Re: Colostrum

[Guest guest]

I concede. I didn't eat as I do now when I first started this journey either,

but I don't want people to think that all it takes are supplements to regain

their health (and by that, I mean replacements for nutritional food). It takes

much more than that.

" Kindscher (Charter) " wrote: ,

I think that what happens for those that spend too much time in these

forums is a lack of reality. Many, many people feel that they are doing

the best they can and cooking healthy foods for their families. They

don't know any other way and you certainly cannot expect people to

change over night.

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

I'd just like to chip in on this one. If people come across this site,

they will hopefully see that getting better with MS is all about BOTH eating

nutritionally balanced meals AND taking supplements PLUS treating the

underlying cause, be it amalgams, heavy metals in the body or food

intolerances. No one can expect miracles without treating the whole

picture.

Many with MS are deficient in certain vitamins or minerals and need

supplements, certainly in the short-term whilst getting used to a healthier

way of eating and living. There may be certain supplements that they always

need as the body just can't eat that much whatever to provide enough of the

missing vitamin/mineral.

But people who are prone to only do one of these things (commonly popping a

pill) often state how well they are; my argument is how they could be even

better if they did the lot.

Janet

----- Original Message -----

From: Pugh

I concede. I didn't eat as I do now when I first started this journey

either, but I don't want people to think that all it takes are supplements

to regain their health (and by that, I mean replacements for nutritional

food). It takes much more than that.

" Kindscher (Charter) " wrote: ,

Many, many people feel that they are doing

the best they can and cooking healthy foods for their families. They

don't know any other way and you certainly cannot expect people to

change over night.

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I wish I could agree but I have seen too many examples that say

different. I have seen people staying on course with their exact same

eating and sometimes drinking habits while adding good whole food

supplements. They have had dramatic results. One such example was my

friend Fred, he is now 71. About 4 years ago he was not well, high blood

pressure, high blood sugar, over weight. He would fall asleep right in

the middle of a conversation. The doctors had him on several meds and

wanted to start using insulin. Well that got his attention and he came

to me for help.

I suggested a complete program of supplements, multi, antioxidants,

phytosterols, fish oil, enzymes, pro-biotics, glyconutrients. He was

faithful every day and the results were absolutely amazing. All his

numbers that doctors look at stabilized and his energy completely was

restored. He did great for 2 years, He did nothing else at all, no diet

changes, no more exercise nothing. Then in the 3rd year his daughter

moved in with them, she is a nurse and thinks she knows best. She

thought he was spending too much money on supplements, over a period of

3 months she managed to talk him out of taking all his stuff. His energy

started to leave, joints started to hurt and he called me almost daily

to complain. About 8 months later he had a heart attack, landed in the

hospital and had to have surgery. SInce then he feels horrible, cannot

gain any strength, is not working and is miserable. He called me

recently to order some products, so the cycle starts again, would your

answer for Fred be to do nothing??? His wife will not cook anything

different and they eat lots of traditional Portuguese foods. I have seen

lots of examples where the nutrition obviously was making a difference,

but of course I know they would do much better changing many things in

their lifestyle, not just adding the supplements. I still think small

changes in the right direction are better then nothing.

Pugh wrote:

>

> I concede. I didn't eat as I do now when I first started this journey

> either, but I don't want people to think that all it takes are

> supplements to regain their health (and by that, I mean replacements

> for nutritional food). It takes much more than that.

>

>

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[Guest guest]

Small changes maybe, but to heal requires more than supplementation. I didn't

make the rules! Supplements don't make up for the toxicity in processed foods

They don't replace the full spectrum of nutrients in whole food. Some

supplements, folate for example, are not assimilable and interfere with

methylfolates (in leafy greens) and other substances entering the brain through

the BBB. Other isolated supplements have the same tendencies.

The idea that one size, one dose or one product fits all is unrealistic.

I do think that supplements are better than meds, but we can do more. Not

everyone will buy the best products if they are unwilling to eat the best diet.

So what have they gained?

" Kindscher (Charter) " wrote:

Hi ,

I wish I could agree but I have seen too many examples that say

different.

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[Guest guest]

How true but each person decides for himself what path they choose. For

some taking a one a day vitamin is a HUGE deal, how on earth would that

person be expected to change their whole diet, take 10 supplements, do

some detoxes, etc., Its all a process, a journey and each one of us goes

at our own pace. I feel my place is to help encourage those that have

lost their way, feel their is no hope and are not even trying anymore.

If all I do is help them get off a few drugs, have a little more energy,

then its still a good thing and worth it to me. GIna

Janet Orchard wrote:

>

>

> But people who are prone to only do one of these things (commonly

> popping a

> pill) often state how well they are; my argument is how they could be

> even

> better if they did the lot.

> Janet

> ----

>

[Guest guest]

No you didn't and you can't really enforce them either. You can show

people, help to educate, support and love and that is about it. The

choice to change is individual and I choose to help people where they

are, not where I want them to be. If they get where I want them to be,

then great. If they don't well I don't blame myself and I certainly

don't stop trying to find someone else who needs help. Small little

changes in peoples lives, thats all I can hope for. Recently I got 2

friends to remove dairy from their diet, its a small move toward better

health, one step at a time and I am hoping to encourage them to do more.

Pugh wrote:

>

> Small changes maybe, but to heal requires more than supplementation. I

> didn't make the rules! Supplements don't make up for the toxicity in

> processed foods They don't replace the full spectrum of nutrients in

> whole food. Some supplements, folate for example, are n

>

> ._,___

[Guest guest]

I can also encourage people to look outside the bottle.

" Kindscher (Charter) " wrote: No you didn't

and you can't really enforce them either. You can show

people, help to educate, support and love and that is about it.

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

Here's my 2 cents worth: I am human. Man, I am so human. And even though I might

know the right things to do to change my diet, etc., it is easier said than

done. And this is coming from someone who worked in health food stores for the

last 20 yrs! So instead of berating myself for not being perfect, I have decided

that I can make small changes, one at a time, and feel good about it. So I went

gluten free and now I am working on dairy free. One step at a time seems to work

best for me. I would rather do it slowly and make habits that stick than

overwhelm myself and end up failing.

Meanwhile, yes, I take a lot of supplements. If there is research behind it

(even if only on the mice), I will try it. I have nothing to lose. But at the

same time, I will keep working on my diet.

An example: My " snacktime " went from eating regular cookies, to eating gluten

free cookies, to yesterday changing to " Organic Food Bar belgium chocolate

chip " . They are 75% raw food, alkalinizing, and delicious!

So my suggestion to people is to remember " slow and steady wins the race. " If

totally changing your diet overwhelms you, pick one thing you can do until

you're comfortable with that, and then go to another change.

Just my opinion,

Beverly

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[Guest guest]

That's what I did too. The whole lot in one go would have been too

difficult.

I did gluten first too which is a good one to start with as fatigue usually

diminishes and it makes you want to keep going to see what else happens.

Dairy next, then Legumes, then Tomatoes, (the Legumes and Tomatoes both

surprised me - more fatigue went) then Refined Sugar. I did the same with

supplements, adding them gradually then every few months removing one that I

thought wasn't doing anything until I wound up with a good set that helps

me.

Glad to hear of someone else who isn't perfect:)

Janet

----- Original Message -----

From: Beverly Hammons

small changes, one at a time, and feel good about it. So I went gluten free

and now I am working on dairy free. One step at a time seems to work best

for me. I would rather do it slowly and make habits that stick than

overwhelm myself and end up failing.

So my suggestion to people is to remember " slow and steady wins the race. "

If totally changing your diet overwhelms you, pick one thing you can do

until you're comfortable with that, and then go to another change.

[Guest guest]

Absolutely, but I personally think you can get better results with

concentrated nutrition. I know you have pulled away from most

supplementation but the average person will never eat enough food to

cover their daily needs. If they are barely breaking even for the

challenges of the day, now can they get over the hump? If it was

available then more people would be getting well and instead more and

more are getting sick.

Pugh wrote:

>

> I can also encourage people to look outside the bottle.

>

[Guest guest]

HI Beverly,

You are certainly not alone, the majority of people are just like you.

It took my one year to really convert my family to more whole foods

without the preservatives. We are human and we have weaknesses, bad

habits, love the taste of certain foods that should never touch our

lips. We all just have to do the best we can. Its really hard when you

have teenagers and a husband who just don't care about it at all. At

least they get some good foods when they are home, got my son finally

hooked on organic rice chips instead of pringles, and those little steps

are going in the right direction. I do really well but I still drink

Star bucks when I go to town. I am not going to condemn myself or anyone

else because its a private walk. I also eat out once a week and

sometimes really pay for it the next day, but its my small rebellion for

having to be so good the rest of the time.

Beverly Hammons wrote:

>

> Here's my 2 cents worth: I am human. Man, I am so human. And even

> though I might know the right things to do to change my diet, etc., it

> is easier said than done. And this is coming from someone who worked

> in health food stores for the last 20 yrs! So instead of berating

> myself for not being perfect, I have decided that I can make small

> changes, one

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Janet,

I just now this year realized beans were affecting me, never had any

allergy testing. For me they cause joint pain and so for now I only eat

them in moderation because I do believe they are good. I can also handle

raw dairy and so eat that sparingly. When you eliminate foods for awhile

it becomes really obvious when adding them back which ones are a

problem!

Janet Orchard wrote:

>

> That's what I did too. The whole lot in one go would have been too

> difficult.

> I did gluten first too which is a good one to start with as fatigue

> usually

> diminishes and it makes you want to keep going to see what else happens.

> Dairy next, then Legumes, then Tomatoes, (the Legumes and Tomatoes both

> surprised me - more fatigue went) then Refined Sugar. I did the same with

> supplements, adding them gradually then every few months

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

Raw food is only concentrated compared to cooked or other highly

processed foods. Its still way more deficient then raw foods of 30-50

years ago. How do you make up for those differences??

Pugh wrote:

>

> Raw food IS concentrated nutrition. People can surely supplement if

> they prefer, but I have found a better way for myself. I wish that

> others would just try it and they would see better results too.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi , That may be true that the produce is more deficient in minerals,

because of the soil, as opposed to 30-50 years ago, but how do you know how many

vitamins and minerals that we really need? We are a diverse species. How do

supplements make up for the unknown active ingredients in produce? I eat

organic whenever I can. I know how I feel. I know the results of blood

testing. I don't get hungry because I get enough nutrition from the food that I

eat.

" Kindscher (Charter) " wrote:

Hi ,

Raw food is only concentrated compared to cooked or other highly

processed foods. Its still way more deficient then raw foods of 30-50

years ago. How do you make up for those differences??

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

Hi

Thanks for sharing that. I have been experiencing less joint pain and I'd

put it down to the Devil's Claw supplement I had introduced but maybe it is

that there are no vestiges of legumes in my system.

Janet

----- Original Message -----

From: Kindscher (Charter)

I just now this year realized beans were affecting me, never had any

allergy testing. For me they cause joint pain

[Guest guest]

Girls and everyone, don't fall for the hype that the whole problem with us is

that we're under nourished. I went to eating all whole grains, nuts and seeds,

and yogurt and veggies and purified water and lots of orange juice and dried

fruit even some brown sugar all from the health food store. Really healthy

stuff. Packed with nutrients. I felt worse than ever. Irregular and fast heart

beat, great fatigue, difficulty sleeping, sore muscles and joints, weight gain.

hair loss, blurred vision, depression and on and on. I said damn, still not

enough nutrition so I took a lot of supplements which did help a little. The

fish oil and some minerals helped the most, especialy with the heart problems.

Why did I do worse with all that (nutrition)? You know the answer........delayed

food reactions, or delayed food allergy. .....RP

" Kindscher (Charter) " wrote: Hi

,

Raw food is only concentrated compared to cooked or other highly

processed foods. Its still way more deficient then raw foods of 30-50

years ago. How do you make up for those differences??

[Guest guest]

How come you are not worried about that thought when you eat all your

raw foods. If they are concentrated the way you say then you could be

over doing it in some areas just as easy as someone who takes a pill. If

I love cherries and eat then every day several times per day is that

good for me cause its raw food? There will always be controversy over

the perfect diet, meat, no meat, fat, no fat, on and on. The old saying

" the proof is in the pudding " is what I go by. If you feel great the

keep going on your course, if not you might need a change.

Do keep in mind that you have taken every kind of supplement out

there for years before taking your current stance. It might be easy for

you to say now that all is good but what did it take to get where you

are?? Also is there something that you are still missing that could get

you walking?? It does not necessarily have to be food related either.

Pugh wrote:

>

> Hi , That may be true that the produce is more deficient in

> minerals, because of the soil, as opposed to 30-50 years ago, but how

> do you know how many vitamins and minerals that we really need? We are

> a diverse species. How do supplements make up for the unknown active

> ingredients in produce? I eat organic whenever I can. I know how I

> feel. I know the results of blood testing. I don't get hungry because

> I get enough nutrition from the food that I eat.

>

>

> ._,___

[Guest guest]

I use Devils claw for my horses with great results, Its probably a combo

of both but the good news is less joint pain!

Janet Orchard wrote:

>

> Hi

> Thanks for sharing that. I have been experiencing less joint pain and I'd

> put it down to the Devil's Claw supplement I had introduced but maybe

> it is

> that there are no vestiges of legumes in my system.

> Janet

> ----

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Rich,

I know nutrition is only a part for sure. But when trying to keep any

house standing if one part of the foundation crumbles, the rest will

follow. I encourage everyone to tend to their mental/emotional,

spiritual, financial, relational and their physical needs and then they

will see complete healing. Once a person achieves complete healing they

have to attend to all of those parts of their life forever. Just like

maintaining a car, you don't just do it once. People that are just

sitting back and waiting for the doctors to find a cure, they will wait

a lifetime.

rich perillo wrote:

>

> Girls and everyone, don't fall for the hype that the whole problem

> with us is that we're under nourished. I went to eating all whole

> grains, nuts and seeds, and yogurt and veggies and purified water and

> lots of orange juice and dried fruit even some brown sugar all from

> the health food store. Really healthy stuff. Packed with nutrients. I

> felt worse than ever. Irregular and fast heart beat, great fatigue,

> difficulty sleeping, sore muscles and joints, weight gain. hair loss,

> blurred vision, depression and on and on. I said damn, still not

> enough nutrition so I took a lot of supplements which did help a

> little. The fish oil and some minerals helped the most, especialy with

> the heart problems. Why did I do worse with all that (nutrition)? You

> know the answer........delayed food reactions, or delayed food

> allergy. .....RP

>

> " Kindscher (Charter) " <morningsunranch@...

> <mailto:morningsunranch%40charter.net>> wrote: Hi ,

>

> Raw food is only concentrated compared to cooked or other highly

> processed foods. Its still way more deficient then raw foods of 30-50

> years ago. How do you make up for those differences??

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

\

No one can agree on what a balanced healthy diet looks like. I believe

meat is part of a good diet, you don't. If my supplements are made from

whole foods why would they be missing the things that were in there when

the plant was picked. Yes I know as soon as you process a plant in

anyway things get lost, but sitting on the shelf it loses value also.

Man will never improve on nature but certainly he can sure screw it up.

If the foods you are eating have been picked before ripe(and most store

bought food is) then you are not getting the phytonutrients and other

values you think you are.

I know you are convinced that what you are doing is right but you have

changed your way of thinking many times in the years I have known you.

People listen intently to what you do and try and duplicate it. I think

knowing the history helps them see how you got where you are. You have

been eating raw for 3 years and even though you argue against

supplements you continue to use good quality whole food ones. Why are

you so opposed to other doing the same? Must you assume that no one

knows how to get quality supplements and that we are all buying garbage?

We can drop the discussion but people are listening and learning every

time you speak. I have been well now for about 2-3 years, I still take

my supplements and always will, for me I don't feel diet is enough to

keep that one pillar of my health strong.

Pugh wrote:

>

> Hi , You don't get excesses from food when you have a balanced,

> healthy diet. The phenols, sterols, enzymes and flavonoids etc. are in

> the foods, but are missing in most supplements. The nutrients are also

> balanced. Man will never

>

[Guest guest]

Hi , I have not changed my basic diet in over three years, nearly four. I

have altered it on occasion to eat a fruitarian diet, which I didn't feel was

right for me. I was eating mostly sweet fruits at time when I knew that I had

candida. I tried the 80/10/10 diet and that was too strict and I didn't eat

enough calories for my size. It didn't take my lack of movement into

consideration. I don't burn as many calories as most people. Both of these are

raw food diets. Not all raw diets are healthy, but most are more healthy than

the standard diet of processed foods. I did try new things, but my raw food

diet has remained a constant. I recently ate meat, based on erroneous advice,

and gave it up quickly. I have tried to look at every angle. I have decided

that the path I'm on is right for me. I rarely eat grocery store produce. I eat

organic most of the time. The produce is picked ripe and delivered the next

day. It's expensive, but I don't eat much. I ate

produce from a neighbor's garden last summer and I'll have the same opportunity

this summer, different neighbor, different state. I don't assume that people

only use poor quality supplements. I know that price is often an issue and many

people buy inferior products not knowing the difference. I use Modifilan to

detox mercury. I drink a superfood because it contains things that I am unable

to eat (spirulina, herbs). I mainly oppose supplementation because it is used

in place of a healthy diet in some cases. Supplements don't undo the damage

caused by processed foods. To add some supplements might actually help some

people, but I was telling MY story, not theirs.

Last post on this subject.

" Kindscher (Charter) " wrote:

Man will never improve on nature but certainly he can sure screw it up.

If the foods you are eating have been picked before ripe(and most store

bought food is) then you are not getting the phytonutrients and other

values you think you are.

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

Very well said . I am with you on that. Yes, I am mostly raw

BBDer (Best Bet Diet), but there are some supplements I take that make

a big difference in my day-to-day well-being.

I agree with that food IS the best source. Undortunately even

the best foods are not as good as they used to be - ground growing

them is depleted, seeds which they grow out of are most likely

genetically modified (it's hard to find the plants that if not first

generation genetically modified, than modified by crosse-polination),

the water that is used to water them has chemicals in it (even if it

is in the form of rain) and so on.

>

> Hi ,

> \

> No one can agree on what a balanced healthy diet looks like. I believe

> meat is part of a good diet, you don't. If my supplements are made from

> whole foods why would they be missing the things that were in there

when

> the plant was picked. Yes I know as soon as you process a plant in

> anyway things get lost, but sitting on the shelf it loses value also.

> Man will never improve on nature but certainly he can sure screw it up.

[Guest guest]

Hi all,

While I enjoy reading all your posts on diet, I was hoping to get more

responses on colostrum. Can yous remember to change the subject line if you're

changing the subject please? I was thinking that I got all these responses on

colostrum but alas, no, the subject was changed on me. Just saying...

Desinie

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

Go to the main MScured page, click on " messages " , look for the search

window, click on " advanced " , then search your heart out for all of the

posts in the message database that have something to do with colostrum.

>

>

>

> Hi all,

> While I enjoy reading all your posts on diet, I was hoping to get

more responses on colostrum. Can yous remember to change the subject......

[Guest guest]

Hi Irina,

And for some its almost impossible to get good quality foods. When I

travel cross country I am horrified at the food choices they have. I am

completely spoiled living on central coast, ville. We produce

something like 1/3 the food for the US here and so we have fresh food

stands everywhere. We also have some really great health food stores

where you can get high quality packaged foods. If I did not live here I

would be getting most of my staples on line for sure.

Irina wrote:

>

> Very well said . I am with you on that. Yes, I am mostly raw

> BBDer (Best Bet Diet), but there are some supplements I take that make

> a big difference in my day-to-day well-being.

>

> I agree with Alliso

>