Dr. Lowe's therapy for fibromyalgia patients...shocked at high dose...

[Guest guest]

I read that Dr. Lowe found his patients needed 118.75 mcg to 162.50

mcg of T-3 in order to fully be well. He did a study on this, and

found his patient's hypo symptoms returned if he took them to a

lower than 118.75 mcg dose of T-3.

His theory is that we fibro patients have cellular resistance to T-

3 - similar to insulin resistance. That we need huge doses of T-3

in order to be well, and that such large doses do not cause any

hyper symptoms whatsoever. (In a person without cellular

resistance, such high doses would probably kill them.)

Anyway I got the old calculator out and figured out that in order to

get that much T-3, I would have to take roughly 13 to 18 grains of

Armour per day!!!

What do you guys all think of this?

Gentle

[Guest guest]

> Anyway I got the old calculator out and figured out that in order

to

> get that much T-3, I would have to take roughly 13 to 18 grains of

> Armour per day!!!

>

> What do you guys all think of this?

>

> Gentle

I have heard of a doctor who pushes his people with severe fibro up

by one grain every week or two until it subsides, and OFTEN has

people on ten grains or more daily. His wife (and RN) is on 6 grains

a day. What I think is this: if natural thyroid helps it's a whole

lot better than strong pain meds and what have you that doctors

prescribe for people and requires them to get their liver function

tested avery 6-12 weeks.

[Guest guest]

> Anyway I got the old calculator out and figured out that in order

>to get that much T-3, I would have to take roughly 13 to 18 grains

>of Armour per day!!!

>

> What do you guys all think of this?

I think that Lowe can be on target with treatment with Fibro and

Hashi's patients, and yes, it can take a lot.

The sad thing about Lowe, though, is that his charges are

EXCESSIVELY exhorbitant for the vast majority of folks, so all we

can do is benefit from what he writes and forget about benefitting

from being his patient.

Janie

[Guest guest]

>

> I think that Lowe can be on target with treatment with Fibro and

> Hashi's patients, and yes, it can take a lot.

>

> The sad thing about Lowe, though, is that his charges are

> EXCESSIVELY exhorbitant for the vast majority of folks, so all we

> can do is benefit from what he writes and forget about benefitting

> from being his patient.

>

> Janie

Thanks...well, I am a fibro patient, that is for sure. I have

actual physical evidence (IC diagnosed under

hydrodistention/cystoscopy/biopsy) of having at least one

fibromyalgia disease.

So...I am going to pay attention to what Dr. Lowe says...but I'm not

going to post what dosage I end up being at, because if it's as high

as 6 grains or even higher, I know people will be worried about me

going hyper, etc. so I think I will just kind of keep dosage

information to myself and talk about my doseage as being " the

appropriate dose of Armour " .....

Gentle

[Guest guest]

>

> I have heard of a doctor who pushes his people with severe fibro

up

> by one grain every week or two until it subsides, and OFTEN has

> people on ten grains or more daily. His wife (and RN) is on 6

grains

> a day. What I think is this: if natural thyroid helps it's a

whole

> lot better than strong pain meds and what have you that doctors

> prescribe for people and requires them to get their liver function

> tested avery 6-12 weeks.

I agree! And the pain meds didn't work so well anyhow...well, guys,

I am going to give my body the amount of Armour it seems to cry out

for. And that probably is going to exceed 3 grains.

My body is different...my body is fibro. What works for one hypo

patient (1 or 2 grains of Armour) might not work for another,

fibromyalgia/hypo patient (who might need 6 grains or more per day

to feel well.)

Gentle

[Guest guest]

> So...I am going to pay attention to what Dr. Lowe says...but I'm

>not going to post what dosage I end up being at, because if it's as

>high as 6 grains or even higher, I know people will be worried

>about me going hyper, etc. so I think I will just kind of keep

>dosage information to myself and talk about my doseage as

>being " the appropriate dose of Armour " .....

Oh Gentle, I hope you won't do that. The way to learn on this list

is to know what others are doing successfully. And if an appropriate

dose for you ends up being high, then so be it.

Sure, you may get a few who worry. But you can counter with your

symptoms and experience as a learning tool.

The only issue I would have with someone going up to a high dose is

that they do it cautiously and gain a great deal of knowledge

beforehand, which you appear to be doing. We've had a gal or two

here that went too high too quick, and one almost ended up in the

hospital. It turns out that she has an ultra sensitive body and also

needs a lot of adrenal support.

Janie

[Guest guest]

If you do any reading on fibromyalgia and what is going on inside

the cells of these patients, it becomes a lot more easy to accept

that high doses of thyroid would help. Basically, in fibromyalgia

patients, they have problems in the energy production mechanisms

inside the cell. Mainly it is with ATP production. ATP production is

directly affected by thyroid hormones. Some doctors who treat

fibromyalgia without much thyroid consideration are using substances

such as expectorants (high doses) and organic forms of silica to

treat their patients. Basically, these two things affect transport

of substances such as phosphorous (a part of ATP) accross the cell

boundary. They help patients, but no mention is ever made of a cure.

They improve cellular energy production by various mechanisms. After

reading this, I began to wonder myself why they weren't trying high

doses of thyroid hormone since I think this is a much safer and more

direct way to get cellular energy up than the use of an expectorant

long term. It is well known that low thyroid hormone itself

interferes with transport of phosphorous accross cellular boundaries

and impedes ATP production.

I have had a personal experience that seems to support Dr. Lowe's

theory. When I first started on Armour, I was taking 1-1/4 grain. I

felt generally ok at this level. But, after about 3 or 4 months on

this dose, I began to develope bursitis in my joints and began to

suffer really bad restless sleep, with aching muscles and joints,

especially in my neck and shoulders. Soon, I could hardly find a

pair of shoes I could wear. My symptoms fit fibromyalgia very well

and I learned that bursitis commonly develops in hypothyroid

patients who are put on T4.

I had never had bursistis before in my life. I knew that somehow my

thyroid treatment was related to my problems and so began to search

the web and literature for information. I found a research article

by Dr. Lowe, in which he said that bursistis was usually caused by

the thyroid replacement dose being a bit low. So, I increased my

dose of thyroid by 1/4 grain and within a week my bursitis was no

longer bothering me and in two weeks it was gone. Within a month my

sleep problems with the tight neck and shoulders also dissapeared. I

have not had a problem with my joints since and the fibro like

symptoms are still gone.

Just based on my own experience, I think that for some patients high

doses of thyroid are what they need. I once was a patient of Dr.

in Indiana who found in his own practice that some

patients respond very well to high doses of T3. He, himself was on

190mcg of T3 a day. I think that there are definitely problems that

can affect how the cells in the body respond to thyroid hormone.

Cellular resistance to thyroid is known in the medical literature

and there are a number of articles on the topic.

Tish

[Guest guest]

Interesting about the bursitis...I always wondered just why that

would appear seemingly out of nowhere!

> I have had a personal experience that seems to support Dr. Lowe's

> theory. When I first started on Armour, I was taking 1-1/4 grain. I

> felt generally ok at this level. But, after about 3 or 4 months on

> this dose, I began to develope bursitis in my joints and began to

> suffer really bad restless sleep, with aching muscles and joints,

> especially in my neck and shoulders. Soon, I could hardly find a

> pair of shoes I could wear. My symptoms fit fibromyalgia very well

> and I learned that bursitis commonly develops in hypothyroid

> patients who are put on T4.

>

> I had never had bursistis before in my life. I knew that somehow my

> thyroid treatment was related to my problems and so began to search

> the web and literature for information. I found a research article

> by Dr. Lowe, in which he said that bursistis was usually caused by

> the thyroid replacement dose being a bit low. So, I increased my

> dose of thyroid by 1/4 grain and within a week my bursitis was no

> longer bothering me and in two weeks it was gone. Within a month my

> sleep problems with the tight neck and shoulders also dissapeared.

I

> have not had a problem with my joints since and the fibro like

> symptoms are still gone.

> Tish

[Guest guest]

I just wanted to comment on dosages. This is just my opinion. In my

own experience, when I get my thyroid dose too high I know it. I am

now on 1-1/2 grains of Armour a day. As an experiment, I went up to

2 and within a few days knew I was too high. First, my hands got a

little shaky in the mornings and I started having more restless

wired up nights. Then my energy began to flag. My eyes began to feel

funny and a little out of focus in the mornings. I couldn't ride my

bike to my usual daily destinations without feeling like it was a

chore. It wasn't a good feeling.

So, I think that if a person raises their thyroid dose " SLOWLY " up

and does not have any symptoms of it being too high, they are not

overdosing. One good check for overdose is to check your resting

pulse. It should not exceed about 80 beats per minute. Also, keep a

diary of your body temperatures taken 3 times a day about 3 hours

apart starting in the morning after your first thyroid dose. Make

notes on how you are feeling each day. Of course adrenal fatigue can

complicate things by affecting pulse as well as temperatures. In

adrenal fatigue, temps will fluctuate a lot and pulse might stay on

the low side. So, with adrenal fatigue it is more difficult to tell

if thyroid is too high. You can easily check for adrenal fatigue by

getting a blood pressure cuff and checking your blood pressure lying

down and then again standing up. If the pressure drops any when you

stand, you have adrenal fatigue. You can also shine a light in your

eyes and have someone or you look at your pupils to see if they are

constricting and staying constricted. Hold the light there for at

least a minute. In adrenal fatigue the pupil cannot remain

constricted and either will open back up or will flutter as it

attempts to block out the light but is having trouble. These tests

indicate a lack of sufficient adrenal hormones.

With adrenal fatigue, I have found that it is difficult to raise

thyroid hormones very fast. If you don't have enough adrenal

hormones, your cells cannot use thyroid hormone well and you can get

thyroid overdose symptoms from relatively low doses. This is because

without sufficient adrenal hormones needed in the process of

creating energy, thyroid hormone builds up in the blood and can

effect some of more sensitive tissues like the heart (racing heart).

When I first was started on thyroid hormone, I couldn't tolerate

even 1/4 grain because of my major adrenal fatigue. So, the two

(adrenals and thyroid) work together and have to be balanced.

Anyway, I don't think it's that big a thing to worry about with

doses because if it's too high you know it and won't be able to

tolerate it for very long.

Tish