Re: Digest Number 552/Reply () & An Artical I Saw On Water.....

[Guest guest]

Hi , I appreciate you coming out of

" lurking " status to reply to me....that means

alot. You touch on many good and firmiliar

things in your post. You are right you are VERY

lucky that the meds you took worked for you. I

wasn't so lucky. I don't think I tried Paxil,

(hard to remember them all), but it is in the

same " family " of ones that I have tried, and I

seem to have no luck with them. I'm not saying I

went, tired a little something, and quit. This

was like 5yrs or so of therapy and different

meds. Just didn't help, so I finally gave up. I

covered alot of this in some replies I just sent

before I read this, so I figure you will see them

before this, and that will cover alot.

I'm really glad to hear that you are doing so

much better though, I hate for anyone to have to

suffer with this illness.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<

Message: 9

Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:56:48 -0400

From: " & Dan Daoust "

Subject: Re: Feeling Left Out/ Lurking/ Physical

Ills/ & DEPRESSION.....

Hi ac, I have been with this group for about 6

months now and rarely post. Im a big time lurker.

But your post screams at me to answer as I can

totally relate to what your going through as I

have

been there. I too at one time was severely

depressed. With the depression comes the weight

gain

because all you want to do when your depressed is

sleep. You have absolutely no energy. Taking a

shower, combing your hair and even getting

dressed

is a big effort. You don't give a shit about

anything let alone yourself so you don't even try

to

do what is healthy to start loosing the weight.

What was a lifesaver for me was Paxil. I was

lucky

that this medication worked for me. I have been

on it now for 6 yrs. When it started to work, it

gave me a complete new lease on life. I conquered

my extreme shyness, got my sense of humour back,

didn't take life so dark and serious anymore, and

had enough energy for 2! It helped me get of my

ass and do fun things that helped me to start

loosing weight. With this new self appreciation,

came

pride in myself to get myself eating properly and

be the best I could be for me. So to get to the

point of all this, I think you must get to a

doctor pronto and get this depression treated

ASAP,

find something that works for you and then you

can

concentrate on getting your body healthy. Without

a healthy mind, you cannot get a healthy body.

Sorry this was so long, .

********************************************************

I saw this artical on AOL when I signed on

and since no one else mentioned it thought I

would share it.....kind of interesting. Don't

know what I really think about it, but it's

" water " for thought. LOL

By LAURAN NEERGAARD

..c The Associated Press

WASHINGTON (Aug. 19) - ``Drink at least eight

glasses of water a day'' is an adage some

obsessively follow, judging by the people sucking

on water bottles at every street corner - but the

need for so much water may be a myth.

Fear that once you're thirsty you're already

dehydrated? For many of us, another myth.

Caffeinated drinks don't count because they

dehydrate? Probably wrong, too.

So says a scientist who undertook an exhaustive

hunt for evidence backing all this water advice

and came up mostly, well, dry. Now the group that

sets the nation's nutrition standards is studying

the issue, too, to see if it's time to declare a

daily fluid level needed for good health - and

how much leaves you waterlogged.

Until then, ``obey your thirst'' is good advice,

says Dr. Heinz Valtin, professor emeritus at

Dartmouth Medical School, whose review of the

eight-glass theory appears in this month's

American Journal of Physiology.

It's about time for all the attention, says

Pennsylvania State University nutritionist

Barbara Rolls, a well-known expert on thirst.

``There's so much confusion out there.''

Much of it centers on where you should get your

daily water.

``There's this conception it can only come out of

a bottle,'' and that's wrong, notes a Trumbo

of the Institute of Medicine's Food and Nutrition

Board, which hopes to decide by March whether to

issue the first official water-intake

recommendation.

In fact, people absorb much water from the food

they eat. Fruits and vegetables are 80 to 95

percent water; meats contain a fair amount; even

dry bread and cheese are about 35 percent water,

says Rolls. That's in addition to juices, milk

and other beverages.

And many of us drink when we don't really need

to, spurred by marketing, salty foods and dry

environments, Rolls says.

``For most of us, that's not going to matter -

you're just going to need to go to the bathroom

more,'' she says.

But for people with certain medical conditions,

chugging too much can be harmful, sometimes

fatal, Valtin warns. Even healthy people - such

as teenagers taking the party drug Ecstasy, which

induces abnormal thirst - can occasionally drink

too much. So-called water intoxication dilutes

sodium in the blood until the body can't function

properly.

Conversely, no one disputes that getting enough

water is crucial. Indeed, the elderly often have

a diminished sensation of thirst and can become

dangerously dehydrated without realizing it.

People with kidney stones, for example, require

lots of water, as does anyone doing strenuous

exercise.

But the question remains: How much water does the

typical, mostly sedentary American truly need?

And what's the origin of the theory, heavily

promoted by water sellers and various nutrition

groups, that the magic number is at least 64

ounces?

Valtin, who has spent 40 years researching how

the body maintains a healthy fluid balance,

determined the advice probably stems from muddled

interpretation of a 1945 Food and Nutrition Board

report. That report said the body needs about 1

milliliter of water for each calorie consumed -

almost 8 cups for a typical 2,000-calorie diet -

but that ``most of this quantity is contained in

prepared foods.''

That language somehow has morphed into ``at

least'' 64 ounces daily, Valtin says. (One Web

site's ``hydration calculator'' even recommends a

startling 125 ounces for a 250-pound couch

potato.) And aside from the American Dietetic

Association's advice, few of the ``drink more

water'' campaigns targeted to consumers mention

how much comes from food.

Valtin couldn't find any research proving the

average person needs to drink a full 64 ounces of

water daily.

Also, contrary to popular opinion, he cites a

University of Nebraska study that found coffee,

tea and sodas are hydrating for people used to

caffeine and thus should count toward their daily

fluid total.

Other myths:

That thirst means you're already dehydrated. That

can be true of the elderly, and studies of

marathon runners and military recruits in

training have found that some focus so intently

on strenuous exercise that they block thirst

sensations until they're in trouble. But Rolls

did hourly hydration tests to prove that drinking

when thirsty is good advice for the rest of us.

That water blocks dieters' hunger. Studies show

water with food can help you feel full faster,

but that just drinking water between meals has

little effect, Rolls says.

So how much do we need? Until the Institute of

Medicine sets a level, ``if people obey their

thirst and they are producing urine of a normal

yellow color, that's a safe sign,'' Valtin

concludes.

08/19/02 16:15 EDT

Copyright 2002 The Associated Press. The

information contained in the AP news report may

not be published, broadcast, rewritten or

otherwise distributed without the prior written

authority of The Associated Press. All active

hyperlinks have been inserted by AOL.

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

BE CAREFUL WITH PAXIL --- it can have life long side effects - do a

search on it!!!

Ang

> Hi , I appreciate you coming out of

> " lurking " status to reply to me....that means

> alot. You touch on many good and firmiliar

> things in your post. You are right you are VERY

> lucky that the meds you took worked for you. I

> wasn't so lucky. I don't think I tried Paxil,

> (hard to remember them all), but it is in the

> same " family " of ones that I have tried, and I

> seem to have no luck with them. I'm not saying I

> went, tired a little something, and quit. This

> was like 5yrs or so of therapy and different

> meds. Just didn't help, so I finally gave up. I

> covered alot of this in some replies I just sent

> before I read this, so I figure you will see them

> before this, and that will cover alot.

> I'm really glad to hear that you are doing so

> much better though, I hate for anyone to have to

> suffer with this illness.

>

> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<

> Message: 9

> Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:56:48 -0400

> From: " & Dan Daoust "

> <pitster@p...>

> Subject: Re: Feeling Left Out/ Lurking/ Physical

> Ills/ & DEPRESSION.....

>

> Hi ac, I have been with this group for about 6

> months now and rarely post. Im a big time lurker.

>

> But your post screams at me to answer as I can

> totally relate to what your going through as I

> have

> been there. I too at one time was severely

> depressed. With the depression comes the weight

> gain

> because all you want to do when your depressed is

>

> sleep. You have absolutely no energy. Taking a

> shower, combing your hair and even getting

> dressed

> is a big effort. You don't give a shit about

> anything let alone yourself so you don't even try

> to

> do what is healthy to start loosing the weight.

> What was a lifesaver for me was Paxil. I was

> lucky

> that this medication worked for me. I have been

> on it now for 6 yrs. When it started to work, it

> gave me a complete new lease on life. I conquered

>

> my extreme shyness, got my sense of humour back,

> didn't take life so dark and serious anymore, and

>

> had enough energy for 2! It helped me get of my

> ass and do fun things that helped me to start

> loosing weight. With this new self appreciation,

> came

> pride in myself to get myself eating properly and

>

> be the best I could be for me. So to get to the

> point of all this, I think you must get to a

> doctor pronto and get this depression treated

> ASAP,

> find something that works for you and then you

> can

> concentrate on getting your body healthy. Without

>

> a healthy mind, you cannot get a healthy body.

> Sorry this was so long, .

> ********************************************************

> I saw this artical on AOL when I signed on

> and since no one else mentioned it thought I

> would share it.....kind of interesting. Don't

> know what I really think about it, but it's

> " water " for thought. LOL

>

>

> By LAURAN NEERGAARD

> .c The Associated Press

>

> WASHINGTON (Aug. 19) - ``Drink at least eight

> glasses of water a day'' is an adage some

> obsessively follow, judging by the people sucking

> on water bottles at every street corner - but the

> need for so much water may be a myth.

>

> Fear that once you're thirsty you're already

> dehydrated? For many of us, another myth.

> Caffeinated drinks don't count because they

> dehydrate? Probably wrong, too.

>

> So says a scientist who undertook an exhaustive

> hunt for evidence backing all this water advice

> and came up mostly, well, dry. Now the group that

> sets the nation's nutrition standards is studying

> the issue, too, to see if it's time to declare a

> daily fluid level needed for good health - and

> how much leaves you waterlogged.

>

> Until then, ``obey your thirst'' is good advice,

> says Dr. Heinz Valtin, professor emeritus at

> Dartmouth Medical School, whose review of the

> eight-glass theory appears in this month's

> American Journal of Physiology.

>

> It's about time for all the attention, says

> Pennsylvania State University nutritionist

> Barbara Rolls, a well-known expert on thirst.

> ``There's so much confusion out there.''

>

> Much of it centers on where you should get your

> daily water.

>

> ``There's this conception it can only come out of

> a bottle,'' and that's wrong, notes a Trumbo

> of the Institute of Medicine's Food and Nutrition

> Board, which hopes to decide by March whether to

> issue the first official water-intake

> recommendation.

>

> In fact, people absorb much water from the food

> they eat. Fruits and vegetables are 80 to 95

> percent water; meats contain a fair amount; even

> dry bread and cheese are about 35 percent water,

> says Rolls. That's in addition to juices, milk

> and other beverages.

>

> And many of us drink when we don't really need

> to, spurred by marketing, salty foods and dry

> environments, Rolls says.

>

> ``For most of us, that's not going to matter -

> you're just going to need to go to the bathroom

> more,'' she says.

>

> But for people with certain medical conditions,

> chugging too much can be harmful, sometimes

> fatal, Valtin warns. Even healthy people - such

> as teenagers taking the party drug Ecstasy, which

> induces abnormal thirst - can occasionally drink

> too much. So-called water intoxication dilutes

> sodium in the blood until the body can't function

> properly.

>

> Conversely, no one disputes that getting enough

> water is crucial. Indeed, the elderly often have

> a diminished sensation of thirst and can become

> dangerously dehydrated without realizing it.

> People with kidney stones, for example, require

> lots of water, as does anyone doing strenuous

> exercise.

>

> But the question remains: How much water does the

> typical, mostly sedentary American truly need?

> And what's the origin of the theory, heavily

> promoted by water sellers and various nutrition

> groups, that the magic number is at least 64

> ounces?

>

> Valtin, who has spent 40 years researching how

> the body maintains a healthy fluid balance,

> determined the advice probably stems from muddled

> interpretation of a 1945 Food and Nutrition Board

> report. That report said the body needs about 1

> milliliter of water for each calorie consumed -

> almost 8 cups for a typical 2,000-calorie diet -

> but that ``most of this quantity is contained in

> prepared foods.''

>

> That language somehow has morphed into ``at

> least'' 64 ounces daily, Valtin says. (One Web

> site's ``hydration calculator'' even recommends a

> startling 125 ounces for a 250-pound couch

> potato.) And aside from the American Dietetic

> Association's advice, few of the ``drink more

> water'' campaigns targeted to consumers mention

> how much comes from food.

>

> Valtin couldn't find any research proving the

> average person needs to drink a full 64 ounces of

> water daily.

>

> Also, contrary to popular opinion, he cites a

> University of Nebraska study that found coffee,

> tea and sodas are hydrating for people used to

> caffeine and thus should count toward their daily

> fluid total.

>

> Other myths:

>

> That thirst means you're already dehydrated. That

> can be true of the elderly, and studies of

> marathon runners and military recruits in

> training have found that some focus so intently

> on strenuous exercise that they block thirst

> sensations until they're in trouble. But Rolls

> did hourly hydration tests to prove that drinking

> when thirsty is good advice for the rest of us.

>

> That water blocks dieters' hunger. Studies show

> water with food can help you feel full faster,

> but that just drinking water between meals has

> little effect, Rolls says.

>

> So how much do we need? Until the Institute of

> Medicine sets a level, ``if people obey their

> thirst and they are producing urine of a normal

> yellow color, that's a safe sign,'' Valtin

> concludes.

>

> 08/19/02 16:15 EDT

>

> Copyright 2002 The Associated Press. The

> information contained in the AP news report may

> not be published, broadcast, rewritten or

> otherwise distributed without the prior written

> authority of The Associated Press. All active

> hyperlinks have been inserted by AOL.

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Ang are you serious?? My friend takes it daily, and she CAN'T give

it up or she would go back to her old bad self. She wouldn't leave

the house, she would have panic attacks. OHHHHH and heres something,

my other friend took half a pill daily just after she had her baby

because of PPD, and she was breast feeding!!!!! Her consultant said

it was the only pill that was safe for her to take while she was

breast feeding.

TTYL

> BE CAREFUL WITH PAXIL --- it can have life long side effects - do

a

> search on it!!!

> Ang

>

>

> > Hi , I appreciate you coming out of

> > " lurking " status to reply to me....that means

> > alot. You touch on many good and firmiliar

> > things in your post. You are right you are VERY

> > lucky that the meds you took worked for you. I

> > wasn't so lucky. I don't think I tried Paxil,

> > (hard to remember them all), but it is in the

> > same " family " of ones that I have tried, and I

> > seem to have no luck with them. I'm not saying I

> > went, tired a little something, and quit. This

> > was like 5yrs or so of therapy and different

> > meds. Just didn't help, so I finally gave up. I

> > covered alot of this in some replies I just sent

> > before I read this, so I figure you will see them

> > before this, and that will cover alot.

> > I'm really glad to hear that you are doing so

> > much better though, I hate for anyone to have to

> > suffer with this illness.

> >

> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<

> > Message: 9

> > Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:56:48 -0400

> > From: " & Dan Daoust "

> > <pitster@p...>

> > Subject: Re: Feeling Left Out/ Lurking/ Physical

> > Ills/ & DEPRESSION.....

> >

> > Hi ac, I have been with this group for about 6

> > months now and rarely post. Im a big time lurker.

> >

> > But your post screams at me to answer as I can

> > totally relate to what your going through as I

> > have

> > been there. I too at one time was severely

> > depressed. With the depression comes the weight

> > gain

> > because all you want to do when your depressed is

> >

> > sleep. You have absolutely no energy. Taking a

> > shower, combing your hair and even getting

> > dressed

> > is a big effort. You don't give a shit about

> > anything let alone yourself so you don't even try

> > to

> > do what is healthy to start loosing the weight.

> > What was a lifesaver for me was Paxil. I was

> > lucky

> > that this medication worked for me. I have been

> > on it now for 6 yrs. When it started to work, it

> > gave me a complete new lease on life. I conquered

> >

> > my extreme shyness, got my sense of humour back,

> > didn't take life so dark and serious anymore, and

> >

> > had enough energy for 2! It helped me get of my

> > ass and do fun things that helped me to start

> > loosing weight. With this new self appreciation,

> > came

> > pride in myself to get myself eating properly and

> >

> > be the best I could be for me. So to get to the

> > point of all this, I think you must get to a

> > doctor pronto and get this depression treated

> > ASAP,

> > find something that works for you and then you

> > can

> > concentrate on getting your body healthy. Without

> >

> > a healthy mind, you cannot get a healthy body.

> > Sorry this was so long, .

> > ********************************************************

> > I saw this artical on AOL when I signed on

> > and since no one else mentioned it thought I

> > would share it.....kind of interesting. Don't

> > know what I really think about it, but it's

> > " water " for thought. LOL

> >

> >

> > By LAURAN NEERGAARD

> > .c The Associated Press

> >

> > WASHINGTON (Aug. 19) - ``Drink at least eight

> > glasses of water a day'' is an adage some

> > obsessively follow, judging by the people sucking

> > on water bottles at every street corner - but the

> > need for so much water may be a myth.

> >

> > Fear that once you're thirsty you're already

> > dehydrated? For many of us, another myth.

> > Caffeinated drinks don't count because they

> > dehydrate? Probably wrong, too.

> >

> > So says a scientist who undertook an exhaustive

> > hunt for evidence backing all this water advice

> > and came up mostly, well, dry. Now the group that

> > sets the nation's nutrition standards is studying

> > the issue, too, to see if it's time to declare a

> > daily fluid level needed for good health - and

> > how much leaves you waterlogged.

> >

> > Until then, ``obey your thirst'' is good advice,

> > says Dr. Heinz Valtin, professor emeritus at

> > Dartmouth Medical School, whose review of the

> > eight-glass theory appears in this month's

> > American Journal of Physiology.

> >

> > It's about time for all the attention, says

> > Pennsylvania State University nutritionist

> > Barbara Rolls, a well-known expert on thirst.

> > ``There's so much confusion out there.''

> >

> > Much of it centers on where you should get your

> > daily water.

> >

> > ``There's this conception it can only come out of

> > a bottle,'' and that's wrong, notes a Trumbo

> > of the Institute of Medicine's Food and Nutrition

> > Board, which hopes to decide by March whether to

> > issue the first official water-intake

> > recommendation.

> >

> > In fact, people absorb much water from the food

> > they eat. Fruits and vegetables are 80 to 95

> > percent water; meats contain a fair amount; even

> > dry bread and cheese are about 35 percent water,

> > says Rolls. That's in addition to juices, milk

> > and other beverages.

> >

> > And many of us drink when we don't really need

> > to, spurred by marketing, salty foods and dry

> > environments, Rolls says.

> >

> > ``For most of us, that's not going to matter -

> > you're just going to need to go to the bathroom

> > more,'' she says.

> >

> > But for people with certain medical conditions,

> > chugging too much can be harmful, sometimes

> > fatal, Valtin warns. Even healthy people - such

> > as teenagers taking the party drug Ecstasy, which

> > induces abnormal thirst - can occasionally drink

> > too much. So-called water intoxication dilutes

> > sodium in the blood until the body can't function

> > properly.

> >

> > Conversely, no one disputes that getting enough

> > water is crucial. Indeed, the elderly often have

> > a diminished sensation of thirst and can become

> > dangerously dehydrated without realizing it.

> > People with kidney stones, for example, require

> > lots of water, as does anyone doing strenuous

> > exercise.

> >

> > But the question remains: How much water does the

> > typical, mostly sedentary American truly need?

> > And what's the origin of the theory, heavily

> > promoted by water sellers and various nutrition

> > groups, that the magic number is at least 64

> > ounces?

> >

> > Valtin, who has spent 40 years researching how

> > the body maintains a healthy fluid balance,

> > determined the advice probably stems from muddled

> > interpretation of a 1945 Food and Nutrition Board

> > report. That report said the body needs about 1

> > milliliter of water for each calorie consumed -

> > almost 8 cups for a typical 2,000-calorie diet -

> > but that ``most of this quantity is contained in

> > prepared foods.''

> >

> > That language somehow has morphed into ``at

> > least'' 64 ounces daily, Valtin says. (One Web

> > site's ``hydration calculator'' even recommends a

> > startling 125 ounces for a 250-pound couch

> > potato.) And aside from the American Dietetic

> > Association's advice, few of the ``drink more

> > water'' campaigns targeted to consumers mention

> > how much comes from food.

> >

> > Valtin couldn't find any research proving the

> > average person needs to drink a full 64 ounces of

> > water daily.

> >

> > Also, contrary to popular opinion, he cites a

> > University of Nebraska study that found coffee,

> > tea and sodas are hydrating for people used to

> > caffeine and thus should count toward their daily

> > fluid total.

> >

> > Other myths:

> >

> > That thirst means you're already dehydrated. That

> > can be true of the elderly, and studies of

> > marathon runners and military recruits in

> > training have found that some focus so intently

> > on strenuous exercise that they block thirst

> > sensations until they're in trouble. But Rolls

> > did hourly hydration tests to prove that drinking

> > when thirsty is good advice for the rest of us.

> >

> > That water blocks dieters' hunger. Studies show

> > water with food can help you feel full faster,

> > but that just drinking water between meals has

> > little effect, Rolls says.

> >

> > So how much do we need? Until the Institute of

> > Medicine sets a level, ``if people obey their

> > thirst and they are producing urine of a normal

> > yellow color, that's a safe sign,'' Valtin

> > concludes.

> >

> > 08/19/02 16:15 EDT

> >

> > Copyright 2002 The Associated Press. The

> > information contained in the AP news report may

> > not be published, broadcast, rewritten or

> > otherwise distributed without the prior written

> > authority of The Associated Press. All active

> > hyperlinks have been inserted by AOL.

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

Well, my son, the one who is almost 15 - he can't remember squat. I

meen I ask him to go out on the portch and get a cup off the table

and he vanishes. I go looking for him wanting to know why, again, he

didn't do what I asked him (usually it takes days to get him to do

something and then only if I stand there and continuously tell him

what the next step is or he'll do it wrong.) Well, he went out the

door, and before he picked up the cup her forgot what he was doing

and started doing somthing else.

I talked to the doctor (and lawyer) about this - and he wasn't

suprised at all...said it's a big problem with paxil, ritalin and

adderall, and that once the damage is done - there isn't much they

can do about it.

Ang

> > BE CAREFUL WITH PAXIL --- it can have life long side effects - do

> a

> > search on it!!!

> > Ang

> >

> >

> > > Hi , I appreciate you coming out of

> > > " lurking " status to reply to me....that means

> > > alot. You touch on many good and firmiliar

> > > things in your post. You are right you are VERY

> > > lucky that the meds you took worked for you. I

> > > wasn't so lucky. I don't think I tried Paxil,

> > > (hard to remember them all), but it is in the

> > > same " family " of ones that I have tried, and I

> > > seem to have no luck with them. I'm not saying I

> > > went, tired a little something, and quit. This

> > > was like 5yrs or so of therapy and different

> > > meds. Just didn't help, so I finally gave up. I

> > > covered alot of this in some replies I just sent

> > > before I read this, so I figure you will see them

> > > before this, and that will cover alot.

> > > I'm really glad to hear that you are doing so

> > > much better though, I hate for anyone to have to

> > > suffer with this illness.

> > >

> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<

> > > Message: 9

> > > Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:56:48 -0400

> > > From: " & Dan Daoust "

> > > <pitster@p...>

> > > Subject: Re: Feeling Left Out/ Lurking/ Physical

> > > Ills/ & DEPRESSION.....

> > >

> > > Hi ac, I have been with this group for about 6

> > > months now and rarely post. Im a big time lurker.

> > >

> > > But your post screams at me to answer as I can

> > > totally relate to what your going through as I

> > > have

> > > been there. I too at one time was severely

> > > depressed. With the depression comes the weight

> > > gain

> > > because all you want to do when your depressed is

> > >

> > > sleep. You have absolutely no energy. Taking a

> > > shower, combing your hair and even getting

> > > dressed

> > > is a big effort. You don't give a shit about

> > > anything let alone yourself so you don't even try

> > > to

> > > do what is healthy to start loosing the weight.

> > > What was a lifesaver for me was Paxil. I was

> > > lucky

> > > that this medication worked for me. I have been

> > > on it now for 6 yrs. When it started to work, it

> > > gave me a complete new lease on life. I conquered

> > >

> > > my extreme shyness, got my sense of humour back,

> > > didn't take life so dark and serious anymore, and

> > >

> > > had enough energy for 2! It helped me get of my

> > > ass and do fun things that helped me to start

> > > loosing weight. With this new self appreciation,

> > > came

> > > pride in myself to get myself eating properly and

> > >

> > > be the best I could be for me. So to get to the

> > > point of all this, I think you must get to a

> > > doctor pronto and get this depression treated

> > > ASAP,

> > > find something that works for you and then you

> > > can

> > > concentrate on getting your body healthy. Without

> > >

> > > a healthy mind, you cannot get a healthy body.

> > > Sorry this was so long, .

> > > ********************************************************

> > > I saw this artical on AOL when I signed on

> > > and since no one else mentioned it thought I

> > > would share it.....kind of interesting. Don't

> > > know what I really think about it, but it's

> > > " water " for thought. LOL

> > >

> > >

> > > By LAURAN NEERGAARD

> > > .c The Associated Press

> > >

> > > WASHINGTON (Aug. 19) - ``Drink at least eight

> > > glasses of water a day'' is an adage some

> > > obsessively follow, judging by the people sucking

> > > on water bottles at every street corner - but the

> > > need for so much water may be a myth.

> > >

> > > Fear that once you're thirsty you're already

> > > dehydrated? For many of us, another myth.

> > > Caffeinated drinks don't count because they

> > > dehydrate? Probably wrong, too.

> > >

> > > So says a scientist who undertook an exhaustive

> > > hunt for evidence backing all this water advice

> > > and came up mostly, well, dry. Now the group that

> > > sets the nation's nutrition standards is studying

> > > the issue, too, to see if it's time to declare a

> > > daily fluid level needed for good health - and

> > > how much leaves you waterlogged.

> > >

> > > Until then, ``obey your thirst'' is good advice,

> > > says Dr. Heinz Valtin, professor emeritus at

> > > Dartmouth Medical School, whose review of the

> > > eight-glass theory appears in this month's

> > > American Journal of Physiology.

> > >

> > > It's about time for all the attention, says

> > > Pennsylvania State University nutritionist

> > > Barbara Rolls, a well-known expert on thirst.

> > > ``There's so much confusion out there.''

> > >

> > > Much of it centers on where you should get your

> > > daily water.

> > >

> > > ``There's this conception it can only come out of

> > > a bottle,'' and that's wrong, notes a Trumbo

> > > of the Institute of Medicine's Food and Nutrition

> > > Board, which hopes to decide by March whether to

> > > issue the first official water-intake

> > > recommendation.

> > >

> > > In fact, people absorb much water from the food

> > > they eat. Fruits and vegetables are 80 to 95

> > > percent water; meats contain a fair amount; even

> > > dry bread and cheese are about 35 percent water,

> > > says Rolls. That's in addition to juices, milk

> > > and other beverages.

> > >

> > > And many of us drink when we don't really need

> > > to, spurred by marketing, salty foods and dry

> > > environments, Rolls says.

> > >

> > > ``For most of us, that's not going to matter -

> > > you're just going to need to go to the bathroom

> > > more,'' she says.

> > >

> > > But for people with certain medical conditions,

> > > chugging too much can be harmful, sometimes

> > > fatal, Valtin warns. Even healthy people - such

> > > as teenagers taking the party drug Ecstasy, which

> > > induces abnormal thirst - can occasionally drink

> > > too much. So-called water intoxication dilutes

> > > sodium in the blood until the body can't function

> > > properly.

> > >

> > > Conversely, no one disputes that getting enough

> > > water is crucial. Indeed, the elderly often have

> > > a diminished sensation of thirst and can become

> > > dangerously dehydrated without realizing it.

> > > People with kidney stones, for example, require

> > > lots of water, as does anyone doing strenuous

> > > exercise.

> > >

> > > But the question remains: How much water does the

> > > typical, mostly sedentary American truly need?

> > > And what's the origin of the theory, heavily

> > > promoted by water sellers and various nutrition

> > > groups, that the magic number is at least 64

> > > ounces?

> > >

> > > Valtin, who has spent 40 years researching how

> > > the body maintains a healthy fluid balance,

> > > determined the advice probably stems from muddled

> > > interpretation of a 1945 Food and Nutrition Board

> > > report. That report said the body needs about 1

> > > milliliter of water for each calorie consumed -

> > > almost 8 cups for a typical 2,000-calorie diet -

> > > but that ``most of this quantity is contained in

> > > prepared foods.''

> > >

> > > That language somehow has morphed into ``at

> > > least'' 64 ounces daily, Valtin says. (One Web

> > > site's ``hydration calculator'' even recommends a

> > > startling 125 ounces for a 250-pound couch

> > > potato.) And aside from the American Dietetic

> > > Association's advice, few of the ``drink more

> > > water'' campaigns targeted to consumers mention

> > > how much comes from food.

> > >

> > > Valtin couldn't find any research proving the

> > > average person needs to drink a full 64 ounces of

> > > water daily.

> > >

> > > Also, contrary to popular opinion, he cites a

> > > University of Nebraska study that found coffee,

> > > tea and sodas are hydrating for people used to

> > > caffeine and thus should count toward their daily

> > > fluid total.

> > >

> > > Other myths:

> > >

> > > That thirst means you're already dehydrated. That

> > > can be true of the elderly, and studies of

> > > marathon runners and military recruits in

> > > training have found that some focus so intently

> > > on strenuous exercise that they block thirst

> > > sensations until they're in trouble. But Rolls

> > > did hourly hydration tests to prove that drinking

> > > when thirsty is good advice for the rest of us.

> > >

> > > That water blocks dieters' hunger. Studies show

> > > water with food can help you feel full faster,

> > > but that just drinking water between meals has

> > > little effect, Rolls says.

> > >

> > > So how much do we need? Until the Institute of

> > > Medicine sets a level, ``if people obey their

> > > thirst and they are producing urine of a normal

> > > yellow color, that's a safe sign,'' Valtin

> > > concludes.

> > >

> > > 08/19/02 16:15 EDT

> > >

> > > Copyright 2002 The Associated Press. The

> > > information contained in the AP news report may

> > > not be published, broadcast, rewritten or

> > > otherwise distributed without the prior written

> > > authority of The Associated Press. All active

> > > hyperlinks have been inserted by AOL.

> > >

> > > __________________________________________________

> > >

[Guest guest]

Ang,

What can it do to you? I took it for 1 1/2 years. Coming off of it

was really bad though I almost couldn't do it. I had really bad head

tremmers and was so drained all the time I couldn't hardley get out

of bed. What else does it do? Just alittle freeked.

Michel

> BE CAREFUL WITH PAXIL --- it can have life long side effects - do a

> search on it!!!

> Ang

>

>

> > Hi , I appreciate you coming out of

> > " lurking " status to reply to me....that means

> > alot. You touch on many good and firmiliar

> > things in your post. You are right you are VERY

> > lucky that the meds you took worked for you. I

> > wasn't so lucky. I don't think I tried Paxil,

> > (hard to remember them all), but it is in the

> > same " family " of ones that I have tried, and I

> > seem to have no luck with them. I'm not saying I

> > went, tired a little something, and quit. This

> > was like 5yrs or so of therapy and different

> > meds. Just didn't help, so I finally gave up. I

> > covered alot of this in some replies I just sent

> > before I read this, so I figure you will see them

> > before this, and that will cover alot.

> > I'm really glad to hear that you are doing so

> > much better though, I hate for anyone to have to

> > suffer with this illness.

> >

> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<

> > Message: 9

> > Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 11:56:48 -0400

> > From: " & Dan Daoust "

> > <pitster@p...>

> > Subject: Re: Feeling Left Out/ Lurking/ Physical

> > Ills/ & DEPRESSION.....

> >

> > Hi ac, I have been with this group for about 6

> > months now and rarely post. Im a big time lurker.

> >

> > But your post screams at me to answer as I can

> > totally relate to what your going through as I

> > have

> > been there. I too at one time was severely

> > depressed. With the depression comes the weight

> > gain

> > because all you want to do when your depressed is

> >

> > sleep. You have absolutely no energy. Taking a

> > shower, combing your hair and even getting

> > dressed

> > is a big effort. You don't give a shit about

> > anything let alone yourself so you don't even try

> > to

> > do what is healthy to start loosing the weight.

> > What was a lifesaver for me was Paxil. I was

> > lucky

> > that this medication worked for me. I have been

> > on it now for 6 yrs. When it started to work, it

> > gave me a complete new lease on life. I conquered

> >

> > my extreme shyness, got my sense of humour back,

> > didn't take life so dark and serious anymore, and

> >

> > had enough energy for 2! It helped me get of my

> > ass and do fun things that helped me to start

> > loosing weight. With this new self appreciation,

> > came

> > pride in myself to get myself eating properly and

> >

> > be the best I could be for me. So to get to the

> > point of all this, I think you must get to a

> > doctor pronto and get this depression treated

> > ASAP,

> > find something that works for you and then you

> > can

> > concentrate on getting your body healthy. Without

> >

> > a healthy mind, you cannot get a healthy body.

> > Sorry this was so long, .

> > ********************************************************

> > I saw this artical on AOL when I signed on

> > and since no one else mentioned it thought I

> > would share it.....kind of interesting. Don't

> > know what I really think about it, but it's

> > " water " for thought. LOL

> >

> >

> > By LAURAN NEERGAARD

> > .c The Associated Press

> >

> > WASHINGTON (Aug. 19) - ``Drink at least eight

> > glasses of water a day'' is an adage some

> > obsessively follow, judging by the people sucking

> > on water bottles at every street corner - but the

> > need for so much water may be a myth.

> >

> > Fear that once you're thirsty you're already

> > dehydrated? For many of us, another myth.

> > Caffeinated drinks don't count because they

> > dehydrate? Probably wrong, too.

> >

> > So says a scientist who undertook an exhaustive

> > hunt for evidence backing all this water advice

> > and came up mostly, well, dry. Now the group that

> > sets the nation's nutrition standards is studying

> > the issue, too, to see if it's time to declare a

> > daily fluid level needed for good health - and

> > how much leaves you waterlogged.

> >

> > Until then, ``obey your thirst'' is good advice,

> > says Dr. Heinz Valtin, professor emeritus at

> > Dartmouth Medical School, whose review of the

> > eight-glass theory appears in this month's

> > American Journal of Physiology.

> >

> > It's about time for all the attention, says

> > Pennsylvania State University nutritionist

> > Barbara Rolls, a well-known expert on thirst.

> > ``There's so much confusion out there.''

> >

> > Much of it centers on where you should get your

> > daily water.

> >

> > ``There's this conception it can only come out of

> > a bottle,'' and that's wrong, notes a Trumbo

> > of the Institute of Medicine's Food and Nutrition

> > Board, which hopes to decide by March whether to

> > issue the first official water-intake

> > recommendation.

> >

> > In fact, people absorb much water from the food

> > they eat. Fruits and vegetables are 80 to 95

> > percent water; meats contain a fair amount; even

> > dry bread and cheese are about 35 percent water,

> > says Rolls. That's in addition to juices, milk

> > and other beverages.

> >

> > And many of us drink when we don't really need

> > to, spurred by marketing, salty foods and dry

> > environments, Rolls says.

> >

> > ``For most of us, that's not going to matter -

> > you're just going to need to go to the bathroom

> > more,'' she says.

> >

> > But for people with certain medical conditions,

> > chugging too much can be harmful, sometimes

> > fatal, Valtin warns. Even healthy people - such

> > as teenagers taking the party drug Ecstasy, which

> > induces abnormal thirst - can occasionally drink

> > too much. So-called water intoxication dilutes

> > sodium in the blood until the body can't function

> > properly.

> >

> > Conversely, no one disputes that getting enough

> > water is crucial. Indeed, the elderly often have

> > a diminished sensation of thirst and can become

> > dangerously dehydrated without realizing it.

> > People with kidney stones, for example, require

> > lots of water, as does anyone doing strenuous

> > exercise.

> >

> > But the question remains: How much water does the

> > typical, mostly sedentary American truly need?

> > And what's the origin of the theory, heavily

> > promoted by water sellers and various nutrition

> > groups, that the magic number is at least 64

> > ounces?

> >

> > Valtin, who has spent 40 years researching how

> > the body maintains a healthy fluid balance,

> > determined the advice probably stems from muddled

> > interpretation of a 1945 Food and Nutrition Board

> > report. That report said the body needs about 1

> > milliliter of water for each calorie consumed -

> > almost 8 cups for a typical 2,000-calorie diet -

> > but that ``most of this quantity is contained in

> > prepared foods.''

> >

> > That language somehow has morphed into ``at

> > least'' 64 ounces daily, Valtin says. (One Web

> > site's ``hydration calculator'' even recommends a

> > startling 125 ounces for a 250-pound couch

> > potato.) And aside from the American Dietetic

> > Association's advice, few of the ``drink more

> > water'' campaigns targeted to consumers mention

> > how much comes from food.

> >

> > Valtin couldn't find any research proving the

> > average person needs to drink a full 64 ounces of

> > water daily.

> >

> > Also, contrary to popular opinion, he cites a

> > University of Nebraska study that found coffee,

> > tea and sodas are hydrating for people used to

> > caffeine and thus should count toward their daily

> > fluid total.

> >

> > Other myths:

> >

> > That thirst means you're already dehydrated. That

> > can be true of the elderly, and studies of

> > marathon runners and military recruits in

> > training have found that some focus so intently

> > on strenuous exercise that they block thirst

> > sensations until they're in trouble. But Rolls

> > did hourly hydration tests to prove that drinking

> > when thirsty is good advice for the rest of us.

> >

> > That water blocks dieters' hunger. Studies show

> > water with food can help you feel full faster,

> > but that just drinking water between meals has

> > little effect, Rolls says.

> >

> > So how much do we need? Until the Institute of

> > Medicine sets a level, ``if people obey their

> > thirst and they are producing urine of a normal

> > yellow color, that's a safe sign,'' Valtin

> > concludes.

> >

> > 08/19/02 16:15 EDT

> >

> > Copyright 2002 The Associated Press. The

> > information contained in the AP news report may

> > not be published, broadcast, rewritten or

> > otherwise distributed without the prior written

> > authority of The Associated Press. All active

> > hyperlinks have been inserted by AOL.

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

Not to worry...If you don't have problems now - you're not going to

have any.

I don't know all the side effects as I haven't really studied up on

it --- but hang on a sec and I'll go look. Probly the basic 'rx hard

on the liver thing'.....but I was concerned with this memory problem

of my sons. It is deffinately noticable by nyone who is around him

even for a short period. It is bad enough that he can't go from one

room to the next and remember 1 task. My little one at 2 years old

could complte a list of task longer than the 14 year old.

It is something you and every one who knows you would definalty have

noticed while you were still taking the meds.

Hang on while I go check something....

whooow - lots, here goes...

(very few are long term/permenant...all of which you would have

already experianced and most likely recovered from)

Mind racing and unable to control thoughts and processes of the mind.

Panic attacks worsening.

Hot surges running through body.

Horrible nightmares.

Obsessive thoughts. (Going to lose it and kill somebody)

Just can't seem to feel any more.

Feeling like a zombie. Absolutely emotionless.

Physically numb. Could not even feel the water hit my body in the

shower.

Lost all taste of food.

Severe dizziness. Felt like going to pass out or lose control.

Sleeping with light on because of the fear.

Feel disconnected. Really drugged out most of the time.

Heart palpitations and tightness in the head.

Flashes of memories and images from the past. (Uncontrollable)

Drugs have taken personal identity away, made feel unable to function

like a normal human being.

Completely lost grip and hate to go out and be around people. Don't

even feel comfortable with family.

Feeling like it will never end.

Feeling foggy and drugged out.

Urge to jump out of a fast moving car.

Feeling like I need to take life to end all of this.

Extreme head pain.

More depressed than before starting SSRI's.

Not sure will ever be your old self again.

A feeling of unreality.

Convinced of having some rare and fatal disease.

Hormones go completely wild during menstruation. (Never happened

before SSRI usage)

fatigue and problem in hands (predominantly left)

which has become less tremors, more pain and slight stiffness and is

spreading up (left) arm and into shoulder.

Head and body seem to feel detached from each other.

Feeling like " in Hell. " Can't go to see doctor or to the hospital

because I am afraid they will prescribe more medication or put me in

the mental ward.

Bleeding from the nose, heavily.

Nausea

Feeling like electrical current is running up and down spine

Memory loss with apathy

In a fog, can't concentrate

Nipple discharge

Loss of sex drive

Manic/depressive episodes

Weight gain of over 40 pounds

(List of side effects from one individual since starting SSRI's) Mind

racing, nightmares, obsessive thoughts, can't " feel " anymore, zombie,

disconnected, memory flashes, hate to be around people, feeling like

it will never end, foggy, urge to jump out of fast moving car, more

depressed, not sure will ever be old self again, feeling of

unreality, numbness in pinky and ring finger on left hand and sever

chills.

Head jerking and muscle spasms

Numbness in genitals

Memory loss

Loss of sexual drive

Swelled penis

Sudden and excessive weight gain

Hating people, do not want to be around people anymore

Tremors, sudden jerky movements of muscles, extreme sensitivity to

sound

Out of control, divorced husband that was loved and now can't even

explain why. Hopeless

Suicidal

Inner restlessness

Can't focus, hard to read words

Worsening of acne

Falling asleep at random times and not even remembering it (people

telling the person this is happening)

Can hardly stand to look at anything anymore

Severe hot flashes while asleep

Difficult having an orgasm

Very aggressive dreams, dream of having battles with people from past

Severe mood changes, tremors in hands more hyperactive

Heavy sweating and electrical shocks that seem to come from within

the side of the head

Milky discharge from nipples and very hot flashes and sweating while

asleep

Can't seeeee comptur skrenn clearrlyyyy

Breast are getting larger, nipples harder and sticking out about 1 "

and swelling

Awake several nights of the week all night and have gained 30 pounds

in less than one year

Urge to drink excessively, never had this problem before. Feel like

in pure hell, manic one moment, deeply depressed the next, severe

headaches, sweating, nightmares, panic and fear

Feet stay cold and can't seem to get them warm

Have not had sex for over one year since starting Prozac

Need for increased dose for same symptom, depression and severe

cleaning compulsion are back and already at 100 mg daily of Prozac

I quit, doing crazy things. On the way to work stopped and got a

tattoo. Hate tattoos!

Sleepy all of the time

Dramatic weight loss

Manic depression, numbness of body, tremors, racing thoughts, hot

flashes, hallucinations, voices and echoes

Excessive or " fake " happiness-not able to feel " normal " sadness or

cry at all

Feeling like an incomplete person without sexual feelings

Feel like going to stop breathing

Cold for hours after jogging

Extremely paranoid, feeling like someone is standing outside of the

shower with a knife-ready to kill me, constantly looking over my

shoulder all of the time and jumping at every noise

Muscle and joint pains

Strange and vivid dreams with erratic sleep patterns

Nightmares, flashbacks, severe night sweats and feel sense of unrest

No emotion and brain twitches

Felt like on a come down from acid for the whole time taking SSRI,

saw tracers (shadows when things were moving) could not sleep, felt

suicidal and more depressed than before

Itchy, rashes on inside of legs, knees, under arms and back, hot

sweats and flushes, very depressed, being very rude and short

tempered

Severe mood swings, angry most of the time and violent

Lost everything

Lost job

dizziness and low blood sugar

Just don't care anymore

Flash anger, verbal aggression and uncontrolled bouts of swearing

Pain in the lower left hand side of the stomach

Sleeping A LOT (13 hours a night)

Self mutilation

Cutting self

Tongue pain at night

Ears ring all the time since I've been on Paxil

Total inability to have an orgasm (I am female). This never happened

to me before I took Prozac

Breathing Difficulty

Uncontrollable bouts of anger during which I can't even talk to

anyone- totally overreacting to different situations.

Delayed sleep pattern, 1 hour later each day, turning the clock

around during one year

Craving for sugar or protein or vitamin c

Changing my mind every minute, completely paranoid

Completely paralyzed by not knowing what to do or where I was going

or what I can do when I feel like this

Delayed ejaculation and subtle loss of genital sensitivity--still

persists 3 years after finishing medication

Annoying dizzy spells that have intensified the longer I have been

off of Paxil

Alzheimer's Condition dramatically accelerated in my 82 year old

mother immediately following Paxil

Hot flashes and profuse sweating

Lethargic

After two days, woke up with left hand and arm numb, feel

disconnected, headachy and anxious

Heard noises that weren't real: electronic humming/buzzing,

doorbells, and voices. Would look for source, but find nothing.

Sometimes, just moving my head would make the noises change or go

away.

TONGUE FEELS LIKE IT HAS BEEN STUCK IN AN ELECTRICAL OUTLET

Severe constipation even Metamucil is not working feeling real

bloated and starting to get depressed

> Ang,

>

> What can it do to you? I took it for 1 1/2 years. Coming off of it

> was really bad though I almost couldn't do it. I had really bad

head

> tremmers and was so drained all the time I couldn't hardley get out

> of bed. What else does it do? Just alittle freeked.

>

> Michel

>

>

> > BE CAREFUL WITH PAXIL --- it can have life long side effects - do

a

> > search on it!!!

> > Ang

[Guest guest]

Dang ang, where did you find all that? I had at least 75% of all

those symptoms. THat is why I had to quit taking it. It was true

about feeling disconected to people. I didn't want to talk to anyone

or see anyone. And it wasn't just my anxiety it was also the pills

doing it. It truly is better if you don't have to be medicated. I

meen try to do it on your own first is the best thing.

Michel

> > > BE CAREFUL WITH PAXIL --- it can have life long side effects -

do

> a

> > > search on it!!!

> > > Ang

[Guest guest]

It depends on the person how these pills will effect each of us. I was on Prozac

for a coupe of weeks and experienced a lot of these symptoms. Paxil has been

great for me. As my doctor told me for some people they can be either a

nightmare or a life saver. .

Re: Digest Number 552/Reply () & An

Artical I Saw On Water.....

Dang ang, where did you find all that? I had at least 75% of all

those symptoms. THat is why I had to quit taking it. It was true

about feeling disconected to people. I didn't want to talk to anyone

or see anyone. And it wasn't just my anxiety it was also the pills

doing it. It truly is better if you don't have to be medicated. I

meen try to do it on your own first is the best thing.

Michel

> > > BE CAREFUL WITH PAXIL --- it can have life long side effects -

do

> a

> > > search on it!!!

> > > Ang