GOOD NEWS?-Influence of animal protein on diabetes

[Guest guest]

MARY T- I am not quite sure why you would call this " good news " ? If this

article is true it is bad news for me because the only way I can keep my

blood sugars in control(without meds)is to low carb. So what you are saying

( to me) is that you are wishing upon me that I will have to give up my diet

and exercise regime and go on meds. Or only eat vegetables for the rest of

my life as I can NOT tolerate carbs. Maybe you did not mean to word it this

way? I hope not. Why would you wish anything " bad " on your fellow

diabetics?

- diet and exercise

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From: maryato@...

To: diabetes_int

Subject: Influence of animal protein on diabetes

Date: Wed, Jun 27, 2001, 1:51 PM

Here's some good news for those of us on this site who do not low

carb.

Below is a recent article from Reuters on a study showing that animal

protein has a strong negative affect on diabetes. This is because it

strains the pancreas. Insulin is NOT JUST PRODUCED FOR CARBOHYPDRATE

METABOLISM; it also metabolizes protein. The insulin you produce to

metabolize protein competes with the insulin that would be needed for

metabolizing carbs. Too much protein can also participate, then, in

pancreatic " burn out. "

Finally, the extra insulin produced to cover animal protein is

believed to worsen insulin resistance.

In the study below, they had participants cut way back on animal

protein, and they also had them cut out added sugar (no cut in

general carb intake, however).

Actually, this study doesn't surprise me. I've been bothered all

along by the low rates of heart disease and diabetes in vegetarian or

almost-vegetarian cultures like Okinawa and other places in the

Orient, or Mediterraneans. There's always been a reason why there's

so much diabetes in the West...we eat too much meat. When Okinawans

and Mediterraneans come here, they get the same diseases.

So...cut carbs way back if you want, but the alternate way to fight

diabetes is to eat vegetables and fruits with primarily vegetable

protein, vegetable fats (like canola and olive oils) and rare animal

protein.

T

Here's the study:

Diet Low in Animal Protein Improves Blood Glucose in Type 2 Diabetics

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DENVER (Reuters Health) Jun 21 - Type 2 diabetics who limit their

intake of animal protein and sugar may significantly improve their

lipid profile and lower their hemoglobin A1c (HbA1c) levels. Dr. Greg

Arsenis, from the University of South Florida, Tampa, and colleagues

reported the findings here Wednesday at the 83rd annual meeting of

the Endocrine Society.

The researchers studied 51 patients with type 2 diabetes who had not

benefited from large doses of oral hypoglycemics and/or insulin. They

were assigned to reduce their dietary animal protein intake from 2 to

3 times a day to once every other day for 6 months, replacing it with

equal amounts of vegetable protein. Sugars were eliminated, but

caloric content remained the same to prevent weight loss.

Among the 31 patients who stayed on the diet, the HbA1c value was

decreased by a significant 30%, from an average of about 10 to about

7. Other significant improvements were that total cholesterol

decreased by 32%, triglycerides by 60%, and low-density lipoprotein

cholesterol by 35%, and high-density lipoprotein cholesterol

increased by 10%.

" Patients liked the new diet and the fact that they did not have to

fast, adhere to low-calorie diets or take appetite suppressants, " the

researchers commented in a meeting abstract. They noted that of the

20 patients who did not follow the diet, 6 followed a low-calorie

diet and lost weight, and 14 switched from red meat to fish and

poultry, but their metabolic profile did not improve.

Three of the patients who did follow the prescribed diet reduced

their insulin dose by 50%, two patients discontinued insulin, four

patients stopped taking oral hypoglycemics and six discontinued one

or two of their hypolipemics.

" We were not really surprised by these findings, " Dr. Arsenis told

Reuters Health. " We know that animal protein contains essential amino

acids which stimulate pancreatic insulin secretion. " The increased

insulin increases adrenaline levels, which is thought to induce

insulin resistance, he explained.

Dr. Arsenis suggested that this type of diet might even help prevent

the development of type 2 diabetes.

[Guest guest]

, I guess the low carbs really worked. I had to go a little

hungry to get 5.3 and you got 5!!! (Ill blame it on a different

test method) Sam

[Guest guest]

Your views are appreciated. I also understand that Dr. Bernstein recommends

limiting protein to lose weight, along with limiting carbs to control blood

sugars.

In my view calories is calories....eat too many and they take up residence on

my hips

ressy

[Guest guest]

> MARY T- I am not quite sure why you would call this " good news " ? If

this

> article is true it is bad news for me >

>

If you read my message, you'll find that I said it was good news for

those of us who DON'T LOW CARB. It's probably not as relevant for

those of you who do.

The implication is that one way to get better bg results when not low

carbing is to reduce animal protein.

Of course, I think that ALL diabetics would be better off using more

vegetable protein and vegetables fats. Soy, beans, etc. are very low

in carbs and very low-glycemic. Most of you probably think " Well,

this soy has 3 or 4 carbs, and I'm only allowed 10 or 15 for this

meal. I don't like tofu, so why waste my carbs on it? " I'm not sure

that's smart.

It's good news to me because I've actually noticed the negative

affect of animal protein on my bg's. During certain times I've

gotten into soy protein, beans, etc., and I've had great bg results.

Then I slip to old habits and start eating too much fish, chicken,

and beef. Bg's go up, and not knowing any better I try to respond by

cutting carbs.

Cutting carbs actually makes me WORSE, not in bg's but in other

ways. I, like some (but not all) diabetics am very adrenalin-

sensitive (the article says that animal protein stimulates adrenalin,

which then causes insulin resistance/ hyperinsulinemia). For

example, I cannot control my blood pressure without a beta blocker…

they block adrenalin. Also, when I low-carb I have lots of trouble

with pseudo-hypos…hunger accompanied by nervousness, inability to

concentrate. Pseudo-hypos are also caused by excess adrenalin.

Apparently, some people like me have great adrenalin-induced distress

on high animal protein diets. I know many people who have bad

reactions to low carbing. Since high adrenalin goes with

hyperinsulinemia IT IS NOT HEALTHFUL.

If you are happy, emotionally even-keeled, etc. on low carbing, more

power to you. You apparently don't have an adrenalin problem and you

may not be as insulin resistant as I am.

I simply continue to try to provide an alternative voice on this

board to the view that low carbing fixes all problems for all

diabetics. I continue to do that because we always get new comers

and I want them to know that the low carb fixes all problems view is

not universal.

T

[Guest guest]

I was in a hurry on that last post. Low carbing hasn't caused my

adrenalin problems...high animal protein has. When low carbing I've

tended to increase my animal protein intake.

T

[Guest guest]

maryato@... wrote:

> If you are happy, emotionally even-keeled, etc. on low carbing, more

> power to you. You apparently don't have an adrenalin problem and you

> may not be as insulin resistant as I am.

>

> I simply continue to try to provide an alternative voice on this

> board to the view that low carbing fixes all problems for all

> diabetics. I continue to do that because we always get new comers

> and I want them to know that the low carb fixes all problems view is

> not universal.

>

> T

Alternative voices are needed. Thanks .

--

Dave - 10:55:04 AM

T2 - 8/98 Glucophage, U & H

A 4th generation Diabetic

-

Davors Daily Aphorism:

I've learned....

That everyone you meet deserves to be greeted with a smile.

--Andy Rooney-

--

[Guest guest]

,

I also very much appreciate your alternative voice and than you for

publishing the study.

Kim

>I simply continue to try to provide an alternative voice on this

>board to the view that low carbing fixes all problems for all

>diabetics. I continue to do that because we always get new comers

>and I want them to know that the low carb fixes all problems view is

>not universal.

>

> T

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[Guest guest]

, I think three meals a day are a great way to start the

rollercoaster. The first advise I read for diabetics was eat

smaller meals more often. (this is not for type 2 or insulin

users, but dietary control). Insulin is needed to store sugars for

later use, lacking effective insulin you may be unable to store

and release sugars, and go high and low. I practice this method.

Sam

[Guest guest]

T - Sorry if I read your message in the wrong way. I am much too happy

to be combative and I apologise if my post seemed that way.

I just had a wonderful evening of mowing and running my dogs in the field.

Life is good again! I finally feel normal again. It has been a long road

and I am just happy to enjoy life as I remember it :-)

My Best to You-

> MARY T- I am not quite sure why you would call this " good news " ? If

this

> article is true it is bad news for me >

>

If you read my message, you'll find that I said it was good news for

those of us who DON'T LOW CARB. It's probably not as relevant for

those of you who do.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 6/28/01 12:46:05 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

1929@... writes:

<< Morning low 100's

After breakfast mid 150-170

2 hours after breakfast I am way down to below 80

this goes on like this for each meal. I can tell when I go up and down and

right now I am on a roller coaster. I am going in today to see if they will

cut back on my glucophage.

I love potatoes and I just can't give them up ( >>

By eating carbs, you body senses them and asks the pancrease for some

insulin, your pancreas does the best it can, and gives you some, which causes

the drop, then you eat more causing the peak, etc, hence the roller coaster.

If you can find a way to stablize the amt of carbs per meal, you will

stablize the rollercoaster.

The only foods I like are carbs lol I went to the doctors and I am stopping the

glucophage in the mornings so I should not have the roller coaster effect

anymore.