Re: Dear Group

[Guest guest]

Kelley

How long before she " hangs " herself??

[Guest guest]

Kelley

I will hang on to your words. I KNEW I wasn't the crazy one!!!!!

Jean

[Guest guest]

Hi Kelley--

In some states, would be prosecuted for recording the phone call without

her daughter's knowledge. That's why I mentioned it.

Meredith

Re: Dear Group

While the recording may not be legal to use in court it can sure be helpful

with DFCS

[Guest guest]

There are many states now that require only one party consent. My own

attorney doesnt even know that about the state I live in as his words were thats

illegal, it was not in this state and I had to point him out to it. In the

instance where it requires two party or all party consent, use your voice mail

as often as possible as that is implied consent.

Hugs

Kelley

Re: Dear Group

While the recording may not be legal to use in court it can sure be helpful

with DFCS

[Guest guest]

Do you think I should take her calls if she does call after all this with her

taking me off the children's pick up list. What do I have to say to her

anyway? She told me she wants me out of her life and has since I told off the

dirt bag the day I picked her, him and the baby at the hospital 3 weeks ago.

Maybe I shouldn't have done it THAT day, but when he slammed the door in my

face,

I completely lost it. Do I follow thru with getting him violated? I'm

getting scared.

Jean

[Guest guest]

I'm afraid I may have gone too far since in taking a stand with her she's

made it more difficult to see the kids.

It seems to be a no win situation. I adore my grandsons. And I just feel

like I may have lost them forever.

Jean

[Guest guest]

Your dtr sounds so out-of-control! Whatever does she think she's

doing? Her sons will hate her, eventually, if she does not permit

them to see you.

Sounds like you're sending the dirtbag back where he belongs. Good

for you.

The stupid thing about all this is that your dtr thinks it is some

sort of power struggle, where she is going to " prevent " you from

controlling her and her life. But, how sad she doesn't see that

that is not the issue with YOU at all!

Whenever I hear of someone who has committed a crime like that guy

has, it makes me so angry that they get off so easily. Why give

them the 20 year sentence if they don't have to serve it, and know

that going in?

You're sure in a rough spot re: seeing those fine young boys. But,

I wouldn't back off if I were you. Do whatever you can, to whatever

extent you can (only you can determine what that is) to help those

kids out--you may be the only hope they have.

Courage,

[Guest guest]

Jean

Sounds like a nightmare, but perhaps it is time to let her be lulled. She isnt

budging and is likely making things for the kids worse because of it. Let your

investigation get done, without them worrying about it, in other words dirtbag

wont need to be looking over his shoulder and being on extra good behavior

worrying about you.

If there is one thing I know that a battle between a NON and a BPD can be more

devastating to the NON, because the BPD has a whole nother way of coping with

life. Hang in there and remember if you give them enough rope they will hang

themselves.

Hugs

Kelley

Re: Dear Group

My daughter called today to tell me she had me taken off the " pick-up " lists

at both my grandsons schools and she once again told me she will get a

restraining order if I send dirt bag back. I said as long as you let me have

a

relationship with my grandchildren, we'll be all set won't we? She started

screaming saying I was not going to control her and I was never going to see

them. I

told her then that I didn't have anything to lose by sending him back then.

If she won't let me see them anyway, why wouldn't I send him back. He's the

reason for this mess. he's the one in collaboration with her whose abusing

them emotionally.

How much of a push over does she think I am?? My whole family wants her in

jail, never mind him. They are so sick of her antics and my grandsons have

always been the apples of the whole family's eye.

I love how she has NO support group in her entire life, but she is going to

call the shots. Just like him; he's such a loser'should keep his mouth shut

because his rapp sheet is twice as long as I thought, but he's too stupid to

lay

low either. The criminal just doesn't get it.

My detective says dirt bag was supposed to have served 20 years for the armed

robbery, but served 5 and got parole after 4. Then there have been numerous

drug related incarcerations and weapons violations. Says he will definitely

be able to get him violated and will get the powers that be take a closer look

at his sentencing.

But once he's back, does that get me any closer to seeing my grandsons? I

don't know. I told her she will never work for me again and she can lose the

house cause I will not give her a dime ever again. Nothing seems to work.

She

just won't back down. I know it is a power struggle, but I believe I am

right.

He is a dirt bag criminal who should not be arounf my grandsons.

I don't know whether to back off or continue. It doesn't seem to be getting

me anywhere.

And she denied that she threatened to slash my throat last night. Says I'm

crazy . And it has always been me. I'm the problem with her whole life and

everyone knows what a rotten childhood she had. MY son says he could not have

imagined having had a better childhood. Since I provided her with a rotten

childhood, that's the reason she doesn't want me arounf my grandsons.

Jean

[Guest guest]

If the child is telling this to the principle of the school, why delay calling

authorities? They will sometimes remove the children temporarily while the

problems are fixed and that sounds a heck of a lot better than what they are

living with now!

Hugs

kelley

Re: Dear Group

Whether I send him back or not she has taken steps to stop me from seeing

them. I made sure today that the principal of 's school and the owner

of

the daycare where goes both know the whole situation. 's

principal told me " I know why you're calling. told me this morning that

his

Mommy new husband is a crazy man " , and he then went on to tell her the rest as

he told me. Everyone is going to hold off about calling DCYF till I talk with

the lawyer. the principal said that the kids would not be removed from the

home unless they felt my daughter would not take steps to correct the

situation. At which point she said they would certainly be put with me till

she gets

her act together.

Jean

[Guest guest]

Jean

Very good idea for you to follow! She is dragging you around by your emotions

Hugs

Kelley

Re: Dear Group

My detective told me to sever all contact with her. If she calls now, don't

answer or answer and say to her " I'm through, I'm finished " and hang up. He

says she feels too sure that I'll always be there and that she has me by the

------ where the kids are concerned. He says she needs to feel less secure

about me.

Jean

[Guest guest]

Normally people do feel that way after getting out of jail, that is the ones who

do not intend to better their lives. an honorable person who felt bad for his

past would have done everything possible to show you he could be a better person

regardless of if he just felt the way he did or you made him feel that way

somehow. But you are not dealing with normal!

Hugs

Kelley

Re: Dear Group

Oh, the other thing is that she hates me because I wouldn't give him a

" chance " . I told her I had offered to take him out looking for a job when he

first

got out, but he didn't want me to do that , said he was " uncomfortable "

around me. But now she says, he really said I turned HIS stomach, because he

knew

I was looking down at him I told her there was no where else to look. He is

not in a position to demand respect. Someone in his shoes HAS to earn it. And

besides, he never wanted to get a job at all !!!

Jean

[Guest guest]

Doesnt sound like very long at all! she chose this partner, she chose to ignore

the laws even though someone else missed them, quite frankly if welfare found

him living there she would lose her food stamps even if she deserved him, and

now the very bad behavvior towards the children, and most likely keeping them

from you because she knows they will tell you whats going on. Get what yu can

from that investigator and get it over.....

Hugs

kelley

Re: Dear Group

Kelley

How long before she " hangs " herself??

[Guest guest]

Of course you are not crazy, crazy think they are normal, normal people feel

crazy!

Hugs

Kelley

Re: Dear Group

Kelley

I will hang on to your words. I KNEW I wasn't the crazy one!!!!!

Jean

[Guest guest]

I hope the detective knows what he's talking about. He's not a

mental health professional. Sounds to me like things are very, very

serious.

>

>

> My detective told me to sever all contact with her. If she calls

now, don't

> answer or answer and say to her " I'm through, I'm finished " and

hang up. He

> says she feels too sure that I'll always be there and that she has

me by the

> ------ where the kids are concerned. He says she needs to feel

less secure

> about me.

>

> Jean

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Oh, I've heard that sort of thing from my bp dtr, too. It's a load

of crap.

When she lived here, and was going out with a guy who found out was

beating on her, and we pointed out how awful that was, she gave us

this huge song and dance about how we didn't give him a chance,

blah, blah, blah.

Yeah, I broke the two of them up, thank God. He made the mistake of

coming by my house. I wouldn't let him in, but met him outside (we

live on a very busy road), and let him have it with both barrels.

He was really mad at me, but he was small, physically, and if he'd

even made a gesture I would have had him behind bars so quick he

wouldn't know what hit him!!!

I told him if he ever called or showed up at my house again, I would

get a restraining order, call the police and if he violated it, it

would give me a great deal of pleasure to have him arrested and his

skinny ass hauled off to jail. And I meant every single word of it,

too.

Hold tough, you can do it!

[Guest guest]

I have no magic answers. So much of what you do depends what you

can live with.

If you have caller id AND voice mail, I definitely think you should

screenher calls, and NOT answer if she does--let the machine pick it

up. If it's important enough, she'll leave a message. If you get a

bunch of calls and NO message, what I just said is still true--if

it's important enough, she'll leave a message.

If she has told you she wants you out of her life, man, I'd take the

opportunity to bow out! Give yourself a well deserved break! That

puts the shoe on her foot--she has to take the next step and decide

whether she wants a relationship with you or not.

Hey, I completely understand you telling the jerk off. Like I just

said, I did it with my dtr's ex . . . but only AFTER she was

finished with him. Doesn't foster good relationships if you do it

while they're still together. However, don't beat yourself over the

head with it. You are, after all, human!!!

You said you're scared. Are you afraid of him? or something else?

If you have concerns for your personal safety, you definitely need

to speak with a professional, either the police, a prosecutor,

detective, something like that. They would be in a much better

position to advise you than I could.

Now, as far as the grandkids are concerned, I simply don't know

because I've never been in that position. I'm sorry I don't have

great words in that regard; however, we here on the forum are

definitely here to listen and support you, and encourage you to

follow your heart and what you believe to be right for your

situation.

Courage,

[Guest guest]

I have not been a real part of your conversations about your

daughter but I can understand why you find this overwhelming.

The only input I have is to urge you to DO NOTHING while you are

upset. Give yourself time to calm down and get a better perspective.

Sleep on it and you will be able to make more rational decisions.

Personally, I don't think this will turn out as awful as you think.

It is easy to run away with things in your imagination before events

happen.

It wouldn't be a bad idea to take a break from your daughter this

evening. Turn the phone off, turn your cell off, go for a walk or

get out of the house. Have some coffee with a friend. But if you act

in haste, you may find that you regret it later.

Good luck my friend.

Carolyn

> I'm afraid I may have gone too far since in taking a stand with

her she's

> made it more difficult to see the kids.

>

> It seems to be a no win situation. I adore my grandsons. And I

just feel

> like I may have lost them forever.

>

> Jean

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Very few things are forever.

> I'm afraid I may have gone too far since in taking a stand with

her she's

> made it more difficult to see the kids.

>

> It seems to be a no win situation. I adore my grandsons. And I

just feel

> like I may have lost them forever.

>

> Jean

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I think that yes you should take the calls if they are not interupting what you

are doing, and when they turn abusive, tell her that you are not going to be

treated that way perhaps she can call back when she is in a better mood, then

say I love you , and hang up. and keep recording!

I am not sure what will say, but in my opinion these phone calls are

trying to assert control over you and you are not letting it happen. When my

BPH had rages and split me black, he could not stop calling me to tell me that

if he came back things were going to change. Any time the conversation got

around to him being responsible for whatever happened he went right back into

rage, and I would hang up. He alwasys called back, each call a bit gentler.

If you completely ignore the calls it may be your grandson calling. But you

do not have to take the abuse. This is a good time to establish your

boundaries.

Hugs

Kelley

Re: Dear Group

Do you think I should take her calls if she does call after all this with her

taking me off the children's pick up list. What do I have to say to her

anyway? She told me she wants me out of her life and has since I told off the

dirt bag the day I picked her, him and the baby at the hospital 3 weeks ago.

Maybe I shouldn't have done it THAT day, but when he slammed the door in my

face,

I completely lost it. Do I follow thru with getting him violated? I'm

getting scared.

Jean

[Guest guest]

Jean

I dont think you have lost the grandkids forever. Your daughter wants you to

play by her rules, and her rules are just not normal at this time. She will

most likely keep fighting with you via the phone. However if she really wanted

you out of thier lives she would not keep calling. Like said screen the

phone calls. If its a real need to talk you can hear it on voice mail or

answering machine. Then you can call back.

Hugs

Kelley

Re: Dear Group

I'm afraid I may have gone too far since in taking a stand with her she's

made it more difficult to see the kids.

It seems to be a no win situation. I adore my grandsons. And I just feel

like I may have lost them forever.

Jean

[Guest guest]

and Kelley--

With regards to the phone calls, I think Kelley is partially

correct.

Yes, the bp dtr is trying to control her (your, Jean) mom, but only

because she has a desperate need to control her life, and ALL

relationships fall in that category. I do not believe she is

deliberately singling you out, Jean; rather, this is one aspect

where you're not doing what she thinks should happen, so she is

expending tremendous energy to get things back in her control, so

she has a measure of peace about it.

I do believe she would act the same way with anyone; this time, it

just happens to be who gets the brunt of the abuse.

A positive side of this: look how very hard she is working to exert

control over her circumstances. Just think what positive steps she

could take if she were to redirect that energy towards her own

health and well-being, and that of her family.

I think the inability to control a situation in her life that is

central to her (her kids) can definitely lead to the bottoming out

that we all hope for for our kids (at least I do).

Why? Because it is only when a bp is finally forced to acknowledge

they cannot control their lives do they seek help.

Kelley has a point about the phone calls; however, if it were me,

I'd still screen them. On our phone, when someone leaves a message,

we can hear the person talking, and have the option to pick it up or

not. If there is obvious " fumbling noises " you may deduce it is

your grandson, and pick up. However, that is only one option.

I do agree that you need to keep recording everything!

Good luck,

katie

>

> I think that yes you should take the calls if they are not

interupting what you are doing, and when they turn abusive, tell her

that you are not going to be treated that way perhaps she can call

back when she is in a better mood, then say I love you , and hang

up. and keep recording!

>

> I am not sure what will say, but in my opinion these phone

calls are trying to assert control over you and you are not letting

it happen. When my BPH had rages and split me black, he could not

stop calling me to tell me that if he came back things were going to

change. Any time the conversation got around to him being

responsible for whatever happened he went right back into rage, and

I would hang up. He alwasys called back, each call a bit gentler.

>

> If you completely ignore the calls it may be your grandson

calling. But you do not have to take the abuse. This is a good

time to establish your boundaries.

>

> Hugs

> Kelley

> Re: Dear Group

>

>

>

>

> Do you think I should take her calls if she does call after all

this with her

> taking me off the children's pick up list. What do I have to

say to her

> anyway? She told me she wants me out of her life and has since

I told off the

> dirt bag the day I picked her, him and the baby at the hospital

3 weeks ago.

> Maybe I shouldn't have done it THAT day, but when he slammed the

door in my face,

> I completely lost it. Do I follow thru with getting him

violated? I'm

> getting scared.

>

> Jean

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Excellent.

Meredith

-----

In Rhode Island only one party needs to know. My son is an asst Dist Attny

and he has advised me of such.

Jean

[Guest guest]

You can expect an N to go bats over " no contact. " Part of N supply comes from

controlling people and seeing them squirm. Ns don't like to lose that, so you

might hear a few bizarre messages on your answering machine or voice mail. They

may feel a little frightening, but will probably work to your benefit. She will

do herself in (though not literally) with her own behavior.

No contact will feel like a breath of fresh air to you. Even if you're worried

about your grandsons, you'll start feeling better.

Meredith

Re: Dear Group

My detective told me to sever all contact with her. If she calls now, don't

answer or answer and say to her " I'm through, I'm finished " and hang up. He

says she feels too sure that I'll always be there and that she has me by the

------ where the kids are concerned. He says she needs to feel less secure

about me.

Jean

[Guest guest]

I hope i've remembered this correctly from a previous post of

yours (bear with me it's 2:30am here, so I'm a little bit tired).

You said something about the boys NOT being able to go to the toilet

without the dirtbags permission?? EVERY CHILD HAS THE RIGHT TO GO TO

THE TOILET!!!! It borders on emotional (mental) abuse if it isn't

downright emotional abuse. What happens if they don't get to the

toilet in time???? Whether they are grounded or not, that affects

children. Have a look at the united nations - rights of the child.

Children have rights!! Some people just shouldn't be allowed to be

anywhere near children!!!>

Another of my 2cents worth!!!

[Guest guest]

LOL Kelley, I'll have to remember that one! " crazy think they are

normal, normal people feel crazy! "