Re: Our we failing our geniuses?

October 8, 2007

>

> " American schools spend $8 billion a year on educating the

mentally

> retarded. Spending on the gifted isn't even tabulated in some

states,

> but by the most generous calculations, we spend no more than $800

> million on gifted programs. " " Are we failing our geniuses? " TIME

Aug

> 16, 2007

>

> Thought I would share this one...it angers me....

>

> Temple Grandin has always said, if Einstein was born to day, he

would

> be lucky to be a UPS driver. No joke...all's they can concentrate

on

> is the deficits....

> This is so true. I wish I could talk to my friends who have

autistic children and tell them how I feel without making them feel

as though they are being told how to raise their children!

> Not saying that genius are all autistic...and truly not saying

that

> autistic means " retarded " I know it doesn't....but making a point.

We

> know with a certainty that many of the amazing people in our

> history...where on the spectrum. Today they are slipping through

the

> cracks...the cookie cut out (under financed) schools...are

destroying

> our special children.

>

> Antoinette

>

October 8, 2007

Antoinette --

Einstein was kicked out of school as a child because they did think

he was retarded, and there was no law keeping him in. He's one of the

main examples given for specialized programming. How many Einsteins

were being lost because they thought and learned differently, who

didn't show up again as adults?

The major, disasterous flaw in today's specialized programming,

whether for autism or other learning differences that slow academic

gain, or for giftedness and other learning differences that speed

academic gain, is that administrators are under the mistaken

impression that if you tell staff to implement a program, they can do

it without adequate training, staffing numbers, or materials.

Therefore, you can get great teachers who don't know what they're

doing, without the time or resources to have a chance at making it

happen. The good teachers that also have the backgrounds, and

therefore have success, frequently get " dumped " on with an overload

(hey, he/she does good, so let's send him/her more), which defeats

the purpose of having the small group to begin with, and makes them

unable to focus individually like they should. To find a well-

trained, good teacher who knows his/her program, with correct student-

teacher ratios, is a rare and unexpected blessing.

Yes, there's still " lemon " teachers out there, in spite of the

stupid " Highly Qualified " paperwork thrown up (sic) by NCLB. Proof

that standardized tests don't mean diddly-squat in any case, since

those " lemon " teachers passed their professional exams. In special

ed, many of these " lemons " survive because a majority of the

administrators tend to be regular ed, whose experience is either 20

years out of date, or young ones who washed " up " in the classroom,

rising into administration in order to survive in their chosen

careers, and don't have a clue themselves about what learners with

differences from the norm need to succeed. And they get offended

rather than interested when given new information... old dogs, new

tricks. Many can even " talk the talk, " but certainly don't " walk the

walk. "

Truly well-implemented ABA and other Autism programs start from the

students' perspectives (YES, they do!), and gradually shape outward

behaviors through positive reinforcement and environment into

survival behaviors. It is in the program literature. It is staff lack

of training, and therefore lack of understanding or correct

implementation, that causes the terrible and hurtful results. But

then, the program or good teacher is blamed, rather than the

administrators who failed to assign correct levels of training,

staffing, and materials to make it positive and successful if it has

a good teacher assigned to it. The program is blamed, rather than

the " lemon " teacher who tries to cookie-cutter it, if implementing it

at all for anytime other than evaulative observations.

Good program implementation focuses on strengths, not just

weaknesses. That's why all IEPs are supposed to start with student

strengths being discussed.

> >

> > " American schools spend $8 billion a year on educating the

> mentally

> > retarded. Spending on the gifted isn't even tabulated in some

> states,

> > but by the most generous calculations, we spend no more than $800

> > million on gifted programs. " " Are we failing our geniuses? " TIME

> Aug

> > 16, 2007

> >

> > Thought I would share this one...it angers me....

> >

> > Temple Grandin has always said, if Einstein was born to day, he

> would

> > be lucky to be a UPS driver. No joke...all's they can

concentrate

> on

> > is the deficits....

> > This is so true. I wish I could talk to my friends who have

> autistic children and tell them how I feel without making them feel

> as though they are being told how to raise their children!

> > Not saying that genius are all autistic...and truly not saying

> that

> > autistic means " retarded " I know it doesn't....but making a

point.

> We

> > know with a certainty that many of the amazing people in our

> > history...where on the spectrum. Today they are slipping through

> the

> > cracks...the cookie cut out (under financed) schools...are

> destroying

> > our special children.

> >

> > Antoinette

> >

>

October 8, 2007

and all,

This is quite an important example. An even more egregious example was

Evariste Galois, one of the two mathematicians who established that the general

fifth degree equation cannot be solved by radicals (that is, there is no analog

of the so-called Quadratic Formula for quintic (fifth degree) equations). He

also invented what is now called Galois Theory, and underpins algebraic number

theory and related fields.

To summarize the sad story, Evarsite lived his teenage years during the French

Revolution. he was denied entrance twice to the Ecole Politechnique. At his

second exam, it has been stated by E.T. Bell that he threw an eraser at one of

the examiners, when they asked him something senseless. His mathematical skill

was far better than theirs, but he did not have the formal training to state

things exactly as they would have had him state them- with the political

niceties of it. Later, he was captured by a political faction, and manipulated

into duelling over a girl he hardly knew. He realized he would die, and wrote

down all the mathematics that bears his name the night before. He duelled the

day before his 21th birthday, lost, was injured incurably, and died the next

day, at the age of 21. he did not know that his manuscript found its way into

the right hands at last.

As a teacher, I have often used his life to illustrate the importance of

staying in school- and of keeping kids in school, if we can. In reading this

particular thread, it makes me wonder if Galois was on the Spectrum -- he

certainly made enough social errors, and did not seem socially astute enough to

be able to talk himself out of getting killed- when it seems that there might

easily have been a way to do so. When I first read his story in E.T. Bell, Men

of mathematics, I was 15 years old. My reaction, at that age, was to identify

strongly with him- I felt that in his shoes, it might well have been me. I

loved mathematics as a child, every bit as much as Galois. I also lacked social

sense, and took many risks I had no business taking- and when upset, I gave up

and reacted badly far too often, too.

wrote:

Antoinette --

Einstein was kicked out of school as a child because they did think

he was retarded, and there was no law keeping him in. He's one of the

main examples given for specialized programming. How many Einsteins

were being lost because they thought and learned differently, who

didn't show up again as adults?

The major, disasterous flaw in today's specialized programming,

whether for autism or other learning differences that slow academic

gain, or for giftedness and other learning differences that speed ...

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October 9, 2007

> Einstein was kicked out of school as a child because they did think

> he was retarded, and there was no law keeping him in. He's one of the

> main examples given for specialized programming. How many Einsteins

> were being lost because they thought and learned differently, who

> didn't show up again as adults?

I was a teacher for 2 years before I switched professions. Now I'm a

stay-at-home mom to a 4 year old dx with autism. I've already put him,

when he was 3, through the highly touted intensive early start program

for autism, which just made my son cry everyday. It took one year of

pubic school to make me leave and decide to homeschool (fortunately I

can do this).

The public school system not only fails almost everyone, especially

those that have special needs, or who are gifted (or both gifted and

special needs as is often the case with autism).

I am very dubious of NT's trying to " cure " autism. Often some NT who

has a loose degree in special ed, or no degree at all, will try to give

me bad advice/goals for my son. I think that is just ridiculous.

Having aspergers myself, having gone through the public school

system,college, and being a teacher gives me a unique perspective. I

don't think that the larger NT community/media/experts have a very good

grasp on autism (I often hear it touted as some horrible disease that

we must find a cure for-- a negligent approach at best). And public

schools in our area just wanted to dump my son into special ed, with

all the kids that don't fit in. This garbage pail approach is touted

as integration. To be fair, there are some good private schools

(some), and some great teachers; however, this is a sad minority of the

education community.

Right now I homeschool, as well as bring my son to supervised speech

and occupational therapy. Everytime during therapy,the teachers ask me

questions about how autistics think and use a lot of the tips I give

them. Any successful approach to educating autistics would have to

involve the input and participation of adult autistics in my opinion.

By the way, to anyone looking for a meaningful career-- look into

educating autistics! Adult autistic voices and understanding is almost

totally missing from the educational community to the detriment and

pain of the masses of young autistics entering education.

October 10, 2007

--

Yes, more autistics/aspies should become teachers. Our students need

teachers who truly understand their situations.

When getting ready to become teachers, they should take more

psychology/sociology electives, and attend counseling for social

interaction coaching, to build masking and positive routines to

ensure survival coping skills for collaboration with other teachers

and parents for " standard " communications. When hired, finding a

social coach for the unexpected is also important. Schools are

awfully herd/pack when it comes to staff interactions especially.

Personal experience and problems, here.

I agree that the current system is awful. However, the choice is

whether to scrap it completely or fix what's wrong with it.

I commend you for what you've done! Your son has a wonderful mother.

I wish more parents were like you, either by taking more

responsibility for their child's education at home, or becoming

strong advocates for their child in school. Your son attending

a " highly touted " program... by who? Parents? Don't believe the

press, especially that published by the school ... word of mouth is

much better. Even teachers who are very concerned for your child do

not dare step outside " the party line " when talking to parents, for

fear of reprisals and intimidation from the system. Just because the

schools claim to have adopted a " research-based, highly successful

program " doesn't mean they're implementing it correctly. Also,

especially with curriculum, that " research " may be publisher

research, not independent and peer reviewed/journal published... in

other words, publisher window dressing.

Unfortunately, many parents are not like you. As an elementary

Resource teacher I have a current caseload of 31 kids, all but 5 of

which are on moderate services (yes, I am way overloaded). About a

quarter of them have parents who have the education, willpower, and

resources to help make changes in their child's education.

Administrators count on parents being ignorant, overwhelmed,

uncaring, busy, etc., etc., etc., so that lack of compliance with

IEPs, regulations, caseload maximums, etc., is the rule rather than

the exception. Teachers are not trained correctly, nor given the

resources they need to implement researched programs effectively.

Then they are blamed for the failure of the system.

Fixing the system: Taxpayers are not willing to shell out the dollars

needed for adequate staffing and materials to make the demands of the

current legislative and case laws something that is within reach.

Either people need to accept that there will be kids falling through

the cracks of the current giant seive, adequate funding and staffing

needs to be provided, or an entirely new way of addressing student

learning needs to be put in place. There is lots on the educator

news, journals, webmail, etc. about places like a district in Alaska

who has told the feds to take a flying leap, and has devised a

student-driven learning environment in which students pre-test each

level's benchmarks, work to learn only those things they missed, and

then test again until they pass each level. A 10 year old can be at

Level 3 in reading, Level 4 in Writing, Level 8 in Math... etc.

Teachers act as facilitators, provide seminars and individual

guidance, coaching, and instruction for students, etc. It's working

like gangbusters. Their students with special needs then also have a

special ed certified teacher focusing on " seminars " for deficit

skills, and providing additional supports, modifications, etc. per

their individual plans (all students have individual plans).

Change is in the wind... and hopefully the current tropical system

doesn't die out as it travels the equator... hopefully, it builds

into a good hurricane. If only the NEA and AFT had some backbone.

> I was a teacher for 2 years before I switched professions. Now I'm

a

> stay-at-home mom to a 4 year old dx with autism. I've already put

him,

> when he was 3, through the highly touted intensive early start

program

> for autism, which just made my son cry everyday. It took one year

of

> pubic school to make me leave and decide to homeschool (fortunately

I

> can do this).

>

> The public school system not only fails almost everyone, especially

> those that have special needs, or who are gifted (or both gifted

and

> special needs as is often the case with autism).

>

> I am very dubious of NT's trying to " cure " autism. Often some NT

who

> has a loose degree in special ed, or no degree at all, will try to

give

> me bad advice/goals for my son. I think that is just ridiculous.

> Having aspergers myself, having gone through the public school

> system,college, and being a teacher gives me a unique perspective.

I

> don't think that the larger NT community/media/experts have a very

good

> grasp on autism (I often hear it touted as some horrible disease

that

> we must find a cure for-- a negligent approach at best). And

public

> schools in our area just wanted to dump my son into special ed,

with

> all the kids that don't fit in. This garbage pail approach is

touted

> as integration. To be fair, there are some good private schools

> (some), and some great teachers; however, this is a sad minority of

the

> education community.

>

> Right now I homeschool, as well as bring my son to supervised

speech

> and occupational therapy. Everytime during therapy,the teachers

ask me

> questions about how autistics think and use a lot of the tips I

give

> them. Any successful approach to educating autistics would have to

> involve the input and participation of adult autistics in my

opinion.

>

> By the way, to anyone looking for a meaningful career-- look into

> educating autistics! Adult autistic voices and understanding is

almost

> totally missing from the educational community to the detriment and

> pain of the masses of young autistics entering education.

>

October 10, 2007

wrote:

>Yes, more autistics/aspies should become teachers. Our students need

>teachers who truly understand their situations.

>When getting ready to become teachers, they should take more

>psychology/sociology electives, and attend counseling for social

>interaction coaching, to build masking and positive routines to

>ensure survival coping skills for collaboration with other teachers

>and parents for " standard " communications.

And after schools become accustomed to autie teachers, we can start

making them user-friendly for teachers who are faceblind (as well as

autie, in some cases).

Jane

October 10, 2007

The only way you can fail is if you don't follow what you know is right

for you and when you know it's the right time. I have had to live with that for

most of my life.

Due to my complex medical history. I am unable to finish anything I start.

right now I am in the middle of a shunt malfuinction and the doctors will take

forever to figure out where and when to go in to fix the porblem.

On the bright side, I did inspire my godmother to go into the field of

teaching special ed and working with the disabled. Her youngest son, , my

once annoying younger god brother finally found the girl of his dreams. She is

also taking the same route in her career thanks to me so I feel blessed in a

way.

I am the secretary of the household and am very good at it. When I did try

college, I worked at the lab under the ESE, as well as, volunteer for the girl

scout office and did very well but I became ill and had to move to Denver.

I am also a great listener and give good advice, it would just be nice if

everyone would take my word for it, and not go to someone else afterwards and

get the samething told to them. It makes me feel so incompentent. I guess it's

why I'll never be a counselor if everyone is second guessing me all the time.

These same people have the nerve also to tell me I am not dumb. Well then why do

you make me feel like I am I want to scream at them? Most of the time I keep it

to myself so they don't think to lock me in a loony bin.