Re: husband advise 101 - all you need to know about men/Laney

July 15, 2002

> This is a sore subject for me....I believe if someone is feeling

they are neglected...they should say so, and not use it as an excuse

for cheating.

...........I agree so much that I have to comment after every sentence!

The way I see it is that if they don't say something - they were just

looking for a reason to leave - at that point it wouldn't matter what

the spouce did, they'd still find a reason!

>If you are that unhappy at home.....leave first.

.....YES YES YES!!!!! I agree. If you want to have an affair - leave

me first!

>An affair is not worth the pain it causes everyone.

..........Not only pain - but a life time of insecrity and on man -

the list goes on....it's been 4 years, and still, it is me, not him

that has all the burden to bear! How unfair that the spouce of a

cheating partener be the one to suffer. (As far as I know - my

husbands cheating was not physical with another person - it was

porography and internet and ???) But the scars are permenant. After

that I decided that if something ever happened to 'us' - I'd never

marrie a man that I love again - too painful - try not to love was my

thinking.

>I am so tired of hearing that excuse. When my husband cheated on me

I was working 2 jobs to support us because he had lost his job, and

he said I didn't spend enough time with him, so that was why he

cheated. If he wanted me to spend more time at home, he could have

went and looked for a job to help me out, instead he said he wanted

to take some time off to relax. Yeah.....what a relaxation he had

too! Sorry for getting upset....like I said, sore subject. -Laney-

......Oh no appology nessacarry! Like I said - it's been 4 years- oh,

no it's been 5 years now. It's only been maybe 4 months that it

hasn't been overwhelming every aspect of my life - literally. I

still can't feel free to leave the house and other things - so

although I did nothing wrong - I have lasting problems too.

How long have you had to deal with this?

Ang

> Re: husband advise 101 - all you

need to know about men/Elly

>

> Yep - it's true - if you don't get it at home - there will come a

> time that when someone else is offering - the tempations can be

too

> much (especially for a 'man') - oh, IF I said that outloud, I'm

just

> sure it wasn't on purpose! LOL.

> Ang

>

> wrote:

> > Not only does it make sence but it makes Perfect sence. Thats

how

> > cheating comes about. I know he loves me and proves it to me

alot

> so

> > I dont need to linger and for this very reason I try my best to

> show

> > him how much I love and need him. However just like we all

like to

> > be looked at in that special way by other men/women letting us

know

> > were still all that, if we never got this reaction from our

mates

> one

> > day someone elses looks may hit us the right way and, well we

long

> > for what we dont have or get...San

> >

> > > Remember man's biggest hurdle - his ego. It's not so much

what

> we

> > > look like - it's HOW THEY FEEL ABOUT THEMSELVES when they are

> with

> > > us. Remember back when you were 'in love'...how did you look

at

> or

> > > sit next to or talk to him then vs. now? How did he feel

about

> > > himself when he was with you then? Why did he rush to be

with

> you?

> > > Think about how a girl other than yourself would see him and

how

> > she

> > > would show it - is he hansome, tall, great hair or eyes,

smart,

> > > sucessfull - what is it that you can give him " wows "

> about...that's

> > > what a man needs to feel good about himself. Kind of like

how we

> > > need to know we are atractive and wanted - they need that

too,

> only

> > > in a very different way. And when he feels good about

himself

> > around

> > > you - he feels he needs you. (A whole difrent/parallel realm

> kind

> > of

> > > thing). LOL

> > > Make sence? I could yank out the old collage marriage

counciling

> > > books and find a better way to say it if you'd like :-) But I

> find

> > > the words behind the phycology of things are best put into

> > > real 'people' experience and words.

> > > Ang

> > >

>

July 15, 2002

Been there, done that... I found out in December my husband cheated on me less

than a year after we were married (been married 5.5 years). It seems his brother

got him drunk and coerced him to screw his brother's wife. They all managed to

hide it from me all this time. When his brother's life wasn't going so well, he

decided to tell me so that he could break up our marriage 2 weeks before

Christmas. No money and no way to support my kids -- I decided to stay and work

on the marriage. What choice did I have?

I have no doubt that my husband was sorry for what he did. He tried so hard to

hide it and suffered deep depression over what he did. After I found out, he was

feeling much better because he didn't have to keep his secret anymore. But I was

still bitter and resentful. Still am to an extent, but it doesn't bother me so

much anymore. He has to live with what he did for the rest of his life, and I do

a good job making him suffer over it. I can be a cruel, hateful, snot when I

want to be. I'm finally at the point where I'm not being that anymore, because

it's not productive for my own mental health.

And now his brother blames me for coming between them because I won't allow them

to be brothers anymore. I told my husband it was either me or his brother and he

had to choose. Oh freakin' well... No one held a gun to their heads and made

them do what they did. They caused my panic disorder to resurface. Eating

healthy and exercising was the only thing that stopped my panic & anxiety and

lifted my depression! And the only reason why I even started losing weight was

because I decided that if he got to have some booty on the side, I should be

able to, too, lol! But now that I feel so much healther, my only motivation is

how good I feel. I realize it would only make things worse if I did the same

thing he did. But it's still tempting!

When your spouse cheats on you, it tends to make you feel very unloved; and I

want that from someone else, because he can never make me feel special like he

used to. Whatever special bond that was between us as partners is gone forever,

and there's nothing he can do to bring it back, nor do I desire for us to have

it again. I prefer to have some distance, yet I feel closer to him at the same

time because we communicate more now. Kind of hard to explain... More like I

feel closer to him in a friend sort of way, but have no desire to have that

" spouse bond " again. So for any men reading this, don't ever cheat on your

wives, because they will probably secretly resent you until the day you die,

lol!

~Angi~

----- Original Message -----

> This is a sore subject for me....I believe if someone is feeling

they are neglected...they should say so, and not use it as an excuse

for cheating.

..........I agree so much that I have to comment after every sentence!

The way I see it is that if they don't say something - they were just

looking for a reason to leave - at that point it wouldn't matter what

the spouce did, they'd still find a reason!

>If you are that unhappy at home.....leave first.

....YES YES YES!!!!! I agree. If you want to have an affair - leave

me first!

>An affair is not worth the pain it causes everyone.

.........Not only pain - but a life time of insecrity and on man -

the list goes on....it's been 4 years, and still, it is me, not him

that has all the burden to bear! How unfair that the spouce of a

cheating partener be the one to suffer. (As far as I know - my

husbands cheating was not physical with another person - it was

porography and internet and ???) But the scars are permenant. After

that I decided that if something ever happened to 'us' - I'd never

marrie a man that I love again - too painful - try not to love was my

thinking.

>I am so tired of hearing that excuse. When my husband cheated on me

I was working 2 jobs to support us because he had lost his job, and

he said I didn't spend enough time with him, so that was why he

cheated. If he wanted me to spend more time at home, he could have

went and looked for a job to help me out, instead he said he wanted

to take some time off to relax. Yeah.....what a relaxation he had

too! Sorry for getting upset....like I said, sore subject. -Laney-

.....Oh no appology nessacarry! Like I said - it's been 4 years- oh,

no it's been 5 years now. It's only been maybe 4 months that it

hasn't been overwhelming every aspect of my life - literally. I

still can't feel free to leave the house and other things - so

although I did nothing wrong - I have lasting problems too.

How long have you had to deal with this?

Ang

---

Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Version: 6.0.360 / Virus Database: 199 - Release Date: 5/7/02

July 15, 2002

I have to say I have never been in your shoes.

I can say that IF it ever happened to me, kids or no kids, I feel I

deserve a better life, and it would be HIS loss and not mine.

To me cheating is just an excuse to get out of the marriage.

Your kids will grow up thinking, that is the " normal " way a marriage

works....they will pick up on the resentment, and the anger between

the two of you.

It is sad, because the words that you write really show how you

feel, and it is easy to detect the hurt and anger.

Remember when you " hurt " someone else with words or any other way,

you are really only hurting yourself.

Take Care

July 15, 2002

Actually, we get along quite well around our children. We seldom argue and work

together as a team in most things. However, if my kids are smart, they will

never get married. Other than being a betraying moron when we first got married,

my husband really is a great husband and father. LOL! Hell yeah, I'm angry. :-)

Ask any spouse who's been betrayed and they will same the same thing. When

someone does something like to you, they rob you of self-respect, trust,

self-worth, etc. You really question who you are as a person afterward. It takes

a lot of work to get it all back again. It doesn't just destroy the marriage --

it destroys the person you thought you were with your partner. It's only been 7

months since D-day. It takes YEARS to work through it and move past it. I have

come a long way in 7 months, but am entitled to feel how I feel. I don't push

myself to " get over it " or feel things that I don't want to feel. We take it a

day at a time and I do my best to make things right with ME. That was what I

decided was that right now I need to work on ME; otherwise, how can I work on

us? :-)

~Angi~

----- Original Message -----

I have to say I have never been in your shoes.

I can say that IF it ever happened to me, kids or no kids, I feel I

deserve a better life, and it would be HIS loss and not mine.

To me cheating is just an excuse to get out of the marriage.

Your kids will grow up thinking, that is the " normal " way a marriage

works....they will pick up on the resentment, and the anger between

the two of you.

It is sad, because the words that you write really show how you

feel, and it is easy to detect the hurt and anger.

Remember when you " hurt " someone else with words or any other way,

you are really only hurting yourself.

Take Care

---

Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Version: 6.0.360 / Virus Database: 199 - Release Date: 5/7/02

July 15, 2002

If I wrote everything I wanted to say - you'd never get done reading

and I'd never get done writing.

I remember (and it still reserfaces) that bitter vile hate - put it

this way - my husband came home to a butcher knife stuck through his

desk top. It ws pinning the 10s of thousnads of porno pics on the

cd's he had burned....I'm talking hundreds and hundreds of hours he

spent looking for and downloading these women...(trying not to get to

angry here)...

Anyway - back to today -

I don't blame you at all for saying him or you. I'd do the same

thing. And when I found out about my husband - I was pregent with my

last baby (durning this entire year he wouldn't touch or look at me

or talk to me except to say horrible things - hurtfull things

purposly).

When it came to a head - I had an 11 year old and a new born. I

remember all the stages my fellings and thoughts went

through....hate, love that made me want to just die, self-torture in

my mind, endlessly. I was afraid to leave the house and even home I

was so ???. I was diagnosed with PDS (post tramatic stress syndrom)

when I finaly went to a shrink and sat down, without a word broke

down in tears and finaly got the words out - " I need something to

make me stop loving him " .

I too started to drop weight for a while just so I could get revenge

on mint, and so he'd love me the next. I kept telling myself that I

refused to do anything wrong - I would do everything exactly right,

be the best wife and mom I could be through the whole thing ---

because when it was over and done - I wanted to be sure all fingers

pointed at him, not me. I didn't want him to be able to say " you did

too. "

Man, all that WITH the pregnancy and post pardom hormons going

crazy...I can't believe I didn't literally die. I felt like it.

If you just found out about it this last december - I can't believe

how calm you are...you must be pretty stong or have some resolve or

plan.

I know what you mean, and cried so many times over that lost ???.

There isn't a word for it - but it is the very soul of the marriage

bond. The most important thing. And once it's gone - it's gone.

There seems to be something comeing to take it's place - something

that even seems more tangable than it was now...like a stronger

desire on his part to be right/loyal/trust worthy. It (what ever

you'd call it) actualy does me more good than that other did.

Because before it was a fantacy 'knight in shining armor' - 'he'll

never...' thing in my head - now it's something that he is very aware

of.

Ang

> Been there, done that... I found out in December my husband cheated

on me less than a year after we were married (been married 5.5

years). It seems his brother got him drunk and coerced him to screw

his brother's wife. They all managed to hide it from me all this

time. When his brother's life wasn't going so well, he decided to

tell me so that he could break up our marriage 2 weeks before

Christmas. No money and no way to support my kids -- I decided to

stay and work on the marriage. What choice did I have?

>

> I have no doubt that my husband was sorry for what he did. He tried

so hard to hide it and suffered deep depression over what he did.

After I found out, he was feeling much better because he didn't have

to keep his secret anymore. But I was still bitter and resentful.

Still am to an extent, but it doesn't bother me so much anymore. He

has to live with what he did for the rest of his life, and I do a

good job making him suffer over it. I can be a cruel, hateful, snot

when I want to be. I'm finally at the point where I'm not being that

anymore, because it's not productive for my own mental health.

>

> And now his brother blames me for coming between them because I

won't allow them to be brothers anymore. I told my husband it was

either me or his brother and he had to choose. Oh freakin' well... No

one held a gun to their heads and made them do what they did. They

caused my panic disorder to resurface. Eating healthy and exercising

was the only thing that stopped my panic & anxiety and lifted my

depression! And the only reason why I even started losing weight was

because I decided that if he got to have some booty on the side, I

should be able to, too, lol! But now that I feel so much healther, my

only motivation is how good I feel. I realize it would only make

things worse if I did the same thing he did. But it's still tempting!

>

> When your spouse cheats on you, it tends to make you feel very

unloved; and I want that from someone else, because he can never make

me feel special like he used to. Whatever special bond that was

between us as partners is gone forever, and there's nothing he can do

to bring it back, nor do I desire for us to have it again. I prefer

to have some distance, yet I feel closer to him at the same time

because we communicate more now. Kind of hard to explain... More like

I feel closer to him in a friend sort of way, but have no desire to

have that " spouse bond " again. So for any men reading this, don't

ever cheat on your wives, because they will probably secretly resent

you until the day you die, lol!

>

> ~Angi~

> ----- Original Message -----

>

> > This is a sore subject for me....I believe if someone is

feeling

> they are neglected...they should say so, and not use it as an

excuse

> for cheating.

>

> ..........I agree so much that I have to comment after every

sentence!

> The way I see it is that if they don't say something - they were

just

> looking for a reason to leave - at that point it wouldn't matter

what

> the spouce did, they'd still find a reason!

>

> >If you are that unhappy at home.....leave first.

>

> ....YES YES YES!!!!! I agree. If you want to have an affair -

leave

> me first!

>

> >An affair is not worth the pain it causes everyone.

>

> .........Not only pain - but a life time of insecrity and on man -

> the list goes on....it's been 4 years, and still, it is me, not

him

> that has all the burden to bear! How unfair that the spouce of a

> cheating partener be the one to suffer. (As far as I know - my

> husbands cheating was not physical with another person - it was

> porography and internet and ???) But the scars are permenant.

After

> that I decided that if something ever happened to 'us' - I'd

never

> marrie a man that I love again - too painful - try not to love

was my

> thinking.

>

> >I am so tired of hearing that excuse. When my husband cheated on

me

> I was working 2 jobs to support us because he had lost his job,

and

> he said I didn't spend enough time with him, so that was why he

> cheated. If he wanted me to spend more time at home, he could

have

> went and looked for a job to help me out, instead he said he

wanted

> to take some time off to relax. Yeah.....what a relaxation he had

> too! Sorry for getting upset....like I said, sore subject. -Laney-

>

> .....Oh no appology nessacarry! Like I said - it's been 4 years-

oh,

> no it's been 5 years now. It's only been maybe 4 months that it

> hasn't been overwhelming every aspect of my life - literally. I

> still can't feel free to leave the house and other things - so

> although I did nothing wrong - I have lasting problems too.

>

> How long have you had to deal with this?

> Ang

>

> ---

> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

> Version: 6.0.360 / Virus Database: 199 - Release Date: 5/7/02

>

July 15, 2002

Everything you said is right.

I must say this...the thing that suprised me the most (other than

what he did of course)...was that I didn't leave. All my life I've

said and know that NEVER would I take that. Never would I allow a

man to do that to me - I'm so glad I loved him too much to leave.

Ang

> I have to say I have never been in your shoes.

> I can say that IF it ever happened to me, kids or no kids, I feel I

> deserve a better life, and it would be HIS loss and not mine.

> To me cheating is just an excuse to get out of the marriage.

>

> Your kids will grow up thinking, that is the " normal " way a

marriage

> works....they will pick up on the resentment, and the anger between

> the two of you.

>

> It is sad, because the words that you write really show how you

> feel, and it is easy to detect the hurt and anger.

>

> Remember when you " hurt " someone else with words or any other way,

> you are really only hurting yourself.

>

> Take Care

>

July 15, 2002

Yep. You are doing great too. I didn't sound anything but hatefull

and bitter for the first several years. And your right it tears you

up completely. Shatters your world.

For the first 3 years EVERYTHING that came out of my mouth was snobby

and sarcastic and double edged.

Ang

> Actually, we get along quite well around our children. We seldom

argue and work together as a team in most things. However, if my kids

are smart, they will never get married. Other than being a betraying

moron when we first got married, my husband really is a great husband

and father. LOL! Hell yeah, I'm angry. :-) Ask any spouse who's been

betrayed and they will same the same thing. When someone does

something like to you, they rob you of self-respect, trust, self-

worth, etc. You really question who you are as a person afterward. It

takes a lot of work to get it all back again. It doesn't just destroy

the marriage -- it destroys the person you thought you were with your

partner. It's only been 7 months since D-day. It takes YEARS to work

through it and move past it. I have come a long way in 7 months, but

am entitled to feel how I feel. I don't push myself to " get over it "

or feel things that I don't want to feel. We take it a day at a time

and I do my best to make things right with ME. That was what I

decided was that right now I need to work on ME; otherwise, how can I

work on us? :-)

>

> ~Angi~

> ----- Original Message -----

> I have to say I have never been in your shoes.

> I can say that IF it ever happened to me, kids or no kids, I feel

I

> deserve a better life, and it would be HIS loss and not mine.

> To me cheating is just an excuse to get out of the marriage.

>

> Your kids will grow up thinking, that is the " normal " way a

marriage

> works....they will pick up on the resentment, and the anger

between

> the two of you.

>

> It is sad, because the words that you write really show how you

> feel, and it is easy to detect the hurt and anger.

>

> Remember when you " hurt " someone else with words or any other

way,

> you are really only hurting yourself.

>

> Take Care

>

> ---

> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

> Version: 6.0.360 / Virus Database: 199 - Release Date: 5/7/02

>

July 16, 2002

The only thing that stopped me from putting a bullet in his head (figuratively

speaking, lol) was that I saw his pain over what he did and had no doubt he

suffered agonizing pain every day over what he did. It wasn't even that he did

it that upset (i know, i'm strange, lol) me. It was that they all hid it from me

all those years. They all knew but me. Even his other brothers and some of their

mutual friends knew!

They all hid it from me and came around to do family things like life was

peachy. I had no clue such a thing even happened. I can understand why he hid it

from me at first. If I found out then, I definitely would've left him. But if I

left, we also may have had our chances to work through it apart for a while and

then reconcile later. But there wouldn't have been all the shame and humiliation

I feel now.

I've heard other betrayed spouses say that we shouldn't feel embarrassed,

ashamed, or humiliated over what they did. But how can you not feel those things

when you trust this person and they lie to you? When I first found out, I went

so off the wall that my husband left one night (maybe a week after d-day -- he

heard me on the phone saying every cruel thing i could think of about him to my

best friend) and tried to commit suicide, and his brother tried to have me

arrested for harrassment because I made his life even more miserable than I made

it for my husband.

I had to call 911 to file a missing person report and called my mother in tears

because I thought he was dead (he left and tried to jump off a bridge). Well, he

returned home and unscathed and my mother went and talked with him alone to find

out what was going on. He told her everything and I got scolded for tormenting

him and harrassing his brother, while he got a hug for holding his painful

secret inside! So I backed off and held all my pain inside since no one was

allowing me to lash out. I lash out at his brother and I go to jail. I lash out

at my husband and he tries to kill himself.

Finally I decided it wasn't worth it. I decided that since I was going to stay,

there was no use torturing myself over it. I knew that I had to work on myself

if things were ever going to get better. So I looked at things about myself that

I didn't like and decided to change them. It was amazing. I tried to make those

positive changes and I feel like a new person. I don't have nearly as much anger

and resentment and I don't even think about what he did every day (i only think

about it when he makes me angry and i need something to throw in his face, lol).

But I can understand all of your pain. It's one of the worst things a person can

go through! It may have taken you a long time, but you seem to be weathering it

well. I think a lot of spouses who betray their partners finally come around and

start acting right when they realize that the bond has been broken and a lot of

the former love is gone. It's only when they realize that they're going to lose

you over what they did that they wake up and try to change themselves.

In my case, my husband did this long before I even knew what happened. So by the

time I found out, he didn't understand why I couldn't see that he'd been trying

to make it up to me for years. But he failed to understand that the biggest way

he could make it up was by telling me what he did and not trying to forget that

it happened! Lately I decided it was best to just put it in the past and move

on.

I tried sneaking around online behind his back (with every intention to take it

to the next level in another couple months), and being paranoid over what he

did, he would spy on me when I left the house and catch me. So now he knows I

have been unfaithful on some level, and this tears him up. He has to live with

the fact that he drove me to do it. At first I was angry that he got to sneak

around my back and I couldn't do it to him without getting caught. But now I

just feel like it's a good thing because it will make me behave long enough to

get past this so I don't do something that I will later regret.

*sigh* It's a major battle. But yes, I am calm and strong. :-) I've been

through so much in my short 24 years of life that I could not possibly let

something like this bring me down. I deserve nothing but the best for myself and

for my children. And I can't be a good mother or productive member of society if

I allow petty things to bring me down. You just get to a point where you decide

nothing is going to stop you from being happy or the person you want to be. Ya

know? And it sounds like you've gotten to that point, too! You should give

yourself a big pat on the back for that because it isn't easy! :-)

~Angi~

Re: husband advise 101 - all you need to know

about men/Laney