Re: Emergency? Child's eyesight

[Guest guest]

Let me make this recommendation. If possible, never wear your glasses to read

(say a page or a book). At distance, sure you need glasses. But as long as

you can read a book without glasses, then never wear glasses when reading a

book, doing homework, etc. </HTML>

[Guest guest]

i too am nearsighted and my layman understanding of the issues boils down to

us not really being designed to view two dimensional stuff for long periods

at a time (ie: reading books, watching tc, computers, etc.). i was / am an

avid book reader; my brother was / is not and has perfect vision. sooo, i'm

sure genetics plays a role but if ya do unatural things (as defined by

things humans didn't do 10,000 years ago or so) then ya sometimes pay the

price of evolutionary slowness <g>.

oliver...

On 7/2/07, aelewark <aelewark@...> wrote:

>

> but he is an avid bookreader -- he reads for several hours

> every day.

> .

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

You won't hear much about this in the eye care world, who deny it can

happen (at least to me they always have) but I remember distinctly as

a child having a period where I had lots of floaters and right around

then I started needing glasses. I still don't know what caused it,

but the floaters went away (until I got lyme) and my perscription has

stayed exactly the same for the last 30 years!

So I had 20/20, then floaters, then astigmatism, then the same

perscription from then on.

Seems to me like it's either something environmental or some sort of

infection. Reason I say that, also, is lots of people with lyme have

floaters. Some think it's parasites getting into the eyes.

Sorry I can't tell you what to do about it. I have heard that vision

loss can be recovered, but I've never tried it either.

--- In , " aelewark " <aelewark@...>

wrote:

>

> I got glasses when I was in first grade -- the classroom was dark, I

> was seated in the last row, and the chalkboard was always dusty. My

> teacher suggested that my vision be evaluated, and it was found to

be

> 20/40 so I was given glasses. After becoming an adult, I've

been

> pretty upset about that. Now my vision is around 20/400.

>

> My DH got glasses in high school. Our vision is about the same now,

> but his astigmatism is in the opposite eye (and he has central

serous

> chorioretinopathy).

>

> Fast forward to last year. I took my son, 5 years old, for his

first

> visit to the optometrist. At the time, we were eating a GFCF diet,

> still some processed foods, and he had just had a megadose of

Vitamin

> A for the antiviral protocol. His vision was 20/15.

>

> He was breastfed until he was nearly 3 1/2, now he eats a very clean

> diet (gluten-free NT, lots of raw dairy and saturated fats, very,

very

> little PUFAs). He's homeschooled. Very little computer time, litte

> television, but he is an avid bookreader -- he reads for several

hours

> every day.

>

> Today he had another eye check. A couple months ago, he started

> getting really close to the television, and said that he was seeing

> floaters. He's stopped wanting to play the piano much. He has

> trouble finding things. He was only able to read the top row of

> letters on the eye chart without assistance. The optometrist said

he

> has 20/200 eyesight.

>

> Since mine is 20/400, I've been asking him to read things, and then

> taking my glasses off to see if he's twice as far away from me when

he

> can't read it anymore... he's probably three times as far away

from me.

>

> Does anyone know anything about this? My educated guess is that the

> eyes must be pretty resilient, if people are growing TEETH back! I

> have a book _Relearning to See_ by Quackenbush, which I

bought

> for my husband and self, but haven't read. I just don't know what

the

> best approach is with a child.

>

> He's on Green Pastures CLO, supplemental K2, Vitamin C, was on B-

100,

> but will be coenzymated B vitamins very soon, glucosamine sulfate,

> sometimes glycine and taurine (going to see if NAC helps), milk

> thistle... and has done a couple rounds of ALA chelation.

>

> I'm apt to think this is nutritionally influenced, despite having

> improved things so much, but if it's mostly because he's got his

head

> tucked into a book so early in his life, then... I'd hate to

> discourage him.

>

> Thanks,

>

> Amy

>

[Guest guest]

>

> I got glasses when I was in first grade -- the classroom was dark, I

> was seated in the last row, and the chalkboard was always dusty. My

> teacher suggested that my vision be evaluated, and it was found to be

> 20/40 so I was given glasses. After becoming an adult, I've been

> pretty upset about that. Now my vision is around 20/400.

>

> My DH got glasses in high school. Our vision is about the same now,

> but his astigmatism is in the opposite eye (and he has central serous

> chorioretinopathy).

>

> Fast forward to last year. I took my son, 5 years old, for his first

> visit to the optometrist. At the time, we were eating a GFCF diet,

> still some processed foods, and he had just had a megadose of Vitamin

> A for the antiviral protocol. His vision was 20/15.

>

> He was breastfed until he was nearly 3 1/2, now he eats a very clean

> diet (gluten-free NT, lots of raw dairy and saturated fats, very, very

> little PUFAs). He's homeschooled. Very little computer time, litte

> television, but he is an avid bookreader -- he reads for several hours

> every day.

>

> Today he had another eye check. A couple months ago, he started

> getting really close to the television, and said that he was seeing

> floaters. He's stopped wanting to play the piano much. He has

> trouble finding things. He was only able to read the top row of

> letters on the eye chart without assistance. The optometrist said he

> has 20/200 eyesight.

>

> Since mine is 20/400, I've been asking him to read things, and then

> taking my glasses off to see if he's twice as far away from me when he

> can't read it anymore... he's probably three times as far away from me.

>

> Does anyone know anything about this? My educated guess is that the

> eyes must be pretty resilient, if people are growing TEETH back! I

> have a book _Relearning to See_ by Quackenbush, which I bought

> for my husband and self, but haven't read. I just don't know what the

> best approach is with a child.

>

> He's on Green Pastures CLO, supplemental K2, Vitamin C, was on B-100,

> but will be coenzymated B vitamins very soon, glucosamine sulfate,

> sometimes glycine and taurine (going to see if NAC helps), milk

> thistle... and has done a couple rounds of ALA chelation.

>

> I'm apt to think this is nutritionally influenced, despite having

> improved things so much, but if it's mostly because he's got his head

> tucked into a book so early in his life, then... I'd hate to

> discourage him.

>

> Thanks,

>

> Amy

>

How's his facial development? I read recently (can't remember where)

that narrow palates and underdevelopment of the face can contribute to

poor eyesight. Cranialsacral therapy is supposed to help with this.

[Guest guest]

I think my vision was pretty good until traumatized at age 8, then I

got nearsighted. My glasses prescriptions started out at -2.25 in my

right eye (left eye has never been all that bad), and is now at -1.25.

I noticed from the beginning that it was uncomfortable to read with my

glasses on -- and I read a LOT, which is probably why my eyes didn't

get better faster -- so I would always take my glasses off to read.

Kept asking people, and the ones who wore glasses all the time got

stronger prescriptions every time they went to the eye Dr. I decided

that my eyes needed to be *used* to get stronger, and wore my glasses

less and less. Then I started looking off into the distance every so

often when I was reading, to relax those eye muscles.

So sad for all these people who weren't told that if they wore their

glasses all the time that those muscles would get " stuck " in that

position.

I'm hoping that my son will save his excellent eyesight by not

focusing up-close for long periods without " stretching " his vision

every little bit.

Joy

> >

> > I got glasses when I was in first grade -- the classroom was dark, I

> > was seated in the last row, and the chalkboard was always dusty. My

> > teacher suggested that my vision be evaluated, and it was found to be

> > 20/40 so I was given glasses. After becoming an adult, I've been

> > pretty upset about that. Now my vision is around 20/400.

> >

> > My DH got glasses in high school. Our vision is about the same no

[Guest guest]

He has a narrow lower third of his face.

Interestingly enough, I was searching for information about B-vitamins

and salicylates (he's been off the B-vitamins for a bit, and his

salicylate reactions are worsening since his last round of chelation

and Vitamin K2), and found references to salicylate poisoning and

fuzzy vision and floaters! It was referenced in articles about

metabolic acidosis, which has been treated with thiamin and B6.

Maybe he's mobilized more oxalate than I thought.

I've got some things to try (coenzymated B complex, mineral complexes

with citrate, baking soda baths), so we'll give those a shot. I'm

also getting a second opinion from a pediatric optometrist next week.

It'll be interesting to see if the prescription matches.

Amy

[Guest guest]

Oh, and we're going to do our best to stay Failsafe before that next

appointment. This means I have to go back to our old fat soluble

vitamin supplementation, because we got the Green Pastures arctic mint

last time. Maybe it's a major contributor to our problem.

It's hard to decide which board on which to post. We have so many

overlapping issues, and I think they're all related somehow.

Amy

[Guest guest]

Dr. Mercola advertised an expensive DVD about eye muscle exercises to

get rid of your glasses altogether. Do you or anyone know about this

and where we can get that information free?

Thanks

On Jul 4, 2007, at 9:40 AM, jmr1290 wrote:

> I think my vision was pretty good until traumatized at age 8, then I

> got nearsighted. My glasses prescriptions started out at -2.25 in my

> right eye (left eye has never been all that bad), and is now at -1.25.

> I noticed from the beginning that it was uncomfortable to read with my

> glasses on -- and I read a LOT, which is probably why my eyes didn't

> get better faster -- so I would always take my glasses off to read.

> Kept asking people, and the ones who wore glasses all the time got

> stronger prescriptions every time they went to the eye Dr. I decided

> that my eyes needed to be *used* to get stronger, and wore my glasses

> less and less. Then I started looking off into the distance every so

> often when I was reading, to relax those eye muscles.

Parashis

artpages@...

zine:

artpagesonline.com

portfolio:

http://www.artpagesonline.com/EPportfolio/000portfolio.html

[Guest guest]

I guess I'm a little overdue for an update on this topic.

I had a second opinion with a local pediatric optometrist, who also

has a vision therapy clinic in her office (so she's not totally

conventional). At my son's appointment the week before, his Rx was

-3.50 in one eye and -2.50 in the other. At this one, it was -1.75 in

the eye that was -3.50, and -2.00 in the one that was -2.50.

Over the course of the week between the two appointments, I was having

my son do very informal vision checks, and it seemed that his eyesight

was varying a lot, even over the course of a day.

The doctor herself was very surprised that it was so different, and

spent quite a bit of time checking and re-checking, looking at other

aspects of his vision, etc. Well, it turns out that this optometrist

was absolutely of the opinion that close work is what causes

nearsightedness. She said that the muscles that control the length of

the eye go into spasm and essentially get 'stuck' if too much work is

done closely without resting the eyes (as suggested earlier in the

thread), and since kids are expected to do so much reading so early

these days that they are 'needing glasses' earlier and earlier. My

son taught himself - I homeschool and do it in a lax manner such that

he directs his education.

She also said that the results of his exam would depend entirely on

how much he had read that day... that's interesting because I

suspected the reading to be a problem and made sure that he didn't

read that morning. In the packet she sent home with us was included

bookmarks with big stop signs on them, saying to put them two pages

ahead -- they say to stop reading for a minute, look at a point in the

distance, and go back to reading for another two pages, replacing the

bookmark.

Nonetheless, she wanted him to come back and give him a cycloplegic

drug to dilate his eyes to get a 'better look' and hopefully more

accurate prescription. After reading on Medscape about the potential

danger of using these drops on children, I cancelled the appointment,

and have decided to make sure that my son's visual sensory diet is

more varied. We'll make more of an effort to get out of the house and

look far as well as close.

My interest was stimulated further after reading myopia.org. I've

always read and done computer work with my glasses on -- my Rx is

somewhere near -4.25. I thought about getting some reading glasses to

help shorten my eye, but the suggestion is to get them about three

diopters different (positive), so that would still leave me with a

-1.25 need for reading glasses. I've been trying to read and do

computer work without my glasses, and I noticed the other day while

driving that my glasses didn't feel right (too strong), so I took off

my glasses for a bit, and I could actually *read the streetsigns.*

My husband who has a similar prescription also played his online

computer game without glasses last night -- at first it was really

difficult, but over the course of the night, he got much better. This

morning I asked him how his eyesight was, and he said that his glasses

didn't feel right -- like his prescription was too strong.

I did see some references about gas permeable contacts retarding the

progression of nearsightedness on the internet, which I also found

interesting, because my Rx was between -2 and -3 diopters for most of

my teen and early adult life, around the time I was wearing gas perm

contacts. Then, my eyes got really dry when I was living in CA, and I

switched to soft lenses, and then after having kids I just didn't want

to bother, so I wear glasses for nearly blind people. LOL. After

losing the gas perms, my eyesight got worse, fast.

Just by coincidence, I happen to have _Relearning to See_ by

Quackenbush, describing the Bates Method, which I purchased after my

husband had some acute (and now chronic) visual problems several years

ago. I'm hoping to give it a read and see what we can do to help

ourselves. Even if I just get a less strong prescription, that would

be great.

My take home message, in all of this, is that our eyes need exercise,

too. Time to get outside and enjoy the great big world. While

I'm not into Waldorf just yet, there's another plus for Rudolf

Steiner.

Amy

[Guest guest]

--- aelewark <aelewark@...> wrote:

> Just by coincidence, I happen to have _Relearning to See_ by

> Quackenbush, describing the Bates Method, which I purchased after my

> husband had some acute (and now chronic) visual problems several years

> ago. I'm hoping to give it a read and see what we can do to help

> ourselves. Even if I just get a less strong prescription, that would

> be great.

Hi Amy,

For awhile there, every time I went to the eye doctor I received a heavier

prescription, and it was driving me crazy to be so dependent on them -- plus,

I was more than wondering if all these heavier prescriptions were actually

making my eyes worse (or at least creating a " crutch " for them, allowing them

to get " lazier " ).

I read the Bates method, and while I was lax in practicing, I did decide to

only actually wear my glasses when absolutely necessary -- and even then see

if I could do things differently or accept a little less " clarity " so I

wouldn't have to wear them. I also skipped my next few eye appointments.

When I went for an exam a year later, the doc told me " This isn't supposed to

happen, but your eyes are actually BETTER now than your last prescription. "

She gave me the lighter prescription -- and now, a year later, I can tell even

these are getting " too heavy " again. All from just not using them all the

time, accepting that it's ok that not everything be in sharp focus all the

time (which is probably allowing my eyes to relax).

One note -- I tried this same thing years ago, when a different doctor, and I

still got a heavier prescription. I think because he didn't believe it was

possible, he went with what he wanted to give me anyway. I could tell they

were too strong because they hurt when wearing them. He told me I'd " get used

to them " . But that's the problem, for sure!

Anyway, at this time in my life, I can do 80% of what I need to do -- in fact,

the only time I wear them is for night driving, and driving in heavy rain. The

other day I bought a CD collection about the Bates method again -- we'll see

if I stick with the practice! But I'd really like to get rid of my glasses all

together.

Anyway -- good luck!

Jent

" The greater part of what my neighbors call good, I believe in my soul to be

bad, and if I repent of anything, it is very likely to be my good behavior. What

demon possessed me that I behaved so well? " -Henry Thoreau

________________________________________________________________________________\

____

Need a vacation? Get great deals

to amazing places on Travel.

http://travel./

[Guest guest]

Over the years, I have had to get stronger prescriptions. Harold Klemp says that

there is a

reason that our eyesight declines as we get older. It's so that when we look in

the mirror

we don't see every gray hair and every wrinkle. LOL Thus we feel better about

getting

older. Louise Hay would say that nearsightedness is due to a fear of the future.

Years ago I

stopped wearing my glasses except for driving and a few other things, like

watching my

daughter play sports. I like not wearing them around the house because now I

don't see

every crumb on the counter and every spot on the kitchen floor. It's helped me

to let go of

having a perfectly clean house. If I can't see the dirt, it doesn't bother me.

LOL

> > Just by coincidence, I happen to have _Relearning to See_ by

> > Quackenbush, describing the Bates Method, which I purchased after my

> > husband had some acute (and now chronic) visual problems several years

> > ago. I'm hoping to give it a read and see what we can do to help

> > ourselves. Even if I just get a less strong prescription, that would

> > be great.

>

> Hi Amy,

>

> For awhile there, every time I went to the eye doctor I received a heavier

> prescription, and it was driving me crazy to be so dependent on them -- plus,

> I was more than wondering if all these heavier prescriptions were actually

> making my eyes worse (or at least creating a " crutch " for them, allowing them

> to get " lazier " ).

>

> I read the Bates method, and while I was lax in practicing, I did decide to

> only actually wear my glasses when absolutely necessary -- and even then see

> if I could do things differently or accept a little less " clarity " so I

> wouldn't have to wear them. I also skipped my next few eye appointments.

>

> When I went for an exam a year later, the doc told me " This isn't supposed to

> happen, but your eyes are actually BETTER now than your last prescription. "

> She gave me the lighter prescription -- and now, a year later, I can tell even

> these are getting " too heavy " again. All from just not using them all the

> time, accepting that it's ok that not everything be in sharp focus all the

> time (which is probably allowing my eyes to relax).

>

> One note -- I tried this same thing years ago, when a different doctor, and I

> still got a heavier prescription. I think because he didn't believe it was

> possible, he went with what he wanted to give me anyway. I could tell they

> were too strong because they hurt when wearing them. He told me I'd " get used

> to them " . But that's the problem, for sure!

>

> Anyway, at this time in my life, I can do 80% of what I need to do -- in fact,

> the only time I wear them is for night driving, and driving in heavy rain. The

> other day I bought a CD collection about the Bates method again -- we'll see

> if I stick with the practice! But I'd really like to get rid of my glasses all

> together.

>

> Anyway -- good luck!

>

> Jent

>

> " The greater part of what my neighbors call good, I believe in my soul to be

bad, and if I

repent of anything, it is very likely to be my good behavior. What demon

possessed me

that I behaved so well? " -Henry Thoreau

>

>

>

>

________________________________________________________________________________\

____

> Need a vacation? Get great deals

> to amazing places on Travel.

> http://travel./

>

[Guest guest]

If it helps anyone, I also went through a scare where the opthamologist told

me I was heading into an eye disease that had no cure (though I could take

scary pharmacuticals for it), and that's I'd end up blind. I researched

nutritional support for this condition (glaucoma), and by the time of my next

eye appointment, ALL my symptioms were gone. They still are, years later.

So, don't take everything your eye doctor says as gospel truth -- s/he may be

well-meaning, but completely full of cabbage!

--- carolyn_graff <zgraff@...> wrote:

> Over the years, I have had to get stronger prescriptions. Harold Klemp says

> that there is a

> reason that our eyesight declines as we get older. It's so that when we look

> in the mirror

> we don't see every gray hair and every wrinkle. LOL Thus we feel better

> about getting

> older. Louise Hay would say that nearsightedness is due to a fear of the

> future. Years ago I

> stopped wearing my glasses except for driving and a few other things, like

> watching my

> daughter play sports. I like not wearing them around the house because now I

> don't see

> every crumb on the counter and every spot on the kitchen floor. It's helped

> me to let go of

> having a perfectly clean house. If I can't see the dirt, it doesn't bother

> me. LOL

>

>

> > > Just by coincidence, I happen to have _Relearning to See_ by

> > > Quackenbush, describing the Bates Method, which I purchased after my

> > > husband had some acute (and now chronic) visual problems several years

> > > ago. I'm hoping to give it a read and see what we can do to help

> > > ourselves. Even if I just get a less strong prescription, that would

> > > be great.

> >

> > Hi Amy,

> >

> > For awhile there, every time I went to the eye doctor I received a heavier

> > prescription, and it was driving me crazy to be so dependent on them --

> plus,

> > I was more than wondering if all these heavier prescriptions were actually

> > making my eyes worse (or at least creating a " crutch " for them, allowing

> them

> > to get " lazier " ).

> >

> > I read the Bates method, and while I was lax in practicing, I did decide

> to

> > only actually wear my glasses when absolutely necessary -- and even then

> see

> > if I could do things differently or accept a little less " clarity " so I

> > wouldn't have to wear them. I also skipped my next few eye appointments.

> >

> > When I went for an exam a year later, the doc told me " This isn't supposed

> to

> > happen, but your eyes are actually BETTER now than your last

> prescription. "

> > She gave me the lighter prescription -- and now, a year later, I can tell

> even

> > these are getting " too heavy " again. All from just not using them all the

> > time, accepting that it's ok that not everything be in sharp focus all the

> > time (which is probably allowing my eyes to relax).

> >

> > One note -- I tried this same thing years ago, when a different doctor,

> and I

> > still got a heavier prescription. I think because he didn't believe it was

> > possible, he went with what he wanted to give me anyway. I could tell they

> > were too strong because they hurt when wearing them. He told me I'd " get

> used

> > to them " . But that's the problem, for sure!

> >

> > Anyway, at this time in my life, I can do 80% of what I need to do -- in

> fact,

> > the only time I wear them is for night driving, and driving in heavy rain.

> The

> > other day I bought a CD collection about the Bates method again -- we'll

> see

> > if I stick with the practice! But I'd really like to get rid of my glasses

> all

> > together.

> >

> > Anyway -- good luck!

> >

> > Jent

> >

> > " The greater part of what my neighbors call good, I believe in my soul to

> be bad, and if I

> repent of anything, it is very likely to be my good behavior. What demon

> possessed me

> that I behaved so well? " -Henry Thoreau

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

________________________________________________________________________________\

____

> > Need a vacation? Get great deals

> > to amazing places on Travel.

> > http://travel./

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

On 7/3/07, haecklers <haecklers@...> wrote:

> Seems to me like it's either something environmental or some sort of

> infection. Reason I say that, also, is lots of people with lyme have

> floaters. Some think it's parasites getting into the eyes.

I got my first floater when I was 15. It was very dark, very solid

and opaque, and single. Over time, it started splitting apart and

becoming more translucent. Now my floaters are chains of things, in

strange shapes that look kind of like chain-like bacterial colonies or

something, largely transparent with certain outlines opaque.

When I was 17, I found out I needed glasses for the first time. My

vision had been slipping for a while, but I didn't notice. What I

noticed was that my eyes would hurt when I was driving and had a focal

point that was far away, and often when I was reading, the page would

kind of jump up at me and my vision would be all distorted, I would

get this pressure in my eyes in both cases. But I didn't know that my

vision was failing. Then I when they had me look through the lenses

for the test I realized I was supposed to be able to see detail far

away that I had no idea I was supposed to be able to see -- so I guess

I slowly got accustomed to poor vision as my vision gradually got

poorer.

Most likely, my vision started going around the same time I got floaters.

My optometrist insisted adamantly that my floaters were from proteins

within my eye that got damaged when I was a fetus. I asked him how it

was possible for me to not have floaters for 15 years if all the

damage occurred before I was born. He told me they were always there

and I just didn't notice them.

I asked him what he thinks might have caused my vision problems, and

he said nothing causes them; they just happen. I asked him if there

was anything I could do, like take vitamin A or something. He told me

it wouldn't help my eyes, but it would give me liver toxicity. I

asked him how it was possible that I didn't need glasses before, but

needed glasses now, if there was no intervening event that caused a

change in my vision. He said, " You're getting older. "

I had noted that my floaters kind of look like I have some parasite in

my eye, but my microbiology professor thought that was pretty much

impossible. I'm inclined to agree with him, because I think if I had

a parasitic infection in my eye for the last 10 years it would have

destroyed my eye or my eye would have destroyed it. However, I could

have damaged remnants or something from one such infection I suppose.

I'm more inclined to think that it is from oxidative/glycative damage,

possibly calcium salts, etc. There was some Russian research I ran

into summarized somewhere on Google that is not indexed for pubmed

that indicated floaters were associated with a low calcium intake and

a low Ca-to-P ratio, and seemed to be related to bone resorption.

This makes some sense, since bone resorption tends to lead to

circulating calcium phosphate crystal nuclei that are much more likely

to lead to soft tissue calcification than dietary calcium. In fact

dietary calcium and phosphorus are not, I don't think, very likely to

lead to soft tissue calcification at all, and it is primarily

preformed crystal nuclei from resorpted bone that does so.

Quite interesting and I wish I had answers!

Chris

[Guest guest]

Amy,

I'm reading this thread with interest. I think you're on exactly the

right track and I think your son is lucky to have a mother like you.

I'm impressed that your optometrist believes and acknowledges the

connection between minus lenses and the progression of myopia. My

impression is that most eye doctors deny any connection, either

completely or they brush it off as inconsequential. One thing I didn't

see you mentioning is reading glasses. I have been wearing +1.75

drugstore reading glasses for close work for several years. During

that time, my prescriptions have indeed gotten weaker. It's all about

reducing the strain on the ciliary muscle, which is relaxed while

focusing on distant objects but contracts for close objects.

So if your son gets to the point where his vision is back to 20/20 or

close, I think you should get him into the habit of using reading

glasses whenever he does close work for any prolonged period. Reading

and computer work especially. Even so frequent short breaks (looking

at a distant object for a few seconds) are important.

I wear RGP contacts and I love them. They do keep the corneas from

accommodating to lots of close work and they also provide sharper

vision that soft contacts or glasses. Orthokeratology is a promising

technique that uses special RGPs that actually return vision to normal

very quickly. You wear them at night only, and they reshape your

corneas overnight, and your vision is 20/20 all day. You do have to

wear them every night or your corneas will return to their normal

shape after couple of days. At some point I'll probably try ortho-K,

but for now I'm happy with my RGPs and reading glasses.

Good luck with improving your family's vision, and keep us updated!

Tom

[Guest guest]

Did you find nutritional support? what were they?

On Jul 16, 2007, at 8:29 AM, Jent Lynne wrote:

> If it helps anyone, I also went through a scare where the

> opthamologist told

> me I was heading into an eye disease that had no cure (though I could

> take

> scary pharmacuticals for it), and that's I'd end up blind. I researched

> nutritional support for this condition (glaucoma), and by the time of

> my next

> eye appointment, ALL my symptioms were gone. They still are, years

> later.

Parashis

artpages@...

zine:

artpagesonline.com

portfolio:

http://www.artpagesonline.com/EPportfolio/000portfolio.html

[Guest guest]

I could have written the original post. I could have also written

this by Tom. I see that one person's optometrist said 17 is getting

old. An audiologist told me the same thing about hearing. He said

human hearing peaks at age 16 and declines from there - and at the

appointment I was 21 so I was old. In high school I had learned that

human hearing declines about 16 from noise pollution.

I also wear RGP contacts. Glasses have always given me problems.

Every one has had something odd in the left eye. It causes imperfect

vision without an identifiable blurry spot. Over a few months, it

turns from imperfect to poor, (I can't read street signs) discomfort

to severe pain, I remove the glasses the instant I'm not driving.

The sense that the world is painted on the surface of the glass turns

to a sense the glass is opaque rather than transparent.

This had to happen several times when I couldn't get contacts. Soft

lenses don't give clear vision. This leaves RGP lenses, the most

expensive ones. The Powers That Be, however, treat contacts as

cosmetic; people can get medical assistance only for glasses.

I once heard of something called Vision Freedom. It was

strengthening the vision by putting text gradually farther away. I

thought it was hard to find the distance. (I unconsciously bring the

book back up.) It would be better to have person-to-person help.

The cheap glasses scratched. The expensive ones got lost. I figured

reducing the text size is the same thing. The text on some computers

can not be reduced.

I'm not upset about this because I'm satisfied with RGP contacts and

good cleaning fluid.

What cleanser do you use Tom? I use Unique PH multi purpose

solution. How long do you have to use Ortho K lenses? Does it come

to a point in a few months that you can stop wearing them?

---LAURA IN MINN---

-- In , " Tom Jeanne " <tjeanne@...>

wrote:

>[delete]

>

One thing I didn't

> see you mentioning is reading glasses. I have been wearing +1.75

> drugstore reading glasses for close work for several years. During

> that time, my prescriptions have indeed gotten weaker. It's all

about

> reducing the strain on the ciliary muscle, which is relaxed while

> focusing on distant objects but contracts for close objects.

>

> So if your son gets to the point where his vision is back to 20/20

or

> close, I think you should get him into the habit of using reading

> glasses whenever he does close work for any prolonged period.

Reading

> and computer work especially. Even so frequent short breaks (looking

> at a distant object for a few seconds) are important.

>

> I wear RGP contacts and I love them. They do keep the corneas from

> accommodating to lots of close work and they also provide sharper

> vision that soft contacts or glasses. Orthokeratology is a promising

> technique that uses special RGPs that actually return vision to

normal

> very quickly. You wear them at night only, and they reshape your

> corneas overnight, and your vision is 20/20 all day. You do have to

> wear them every night or your corneas will return to their normal

> shape after couple of days. At some point I'll probably try ortho-K,

> but for now I'm happy with my RGPs and reading glasses.

>

> Good luck with improving your family's vision, and keep us updated!

>

> Tom

>

[Guest guest]

,

> I also wear RGP contacts. Glasses have always given me problems.

> Every one has had something odd in the left eye. It causes imperfect

> vision without an identifiable blurry spot. Over a few months, it

> turns from imperfect to poor, (I can't read street signs) discomfort

> to severe pain, I remove the glasses the instant I'm not driving.

> The sense that the world is painted on the surface of the glass turns

> to a sense the glass is opaque rather than transparent.

That's really odd. I've never had anything like that. I've never had

floaters or anything unusual, either.

> This had to happen several times when I couldn't get contacts. Soft

> lenses don't give clear vision. This leaves RGP lenses, the most

> expensive ones. The Powers That Be, however, treat contacts as

> cosmetic; people can get medical assistance only for glasses.

RGP lenses are pretty darn cheap! I don't know what you're comparing

against, but I ordered my most recent pair online for about $35 a lens

plus shipping.... Contrast that to a new pair of glasses where the

frames alone are $150 to $250 (unless you're getting the cheapest,

ugliest frames) and the decent lenses are about the same so you're

looking at $400 pretty easily... RGP contacts are a fantastic bargain

because they last a long time and provide the best vision. I had my

last ones about 4 years--too long as they had a lot of protein buildup

around the edges where they were slightly scratched--but a typical

pair lasts at least 1-2 years.

> I once heard of something called Vision Freedom. It was

> strengthening the vision by putting text gradually farther away. I

> thought it was hard to find the distance. (I unconsciously bring the

> book back up.) It would be better to have person-to-person help.

> The cheap glasses scratched. The expensive ones got lost. I figured

> reducing the text size is the same thing. The text on some computers

> can not be reduced.

Whoa, reducing text size on your computer is definitely not something

I'd recommend! When you do that, you make it harder to read so you

have to lean in closer and then you're really weakening your eyes! I

sometimes *increase* the font of websites with really small fonts, and

then sit as far back from the monitor as possible. Straining to read

small text is not going to relax your eyes. Allowing your eyes to

relax and see distant text that is barely within focus is a completely

different thing.

> I'm not upset about this because I'm satisfied with RGP contacts and

> good cleaning fluid.

>

> What cleanser do you use Tom? I use Unique PH multi purpose

> solution. How long do you have to use Ortho K lenses? Does it come

> to a point in a few months that you can stop wearing them?

I'm wary of any " multipurpose " solution because I suspect that the

cleaning agents are generally harsh and should not be continually in

contact with one's eyes. If they tone down the cleaning agents for the

multipurpose solutions for lower toxicity, then it seems likely to me

that they won't clean the lens as well. I've been using Boston/Bausch

& Lomb separate cleaner & conditioner solution for a decade and I'm

happy with it I guess. I wish I could find out more about the

chemicals they use. Does Unique PH make separate cleaner/conditioners,

and do they claim their formulation is healthier for eyes? If so I'm

definitely interested.

Re ortho-K, I'm pretty sure you have to keep wearing them

indefinitely. But it's pretty cool that you can have perfect vision

every day without surgery and without wearing corrective lenses during

the day! Also, you don't have to worry about getting dirt under your

lenses because you only wear them while sleeping. I think ortho-K is

best for children where it could theoretically reverse

myopia/hyperopia for good.

Tom

[Guest guest]

--- In , " Tom Jeanne " <tjeanne@...>

wrote:

>

>

> > The sense that the world is painted on the surface of the glass

turns

> > to a sense the glass is opaque rather than transparent.

>

> That's really odd. I've never had anything like that. I've never had

> floaters or anything unusual, either.

>

I was trying to describe the sensation of having that barrier between

oneself and the world, that's all.

> >

> RGP lenses are pretty darn cheap! I don't know what you're comparing

> against, but I ordered my most recent pair online for about $35 a

lens

> plus shipping....

Wow! Mine are $100 each. I buy them at the vision center. There is

a difference between stores and my current shop is one of two that

I'm satisfied with, in terms of service and assurance of a correct

prescription. The lenses do last. But they didn't last in a period

where I had bad luck losing them...and it's $200 to replace. (There

was a special on certain glasses.)

> > > Whoa, reducing text size on your computer is definitely not

something

> I'd recommend! When you do that, you make it harder to read so you

> have to lean in closer and then you're really weakening your eyes! I

> sometimes *increase* the font of websites with really small fonts,

I've reduced the text these last two days and already feel my far-

away vision is better.

You refer to web pages with small fonts. I'm reducing fonts that

start too large.

>

> I'm wary of any " multipurpose " solution because I suspect that the

> cleaning agents are generally harsh and should not be continually in

> contact with one's eyes.

> Does Unique PH make separate cleaner/conditioners,

> and do they claim their formulation is healthier for eyes? If so I'm

> definitely interested.

>

I hated those cleansers because the three separate solutions got so

expensive. I switched as soon as multi-purpose solutions came out.

Unique PH is made by Alcon. It says the same as others do, that it

contains [x] ingredients and stop using the product if you are

allergic. It has the nicest feel of the cleaners I've tried. I

always have clarity for as long as I have the lens. It must be

cleaning them. Protein never builds up.

> Re ortho-K, I'm pretty sure you have to keep wearing them

> indefinitely. But it's pretty cool that you can have perfect vision

> every day without surgery and without wearing corrective lenses

during

> the day! Also, you don't have to worry about getting dirt under your

> lenses because you only wear them while sleeping. I think ortho-K

is

> best for children where it could theoretically reverse

> myopia/hyperopia for good.

>

> Tom

It sure would be.

[Guest guest]

--- In , " Tom Jeanne " <tjeanne@...>

wrote:

>

> ,

>

>

>

> Whoa, reducing text size on your computer is definitely not

something

> I'd recommend! When you do that, you make it harder to read so you

> have to lean in closer and then you're really weakening your eyes! I

> sometimes *increase* the font of websites with really small fonts,

Increasing the font is just like reading too close.

Reducing the font is like moving it farther away. I don't lean

towards the computer. I look at another object in the room when my

eyes get tired. It's been two days of this, and I see street signs

easier. I have already lost my habit of looking down while walking!

It actually is hard to look closeup. Willpower didn't have that

effect.

LAURA

[Guest guest]

,

> Increasing the font is just like reading too close.

> Reducing the font is like moving it farther away.

I respectfully disagree. What matters is not how easy it is to read

the text, but how far away your eyes are from the text. Extreme

examples might help to explain my point: tiny print that you have to

get really close to clearly strains the eyes. But text at great

distance does not strain the eyes, whether it's large or small. Even a

barely discernable word on a distant sign does not strain your

(relaxed) eyes, just your brain which is trying to interpret the

visual image.

Tom

[Guest guest]

--- Parashis <artpages@...> wrote:

> On Jul 16, 2007, at 8:29 AM, Jent Lynne wrote:

>

> > If it helps anyone, I also went through a scare where the

> > opthamologist told

> > me I was heading into an eye disease that had no cure (though I could

> > take

> > scary pharmacuticals for it), and that's I'd end up blind. I researched

> > nutritional support for this condition (glaucoma), and by the time of

> > my next

> > eye appointment, ALL my symptioms were gone. They still are, years

> > later.

>

> Did you find nutritional support? what were they?

Someone asked me a similar question privately, and it's been so long I don't

remember the exact things I tried. However, I've also learned since then that

the " one size fits all " , " this symptom = this pill " approach we all know too

well from " conventional " western medicine is rarely of any real help.

So what worked for me might not work for someone else. My best suggestion is

to google and research, and *keep trying* things until you find what works for

*you* (or the person you're wanting help for). Doing that has healed me of

MANY health problems conventional medicine was either ignoring, misdiagnosing,

or making worse. It's also led me to better understand the human body, and my

own body, over time -- including the benefits of eating more naturally and

traditionally

Good luck!

Jent

" The greater part of what my neighbors call good, I believe in my soul to be

bad, and if I repent of anything, it is very likely to be my good behavior. What

demon possessed me that I behaved so well? " -Henry Thoreau

________________________________________________________________________________\

____

Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows.

Answers - Check it out.

http://answers./dir/?link=list & sid=396545433

[Guest guest]

--- In , " Tom Jeanne " <tjeanne@...>

wrote:

>

> ,

>

> > Increasing the font is just like reading too close.

> > Reducing the font is like moving it farther away.

>

> I respectfully disagree. What matters is not how easy it is to read

> the text, but how far away your eyes are from the text.

Now you're unintelligible.

Extreme

> examples might help to explain my point: tiny print that you have

to

> get really close to clearly strains the eyes.

But I don't have to get close to it.

>But text at great> distance does not strain the eyes,

And I keep the text at great distance. If the monitor moves, I

slide as far back as it will go.

>whether it's large or small.

But if the text is up close, you say it does matter. And you

increase the font even more? And this is GOOD?

Even a

> barely discernable word on a distant sign does not strain your

> (relaxed) eyes,

My eyes may not be straining, but they're not functioning either.

We aren't talking about straining to see signs. We are talking

about not straining, not seeing the sign, not getting information or

stimulation, and looking downward toward something one can see: the

sidewalk.

>just your brain which is trying to interpret the

> visual image.

Or not trying to interpret because there's no image.

Your brain wants something to interpret. You turn your head to

what's clear. If that's the sidewalk, that's where you go.

On the other hand, if you look at the street sign and actually read

it, you get some information about the world. You look up some more

to see some more things.

And if you notice yourself looking upward more often, you know

something good has happened.

laura

[Guest guest]

> I'm reading this thread with interest. I think you're on exactly the

> right track and I think your son is lucky to have a mother like you.

Aw, thanks! That's always nice to hear, especially when one is

choosing to do things that are so outside the realm of normal.

> I'm impressed that your optometrist believes and acknowledges the

> connection between minus lenses and the progression of myopia. My

> impression is that most eye doctors deny any connection, either

> completely or they brush it off as inconsequential.

Yeah, she said herself that she is pretty unconventional -- though not

extremely so. She has a vision therapy center in her office, which is

generally condemned by mainstream optometrists. Joy, have you thought

about vision therapy, or have you been evaluated for convergence and

tracking problems?

I did ask if she had ever worked with children with environmental

illness or toxicities, and she said she didn't really know anything

about it. Then, I told her about the food allergies, and she said

that she did notice that kids who were having nearsightedness this

early in her office were much more likely to have food allergies. So,

that makes me think that there is a contributing factor of toxicities,

perhaps nutrient deficiencies, and that by figuring out what is

causing the food allergies, we might also help his eyesight. She did

say she worked with a mom who was interested in how different minerals

affected eyesight.

One thing I didn't

> see you mentioning is reading glasses.

Yeah, I read about them on myopia.org. It's not like getting reading

glasses for an adult. I have to get special ones for a child,

otherwise, because of the focal point being in the wrong place, he

will develop convergence problems. I guess having the focal point

being 'too close together' is not a problem because it actually aids

convergence. The reading glasses for kids have to be obtained with a

prescription, because kids are born farsighted, and become nearsighted

as they age. Kids who are learning to read, I guess, are commonly

farsighted and need prescription lenses to read close (at the young

ages we expect kids to learn to read nowadays).

So, the one place (myopia.org) where the glasses can be purchased with

focal points adequate for a child, they are $50. Here's the problem:

I went and tried the children's frames on my son at a local eye

center, and when they fit his face, they hurt over his ears. I

actually couldn't find any sunglasses for him in a child's size for

the same reason (I wanted to make him some pinhole glasses). I bought

some for myself (to try the pinhole glasses experiment without

spending $45 to do another one of my freaky experiments (LOL)), and

they actually fit *him.* Yes, the six year old actually has a head

the size of an adult (which is interesting because the Vitamin D

Council actually talks about the head size of autistics being larger

on average, though he's not autistic, he was probably on the spectrum

for some of his life). I did see some reading glasses for adults with

small heads on the internet, but I'm still concerned about creating a

convergence problem.

So, for now, he's being nagged to not lay on the floor to read, I got

him special video game rocking chairs so when he reads he's sitting up

with the book on his lap at least, and I interrupt him regularly so

he's changing his focus. I can tell his sight is better already.

He was on the fat soluble vitamin protocol, and I was giving him a

B-complex, too. After the middle of June, he developed pretty severe

salicylate sensitivity (he has very obvious physical and emotional

symptoms). Right around that time, I got him the Arctic Mint Blue Ice

CLO, which I'm assuming is made with oil of wintergreen (or pure

methyl salicylate) for flavor, which is toxic to children. I've

switched him to the unflavored CLO/BO and withdrawn all other

supplements, and he's tolerating ketchup and coconut flour just fine.

I read somewhere (on eMedicine, maybe?) that a symptom of salicylate

poisoning is partial blindness. Well, he was also saying that he had

floaters.

> So if your son gets to the point where his vision is back to 20/20 or

> close, I think you should get him into the habit of using reading

> glasses whenever he does close work for any prolonged period.

I agree. I just don't know what strength to get, and at $50 a pop

with his eyesight changing so much on even a daily basis... I don't know!

Thanks for the information about orthokeratology. I don't have a

problem with eye dryness anymore (funny that it peaked when I went on

a low-fat diet), so maybe I could go back to RGPs, or do the ortho-K

(if I can find a practitioner in my area).

Amy

[Guest guest]

I've been meaning to post an update on this topic for a while now.

We noticed that my son's eyesight was getting worse rather than

better, so I took him in to get glasses in December. Actually, it was

a family vacation with him able to borrow my glasses to see the

animals at Sea World that convinced me that getting glasses was the

right solution. Oh, and watching him struggle in soccer...

Upon a third examination, his eyesight was about where the first

examination had placed him.

We saw immediate improvement in his behavior upon getting the glasses.

He was no longer constantly losing things, he was much calmer and

quieter, and generally happier.

He does not use his glasses for close reading, and he's been very good

about making sure to take them off for reading and put them back on

for distance vision.

Another thing that made me think that he might not escape glasses

entirely is his constant desire to read (um, don't know where he gets

that from! ), and also his narrower face. I saw a reference to

vision deficits in an article on the WAPF site with regard to Dr.

Price's studies on palate width and skull shape. He's just got a

narrower face, so perhaps there is a structural abnormality there as

well. When he was a baby, people always commented on what a

" grown-up " looking face he had, and I ate a very low fat diet before

he was conceived and during my pregnancy with him (less than 25g of

fat total per day). I wish I could take that all back!!

Amy