RE: Biopsy vs. watch?

[Guest guest]

> Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance.

>

Not really in the class you're in, being somewhat older, but I watched

my dad die of PCa too and it sure leaves a mark. I'd get the biopsy in

short order if I were you. Being at a younger age it seems the cancer

is quite often a more aggressive breed and you certainly may have a

lot to lose if you wait. The biopsy is probably the best indicator of

what you have. The PSA readings do change for several reasons as

you'll find in your research, but the higher reading at your age is

alarming I'd think. I hit mine with the " big stick " of radical surgery

and so far the results have been good (knock on wood.) Lots of options

these days that my dad didn't have, thank goodness for medical

science.

[Guest guest]

Do the

biopsy.

My best friend died of the aggressive kind.

I had PSA 4.1 and robotic surgery September

1.

They think they got all of mine while still

in capsule. Prognosis good.

Heredity definitely an issue. Gleason

score very important to decisions on any treatment.

Lots of help on this board.

[Guest guest]

Are you aware that sexual activity prior to a PSA test can cause the number to go up? Depending on the person, even riding a bicycle can throw a test off. Did you do either of these activities within 24 hours prior to any of your PSA tests? I ask this because before you consider a biopsy you need to first make sure you are getting accurate PSA tests. Mick bored_cops wrote: Greetings to all, 1st

post other than a previous test which I still don't see, but here's the post anyway. My father died of metastatic PCa in 1990 within few months of diagnosis. I therefore decided to start monitoring my PSA. a bit of background: very healthy (guy of course age 45, 6'1 (185cm), 185lb(84kg) married with a 4 and 7 yr old boys. My first PSA was on June 10/2006 at 4.59 My internist said my DRE was completely benign. Even though I had no symptoms of prostatitis, A urologist friend suggested a recheck after a 4 wk Cipro course. On July 19/2006 it dropped to 3.3 He suggested we watch in recheck in few months. At that point I added an incosistent GNC prostate formula supplement. I just rechecked again 2 days ago and the number had climbed back up to 4 and a free of 10% (1st time I do the free). The urologist -being a personal friend- said if I was in his office he would probably recommend a biopsy, but if

I'm not anxious, I can wait and recheck it in 6 months. I'm tempted to go for the biopsy and my wife feels stronger that I should. I'm a bit "bummed out" and overwhelmed specially being only 45 with little children. I don't feel like sharing this with any of my family or friends but willing to share it here with people who have gone through similar experience. I probably have a 50-50% chance of having PCa given the above scenario. I don't know if it's false reassurance but I'm taking the quick drop from 4.6 to 3.3 in 5 weeks following Abx course as a good sign but why the rise back to 4 in 5 month?. It probably really doesn't matter and I feel a biopsy is now in order. Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance. God rewards those that keep on keeping on. Stay positive. Think positive. Pray positive. And talk positive.

Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask your question on

Yahoo! Answers.

[Guest guest]

Your psa seems low but you do have a family history of PCa so you need to be checked regularly. I was able to drop my psa from 11.2 to 8.9 by changing my diet and eliminating nearly all animal products. You can slow the growth of the disease ( if you even have it at all as other things can raise your psa like sex or bike / motor cycle riding, prostatitis etc) with a diet change and give yourself a lot more enjoyment of your life without the side efects of treatment. bored_cops wrote: Greetings to all,

1st post other than a previous test which I still don't see, but here's the post anyway. My father died of metastatic PCa in 1990 within few months of diagnosis. I therefore decided to start monitoring my PSA. a bit of background: very healthy (guy of course age 45, 6'1 (185cm), 185lb(84kg) married with a 4 and 7 yr old boys. My first PSA was on June 10/2006 at 4.59 My internist said my DRE was completely benign. Even though I had no symptoms of prostatitis, A urologist friend suggested a recheck after a 4 wk Cipro course. On July 19/2006 it dropped to 3.3 He suggested we watch in recheck in few months. At that point I added an incosistent GNC prostate formula supplement. I just rechecked again 2 days ago and the number had climbed back up to 4 and a free of 10% (1st time I do the free). The urologist -being a personal friend- said if I was in his office he would probably recommend a biopsy, but

if I'm not anxious, I can wait and recheck it in 6 months. I'm tempted to go for the biopsy and my wife feels stronger that I should. I'm a bit "bummed out" and overwhelmed specially being only 45 with little children. I don't feel like sharing this with any of my family or friends but willing to share it here with people who have gone through similar experience. I probably have a 50-50% chance of having PCa given the above scenario. I don't know if it's false reassurance but I'm taking the quick drop from 4.6 to 3.3 in 5 weeks following Abx course as a good sign but why the rise back to 4 in 5 month?. It probably really doesn't matter and I feel a biopsy is now in order. Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance.

Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.

[Guest guest]

snip "Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance." snip

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Hi.

Think of it as a poker game. One should be hesitant to bet the farm if he has not seen the last card. The last card in this case being the biopsy report. Gather every piece of info you can get so that when it comes time to deal with this disease you can deal from a strong knowledgable position. Best of luck.

"il faut d'abord durer" Hemingway

Biopsy vs. watch?

Greetings to all,1st post other than a previous test which I still don't see, but here's the post anyway.My father died of metastatic PCa in 1990 within few months of diagnosis.I therefore decided to start monitoring my PSA. a bit of background:very healthy (guy of course age 45, 6'1 (185cm), 185lb(84kg) married with a 4 and 7 yr old boys.My first PSA was on June 10/2006 at 4.59 My internist said my DRE was completely benign. Even though I had no symptoms of prostatitis, A urologist friend suggested a recheck after a 4 wk Cipro course. On July 19/2006 it dropped to 3.3 He suggested we watch in recheck in few months. At that point I added an incosistent GNC prostate formula supplement. I just rechecked again 2 days ago and the number had climbed back up to 4 and a free of 10% (1st time I do the free).The urologist -being a personal friend- said if I was in his office he would probably recommend a biopsy, but if I'm not anxious, I can wait and recheck it in 6 months. I'm tempted to go for the biopsy and my wife feels stronger that I should. I'm a bit "bummed out" and overwhelmed specially being only 45 with little children. I don't feel like sharing this with any of my family or friends but willing to share it here with people who have gone through similar experience. I probably have a 50-50% chance of having PCa given the above scenario. I don't know if it's false reassurance but I'm taking the quick drop from 4.6 to 3.3 in 5 weeks following Abx course as a good sign but why the rise back to 4 in 5 month?. It probably really doesn't matter and I feel a biopsy is now in order. Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance.

[Guest guest]

I am 59..PSA 3.4...Put off a biopsy too long. Once I had it...12 positive results (Cancer). Don't put it off. Don't do it. The biopsy is not bad at all. Go yo a big hospital where they do a lot of them, not some small neighborhood hospital.

> Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance.

>

Not really in the class you're in, being somewhat older, but I watched

my dad die of PCa too and it sure leaves a mark. I'd get the biopsy in

short order if I were you. Being at a younger age it seems the cancer

is quite often a more aggressive breed and you certainly may have a

lot to lose if you wait. The biopsy is probably the best indicator of

what you have. The PSA readings do change for several reasons as

you'll find in your research, but the higher reading at your age is

alarming I'd think. I hit mine with the " big stick " of radical surgery

and so far the results have been good (knock on wood.) Lots of options

these days that my dad didn't have, thank goodness for medical

science.

-- Terry Brejla

[Guest guest]

First, as others have said - GO GET THE BIOPSY as soon as possible.Second - My dad had PCa in the mid 90's. He's still with use today but at 42, I ignored the signs and put off the doctors visit. My mistake. Mine is advanced, your's could be very earliy, very, very treatable.Go for the biopsy, you'll never regret it.Funny how we act as humans. We'll fret and let the unknown tear us apart inside versus getting a test that will tell us the answer.I guess it's the fear of confirmation? However, what if the test indicates other..... EmersonFaith-Love-Hope-Winwww.flhw.org"the Big C" Biopsy vs. watch?

Greetings to all,

1st post other than a previous test which I still don't see, but

here's the post anyway.

My father died of metastatic PCa in 1990 within few months of

diagnosis.

I therefore decided to start monitoring my PSA. a bit of background:

very healthy (guy of course age 45, 6'1 (185cm), 185lb(84kg)

married with a 4 and 7 yr old boys.

My first PSA was on June 10/2006 at 4.59 My internist said my DRE

was completely benign. Even though I had no symptoms of prostatitis,

A urologist friend suggested a recheck after a 4 wk Cipro course. On

July 19/2006 it dropped to 3.3 He suggested we watch in recheck in

few months. At that point I added an incosistent GNC prostate

formula supplement. I just rechecked again 2 days ago and the number

had climbed back up to 4 and a free of 10% (1st time I do the free).

The urologist -being a personal friend- said if I was in his office

he would probably recommend a biopsy, but if I'm not anxious, I can

wait and recheck it in 6 months. I'm tempted to go for the biopsy

and my wife feels stronger that I should. I'm a bit "bummed out" and

overwhelmed specially being only 45 with little children. I don't

feel like sharing this with any of my family or friends but willing

to share it here with people who have gone through similar

experience. I probably have a 50-50% chance of having PCa given the

above scenario. I don't know if it's false reassurance but I'm

taking the quick drop from 4.6 to 3.3 in 5 weeks following Abx

course as a good sign but why the rise back to 4 in 5 month?. It

probably really doesn't matter and I feel a biopsy is now in order.

Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance.

[Guest guest]

My suggestion is to get the biopsy done. Don't wait. If you have a lot of anxiety about it, ask for some Valium or, better yet, general anesthesia (which is what I had). At age 45 I had a PSA of 4.7, if I remember correctly. My urologist recommended a biopsy. I went and had another blood test done at a local hospital (including free PSA) and it was " within normal limits " (meaning < 4.0). Since then, I've never had a PSA > 3.0, but last summer my " new " urologist recommended a biopsy because (according to him) every PSA that I've ever had was high for my age. Finally, this past August, at age 47, I had the biopsy done. One core out of 12 was positive. Gleason was 3+3.

I'm glad I switched urologists. The first one used what I would call a cookie-cutter approach to diagnosis, failing to factor my age into the clinical picture. He uses a simple form letter to advise patients of their PSA results. The form letter says if the result is over 4.0, the patient should have a biopsy. The one I've seen more recently looked at the numbers, my family history (paternal uncle had PCa and RRP three years ago), and my age, and told me there was no doubt in his mind I should have a biopsy. He was right.

Even so, after getting the results back I considered waiting a few years, or possibly getting a second biopsy or looking other tests that might be out there. Eventually, after a lot of reading and talking with people, including consulting with three urological surgeons, a radiation oncologist, my internist, and a medical oncologist (not to mention a couple of MD friends whom I spoke with informally), I decided the best course for me, with my projected life expectancy (which is presumably about the same as yours), was surgery. I had an RRP last month at Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center in NYC. I don't regret it, even though I'm still working through the immediate after-effects of surgery. I told my son that the surgery for me was like an insurance premium for the old age that I hope to live to see.

Another suggestion that I'd add is not to keep your family or close friends in the dark. There's nothing to be ashamed of regarding a prostate biopsy, regardless of the outcome. If the outcome is unfavorable, you'll need their support. Even a biopsy can be stressful, so why keep it secret?

Good luck to you. If you'd like to e-mail me privately, or respond publicly on the list, you're welcome to do so either way.

Tom Rue

http://vitruvian.tomrue.net/pmwiki.php?n=Health.MensHealth

http://tomrue.net

Greetings to all,1st post other than a previous test which I still don't see, but here's the post anyway.My father died of metastatic PCa in 1990 within few months of diagnosis.I therefore decided to start monitoring my PSA. a bit of background:

very healthy (guy of course age 45, 6'1 (185cm), 185lb(84kg) married with a 4 and 7 yr old boys.My first PSA was on June 10/2006 at 4.59 My internist said my DRE was completely benign. Even though I had no symptoms of prostatitis, A urologist friend suggested a recheck after a 4 wk Cipro course. On July 19/2006 it dropped to 3.3 He suggested we watch in recheck in few months. At that point I added an incosistent GNC prostate formula supplement. I just rechecked again 2 days ago and the number had climbed back up to 4 and a free of 10% (1st time I do the free).The urologist -being a personal friend- said if I was in his office he would probably recommend a biopsy, but if I'm not anxious, I can wait and recheck it in 6 months. I'm tempted to go for the biopsy and my wife feels stronger that I should. I'm a bit " bummed out " and overwhelmed specially being only 45 with little children. I don't feel like sharing this with any of my family or friends but willing to share it here with people who have gone through similar experience. I probably have a 50-50% chance of having PCa given the above scenario. I don't know if it's false reassurance but I'm taking the quick drop from 4.6 to 3.3 in 5 weeks following Abx course as a good sign but why the rise back to 4 in 5 month?. It probably really doesn't matter and I feel a biopsy is now in order. Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance. -- /} @#####{ ]::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::> \} http://tomrue.net

http://vitruvian.tomrue.net

[Guest guest]

Hi there,

Don’t fret about the marginal

changes in PSA – although it is a reasonable marker for PCa, it is NOT prostate

cancer specific. I’d say that your chances are not 50/50 of cancer being

found, but less than 35% - and that’s based on your having multiple biopsies

or a 23 needle biopsy (OUCH!) to start with – because that is

statistically what the studies show.

If you’re interested in some simple

explanations about PSA you might like to have a look at these sites of mine,

one of which was written by well known PCa activist and guru Ralph Valle.

PSA 101 http://tinyurl.com/8x6my

My personal PSA variance http://tinyurl.com/cxwj6

What’s new ine? http://tinyurl.com/p7h4b (that’s Ralph’s piece)

I’m not saying you shouldn’t

have a biopsy. For most men, especially those with a good doctor, the procedure

is not too traumatic, although the discomfort does rise with the number of

needles used. Be aware of something that no-one told me, if you go ahead, that

your urine and semen are likely to be bloody for some indeterminate time after

the procedure. The time varies considerably from days to weeks, but it is a bit

of a shock initially for those men who have the problem.

If you go ahead with the biopsy and if you

find a smidgin of an atypical cell, be aware that might even be classified as prostate

cancer on the better to be safe than to be sorry basis. Logothetis, a leading expert in

advanced prostate cancer was asked a question at a US-TOO meeting in Texas. He had been

commenting on the relative inaccuracy of the diagnostic process. The question

was: " Does this mean that a lot of people who are diagnosed as having

cancer really don't? His answer was: " Yes, if one accepts the diagnosis

that the cancer is a disease that is potentially lethal……. One of

the problems with prostate cancer is definition. They label it as a cancer, and

they force us all to behave in a way that introduces us to a cascade of events

that sends us to very morbid therapy. It's sort of like once that cancer label

is put on there we are obligated to behave in a certain way, and its driven by

physician beliefs and patient beliefs and frequently they don't have anything

to do with reality. And they are only worrisome because the pathologist has

decided to call it a cancer.

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason

3+3=6: No treatment. June '04: TURP. Nov '06 PSA 31.4

My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of the world that no one

knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is

that he knows everything. Joyce Carey

From: ProstateCancerSupport

[mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ]

On Behalf Of bored_cops

Sent: Monday, 11 December 2006

4:46 AM

To: ProstateCancerSupport

Subject: Biopsy vs. watch?

Greetings to all,

1st post other than a previous test which I still don't see, but

here's the post anyway.

My father died of metastatic PCa in 1990 within few months of

diagnosis.

I therefore decided to start monitoring my PSA. a bit of background:

very healthy (guy of course age 45, 6'1 (185cm), 185lb(84kg)

married with a 4 and 7 yr old boys.

My first PSA was on June 10/2006 at 4.59 My internist said my DRE

was completely benign. Even though I had no symptoms of prostatitis,

A urologist friend suggested a recheck after a 4 wk Cipro course. On

July 19/2006 it dropped to 3.3 He suggested we watch in recheck in

few months. At that point I added an incosistent GNC prostate

formula supplement. I just rechecked again 2 days ago and the number

had climbed back up to 4 and a free of 10% (1st time I do the free).

The urologist -being a personal friend- said if I was in his office

he would probably recommend a biopsy, but if I'm not anxious, I can

wait and recheck it in 6 months. I'm tempted to go for the biopsy

and my wife feels stronger that I should. I'm a bit " bummed out " and

overwhelmed specially being only 45 with little children. I don't

feel like sharing this with any of my family or friends but willing

to share it here with people who have gone through similar

experience. I probably have a 50-50% chance of having PCa given the

above scenario. I don't know if it's false reassurance but I'm

taking the quick drop from 4.6 to 3.3 in 5 weeks following Abx

course as a good sign but why the rise back to 4 in 5 month?. It

probably really doesn't matter and I feel a biopsy is now in order.

Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance.

[Guest guest]

I'm very grateful to everyone who responded to my post. I can't tell

you how much it means that you all took the time. I have a very busy

schedule and will try to respond to some of the posts individually

later on when I get a second.

Best regards,

[Guest guest]

Okay...okay....I was one who put off the biopsy for way too long because I was terrified. There was nothing to it. if you're getting it done, go to a big teaching hospital where they do it all the time, not a small neighborhood medical center. 20% of guys with a low PSA, including me at 3.4, have PC. Just do it!!!

> Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance.>Not really in the class you're in, being somewhat older, but I watched my dad die of PCa too and it sure leaves a mark. I'd get the biopsy in short order if I were you. Being at a younger age it seems the cancer is quite often a more aggressive breed and you certainly may have a lot to lose if you wait. The biopsy is probably the best indicator of what you have. The PSA readings do change for several reasons as you'll find in your research, but the higher reading at your age is alarming I'd think. I hit mine with the " big stick " of radical surgery and so far the results have been good (knock on wood.) Lots of options these days that my dad didn't have, thank goodness for medical science. -- Terry Brejla

[Guest guest]

My dad was terrified of the biopsy too but he went ahead with it and there was no problems whatsoever, we are so proud of him. I'm glad to say he has been talking about it to other men he works with and put their minds at rest too. Get it done, it sounds scary but truly isn't. Take care, Clare tkb wrote: Okay...okay....I was one who put off the biopsy for way too long because I was terrified. There was nothing to it.

if you're getting it done, go to a big teaching hospital where they do it all the time, not a small neighborhood medical center. 20% of guys with a low PSA, including me at 3.4, have PC. Just do it!!! On 12/10/06, mccartney_7 <mccartney_7> wrote: > Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance.>Not really in the class you're in, being somewhat older, but I watched my dad die of PCa too and it sure leaves a mark. I'd get the

biopsy in short order if I were you. Being at a younger age it seems the cancer is quite often a more aggressive breed and you certainly may have a lot to lose if you wait. The biopsy is probably the best indicator of what you have. The PSA readings do change for several reasons as you'll find in your research, but the higher reading at your age is alarming I'd think. I hit mine with the "big stick" of radical surgery and so far the results have been good (knock on wood.) Lots of options these days that my dad didn't have, thank goodness for medical science. -- Terry Brejla

Try the all-new Yahoo! Mail . "The New Version is radically easier to use" – The Wall Street Journal

[Guest guest]

I've already extended big thanks to all those who replied and feel I

owe it to you that I give you an update. first , a side note as some

seemed to imply that I was concerned about the procedure itself.

That was never the case, I once had a wisdom tooth extraction and

had sutures in my chin without a local anesthetic

I had the biopsy done on 12/22 by a good friend who works at a

reputable and well known Univ. Hospital.

The very next morning, I developed 101 temp and by the evening it

got to 39.3C (103F) with unbelievable shaking chills. My color was

that of a ghost. My wife rushed me to the ER and was placed on

initially on Cipro and Flagyl then few hours later changed to Zosyn.

After 24 hrs when the fever kept climbing and I was starting to

halucinate, Tobramycin was added. (BTW, I had already been on Cipro

500BID prior to the procedure and into the ilness). In less than 36

hrs. I had a temp. of 108 at which point I developed

amnesia..lol....I truly don't remember much. I spend 2 days in the

ICU. yesterday, both the blood and urine grew ESBL E.coli (Extended

Beta Lactamase), one of the deadliest and toughest to kill. The

short story is that now I have a PICC line (peripherally inserted

central catheters)

[http://www.cancerbackup.org.uk/Treatments/Chemotherapy/Linesports/PI

CCline] since there's no oral abx that can take care of it.

As for the biopsy results, the " unofficial " reading is that it's

cancer-free but shows significant degree of both chronic and acute

inflammation. Incidentally I didn't have any symptoms of any kind

relating to prostatitis. I guess it may end up being a happy ending

but I'll say that once I get the official report and have that PICC

line out of my arm in few weeks.

I hope my story NEVER discourage anyone from getting the biopsy and

this is not my intention. This kind of complication is very rare and

if I had to do it knowing this, I would do it again. I'm sharing my

experience in case it helps someone just as reading some replies

were helpful to me as well.

Incidentally, it was not only a blood and urinary infection, it was

also septic shock where the Hematocrit dropped from 47% to 38% and

platelets down to an abnormal 89k.

Again many thanks to all and best of luck.

>

> Greetings to all,

> 1st post other than a previous test which I still don't see, but

> here's the post anyway.

>

> My father died of metastatic PCa in 1990 within few months of

> diagnosis.

> I therefore decided to start monitoring my PSA. a bit of

background:

> very healthy (guy of course age 45, 6'1 (185cm), 185lb(84kg)

> married with a 4 and 7 yr old boys.

> My first PSA was on June 10/2006 at 4.59 My internist said my DRE

> was completely benign. Even though I had no symptoms of

prostatitis,

> A urologist friend suggested a recheck after a 4 wk Cipro course.

On

> July 19/2006 it dropped to 3.3 He suggested we watch in recheck in

> few months. At that point I added an incosistent GNC prostate

> formula supplement. I just rechecked again 2 days ago and the

number

> had climbed back up to 4 and a free of 10% (1st time I do the

free).

> The urologist -being a personal friend- said if I was in his

office

> he would probably recommend a biopsy, but if I'm not anxious, I

can

> wait and recheck it in 6 months. I'm tempted to go for the biopsy

> and my wife feels stronger that I should. I'm a bit " bummed out "

and

> overwhelmed specially being only 45 with little children. I don't

> feel like sharing this with any of my family or friends but

willing

> to share it here with people who have gone through similar

> experience. I probably have a 50-50% chance of having PCa given

the

> above scenario. I don't know if it's false reassurance but I'm

> taking the quick drop from 4.6 to 3.3 in 5 weeks following Abx

> course as a good sign but why the rise back to 4 in 5 month?. It

> probably really doesn't matter and I feel a biopsy is now in

order.

> Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance.

>

[Guest guest]

Sorry to hear of your experience and hope

you make a good recovery.

I believe however that this kind of

experience is NOT as rare as you may have been told. I know that there are few

studies that show serious side effects from biopsy, but some years ago a man

who was wishing to institute a law suit because of his post biopsy problems was

doing the rounds of the Lists and Forums looking for others who had bad experiences.

It was surprising how many men there were, all of whom were told that their

case was unusual and for that reason they hadn’t pursued the matter any

further. Even on this List, this is the second bad experience in a couple of

days – are there any others out there?

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason

3+3=6: No treatment. June '04: TURP. Nov '06 PSA 31.4

My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of the world that no one

knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is

that he knows everything. Joyce Carey

From:

ProstateCancerSupport

[mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ] On Behalf Of bored_cops

Sent: Wednesday, 27 December 2006

9:53 AM

To:

ProstateCancerSupport

Subject:

Re: Biopsy vs. watch?

I've already extended big thanks to all those who

replied and feel I

owe it to you that I give you an update. first , a side note as some

seemed to imply that I was concerned about the procedure itself.

That was never the case, I once had a wisdom tooth extraction and

had sutures in my chin without a local anesthetic

I had the biopsy done on 12/22 by a good friend who works at a

reputable and well known Univ.

Hospital.

The very next morning, I developed 101 temp and by the evening it

got to 39.3C (103F) with unbelievable shaking chills. My color was

that of a ghost. My wife rushed me to the ER and was placed on

initially on Cipro and Flagyl then few hours later changed to Zosyn.

After 24 hrs when the fever kept climbing and I was starting to

halucinate, Tobramycin was added. (BTW, I had already been on Cipro

500BID prior to the procedure and into the ilness). In less than 36

hrs. I had a temp. of 108 at which point I developed

amnesia..lol....I truly don't remember much. I spend 2 days in the

ICU. yesterday, both the blood and urine grew ESBL E.coli (Extended

Beta Lactamase), one of the deadliest and toughest to kill. The

short story is that now I have a PICC line (peripherally inserted

central catheters)

[http://www.cancerbackup.org.uk/Treatments/Chemotherapy/Linesports/PI

CCline] since there's no oral abx that can take care of it.

As for the biopsy results, the " unofficial " reading is that it's

cancer-free but shows significant degree of both chronic and acute

inflammation. Incidentally I didn't have any symptoms of any kind

relating to prostatitis. I guess it may end up being a happy ending

but I'll say that once I get the official report and have that PICC

line out of my arm in few weeks.

I hope my story NEVER discourage anyone from getting the biopsy and

this is not my intention. This kind of complication is very rare and

if I had to do it knowing this, I would do it again. I'm sharing my

experience in case it helps someone just as reading some replies

were helpful to me as well.

Incidentally, it was not only a blood and urinary infection, it was

also septic shock where the Hematocrit dropped from 47% to 38% and

platelets down to an abnormal 89k.

Again many thanks to all and best of luck.

>

> Greetings to all,

> 1st post other than a previous test which I still don't see, but

> here's the post anyway.

>

> My father died of metastatic PCa in 1990 within few months of

> diagnosis.

> I therefore decided to start monitoring my PSA. a bit of

background:

> very healthy (guy of course age 45, 6'1 (185cm), 185lb(84kg)

> married with a 4 and 7 yr old boys.

> My first PSA was on June 10/2006 at 4.59 My internist said my DRE

> was completely benign. Even though I had no symptoms of

prostatitis,

> A urologist friend suggested a recheck after a 4 wk Cipro course.

On

> July 19/2006 it dropped to 3.3 He suggested we watch in recheck in

> few months. At that point I added an incosistent GNC prostate

> formula supplement. I just rechecked again 2 days ago and the

number

> had climbed back up to 4 and a free of 10% (1st time I do the

free).

> The urologist -being a personal friend- said if I was in his

office

> he would probably recommend a biopsy, but if I'm not anxious, I

can

> wait and recheck it in 6 months. I'm tempted to go for the biopsy

> and my wife feels stronger that I should. I'm a bit " bummed out "

and

> overwhelmed specially being only 45 with little children. I don't

> feel like sharing this with any of my family or friends but

willing

> to share it here with people who have gone through similar

> experience. I probably have a 50-50% chance of having PCa given

the

> above scenario. I don't know if it's false reassurance but I'm

> taking the quick drop from 4.6 to 3.3 in 5 weeks following Abx

> course as a good sign but why the rise back to 4 in 5 month?. It

> probably really doesn't matter and I feel a biopsy is now in

order.

> Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in advance.

>

[Guest guest]

Terry

You may be right, but given the use of anti-biotics alongside the procedure the side effects should be limited to a low percentage.

The important thing is that this should be discussed with the urologist and Doc doing the biopsy.

Not only should they discuss it, but also what to do if the infection occurs. How help can be gained quickly!

I talked to a friend who had a biopsy at York this year. I said you would have had to slow down for a few days. The answer was no, I was fine, I carried on as normal!

Just shows that much of this is practitioner and patient variable.

B

RE: Re: Biopsy vs. watch?

Sorry to hear of your experience and hope you make a good recovery.

I believe however that this kind of experience is NOT as rare as you may have been told. I know that there are few studies that show serious side effects from biopsy, but some years ago a man who was wishing to institute a law suit because of his post biopsy problems was doing the rounds of the Lists and Forums looking for others who had bad experiences. It was surprising how many men there were, all of whom were told that their case was unusual and for that reason they hadn’t pursued the matter any further. Even on this List, this is the second bad experience in a couple of days – are there any others out there?

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 3+3=6: No treatment. June '04: TURP. Nov '06 PSA 31.4

My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of the world that no one knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is that he knows everything. Joyce Carey

..

[Guest guest]

Terry,

as always, thanks for the prompt response. I apologize if I missed

it, but can't find the post that lists the complications. If it's

handy, woulkd appreciate a link or post #.

> >

> > Greetings to all,

> > 1st post other than a previous test which I still don't see, but

> > here's the post anyway.

> >

> > My father died of metastatic PCa in 1990 within few months of

> > diagnosis.

> > I therefore decided to start monitoring my PSA. a bit of

> background:

> > very healthy (guy of course age 45, 6'1 (185cm), 185lb(84kg)

> > married with a 4 and 7 yr old boys.

> > My first PSA was on June 10/2006 at 4.59 My internist said my

DRE

> > was completely benign. Even though I had no symptoms of

> prostatitis,

> > A urologist friend suggested a recheck after a 4 wk Cipro

course.

> On

> > July 19/2006 it dropped to 3.3 He suggested we watch in recheck

in

> > few months. At that point I added an incosistent GNC prostate

> > formula supplement. I just rechecked again 2 days ago and the

> number

> > had climbed back up to 4 and a free of 10% (1st time I do the

> free).

> > The urologist -being a personal friend- said if I was in his

> office

> > he would probably recommend a biopsy, but if I'm not anxious, I

> can

> > wait and recheck it in 6 months. I'm tempted to go for the

biopsy

> > and my wife feels stronger that I should. I'm a bit " bummed out "

> and

> > overwhelmed specially being only 45 with little children. I

don't

> > feel like sharing this with any of my family or friends but

> willing

> > to share it here with people who have gone through similar

> > experience. I probably have a 50-50% chance of having PCa given

> the

> > above scenario. I don't know if it's false reassurance but I'm

> > taking the quick drop from 4.6 to 3.3 in 5 weeks following Abx

> > course as a good sign but why the rise back to 4 in 5 month?. It

> > probably really doesn't matter and I feel a biopsy is now in

> order.

> > Any input, personal experience or advice is appreciated in

advance.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Dear B,

the use of Abx does reduce the risk but let no one think it's a fool

proof guarantee. I took 3 doses of Cipro 500 prior the procedure and

the plan was to take it for 4 days but got sick before I got to the

4th dose.

When I started feeling the chills and aches, I was seeing patients

(yes, an MD) and KNEW for sure what I have. I drew the blood culture

and sent the urine culture from my office and went to the ER. I

doubt there would have been too many people as fortunate as I am to

recognize and act as fast YET I truly saw death in the ICU. I had 7

hrs that I recall nothing of. I was in septic shock and DIC. Again I

would still do it if I was in the same position, but my point was

for people not to think of it as going to check an ear infection.

This is a needle going through a terribly non-sterile anterior

rectal wall into a tiny gland with bad perfusion. When it happens,

it is NOT because I DID NOT discuss ir with my urologist or because

I was TOO late to pick up on the early signs of sepsis. Thanks for

your input.

>

> Terry

>

> You may be right, but given the use of anti-biotics alongside the

procedure the side effects should be limited to a low percentage.

>

> The important thing is that this should be discussed with the

urologist and Doc doing the biopsy.

>

> Not only should they discuss it, but also what to do if the

infection occurs. How help can be gained quickly!

>

> I talked to a friend who had a biopsy at York this year. I said

you would have had to slow down for a few days. The answer was no, I

was fine, I carried on as normal!

>

> Just shows that much of this is practitioner and patient variable.

>

> B

> RE: Re: Biopsy vs. watch?

>

>

>

> Sorry to hear of your experience and hope you make a good

recovery.

>

>

>

> I believe however that this kind of experience is NOT as rare

as you may have been told. I know that there are few studies that

show serious side effects from biopsy, but some years ago a man who

was wishing to institute a law suit because of his post biopsy

problems was doing the rounds of the Lists and Forums looking for

others who had bad experiences. It was surprising how many men there

were, all of whom were told that their case was unusual and for that

reason they hadn't pursued the matter any further. Even on this

List, this is the second bad experience in a couple of days - are

there any others out there?

>

>

>

>

>

> All the best

>

>

>

> Terry Herbert

>

> in Melbourne Australia

>

> Diagnosed '96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 3+3=6: No

treatment. June '04: TURP. Nov '06 PSA 31.4

>

> My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

>

> It is a tragedy of the world that no one knows what he doesn't

know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is that he knows

everything. Joyce Carey

>

>

>

> Recent Activity

> a.. 13New Members

> Visit Your Group

>

[Guest guest]

I didn’t give a copy of any study

or URL on side effects of biopsy, but here is one from my files:

Risks attached to prostate biopsy

addressed Urology LONDON By health-newswire.com reporters

Increased prostate cancer screening has

led to an increase in the number of men who develop post-biopsy complications

and specific prevention strategies may need emplacing, particularly for

post-biopsy infections, say US

researchers. The survey of all prostate biopsies carried out in Olmsted County, Minnesota,

examined how the rate of complications had changed since the use of the

Prostate-Specific Antigen (PSA) test had become routine.

The risk of a biopsy leading to

complications remained relatively constant - at around 17 per cent - between

1980 and 1997, which is lower than that reported by previous studies using

questionnaires rather than examining medical records. The prevalence of

complications in the population, however, increased more than twofold over the

same period. Dr Rosebud and colleagues from the Mayo Clinic in Rochester believe that

the increase was probably due to the concurrent 170 per cent rise in the number

of biopsies performed with the advent of PSA screening. " Improvement in

biopsy techniques, use of the smaller 18-gauge needle and the automated Biopty

gun may have contributed to these declines in post-biopsy complications

observed in our study, " wrote the researchers.

The most common complications resulting

from prostate biopsies are haematuria, rectal bleeding, infection and acute

urinary retention. The study also found that patients who had reported

urogenital infections in the six weeks preceding the biopsy had 5.5-fold

increased risk of post-biopsy infection. Post-biopsy infection can be

potentially life threatening because of the risk of septicaemia and septic

shock. The researchers, therefore, suggest that precautions are brought in to

protect such patients - for example, giving prophylactic antibiotics for a

longer period, the use of cleansing enemas before biopsies or delaying surgery.

Reference: et al, Urology

2002;59:79-84

All the best

Terry Herbert

in Melbourne Australia

Diagnosed ‘96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason

3+3=6: No treatment. June '04: TURP. Nov '06 PSA 31.4

My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

It is a tragedy of the world that no one

knows what he doesn’t know, and the less a man knows, the more sure he is

that he knows everything. Joyce Carey

From:

ProstateCancerSupport [mailto:ProstateCancerSupport ]

On Behalf Of bored_cops

Sent: Wednesday, 27 December 2006

12:47 PM

To:

ProstateCancerSupport

Subject:

Re: Biopsy vs. watch?

Terry,

as always, thanks for the prompt response. I apologize if I missed

it, but can't find the post that lists the complications. If it's

handy, woulkd appreciate a link or post #.

>

> Sorry to hear of your experience and hope you make a good recovery.

>

>

>

> I believe however that this kind of experience is NOT as rare as

you may

> have been told. I know that there are few studies that show

serious side

> effects from biopsy, but some years ago a man who was wishing to

institute a

> law suit because of his post biopsy problems was doing the rounds

of the

> Lists and Forums looking for others who had bad experiences. It was

> surprising how many men there were, all of whom were told that

their case

> was unusual and for that reason they hadn't pursued the matter any

further.

> Even on this List, this is the second bad experience in a couple

of days -

> are there any others out there?

>

>

>

>

>

> All the best

>

>

>

> Terry Herbert

>

> in Melbourne Australia

>

> Diagnosed '96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 3+3=6: No

treatment. June

> '04: TURP. Nov '06 PSA 31.4

>

> My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

>

> It is a tragedy of the world that no one knows what he doesn't

know, and the

> less a man knows, the more sure he is that he knows everything.

Joyce

> Carey

>

[Guest guest]

Terry,

great info. Close to what I had come to know. There are more recent

studies that claim post Bx infection of less than 1% !!

I forgot to state, even though enemas have not proven to reduce the

risk, I did use it before the procedure.

2 different Infectious Disease specialist came to see me. I asked

them each separately how often they get consulted on this. The older

lady said about once per year! the younger guy said I was his

first I probably should get the opinion of a 80 yr old ID

expert

> >

> > Sorry to hear of your experience and hope you make a good

recovery.

> >

> >

> >

> > I believe however that this kind of experience is NOT as rare as

> you may

> > have been told. I know that there are few studies that show

> serious side

> > effects from biopsy, but some years ago a man who was wishing to

> institute a

> > law suit because of his post biopsy problems was doing the

rounds

> of the

> > Lists and Forums looking for others who had bad experiences. It

was

> > surprising how many men there were, all of whom were told that

> their case

> > was unusual and for that reason they hadn't pursued the matter

any

> further.

> > Even on this List, this is the second bad experience in a couple

> of days -

> > are there any others out there?

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > All the best

> >

> >

> >

> > Terry Herbert

> >

> > in Melbourne Australia

> >

> > Diagnosed '96: Age 54: Stage T2b: PSA 7.2: Gleason 3+3=6: No

> treatment. June

> > '04: TURP. Nov '06 PSA 31.4

> >

> > My site is at www.prostatecancerwatchfulwaiting.co.za

> >

> > It is a tragedy of the world that no one knows what he doesn't

> know, and the

> > less a man knows, the more sure he is that he knows everything.

> Joyce

> > Carey

> >

>