butter oil vs. K2 supplement

[Guest guest]

>On the VitaminK list, folks are finding bad symptoms

>(presumably from oxalate dumping) if the dose is increased too

>rapidly in children.

Amy, what are the symptoms of oxalate dumping?

And do you have a link to that list?

Thanks,

Suze

[Guest guest]

-

> Is it possible to culture your own already formed butter?

No, not that I know of. Cultured butter is made from cultured cream

or cultured milk.

-

[Guest guest]

At 08:50 AM 6/20/2007, you wrote:

>On Jun 19, 2007, at 6:16 PM, Snider wrote:

>

> > I currently buy cultured hand churned butter from our raw milk farmer.

>

>I have been wondering about cultured butter. Is this a better thing

>than just regular raw butter?

Yes. It has probiotics in it, as yogurt does.

>Should we ask Organic Pastures to culture

>some butter?

Yes! I wish they did! When I want cultured butter I buy President brand

imported from France, but it's not organic.

>Is it possible to culture your own already formed butter?

I doubt it since the culturing normally occurs before the

churning/butter-making. But I don't know for sure.

mother of Adam (8, PDD-NOS, Lyme, asthma)

[Guest guest]

>Is it possible to culture your own already formed butter?

A friend of mine made cultured butter out of kefir. That is, she

made kefir out of cream (milk kefir + cream; let sit for a day or

two). Then she took the cream kefir and made butter out of it in her

food processor. Yum. It had a slightly unusual texture, probably

because of the unusual texture that kefir has (compared to milk/cream).

-jennifer

[Guest guest]

Here is a link to the list:

VitaminK/

The side effects that , the list owner, mentions are

insomnia, stimming, regression, moodiness, diarrhea, and intestinal or

bladder discomfort. Sometimes there can be redness around the urethra

or rectum, or burning during urination or moving bowel.

I had read somewhere about viruses and bacteria being 'locked up' in

the oxalate crystals, but I've read too much and can't find where I

saw that. did say that old cellular debris can get released

during the breakup of the crystals. My son had symptoms of measles or

German measles last month, ran about four days with a rash that looked

just like German measles, no fever or itching. But, it could have

been Fifth Disease, because that virus (parvovirus) is easily confused

for rubella/rubeola and has no fever or itching either. He's about

that age, too (6 yo).

Other folks on the list have been testing urine for oxalate crystals,

and there are other recommended supplements to help with the side effects.

She has a very helpful protocol in the files section, and the list is

heavily moderated.

Amy

> Amy, what are the symptoms of oxalate dumping?

>

> And do you have a link to that list?

>

> Thanks,

>

> Suze

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks. Maybe I'll call OP even though I don't feel powerful enough to

make a difference. If enough people ask they might, after all they're

making cheese and kefir now so why not cultured butter?

On Jun 20, 2007, at 8:10 AM, M. Kalb wrote:

>>> I currently buy cultured hand churned butter from our raw milk

>>> farmer.

>>

>> I have been wondering about cultured butter. Is this a better thing

>> than just regular raw butter?

>

> Yes. It has probiotics in it, as yogurt does.

Parashis

artpages@...

zine:

artpagesonline.com

portfolio:

http://www.artpagesonline.com/EPportfolio/000portfolio.html

[Guest guest]

Chris-

> Well no but they are the most economical that are not synthetic, and

> some people do not want to use synthetic supplements.

Do you happen to know what mechanism is used to produce the K2 in

Thorne's supplement? If it's bacterial, " synthetic " might not be

exactly the right word.

> From one anecdote, I know one person who was using a K1-containing K2

> supplement (I think one with much less than this actually), and her

> son had food intolerance problems that got worse with it, but they got

> incredibly better when they ran out and switched to Thorne. I think

> she might be on this list now actually.

Interesting.

Some years ago, a former girlfriend tried the LEF's Super-K and found

that, despite its (allegedly) very high dose of K1, it wasn't nearly

as effective at reducing bruising and promoting clotting (she had

some sort of disorder which caused her to bruise practically just

from getting breathed on) as other K supplements. I'm not sure what

that means about high doses of K1 and/or the LEF supplement, though.

-

[Guest guest]

On 6/24/07, Idol <Idol@...> wrote:

> Do you happen to know what mechanism is used to produce the K2 in

> Thorne's supplement? If it's bacterial, " synthetic " might not be

> exactly the right word.

It isn't bacterial, but I don't know the details. I think it's

basically organic chem lab from scratch. However there is someone

claiming to have food-source MK-4 isolate and I forget the name, but

have to look in my old email and call the company and ask about it,

and I'll report back.

> Some years ago, a former girlfriend tried the LEF's Super-K and found

> that, despite its (allegedly) very high dose of K1, it wasn't nearly

> as effective at reducing bruising and promoting clotting (she had

> some sort of disorder which caused her to bruise practically just

> from getting breathed on) as other K supplements. I'm not sure what

> that means about high doses of K1 and/or the LEF supplement, though.

Are you sure this is a clotting issue rather than an issue of blood

vessel elasticity and integrity? I'm thinking calcified blood vessels

might be more likely to rupture?

Chris