Re: Euthanasia

[Guest guest]

Kevorkian, I think he was from somewhere like Michigan.

Oregon does have an assisted suicide law but you have to be terminal, 6 months

to live, and not depresed. She is depressed and not terminal with anything. Just

has balance and chronic pain issues. I am still freaked by it. I am going to

find out where the counselor is and call and talk to someone there about it.

Carolyn Eddy

" Sweet Goat Mama "

[Guest guest]

You know, this topic reminds me of the a couple of lines from the 'Hippocratic

Oath' (I often jokingly refer to it as the 'hypocrit-ic oath):

" I will respect the privacy of my patients, for their problems are not

disclosed to me that the world may know. Most especially must I tread

with care in matters of life and death. If it is given to me to save a life, all

thanks. But it may also be within my power to take a life; this awesome

responsibility must be faced with great humbleness and awareness of my own

frailty. Above all, I must not play at God.

I will remember that I do not treat a fever chart, a cancerous

growth, but a sick human being, whose illness may affect the person's

family and economic stability. My responsibility includes these related

problems, if I am to care adequately for the sick. "

It is so interesting that the industry still tries to hold to these standards,

yet fall short so often.

The person that suggested euthanasia to a patient as a viable option for

treatment of depression, should be fired. I know that Oregon has the 'right to

die with dignity' statute, but that is gross negligence in it's use. It is

exactly the reason that so many people fear policies of this kind. Misuse. Pure

and simple. That she would suggest that as a viable option to someone who is not

terminally ill is simply malpractice of the worst kind and she should be

reported immediately.

- PA

> Bennie wrote:

Now, this lady needs to report her counselors to their credentialing agency and

she also needs to contact her insurance carrier and let them know. This lady

does not need to have any medications so she can euthanasia herself.

[Guest guest]

Talk about jumping the gun. Did those doctors know her well? Were they aware

of her depression? All this talk of euthanasia for humans sounds so wrong to

me. I know full well that a person who is being treated for pain at the end

can essentially overdose treating pain, but for a doctor to initiate euthanasia

seems to me one who has lost sight of their profession.

Jennette

> Carolyn wrote:

This was in Oregon last week. Has anyone else heard of this? Was it some attempt

to scare her out of her depression? What the heck???

[Guest guest]

> Candys Gmail wrote:

> I am appalled they made the offer to your friend. If you look at the criteria,

her depression would have disqualified her from the process. As my own health

insurance gets more and more expensive and offers less and less service, I worry

about future health care. This post certainly provides food for thought.

Candy,

The main point is that medical professionals take an Hippocratic oath to " DO NO

HARM " plus we all take medical ethics classes and training. This is not a

recommendation allowed by medical professionals to allow. This counselor is

violating all kinds of medical ethics to probably to include a law. If she is

doing this with Carol's friend, I cannot imagine what she is telling others.

As a radiation therapist and seeing many Cancer patients die, I can tell you

that that there are options to allow a comfortable " leaving of the earth " so to

speak. A TV show is not reflective of what is allowed and many of us take

medication, if we took the whole bottle, we would leave this earth.

I can tell you personally, a pharmacist would NOT allow such a prescription to

be filled to cause a " necessary " overdose and if a person wants to there are

already options to to so. I hate it when medical shows do this as this is not

true and there are not rules such as this as there has to be multiple court

hearings and " competency " documented even it is allowed.

The Hemlock Society is the a Society that advocates this. My quality of life is

compromised right now and myself and others could be evaluated and we would be

comparable to what the pain that cancer patients experience. These days and

this is trying to be changed especially for those with Chronic pain, there is no

cancer is a worse pain than " diabetic neuropathy, fibromyagia, war wound pain

patients, amputation patients, and the Pain Patient Act was drafted to counter

the rules of the DEA stating " only " cancer patients can get potent medication

such as Actiqa, Fentoria, and even Fentyl patches.

Thank those pain patient advocates that lobbied that all documented intractable

pain patients could have access to being prescribed these and insurance pay for

them. Some insurance companies still will not pay for these prescriptions unless

you are a cancer patient.

I do not to be disrespectful to anyone but a 9 level on the pain level is a 9

level no matter if you are a cancer patient, surgical patient, ruptured bowel

patient, or chronic pain patient. Those patients with Lou Greggs disease,

Multiple Scleroisis, and other chronic patients suffer the same as cancer

patients.

Cancer is just " abnormal cells " and is a horrible disease but there are others

that meet the same criteria. Speaking from experience and glad Hospice and

other support services for Cancer patients and those whose prognosis deems they

will never be cured, by the way, includes me, deserve to have their pain

relieved also.

Please know that overdose is also not a gentle death, it comes with it a

sensation you cannot wake up and are smothering, the same as being injected with

sodium penothal without a breathing tube.

Let's not glamorize a process that does not need to be glamorized and carries

with it, it's own set of problems. Respectfully to all and their opinions,

Bennie

[Guest guest]

> Carol wrote:

She is depressed and not terminal with anything. Just has balance and chronic

pain issues. I am still freaked by it. I am going to find out where the

counselor is and call and talk to someone there about it.

Carolyn,

I also bet you have to go through legal hearings and competency hearings and the

judges determination outweighs the patients. This counselor needs to be

reported, their remark was unprofessional. I will look up the law, I am sure I

am right about the criteria and I believe a Doctor has to sign off on it and how

many doctors do you know that will put their reputation to stake. I know

Kevorkian was sent to jail and his daughter tried to carry on his practice but

got caught also.

I am curious also to how many patients have been allowed to use this. You have

to realize that to prevent family members of getting their heir money and say

their family member needs to be assisted suicide, these measures have to be

taken. I used to know this but it has not been brought up in years. Bennie

[Guest guest]

> wrote:

> You know, this topic reminds me of the a couple of lines from the 'Hippocratic

Oath' (I often jokingly refer to it as the 'hypocrit-ic oath):

Kathyrn,

I am glad you posted the words as I take this seriously as my marriage vows,

even the living in sickness and poor which I am doing now. Most of us do that

have been in the medical field and as of patient we should expect and not have

the lines blurred having someone offering us to " euthanize " us or put us out of

misery. Do I divorce my husband to have better finances and kill myself so

others can live better, No I do not.

I know it is now pleasant listening to patients begging to be put out of pain,

not wanting to survive, or just go ahead and do it as I am going to die anyway.

Would they do this if their pain was controlled and other options made for them?

I hope not.

My criteria would meet the " prognosis " of never getting better and I would like

to offer to you that patients with properly controlled pain and afraid of

financial ruin will

utter these phrases.

Those with uncontrolled pain are depressed, it should be the number one criteria

on the list of diagnosing depression. " Do you have uncontrolled pain, where you

are unable to get out of the bed and have a " fulfilled " life to include a sex

life, financial life, and work. See what I mean.

We could kill off ninety per cent of the people in the Nursing Homes with this

law, this is why I do not agree with it.

If you want to commit suicide, it is easy to do with over the counter the

medications and alcohol. Including the medical profession and legal

professions, does bother me.

I want to clarify, I do not like to see anyone suffer and this is my opinion. I

probably have seen patients in worse conditions than I would like and I would

not like to share with anyone on this forum but they would never do this.

It is my opinion only and just like other decisions in passing laws, bothers me

when they get involved. These laws were enacted to prevent criminalization of

the act of others included.

All the aspects of this have been discussed and those Doctors who dispense these

prescriptions knowing what is going to happen are violating the Hippocratic

Oath.

There remains the patient must " self medicate " leaving the Doctor harmless when

other Pain Patient Doctors are being put behind bars for giving pain patients

medications and being sued for millions, because a family member took too much

and died. Seems wrong that this could happened as the patient self medicated

and probably was wanting to have the thing happened that did.

The medications are labeled, indications, side effects are always listed and the

patient must be responsible for their health care and if family are caring for

them, please be informed.

This is how I view caring for a patient and ending a life because you can, comes

with a huge responsibility of accountability. Bennie

[Guest guest]

I have set up my donation of my body to science with a group that will cremate

me once they are done and will send my ashes to my daughter. I have let my

pastor know and I am going to plan my service and leave the instructions with my

granddaughter. My daughter would not be able to handle it as she has her own

health issues. The only expenses should be a donation to the church for my

pastor to do the memorial service, (that service can take place any time and

does not need my body or ashes to be there) and a container for my ashes. As

far as I am concerned, I really do not care what they do with them.

I am trying to simplify my life (trying to curb my hoarding tendencies) so that

there will not be a lot of " stuff " for my kids to go through. I live in a

remodeled RV and have gotten rid of a lot of " stuff " .

Christie in AZ

> Peggy wrote:

> I believe in being informed and letting your family know. I am to donate my

body to science and be cremated. My whole family knows that and even put it in

my will even though it is an after the fact instrument.