocet as it just does not seem

to work for very long. The vicoden works well but I am only allowed

2 a day. So I am spending more time lying down as the pain from my

waist down gets so bad. The nurse got me an electric wheelchair a while back

and I seem to be using it more and more which is a bit

demoralizing. I am by myself with no family (except for my 3 dogs) so I tend to

worry about what I will do about all this. I often just wish

I had someone to talk to about how bad I hurt which I am sure everyone

here can relate to.

The only other medicine I have taken that helps a great deal is prednisone. But

the side effects they say are bad for you which prevents long term use.

I appreciate the kind advise and am glad I found your group!

Thanks, Dan

[Guest guest]

You might try a half a vicodin at a time and see if that spreads it out better.

Carolyn Eddy

" Sweet Goat Mama "

[Guest guest]

Dan,

Have you tried the extended release Ultram? I didn't have much success with

regular Ultram until I switched to the extended release. They start you off

with 100mg for four days and then you go to 200mg. The max is 300mg. After

that you have to switch over to something else. For me the Ultram (er)

lasted seven months until my body synthesized it.

[Guest guest]

Have you seen a Rheumatologist? There are many prescription drugs for

arthritis. What about over the counter NSAIDS? Aleve, ibuprophen and my mind

just went blank. Steroids help me but I don't want to take them all the time

since the benefits don't outweigh the side effects in my case. I sometimes get

a cortisone injection if the pain is really bad in my hips but that can and does

speed up the damage to the joint so there's no wonder drug.

Now if you want to look into herbal ant-inflammatories there are quite a few. I

remember yucca and cats claw were given to my ex for his rheumatoid arthritis in

his knees. We used to see a herbalist that was quite gifted helping people

heal. I don't know if he's still living or not.

Just remember there are medicines older than our modern medications and many are

quite potent.

Jennette

>Don wrote:

>My doctor (who is actually a nurse practitioner) was giving me the darvocet

wrote me a prescription for ultram and the vicodin. The ultram is not as good

for me as the darvocet as it just does not seem

to work for very long.

>The vicodin works well but I am only allowed 2 a day. So I am spending more

time lying down as the pain from my waist down gets

so bad. The nurse got me an electric wheelchair a while back and I seem to be

using it more and more which is a bit demoralizing.

>The only other medicine I have taken that helps a great deal is prednisone. But

the side effects they say are bad for you which prevents long term use.

[Guest guest]

>Dan wrote:

>I suffer from bone and joint problems that cause me chronic and severe pain. I

was taking darvocet for over 30 years with no ill effects. It kept my pain down

enough for me to at least be independent. But now that it is no longer available

the only medications that the doctor can prescribe are either too weak or

stronger than the darvocet. 

Hi Dan

Welcome to the group. I'm one of the four moderators. It's odd that it took so

many years for doctors and the pharmaceutical companies to tell us the darvocet

or darvon can cause cardiac problems.

Someone mentioned ibuprofen, aspirin, or Aleve, which are a good idea.

Be careful to watch for any kind of stomach problems.

Have you tried Tylenol #3. It has Tylenol (acetaminophen) and codeine in it,

You can always break it in half. After awhile any sedation it causes should

resolve.

Would it be possible for you to physical therapy, to improve your function?

Gentle warm water therapy would be ideal for you.

There are also gentle stretching and other exercises you could learn to do.

I have never tried acupuncture, or acupressure, but those are something

to consider too.

I have fibromyaglia, and nerve damage in my legs, so I make sure to keep

warm clothes on, and have several small blankets to use when I am sitting

in my favorite chair.

Once again, welcome to the group.

Kaylene

Moderator

[Guest guest]

--- " skyepyper " wrote:

>

> The vicoden works well but I am only allowed

> 2 a day. So I am spending more time lying down as the pain from my

> waist down gets so bad.

Hi again, Dan -

No wonder you're suffering! Vicodin only works for four hours AT BEST. Two a

day is a meaningless prescription.

And besides that, Vicodin is a TERRIBLE choice for chronic pain, because it

contains so much Tylenol (acetaminophen). If you're taking daily pain meds, you

need to INSIST that your doctor/nurse give you a long-acting pain medication

that does NOT contain tylenol, or you're risking liver damage and potentially

death. At the very least, insist that she write the prescription for Norco -

it's the exact same opiate (hydrocodone) as Vidocin (which is just a brand name)

at the exact same dose, but with half the Tylenol.

It sounds to me like you need to find a doctor with the expertise to help

someone in chronic pain. This is a ridiculous level of care.

Cheryl in AZ

Moderator

[Guest guest]

Where in TN do you live? I live in Smyrna now but I used to live as rural as

Tellico Plains and Decatur. It was a lot harder to find a dr in East TN but as

soon as I moved to a small town in middle TN I found a great dr. Maybe I have

been close to where you live. You can email me off the list if you want to.

Hugs,

SHELL

<I live in rural Tennessee. I love the woods and wildlife but

there arn't many nearby options for doctors. The nearest

rheumatologist would be about 100 miles away. Might be worth it

when I feel up to it.>

[Guest guest]

Dan wrote:

>

> I've been keeping my eye out for a used jacuzzi. It would be great to have one

of those for the pain.

Dan,

We bought a hot tub and paid a bundle and then my Sister in Law buys one from

Sears for about three hundred on sale. It was a two person round one but it was

effective in what it was used for so check out the catalogs. I was really

envious she found that good deal and happy for her. I think the hook up for it

was easy also.

It was like an outdoor swimming pool that heated up with jets.

Bennie

[Guest guest]

> Dan wrote:

> Hi , I am planning on asking her to adjust my meds. I was hoping

> there might be something out there that I didn't know about that worked well.

When I tried the prednisone it helped immensely. I may have to go on it again I

suppose, especially since they took away the darvocet.

> Thanks, Dan

Dan,

Tramadol or Ultram is a good alternative. I would ask for the Ultram not the

Ultracet (has Tylenol) as you can take Tylenol extra if you need it. Prednisone

is a steroid that they don't let you stay on for a long period of time, but it

does help a lot. Hope you get some pain relief and getting it round the clock

is the goal. Bennie

[Guest guest]

That's what I got. One of the little round ones. It's plenty big for one person

and has the advantage of being able to be moved easily as you can just tip it on

it's side and roll it. I found it on craigslist for about $300. It also plugs

into a regular house outlet and fills with a garden hose so no expensive wiring

setup.

You don't need a big fancy expensive one just to soak your bones.

Carolyn Eddy

" Sweet Goat Mama "

[Guest guest]

wrote:

> The only other medicine I have taken that helps a great deal is prednisone.

But the side effects they say are bad for you which prevents long term use.

Read what has to say and maybe you can talk to your Nurse Practitioner

about it taking the prednisone longer. Maybe you can keep a Pain Dairy and show

your Nurse Practitioner so she knows when your meds wear off and how she can

supplement with break through med. Did you see about a timed Ultram so the pain

med is being over a longer period?

You might not be a candidate for longer term Prednisone but see, it cannot hurt

to ask.

You can go to the internet and look up pain dairy template and you can choose

one of those. I am having some bad pain days and trying to get my fibro flare

settled down before the holidays so I can go out of town and help my Dad. Can

you call the Nurse Practitioner's office before the holidays and tell her the

Ultram is not working very long so you do not have to deal with uncontrolled

pain?

Bennie

[Guest guest]

I was on 60 mg of prednisone for six months for temporal pain/vasculitis. The

prednisone made me gain weight, swell horribly, be moody (sad to mad in a

flash), get insomnia and feel terrible. I vowed never to take it again. I've

never been such a physical and emotional wreck as I was with prednisone. I think

the side effects need better explained.

wrote:

> The only other medicine I have taken that helps a great deal is prednisone.

But the side effects they say are bad for you which prevents long term use.