RE: Re: St. Augustine to explore offering t-DPT to DC's?

[Guest guest]

I'd have to find out more about the program, but if it's a DPT and not

a tDPT, the the applicant/student will have to go through PT school to

get their MPT then on to DPT...so marketing to anyone with a Bachelors

is what he's doing..a teacher, journalist, or DC...they will all have

to go thru the MPT first...if I'm reading it right. However, I don't

think marketing to DC's is what he should do. We already compete so

much with them...but I can tell you from experience, Paris' philosophy

is that there is always room for GOOD PT's.. and if others can't

compete they must improve or move...So he'll continue to pump out PT's

from whatever profession is interested. I still don't agree though.

Re: St. Augustine to explore offering t-DPT to

DC's?

This is a disconcerting move, to say the least. The DPT is currently

considered the terminal degree for PTs and now DCs can skip right to

the terminal degree as an online option while " comping " out of classes

as well?! It would be nice (if not idealistic) if some resemblance of

academic integrity could be maintained now days. The two paradigms

are very different and it seems irresponsible to allow the cross over

between professions without more rigorous prior study before allowing

a candidate to enter the DPT program. I know there are many people who

still feel strongly against the DPT (that's another story) but this

seems like a blatant strategy to increase the market for Dr. Paris'

DPT program and allow DCs to improve their billing strategies as well.

Cohen PT, MS

Looking to start and own 100% of your own Practice?

Visit www.InHomeRehab.com.

PTManager encourages participation in your professional association.

Join and

participate now!

Please identify yourself in all postings to PTManager.

[Guest guest]

Josh, I agree with you in that regard about the chiros going through a DPT

program just as any athletic trainer, artist, or foreign trained MD would. I

have a problem if it is a t-DPT because this is were it would be easy for them

and real sacrifice to obtain the degree. I think it would not be a bad problem

if they went through the program just like you and I did. I had thought of

going to Chiropractic school at one time and if it would make my entrance into

the

program easier because I was a PT great but I am expected to do the same

work. Now if I could test out of a massage class cool but the bulk of the work I

have to be taught over under their philosophy. I don't have a problem with that

in this regard because they would make a much better PT than someone who has

no background what so ever in the healthcare arena. I find that that person

would help the profession as far as the image of physical therapy but they have

to earn it through a traditional program and not online through a t-DPT

because they are not transitioning. This would be the information to find out.

Onuwa Terry, PT

( Doctor of Physical Therapy, Student)

Terry Physical Therapy, PC

1918 E. Parkway

Mission Texas 98752

www.terrypt.com

) Office

Fax

[Guest guest]

Are we saying Chiros we be able to obtain a state PT license and thus bill

as a PT?

Joe Ruzich, PT

Re: St. Augustine to explore offering t-DPT to DC's?

This is a disconcerting move, to say the least. The DPT is currently

considered the terminal degree for PTs and now DCs can skip right to the

terminal degree as an online option while " comping " out of classes as well?!

It would be nice (if not idealistic) if some resemblance of

academic integrity could be maintained now days. The two paradigms

are very different and it seems irresponsible to allow the cross over

between professions without more rigorous prior study before allowing a

candidate to enter the DPT program. I know there are many people who still

feel strongly against the DPT (that's another story) but this seems like a

blatant strategy to increase the market for Dr. Paris'

DPT program and allow DCs to improve their billing strategies as well.

Cohen PT, MS

Looking to start and own 100% of your own Practice?

Visit www.InHomeRehab.com.

PTManager encourages participation in your professional association. Join

and participate now!

Please identify yourself in all postings to PTManager.

[Guest guest]

I am currently enrolled int he t-DPT program at the University of St. Augustine.

Acceptance into the program includes among many things, a degree, BS or MS in

physical therapy. The program is completed partly on-line, with seminars, a

capstone residency and a week long testing for certification. Dr. Paris has

always been a staunch advocate for the physical therapy profession, especially

in regard to chiropractic and other practices which pit themselves in an

adversarial fashion to our profession. By the way, the St. Augustine program

was one of the first programs to receive accreditation for their distance

learning format.

Re: Re: St. Augustine to explore offering t-DPT to

DC's?

Josh, I agree with you in that regard about the chiros going through a DPT

program just as any athletic trainer, artist, or foreign trained MD would. I

have a problem if it is a t-DPT because this is were it would be easy for them

and real sacrifice to obtain the degree. I think it would not be a bad problem

if they went through the program just like you and I did. I had thought of

going to Chiropractic school at one time and if it would make my entrance into

the

program easier because I was a PT great but I am expected to do the same

work. Now if I could test out of a massage class cool but the bulk of the work I

have to be taught over under their philosophy. I don't have a problem with that

in this regard because they would make a much better PT than someone who has

no background what so ever in the healthcare arena. I find that that person

would help the profession as far as the image of physical therapy but they have

to earn it through a traditional program and not online through a t-DPT

because they are not transitioning. This would be the information to find out.

Onuwa Terry, PT

( Doctor of Physical Therapy, Student)

Terry Physical Therapy, PC

1918 E. Parkway

Mission Texas 98752

www.terrypt.com

) Office

Fax

[Guest guest]

,

I have copied your note to Dr. Paris and will encourage him to join this

list serve so that he can be part of this discussion. I certainly appreciate

your eloquent and thought provoking comments. I believe that when individuals

such as yourself express clearly their concerns and accolades, that persons

who have the best interest of the profession in mind will prevail (my hopeful

vision). I do think that Dr. Paris is often a lightening rod but he forces us

to look carefully at ourselves. I do believe that he only wishes our

profession to grow and prosper.

Thanks,

Steve Tepper, PT, PhD

PS I will check into the land law regarding DC's but I believe that you

are correct.

In a message dated 1/31/2006 10:23:58 PM Eastern Standard Time,

DrDrewpt@... writes:

Steve,

Thank you for getting clarification from Dr. Paris, please pass along

my personal thanks, and the thanks of others on this forum for that.

No one here is attacking Dr. Paris' integrity or commitment to the

profession, and I for one GREATLY appreciate his clarification. To

paraphrase, I'd agree with what Dr. Paris describes as the potential

to find " diamonds in the rough " among disgruntled DC's willing to

disavow chiropractic philosophy in favor of a clinical philosophy

more consistent with the DPT.

I'd like, again, to try to turn people away from discussion about the

ethics or legality of such a program, and refocus upon the idea

of, " Is this a smart move for the profession? " I'm still not

convinced or reassured by Dr. Paris that it is (But I am reassured

that it doesn't sound as though he's completely convinced either).

While I understand and appreciate the potentially positive vision

that Dr. Paris puts forth, there are several doomsday scenarios that,

in my opinion should be judiciously considered. Not in a panic, and

not with any animosity, but seriously considered in a " profession of

physical therapy business plan " or strategic vision sort of way.

Among them are the following:

1. The majority of DPT's are not seasoned clinicians who have

completed a t-DPT. Most are entry-level novice physical therapists.

As the profession moves forward toward autonomous interdependence, we

must consider the potential perils of admitting DC's to DPT programs,

even entry level. This is not to advocate an anti DC bias, but if

the DPT vision is to succeed, it must be considered that DPT's, not

those with combined degrees, must lead the charge. It must be

considered that the vision and motivation of an individual with

multiple degrees may not be entirely loyal to the profession of

physical therapy. Should such a negative outcome be realized, the

DPT vision may be squashed before it ever gets legs. That, I'm sure

even Dr. Paris would agree, would be a shame.

2. It has been argued that any DC who enters a DC to DPT program

would have to pass the same boards as any DPT. This may not be the

case. There are several states, (I believe, and Steve please correct

me if I'm wrong, that land is an example), where DC's are

permitted to advertise " physical therapy " because the term is not yet

protected. The potential for a DC to complete a DPT program as

described by Dr. Paris, but to NOT take the licensing exam, does

exist in theory. Furthermore, the potential for a DC to complete the

DPT program, sit for the boards, pass them, and advertise oneself as

a Doctor of Chiropractic who, as a DC also has complete mastery of

physical therapy, exists as well. My concern is that as DC's

currently have direct access to directly reimbursable patients, and

DPT's do not, that the public can be quickly and incorrectly skewed

into thinking that a DC is to a DPT, as a lawyer is to a paralegal ---

even those DC's WITHOUT DPT training. That, I'm confident Dr. Paris

would agree, would be a disaster for our profession.

Alarmist? Perhaps, but most bad ideas and unintended consequences

begin with a positive vision, full of hope. As Dr. Paris proceeds

with exploration of his vision --- and make no mistake, I support him

in that exploration --- I believe that we as a profession must

encourage him to tread VERY carefully, and judiciously weigh the

potential benefits and value for the profession with very real, very

plausible dangers. I do not question the commitment nor loyalty that

Dr. Paris has demonstrated to the profession of physical therapy over

the years, but I do request that we as stakeholders have a very real,

non-alarmist debate on the issue, BEFORE decisions are made and a

program of this sort encouraged. Concurrently, I'd like to appeal to

Dr. Paris that as he explores the potential of such a program, he

strongly consider less what alarmist PT's may have to say about such

a program --- and more in a business plan nature, about the full span

of potential positive AND negative consequences of such a program,

constantly asking himself, at every stage in the process, and about

every potential outcome (positive AND negative) " Is this outcome

right for the profession? "

M. Ball, PT, DPT, PhD

[Guest guest]

I agree with below. If they earn the degree and past the state boards,

then they can choose which way they would prefer to practice and bill.

The licensing is the key here.

Kathy berger, P.T.

Manager of Physical Therapy

Mercy Medical Center

Canton, Ohio 44708

kathy.smithberger@...

Re: St. Augustine to explore offering t-DPT to

DC's?

Hi Steve!

Thanks you for posting this interesting discussion! I was talking to

a University of St. Augustine alumni friend this afternnon when I

first heard about this topic. To be honest, I was shocked at first so

I tried to do some checking on the topic. I am so glad to read the

position of Dr. Paris on your posting. It was quite a relief.

It is nice to realize that the program provided by Univeristy of St.

Augustine is not a t-DPT but a 12 Semester DPT Post Baccalaureate -

an entry level degree. This makes a lot of difference for those who

were alarmed like me.

I think the main issues here are: DC earning a DPT degree, billing,

and licensing.

I don't have much conern with the the first 2 issues but I am

concerned on the licensing.

DC earning a DPT degree? The program USA offers is a post BS DPT

degree. I don't see a problem with that. It's like offering the

program to anyone who has a BS degree. It's open for anyone eligible

to apply for the program. Therefore, chiropractors can pursue their

degree in physical therapy like anyone else. I think it just more

sensationalized because of the fact that chiropractors are in the

program or could be in the program. Really, no problem with that!

Just like PTs becoming MDs or vice-versa. I am a graduate of

University of St. Augustine so I know how rigorous the program is and

anyone who is in program would know.(let the chiropractors experience

it, too, smilin).Who knows, the best DPT can be a DC? Nothing wrong

with that, it would benefit our physical therapy profession.

The billing situation. Not a problem if they become physical

therapists. This is my very main concern: they have to be a state

licensed physical therapists. I believe that these chiropractors

becoming a physical therapists should also be licensed physical

therapists before they can practice our profession and bill for the

services. If this happens, still, not a problem. If this is not the

case, then it is a concern.

There will be a lot of opinions on this issue and it is a good topic

to discuss since it will affect our profession now and in the future.

I respect Dr. Paris highly and I am sure he would not do anything to

hurt our profession.I thank him for his vision. I thank you Steve for

posting this interesting topic.

Gerry Catapang, PT, DPT

President

Missouri Medical Private Practice Consultants, LLC

www.myownclinicinoneweek.com

-- In PTManager , MDTepper@... wrote:

>

> Hello,

>

> I asked Dr. Stanley Paris to comment on this discussion and I

received the

> following email from him which he asked me to share with all of

you. I

> apologize if this is not the usual way to post information.

>

> Thanks,

> Steve Tepper

>

>

>

> In a message dated 1/30/2006 2:38:52 PM Eastern Standard Time,

> sparis@... writes:

>

>

> Steve,

>

> WHAT MIGHT NOT HAVE BEEN CLEAR IS THAT THIS IS NOT A T-DPT BUT A

12 SEMESTER

> DPT FOR POST BACCALAUREATE - AN ENTRY LEVEL PROGRAM

>

> I would appreciate this response being posted to anyone who has

heard of the

> meeting that we are planning to have with chiropractors interested

in

> transitioning to a DPT degree. For a start we are not the only

school looking at

> this issue and the other program has been looking at it longer

than us. While I

> have historically fought chiropractic, no doubt more than any

other

> therapist, and have spent quite a few dollars and much time in the

process being sued

> by them etc. both in New Zealand and the United States, I have

always felt

> that out best defense was to strengthen our own profession and

defend against

> incursions by them while at the same time not speaking ill of them.

>

> Basically chiropractors are of three groups. The super straight,

straight

> and those using EBP. Most schools are tending towards the straight

to EBP model

> but most students are in the super straight and straight schools.

There is a

> growing realization in chiropractic that EBP is the way

reimbursement and

> practice is going and that where they need to be. The schools

might be less

> concerned than the clinicians. But today's EBP chiropractor, is at

least in the

> musculoskeletal area, not too far removed from physical therapy

practices.

> Given that five years after graduation only 50% are practicing as

chiropractors

> there are a great number that have left the profession for

whatever

> reason(s).

>

> We already have one DC in our 12 semester online and weekend lab

DPT program

> based in Boca Raton. He is taking all the courses and not clepping

out or

> transferring credits in any way. He is a student in every sense.

We are calling

> the meeting to which you refer to look at all the issues involved

in

> allowing these persons to become PTs. Culture is foremost and so

is EBP. Paying

> attention to those aspects I b believe we will find many a

candidate that will

> make an ideal DPT. Today, sociologists predict that most young

people will have

> three careers. I am sure that if a DC wishes to become a DPT such

a career

> move will serve them well and serve well those in need of their

services.

>

> Do consider that if the likes of Erhard PT., DC who has

worked and

> researched with Tony Delitto as well as being a founding member of

AAOMPT and

> the first president of IFOMT (International Federation of

Orthopaedic

> Manipulative Therapists), then while there might not be other Dr.

Erhards there are

> still many fine DC's that would make excellent DPTs. We are just

considering

> the process in reverse. Likewise both chiropractors and physical

therapists

> have applied to and be accepted into medical schools. So I have

difficulty in

> seeing what the problem is. We certainly are not teaching them

seminars. We

> have never knowingly admitted a chiropractor to our seminars.

>

> There is no political agenda here but I am sure some will read

such into

> it. There certainly is no " selling out. " Any candidate must meet

our usual

> criteria for admission including interviews. Our program has rigor

and does

> graduate an excellent DPT. Personally I feel that I am in good

position to both

> listen to and be understanding of the cultural differences and

will assure my

> profession that should we continue to admit DCs they will be

cultured into

> physical therapy. We are calling a meeting and have made no firm

decisions

> beyond that. We are proceeding slowly and cautiously. Additionally

I am aware of

> my position in this profession and I feel my actions are wholly

consistent

> with that position.

>

> Thank you for your request for information.. Best wishes.

>

> Stanley

>

>

> Stanley V. Paris PT., PhD., FAPTA

> President, University of St. Augustine,

> 1 University Blvd.,

> St. Augustine, FL 32086

> USA

> Voice

> Toll Free

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Please help clarify for me, from the last email it appears to me that the

University of Augustine is an accredited university that offers entry level PT

training. What Stanley Paris is doing is offering a part time entry level

course of study which is 12 semesters long (6 years) and is open to

chiropractors. I would then infer that they would go through all entry level PT

training including learning how to care for inpatients as well as having

mandatory clinical training in a variety of settings, etc. Is this what the St

Augustine program is?

Bettye -Saleh, PT

Easter Seals

Ventura, CA

________________________________

From: PTManager on behalf of Dr. Gerry Catapang

Sent: Thu 2/2/2006 2:10 AM

To: PTManager

Subject: Re: St. Augustine to explore offering t-DPT to DC's?

Hi Steve!

Thanks you for posting this interesting discussion! I was talking to

a University of St. Augustine alumni friend this afternnon when I

first heard about this topic. To be honest, I was shocked at first so

I tried to do some checking on the topic. I am so glad to read the

position of Dr. Paris on your posting. It was quite a relief.

It is nice to realize that the program provided by Univeristy of St.

Augustine is not a t-DPT but a 12 Semester DPT Post Baccalaureate -

an entry level degree. This makes a lot of difference for those who

were alarmed like me.

I think the main issues here are: DC earning a DPT degree, billing,

and licensing.

I don't have much conern with the the first 2 issues but I am

concerned on the licensing.

DC earning a DPT degree? The program USA offers is a post BS DPT

degree. I don't see a problem with that. It's like offering the

program to anyone who has a BS degree. It's open for anyone eligible

to apply for the program. Therefore, chiropractors can pursue their

degree in physical therapy like anyone else. I think it just more

sensationalized because of the fact that chiropractors are in the

program or could be in the program. Really, no problem with that!

Just like PTs becoming MDs or vice-versa. I am a graduate of

University of St. Augustine so I know how rigorous the program is and

anyone who is in program would know.(let the chiropractors experience

it, too, smilin).Who knows, the best DPT can be a DC? Nothing wrong

with that, it would benefit our physical therapy profession.

The billing situation. Not a problem if they become physical

therapists. This is my very main concern: they have to be a state

licensed physical therapists. I believe that these chiropractors

becoming a physical therapists should also be licensed physical

therapists before they can practice our profession and bill for the

services. If this happens, still, not a problem. If this is not the

case, then it is a concern.

There will be a lot of opinions on this issue and it is a good topic

to discuss since it will affect our profession now and in the future.

I respect Dr. Paris highly and I am sure he would not do anything to

hurt our profession.I thank him for his vision. I thank you Steve for

posting this interesting topic.

Gerry Catapang, PT, DPT

President

Missouri Medical Private Practice Consultants, LLC

www.myownclinicinoneweek.com

-- In PTManager , MDTepper@... wrote:

>

> Hello,

>

> I asked Dr. Stanley Paris to comment on this discussion and I

received the

> following email from him which he asked me to share with all of

you. I

> apologize if this is not the usual way to post information.

>

> Thanks,

> Steve Tepper

>

>

>

> In a message dated 1/30/2006 2:38:52 PM Eastern Standard Time,

> sparis@... writes:

>

>

> Steve,

>

> WHAT MIGHT NOT HAVE BEEN CLEAR IS THAT THIS IS NOT A T-DPT BUT A

12 SEMESTER

> DPT FOR POST BACCALAUREATE - AN ENTRY LEVEL PROGRAM

>

> I would appreciate this response being posted to anyone who has

heard of the

> meeting that we are planning to have with chiropractors interested

in

> transitioning to a DPT degree. For a start we are not the only

school looking at

> this issue and the other program has been looking at it longer

than us. While I

> have historically fought chiropractic, no doubt more than any

other

> therapist, and have spent quite a few dollars and much time in the

process being sued

> by them etc. both in New Zealand and the United States, I have

always felt

> that out best defense was to strengthen our own profession and

defend against

> incursions by them while at the same time not speaking ill of them.

>

> Basically chiropractors are of three groups. The super straight,

straight

> and those using EBP. Most schools are tending towards the straight

to EBP model

> but most students are in the super straight and straight schools.

There is a

> growing realization in chiropractic that EBP is the way

reimbursement and

> practice is going and that where they need to be. The schools

might be less

> concerned than the clinicians. But today's EBP chiropractor, is at

least in the

> musculoskeletal area, not too far removed from physical therapy

practices.

> Given that five years after graduation only 50% are practicing as

chiropractors

> there are a great number that have left the profession for

whatever

> reason(s).

>

> We already have one DC in our 12 semester online and weekend lab

DPT program

> based in Boca Raton. He is taking all the courses and not clepping

out or

> transferring credits in any way. He is a student in every sense.

We are calling

> the meeting to which you refer to look at all the issues involved

in

> allowing these persons to become PTs. Culture is foremost and so

is EBP. Paying

> attention to those aspects I b believe we will find many a

candidate that will

> make an ideal DPT. Today, sociologists predict that most young

people will have

> three careers. I am sure that if a DC wishes to become a DPT such

a career

> move will serve them well and serve well those in need of their

services.

>

> Do consider that if the likes of Erhard PT., DC who has

worked and

> researched with Tony Delitto as well as being a founding member of

AAOMPT and

> the first president of IFOMT (International Federation of

Orthopaedic

> Manipulative Therapists), then while there might not be other Dr.

Erhards there are

> still many fine DC's that would make excellent DPTs. We are just

considering

> the process in reverse. Likewise both chiropractors and physical

therapists

> have applied to and be accepted into medical schools. So I have

difficulty in

> seeing what the problem is. We certainly are not teaching them

seminars. We

> have never knowingly admitted a chiropractor to our seminars.

>

> There is no political agenda here but I am sure some will read

such into

> it. There certainly is no " selling out. " Any candidate must meet

our usual

> criteria for admission including interviews. Our program has rigor

and does

> graduate an excellent DPT. Personally I feel that I am in good

position to both

> listen to and be understanding of the cultural differences and

will assure my

> profession that should we continue to admit DCs they will be

cultured into

> physical therapy. We are calling a meeting and have made no firm

decisions

> beyond that. We are proceeding slowly and cautiously. Additionally

I am aware of

> my position in this profession and I feel my actions are wholly

consistent

> with that position.

>

> Thank you for your request for information.. Best wishes.

>

> Stanley

>

>

> Stanley V. Paris PT., PhD., FAPTA

> President, University of St. Augustine,

> 1 University Blvd.,

> St. Augustine, FL 32086

> USA

> Voice

> Toll Free

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Kathy,

Your post poses a very interesting question.

If a DC does indeed complete a Post Baccalaureate DPT degree and then pass

their State Board Examination will they in fact have to choose which way

they will practice and bill? Can someone like that have dual licenses within

the same state? If so, which licensing board will they be held accountable

to for their professional, ethical and legal conduct? Who will have

jurisdiction - the PT Board or the DC Board?

Here's an even more mind boggling question.

There are mnay cases where a PTA goes on to become a PT or an ATC or Massage

Therapist goes on to become a PT and get their PT license, and it has been

proposed that in most states that particular person will always be held

accountable for the higher (greater responsibility) license - presumably the

PT license in such examples. In other words if a PT decides to work in a

fitness center and practice as a trainer or masseuse, but still holds a PT

license, they will be held accountable by the highest license - in such

cases, perhaps arguably, the PT license.

Well, you've guessed my next question.

What would happen if a person has both DC and PT licenses in a state that

allows it, and they are involved in some complaint/ dispute about their

professional or ethical conduct? Which license would be considered the

'higher standard' to be held to? DC or PT?

Quite the conundrum. But all questions that our profession should think

about and discuss openly.

All the best

Louie Puentedura, PT, DPT, GDMT, OCS

S.W. Rehabilitation Associates

Yuma, AZ 85364

RE: Re: St. Augustine to explore offering t-DPT to

DC's?

>I agree with below. If they earn the degree and past the state boards,

> then they can choose which way they would prefer to practice and bill.

> The licensing is the key here.

>

> Kathy berger, P.T.

> Manager of Physical Therapy

> Mercy Medical Center

> Canton, Ohio 44708

> kathy.smithberger@...

[Guest guest]

Interesting discussion

One item that would figure into the mix is if the professional lists dual

licensing in advertising / on wall / or even maintaining with board. In

that case you would certainly need to be held to standards for both. I

would think they are expected to have professional judgment equal to

community standards in both. If you make a clear break with one profession;

then, with time you would no longer be held to that standard. I suspect

there is no clear cut answer and it depends on who is " after your

reputation " at the time.

Steve Passmore PT

Healthy Recruiting Tools

spass@...

Re: Re: St. Augustine to explore offering t-DPT to

DC's?

Hi Kathy,

Your post poses a very interesting question.

If a DC does indeed complete a Post Baccalaureate DPT degree and then pass

their State Board Examination will they in fact have to choose which way

they will practice and bill? Can someone like that have dual licenses within

the same state? If so, which licensing board will they be held accountable

to for their professional, ethical and legal conduct? Who will have

jurisdiction - the PT Board or the DC Board?

Here's an even more mind boggling question.

There are mnay cases where a PTA goes on to become a PT or an ATC or Massage

Therapist goes on to become a PT and get their PT license, and it has been

proposed that in most states that particular person will always be held

accountable for the higher (greater responsibility) license - presumably the

PT license in such examples. In other words if a PT decides to work in a

fitness center and practice as a trainer or masseuse, but still holds a PT

license, they will be held accountable by the highest license - in such

cases, perhaps arguably, the PT license.

Well, you've guessed my next question.

What would happen if a person has both DC and PT licenses in a state that

allows it, and they are involved in some complaint/ dispute about their

professional or ethical conduct? Which license would be considered the

'higher standard' to be held to? DC or PT?

Quite the conundrum. But all questions that our profession should think

about and discuss openly.

All the best

Louie Puentedura, PT, DPT, GDMT, OCS

S.W. Rehabilitation Associates

Yuma, AZ 85364

RE: Re: St. Augustine to explore offering t-DPT to

DC's?

>I agree with below. If they earn the degree and past the state boards,

> then they can choose which way they would prefer to practice and bill.

> The licensing is the key here.

>

> Kathy berger, P.T.

> Manager of Physical Therapy

> Mercy Medical Center

> Canton, Ohio 44708

> kathy.smithberger@...

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[Guest guest]

Louie,

Maybe too simple of an answer, but if they are going to carry both

licenses and practice/bill as a PT and a DC then you are held to the

standards of both boards. I am assuming here (and I know I probably

shouldn't) but I would be willing to bet if you look at both boards

ethical standards, they would be similiar. The person that held both

licenses would have the burden of maintaining the standards of both

boards and making sure he is billing, documenting, and representing

himself to the public in an ethical and legal manner.

Kathy berger, P.T.

Manager of Physical Therapy

Mercy Medical Center

Canton, Ohio 44708

kathy.smithberger@...

Re: Re: St. Augustine to explore offering t-DPT to

DC's?

Hi Kathy,

Your post poses a very interesting question.

If a DC does indeed complete a Post Baccalaureate DPT degree and then

pass

their State Board Examination will they in fact have to choose which way

they will practice and bill? Can someone like that have dual licenses

within

the same state? If so, which licensing board will they be held

accountable

to for their professional, ethical and legal conduct? Who will have

jurisdiction - the PT Board or the DC Board?

Here's an even more mind boggling question.

There are mnay cases where a PTA goes on to become a PT or an ATC or

Massage

Therapist goes on to become a PT and get their PT license, and it has

been

proposed that in most states that particular person will always be held

accountable for the higher (greater responsibility) license - presumably

the

PT license in such examples. In other words if a PT decides to work in a

fitness center and practice as a trainer or masseuse, but still holds a

PT

license, they will be held accountable by the highest license - in such

cases, perhaps arguably, the PT license.

Well, you've guessed my next question.

What would happen if a person has both DC and PT licenses in a state

that

allows it, and they are involved in some complaint/ dispute about their

professional or ethical conduct? Which license would be considered the

'higher standard' to be held to? DC or PT?

Quite the conundrum. But all questions that our profession should think

about and discuss openly.

All the best

Louie Puentedura, PT, DPT, GDMT, OCS

S.W. Rehabilitation Associates

Yuma, AZ 85364

RE: Re: St. Augustine to explore offering t-DPT to

DC's?

>I agree with below. If they earn the degree and past the state boards,

> then they can choose which way they would prefer to practice and bill.

> The licensing is the key here.

>

> Kathy berger, P.T.

> Manager of Physical Therapy

> Mercy Medical Center

> Canton, Ohio 44708

> kathy.smithberger@...

Looking to start and own 100% of your own Practice?

Visit www.InHomeRehab.com.

PTManager encourages participation in your professional association.

Join and participate now!

Please identify yourself in all postings to PTManager.