RE: sun & vitamins Re: sun Re: Re: spider bite

[Guest guest]

On 7/5/06, haecklers <haecklers@...> wrote:

> Florida is supposed to be where a lot of the fluoride they put in

> drinking water comes from, from the phosphate fertilizer industry.

> Do you think they are using more vitamin D to detox fluoride

> poisoning or something? Do you know if there is fluoride pollution

> near you? I've heard it's hard to find out, but if there are metal

> works or phosphate companies, I guess that's a big clue.

I don't know how fluoride affects vitamin D metabolism, but I do know

we haven't covered all the conventional bases yet. Buildings, ozone,

air pollution, clouds, sunscreen, and so on all reduce exposure to

UV-B light. So if you're in a city, for example, it's much harder to

get sufficient UV-B. Going out in the sun with sunscreen is entirely

useless. Going out in the sun for a half hour, and then washing all

the vitamin D off your skin in the shower is likewise useless.

So, I wonder if these people Allyn is talking to could use any of

those variables to account for their inability to maintain D with the

sun?

Chris

--

The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

The ones who have had their Vit. D tested, as previously stated, take 1 tsp.

of cod liver oil and go out in the sun for an hour. Most of us live " near "

Tampa Florida but most of us are out of the city. I live 20 miles north of

the very edge of Tampa and most of the people I know are in this vicinity.

They have stated it is in the middle of the day so I don't think they go in

the house and take a shower afterwards. I think the point I am getting at

is that we need to take a lot more Vit. D than we think. I take two

tablespoons a day of Blue Ice high vitamin but have not had my Vit. D

tested.

Allyn

_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of Masterjohn

Sent: Wednesday, July 05, 2006 5:39 PM

Subject: Re: sun & vitamins Re: sun Re: Re: spider bite

On 7/5/06, haecklers <haecklers (DOT) <mailto:haecklers%40> com>

wrote:

> Florida is supposed to be where a lot of the fluoride they put in

> drinking water comes from, from the phosphate fertilizer industry.

> Do you think they are using more vitamin D to detox fluoride

> poisoning or something? Do you know if there is fluoride pollution

> near you? I've heard it's hard to find out, but if there are metal

> works or phosphate companies, I guess that's a big clue.

I don't know how fluoride affects vitamin D metabolism, but I do know

we haven't covered all the conventional bases yet. Buildings, ozone,

air pollution, clouds, sunscreen, and so on all reduce exposure to

UV-B light. So if you're in a city, for example, it's much harder to

get sufficient UV-B. Going out in the sun with sunscreen is entirely

useless. Going out in the sun for a half hour, and then washing all

the vitamin D off your skin in the shower is likewise useless.

So, I wonder if these people Allyn is talking to could use any of

those variables to account for their inability to maintain D with the

sun?

Chris

--

The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

http://www.choleste <http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com>

rol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

Allyn,

> The ones who have had their Vit. D tested, as previously stated, take 1 tsp.

> of cod liver oil and go out in the sun for an hour. Most of us live " near "

> Tampa Florida but most of us are out of the city. I live 20 miles north of

> the very edge of Tampa and most of the people I know are in this vicinity.

> They have stated it is in the middle of the day so I don't think they go in

> the house and take a shower afterwards. I think the point I am getting at

> is that we need to take a lot more Vit. D than we think. I take two

> tablespoons a day of Blue Ice high vitamin but have not had my Vit. D

> tested.

I completely agree with you that we tend to need more vitamin D than

we think. I also agree that it is much more difficult to get it from

the sun than many people think. I'm just trying to think of what

variables might be responsible for *why* these people aren't getting

sufficient vitamin D in sunny Florida, sunbathing at noon.

When people sweat, they often like to wipe themselves down or jump in

the pool or rinse themselves off in the shower. I doubt they are

going to take a hot shower and thoroughly clean themselves with soap

and wash their hair in the middle of the day, but I think a lot of

people would want to rinse off after sitting in the sun and sweating.

I was just trying to brainstorm what might account for what you're

seeing. And swimming or rinsing off or wiping yourself down to much

without giving a chance for the vitamin D to absorb is one thing that

could account for it.

That supports your point that it is difficult to get enough D from

sun, but is an attempt to explain why. It has been pretty

well-studied, and light-skinned people do in fact make plenty of

vitamin D in a half hour of mid-day sun, assuming a variety of

variables, such as clouds, ozone, air pollution, and so on are

optimal, and assuming it is a relatively open space and so on.

Chris

--

The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

I find it interesting that you say you can " wipe off " the Vitamin D if you

don't let it absorb. I never thought that it would be sitting " on " your

skin but I thought the sun did something in the body and they made the D in

your body. Very interesting to me how this works.

Allyn

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_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of Masterjohn

Sent: Wednesday, July 05, 2006 9:35 PM

Subject: Re: sun & vitamins Re: sun Re: Re: spider bite

Allyn,

> The ones who have had their Vit. D tested, as previously stated, take 1

tsp.

> of cod liver oil and go out in the sun for an hour. Most of us live " near "

> Tampa Florida but most of us are out of the city. I live 20 miles north of

> the very edge of Tampa and most of the people I know are in this vicinity.

> They have stated it is in the middle of the day so I don't think they go

in

> the house and take a shower afterwards. I think the point I am getting at

> is that we need to take a lot more Vit. D than we think. I take two

> tablespoons a day of Blue Ice high vitamin but have not had my Vit. D

> tested.

I completely agree with you that we tend to need more vitamin D than

we think. I also agree that it is much more difficult to get it from

the sun than many people think. I'm just trying to think of what

variables might be responsible for *why* these people aren't getting

sufficient vitamin D in sunny Florida, sunbathing at noon.

When people sweat, they often like to wipe themselves down or jump in

the pool or rinse themselves off in the shower. I doubt they are

going to take a hot shower and thoroughly clean themselves with soap

and wash their hair in the middle of the day, but I think a lot of

people would want to rinse off after sitting in the sun and sweating.

I was just trying to brainstorm what might account for what you're

seeing. And swimming or rinsing off or wiping yourself down to much

without giving a chance for the vitamin D to absorb is one thing that

could account for it.

That supports your point that it is difficult to get enough D from

sun, but is an attempt to explain why. It has been pretty

well-studied, and light-skinned people do in fact make plenty of

vitamin D in a half hour of mid-day sun, assuming a variety of

variables, such as clouds, ozone, air pollution, and so on are

optimal, and assuming it is a relatively open space and so on.

Chris

--

The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

http://www.choleste <http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com>

rol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

Hi Allyn,

> I find it interesting that you say you can " wipe off " the Vitamin D if you

> don't let it absorb. I never thought that it would be sitting " on " your

> skin but I thought the sun did something in the body and they made the D in

> your body. Very interesting to me how this works.

The UV-B doesn't even penetrate very far into the skin at all. UV-A

penetrates much deeper, which doesn't make vitamin D. The Vitamin D

is produced on or near the surface of your skin, and takes time to

absorb. I think I read that it actually takes something like 7-9 days

to sink all the way into the blood stream! I think in general though

that an hour without rinsing or too much wiping should be sufficient

to get what is off the surface of the skin in a little bit.

Chris

--

The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

How can Vitamin D be washed off? Does it sit on your skin? I had the

idea it was inside. Don't really understand it. Do you know the actual

molecular/chemical happening? Could this be another article?

On Jul 5, 2006, at 2:39 PM, Masterjohn wrote:

> Going out in the sun for a half hour, and then washing all

> the vitamin D off your skin in the shower is likewise useless.

>

Parashis

artpages@...

zine:

artpagesonline.com

portfolio:

http://www.artpagesonline.com/EPportfolio/000portfolio.html

[Guest guest]

On 7/6/06, Parashis <artpages@...> wrote:

> How can Vitamin D be washed off? Does it sit on your skin? I had the

> idea it was inside. Don't really understand it. Do you know the actual

> molecular/chemical happening? Could this be another article?

It is mostly covered in my vitamin D article on my website

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/Vitamin-D.html, but I didn't go

into all the details.

The process is non-enzymatic. The UV-B causes a break in one of the

rings of 7-dehydrocholesterol, converting it into previtamin D3, which

is a cis/cis isomer of vitamin D3. Over the course of a couple hours,

this automatically isomerizes because it is itself thermodynamically

unstable, converting itself into vitamin D3. This latter part takes

place over the course of a couple hours and does not require sunlight.

As this occurs, the vitamin D is suggested to be freed from the

plasma membrane into the extracellular space, where it would be

eventually brought into the bloodstream.

I'm not sure exactly how deep vitamin D is formed, but it isn't very

deep, and there is oil transfer between the surface of your skin and

the just-beneath-the-surface of your skin, so it seems plausible that

you could lose vitamin D through the surface if you were sweating and

secreting oils and then washing them off. Now that I think of it, I

believe I read this in a secondary source -- Krispin Sullivan -- and

never followed up the references for it. So maybe it is unreliable

but I would think you could lose some, but not all, of the vitamin D

that way.

Chris

--

The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

Wow, so I guess people like me who are not sun worshippers, lol, really need

to take more cod liver oil. I am outside to get in my car and stuff like

that but don't like sitting in the sun. Too hot and I have enough hot

flashes!!!

Allyn

_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of Masterjohn

Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2006 8:17 AM

Subject: Re: sun & vitamins Re: sun Re: Re: spider bite

Hi Allyn,

> I find it interesting that you say you can " wipe off " the Vitamin D if you

> don't let it absorb. I never thought that it would be sitting " on " your

> skin but I thought the sun did something in the body and they made the D

in

> your body. Very interesting to me how this works.

The UV-B doesn't even penetrate very far into the skin at all. UV-A

penetrates much deeper, which doesn't make vitamin D. The Vitamin D

is produced on or near the surface of your skin, and takes time to

absorb. I think I read that it actually takes something like 7-9 days

to sink all the way into the blood stream! I think in general though

that an hour without rinsing or too much wiping should be sufficient

to get what is off the surface of the skin in a little bit.

Chris

--

The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

http://www.choleste <http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com>

rol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

Thanks, I'll reread your article and the rest of you email was

interesting. So it follow that bathing isn't really all that great. I

wonder if you live in Hawaii and bath in the ocean where you would get

a lot of sun rays on your skin plus all those minerals, if they are the

healthiest people alive? I never get to shower right after my run so

now feel heaps better about having to wait at least 12 hours.

On Jul 6, 2006, at 6:38 AM, Masterjohn wrote:

> It is mostly covered in my vitamin D article on my website

> http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/Vitamin-D.html, but I didn't go

> into all the details.

>

> The process is non-enzymatic. The UV-B causes a break in one of the

> rings of 7-dehydrocholesterol, converting it into previtamin D3, which

> is a cis/cis isomer of vitamin D3.

Parashis

artpages@...

zine:

artpagesonline.com

portfolio:

http://www.artpagesonline.com/EPportfolio/000portfolio.html

[Guest guest]

,

> Thanks, I'll reread your article and the rest of you email was

> interesting. So it follow that bathing isn't really all that great. I

> wonder if you live in Hawaii and bath in the ocean where you would get

> a lot of sun rays on your skin plus all those minerals, if they are the

> healthiest people alive? I never get to shower right after my run so

> now feel heaps better about having to wait at least 12 hours.

I don't think you need to wait 12 hours. An hour is probably good,

possibly a half hour. I read this in Krispin Sullivan's stuff, who's

done a lot of research on vitamin D, and I'll try to trace it back to

some primary research and let the list now if I find anything. Until

then, I'm not positive about how important the not washing thing is or

how long you should wait.

Chris

--

The Truth About Cholesterol

Find Out What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com