RE: Gleason number and seeds

[Guest guest]

<snip>"My question is, Will radioactive seeds be a permant solution for me"<snip>

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Charlie.

The first thing to realize about PCa is that nothing is certain. As you say, "I'm new to this world." There are no treatments yet that come with a guarantee. No one can be sure that there will be no recurrence or no erectile dysfunction or no incontinence or any of the other variables that come with a diagnosis of Prostate Cancer. It is not like having an appendectomy.

Having said that, you need to become an informed patient before you make a treatment decision. Get the best book on the subject, A Primer for Prostate Cancer The empowered patient's guide by Dr. Strum and Donna Pogliano (at all good booksellers. Got mine at Amazon) Read this list. Take time to learn before you decide. Your cancer has been there for some time and is not going to kill you any time soon.

Best of luck.

"il faut d'abord durer" Hemingway

Gleason number and seeds

hi Group,I'm new to this world. Am 53 and just diginosed with the prostrate C. I am told my Gleason number is 7, prostrate normal size and psa of 8.2. I have not chosen a treatment yet.My question is, Will radioactive seeds be a permant solution for me, as I hear of reoccurance in a few years with radiation therapys. I realize I might live 10 years with the ability to have a hard on,then die, or live another 40 like a choir singer. i suppose a sex change might be better than death, but I'd rather have all my apperatus if it can be saved. So any longivity reports with seeds in "young' men? Or instances of re-ocurance?Also, why can the not do surgury after radiation treatment?Thank's all of you out there. I could really use some support and will do what I can for you.Charlie

[Guest guest]

G’day Charlie

As says in his post, there are

simply no guarantees with PCa, just various degrees of uncertainty in the

diagnosis, the choice of treatment and the outcomes. We can look to many

studies and draw some conclusions as to what might be the best path to take as individuals,

but the end result will not be known until we get there. As Aubrey Pilgrim,

long time survivor says “The only Ruke about prostate cancer is that

there are no Rules” incidentally Aubrey has written a very good book

about the disease and the options. The book is A Revolutionary Approach to

Prostate Cancer-Read and the original book is available FREE at: http://www.prostatepointers.org/prostate/lay/apilgrim/

You can read new edition for FREE at http://www.cancer.prostate-help.org/capilgr.htm

You might also find it helpful to go along

to YANA – You Are Not Alone Now at http://www.yananow.net a site set up for newly diagnosed people. The

first section gives some basic information in plain language with links to more

complex and technical sites. The second section of the site is where men are

invited to tell their prostate cancer stories and how they arrived at their decisions

regarding treatment. Many people have mailed to say how useful they have found

this, especially because most of the men are happy to respond to specific

questions. The section of the site can be found by clicking the link labelled

Experiences or going to http://www.yananow.net/Experiences.html

The diagnosis you have is one that

may indicate that you have what has been termed an insignificant tumor, defined

as

1. Nonpalpable

2. Stage T1c

3. Percent free PSA 15 or

greater

4. Gleason less than 7

5. Less than three needle

cores with none greater than 50% tumour.

If this is the case, then statistically

your chances of dying from prostate cancer within the next 10 or 15 years is

probably less than 5%, no matter what your choice of treatment is. If you look

on this site at the Files option (http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/ProstateCancerSupport/files/

) you will find, amongst the excellent material, one labeled Insights AS

article – you might like to read that as background to your decision

making.

Finally, in response to your question <snip>

why can they not do surgery after radiation treatment? <snip> the answer

is that surgery IS possible after radiation but it is very rarely successful

because all the scarring of the tissue from the radiation makes it very

difficult to join all the bits up after the removal of the gland.

Hope this helps some – if not keep

asking questions until you get the answers you need, remembering there are no

dumb questions. Every one of us on theis List started with zero knowledge!

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason

3+3=6: No treatment. June '04: TURP. Nov '06 PSA 31.4

My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of the world that no one knows

what he doesn’t know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is that

he knows everything. Joyce Carey

From: ProstateCancerSupport

[mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ]

On Behalf Of Charlie Beyer

Sent: Tuesday, 12 December 2006

2:06 AM

To: ProstateCancerSupport

Subject: Gleason number and seeds

hi Group,

I'm new to this world. Am 53 and just diginosed with the prostrate C. I am

told my Gleason number is 7, prostrate normal size and psa of 8.2. I have

not chosen a treatment yet.

My question is, Will radioactive seeds be a permant solution for me, as I

hear of reoccurance in a few years with radiation therapys. I realize I

might live 10 years with the ability to have a hard on,then die, or live

another 40 like a choir singer. i suppose a sex change might be better than

death, but I'd rather have all my apperatus if it can be saved. So any

longivity reports with seeds in " young' men? Or instances of re-ocurance?

Also, why can the not do surgury after radiation treatment?

Thank's all of you out there. I could really use some support and will do

what I can for you.

Charlie

[Guest guest]

Hi Terry and Charlie,

Terry, I'm not convinced that a Gleason of 7 fits very well with an insignificant tumor. YMMV.

Charlie, up here in the frozen north, so far they won't do seeds with a Gleason over 6.

I'm one of the lucky ones so far. Just turned 53 this month, and had an nerve-sparing open RRP by a very experienced surgeon Oct 16th this year (roughly two months ago). Great erections at two weeks, orgasms at three weeks, no penile shrinkage. Continent at night immediately after catheter removal, and very nearly fully continent now. I still wear a pad when going out, but more for safety than need.

I did have some blood loss during surgery, in hospital for about a week and a reluctance in Ontario to perform transfusions unless REALLY necessary meant I was released with a hemoglobin of 76 plus pretty low blood pressure which made me really dizzy for a while. Had to get the catheter reinserted for another ten days after some bleeding at three weeks plugged my urethra with clots, but its been "golden" ever since (pun intended). Stream is now like twenty years ago.

So far I'm glad of the surgery. Seems its really the only way you can get an accurate pathology report about your disease state although mets are certainly still possible. In my case a pre-op 3+4=7 changed to a 4+3=7 plus a little bit of an 8. Tumor 5-10 percent of the gland, fully contained, clean margins etc. Now I keep my fingers and everything else crossed for a few years. PSA was hovering around 5 for a year prior to surgery. I still have to have a post-op PSA test to make sure its gone.

A lot of people have bad experiences with an RRP, so mine is an example of an Open RRP plus an early recovery that has gone really well so far. I'm now back at work doing normal long days. Pretty tired by the evening, but it gets better every week.

One thing I really noticed was a huge difference between six weeks post op and seven weeks post op. That extra week really made the difference between feeling pretty beat up and feeling pretty much back to normal. Interesting that it took that long, I had expected faster progress....

In addition, I had a gastric bypass 18 months ago and lost 120 pounds. (www.clos.net - highly recommended!!) Now I've lost about another 20 pounds in hospital for the RRP. I also underwent an open umbilical hernia repair a year ago that placed some reinforcing mesh around my navel area that ruled out a laparoscopic RRP. I hope to stay out of the body shop for a while now, enough is enough!! :-)

All the best

From: ProstateCancerSupport [mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ] On Behalf Of Terry HerbertSent: Monday, December 11, 2006 6:54 PMTo: ProstateCancerSupport Subject: RE: Gleason number and seeds

G’day Charlie

As says in his post, there are simply no guarantees with PCa, just various degrees of uncertainty in the diagnosis, the choice of treatment and the outcomes. We can look to many studies and draw some conclusions as to what might be the best path to take as individuals, but the end result will not be known until we get there. As Aubrey Pilgrim, long time survivor says “The only Ruke about prostate cancer is that there are no Rules” incidentally Aubrey has written a very good book about the disease and the options. The book is A Revolutionary Approach to Prostate Cancer-Read and the original book is available FREE at: http://www.prostatepointers.org/prostate/lay/apilgrim/ You can read new edition for FREE at http://www.cancer.prostate-help.org/capilgr.htm

You might also find it helpful to go along to YANA – You Are Not Alone Now at http://www.yananow.net a site set up for newly diagnosed people. The first section gives some basic information in plain language with links to more complex and technical sites. The second section of the site is where men are invited to tell their prostate cancer stories and how they arrived at their decisions regarding treatment. Many people have mailed to say how useful they have found this, especially because most of the men are happy to respond to specific questions. The section of the site can be found by clicking the link labelled Experiences or going to http://www.yananow.net/Experiences.html

The diagnosis you have is one that may indicate that you have what has been termed an insignificant tumor, defined as

1. Nonpalpable

2. Stage T1c

3. Percent free PSA 15 or greater

4. Gleason less than 7

5. Less than three needle cores with none greater than 50% tumour.

If this is the case, then statistically your chances of dying from prostate cancer within the next 10 or 15 years is probably less than 5%, no matter what your choice of treatment is. If you look on this site at the Files option (http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/ProstateCancerSupport/files/ ) you will find, amongst the excellent material, one labeled Insights AS article – you might like to read that as background to your decision making.

Finally, in response to your question <snip> why can they not do surgery after radiation treatment? <snip> the answer is that surgery IS possible after radiation but it is very rarely successful because all the scarring of the tissue from the radiation makes it very difficult to join all the bits up after the removal of the gland.

Hope this helps some – if not keep asking questions until you get the answers you need, remembering there are no dumb questions. Every one of us on theis List started with zero knowledge!

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 3+3=6: No treatment. June '04: TURP. Nov '06 PSA 31.4

My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of the world that no one knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is that he knows everything. Joyce Carey

From: ProstateCancerSupport [mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ] On Behalf Of Charlie BeyerSent: Tuesday, 12 December 2006 2:06 AMTo: ProstateCancerSupport Subject: Gleason number and seeds

hi Group,I'm new to this world. Am 53 and just diginosed with the prostrate C. I am told my Gleason number is 7, prostrate normal size and psa of 8.2. I have not chosen a treatment yet.My question is, Will radioactive seeds be a permant solution for me, as I hear of reoccurance in a few years with radiation therapys. I realize I might live 10 years with the ability to have a hard on,then die, or live another 40 like a choir singer. i suppose a sex change might be better than death, but I'd rather have all my apperatus if it can be saved. So any longivity reports with seeds in "young' men? Or instances of re-ocurance?Also, why can the not do surgury after radiation treatment?Thank's all of you out there. I could really use some support and will do what I can for you.Charlie

[Guest guest]

Hi Terry,

Thanks for the great letter with your well defined thoughts. And thanks for

all the links. I'll be digging in there extensivly. Tomorrow I go for a bone

scan and MRI , both of which one doc thought necessary and another thought

not conclusive. But if it has jumped " out " (of the capsule) I suspect this

will tell me. OK... nobody tell me how freaky these tests are, it will all

be over by noon tomorow.

Thanks, all you people out there. How wonderful that we can meet here in

cyberspace and share our lives. Thanks for being there.

Charlie

Terry .. I hope your number goes down. Have you heard of marinol injections

or the sindbis virus?

>

>G'day Charlie

>

>

>

>As says in his post, there are simply no guarantees with PCa, just

>various degrees of uncertainty in the diagnosis, the choice of treatment

>and

>the outcomes. We can look to many studies and draw some conclusions as to

>what might be the best path to take as individuals, but the end result will

>not be known until we get there. As Aubrey Pilgrim, long time survivor says

> " The only Ruke about prostate cancer is that there are no Rules "

>incidentally Aubrey has written a very good book about the disease and the

>options. The book is A Revolutionary Approach to Prostate Cancer-Read and

>the original book is available FREE at:

>http://www.prostatepointers.org/prostate/lay/apilgrim/ You can read new

>edition for FREE at http://www.cancer.prostate-help.org/capilgr.htm

>

>

>

>You might also find it helpful to go along to YANA - You Are Not Alone Now

>at http://www.yananow.net <http://www.yananow.net/> a site set up for

>newly diagnosed people. The first section gives some basic information in

>plain language with links to more complex and technical sites. The second

>section of the site is where men are invited to tell their prostate cancer

>stories and how they arrived at their decisions regarding treatment. Many

>people have mailed to say how useful they have found this, especially

>because most of the men are happy to respond to specific questions. The

>section of the site can be found by clicking the link labelled Experiences

>or going to http://www.yananow.net/Experiences.html

>

>

>

>The diagnosis you have is one that may indicate that you have what has

>been

>termed an insignificant tumor, defined as

>

>1. Nonpalpable

>

>2. Stage T1c

>

>3. Percent free PSA 15 or greater

>

>4. Gleason less than 7

>

>5. Less than three needle cores with none greater than 50% tumour.

>

>

>

>If this is the case, then statistically your chances of dying from prostate

>cancer within the next 10 or 15 years is probably less than 5%, no matter

>what your choice of treatment is. If you look on this site at the Files

>option (http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/ProstateCancerSupport/files/ )

>you will find, amongst the excellent material, one labeled Insights AS

>article - you might like to read that as background to your decision

>making.

>

>

>

>Finally, in response to your question <snip> why can they not do surgery

>after radiation treatment? <snip> the answer is that surgery IS possible

>after radiation but it is very rarely successful because all the scarring

>of

>the tissue from the radiation makes it very difficult to join all the bits

>up after the removal of the gland.

>

>

>

>Hope this helps some - if not keep asking questions until you get the

>answers you need, remembering there are no dumb questions. Every one of us

>on theis List started with zero knowledge!

>

>

>

>All the best

>

>

>

>Terry Herbert

>

>in Melbourne Australia

>

>Diagnosed '96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 3+3=6: No treatment.

>June

>'04: TURP. Nov '06 PSA 31.4

>

>My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for your story Grorge,

Very hopeful about the surgury. Glad to hear about your bone-on (for you).

It's a tough thought to give up the idea of having that. Hmmmmm .. death ...

hard on ... tough decision. I really like women and they really like me.

Might it be better to go out with just a huge phallic tombstone, or get

nutered and go teach phisics to underprivilaged Panimainian children?

Anyway . really appreciate your thoughts, and knowing that it CAn be done

right. I am hearing about such a surgon in Seattle ... my neck of the woods.

I continue to gather my options. Thanks again.

Charlie

>

>Reply-To: ProstateCancerSupport

>To: <ProstateCancerSupport >

>Subject: RE: Gleason number and seeds

>Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2006 19:52:00 -0500

>

>Hi Terry and Charlie,

>

>Terry, I'm not convinced that a Gleason of 7 fits very well with an

>insignificant tumor. YMMV.

>

>Charlie, up here in the frozen north, so far they won't do seeds with a

>Gleason over 6.

>

[Guest guest]

The tests are not freaky at all.Here is the process based on m y three times through it:Arrive at imaging center, wait (just a little humor)- Recevie injection of radioactive matter necessary for bone scan. Takes two hours or so to circulate.One time we left and came back, the last two times they had the schedule together.- If scheduled correctly you proceed to the MRI area where you have to drink 4 32oz glasses of liquid. Each glasss is consumed every 30 minutes (aprox). So this step takes about two hours.- Proceed to the MRI machine. If it is the newer machine it's like a giant donut that slides you in and out. Nothing scary, just a big noisy machine.- If the schedule lines up you go back to the bone scan area. This is a little more substantial, perhaps

'freaky' than the MRI. The x-ray device takes a full body x-ray from head to toe. It takes about 20-25 minutes to complete. The first 5 minutes or so the machine is directly (2-3") above your face. After that your head is in the open.Let me know if you have more questions! EmersonFaith-Love-Hope-Winwww.flhw.org"the Big C" RE: Gleason number and seeds

Hi Terry,

Thanks for the great letter with your well defined thoughts. And thanks for

all the links. I'll be digging in there extensivly. Tomorrow I go for a bone

scan and MRI , both of which one doc thought necessary and another thought

not conclusive. But if it has jumped "out" (of the capsule) I suspect this

will tell me. OK... nobody tell me how freaky these tests are, it will all

be over by noon tomorow.

Thanks, all you people out there. How wonderful that we can meet here in

cyberspace and share our lives. Thanks for being there.

Charlie

Terry .. I hope your number goes down. Have you heard of marinol injections

or the sindbis virus?

>

>G'day Charlie

>

>

>

>As says in his post, there are simply no guarantees with PCa, just

>various degrees of uncertainty in the diagnosis, the choice of treatment

>and

>the outcomes. We can look to many studies and draw some conclusions as to

>what might be the best path to take as individuals, but the end result will

>not be known until we get there. As Aubrey Pilgrim, long time survivor says

>"The only Ruke about prostate cancer is that there are no Rules"

>incidentally Aubrey has written a very good book about the disease and the

>options. The book is A Revolutionary Approach to Prostate Cancer-Read and

>the original book is available FREE at:

>http://www.prostate pointers. org/prostate/ lay/apilgrim/ You can read new

>edition for FREE at http://www.cancer. prostate- help.org/ capilgr.htm

>

>

>

>You might also find it helpful to go along to YANA - You Are Not Alone Now

>at http://www.yananow. net <http://www.yananow. net/> a site set up for

>newly diagnosed people. The first section gives some basic information in

>plain language with links to more complex and technical sites. The second

>section of the site is where men are invited to tell their prostate cancer

>stories and how they arrived at their decisions regarding treatment. Many

>people have mailed to say how useful they have found this, especially

>because most of the men are happy to respond to specific questions. The

>section of the site can be found by clicking the link labelled Experiences

>or going to http://www.yananow. net/Experiences. html

>

>

>

>The diagnosis you have is one that may indicate that you have what has

>been

>termed an insignificant tumor, defined as

>

>1. Nonpalpable

>

>2. Stage T1c

>

>3. Percent free PSA 15 or greater

>

>4. Gleason less than 7

>

>5. Less than three needle cores with none greater than 50% tumour.

>

>

>

>If this is the case, then statistically your chances of dying from prostate

>cancer within the next 10 or 15 years is probably less than 5%, no matter

>what your choice of treatment is. If you look on this site at the Files

>option (http://health. groups.yahoo. com/group/ ProstateCancerSu pport/files/ )

>you will find, amongst the excellent material, one labeled Insights AS

>article - you might like to read that as background to your decision

>making.

>

>

>

>Finally, in response to your question <snip> why can they not do surgery

>after radiation treatment? <snip> the answer is that surgery IS possible

>after radiation but it is very rarely successful because all the scarring

>of

>the tissue from the radiation makes it very difficult to join all the bits

>up after the removal of the gland.

>

>

>

>Hope this helps some - if not keep asking questions until you get the

>answers you need, remembering there are no dumb questions. Every one of us

>on theis List started with zero knowledge!

>

>

>

>All the best

>

>

>

>Terry Herbert

>

>in Melbourne Australia

>

>Diagnosed '96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 3+3=6: No treatment.

>June

>'04: TURP. Nov '06 PSA 31.4

>

>My site is at www.prostatecancerw atchfulwaiting. co.za

>