Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 Tony, This might sound offensive, but she sounds like a real witch. " What feelings are stirred up now? " ??????? After she just defamed you to your entire family and both of them are playing the martyr, while you were off on vacation having a pleasant time and didn't expect to return home to chaos. I don't mean to be blunt and offend you, I just want to give you an outside reaction because it seems to be that you are being manipulated with NO regard for your feelings at all. Both parents are saying and doing incredibly hurtful things to you, and then turning around and acting like YOU hurt THEM. And of course they aren't lying or twisting the facts, because they are your parents and they wouldn't do that, right??? (not). Here is something to chew on: you can still love them even if they are manipulative liars. You don't have to like their behavior but you can still love them. What I see you doing is trying to make them into something they are not, and pretend they are not what they are, to meet some conditions you have for relationship with them. They aren't the people you want to be, they are behaving TERRIBLY. I think you need reinforcements, like a therapist who knows bpd because you are being double-teamed horribly, and to make matters worse they've brought the whole family on board now. It's okay to come here and ask for advice as many times as you need to, as well as support, and it's perfectly okay to NOT know how to handle this, and to not address it, and like others have advised, to attend the parties if you want without regard to their demands. When I read her letter I get the image of an evil queen in a castle like in Snow White, looking at her reflection in the mirror and smiling at her cleverness. Just by the tone of your response it's obvious she has you confused and questioning reality again, which is where she wants you. I won't take it personally if you feel this description is too harsh, I just want you to see how she is coming off to a person outside the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 I kind of think a gauntlet has been thrown and thanks to their behavior and the inane 'shifts' thing it's moved your relationship further into the pale. It's like Act 5 scene 1 take 47. I have a 'fake' and 'get by' relationship with my parents and don't expect any real reason or intimacy. But if you believe they are capable of it and really want to work toward an honest exchange of feelings someday I think I would back the whole thing up and just send them an e-mail saying 'you violated my trust by involving the whole family, I want all this b.s. shift drama to stop and I want you to demonstrate for me that I can trust you to keep personal matters private and then eventually someday maybe we can broach the issue of getting back to the point where we were before the Italy trip. Right now you have screwed things up immeasurably and I've about had it.' But that's just me, it's easy for me to say that because I just get by with my parents and even though I get hurt by particularly my dad's insanity (because he is so unpredictable) he never solicits any kind of relationship with me because he doesn't like me and he's admitted to such after I backed him into a corner about it. My mother just plays both ends to the middle depending on who is in the room. I don't see any potential there at all for any real relationship, there never has been and there never will be so I have maybe less to lose than you do. Maybe that is the reason I can live here because I know there isn't any hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 You can't control what other people think. Your cousin shouldn't be involved in this -- it's their choice whether they do or not, but I would encourage them to leave that alone and just have their engagement party. you can't control what the rest of your family does -- and if they're on board with this kind of foolishness, you don't have a choice but to let them go. Sorry you feel at such a loss -- You can't contol the actions of others, only conduct yourself with respect and integrity. This is like two divorced people messing up their child's wedding because they can't put their differences aside long enough. It's self indulgent behavior -- it has nothing to do with you. If your cousin drops you because they want to join the drama, let them go. If your aunt wants to join this drama, let her go. If your uncle wants to jump in, let him go.....etc.....etc.... Your other choice is to sell your soul in some vain attempt to pretend that all of this hasn't happened. And in the end, you definitely wouldn't have the " closeness " you appear to have. What they've done is cruel and manipulative. You can't control it. Nurture relationships with people who treat you with respect -- " family " is not a license to mistreat someone. They have chosen this game, not you. It's not your fault if a few relationships fall apart because of it. And I seriously doubt that EVERY SINGLE relative will run off to indulge your parents. Live your own life. -Kyla > > May, > Thanks for your honesty. In no way did i take offense to anything you said. I appreciate having a source where i can go and get unbiased, outside opinions. I am at such a loss of what to do. My cousin is getting involved, and I know she is just trying to help, but i feel it is impossible to even try to explain to someone in her position what i am going through, i feel they just would not get it. I do not want to have to cut off my whole family cause of my parents, but i feel like my parents are pushing me into that corner where i may have to make that choice. I honestly do not know how a parent could treat their child this way, putting aside the emails and all, how could you sell your child out so he would miss his grandmothers bday? I am at a complete loss as to how to handle this. I feel like when i left, i had a pretty good handle on this situation, i get back, and it has all gone to shit. > > Thank you May for your words, and trust me, witch is nice compared to some of the things i have called my mom > > > > Re: Returning home > > > Tony, > > This might sound offensive, but she sounds like a real witch. " What > feelings are stirred up now? " ??????? After she just defamed you to > your entire family and both of them are playing the martyr, while > you were off on vacation having a pleasant time and didn't expect to > return home to chaos. I don't mean to be blunt and offend you, I > just want to give you an outside reaction because it seems to be > that you are being manipulated with NO regard for your feelings at > all. Both parents are saying and doing incredibly hurtful things to > you, and then turning around and acting like YOU hurt THEM. And of > course they aren't lying or twisting the facts, because they are > your parents and they wouldn't do that, right??? (not). Here is > something to chew on: you can still love them even if they are > manipulative liars. You don't have to like their behavior but you > can still love them. What I see you doing is trying to make them > into something they are not, and pretend they are not what they are, > to meet some conditions you have for relationship with them. They > aren't the people you want to be, they are behaving TERRIBLY. I > think you need reinforcements, like a therapist who knows bpd > because you are being double-teamed horribly, and to make matters > worse they've brought the whole family on board now. It's okay to > come here and ask for advice as many times as you need to, as well > as support, and it's perfectly okay to NOT know how to handle this, > and to not address it, and like others have advised, to attend the > parties if you want without regard to their demands. > > When I read her letter I get the image of an evil queen in a castle > like in Snow White, looking at her reflection in the mirror and > smiling at her cleverness. Just by the tone of your response it's > obvious she has you confused and questioning reality again, which is > where she wants you. I won't take it personally if you feel this > description is too harsh, I just want you to see how she is coming > off to a person outside the situation. > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 Just my two cents' worth (when has that ever stopped me? lol), but I think that option is, as you're figuring out, distasteful. It lacks dignity and makes you look the same as them. This is between you and your parents -- I wouldn't spread this dirty laundry around. (And I wouldn't belabor it too long with your parents, either!) It just looks like you're a child pleading with everyone to believe you. Maturity is when we don't need to live by committee or popularity contests -- we just make our decisions, mark our boundaries, and people who respect you will respect your choices. You're finally grown up when you live according to the dictates of your own household -- -kyla > > > > > > Well, > > > My wife and I just got back from our vacation, and it was > > incredible. We were in Italy for a little more the 2 weeks, and > > toured practically the whole country, it was great. Well, prior to > > leaving, i know i posted a few times, and i did end up telling my > > mom i didnt want to do therapy yet, but we continued to talk > > periodically, as did my dad and I. I even called and said goodbye > > to them before i left. > > > > > > Well....when i got back, i got a voicemail from my Aunt (dad's > > sister), telling me to call as soon as i could, that it was very > > important. When i called, she told me that they were having a 80th > > bday party for my grandma on sunday (yesterday), and that she felt > > it would be better if i didnt go. I asked why, and she said that > my > > dad says that if i go, he will not go, and they feel it is more > > important to have my dad there then me. I ask here where this is > > coming from, cause my dad and I have been talking recently and > > things have been getting better. she says that he doesnt want a > > relationship with his son that he only sees him at family get > > togethers, he wants more then that. So after much discussion with > > my aunt, i finally got off the phone. > > > > > > I then called my dad and asked him what the deal was? He said it > > hurts him too much to see me and know that we dont have a > > relationship, and that i could go to the bday party, but he would > > not go. I told him i thought we were making progress and getting > > things back to normal, and he said we were, but he wouldnt go to > my > > grandmas thing without seeing me first. and started saying he > would > > be willing to see me today (saturday), and he just wants us to > > forget everything that has happend. I told him that last time we > > tried doing that, that they couldnt last a week with " forgetting " > > things, and started bringing things up again. He kept getting > upset > > and saying he doesnt understand why i am mad at him when it was my > > mom that did most of the wrongs. he did apologize for barging into > > my house, but that was it. He started crying and asked if i want > to > > have a relationship with him, and he will do anything for me to > make > > this work, and i told him i dont know, > > > and got off the phone. i find it funny he said he would do > > anything, except, let me go to my grandmas bday party. > > > > > > so i ended up not going, which i am very resentful for. now i > get > > an evite for my cousins engagement party. quickly following it was > > an email to me and my dad from my cousin, telling us that the > family > > thinks we both should be able to go to this party, but since my > dad > > wont be there when i am there, we need to work something out, so > > they want to split the time up between us, so my dad will go from > 7- > > 8:30, and we will go 8:30 to 10. I think this is so ridiculous, > and > > i dont know what to do. I already agreed to see my mom on > wednesday > > to show her pictures, which i am nervous about. i just dont know > > how to handle this anymore. I was on the right track trying to get > > things back to normal, and for no reason it all came crashing. i > > guess the reason i am meeting with my mom is cause she did actual > > write me an apology for the email finally, so i am rewarding her. > > and i want to just punish my dad now for pulling this shit and > > keeping me from seeing my > > > grandma on her 80th bday. anyone have any thoughts or > > suggestions? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > T > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 OH MY GOODNESS -- this is beyond ridiculous! Your cousin is insulting you by these " shifts " !! I would answer that you " don't want them involved in this fray -- that you'd like to come to the party as an invited guest and not for a " shift " to avoid anyone else. That you have faith that everyone can behave themselves long enough to honor cousin's upcoming wedding. Thanks for the recommendation for a therapist, but I am taking care of things on my end. You have enough on your plate, you don't need this, too. Let us work it out among ourselves. " When I read that e-mail from your cousin, I thought it was very demeaning. Assure him/her that you don't wish them to get involved, and you look forward to seeing them at the party, and you'd rather not do shifts. Honestly, I wouldn't put up with this for anything. Why would you let people demean you this way? -Kyla > > > > > > > > > > Well, > > > > > My wife and I just got back from our vacation, and it was > > > > incredible. We were in Italy for a little more the 2 weeks, and > > > > toured practically the whole country, it was great. Well, prior to > > > > leaving, i know i posted a few times, and i did end up telling my > > > > mom i didnt want to do therapy yet, but we continued to talk > > > > periodically, as did my dad and I. I even called and said goodbye > > > > to them before i left. > > > > > > > > > > Well....when i got back, i got a voicemail from my Aunt (dad's > > > > sister), telling me to call as soon as i could, that it was very > > > > important. When i called, she told me that they were having a 80th > > > > bday party for my grandma on sunday (yesterday), and that she felt > > > > it would be better if i didnt go. I asked why, and she said that > > > my > > > > dad says that if i go, he will not go, and they feel it is more > > > > important to have my dad there then me. I ask here where this is > > > > coming from, cause my dad and I have been talking recently and > > > > things have been getting better. she says that he doesnt want a > > > > relationship with his son that he only sees him at family get > > > > togethers, he wants more then that. So after much discussion with > > > > my aunt, i finally got off the phone. > > > > > > > > > > I then called my dad and asked him what the deal was? He said it > > > > hurts him too much to see me and know that we dont have a > > > > relationship, and that i could go to the bday party, but he would > > > > not go. I told him i thought we were making progress and getting > > > > things back to normal, and he said we were, but he wouldnt go to > > > my > > > > grandmas thing without seeing me first. and started saying he > > > would > > > > be willing to see me today (saturday), and he just wants us to > > > > forget everything that has happend. I told him that last time we > > > > tried doing that, that they couldnt last a week with " forgetting " > > > > things, and started bringing things up again. He kept getting > > > upset > > > > and saying he doesnt understand why i am mad at him when it was my > > > > mom that did most of the wrongs. he did apologize for barging into > > > > my house, but that was it. He started crying and asked if i want > > > to > > > > have a relationship with him, and he will do anything for me to > > > make > > > > this work, and i told him i dont know, > > > > > and got off the phone. i find it funny he said he would do > > > > anything, except, let me go to my grandmas bday party. > > > > > > > > > > so i ended up not going, which i am very resentful for. now i > > > get > > > > an evite for my cousins engagement party. quickly following it was > > > > an email to me and my dad from my cousin, telling us that the > > > family > > > > thinks we both should be able to go to this party, but since my > > > dad > > > > wont be there when i am there, we need to work something out, so > > > > they want to split the time up between us, so my dad will go from > > > 7- > > > > 8:30, and we will go 8:30 to 10. I think this is so ridiculous, > > > and > > > > i dont know what to do. I already agreed to see my mom on > > > wednesday > > > > to show her pictures, which i am nervous about. i just dont know > > > > how to handle this anymore. I was on the right track trying to get > > > > things back to normal, and for no reason it all came crashing. i > > > > guess the reason i am meeting with my mom is cause she did actual > > > > write me an apology for the email finally, so i am rewarding her. > > > > and i want to just punish my dad now for pulling this shit and > > > > keeping me from seeing my > > > > > grandma on her 80th bday. anyone have any thoughts or > > > > suggestions? > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > T > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 Tony -- I agree with Jane -- It's PERFECT -- and I would send it -- then, going forward, I would STOP explaining myself. If your mother were to respond with more noise, just send the SAME LETTER. THAT LETTER IS FANTASTIC. I say " SEND IT! " -Kyla > > > > > > > > Well, > > > > My wife and I just got back from our vacation, and it was > > > incredible. We were in Italy for a little more the 2 weeks, and > > > toured practically the whole country, it was great. Well, prior to > > > leaving, i know i posted a few times, and i did end up telling my > > > mom i didnt want to do therapy yet, but we continued to talk > > > periodically, as did my dad and I. I even called and said goodbye > > > to them before i left. > > > > > > > > Well....when i got back, i got a voicemail from my Aunt (dad's > > > sister), telling me to call as soon as i could, that it was very > > > important. When i called, she told me that they were having a 80th > > > bday party for my grandma on sunday (yesterday), and that she felt > > > it would be better if i didnt go. I asked why, and she said that > > my > > > dad says that if i go, he will not go, and they feel it is more > > > important to have my dad there then me. I ask here where this is > > > coming from, cause my dad and I have been talking recently and > > > things have been getting better. she says that he doesnt want a > > > relationship with his son that he only sees him at family get > > > togethers, he wants more then that.. So after much discussion with > > > my aunt, i finally got off the phone. > > > > > > > > I then called my dad and asked him what the deal was? He said it > > > hurts him too much to see me and know that we dont have a > > > relationship, and that i could go to the bday party, but he would > > > not go. I told him i thought we were making progress and getting > > > things back to normal, and he said we were, but he wouldnt go to > > my > > > grandmas thing without seeing me first. and started saying he > > would > > > be willing to see me today (saturday), and he just wants us to > > > forget everything that has happend. I told him that last time we > > > tried doing that, that they couldnt last a week with " forgetting " > > > things, and started bringing things up again. He kept getting > > upset > > > and saying he doesnt understand why i am mad at him when it was my > > > mom that did most of the wrongs. he did apologize for barging into > > > my house, but that was it. He started crying and asked if i want > > to > > > have a relationship with him, and he will do anything for me to > > make > > > this work, and i told him i dont know, > > > > and got off the phone. i find it funny he said he would do > > > anything, except, let me go to my grandmas bday party. > > > > > > > > so i ended up not going, which i am very resentful for. now i > > get > > > an evite for my cousins engagement party. quickly following it was > > > an email to me and my dad from my cousin, telling us that the > > family > > > thinks we both should be able to go to this party, but since my > > dad > > > wont be there when i am there, we need to work something out, so > > > they want to split the time up between us, so my dad will go from > > 7- > > > 8:30, and we will go 8:30 to 10. I think this is so ridiculous, > > and > > > i dont know what to do. I already agreed to see my mom on > > wednesday > > > to show her pictures, which i am nervous about. i just dont know > > > how to handle this anymore. I was on the right track trying to get > > > things back to normal, and for no reason it all came crashing. i > > > guess the reason i am meeting with my mom is cause she did actual > > > write me an apology for the email finally, so i am rewarding her. > > > and i want to just punish my dad now for pulling this shit and > > > keeping me from seeing my > > > > grandma on her 80th bday.. anyone have any thoughts or > > > suggestions? > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > T > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 I agree -- the " shifts " are a clever way of putting their dirty laundry for everyone to see. Tony is either an invited guest, or he's not. I wouldn't consent to being demoted to a " shift guest " . I would politely decline. -Kyla > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, > > > > > > My wife and I just got back from our vacation, and it was > > > > > incredible. We were in Italy for a little more the 2 weeks, and > > > > > toured practically the whole country, it was great. Well, prior to > > > > > leaving, i know i posted a few times, and i did end up telling my > > > > > mom i didnt want to do therapy yet, but we continued to talk > > > > > periodically, as did my dad and I. I even called and said goodbye > > > > > to them before i left. > > > > > > > > > > > > Well....when i got back, i got a voicemail from my Aunt (dad's > > > > > sister), telling me to call as soon as i could, that it was very > > > > > important. When i called, she told me that they were having a 80th > > > > > bday party for my grandma on sunday (yesterday), and that she felt > > > > > it would be better if i didnt go. I asked why, and she said that > > > > my > > > > > dad says that if i go, he will not go, and they feel it is more > > > > > important to have my dad there then me. I ask here where this is > > > > > coming from, cause my dad and I have been talking recently and > > > > > things have been getting better. she says that he doesnt want a > > > > > relationship with his son that he only sees him at family get > > > > > togethers, he wants more then that. So after much discussion with > > > > > my aunt, i finally got off the phone. > > > > > > > > > > > > I then called my dad and asked him what the deal was? He said it > > > > > hurts him too much to see me and know that we dont have a > > > > > relationship, and that i could go to the bday party, but he would > > > > > not go. I told him i thought we were making progress and getting > > > > > things back to normal, and he said we were, but he wouldnt go to > > > > my > > > > > grandmas thing without seeing me first. and started saying he > > > > would > > > > > be willing to see me today (saturday), and he just wants us to > > > > > forget everything that has happend. I told him that last time we > > > > > tried doing that, that they couldnt last a week with " forgetting " > > > > > things, and started bringing things up again. He kept getting > > > > upset > > > > > and saying he doesnt understand why i am mad at him when it was my > > > > > mom that did most of the wrongs. he did apologize for barging into > > > > > my house, but that was it. He started crying and asked if i want > > > > to > > > > > have a relationship with him, and he will do anything for me to > > > > make > > > > > this work, and i told him i dont know, > > > > > > and got off the phone. i find it funny he said he would do > > > > > anything, except, let me go to my grandmas bday party. > > > > > > > > > > > > so i ended up not going, which i am very resentful for. now i > > > > get > > > > > an evite for my cousins engagement party. quickly following it was > > > > > an email to me and my dad from my cousin, telling us that the > > > > family > > > > > thinks we both should be able to go to this party, but since my > > > > dad > > > > > wont be there when i am there, we need to work something out, so > > > > > they want to split the time up between us, so my dad will go from > > > > 7- > > > > > 8:30, and we will go 8:30 to 10. I think this is so ridiculous, > > > > and > > > > > i dont know what to do. I already agreed to see my mom on > > > > wednesday > > > > > to show her pictures, which i am nervous about. i just dont know > > > > > how to handle this anymore. I was on the right track trying to get > > > > > things back to normal, and for no reason it all came crashing. i > > > > > guess the reason i am meeting with my mom is cause she did actual > > > > > write me an apology for the email finally, so i am rewarding her. > > > > > and i want to just punish my dad now for pulling this shit and > > > > > keeping me from seeing my > > > > > > grandma on her 80th bday. anyone have any thoughts or > > > > > suggestions? > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > T > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 I feel sorry for his cousin -- this has already overshadowed the reason for the party: her happiness at being engaged. She's been shoved aside, and the greater drama will take center stage -- especially if there are shifts. Reminds me of when I was newly engaged and my dad told me to " keep it to yourself " and not announce it because it would " hurt your mother " . I was shoved out of the spotlight, just like tony's cousin. > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, > > > > > > My wife and I just got back from our vacation, and it was > > > > > incredible. We were in Italy for a little more the 2 weeks, > and > > > > > toured practically the whole country, it was great. Well, > prior to > > > > > leaving, i know i posted a few times, and i did end up > telling my > > > > > mom i didnt want to do therapy yet, but we continued to talk > > > > > periodically, as did my dad and I. I even called and said > goodbye > > > > > to them before i left. > > > > > > > > > > > > Well....when i got back, i got a voicemail from my Aunt > (dad's > > > > > sister), telling me to call as soon as i could, that it was > very > > > > > important.. When i called, she told me that they were having > a 80th > > > > > bday party for my grandma on sunday (yesterday), and that > she felt > > > > > it would be better if i didnt go. I asked why, and she said > that > > > > my > > > > > dad says that if i go, he will not go, and they feel it is > more > > > > > important to have my dad there then me. I ask here where > this is > > > > > coming from, cause my dad and I have been talking recently > and > > > > > things have been getting better. she says that he doesnt > want a > > > > > relationship with his son that he only sees him at family get > > > > > togethers, he wants more then that. So after much discussion > with > > > > > my aunt, i finally got off the phone. > > > > > > > > > > > > I then called my dad and asked him what the deal was? He > said it > > > > > hurts him too much to see me and know that we dont have a > > > > > relationship, and that i could go to the bday party, but he > would > > > > > not go. I told him i thought we were making progress and > getting > > > > > things back to normal, and he said we were, but he wouldnt > go to > > > > my > > > > > grandmas thing without seeing me first. and started saying he > > > > would > > > > > be willing to see me today (saturday), and he just wants us > to > > > > > forget everything that has happend. I told him that last > time we > > > > > tried doing that, that they couldnt last a week > with " forgetting " > > > > > things, and started bringing things up again. He kept getting > > > > upset > > > > > and saying he doesnt understand why i am mad at him when it > was my > > > > > mom that did most of the wrongs. he did apologize for > barging into > > > > > my house, but that was it. He started crying and asked if i > want > > > > to > > > > > have a relationship with him, and he will do anything for me > to > > > > make > > > > > this work, and i told him i dont know, > > > > > > and got off the phone. i find it funny he said he would do > > > > > anything, except, let me go to my grandmas bday party. > > > > > > > > > > > > so i ended up not going, which i am very resentful for. > now i > > > > get > > > > > an evite for my cousins engagement party. quickly following > it was > > > > > an email to me and my dad from my cousin, telling us that the > > > > family > > > > > thinks we both should be able to go to this party, but since > my > > > > dad > > > > > wont be there when i am there, we need to work something > out, so > > > > > they want to split the time up between us, so my dad will go > from > > > > 7- > > > > > 8:30, and we will go 8:30 to 10. I think this is so > ridiculous, > > > > and > > > > > i dont know what to do. I already agreed to see my mom on > > > > wednesday > > > > > to show her pictures, which i am nervous about. i just dont > know > > > > > how to handle this anymore. I was on the right track trying > to get > > > > > things back to normal, and for no reason it all came > crashing. i > > > > > guess the reason i am meeting with my mom is cause she did > actual > > > > > write me an apology for the email finally, so i am rewarding > her. > > > > > and i want to just punish my dad now for pulling this shit > and > > > > > keeping me from seeing my > > > > > > grandma on her 80th bday. anyone have any thoughts or > > > > > suggestions? > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > T > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 Oh -- you're right -- I hadn't considered that! Then I would be politely brief -- say you're handling it and don't think it's a good idea for others to get involved. Then I'd clam up! I liked the letter that Lilly Blue wrote -- that this issue has its own timetable, that you're getting help (and don't provide details on that!) and that you appreciate her concern but she doesn't need to get involved. I know there are people who have no clue about what we deal with as regards our BPD family members, and they think they can fix everything -- but what they don't understand is your parents are bullying you and putting the tightest squeeze play on you that they possibly can, in an effort to get you to cede to their demands. Giving in to " make peace " would be like handing a 2 year old a cookie after their temper tantrum: all it does it teach them that the temper tantrum delivers the goods. Ride this out -- no matter how long it takes, so your parents will realize these blackmail games don't work on you. Outlast them. -Kyla > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, > > > > > > > My wife and I just got back from our vacation, and it was > > > > > > incredible. We were in Italy for a little more the 2 > weeks, > > and > > > > > > toured practically the whole country, it was great. Well, > > prior to > > > > > > leaving, i know i posted a few times, and i did end up > > telling my > > > > > > mom i didnt want to do therapy yet, but we continued to > talk > > > > > > periodically, as did my dad and I. I even called and said > > goodbye > > > > > > to them before i left. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well....when i got back, i got a voicemail from my Aunt > > (dad's > > > > > > sister), telling me to call as soon as i could, that it > was > > very > > > > > > important.. When i called, she told me that they were > having > > a 80th > > > > > > bday party for my grandma on sunday (yesterday), and that > > she felt > > > > > > it would be better if i didnt go. I asked why, and she > said > > that > > > > > my > > > > > > dad says that if i go, he will not go, and they feel it is > > more > > > > > > important to have my dad there then me. I ask here where > > this is > > > > > > coming from, cause my dad and I have been talking recently > > and > > > > > > things have been getting better. she says that he doesnt > > want a > > > > > > relationship with his son that he only sees him at family > get > > > > > > togethers, he wants more then that. So after much > discussion > > with > > > > > > my aunt, i finally got off the phone. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I then called my dad and asked him what the deal was? He > > said it > > > > > > hurts him too much to see me and know that we dont have a > > > > > > relationship, and that i could go to the bday party, but > he > > would > > > > > > not go. I told him i thought we were making progress and > > getting > > > > > > things back to normal, and he said we were, but he wouldnt > > go to > > > > > my > > > > > > grandmas thing without seeing me first. and started saying > he > > > > > would > > > > > > be willing to see me today (saturday), and he just wants > us > > to > > > > > > forget everything that has happend. I told him that last > > time we > > > > > > tried doing that, that they couldnt last a week > > with " forgetting " > > > > > > things, and started bringing things up again. He kept > getting > > > > > upset > > > > > > and saying he doesnt understand why i am mad at him when > it > > was my > > > > > > mom that did most of the wrongs. he did apologize for > > barging into > > > > > > my house, but that was it. He started crying and asked if > i > > want > > > > > to > > > > > > have a relationship with him, and he will do anything for > me > > to > > > > > make > > > > > > this work, and i told him i dont know, > > > > > > > and got off the phone. i find it funny he said he would > do > > > > > > anything, except, let me go to my grandmas bday party. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so i ended up not going, which i am very resentful for. > > now i > > > > > get > > > > > > an evite for my cousins engagement party. quickly > following > > it was > > > > > > an email to me and my dad from my cousin, telling us that > the > > > > > family > > > > > > thinks we both should be able to go to this party, but > since > > my > > > > > dad > > > > > > wont be there when i am there, we need to work something > > out, so > > > > > > they want to split the time up between us, so my dad will > go > > from > > > > > 7- > > > > > > 8:30, and we will go 8:30 to 10. I think this is so > > ridiculous, > > > > > and > > > > > > i dont know what to do. I already agreed to see my mom on > > > > > wednesday > > > > > > to show her pictures, which i am nervous about. i just > dont > > know > > > > > > how to handle this anymore. I was on the right track > trying > > to get > > > > > > things back to normal, and for no reason it all came > > crashing. i > > > > > > guess the reason i am meeting with my mom is cause she did > > actual > > > > > > write me an apology for the email finally, so i am > rewarding > > her. > > > > > > and i want to just punish my dad now for pulling this shit > > and > > > > > > keeping me from seeing my > > > > > > > grandma on her 80th bday. anyone have any thoughts or > > > > > > suggestions? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > T > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 True, but the bride has to know it's going on, and it's still unfortunate that your parents have commandeered her party. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, > > > > > > > My wife and I just got back from our vacation, and it was > > > > > > incredible. We were in Italy for a little more the 2 > weeks, > > and > > > > > > toured practically the whole country, it was great. Well, > > prior to > > > > > > leaving, i know i posted a few times, and i did end up > > telling my > > > > > > mom i didnt want to do therapy yet, but we continued to > talk > > > > > > periodically, as did my dad and I. I even called and said > > goodbye > > > > > > to them before i left. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well....when i got back, i got a voicemail from my Aunt > > (dad's > > > > > > sister), telling me to call as soon as i could, that it > was > > very > > > > > > important.. When i called, she told me that they were > having > > a 80th > > > > > > bday party for my grandma on sunday (yesterday), and that > > she felt > > > > > > it would be better if i didnt go. I asked why, and she > said > > that > > > > > my > > > > > > dad says that if i go, he will not go, and they feel it is > > more > > > > > > important to have my dad there then me. I ask here where > > this is > > > > > > coming from, cause my dad and I have been talking recently > > and > > > > > > things have been getting better. she says that he doesnt > > want a > > > > > > relationship with his son that he only sees him at family > get > > > > > > togethers, he wants more then that. So after much > discussion > > with > > > > > > my aunt, i finally got off the phone. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I then called my dad and asked him what the deal was? He > > said it > > > > > > hurts him too much to see me and know that we dont have a > > > > > > relationship, and that i could go to the bday party, but > he > > would > > > > > > not go. I told him i thought we were making progress and > > getting > > > > > > things back to normal, and he said we were, but he wouldnt > > go to > > > > > my > > > > > > grandmas thing without seeing me first. and started saying > he > > > > > would > > > > > > be willing to see me today (saturday), and he just wants > us > > to > > > > > > forget everything that has happend. I told him that last > > time we > > > > > > tried doing that, that they couldnt last a week > > with " forgetting " > > > > > > things, and started bringing things up again. He kept > getting > > > > > upset > > > > > > and saying he doesnt understand why i am mad at him when > it > > was my > > > > > > mom that did most of the wrongs. he did apologize for > > barging into > > > > > > my house, but that was it. He started crying and asked if > i > > want > > > > > to > > > > > > have a relationship with him, and he will do anything for > me > > to > > > > > make > > > > > > this work, and i told him i dont know, > > > > > > > and got off the phone. i find it funny he said he would > do > > > > > > anything, except, let me go to my grandmas bday party. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so i ended up not going, which i am very resentful for. > > now i > > > > > get > > > > > > an evite for my cousins engagement party. quickly > following > > it was > > > > > > an email to me and my dad from my cousin, telling us that > the > > > > > family > > > > > > thinks we both should be able to go to this party, but > since > > my > > > > > dad > > > > > > wont be there when i am there, we need to work something > > out, so > > > > > > they want to split the time up between us, so my dad will > go > > from > > > > > 7- > > > > > > 8:30, and we will go 8:30 to 10. I think this is so > > ridiculous, > > > > > and > > > > > > i dont know what to do. I already agreed to see my mom on > > > > > wednesday > > > > > > to show her pictures, which i am nervous about. i just > dont > > know > > > > > > how to handle this anymore. I was on the right track > trying > > to get > > > > > > things back to normal, and for no reason it all came > > crashing. i > > > > > > guess the reason i am meeting with my mom is cause she did > > actual > > > > > > write me an apology for the email finally, so i am > rewarding > > her. > > > > > > and i want to just punish my dad now for pulling this shit > > and > > > > > > keeping me from seeing my > > > > > > > grandma on her 80th bday. anyone have any thoughts or > > > > > > suggestions? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > T > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 tony: I'm not clear what e-mail your mom's responding to, but she's continuing to engage you, which is what she wants. It's almost like she thinks she can lead you inside by holding out a cookie -- Depending on what e-mail she's responding to, I would leave it at this -- it's noise. BPD noise. (That " perhaps you misunderstood " is a CLASSIC BPD gaslighting response!) I'd send that long, well thought out e-mail in response to this -- I wouldn't change a thing. Then, I wouldn't respond any more. She's trying to make you explain yourself -- as if she's an authority over you, and she's not. That's why I wanted to clarify what she's responding to -- if you haven't sent that good, long e-mail, send it and be done with this. If she keeps at it, send a brief, " I've explained where I stand on this. I can't say any more. " Quit engaging -- draw your boundaries then clam up. As long as she's engaging you, her adrenaline's up and the game is on! They LIVE for the game! Walk away after you make your opinions clear. Adults don't have to overexplain their position. Your mother's trying to make you a child again. Don't focus on what she wrote -- it's just noise. Take a breath and don't let her pull your strings. State your case and then pull back. Your words will have more effect if you keep the explanations to a minimum. And that " perhaps you misunderstood " is total crap. You aren't misunderstanding ANYTHING. Being disinvited to your grandmother's birthday doesn't leave much to be misunderstood -- the message was loud and clear: emotional blackmail. Stop tangling with her. Pull back after making your position clear. -Kyla > > > > > > Well, > > > My wife and I just got back from our vacation, and it was > > incredible. We were in Italy for a little more the 2 weeks, and > > toured practically the whole country, it was great. Well, prior to > > leaving, i know i posted a few times, and i did end up telling my > > mom i didnt want to do therapy yet, but we continued to talk > > periodically, as did my dad and I. I even called and said goodbye > > to them before i left. > > > > > > Well....when i got back, i got a voicemail from my Aunt (dad's > > sister), telling me to call as soon as i could, that it was very > > important. When i called, she told me that they were having a 80th > > bday party for my grandma on sunday (yesterday), and that she felt > > it would be better if i didnt go. I asked why, and she said that > my > > dad says that if i go, he will not go, and they feel it is more > > important to have my dad there then me. I ask here where this is > > coming from, cause my dad and I have been talking recently and > > things have been getting better. she says that he doesnt want a > > relationship with his son that he only sees him at family get > > togethers, he wants more then that. So after much discussion with > > my aunt, i finally got off the phone. > > > > > > I then called my dad and asked him what the deal was? He said it > > hurts him too much to see me and know that we dont have a > > relationship, and that i could go to the bday party, but he would > > not go. I told him i thought we were making progress and getting > > things back to normal, and he said we were, but he wouldnt go to > my > > grandmas thing without seeing me first. and started saying he > would > > be willing to see me today (saturday), and he just wants us to > > forget everything that has happend. I told him that last time we > > tried doing that, that they couldnt last a week with " forgetting " > > things, and started bringing things up again. He kept getting > upset > > and saying he doesnt understand why i am mad at him when it was my > > mom that did most of the wrongs. he did apologize for barging into > > my house, but that was it. He started crying and asked if i want > to > > have a relationship with him, and he will do anything for me to > make > > this work, and i told him i dont know, > > > and got off the phone. i find it funny he said he would do > > anything, except, let me go to my grandmas bday party. > > > > > > so i ended up not going, which i am very resentful for. now i > get > > an evite for my cousins engagement party. quickly following it was > > an email to me and my dad from my cousin, telling us that the > family > > thinks we both should be able to go to this party, but since my > dad > > wont be there when i am there, we need to work something out, so > > they want to split the time up between us, so my dad will go from > 7- > > 8:30, and we will go 8:30 to 10. I think this is so ridiculous, > and > > i dont know what to do. I already agreed to see my mom on > wednesday > > to show her pictures, which i am nervous about. i just dont know > > how to handle this anymore. I was on the right track trying to get > > things back to normal, and for no reason it all came crashing. i > > guess the reason i am meeting with my mom is cause she did actual > > write me an apology for the email finally, so i am rewarding her. > > and i want to just punish my dad now for pulling this shit and > > keeping me from seeing my > > > grandma on her 80th bday. anyone have any thoughts or > > suggestions? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > T > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2008 Report Share Posted July 16, 2008 " I guess you are forcing us to go to Christie’s in split shifts, " Absolute INSULT! Projection! This mess was brought about by THEM and look how she's putting it on you! Then she contradicts herself by continuing to say " we would appreciate it if you honor the families request to do so. " Insane! She wants split shifts so she can play the victim!!! Tony, you might need to perhaps get used to the idea that this woman (and your father) are not good for your life. They don't respect you, they play emotional hardball -- cruel emotional hardball. They are cruel people, Tony. They're tearing you apart. That's not " family closeness " -- it's abuse. Back to the e-mail -- I'd seriously consider ignoring her point by point insanity. You can respond with your own e-mail and then shut the window on her for awhile. She's not mentally stable. -Kyla > > > > > > Well, > > > My wife and I just got back from our vacation, and it was > > incredible. We were in Italy for a little more the 2 weeks, and > > toured practically the whole country, it was great. Well, prior to > > leaving, i know i posted a few times, and i did end up telling my > > mom i didnt want to do therapy yet, but we continued to talk > > periodically, as did my dad and I. I even called and said goodbye > > to them before i left. > > > > > > Well....when i got back, i got a voicemail from my Aunt (dad's > > sister), telling me to call as soon as i could, that it was very > > important. When i called, she told me that they were having a 80th > > bday party for my grandma on sunday (yesterday), and that she felt > > it would be better if i didnt go. I asked why, and she said that > my > > dad says that if i go, he will not go, and they feel it is more > > important to have my dad there then me. I ask here where this is > > coming from, cause my dad and I have been talking recently and > > things have been getting better. she says that he doesnt want a > > relationship with his son that he only sees him at family get > > togethers, he wants more then that. So after much discussion with > > my aunt, i finally got off the phone. > > > > > > I then called my dad and asked him what the deal was? He said it > > hurts him too much to see me and know that we dont have a > > relationship, and that i could go to the bday party, but he would > > not go. I told him i thought we were making progress and getting > > things back to normal, and he said we were, but he wouldnt go to > my > > grandmas thing without seeing me first. and started saying he > would > > be willing to see me today (saturday), and he just wants us to > > forget everything that has happend. I told him that last time we > > tried doing that, that they couldnt last a week with " forgetting " > > things, and started bringing things up again. He kept getting > upset > > and saying he doesnt understand why i am mad at him when it was my > > mom that did most of the wrongs. he did apologize for barging into > > my house, but that was it. He started crying and asked if i want > to > > have a relationship with him, and he will do anything for me to > make > > this work, and i told him i dont know, > > > and got off the phone. i find it funny he said he would do > > anything, except, let me go to my grandmas bday party. > > > > > > so i ended up not going, which i am very resentful for. now i > get > > an evite for my cousins engagement party. quickly following it was > > an email to me and my dad from my cousin, telling us that the > family > > thinks we both should be able to go to this party, but since my > dad > > wont be there when i am there, we need to work something out, so > > they want to split the time up between us, so my dad will go from > 7- > > 8:30, and we will go 8:30 to 10. I think this is so ridiculous, > and > > i dont know what to do. I already agreed to see my mom on > wednesday > > to show her pictures, which i am nervous about. i just dont know > > how to handle this anymore. I was on the right track trying to get > > things back to normal, and for no reason it all came crashing. i > > guess the reason i am meeting with my mom is cause she did actual > > write me an apology for the email finally, so i am rewarding her. > > and i want to just punish my dad now for pulling this shit and > > keeping me from seeing my > > > grandma on her 80th bday. anyone have any thoughts or > > suggestions? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > T > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2008 Report Share Posted July 17, 2008 I am suspicious of the motives of the cousin, although she may mean well to some extent my own family is full of drama junkies, being a family (well at least on my dad's side, my mother's side, although there are definitely issues, is populated by people who are a bit more capable of going out and having their own lives and being happy and not miserable or feeding off of each other's misery...many of them seem genuinely close and happy to be around each other and truly glad for each other when something good happens) ...sorry for the digression; being a family that spawned bpd/npd types as far as the eyes could see. So anyway, what happens on the paternal side is there is alot of back-stabbing and character defaming but only behind the backs of people although you can always 'read' the energy in the room and know you have been talked about. Everyone on that side of the family is so truly miserable in their own lives, and feels so bad about themselves, that they get a bit of 'high' off of drama that other family members may have, if only because it makes them feel better about themselves. It was very hard for me to see these people in their true light when it finally became clear to me what was going on. One cousin in particular that is less than a year younger than me that I was close to growing up, and whom I have been the ONLY defender of throughout her adolescence which was very rocky, and the only one who supported her many times, got in on the family drama repeatedly and I realize now did not only not defend me but sided with the parents, aunts, and uncles and betrayed me, which really hurt considering the amount of times I had shut down discussions about her behavior by speaking up in her defense (when she wasn't in the room). I know she feels so bad about herself that any family drama like this is a distraction from her own low-self- esteem and problem relationships and you have to tread very carefully around people like this in your family because they are always willing to make things worse for you in an attempt to put themselves in a better light. Sometimes it's just hard to see that is going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2008 Report Share Posted July 17, 2008 Very good point -- this cousin may be seeing this as her turn to be the hero, thereby feeding her own ego. She could be a " drama junkie " -- they do like to feed off family drama. If you step back and notice, the wise ones know to stay out of the drama, but like the saying goes " There's a clown in every classroom " , every family (especially BPD and NPD families) has its drama junkie(s). In my family, there was a HUGE drama over my grandmother's estate -- and plenty more around my grandmother's memorial service, etc. I steered CLEAR of all of it. Tony, take a moment to notice the people who have inserted themselves into this drama -- and yes, they did it VOLUNTARILY: Your aunt, your cousin,......who else? Remember, they're getting a " payoff " when they get involved in this drama, too. Don't think their motives are all pure -- in fact, their motives are probably selfish. Your aunt must have a part of her that delights in delivering bad news. After all, what person with a good heart on this earth would conspire to deliver a " dis- invitation " to her nephew concerning his grandmother's 80th birthday celebration? Your aunt did a mean thing -- and you can't put that on your dad. It was her choice to get involved. Drama junkies are the lifeblood of this type of hurt. They keep this commerce of negativity and abuse going strong. If it had been me, and my brother had asked me to disinvite his son, I would have told him " No way. How dare you hijack mom's party! " See the difference? Moral of the story: watch out for drama junkies. They're co-conspirators. -Kyla > > I am suspicious of the motives of the cousin, although she may mean > well to some extent my own family is full of drama junkies, being a > family (well at least on my dad's side, my mother's side, although > there are definitely issues, is populated by people who are a bit > more capable of going out and having their own lives and being happy > and not miserable or feeding off of each other's misery...many of > them seem genuinely close and happy to be around each other and > truly glad for each other when something good happens) ...sorry for > the digression; being a family that spawned bpd/npd types as far as > the eyes could see. So anyway, what happens on the paternal side is > there is alot of back-stabbing and character defaming but only > behind the backs of people although you can always 'read' the energy > in the room and know you have been talked about. Everyone on that > side of the family is so truly miserable in their own lives, and > feels so bad about themselves, that they get a bit of 'high' off of > drama that other family members may have, if only because it makes > them feel better about themselves. It was very hard for me to see > these people in their true light when it finally became clear to me > what was going on. One cousin in particular that is less than a year > younger than me that I was close to growing up, and whom I have been > the ONLY defender of throughout her adolescence which was very > rocky, and the only one who supported her many times, got in on the > family drama repeatedly and I realize now did not only not defend me > but sided with the parents, aunts, and uncles and betrayed me, which > really hurt considering the amount of times I had shut down > discussions about her behavior by speaking up in her defense (when > she wasn't in the room). I know she feels so bad about herself that > any family drama like this is a distraction from her own low-self- > esteem and problem relationships and you have to tread very > carefully around people like this in your family because they are > always willing to make things worse for you in an attempt to put > themselves in a better light. Sometimes it's just hard to see that > is going on. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2008 Report Share Posted July 17, 2008 I wonder what would have happened if, during the aunt's dis-inviting phone call to tony, if he would have taken that moment to stop and focus on HER and said " Why Auntie, I'm surprised you're making this call. I'm hurt you'd be a part of this. This isn't like you. " Co-conspirators like to sweep themselves along in the drama, hoping the spotlight won't be turned on their role. It's usually effective to take a moment and single them out personally. They truly hope that with all the drama and swept-up emotion, they won't be noticed. I like to take a moment to do just that. I had a former friend who was jealous of everything I had and did, and she would always find a way to tell me some nugget of negative gossip that " someone else " said about me. Finally, I looked her square in the eye and said " Well I'm really surprised that you carefully scooped it all up and brought it all back to me -- you must have wanted to hurt me. I'm sure Jane didn't mean for me to hear it -- so why would you bring it to me? " (paraphrasing) That stopped her cold. She was counting on me being mad at Jane, the originator of the gossip. Instead, I questioned my " friend " on why she kept bringing me hurtful gossip. I made my point with her. Also, with time, I realized she was no friend, and I dropped her. -Kyla > > > > I am suspicious of the motives of the cousin, although she may > mean > > well to some extent my own family is full of drama junkies, being > a > > family (well at least on my dad's side, my mother's side, although > > there are definitely issues, is populated by people who are a bit > > more capable of going out and having their own lives and being > happy > > and not miserable or feeding off of each other's misery...many of > > them seem genuinely close and happy to be around each other and > > truly glad for each other when something good happens) ...sorry > for > > the digression; being a family that spawned bpd/npd types as far > as > > the eyes could see. So anyway, what happens on the paternal side > is > > there is alot of back-stabbing and character defaming but only > > behind the backs of people although you can always 'read' the > energy > > in the room and know you have been talked about. Everyone on that > > side of the family is so truly miserable in their own lives, and > > feels so bad about themselves, that they get a bit of 'high' off > of > > drama that other family members may have, if only because it makes > > them feel better about themselves. It was very hard for me to see > > these people in their true light when it finally became clear to > me > > what was going on. One cousin in particular that is less than a > year > > younger than me that I was close to growing up, and whom I have > been > > the ONLY defender of throughout her adolescence which was very > > rocky, and the only one who supported her many times, got in on > the > > family drama repeatedly and I realize now did not only not defend > me > > but sided with the parents, aunts, and uncles and betrayed me, > which > > really hurt considering the amount of times I had shut down > > discussions about her behavior by speaking up in her defense (when > > she wasn't in the room). I know she feels so bad about herself > that > > any family drama like this is a distraction from her own low- self- > > esteem and problem relationships and you have to tread very > > carefully around people like this in your family because they are > > always willing to make things worse for you in an attempt to put > > themselves in a better light. Sometimes it's just hard to see that > > is going on. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2008 Report Share Posted July 17, 2008 My BPD mom is a prime example: HUGE drama junkie. Rushes to hospital bedsides (missed my college graduation to do that), jumps right in to family squabbles, sees conspiracies everywhere.... Even her choice of reading material -- true crime books -- shows her penchant for dark drama. -Kyla > > > > I am suspicious of the motives of the cousin, although she may > mean > > well to some extent my own family is full of drama junkies, being > a > > family (well at least on my dad's side, my mother's side, although > > there are definitely issues, is populated by people who are a bit > > more capable of going out and having their own lives and being > happy > > and not miserable or feeding off of each other's misery...many of > > them seem genuinely close and happy to be around each other and > > truly glad for each other when something good happens) ...sorry > for > > the digression; being a family that spawned bpd/npd types as far > as > > the eyes could see. So anyway, what happens on the paternal side > is > > there is alot of back-stabbing and character defaming but only > > behind the backs of people although you can always 'read' the > energy > > in the room and know you have been talked about. Everyone on that > > side of the family is so truly miserable in their own lives, and > > feels so bad about themselves, that they get a bit of 'high' off > of > > drama that other family members may have, if only because it makes > > them feel better about themselves. It was very hard for me to see > > these people in their true light when it finally became clear to > me > > what was going on. One cousin in particular that is less than a > year > > younger than me that I was close to growing up, and whom I have > been > > the ONLY defender of throughout her adolescence which was very > > rocky, and the only one who supported her many times, got in on > the > > family drama repeatedly and I realize now did not only not defend > me > > but sided with the parents, aunts, and uncles and betrayed me, > which > > really hurt considering the amount of times I had shut down > > discussions about her behavior by speaking up in her defense (when > > she wasn't in the room). I know she feels so bad about herself > that > > any family drama like this is a distraction from her own low- self- > > esteem and problem relationships and you have to tread very > > carefully around people like this in your family because they are > > always willing to make things worse for you in an attempt to put > > themselves in a better light. Sometimes it's just hard to see that > > is going on. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2008 Report Share Posted July 17, 2008 Yes, I'd drop my cousin from any further discussion on this -- she gave the usual " I'm just trying to be a good host, etc. " when, in actuality, she's doing just what everybody here (including you) suspects she's doing: getting involved for her own reasons. Good e-mail to her -- I wouldn't address it any more. And, on the day of the party, since the party will already be planned and she will have other things to do, you don't have to follow her dictates of appearing in your assigned shift -- I would use that time to make a statement: show up outside the bounds of your shift! If anyone is rude enough to bring it up, just say " I never agreed to show up in a shift -- I didn't agree with that idea. Aren't we here to honor ? " Yep, your cousin's a drama junkie. I'd ignore her reply. Your e- mail to her was great. Let it be your stand. Good job. Go ahead and join the " Proud Moment " thread anytime you like -- because you keep triumphing over your own panicked e-mails. GOOD FOR YOU! -Kyla > > > > > > I am suspicious of the motives of the cousin, although she may > > mean > > > well to some extent my own family is full of drama junkies, > being > > a > > > family (well at least on my dad's side, my mother's side, > although > > > there are definitely issues, is populated by people who are a > bit > > > more capable of going out and having their own lives and being > > happy > > > and not miserable or feeding off of each other's misery...many > of > > > them seem genuinely close and happy to be around each other and > > > truly glad for each other when something good happens) ...sorry > > for > > > the digression; being a family that spawned bpd/npd types as far > > as > > > the eyes could see. So anyway, what happens on the paternal side > > is > > > there is alot of back-stabbing and character defaming but only > > > behind the backs of people although you can always 'read' the > > energy > > > in the room and know you have been talked about. Everyone on > that > > > side of the family is so truly miserable in their own lives, and > > > feels so bad about themselves, that they get a bit of 'high' off > > of > > > drama that other family members may have, if only because it > makes > > > them feel better about themselves. It was very hard for me to > see > > > these people in their true light when it finally became clear to > > me > > > what was going on. One cousin in particular that is less than a > > year > > > younger than me that I was close to growing up, and whom I have > > been > > > the ONLY defender of throughout her adolescence which was very > > > rocky, and the only one who supported her many times, got in on > > the > > > family drama repeatedly and I realize now did not only not > defend > > me > > > but sided with the parents, aunts, and uncles and betrayed me, > > which > > > really hurt considering the amount of times I had shut down > > > discussions about her behavior by speaking up in her defense > (when > > > she wasn't in the room). I know she feels so bad about herself > > that > > > any family drama like this is a distraction from her own low- > self- > > > esteem and problem relationships and you have to tread very > > > carefully around people like this in your family because they > are > > > always willing to make things worse for you in an attempt to put > > > themselves in a better light. Sometimes it's just hard to see > that > > > is going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2008 Report Share Posted July 17, 2008 Or, you could respond with a brief, " Thanks, I'd rather handle this between me and my parents. " A subtle message that she's in someone else's business. She apparently thinks her status as " hostess " gives her some kind of free pass into all the guests' squabbles. -K > > > > > > > > I am suspicious of the motives of the cousin, although she may > > > mean > > > > well to some extent my own family is full of drama junkies, > > being > > > a > > > > family (well at least on my dad's side, my mother's side, > > although > > > > there are definitely issues, is populated by people who are a > > bit > > > > more capable of going out and having their own lives and being > > > happy > > > > and not miserable or feeding off of each other's misery...many > > of > > > > them seem genuinely close and happy to be around each other > and > > > > truly glad for each other when something good > happens) ...sorry > > > for > > > > the digression; being a family that spawned bpd/npd types as > far > > > as > > > > the eyes could see. So anyway, what happens on the paternal > side > > > is > > > > there is alot of back-stabbing and character defaming but only > > > > behind the backs of people although you can always 'read' the > > > energy > > > > in the room and know you have been talked about. Everyone on > > that > > > > side of the family is so truly miserable in their own lives, > and > > > > feels so bad about themselves, that they get a bit of 'high' > off > > > of > > > > drama that other family members may have, if only because it > > makes > > > > them feel better about themselves. It was very hard for me to > > see > > > > these people in their true light when it finally became clear > to > > > me > > > > what was going on. One cousin in particular that is less than > a > > > year > > > > younger than me that I was close to growing up, and whom I > have > > > been > > > > the ONLY defender of throughout her adolescence which was very > > > > rocky, and the only one who supported her many times, got in > on > > > the > > > > family drama repeatedly and I realize now did not only not > > defend > > > me > > > > but sided with the parents, aunts, and uncles and betrayed me, > > > which > > > > really hurt considering the amount of times I had shut down > > > > discussions about her behavior by speaking up in her defense > > (when > > > > she wasn't in the room). I know she feels so bad about herself > > > that > > > > any family drama like this is a distraction from her own low- > > self- > > > > esteem and problem relationships and you have to tread very > > > > carefully around people like this in your family because they > > are > > > > always willing to make things worse for you in an attempt to > put > > > > themselves in a better light. Sometimes it's just hard to see > > that > > > > is going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2008 Report Share Posted July 17, 2008 Tony -- having been through this myself, it is very gratifying to reach out and pull someone else out of the muck. I'm sure I'm not alone in that sentiment. Life is too short to be living the tortures of someone else's dysfunction. Or to worry constantly about filling the bottomless emotional needs of emotionally damaged people. If you conquer this, the way many of us have, you will deal with the emotional unstables of the world that much better. You'll have one of the best tools life can give you. Because, trust me, they walk among us every day. Might as well strengthen yourself now, with the toughest of them all: emotionally demanding parents and family. {hugs} Kyla > > > > > > > > I am suspicious of the motives of the cousin, although she may > > > mean > > > > well to some extent my own family is full of drama junkies, > > being > > > a > > > > family (well at least on my dad's side, my mother's side, > > although > > > > there are definitely issues, is populated by people who are a > > bit > > > > more capable of going out and having their own lives and being > > > happy > > > > and not miserable or feeding off of each other's misery...many > > of > > > > them seem genuinely close and happy to be around each other > and > > > > truly glad for each other when something good > happens) ...sorry > > > for > > > > the digression; being a family that spawned bpd/npd types as > far > > > as > > > > the eyes could see. So anyway, what happens on the paternal > side > > > is > > > > there is alot of back-stabbing and character defaming but only > > > > behind the backs of people although you can always 'read' the > > > energy > > > > in the room and know you have been talked about. Everyone on > > that > > > > side of the family is so truly miserable in their own lives, > and > > > > feels so bad about themselves, that they get a bit of 'high' > off > > > of > > > > drama that other family members may have, if only because it > > makes > > > > them feel better about themselves. It was very hard for me to > > see > > > > these people in their true light when it finally became clear > to > > > me > > > > what was going on. One cousin in particular that is less than > a > > > year > > > > younger than me that I was close to growing up, and whom I > have > > > been > > > > the ONLY defender of throughout her adolescence which was very > > > > rocky, and the only one who supported her many times, got in > on > > > the > > > > family drama repeatedly and I realize now did not only not > > defend > > > me > > > > but sided with the parents, aunts, and uncles and betrayed me, > > > which > > > > really hurt considering the amount of times I had shut down > > > > discussions about her behavior by speaking up in her defense > > (when > > > > she wasn't in the room). I know she feels so bad about herself > > > that > > > > any family drama like this is a distraction from her own low- > > self- > > > > esteem and problem relationships and you have to tread very > > > > carefully around people like this in your family because they > > are > > > > always willing to make things worse for you in an attempt to > put > > > > themselves in a better light. Sometimes it's just hard to see > > that > > > > is going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2008 Report Share Posted July 17, 2008 you're welcome -- I've learned from this, too! You've obviously touched a nerve with this thread! {hugs} Kyla > > > > > > > > I am suspicious of the motives of the cousin, although she may > > > mean > > > > well to some extent my own family is full of drama junkies, > > being > > > a > > > > family (well at least on my dad's side, my mother's side, > > although > > > > there are definitely issues, is populated by people who are a > > bit > > > > more capable of going out and having their own lives and being > > > happy > > > > and not miserable or feeding off of each other's misery...many > > of > > > > them seem genuinely close and happy to be around each other > and > > > > truly glad for each other when something good > happens) ...sorry > > > for > > > > the digression; being a family that spawned bpd/npd types as > far > > > as > > > > the eyes could see. So anyway, what happens on the paternal > side > > > is > > > > there is alot of back-stabbing and character defaming but only > > > > behind the backs of people although you can always 'read' the > > > energy > > > > in the room and know you have been talked about. Everyone on > > that > > > > side of the family is so truly miserable in their own lives, > and > > > > feels so bad about themselves, that they get a bit of 'high' > off > > > of > > > > drama that other family members may have, if only because it > > makes > > > > them feel better about themselves. It was very hard for me to > > see > > > > these people in their true light when it finally became clear > to > > > me > > > > what was going on. One cousin in particular that is less than > a > > > year > > > > younger than me that I was close to growing up, and whom I > have > > > been > > > > the ONLY defender of throughout her adolescence which was very > > > > rocky, and the only one who supported her many times, got in > on > > > the > > > > family drama repeatedly and I realize now did not only not > > defend > > > me > > > > but sided with the parents, aunts, and uncles and betrayed me, > > > which > > > > really hurt considering the amount of times I had shut down > > > > discussions about her behavior by speaking up in her defense > > (when > > > > she wasn't in the room). I know she feels so bad about herself > > > that > > > > any family drama like this is a distraction from her own low- > > self- > > > > esteem and problem relationships and you have to tread very > > > > carefully around people like this in your family because they > > are > > > > always willing to make things worse for you in an attempt to > put > > > > themselves in a better light. Sometimes it's just hard to see > > that > > > > is going on. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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