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In a message dated 4/13/01 12:26:58 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

bbledsoe@... writes:

<< Where is Dallas? Can somebody give me directions?

Thanks

>>

821 South Southwest of Normal, Illinois

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Hmmmm. Lets see here. Last I heard it was near Ft. Worth....... as for

Dallas, I think it can still be seen on TNN.

Jay

Help

Where is Dallas? Can somebody give me directions?

Thanks

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On the same note- can anyone tell me where Paris, Texas is?

I have seen all these fancy posters with Paris, Texas on um, but cant find out

where it is!

Jay

Help

Where is Dallas? Can somebody give me directions?

Thanks

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Just look for that really big tower that Monsieur Eiffel built-- Paris is

near there!

Brad

Help

>

>

> Where is Dallas? Can somebody give me directions?

>

> Thanks

>

>

>

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:

After over 25 years of searching, I have come to the conclusion that Dallas,

the mythical golden city described to me by many self-proclaimed adventurers

in bars over the years, is an urban legend. On each of my expeditions east

of the fair city of Fort Worth, the real jewel of the West, I encountered

not the sophisticated, urban paradise so often described to me, but instead

a dirty, crowded, race-conflicted, police-corrupted, and

traffic-overburdened sprawl of residences, high-rises and such. It seems

apparent that the denizens of this place surreptitiously took on the name of

the fabled lost City of Dallas in an effort to draw tourist trade, there

being absolutely no other reason why anyone of sound mind would want to go

anywhere near the place. I wish you luck in your effort to find the Lost

City of Dallas. If you are successful and can bring back pictures or even a

living specimen, your future is assured.

Dave

Help

> Where is Dallas? Can somebody give me directions?

>

> Thanks

>

>

>

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  • 7 years later...
Guest guest

I am feeling intense pain and anger. I cannot lash out and so I turn it inwards

and it becomes depression. I cannot sleep at night and spend way too much time

thinking about, writing about and talking about nada, let alone the time I spend

reading about these various conditions.

My husband is convinced that nada is not mentally ill but can be 'difficult'. I

feel very alone when my husband cannot even be in the space where " I dont

understand but I do support you " . Instead it is " I dont understand, you are

wrong, you need to reconcile with your mother, you probably will " . The other

argument goes " Just cut her off then. Tell her not to call or contact you, tell

all the relatives you no longer communicate with her and just get on with your

life " . The latter argument sounds good but in practice, having that conversation

is not going to be worth much. Nada knows how to get people emotionally hooked

in. Her family has that " whatever it is, she is your mother and you must

communicate " attitude or they take sides and lie for her etc. I know I dont have

to justify myself and have to be true to myself but I am SO ANGRY that she

continues to behave like this poor, hard done by victim...it is all so

subtle....today she rang the doorbell and

my son answered. She had come to hand over some Christmas cake. Thank goodness

she did it at the gate. Tim (my lawyer friend; see previous emails for that

drama) makes these great cakes and often gives us some and he had brought some

with him to the dinner they had together last night, so she had brought some

round for us. Oh, how nice and normal and lovey dovey. This is why my husband

sees nothing. Everything is done in the sweetest possible way until it comes to

me. Is it possible that ONLY ONE PERSON can see the whole picture whilst others

think she is a bit eccentric, excitable etc?? At least my cousin who lives in my

city is beginning to really see aspects as I have been completely honest and

confided in her completely. Nada tries to manipulate her but my version helps

her see through it all. She suggested I play the tapes of nada's mean, nasty,

hysterical, sobbing messages on my voicemail for my brother and uncle to hear so

that they can

understand what I am going through. She feels some shock therapy may get people

to see.

But really, from the outside looking in it looks like a daughter is accusing her

mother of being mentally ill. How mean is that??

Perhaps I am trying to psychoanalyse it all too much. Perhaps it does not matter

whether she is mentally ill or not. She is toxic for me and on that basis, I

need to keep away. Quite frankly, I dont want my child to be alone with her and

there is no one I trust who can be with him if he goes to see her without me.

I should add that my nada does not have a psychologist. She sees a family

physician for some medical ailments like high blood pressure and diabetes but

certainly this doctor will not twig there is something going on. And I guess the

trouble with mental illness is that a patient cannot be treated involuntarily.

Sometimes I wish she would threaten suicide or self mutilate so that I could at

least get her into the mental health care system and some real help. I could

ask the psychologist I have been seeing whether he will speak to her family

physician but that makes me sound crazy too!!! 

I am not even sure what this rant is all about.. I feel like I am on a roller

coaster ride and all I want to do is GET OFF!!

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(((((((()))))))))

That's hard to feel so all alone, and frustrating when everyone else seems so

blind when it comes to your nada.

Your own psychologist, frankly, sounds pretty much useless; if your own

psychologist can't see the situation from your perspective, can't see your pain

and isn't helping you find ways to protect yourself from your pd mother's

mentally ill and abusive behavior, then, I'd look for a new psychologist!

A good therapist familiar with personality disorders would (hopefully) suggest

that you and your husband come in for a few sessions so that the therapist can

help your husband understand the level of emotional pain you are in, and help

weld you together as a team so you can establish boundaries with your nada and

enforce them as a team. That's got to be particularly hard on you if your

husband isn't very supportive of your needs.

To help you relieve your current pain and anger, I suggest you channel it:

start writing a retro-diary. List as many memories of abuse that you can from

your childhood, up to now. Concurrently, begin keeping a daily journal listing

current incidents of her being manipulative, subversive, intrusive, insulting,

etc.

Since you are her main (if not only) target, you are going to have to provide

all the evidence. And yes, your cousin is right: keep and store every

voice-mail so you have hard evidence of the kinds of mean, nasty, hysterical,

manipulative messages she sends you.

Think of collecting incidents and evidence of just how covertly abusive your

nada is, as your new hobby.

Then go shopping for a new therapist/psychologist who is more attuned to your

needs and your situation.

*Use* your anger, girl! In this case, righteous anger is a gift, a survival

mechanism, and can be a powerful tool. Use it!

-Annie

>

> I am feeling intense pain and anger. I cannot lash out and so I turn it

inwards and it becomes depression. I cannot sleep at night and spend way too

much time thinking about, writing about and talking about nada, let alone the

time I spend reading about these various conditions.

>

> My husband is convinced that nada is not mentally ill but can be 'difficult'.

I feel very alone when my husband cannot even be in the space where " I dont

understand but I do support you " . Instead it is " I dont understand, you are

wrong, you need to reconcile with your mother, you probably will " . The other

argument goes " Just cut her off then. Tell her not to call or contact you, tell

all the relatives you no longer communicate with her and just get on with your

life " . The latter argument sounds good but in practice, having that conversation

is not going to be worth much. Nada knows how to get people emotionally hooked

in. Her family has that " whatever it is, she is your mother and you must

communicate " attitude or they take sides and lie for her etc. I know I dont have

to justify myself and have to be true to myself but I am SO ANGRY that she

continues to behave like this poor, hard done by victim...it is all so

subtle....today she rang the doorbell and

> my son answered. She had come to hand over some Christmas cake. Thank

goodness she did it at the gate. Tim (my lawyer friend; see previous emails for

that drama) makes these great cakes and often gives us some and he had

brought some with him to the dinner they had together last night, so she had

brought some round for us. Oh, how nice and normal and lovey dovey. This is why

my husband sees nothing. Everything is done in the sweetest possible way until

it comes to me. Is it possible that ONLY ONE PERSON can see the whole picture

whilst others think she is a bit eccentric, excitable etc?? At least my cousin

who lives in my city is beginning to really see aspects as I have been

completely honest and confided in her completely. Nada tries to manipulate her

but my version helps her see through it all. She suggested I play the tapes of

nada's mean, nasty, hysterical, sobbing messages on my voicemail for my brother

and uncle to hear so that they can

> understand what I am going through. She feels some shock therapy may get

people to see.

>

> But really, from the outside looking in it looks like a daughter is accusing

her mother of being mentally ill. How mean is that??

>

> Perhaps I am trying to psychoanalyse it all too much. Perhaps it does not

matter whether she is mentally ill or not. She is toxic for me and on that

basis, I need to keep away. Quite frankly, I dont want my child to be alone with

her and there is no one I trust who can be with him if he goes to see her

without me.

>

> I should add that my nada does not have a psychologist. She sees a family

physician for some medical ailments like high blood pressure and diabetes but

certainly this doctor will not twig there is something going on. And I guess the

trouble with mental illness is that a patient cannot be treated involuntarily.

Sometimes I wish she would threaten suicide or self mutilate so that I could at

least get her into the mental health care system and some real help. I could

ask the psychologist I have been seeing whether he will speak to her family

physician but that makes me sound crazy too!!! 

>

> I am not even sure what this rant is all about.. I feel like I am on a roller

coaster ride and all I want to do is GET OFF!!

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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Guest guest

,

I gave up trying to convince people what nada was like a long time ago. I know

what she did to me and how she still behaves. I have dealt with it through

therapy, through writing and through a lot of tears and anger. More than likely

your family will not acknowledge what happened to you unless they were they

experienced the same thing. Even if they did acknowledge it, it doesn't change

what happened and it won't change her. Work on yourself and try to let go of the

FOG (fear, obligation and guilt). The anger, insomnia and obession with your

nada are all part of the healing process. With time it will subside and you will

find peace.

Here you will find the acknowledgement and understanding that you will probably

not find anywhere else. We've been there and we know exactly what you're going

through.

Abby

> >

> > I am feeling intense pain and anger. I cannot lash out and so I turn it

inwards and it becomes depression. I cannot sleep at night and spend way too

much time thinking about, writing about and talking about nada, let alone the

time I spend reading about these various conditions.

> >

> > My husband is convinced that nada is not mentally ill but can be

'difficult'. I feel very alone when my husband cannot even be in the space where

" I dont understand but I do support you " . Instead it is " I dont understand, you

are wrong, you need to reconcile with your mother, you probably will " . The other

argument goes " Just cut her off then. Tell her not to call or contact you, tell

all the relatives you no longer communicate with her and just get on with your

life " . The latter argument sounds good but in practice, having that conversation

is not going to be worth much. Nada knows how to get people emotionally hooked

in. Her family has that " whatever it is, she is your mother and you must

communicate " attitude or they take sides and lie for her etc. I know I dont have

to justify myself and have to be true to myself but I am SO ANGRY that she

continues to behave like this poor, hard done by victim...it is all so

subtle....today she rang the doorbell and

> > my son answered. She had come to hand over some Christmas cake. Thank

goodness she did it at the gate. Tim (my lawyer friend; see previous emails for

that drama) makes these great cakes and often gives us some and he had

brought some with him to the dinner they had together last night, so she had

brought some round for us. Oh, how nice and normal and lovey dovey. This is why

my husband sees nothing. Everything is done in the sweetest possible way until

it comes to me. Is it possible that ONLY ONE PERSON can see the whole picture

whilst others think she is a bit eccentric, excitable etc?? At least my cousin

who lives in my city is beginning to really see aspects as I have been

completely honest and confided in her completely. Nada tries to manipulate her

but my version helps her see through it all. She suggested I play the tapes of

nada's mean, nasty, hysterical, sobbing messages on my voicemail for my brother

and uncle to hear so that they can

> > understand what I am going through. She feels some shock therapy may get

people to see.

> >

> > But really, from the outside looking in it looks like a daughter is accusing

her mother of being mentally ill. How mean is that??

> >

> > Perhaps I am trying to psychoanalyse it all too much. Perhaps it does not

matter whether she is mentally ill or not. She is toxic for me and on that

basis, I need to keep away. Quite frankly, I dont want my child to be alone with

her and there is no one I trust who can be with him if he goes to see her

without me.

> >

> > I should add that my nada does not have a psychologist. She sees a family

physician for some medical ailments like high blood pressure and diabetes but

certainly this doctor will not twig there is something going on. And I guess the

trouble with mental illness is that a patient cannot be treated involuntarily.

Sometimes I wish she would threaten suicide or self mutilate so that I could at

least get her into the mental health care system and some real help. I could

ask the psychologist I have been seeing whether he will speak to her family

physician but that makes me sound crazy too!!! 

> >

> > I am not even sure what this rant is all about.. I feel like I am on a

roller coaster ride and all I want to do is GET OFF!!

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

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Guest guest

Annie & Abby

Thank you so much. I really needed that validation and support. It is

interesting that the two cousins I have spoken to so far within the family got

it straight away. One of them told me several months ago that nada was jealous

of me, long before I knew anything about BPD. It is very helpful to get this

support and I am grateful to them. I needed to trust someone and obviously these

people came through for me. However, no one is a psychologist and have not got

any comprehension of what a PD is. I think it is hard to grasp that a mother

does not unconditionally love her child. One cousin said, " Your Mum does love

you, just not the way you want to be loved " and she based that on the fact that

as she too has a child, she cannot imagine not loving that child

unconditionally. It is hard to grasp but then she is the same cousin who said

she had seen how jealous and competitive nada is with me.

I also looked at excerpts from 'Children of the Self Absorbed' and am amazed at

how much that resonates with me too. It is about the KO NPD parents.

I have also just done something really major. I have written a lengthy letter to

my brother laying all the history on the table plus current situation. He

emailed me saying he had read it, it was a lot to absorb, give him some time and

he would talk to me. I await the outcome of that. It was very emotional for me

to write that letter because I had to go back to when I was 10 and Dad was going

to leave us but did not. The excruciating fights etc....

I have made an appointment to see the psychologist that I have seen twice

already. I really would like my husband to come along. It is very hard to go

through this not only without his support but also with his down right

antagonism towards me for not reconciling with nada. He actually suggested today

that I should take Prozac because I was feeling emotional as I wrote the letter

to my brother. The story goes that I am the one with the problem and so I should

get help. I will give the guy one last chance.

Of course, you have all said that it is hard for anyone to get this and it is so

easy to say 'just reconcile' or 'just cut her off', wish it was that simple.

I really thank you for your input, for reading all my posts, for your validation

and support. It has helped me so much through a very difficult few weeks.

Best wishes

________________________________

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Monday, April 6, 2009 8:19:27 AM

Subject: Re: Help

,

I gave up trying to convince people what nada was like a long time ago. I know

what she did to me and how she still behaves. I have dealt with it through

therapy, through writing and through a lot of tears and anger. More than likely

your family will not acknowledge what happened to you unless they were they

experienced the same thing. Even if they did acknowledge it, it doesn't change

what happened and it won't change her. Work on yourself and try to let go of the

FOG (fear, obligation and guilt). The anger, insomnia and obession with your

nada are all part of the healing process. With time it will subside and you will

find peace.

Here you will find the acknowledgement and understanding that you will probably

not find anywhere else. We've been there and we know exactly what you're going

through.

Abby

> >

> > I am feeling intense pain and anger. I cannot lash out and so I turn it

inwards and it becomes depression. I cannot sleep at night and spend way too

much time thinking about, writing about and talking about nada, let alone the

time I spend reading about these various conditions.

> >

> > My husband is convinced that nada is not mentally ill but can be

'difficult'. I feel very alone when my husband cannot even be in the space where

" I dont understand but I do support you " . Instead it is " I dont understand, you

are wrong, you need to reconcile with your mother, you probably will " . The other

argument goes " Just cut her off then. Tell her not to call or contact you, tell

all the relatives you no longer communicate with her and just get on with your

life " . The latter argument sounds good but in practice, having that conversation

is not going to be worth much. Nada knows how to get people emotionally hooked

in. Her family has that " whatever it is, she is your mother and you must

communicate " attitude or they take sides and lie for her etc. I know I dont have

to justify myself and have to be true to myself but I am SO ANGRY that she

continues to behave like this poor, hard done by victim...it is all so

subtle....today she rang the doorbell

and

> > my son answered. She had come to hand over some Christmas cake. Thank

goodness she did it at the gate. Tim (my lawyer friend; see previous emails for

that drama) makes these great cakes and often gives us some and he had

brought some with him to the dinner they had together last night, so she had

brought some round for us. Oh, how nice and normal and lovey dovey. This is why

my husband sees nothing. Everything is done in the sweetest possible way until

it comes to me. Is it possible that ONLY ONE PERSON can see the whole picture

whilst others think she is a bit eccentric, excitable etc?? At least my cousin

who lives in my city is beginning to really see aspects as I have been

completely honest and confided in her completely. Nada tries to manipulate her

but my version helps her see through it all. She suggested I play the tapes of

nada's mean, nasty, hysterical, sobbing messages on my voicemail for my brother

and uncle to hear so that they can

> > understand what I am going through. She feels some shock therapy may get

people to see.

> >

> > But really, from the outside looking in it looks like a daughter is

accusing her mother of being mentally ill. How mean is that??

> >

> > Perhaps I am trying to psychoanalyse it all too much. Perhaps it does not

matter whether she is mentally ill or not. She is toxic for me and on that

basis, I need to keep away. Quite frankly, I dont want my child to be alone with

her and there is no one I trust who can be with him if he goes to see her

without me.

> >

> > I should add that my nada does not have a psychologist. She sees a family

physician for some medical ailments like high blood pressure and diabetes but

certainly this doctor will not twig there is something going on. And I guess the

trouble with mental illness is that a patient cannot be treated involuntarily.

Sometimes I wish she would threaten suicide or self mutilate so that I could at

least get her into the mental health care system and some real help. I could

ask the psychologist I have been seeing whether he will speak to her family

physician but that makes me sound crazy too!!! 

> >

> > I am not even sure what this rant is all about.. I feel like I am on a

roller coaster ride and all I want to do is GET OFF!!

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

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