Re: RE: Unstable Identity

[Guest guest]

Kelley, , and Others

Whether you are the one having had BPD or have a child with it or both, has

the transient, fluid personality been something who have witnessed first hand?

Do BPs actually assume the identity of the people they are around? Don't

they have any opinions, beliefs, likes, dislikes, etc that are their own??

Jean

[Guest guest]

Yes I have seen that with my daughter when she was with my grandsons' father

and his bum friends and relatives (he was ghetto black) and she " became "

ghetto black. It was weird to watch, and frightening. She went from being this

little private school girl to this I don't know what. But once she was away

from

him, she went back to herself. Now she is acting like white trash, BUT when

she was in court the other day even in front of him and his mother, she acted

like herself (the herself I know). So, it kind of seems like an act !!!!!????

AND, I was thinking about you just now. You have stood your ground on this

" In a Name " debate. I didn't see you backing down to get anyone's approval

here. GOOD FOR YOU!

Your identity must be stronger .

Have a good day.

Jean

[Guest guest]

Kelley

Sounds like if they can control it (and from what you say about him and what

I've seen in my daughter), THEY ARE CONTROLLING IT , then this behavior is

more of an act to get what they want (to be liked by who they are with or

whatever else they want). I remember when my kids were little, I'd be yelling

at

them to clean their rooms or pick up the toys and the phone would ring and I

would be a sweet pleasant person to whomever was calling. My son asked me one

day

why I answered the phone and was " nice " to the person calling and I said,

Because I'm not angry with them, I'm angry with you. Why should I yell at the

person on the phone? "

Isn't that what we do? Or do I have a problem too?

Jean

[Guest guest]

Kelley

As far as the situation with your stepson, my older grandson, can be

an absolute brat, however NEVER with me. He drives my daughter crazy, whining,

wanting, screaming at her (GO NATHAN!!!!!!! Just joking), and demanding

anything and everything from her. I've had her calling me when he was 2 1/2

telling me he was hitting her and I needed to yell at him for her. I told her

if

she couldn't control a 2 yr old she needed help.

Now when I have with me, he is an angel. I treat him with respect, he

treats me with respect and he is well behaved. He knows I genuinely love

him. Kids will get away with whatever they have been allowed to get away with

with each person in their lives.

I used to be a teacher before I had my kids. I was just out of college and

my first class was 6th grade. The first week of school was difficult because

of my age and my class' past 5th grade teacher. They tried playing all sorts

of tricks on me and then when none worked they gave up and fell into line and

behaved. One of the ring leader boys said to me, " Gee, the teacher we had last

year, we'd hide in the closet on her and she'd never know we were there " . I

said, " And you thought you were putting something over on her? She probably

knew you were there and it was a good way for her to be rid of you for a few

hours!!! " He looked quite perplexed. It's all in the training.

So where did I screw up the training with you know who?

Jean

[Guest guest]

GOOD GIRL !!!

Jean

[Guest guest]

Kelley

When I would argue with my ex, I would be pretty much in a rage after I found

out about his affair and I remember answering the phone during fights with

him and be nice on the phone. But after speaking on the phone my anger even at

him disipated and I would not even talk to him at that point. So I guess I

was 1/2 borderline. Actually there have been times readimng stuff here or in

books that I have wondered if I have a touch of this disorder myself. But. it's

probably just my " adult child of alcoholic parent " problem.

Jean

[Guest guest]

Kelley

I am so afraid this is how my grandsons are going to end up. My daughter

sucks as a mother. When they are at home, since they were born, television has

been the babysitter.

And movies, My daughter owns every Disney movie ever made, which is fine,

but they do nothing but sit and are entertained so they don't bother her.

I'm also concerned about this abandonment business, that they will feel I

have abandoned them. God only knows what crap she's telling them about me.

With your stepson, just keep up the good stuff. He may just like it better.

That's what my son and I did with and ; just kept exposing

them to the good stuff (foods, thinking, right and wrong, educational games,

manners, rules, etc)

Jean

[Guest guest]

My daughter in different settings can be the most opinionated person in the

world. She's right and no one else is. The only one who can out argue her is

my son and then her nose gets all bent out of shape. But as I mentioned when

she was around the 2 dirtbags, she became just like them except for the day in

court last week. That must have been difficult, trying to con the judge and

trying to please dirtbag at the same time.

Jean

[Guest guest]

Because you are thinking outside your heart with other children, with

your head.

We are unable to do that with our children, we think with our hearts, not

with our heads.

I could always do that with other children, say like send them home, kick

them out when they were unruly. Can't do that with my own.

Debbie

[Guest guest]

Kelley

I just reread your post on the rage thing. You said a normal person in the

midst of an all out rage could not stop it and then go back to it again at full

force, but that is what the Bp does.

one time during one of her door kicking, hitting me, screaming rages

found the police at our door. She practically attacked the cop. She was not

able to control that rage at a time when she should have. They took her in

and then she charmed them and got out. Other times, she would be in a rage,

crying, sweating, screaming and the phone would ring. She would stop the rage

answer it and if it was a call for her, that was the complete end of the

rage---in didn't continue.

Jean

[Guest guest]

Debbie

I pretty much consider and to be my children and I have no

problem disciplining them and not being ego involved with them as I was with

her. Every pain she felt, I felt. I might add, I think my son is probably

normal

today because I was NOT ego involved with him either.

Jean

[Guest guest]

I keep trying to convince myself she's just a spoiled rotten brat, and then I

remember she's still not working and her past 2 relationships have been with

TOTAL losers and she doesn't use birth control. Obviously there's a problem.

Jean

[Guest guest]

Well I did and my daughter does, so that she will be approved and accepted....so

we turn into what we think people will like...this was one of the hardest traits

for me to fight....and also with her...the need for approval was something very

important to me, and it is to her right now. I can physically watch her

language and the way she presents herself change, as she gets around different

friends....it is scary to watch as a mother...but i know I did it for years

too...

cascorsam@... wrote:

Kelley, , and Others

Whether you are the one having had BPD or have a child with it or both, has

the transient, fluid personality been something who have witnessed first hand?

Do BPs actually assume the identity of the people they are around? Don't

they have any opinions, beliefs, likes, dislikes, etc that are their own??

Jean

[Guest guest]

I do hope you point this out to her. She has to find an identity of her own not

project the identity of who she is with or she will suffere lifelong.

Hgus

kelley

wife of a 40 year old BP!

Re: RE: Unstable Identity

Well I did and my daughter does, so that she will be approved and

accepted....so we turn into what we think people will like...this was one of the

hardest traits for me to fight....and also with her...the need for approval was

something very important to me, and it is to her right now. I can physically

watch her language and the way she presents herself change, as she gets around

different friends....it is scary to watch as a mother...but i know I did it for

years too...

cascorsam@... wrote:

Kelley, , and Others

Whether you are the one having had BPD or have a child with it or both, has

the transient, fluid personality been something who have witnessed first hand?

Do BPs actually assume the identity of the people they are around? Don't

they have any opinions, beliefs, likes, dislikes, etc that are their own??

Jean

[Guest guest]

Jean

Yes they do. BPH can be for some unknown reason ranting and raving at me,

spouting how horrible I am and throwing me out of his life, calling me names you

dont want to be called, and someone will come to the door and he literally turns

off the rage for this person, and turns into a completely different person. he

has also gone on degradation campaigns against me with his family when he leaves

during a rage. The way they picture me is rediculous! And they know this man

and have for far longer than I have so why they fall for it is beyond me. I

have also witnessed personality shifts from Jeckyll to Hyde and back agian

within minutes. When he is wanting something from me he is interested in

everything I do, likes my books, watches movies I want to watch, then split!

His 6 year old son also changes personalities in the same way. With me alone,

he is a model child, respectful, couteous, learning new things, learning from

mistakes, Dad comes home and he turns into a whiny angry brat, thinking Dad will

give him whatever he wants to make it better, problem is nothing makes it

better. He wants things at the store when we shop be it toys or food that he

has no interest in playing with or eating, he just wants it.

Hugs

Kelley

Re: RE: Unstable Identity

Kelley, , and Others

Whether you are the one having had BPD or have a child with it or both, has

the transient, fluid personality been something who have witnessed first hand?

Do BPs actually assume the identity of the people they are around? Don't

they have any opinions, beliefs, likes, dislikes, etc that are their own??

Jean

[Guest guest]

Thank you I might have gotten a little over emotional with it, but yeah

that is my opinion and it won't change.....I am me now, and if people don't like

it, they can kiss my hind side...the only person's approval I need anymore, is

mine....like I know I need Saturday off for me and like I said if my boss can't

deal with that, that is her problem...she knows of me and how I am...I am

now, and I don't change for nobody or noone, sometimes when I believe strongly

in something, I get emotional, or sometimes there is an underlaying factor, but

even though seeing the underlying factor last night, I still believe they should

change the name, but that is just my opinion, and everybody has one of

those...hehehe

cascorsam@... wrote:

Yes I have seen that with my daughter when she was with my grandsons' father

and his bum friends and relatives (he was ghetto black) and she " became "

ghetto black. It was weird to watch, and frightening. She went from being this

little private school girl to this I don't know what. But once she was away

from

him, she went back to herself. Now she is acting like white trash, BUT when

she was in court the other day even in front of him and his mother, she acted

like herself (the herself I know). So, it kind of seems like an act !!!!!????

AND, I was thinking about you just now. You have stood your ground on this

" In a Name " debate. I didn't see you backing down to get anyone's approval

here. GOOD FOR YOU!

Your identity must be stronger .

Have a good day.

Jean

[Guest guest]

Jean

It seems like an act but it really isnt. When they get " bad " it is because they

cannot control all those partial thoughts and fragments of emotions that are not

making one picture at a time but puzzle peices of too many pictures! So it

seems that way but it really is not.

as for the phone thing, no, that is normal. But in the middle of a full out

rage, say you were really really angry, you could not compose yourself that

fast, your emotions from the rage would show when you answered the door. The BP

just shuts off that compartment and switches to the other one, then when the

other person is gone, they switch right back to rage mode!

Hgus

kelley

Re: RE: Unstable Identity

Kelley

Sounds like if they can control it (and from what you say about him and what

I've seen in my daughter), THEY ARE CONTROLLING IT , then this behavior is

more of an act to get what they want (to be liked by who they are with or

whatever else they want). I remember when my kids were little, I'd be yelling

at

them to clean their rooms or pick up the toys and the phone would ring and I

would be a sweet pleasant person to whomever was calling. My son asked me one

day

why I answered the phone and was " nice " to the person calling and I said,

Because I'm not angry with them, I'm angry with you. Why should I yell at the

person on the phone? "

Isn't that what we do? Or do I have a problem too?

Jean

[Guest guest]

Jean

You probably did not screw up the training, it was as wrong path in her brain,

short circuited so to speak. Oh I am sure you made mistakes, all parents do!

But not enough from a normal parent to cause that kind of short circuit. It is

the way she was wired

My stepson, definitely is not normal. He has his UBPD mom to deal with, a drug

addict ass of a big brother, his Grandmother who he refers to as SHE or THE

GRANMOTHER, like she is Mommy dearest. Does not have his own room or even a

bed, but sleeps on the couch, is allowed to do nothing but play video games and

watch tv till all hours because everyone else is up and he sleeps on the couch,

eats only when his mother is home, and not to drunk to recall to feed him.

Lately he has been spouting nonsense like this had so many grams of sugar or fat

and this food is bad, and you know what? Thats a load of malarky for a 6 year

old who is about 10 pounds underweight! He should be eating whatever he wants,

when he is here he eats fruit like its a new delicacy and it wont be here

tomorrow! Drinks milk by request or juice! He also has been showing us

exercises like crunches and pushups that I am pretty sure he did not learn at

recess in first grade. What the heck are they doing to this kid? Instead of

being in the house with adults playing video games he should be outside with

children playing! Riding a bike, at six he cant ride his bike without training

wheels and prefers his toddler big wheel to the bike. He cant play a game

without whining and getting angry if he seems to be losing! He is a very sad

child, I just dont put up with it, nor do I cave in to his emotional outbusts.

I think I am teh only one who disciplines him, and you know what? He doesnt

hate me! In fact this past weekend I really got tired of him talking to me all

the time LOL

Hgus

Kelley

Re: RE: Unstable Identity

Kelley

As far as the situation with your stepson, my older grandson, can be

an absolute brat, however NEVER with me. He drives my daughter crazy,

whining,

wanting, screaming at her (GO NATHAN!!!!!!! Just joking), and demanding

anything and everything from her. I've had her calling me when he was 2 1/2

telling me he was hitting her and I needed to yell at him for her. I told her

if

she couldn't control a 2 yr old she needed help.

Now when I have with me, he is an angel. I treat him with respect, he

treats me with respect and he is well behaved. He knows I genuinely love

him. Kids will get away with whatever they have been allowed to get away with

with each person in their lives.

I used to be a teacher before I had my kids. I was just out of college and

my first class was 6th grade. The first week of school was difficult because

of my age and my class' past 5th grade teacher. They tried playing all sorts

of tricks on me and then when none worked they gave up and fell into line and

behaved. One of the ring leader boys said to me, " Gee, the teacher we had

last

year, we'd hide in the closet on her and she'd never know we were there " . I

said, " And you thought you were putting something over on her? She probably

knew you were there and it was a good way for her to be rid of you for a few

hours!!! " He looked quite perplexed. It's all in the training.

So where did I screw up the training with you know who?

Jean

[Guest guest]

Jean-

Yes, they do have opinions, beliefs, etc. of their own, but they are

so incredibly insecure about the same that they readily adopt the

same from people around them.

katie

> Kelley, , and Others

>

> Whether you are the one having had BPD or have a child with it or

both, has

> the transient, fluid personality been something who have witnessed

first hand?

> Do BPs actually assume the identity of the people they are

around? Don't

> they have any opinions, beliefs, likes, dislikes, etc that are

their own??

>

> Jean

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I understand your concerns about your grandkids. They sound pretty

normal. But you know, that too, is beyond your control, and you

must learn to let it go.

Hopefully the counselor you will see soon (?) will be able to help

you deal with your feelings and concerns for your grandkids. And,

between now and then, perhaps sending a few prayers winging heaven-

ward won't hurt, either!

katie

> Kelley

>

> I am so afraid this is how my grandsons are going to end up. My

daughter

> sucks as a mother. When they are at home, since they were born,

television has

> been the babysitter.

> And movies, My daughter owns every Disney movie ever made, which

is fine,

> but they do nothing but sit and are entertained so they don't

bother her.

>

> I'm also concerned about this abandonment business, that they will

feel I

> have abandoned them. God only knows what crap she's telling them

about me.

>

> With your stepson, just keep up the good stuff. He may just like

it better.

> That's what my son and I did with and ; just kept

exposing

> them to the good stuff (foods, thinking, right and wrong,

educational games,

> manners, rules, etc)

>

> Jean

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

it depends. Normal is not to rage at all. The fact that she charmed the police

later indicates a problem. Violent anger of any kind is not right for anyone

involved!

Hgus

kelley

Re: RE: Unstable Identity

Kelley

I just reread your post on the rage thing. You said a normal person in the

midst of an all out rage could not stop it and then go back to it again at

full

force, but that is what the Bp does.

one time during one of her door kicking, hitting me, screaming rages

found the police at our door. She practically attacked the cop. She was not

able to control that rage at a time when she should have. They took her in

and then she charmed them and got out. Other times, she would be in a rage,

crying, sweating, screaming and the phone would ring. She would stop the rage

answer it and if it was a call for her, that was the complete end of the

rage---in didn't continue.

Jean

[Guest guest]

We are very adaptive people...ex...my daughter had not seen my parents in 8

years, a " normal " person would be uncomfortable in seeing people she hadn't seen

or been in their house for 8 years...my daughter made herself at home that

night...acted like they hadn't missed a year...my mom called me that night and

told me that she had BPD...my mom knew from one night with my daughter from

dealing with me. I got my daughter the next day....and I expected angry

questions, but no, she acted like nothing wrong had happened. but, my point is

my daughter made herself at home, as she did here when she got here....and I use

to be the same way, because of the way I could change, any place could be homey

as soon as walked in the door and a stranger i just met, my best friend. We

don't attach to anything really so we adjust.....

katiehines57 wrote:

Jean-

Yes, they do have opinions, beliefs, etc. of their own, but they are

so incredibly insecure about the same that they readily adopt the

same from people around them.

katie

> Kelley, , and Others

>

> Whether you are the one having had BPD or have a child with it or

both, has

> the transient, fluid personality been something who have witnessed

first hand?

> Do BPs actually assume the identity of the people they are

around? Don't

> they have any opinions, beliefs, likes, dislikes, etc that are

their own??

>

> Jean

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Yes her and I are working on that.....on finding out who Brittany is...

Kelley wrote:

I do hope you point this out to her. She has to find an identity of her own not

project the identity of who she is with or she will suffere lifelong.

Hgus

kelley

wife of a 40 year old BP!

Re: RE: Unstable Identity

Well I did and my daughter does, so that she will be approved and

accepted....so we turn into what we think people will like...this was one of the

hardest traits for me to fight....and also with her...the need for approval was

something very important to me, and it is to her right now. I can physically

watch her language and the way she presents herself change, as she gets around

different friends....it is scary to watch as a mother...but i know I did it for

years too...

cascorsam@... wrote:

Kelley, , and Others

Whether you are the one having had BPD or have a child with it or both, has

the transient, fluid personality been something who have witnessed first hand?

Do BPs actually assume the identity of the people they are around? Don't

they have any opinions, beliefs, likes, dislikes, etc that are their own??

Jean

[Guest guest]

Do you now attach? This part of the disorder is what scares me, because if

you don't attach to anything then of course, no one will mean anything to you.

No wonder my daughter can just blow me off like some useless object. I don't

have any meaning to her. And no wonder she doesn't give a dam- about what my

family thinks, they're just more useless baggage to her.

I noticed years ago that she formed bossom buddy relationships with people

she had just met. Never took the time to see if she had anything in common, but

this was only with guys.

BAsically it's like there is no depth, but then there is no person in that

body either, is there? When does this change???

Jean

[Guest guest]

You've done an about face, haven't you? You don't let people in your safe

zone. Earlier when just hooked up with the losers, you didn't have a safe zone,

did you?

It's funny, since my divorce, and more so since my mother's death many

years ago, I have not let any guy into my safe zone. I am very friendly,

outgoing

and caring, but I felt too fragile to let anyone other than my kids and

grandkids into that " safe zone " . And I've been thinking I will probably live a

very lonely, superficial life for my remaining years, because after this with

, I cannot emotionally risk to ever let ANYONE into my life again. I

just

could not survive the pain of something like this again. I'll probably just

buy another golden retriever (my Harry is a big chocolate Lab) and have the 2

dogs. I am a dog person, and you can trust a dog with your emotions----they

adore you till the end.

And yes, People from Louisiana are much friendlier. You are very open, I'm

sure Louisiana

would suit you better.

Jean