Guest guest Posted June 22, 1999 Report Share Posted June 22, 1999 I visited the xoom.com site. While I have used some RET in various real life situation, I have to say that in the midst of a killer urge to use, it just gets too complicated. I have found that the NEVER word of AVRT is much simpler. I attended some SMART meetings, and while I really enjoyed the education in REBT, the tool seemed far to abstract for answering the Beast. I have read posts on various boards by SMART guys, and it did seem to work for them, however. As one with serious Recovery Group Disorder, I have found RR's group bashing ways highly effective. Those who are put off offended by let us say, www.rational.org/recovery, may not suffer from RGD, and therefore may need SMART if AA is not their thing. I appreciate that so far this board is not a " recovery group debate. " I find that members are careful to stick to the objectives of this page. Thank you all. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free - Simplifying group communications Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 1999 Report Share Posted June 23, 1999 --- Hi & list, Your comments are very interesting. I went to SMART for a while (not voluntarily) and I thought their approach was a heck of a lot better than XA; the first thing I noticed was that " cross-talk " wasn't forbidden but actually encouraged, and individuality and intellectualism were also cool. I liked all the people in the group. However, I did note that their own literature suggested it would take 18 months to 2 years of their REBT-based program for someone with a serious substance abuse problem to really solve the problem. I thought, that's kind of a long time! What if your job or your marriage is at stake? Do you do RET on that -- " the world will not end if I get fired from my job " ? It seems to me that SMART is a good thing for people who have _already_ made an abstinence commitment, and enjoy discussing " issues " in a group setting. I like Trimpey's concept of " Recovery Group Disorder " . It is an accurate description of the lack of self-confidence and the over-dependence on groups, sponsors, and " group conscience " that can ensue from internalizing XA ideology. SMART is one alternative for those who really do blossom in groups but are looking for a healthier one than 12-step. OTOH, people who are do-it-yourselfers by nature are better off without groups of any kind. ~Rita ------------------------------------ >I visited the xoom.com site. While I have used some RET in various real life >situation, I have to say that in the midst of a killer urge to use, it just >gets too complicated. I have found that the NEVER word of AVRT is much >simpler. > I attended some SMART meetings, and while I really enjoyed the education >in REBT, the tool seemed far to abstract for answering the Beast. I have >read posts on various boards by SMART guys, and it did seem to work for them, >however. > As one with serious Recovery Group Disorder, I have found RR's group >bashing ways highly effective. Those who are put off offended by let us say, >www.rational.org/recovery, may not suffer from RGD, and therefore may need >SMART if AA is not their thing. > I appreciate that so far this board is not a " recovery group debate. " >I find that members are careful to stick to the objectives of this page. >Thank you all. > --== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==-- Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free - Simplifying group communications Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 1999 Report Share Posted June 23, 1999 Hi ; As to a " Recovery Group " , there are just too many individuals here to get that type of mentality going. Most likely if you got five of us together we couldn't agree on where to have lunch, let alone other issues. Don't ya' just love it? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free - Simplifying group communications Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 1999 Report Share Posted June 23, 1999 Hi! Thanks for your thoughtful reply Rose. I'll reply more when I return from my trip to the Unitarian Universalist General Assembly in Salt Lake City, Utah. Hope you and the other posters have a great week. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free - Simplifying group communications Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 1999 Report Share Posted June 24, 1999 Hi Rita, folks On Wed, 23 Jun 1999 12:44:14 -0700 Railroad Rita wrote: > I went to SMART for a while (not voluntarily) and I thought their approach was a heck of a lot better than XA; the first thing I noticed was that " cross-talk " wasn't forbidden but actually encouraged, and individuality and intellectualism were also cool. I liked all the people in the group. However, I did note that their own literature suggested it would take 18 months to 2 years of their REBT-based program for someone with a serious substance abuse problem to really solve the problem. I thought, that's kind of a long time! What if your job or your marriage is at stake? Do you do RET on that -- " the world will not end if I get fired from my job " ? It seems to me that SMART is a good thing for people who have _already_ made an abstinence commitment, and enjoy discussing " issues " in a group setting.> I dont know if this is what SMART is talking abt, but here's my take on this: depending what your 'bag' is,. for the first month or so after stopping using you may get cravings, after which time they'll probably diminish. after that, you could consider the problem beat, but it's known that ppl are prone to relapse of substance abuse for the first year or so, hence it pays to be wary. Sonmething I heard in 12-step rehab is that there is a theory that menatally readjusting to stopping using takes abt 2 years, and the reason is neurological, taking the brain that long to reorganise itself on meeeting rewards non-chemically. as i said, i dont know if this is where SMART gets the 1.5 to 2 year figure, but it might do. I expect SMART ppl say that you can pick your life enough to save job, marriage etc just by quitting using; the 2 year figure is just perhaps the time when you can relax abt the prospect of relapsing. > I like Trimpey's concept of " Recovery Group Disorder " . It is an accurate description of the lack of self-confidence and the over-dependence on groups, sponsors, and " group conscience " that can ensue from internalizing XA ideology. SMART is one alternative for those who really do blossom in groups but are looking for a healthier one than 12-step. OTOH, people who are do-it-yourselfers by nature are better off without groups of any kind. > > ~Rita > Right on Rita. You can see I am definitely one with RGD, which is why I ought to start the UK's first SMART group! Pete Watts Owner PSY-PHAR Psychology/Psychiatry Outcome Research in PsychoPharm PD Personality Disorders Discussion ------------------------------------------------------------------------ eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free - Simplifying group communications Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 1999 Report Share Posted June 25, 1999 , Sometimes I think AA people relapse on purpose so they can go back to the meetings and get all the hugs and attention and atta boys for coming back. And then they can pontificate in such solemn tones about how grateful they are for the program. I think its Guru Training 101. Jan Re: Web page > >Oh well, nearly 7am and I have work to do. > >Take care, > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Listen to Britany spears and more top artisits >now at audiohighway.com! >http://clickhere./click/395 > > >eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free > - Simplifying group communications > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free - Simplifying group communications Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 26, 1999 Report Share Posted June 26, 1999 Hi Jan. I know they do. A couple of years ago one of my social clients had great troubles because her ex was drinking just before christmas. He had been an AA'er for years, relapsing from time to time. Maybe twice or thrice a year. She had almost no money while he was earning a lot as a good brain within the IT industry. In relation to my client he was an intolerable parasite, so I advised her to throw him out of her flat. Or back to his mother who had spoiled him in the first place, or back to that expensive treatment center who had convinced him he had an alcohol problem. She tried the treatment center, but he could only be there for a couple of days, every room between christmas eve and new year was occupied. The smarter AA'ers had planned a christmas relapse and ordered a place at the treatment center in advance. So they didn't have a place for this person already being in a mess. One day at a time. Not even a vegetable could function according to that principle. Wealthy AA'ers don't. Maybe Christmas made their HP busy with other items? Who knows. What a bunch of hypocrites. The disease concept is used to promote irresponsibility and destruction of normal moral standards. I don't think I would be a good therapist for them unless I was allowed to kick their asses all day long. They don't get the shit they deserve. IMO. People should be judged on their actions, not their socalled spiritual diseases. Bjørn Rio wrote: > > , Sometimes I think AA people relapse on purpose so they can go back to the meetings and get all the hugs and attention and atta boys for coming back. And then they can pontificate in such solemn tones about how grateful they are for the program. I think its Guru Training 101. Jan Re: Web page > >Oh well, nearly 7am and I have work to do. > >Take care, > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Listen to Britany spears and more top artisits >now at audiohighway.com! >http://clickhere./click/395 > > >eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free > - Simplifying group communications > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > > eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free > www. - Simplifying group communications ------------------------------------------------------------------------ eGroups.com home: /group/12-step-free - Simplifying group communications Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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