Post PVA

[Guest guest]

Hi Vicky,

The post operative instructions I received from my EP also say to take it

easy for 30 days. No heavy lifting or other vigorous activities.Pace yourself

and allow the heart to heal.

Rich O

[Guest guest]

Guys I could not see the report so I signed up for you all and copied it.

here it is.

c

Source: University of Pennsylvania

by: Ellen O'Brien

03/20/2002

Cardiac rhythm specialists for the University of Pennsylvania Health System have

documented the effectiveness of a new technique to cure atrial fibrillation

(A-Fib).

The technique targets and isolates the triggers, or " hot spots, " on pulmonary

veins leading to the heart, preserving the heart's natural electrical circuitry

and eliminating the need for a pacemaker or medication.

Francis E. Marchlinski, M.D., director of Cardiac Electrophysiology for the

University of Pennsylvania Health System, discussed the findings on March 20,

2002, at the American College of Cardiologists meeting in Atlanta.

" This procedure can eliminate atrial fibrillation completely and patients can

resume their lives without relying on mechanical devices or any form of

medication, including blood-thinners, " Marchlinski says.

Atrial fibrillation is a serious condition, often associated with aging, which

results when electrical discharges in one of the atria (upper chambers of the

heart) disrupt the normal, organized electrical activity, or " sinus rhythm, "

generated by the heart's sinus node.

Patients with this arrhythmia often suffer a rapid heartbeat, palpitations,

weakness, shortness of breath and fatigue, although sometimes the condition

manifests no symptoms. The arrhythmia may begin with occasional or regular bouts

of an irregular heart beat, but it generally worsens over the

years.

Traditional ablation procedures for this arrhythmia deliver an electrical charge

that permanently blocks the electrical connection that transmits the impulse

from the atria to the heart's lower ventricles. A pacemaker is then required to

maintain an adequate heart rate.

The older procedure does not cure fibrillation, but merely prevents the fast

heart rate that frequently accompanies atrial fibrillation, and patients still

require blood-thinning medication.

The Penn procedure is more specific in targeting the triggers for atrial

fibrillation rather than blocking the main electrical road to the heart. During

the ablation process, Penn electrophysiologists infuse drugs that promote the

firing of so-called " hot spots " in the pulmonary veins. Once those

triggers are identified with the use of sophisticated electrical recording

techniques, a catheter-based ablation procedure isolates the abnormal fibers

that cause them.

The Penn team has developed what it believes are the optimal recording

strategies and pacing techniques for identifying the affected veins rapidly and

confirming the effectiveness of the isolation procedure.

" We've been working on this problem for the last five years, and we're excited

by the effectiveness and low complication rates associated with our current

technique, " Marchlinski says.

Others who assisted Marchlinski include . J. Callans, M.D.; a S. Zado;

J. Russo, M.D.; P. Gerstenfeld, M.D.; Sanjay Dixit, M.D.;

W. Rho, M.D.; Vickas Patel, M.D.; Veshai, M.D.; ph W. Poku, M.D., and

Lin, M.D., all of the Penn heath system.

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Re: Post PVA

Is this the proceedure you are talking abourt?

http://www.acurian.com/link.jsp?cd=FEATURE & id=0900744b800195b6

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[Guest guest]

on Fri, 21 Jun 2002 at 11:32:37, celtic8586@... wrote :

>Has your Dr. given you a time frame of recovery and at the end of that

>recovery, you are declared cured of AF?

Rich,

No, no time frame given, or discussed. I did try and get a clue since I

thought he might know more after I had been on the table than he did

before, but even so he wouldn't be drawn any more than the standard

figures.

So I am basically taking it a day at a time but enjoying it! I come off

the Flecainide in 10 days time, then see my Cardio (not the same as the

EP who did the op) 10 days after that, then I'll try and discuss

prognosis again.

I've had indications that I should take it easy for a month from the Op,

keeping to " normal " but light activities, and only after a month try and

get some fitness back.

I think the rule of thumb is you are " cured " if you make 6 months free.

Best of health to all,

Vicky

[Guest guest]

on Fri, 21 Jun 2002 at 11:32:37, celtic8586@... wrote :

>Has your Dr. given you a time frame of recovery and at the end of that

>recovery, you are declared cured of AF?

Rich,

No, no time frame given, or discussed. I did try and get a clue since I

thought he might know more after I had been on the table than he did

before, but even so he wouldn't be drawn any more than the standard

figures.

So I am basically taking it a day at a time but enjoying it! I come off

the Flecainide in 10 days time, then see my Cardio (not the same as the

EP who did the op) 10 days after that, then I'll try and discuss

prognosis again.

I've had indications that I should take it easy for a month from the Op,

keeping to " normal " but light activities, and only after a month try and

get some fitness back.

I think the rule of thumb is you are " cured " if you make 6 months free.

Best of health to all,

Vicky

[Guest guest]

> Cardiac rhythm specialists for the University of Pennsylvania

Health System have documented the effectiveness of a new technique to

cure atrial fibrillation (A-Fib).

>

> The technique targets and isolates the triggers, or " hot spots, " on

pulmonary veins leading to the heart,

I have the dim idea that there are two ablation techniques for afib,

not counting the pseudo-maze. One goes after identifiable hot spots

and the other does a circular thing that isolates the pulmonary veins

electrically from the heart completely. If that's right, does anyone

know which is preferable?

Off the top of my head, I would think the spots technique might miss

places, while the everything technique would have a higher potential

for bad side effects.

[Guest guest]

> Cardiac rhythm specialists for the University of Pennsylvania

Health System have documented the effectiveness of a new technique to

cure atrial fibrillation (A-Fib).

>

> The technique targets and isolates the triggers, or " hot spots, " on

pulmonary veins leading to the heart,

I have the dim idea that there are two ablation techniques for afib,

not counting the pseudo-maze. One goes after identifiable hot spots

and the other does a circular thing that isolates the pulmonary veins

electrically from the heart completely. If that's right, does anyone

know which is preferable?

Off the top of my head, I would think the spots technique might miss

places, while the everything technique would have a higher potential

for bad side effects.

[Guest guest]

I am 11 weeks past my second pva. I had/have similar problems. The

palpitations have not caused any afib. These palpitations lessened

dramatically since the 5 week time frame you have stated. I am basically

clear at this time of any problems, yet I felt something like palpitations a

few days ago, but it could have been caused by Levaquin, a super antibiotic

that I need from time to time for a lung condition. My previous posts give

the details of my ablation experiences. members of this group were most

helpful to me and I hope that this helps you.

[Guest guest]

I am 11 weeks past my second pva. I had/have similar problems. The

palpitations have not caused any afib. These palpitations lessened

dramatically since the 5 week time frame you have stated. I am basically

clear at this time of any problems, yet I felt something like palpitations a

few days ago, but it could have been caused by Levaquin, a super antibiotic

that I need from time to time for a lung condition. My previous posts give

the details of my ablation experiences. members of this group were most

helpful to me and I hope that this helps you.

[Guest guest]

> Isabelle

>

Dear Isabelle,

I can obviously only speak from my own experience regarding palpitations.

Now that this caveat has been given........

My afib was very rapid and noticeable. I felt a very strong and irregular

thumping in the heart, with a pulse often over 230. It is constant and could

last for many hours until I was converted with Tambacor. It felt like there

were a bunch of scared bullfrogs in a bag inside my chest trying to jump out.

With palpitations, I feel/felt a very strong regular thumping in the heart -

or elsewhere- , with a pulse below 120. They lasted a few minutes at most. It

felt like one scared frog jumping to a regular beat.

With Premature Atrial Contractions - PACs - I felt a very strong short term

irregular thumping in the heart, with a pulse in the normal range. They also

lasted a few minutes at most - except for the few post ablation weeks. It

felt like one scared frog who only jumped once in a while.

Sometimes I felt the same sort of symptom that you described. These were, in

my belief, caused partially by our medications that artificially control our

hearts. When we do not get enough blood to certain areas of our body, and our

physical position cuts off normal blood flow, we feel the blood backing up.

It felt like a little frog in a small bag jumping to a regular beat

best always,

[Guest guest]

> Isabelle

>

Dear Isabelle,

I can obviously only speak from my own experience regarding palpitations.

Now that this caveat has been given........

My afib was very rapid and noticeable. I felt a very strong and irregular

thumping in the heart, with a pulse often over 230. It is constant and could

last for many hours until I was converted with Tambacor. It felt like there

were a bunch of scared bullfrogs in a bag inside my chest trying to jump out.

With palpitations, I feel/felt a very strong regular thumping in the heart -

or elsewhere- , with a pulse below 120. They lasted a few minutes at most. It

felt like one scared frog jumping to a regular beat.

With Premature Atrial Contractions - PACs - I felt a very strong short term

irregular thumping in the heart, with a pulse in the normal range. They also

lasted a few minutes at most - except for the few post ablation weeks. It

felt like one scared frog who only jumped once in a while.

Sometimes I felt the same sort of symptom that you described. These were, in

my belief, caused partially by our medications that artificially control our

hearts. When we do not get enough blood to certain areas of our body, and our

physical position cuts off normal blood flow, we feel the blood backing up.

It felt like a little frog in a small bag jumping to a regular beat

best always,

[Guest guest]

It has now been 5 weeks since my PVA at the Mayo Clinic with Dr. Packer. The

good news is NO A-FIB (use to experience A-Fib every 8-10 days for up to 24

hours per event). The (somewhat) bad news is I continue to have a fairly high

frequency of palpitations (every few minutes for the first week following the

PVA but now settled into a pattern of anywhere from every 10 minutes to several

hours). They are always (thankfully) lone palpitations...there have been no

runs. My concerns include 1) is this what I can expect from now on? 2) Will

the frequency of these palpitations lessen in the coming weeks and months? 3)

Or are these palpitations a harbinger of A-Fib on the horizon? As palpitations

always preceded my A-Fib events prior to the PVA they continue to make me

nervous to say the least. Am 48 yr. old, in good shape otherwise, am back to

working out on the stairmaster approximately 40 minutes daily, have a great

appetite, alot of energy, etc. But it's just these darn palpitations? Anyone

have any thoughts or knowledge of what I might expect? Dr. Packer is great and

has been very helpful but in this area he remains rather cryptic so I must seek

knowledge elsewhere.

Wade Palmer

wep@...

[Guest guest]

> It has now been 5 weeks since my PVA at the Mayo Clinic with Dr.

Packer. The good news is NO A-FIB (use to experience A-Fib every 8-

10 days for up to 24 hours per event). The (somewhat) bad news is I

continue to have a fairly high frequency of palpitations (every few

minutes for the first week following the PVA but now settled into a

pattern of anywhere from every 10 minutes to several hours). They

are always (thankfully) lone palpitations...there have been no runs.

My concerns include 1) is this what I can expect from now on? 2)

Will the frequency of these palpitations lessen in the coming weeks

and months? 3) Or are these palpitations a harbinger of A-Fib on the

horizon? As palpitations always preceded my A-Fib events prior to

the PVA they continue to make me nervous to say the least. Am 48

yr. old, in good shape otherwise, am back to working out on the

stairmaster approximately 40 minutes daily, have a great appetite,

alot of energy, etc. But it's just these darn palpitations? Anyone

have any thoughts or knowledge of what I might expect? Dr. Packer is

great and has been very helpful but in this area he remains rather

cryptic so I must seek knowledge elsewhere.

>

Wade, I am three weeks post PVA and the palpitations seem to be

settling down. I had a very short run of a-fib the 1st week, and

palpitations mostly at night when I laid down. My heart rate is

still running higher than normal so when I exercise I just pace

myself. At first just walking around the house my heart would start

to race a little bit. My Dr. says this is all normal and it takes a

good three months for it to settle down completely. Hope this helps

a little bit. I am on no heart medication, i.e. Toprol, just

coumadin. How about you?

Dorothy

> Wade Palmer

> wep@j...

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> I am 11 weeks past my second pva. I had/have similar problems. The

> palpitations have not caused any afib.snip...........

, so glad to see you posting and that except for the

palpitations you are doing fairly well.

Can you please tell me the difference between palpitations and

afib......I sometimes get palpitations near the left waist area when

I am at the computor for a long time and I am either tired or

excited or both....and I think I will be going into afib....but I

don't. Good wishes go your way always, Isabelle

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> I am 11 weeks past my second pva. I had/have similar problems. The

> palpitations have not caused any afib.snip...........

, so glad to see you posting and that except for the

palpitations you are doing fairly well.

Can you please tell me the difference between palpitations and

afib......I sometimes get palpitations near the left waist area when

I am at the computor for a long time and I am either tired or

excited or both....and I think I will be going into afib....but I

don't. Good wishes go your way always, Isabelle

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> It has now been 5 weeks since my PVA at the Mayo Clinic with Dr.

Packer. The good news is NO A-FIB (use to experience A-Fib every 8-

10 days for up to 24 hours per event). The (somewhat) bad news is I

continue to have a fairly high frequency of palpitations (every few

minutes for the first week following the PVA but now settled into a

pattern of anywhere from every 10 minutes to several hours). They

are always (thankfully) lone palpitations...there have been no runs.

My concerns include 1) is this what I can expect from now on? 2)

Will the frequency of these palpitations lessen in the coming weeks

and months? 3) Or are these palpitations a harbinger of A-Fib on the

horizon? As palpitations always preceded my A-Fib events prior to

the PVA they continue to make me nervous to say the least. Am 48

yr. old, in good shape otherwise, am back to working out on the

stairmaster approximately 40 minutes daily, have a great appetite,

alot of energy, etc. But it's just these darn palpitations? Anyone

have any thoughts or knowledge of what I might expect? Dr. Packer is

great and has been very helpful but in this area he remains rather

cryptic so I must seek knowledge elsewhere.

>

> Wade Palmer

> wep@j...

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> It has now been 5 weeks since my PVA at the Mayo Clinic with Dr.

Packer. The good news is NO A-FIB (use to experience A-Fib every 8-

10 days for up to 24 hours per event). The (somewhat) bad news is I

continue to have a fairly high frequency of palpitations (every few

minutes for the first week following the PVA but now settled into a

pattern of anywhere from every 10 minutes to several hours). They

are always (thankfully) lone palpitations...there have been no runs.

My concerns include 1) is this what I can expect from now on? 2)

Will the frequency of these palpitations lessen in the coming weeks

and months? 3) Or are these palpitations a harbinger of A-Fib on the

horizon? As palpitations always preceded my A-Fib events prior to

the PVA they continue to make me nervous to say the least. Am 48

yr. old, in good shape otherwise, am back to working out on the

stairmaster approximately 40 minutes daily, have a great appetite,

alot of energy, etc. But it's just these darn palpitations? Anyone

have any thoughts or knowledge of what I might expect? Dr. Packer is

great and has been very helpful but in this area he remains rather

cryptic so I must seek knowledge elsewhere.

>

> Wade Palmer

> wep@j...

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> It has now been 5 weeks since my PVA at the Mayo Clinic with Dr.

Packer. The good news is NO A-FIB (use to experience A-Fib every 8-

10 days for up to 24 hours per event). The (somewhat) bad news is I

continue to have a fairly high frequency of palpitations (every few

minutes for the first week following the PVA but now settled into a

pattern of anywhere from every 10 minutes to several hours). They

are always (thankfully) lone palpitations

Wade, that's about the rate at which I have " lone palpitations " . My

understanding is that that is a normal thing for everyone. We

afibers, current and cured, probably are more aware of them because

we now know those litle things are actually our hearts, whereas

before in our blissful ignorance we didn't. I find a beta blocker

(toprol xl) very helpful in suppressing them. On the beta blocker I

can almost forget them, without it, I have them more often and become

anxious.

You might ask for a 24 hour holter monitor to see what is actually

happening.

One thing I do wonder, like you, is where the extra beats are

originating from if you had your pulmonary veins isolated.

If I could do 40 minutes on an exercise machine with only paps like

those, I'd be thrilled.

[Guest guest]

Isabelle

When you talk of palpitations near the waist area are you talking about

tremors on/in your skin. Palpitations per se are usually made by the heart

although they can be felt in the throat etc. But palpitations in the waist

area does not sound like heart palpitations to me. I used to get tremoring

patches on my torso under my rib cage (lloked like a baby kicking), also my

eye used to tic and sometimes my toes and fingers would tremor and move by

themselves. All these were visable to the eye.

These are signs of Mg deficiency. One thing that many Afibbers have is an

overload of intracellular calcium and their Mg levels are not high enough.

If this is what you are describing it may be that you need to increase your

Mg. I see you supplement with calcium which may make the problem more

pronounced..

Fran

Re: Post PVA

>

> > I am 11 weeks past my second pva. I had/have similar problems. The

> > palpitations have not caused any afib.snip...........

>

> , so glad to see you posting and that except for the

> palpitations you are doing fairly well.

>

> Can you please tell me the difference between palpitations and

> afib......I sometimes get palpitations near the left waist area when

> I am at the computor for a long time and I am either tired or

> excited or both....and I think I will be going into afib....but I

> don't. Good wishes go your way always, Isabelle

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

> Isabelle

> When you talk of palpitations near the waist area are you talking

about

> tremors on/in your skin. Palpitations per se are usually made by

the heart

> although they can be felt in the throat etc. But palpitations in

the waist

> area does not sound like heart palpitations to

me. .................................................................

......................................................................

...........................................................Frances:

Thanks so much for sharing your insight.....I too have a tick in my

eyes....first it started about two months ago with my right eye and

now it is in my left eye. I forgot to mention that when I was in

my doctor's office, my left arm went into a tremor for about 30

seconds....I thought that was kind of long....and also I thought

maybe this is a stroke...I used my other hand and arm to calm the

arm down. I have never experienced anything like that before.

Frances I also want to thank you for your previous post to me.

Regards, Isabelle

[Guest guest]

Ronnie,

    How many days post PVA are you? I had it done the Monday before

Thanksgiving. had a PVA mid Sept, and went

back to afib in about 3 days and remained stuck in it, as I had

before. The EP never suggested a cardioversion at that point, just

was told that for a month, heart can do strange things, go in & out,

etc, and need to wait the month to see what happens. that's why i'm

so interested as to how many days post PVA that you are. My EP will not leave

me in AF post PVA. I am a patient of a very well regarded Rhythm Lab here in

NYC with a EP who is pretty famous, Larry Chinitz. He was just interviewed

for a program on his clinic on the Discovery Channel as well as NBC. I do

believe in his judjment.I also

wonder when is it too late to go for a cardioversion as I am now 

over 3 months post pvaI was supposed to go for one Jan 3rd, but it

was cancelled because my inr went to 1.5, anfter having been perfect

for the previous month!   thanks, Marcelle

I do not think it is too late for you to be cardioverted.

I do know the heart is going through a healing process- but of course wish I

did not have to be zapped twice in 8 days . :-(

Thank you for your support-

Ronnie

P.S. This is my SECOND ablation!

[Guest guest]

>

> I do not think it is too late for you to be cardioverted.

> I do know the heart is going through a healing process- but of

course wish I

> did not have to be zapped twice in 8 days . :-(

> Thank you for your support-

> Ronnie

> P.S. This is my SECOND ablation!

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

> I do not think it is too late for you to be cardioverted.

> I do know the heart is going through a healing process- but of

course wish I

> did not have to be zapped twice in 8 days . :-(

> Thank you for your support-

> Ronnie

> P.S. This is my SECOND ablation!

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

> I do not think it is too late for you to be cardioverted.

> I do know the heart is going through a healing process- but of

course wish I

> did not have to be zapped twice in 8 days . :-(

> Thank you for your support-

> Ronnie

> P.S. This is my SECOND ablation!

>

>

>