Re: Nada and sexual inappropriateness

February 3, 2010

We watched a film too; it was made by Disney, I believe. It was so weird the

way they handled all that! I guess it was better than how it was before, but it

added this weird element to something natural. Certainly took away any idea of

natural beauty and all that.

~p

Re: Nada and sexual inappropriateness

I grew up in a small town in the mid-west, and in 5th grade in the early 60's

all us girl students had to watch " the film about becoming a woman. " Apparently

the boys were forbidden to watch it with us, or they had their own separate film

to watch. But our film was all about how our bodies were changing, how to care

for ourselves during our period, etc. There wasn't a health class, per se,

until high school but we did watch " the film " . I'm pretty sure we had to get a

permission slip from our parents to do so; maybe your nada didn't want you to

see it?

-Annie

>

> way back when, we didnt have a " health class " in school ...

>

> Jackie

>

> I can understand nadas objecting to tampons for those reasons,

> but that doesn't explain insisting that their daughters use

> those nasty old belt and pad contraptions when more modern types

> of pads had been available for years by the 80s. No one thought

> that stick-on pads were dangerous in any way.

>

> I can't remember ever asking my nada questions about such

> things. We learned about that stuff in health class in school

> starting in 4th or 5th grade and I trusted what I learned there

> far more than anything my nada might have said.

>

------------------------------------

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SEND HER ANY POSTS THAT CONCERN YOU; DO NOT Respond ON THE GROUP.

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() for your copy. We also refer to " Understanding the Borderline

Mother " (Lawson) and " Surviving the Borderline Parent, " (Roth) which you can

find at any bookstore. Welcome to the WTO community!

From Randi Kreger, Owner BPDCentral, WTO Online Community and author SWOE and

the SWOE Workbook.

February 3, 2010

Hey all,

thanks all for sharing your stories. It is so empowering to see that I'm not

the only one with crazy in my life, and to see all of you recognizing it and

saying " no more " .

This issue has been on my mind quite a bit lately. I am just realizing now that

my nada was sexually abusive in a verbal/emotional kind of way. This is an

entirely new concept to me!

My nada hasn't dated since my parents divorced, 18 years ago. My nada spent

years telling me about all the sexual exploits of my father. My father was a

sex addict (been in recovery for 15 years now, happily remarried for 11 years of

that), however, in retrospect she didn't need to go into any detail with me, but

she did anyways. It made me uncofortable, and she was clearly using my father's

sexual issues as a way to poison me against him.

There was a lot of power struggle between my nada and father, with me in the

middle. Finally, my nada took me to therapy. I think I was a freshman in high

school. I had no idea why I was going there, and after I attended about one or

two sessions, and the therapist even said to me that she didn't really know why

I was there, that I seemed pretty well adjusted. Then my nada came in and said

she had something to say. She sat next to me on the couch and told me that my

father had sexually abused me as a child, when I was 2 or 3. Then, after that

moment, I did need therapy. funny, huh?

At the time I just belived her, because who wouldn't believe her own mother? I

have no memory of this alleged sexual abuse, and I had spent tuesdays and every

other weekend with him for years as part of the custody agreement. She

continued to tell me lies about my father and how awful he was to the point that

I no longer trusted him. I was completly devistaded. My father denied it flat

out, and I didn't believe him. We were estranged for two long and painful

years. Finally I reconnected with him (as a senior in high school)and it was

really nice.

Years later, as a senior in college, I tried to figure out what really happened.

When I tried to have a discussion with my nada about it she went into a rage.

Then she hung up on me. She called me the next day and told me to meet her at

the DMV. She wouldn't speak to me the entire time we were there. I noticed my

childhood dog was in the back seat of her car. We transfered the title of my

car to my name, and then in the parking lot she opened the trunk of her car and

gave me boxes of my things that were in storage at her house, and then the dog.

She told me never to contact her again.

I, of course, had no place for the dog, as a college student living crammed into

a small apartment with 4 other girls. That didn't matter. The point was that I

questioned her, and that this was a way for her to be as hurtful as possible.

To this day, my mother innapropriatly bashes men in front of me, claiming that

they are all evil, stupid, selfish, etc. She has always done this, and I used

to not think anything of it. But when I started to have as serious boyfriend,

she got worse. Whenever I would have my boyfriend over, at a holiday or family

gathering, and she would go into a tirade against men. My boyfriend is usually

the only male at the table. My aunt has spoken to her about it, because she

doesn't want her daughter (my cousin) to be exposed to it. It is wrong, and is

clearly sexist.

Every time I have seen my mother since she has made a point to show me a " funny "

video on the internet about how stupid men are, or just tells me that since the

invention of birth control me just get sex for free, and they are all taking

advantage of women and I need to be careful...

In other words, my mother has always used sexuality as a way to turn me against

the men in my life. God I love having almost no contact with her!!!

February 3, 2010

Thanks for sharing this part of your story. It's good to know that

you had the experience that someone

did care and could see through the facade.

~patricia

Re: Nada and sexual inappropriateness

Annie,thank you so much for your understanding and supportive post.What you

wrote is so kind and sweet.

It's actually pretty amazing what one person can do for someone who is

trapped in such a hopeless situation as I was.Many times--and every

time I think of that year and these incidents--I have blessed that

psychiatrist for trying to help,for standing up for me.He has been blessed by me

many times.While I was going through that emotional torture in the " family

therapy " I had his words to give me strength; I had the fact that he existed and

knowing that decent people like him exist to give me strength--I had some

example of sanity to hold on to.

Because while the " family " therapist was colluding with my parents,I

could remember that the psychiatrist had been annoyed with them.I left that part

out for the sake of brevity but the day they stormed out of his office,he had

said to them with some real pique in his voice when they got angry at his

suggestion that he see them too, " I see young people in my practice who have very

tragic,very serious illnesses and this young lady here just isn't one of

them.There is nothing seriously wrong with this young lady,aside from a mild

depression I'd like to know the causes of and that she happens to be

exceptionally bright... "

He was annoyed on my behalf--he referred to me respectfully as a young

lady and he seemed to think that it was nada and fada who WANTED me to be " sick "

and he was disgusted with them because he knew what real sickness was and how

wrong for a parent to somehow wish something so tragic on their own child.

And one more thing: as I was following them out of his office that

day,he said, " I'm sorry, " .He was the *only* adult who ever said that to

me.He said it like he cared.That made me cry later,but good tears.

I kept reminding myself of what he had said.I felt so comforted by

it,that somebody had cared.I had that to rely on afterward.It might not even

have seemed like much to him or that he'd been able to do much for me,but he

helped me enormously by being good and honest and decent.

In that morass of dysfunction,there was that one shining point of

light.

>

> ,

> You were wronged and abused on so many levels, by so many people, that it

astounds me that you even survived at all. You must have a core of steel to be

as undamaged as you are; not that you were not profoundly damaged, but its

amazing that you weren't broken by your experiences. It just staggers me how

many adults had the opportunity to help you and were either prevented from doing

so, or decided to exploit you their own self.

> Wow.

> Kudos to you. Many kudos.

> -Annie

>

> >

>

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SEND HER ANY POSTS THAT CONCERN YOU; DO NOT Respond ON THE GROUP.

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() for your copy. We also refer to " Understanding the Borderline

Mother " (Lawson) and " Surviving the Borderline Parent, " (Roth) which you can

find at any bookstore. Welcome to the WTO community!

From Randi Kreger, Owner BPDCentral, WTO Online Community and author SWOE and

the SWOE Workbook.

February 3, 2010

~ at first I thought you were talking about a taekwondo lesson ...haha.

But it sort of makes sense. Those are lessons to teach

a person not to be a victim. I walk around a lot feeling like a victim these

days and I can't seem to get on top of it, you know? I feel

like my dad just did so wrong by us kids by not leaving us any part of his

business when he died; and his wife the same (she could be

a good person and reach out to us). I am angry and sad all the time. I have to

deal with my mom; and she is crotchety and pissed all the time

because she is in pain, can't walk, and I am sure it is her grief too. It seems

like every single thing I try to do, turns into a big pain in the

ass. (On top of it, my dial up connection is getting worse! I can't even load

pages like my banking site).

And it just never ends. It has been this way for six years. I've had to drop

friends because of their weird behavior or outright wrong

behavior. I've lost friends from moving or them sort of going more with my ex.

And at the same time I feel like a big baby for complaining all the time.

When I got divorced, I bought a house so I wouldn't have to pay rent to someone.

This house has been a nightmare to me because it is a

fixer-upper and I just can't do what needs to be done (or have been depressed,

having ADD, etc). I feel trapped in it now and don't know how

to get out. Now this stuff with my mom...who I have been calling to make sure

she is okay, and because she is angry and sad, she did one of

her yell at me things. And it made me feel pretty sad. Because I feel so

alone. I come home and cry and sometimes my son sees me and I think~

oh god, I don't want him to feel bad like I did when I saw my mom cry when I was

a kid.

I really don't know what to do with myself; how to get free; every day I try to

get through some of this crap and then it seems a pile more

comes down (today I got through to social security and they want to talk to my

mom; my mom wasn't going to do call them because she can't

manage it. And now soc sec wants proof of my mom having custody....I don't want

my brother in law involved because he abandoned them, and

now he will probably end up with custody of her).

Sorry...off on a tangent. Just messed up day to day. Having to deal with the

nada thing on top of it...sucks!

~patricia

Re: Nada and sexual inappropriateness

,I had to be pushed into fighting back.It took me months that year

before I started to.At first I was in shock,then I was hurt and upset and

begging for mercy from all these people who would show me none.I had to make the

decision not to care anymore about the consequences of fighting back since

caring had alllowed the abuse to continue and it was not going to stop unless I

did something on my own.I had been,before that year,a straight A plus student

and " teacher's pet " ,not a behavior problem in any way shape or form...and yet

that seemed to mean nothing to the principal for example.

I really like your take on my " victory " --that is so very

insightful...and very helpful,thank you!!!

I need to take my hound for her walk right now but I'm going to reflect

on what you said,really interesting perspective...in many ways I'm still beating

myself up over every single thing I did that year whether it was when I was

hunkering down or when I was fighting back...thank you again for giving me

another,more positive angle on this.

> >

> > ...all I can say is OMG! Yes, that therapist was totally

corrupt and messed up herself. The whole thing is so creepy, like one of those

shows where the men in the white coats come after the sane person.

Please...there was nothing not weird about the whole thing and especially your

nada's suggestion at the end. It is all apalling.

> > sorry you had to endure all that at such a young age.

> > ~patricia

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> > Problems? Ask our friendly List Manager for help at @ SEND

HER ANY POSTS THAT CONCERN YOU; DO NOT Respond ON THE GROUP.

> >

> > To order the KO bible " Stop Walking on Eggshells, " call 888-35-SHELL

() for your copy. We also refer to " Understanding the Borderline

Mother " (Lawson) and " Surviving the Borderline Parent, " (Roth) which you can

find at any bookstore. Welcome to the WTO community!

> >

> > From Randi Kreger, Owner BPDCentral, WTO Online Community and author

SWOE and the SWOE Workbook.

February 3, 2010

I wonder if this 'therapist' had any credentials whatsoever? Was she just some

acquaintance of your nada perhaps? Where did this twit practice? Did she

practice out of her home? Did you ever see a business card, an associate, a

diploma on the wall?

I am just pondering the possibility that perhaps she was a complete phony who

your nada was trying to pass off to you as a therapist. That's how far off in

left field this incompetent loon seems. Gosh, that must have been sheer hell for

you . You did will in spite of them all.

If its any consolation I know someone who, as a teenager, was sent to a

" therapist " after her parents divorce. This teenager had a narcisisst father and

a waif-type mother. This so called therapist actually called this teenager " a

little bitch " in one session.

February 3, 2010

On behalf of all the gentlemen, thank you. LOL

But most of us, I think , are way too far down the corn field to be

freaked out by normal biological processes. Still, your delicacy on our

part is appreciated!

Doug

> >

> > oh, same here !! I remember my sister being called dirty because she

was

> > exploring herself...( we were little kids, 6 & 8 years) she never

taught

> > us anything about sex other than it was dirty and only for making

> > babies..she never told me anything about the monthly curse..but once

it

> > happened, boy, she was right there nosing around...tampons and such

were

> > NOT allowed.. we had to use those awful pads with the belt that

always wore

> > a raw patch on my backside..

> >

> > Jackie

> >

> > My nada was also extremely obsessed with any hints of sensuality or

sexual

> > curiosity in me. I would be brutally punished if caught exploring

with

> > another child or by myself. She pretty much traumatized me about all

things

> > sexual, pretty severely.

> > Its just so wrong for a mother to turn her child into an asexual

zombie

> > robot because the mother herself has sexual hangups.

> > -Annie

> >

>

February 3, 2010

We watched Bambi, and cheered when the hunter made a perfect kill shot.

Then the coach said, boys be sure you wear a jock so you don t bust your

balls when we run in gym. And take a shower after, cause your ass smells

like 10 miles of bad road.

And that was health for the guys. Oh, and don t stare at the girls.

LOL...

Doug

> >

> > way back when, we didnt have a " health class " in school ...

> >

> > Jackie

> >

> > I can understand nadas objecting to tampons for those reasons,

> > but that doesn't explain insisting that their daughters use

> > those nasty old belt and pad contraptions when more modern types

> > of pads had been available for years by the 80s. No one thought

> > that stick-on pads were dangerous in any way.

> >

> > I can't remember ever asking my nada questions about such

> > things. We learned about that stuff in health class in school

> > starting in 4th or 5th grade and I trusted what I learned there

> > far more than anything my nada might have said.

> >

>

February 4, 2010

Well now, that explains a lot. thanks for the illumination on some of the

many mysteries [in my mind] of the development of the male psyche.

-l

> > >

> > > way back when, we didnt have a " health class " in school ...

> > >

> > > Jackie

> > >

> > > I can understand nadas objecting to tampons for those reasons,

> > > but that doesn't explain insisting that their daughters use

> > > those nasty old belt and pad contraptions when more modern types

> > > of pads had been available for years by the 80s. No one thought

> > > that stick-on pads were dangerous in any way.

> > >

> > > I can't remember ever asking my nada questions about such

> > > things. We learned about that stuff in health class in school

> > > starting in 4th or 5th grade and I trusted what I learned there

> > > far more than anything my nada might have said.

> > >

> >

>

February 4, 2010

Doug - Well, you are quite welcome. Excuse me while I arise from my fainting

couch and put away the smelling salts...

> > >

> > > oh, same here !! I remember my sister being called dirty because she

> was

> > > exploring herself...( we were little kids, 6 & 8 years) she never

> taught

> > > us anything about sex other than it was dirty and only for making

> > > babies..she never told me anything about the monthly curse..but once

> it

> > > happened, boy, she was right there nosing around...tampons and such

> were

> > > NOT allowed.. we had to use those awful pads with the belt that

> always wore

> > > a raw patch on my backside..

> > >

> > > Jackie

> > >

> > > My nada was also extremely obsessed with any hints of sensuality or

> sexual

> > > curiosity in me. I would be brutally punished if caught exploring

> with

> > > another child or by myself. She pretty much traumatized me about all

> things

> > > sexual, pretty severely.

> > > Its just so wrong for a mother to turn her child into an asexual

> zombie

> > > robot because the mother herself has sexual hangups.

> > > -Annie

> > >

> >

>

February 4, 2010

Hellfireblonde,the therapist did have a PhD in psychology--her diploma was right

there on the wall.I also think she must have had quite a lucrative practice

because her office was in the wealthiest town in the area where rent is *not*

cheap and she had an entire floor of a downtown office building to

herself.Having said that,I have no idea what her orientation was.She talked *at*

me,never to me.

That's terrible about your friend.The last time I checked,verbal abuse

isn't a therapeutic technique,but it doesn't really surprise me.There is more

mediocrity than excellence in any field and psychotherapy is no exception.Just

that there is such great

potential for harm.

Thank you for your support

>

> I wonder if this 'therapist' had any credentials whatsoever? Was she just some

acquaintance of your nada perhaps? Where did this twit practice? Did she

practice out of her home? Did you ever see a business card, an associate, a

diploma on the wall?

>

> I am just pondering the possibility that perhaps she was a complete phony who

your nada was trying to pass off to you as a therapist. That's how far off in

left field this incompetent loon seems. Gosh, that must have been sheer hell for

you . You did will in spite of them all.

>

> If its any consolation I know someone who, as a teenager, was sent to a

" therapist " after her parents divorce. This teenager had a narcisisst father and

a waif-type mother. This so called therapist actually called this teenager " a

little bitch " in one session.

>

February 4, 2010

,I'm sorry to hear you were having a bad day.I can relate to that

feeling of things piling up and I guess as you know of feeling trapped.And about

the house situation,too.I bought a " charming " 1920s bungalow mostly (believe it

or not lol) because I had pets and it's a pain renting when you have

pets.Now,looking back on it,it was folly for me to think that living nearby nada

and fada (two towns over) that I'd even have the mental space to work on the

house as I'd planned let alone the will to,but that was my idea.I went through

so much crap with them before I went NC--and of course at the time I had no

inkling that fada would die as suddenly as he did with all the horrors that went

with that.Or that I still had so much of my own stuff to work on which would

blind side me at times.I think now that I bought this house in something of a

delusional state--and I still haven't done much work on it.I keep telling myself

that I will take two weeks off and have a blitz of work done on it but I never

do.It's not worth much more now than it was when I bought it--but lesson

learned: home ownership isn't going to fill in the gaps within *me*.I'm very

grateful to have the equity,such as it is,and I love my pets dearly but I tied

myself down here and entrapped myself by acquiring both.I think alot of that was

due to feeling more despondent at the time than I even realized and also

accepting feeling down as my lot in life when it isn't--and so what seemed at

the time (when I bought this house) as a " solution " was only a band aid

measure--an attempt to have *that* make things better when it wasn't going to.At

the time I wasn't able to realistically assess my own limits,like thinking that

I'd have it in me to just occupy myself rehabbing the house as if I had nothing

else to worry about,like other people...or an attempt to convince myself that I

could be like other people.I see now that I was putting the cart before the

horse.

About your dial up: it sounds like maybe you need to update your web

browser,if pages aren't loading.You could call the costumer service number of

your internet service provider and have them transfer you to tech support--they

could tell you what you need to do.

I hate dealing with bureaucracy,places like social security! Esp when

there's a PD person in the mix.I've had to do stuff like that a couple of times

because my brother didn't do something right with our father's estate--but

because he's the executor it was more me being the one finding out what he had

to do,telling him,and then being powerless as to whether or not he actually did

it.Does your nada have formal/legal custody of your nieces?

When I was in contact with nada and fada everything I tried to do for

them became a pain in the ass because they didn't really want help or for things

to be better--they just wanted to marinate in their negativity.And even when I

could tell myself that they were sick,they still managed to get under my skin.I

had to walk away from nada and brother,although I think that isn't quite what

you want to do.

You have had alot on your plate,so it's not surprising you feel

overwhelmed.It seems like it might help you to break that whole down into parts

because you are only one person and you can't do it all and nobody can do

everything all at once.

Even if you got an associate's degree or took some technical course

now,you'd be making more money and you might even qualify for a Pell Grant as a

single mother.It doesn't mean you'd be tying yourself to that one job

forever--if you were making more money it would be easier later to continue your

education.

That's what I'm going to have to do to start over.The hours of the job I

have now make it impossible to even go to night school--and for what I want to

study there is no night school anyway! I can't afford to not work and just go to

school.So I'm having to break making a change down into parts:

First I'm going to get another job which I'm looking for now that

enables me at least to go to night school.I'm going to take a yearish long LPN

course,which will enable me to work long shifts on the weekend and go to school

full time during the week.This is going to mean a cut in pay for me the entire

time I am studying but once I have my master's I will have a very good

salary--and options.

Doing this is going to be a big leap into space but if I don't,I will

just stay stuck where I am.My girlfriend is not happy with my decision,which is

actually a whole other topic! She's not getting it,that I don't want to settle

for being unfulfilled in my current job and she also doesn't get that it's more

than that.My job makes me despair of human nature,it just does.I grew up with

that despair too and I've realized that no amount of money is worth feeling that

way almost on a daily basis.The more I learn about this corporation and the way

it functions the more I want to disengage myself from it.

But before I go off on a tangent of my own...I don't know if that kind

of breaking it down into parts would work for you,but I hope you're feeling a

bit better today.It's hard to make a change but it can be done--you have to do a

fair amount of deciding what sacrifices you're going to make first.

Take care,

>

> ~ at first I thought you were talking about a taekwondo lesson

....haha. But it sort of makes sense. Those are lessons to teach

> a person not to be a victim. I walk around a lot feeling like a victim these

days and I can't seem to get on top of it, you know? I feel

> like my dad just did so wrong by us kids by not leaving us any part of his

business when he died; and his wife the same (she could be

> a good person and reach out to us). I am angry and sad all the time. I have

to deal with my mom; and she is crotchety and pissed all the time

> because she is in pain, can't walk, and I am sure it is her grief too. It

seems like every single thing I try to do, turns into a big pain in the

> ass. (On top of it, my dial up connection is getting worse! I can't even load

pages like my banking site).

>

> And it just never ends. It has been this way for six years. I've had to drop

friends because of their weird behavior or outright wrong

> behavior. I've lost friends from moving or them sort of going more with my

ex.

> And at the same time I feel like a big baby for complaining all the time.

>

> When I got divorced, I bought a house so I wouldn't have to pay rent to

someone. This house has been a nightmare to me because it is a

> fixer-upper and I just can't do what needs to be done (or have been depressed,

having ADD, etc). I feel trapped in it now and don't know how

> to get out. Now this stuff with my mom...who I have been calling to make sure

she is okay, and because she is angry and sad, she did one of

> her yell at me things. And it made me feel pretty sad. Because I feel so

alone. I come home and cry and sometimes my son sees me and I think~

> oh god, I don't want him to feel bad like I did when I saw my mom cry when I

was a kid.

> I really don't know what to do with myself; how to get free; every day I try

to get through some of this crap and then it seems a pile more

> comes down (today I got through to social security and they want to talk to my

mom; my mom wasn't going to do call them because she can't

> manage it. And now soc sec wants proof of my mom having custody....I don't

want my brother in law involved because he abandoned them, and

> now he will probably end up with custody of her).

>

> Sorry...off on a tangent. Just messed up day to day. Having to deal with the

nada thing on top of it...sucks!

> ~patricia

>

> ------------------------------------

>

> Problems? Ask our friendly List Manager for help at @... SEND HER

ANY POSTS THAT CONCERN YOU; DO NOT Respond ON THE GROUP.

>

> To order the KO bible " Stop Walking on Eggshells, " call 888-35-SHELL

() for your copy. We also refer to " Understanding the Borderline

Mother " (Lawson) and " Surviving the Borderline Parent, " (Roth) which you can

find at any bookstore. Welcome to the WTO community!

>

> From Randi Kreger, Owner BPDCentral, WTO Online Community and author SWOE

and the SWOE Workbook.

February 5, 2010

Thank goodness you had the intelligence, even at that young age, to understand

this woman was a farce. I shudder to think of the many children she surely

'treated' who perhaps didn't fare as well as you. You seem to have a naturally

built-in resilience mechanism, good for you. I can identify with that too. Its

what kept us alive I am sure.

HUGS from HF

> >

> > I wonder if this 'therapist' had any credentials whatsoever? Was she just

some acquaintance of your nada perhaps? Where did this twit practice? Did she

practice out of her home? Did you ever see a business card, an associate, a

diploma on the wall?

> >

> > I am just pondering the possibility that perhaps she was a complete phony

who your nada was trying to pass off to you as a therapist. That's how far off

in left field this incompetent loon seems. Gosh, that must have been sheer hell

for you . You did will in spite of them all.

> >

> > If its any consolation I know someone who, as a teenager, was sent to a

" therapist " after her parents divorce. This teenager had a narcisisst father and

a waif-type mother. This so called therapist actually called this teenager " a

little bitch " in one session.

> >

>

February 5, 2010

Hi ,

Well not that I am glad you have a similar house situation as I do; but it is

good to have someone understand. In the beginning, I was all gung ho about

getting the work done and then major depressive things happened. Plus with my

ADD I never realized how hard it would be to do EVERYTHING! ADD affects your

executive functioning and so, having to do so much of that, I just get

completely overwhelmed. I know that I could learn how to do the fixer upper

stuff (after all I put up a rain gutter, which was not easy, and a bunch of

other things) I just don't have the mental energy to *learn* stuff right now. I

do have equity also, but as you know, the market is bad and I would not really

want to sell. I also did not realize the *trap* of it. That is because we are

told how it is the *american dream* right? The pet thing too, I avoided getting

a dog or goats because I knew it would just add to things. My boyfriend would

say: You should get a dog. And I'd say: well then I couldn't come and sleep

over here (when he lived here) now could I? (he has ADD too, and does not think

stuff through all the time, though he's a complete genius in his field).

Everything you said here I can relate to; assessing my limits, rehabbing my

house (like other people), the house being a *solution* (for me I did not want

to pay rent and I thought that the housing prices would just get higher; plus I

thought having an apartment to rent out too would help, which it has, but is

also a MAJOR stress on me).

Thanks for the computer advice; today my computer connection seems better.

Something is definitely up with the phone lines. So we'll see.

You know, my big fear is that I will make a bunch of changes and leave this

place (house/town) and go to a new place and feel just as lost and then not have

anything

familiar around me.

**sigh** You know that commercial: Life comes at you hard! ? It definitely

does.

Take care, thanks for your email,